It is a complete misconception that Westfield is over-crowded. They just had a 44-room and cafeteria expansion added to the school in fall of 2006. The school is just at 68 over-capacity right now and next fall they will be 100 under. The student population will steadily drop each year to 300 under capacity in 2010. There is no need to relieve over-crowding at this school because it does not exist!

Westfield Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It is a complete misconception that Westfield is
> over-crowded. They just had a 44-room and
> cafeteria expansion added to the school in fall of
> 2006. The school is just at 68 over-capacity
> right now and next fall they will be 100 under.
> The student population will steadily drop each
> year to 300 under capacity in 2010. There is no
> need to relieve over-crowding at this school
> because it does not exist!


That is correct - I am looking at the CIP. Meanwhile people in Fairfax Station REFUSED to continue in a boundary process to move from South County to Lake Braddock which also got an ADDITION. What is with these fools on the shool board? Each wants additions and renovations with the result they have to scramble to justify it.

It is bizarre that Westfields [by the airport] is in this boundary process when an addition is being built at Langley to house people who any normal person would have sent to Herndon or South Lakes.

Reston is a distinct community and someone posted about wanting community schools. Anyone not in Reston who is sent there is an outsider. They mentionned Hunters Woods which was listed as having 8 trailers, a GT center, a magnet program, plus who knows what other extra funding...the magnet uses about 4 school busses. Why does that school get all these extras yet I never see Gibson changing any of those boundaries? Why do we have to continue paying for all of that? How many schools does Gibson have with Foreign Language Immersion? Fox Mill and Floris are listed as having japanese. Exactly how many kids are in those programs at each grade level --- why isn't one on the other side of the county? How many schools in Sully have extra /focus/magnet money?

I don't know why people think that Reston as a whole is a distinct community. South Reston and North Reston are completely different communities. I know a lot more people from Fox Mill area because my kids go to Hunters Woods, so i would consider them part of my community. It has more to do with the school in your immediate area than what your address is. Of course, if North Reston was part of SL pyramid, I might feel differently because I would know people there. But I don't think basing arguments on zip codes or addresses holds much water, especially given how they mix and match the schools currently. It's all FFX county.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2007 01:52PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------
> ...if North Reston
> was part of SL pyramid, I might feel differently
> because I would know people there. But I don't
> think basing arguments on zip codes or addresses
> holds much water. It's all FFX county.

There are parts of Reston north of the Town Center that go to South Lakes - Forest Edge [areas that border Route 7] and Lake Anne -- both share borders with Aldrin. Who's left in the special tax district that isn't at South Lakes?

Tell it's all FFX to many who won't use Lake Braddock - Gibson, Storck, Strauss, Tom Davis, Hyland, Connelly, etc.

Many of the magnet programs were put in schools that were low performing. For instance, there are no language immersion programs in Vienna and only one in McLean, in the lowest income neighborhood. GT centers were also put in the low income areas. Then the county decided that they really needed more black students in GT centers so the percentage of students in GT centers went from 4.5% to 14% and over crowded all of the schools with GT centers. DUH Couldn't they see that coming?

I am not surprised that there would be fewer magnets and language immersion schools in Sully and more in Reston. Reston schools need all the help they can get.

How much extra in taxes do people in Reston pay? Or does it all go to the Reston Association? How much do people have to pay for the privilege of living in Reston?

Neen, I really wish you would stop being so insulting to SL people, not to mention inaccurate. Floris and Fox Mill aren't even in Reston. And Chantilly has the academy magnet.

We pay around $450 a year for Reston "amenities" including the pools, tennis courts, and trail upkeep. I find it's well worth it just for the pools.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2007 05:24PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

South Lakes Pyramid parent~You are most prolific on this thread. Do you receive this attribute from pyramid power? I've heard about this phenomenon, but really never believed it.
Attachments:

I never said that Floris is in Reston, or Fox Mill. Both schools are close enough to South Lakes that they might be part of the redistricting.

What's the Chantilly academy got to do with anything? Chantilly was not one of the higher performing schools, so it's not surprising that they got an academy. Was that your point? Lower performing schools get the special programs. The lowest performing schools got stuck with IB.

What have I said about Reston that is inaccurate?

I'm glad to hear that your Reston taxes are so low. Does that include police protection, trash collection, street cleaning, leaf collection, large refuse removal, Christmas tree removals, and snow removal, like in the town of Vienna and city of Falls Church? If so, that is a great bargain!

Neen:

Did one of your kids lose in a swim meet to a Reston kid? Did RA deny your application to paint your fence a lovely grape color, if you deigned to move to Reston?

Why the antipathy? Give it a rest. I am sure you'll find a way to avoid Reston forever, and to tell everyone what a crappy place it is. Many of us find it a fine place to live, even if we grouse about RA, the traffic, or our taxes.

People can make their own choices, but quit sliming everything about SLHS and Reston. It distorts and cheapens the debate.

I have to laugh at all this talk about property values. Face it folks...regardless of what happens with the redistricting...your home values are in a free fall. And where the bottom is...nobody knows. Before it's over, it might make the Great Depression look like a walk in the park.

I've bought and sold over 30 SFHs since the late 70's and I've never been more apprehensive than I am now....I quit buying houses when the prices started skyrocketing and have been unloading long-held properties as fast as I can.

I truly feel sorry for all the morons that financed that Hummer H2, fancy TVs, and all manner of granite this and stainless that with home equity loans. NO WAY these dumb fucks will be able able to sell their homes in at least the next decade. A lotta these assholes will be lucky to keep their goddamn hair dryers from the repo man!

Nationwide, millions will eventually be forced to walk away....FURTHER worsening the situation. Already, cities like Cleveland, Ohio are facing huge costs to bulldoze entire neighborhoods that have been abandoned.

But I'll be alright...and am actually savoring thought of picking off some choice properties from the lenders for pennies on the dollar.

South Lakes is the LEAST of your worries, suckers!

>>>>People can make their own choices<<<<

Isn't that wonderful? If only they could make their own choice about schools too. If only they had a choice to stay in the schools they like.

DUH, yes, house prices are going down. But most of us didn't buy our homes yesterday. We bought them long before 2004. We'll make money whenever choose to sell. It doesn't really matter if we make $500,000 or $700,000, that we might have made in 2005. It's all gravy for us.

Thanks to the federal government we have the lowest unemployment in the country. This is not Cleveland. You are obviously clueless about economics, and clueless about this area.

Did you really think that house prices would never go down, and you would always be able to be a flipper?

What a dope. I'd have to say that is YOU who is the dump fuck. No wonder you're bitter and jealous. Get used to it. Or get a real job.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> DUH, yes, house prices are going down. But most
> of us didn't buy our homes yesterday. We bought
> them long before 2004. We'll make money whenever
> choose to sell. It doesn't really matter if we
> make $500,000 or $700,000, that we might have made
> in 2005. It's all gravy for us.
>
> Thanks to the federal government we have the
> lowest unemployment in the country. This is not
> Cleveland. You are obviously clueless about
> economics, and clueless about this area.
>
> Did you really think that house prices would never
> go down, and you would always be able to be a
> flipper?
>
> What a dope. I'd have to say that is YOU who is
> the dump fuck. No wonder you're bitter and
> jealous. Get used to it. Or get a real job.



I don't need a "real job", asshole...I'm VERY comfortably retired. Actually, my sons are anxiously awaiting my demise! LOL

Of course I understand that this is not Cleveland and that most of "us" bought before the boom...but have you checked the foreclosure section in the newspaper lately? All I'm saying is you better quit tapping your equity line of credit...it's later than you think.

Hey, when are you Republicans going to lower MY taxes....I just sent off my September quarterly IRS payment of almost 16 grand....probably more than you make in a year.

And no I don't live in liberal Reston....I'm on very conservative Chapel Rd in Clifton.

Where do the majority of students for TJ come fom (disticts)?

I think this makes the most sense. Use South Lakes facilities for the TJ program.

It would be "wonderful" if you could make a point without demeaning everything and everyone you oppose or don't agree with.

SLHS is an excellent, rising high school that will expand its very successful IB program and other courses when it gets additional students to fill the renovated, expanded facilities. Parents and students will welcome new families and kids and work to make it a great academic and social experience.

Reston is a very nice, safe, affluent, and diverse community -- not perfect and not for everyone's taste or druthers, but home to many, many successful people of all kinds of political views, backgrounds, and opinions who don't sit around singing Koombiyah, figuring out how to get everyone to dress and think the same, or -- for that matter- espouse some wingnut slogan either.

If people cared about facilities, no one would live in McLean or Vienna. Most of their schools are old, run down, and falling apart. If a nice facility contributed to academics or anything else, Mount Vernon high school would be packed, rather than 800 under enrolled. That school was also renovated, beautifully. No one would attend TJ, if facilities mattered. TJ is a dump, hasn't been renovated in 25 years.

Most TJ kids come from........wait for it........the richest parts of the county. Smart people tend to be richer than dumb people. Smart people tend to have smart kids. (Genetics can be such a drag that way.) That might explain why Langley, Oakton, Madison have higher SAT scores than other parts of the county. South Lakes is close to all of those areas so putting TJ students into South Lakes is perfect. FCPS could make a bundle selling the TJ property. All South Lakes students could be reassigned to Madison, Oakton, Herndon, Oakton, Wesfield, and Chantilly. Four years out, none of those schools would be over crowded, even with the South Lakes students. Do the math.

Again, I'm happy that there are people who like South Lakes. That's wonderful. That doesn't mean you can expect everyone else to share your opinion or want to go to South Lakes. You could just continue to enjoy it and expect to have small class sizes and expect every child to make the team, whatever team they choose. Sounds like a win-win for everyone.

word: hahahahahahaha. lighten up.

yeah westfields starting running back (if you want to know his name go to a game) was expelled from south lakes his freshman year (now a senior) because he and a whole bunch of other players gave out birthday hits to one guy and it escalated.

neen: so what youre saying is... everyone who isnt rich and white is a thug? if youre a parent with a kid with that attitude you can stay out of south lakes. we dont need any cancers. and south lakes HAS been fixed. its people like you who keep propagating its negative image.

academies are useless to the bulk of students. i'm not at chantilly so i never see kids coming in to my school but it really seems like a hassle. however, they offer career training for kids who go into service professions like nursing or EMT. and i swear you have no heart if you can look down on a person who ends up at nova training to be an EMT instead of going to a 4 year college like your kid does.

the lowest performing schools get the IB? then hows robinson for you as an outliar on your nice little chart, there? with the exception of robinson, which has a perfect fit for ib since its a secondary school, the ib schools in ffx co are the smaller ones.

and now, neen, you make your argument based on reston not being a town? i'm extremely pleased that reston neither has no mayor nor a police force. i guess youve never talked to herndon cops, but they are complete cocks. they fine higher, too, since they are privatized and more hard-up for money.


just as an added note, i hope that when the redistricting happens that south lakes doesnt get a new westfield murderer on their hands.


and just for humor's sake on http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/18/us/18school.html?_r=1&oref=slogin '“Mostly, people are confused,” said Steve Webb, who dropped out of Westfield last year to become a professional juggler'

brian Wrote:
----------------------------------------------------
> ... westfields starting running back (if you want
> to know his name go to a game) was expelled from
> south lakes his freshman year (now a senior)
> because he and a whole bunch of other players gave
> out birthday hits to one guy and it escalated...

so they physically hurt someone else on the team - that is severe hazing. This must have been under the prior worthless principal. Was that creature the only one punished and how is getting moved to Westfields punitive enough? If the hits wre on the field where were the coaches? Any fired? If they were in the locker room was he also abused sexually? FCPS sweeps everything under the carpet. Wash Post doesn't cover FX as well as it does Montco. More makes the local papers about shenanigans at SL's than other schools. Butler is a real principal and South Lakes now has good admins. Remember Eastern HS in DC? The FCPS admin that went there had been doing a bad job at Madison for years and lasted about 6 months in SE DC before even his colleagues were quoted about his abusve nature in the Post. Hey if you live in SE you have nothing to lose about complaining about lousy public schools...

Woodson has the highest ST scores in this county but FCPS adds in adult ed numbers - it through out IB. Robinson is large enough to have both programs and the other IB schools looked at it as a way out to stop the flight of the middle class, get pupil placements, train lifers , etc. Guess what? The per pupil per course costs are staggering. FCPS does not accurately represent the cost of the program and it is an extremely tight budget cycle for years. I for one expect to pay less property taxes this year since the FMV of my home has decreased. Rather than fool with this no financial benefit boundary chnage this year after the fiscally irresponsible maneuvers over the last year.

They operate like the little money down borrowers who then took out second mortgages for hummers and pools.

Wow—I’m really glad I found this forum. I’ve learned so much from the opponents of redistricting:

1) The Fairfax County School Board is obligated to prop up the value of people’s homes, giving that a higher priority in drawing school boundaries than demographics or the educational needs of all the students in the county.

2) Schools with lots of racial and ethnic diversity are bad. Gangs regularly torment students at such schools. Kids who want to go to college are forced to sit through many classes with hopeless, disruptive losers who like something called “hip-hop.”

3) The education you get at a school where white students average 1161 on the SATs is indisputably superior to one where white kids average 1127. The differing income levels and educational backgrounds of the white parents whose children attend those schools has little if any effect on the variation in test scores.

4) It’s wrong to bus children to schools with lots of black or hispanic students, because the bussed students are merely part of an experiment that will turn them into small rodents. All students should attend the schools closest to their homes—unless a school farther away has more affluent students and higher aggregate test scores, in which case it’s ok for the kids to ride a bus there until they’re old enough to take the Beamer.

But the best thing I learned, is which candidates for the Fairfax County school board are for redistricting, and which are more likely to protect the privileges white and Asian folks thought they had bought themselves by buying houses in certain neighborhoods. I wasn’t going to vote at all, but now I see the light. A big thank you to all of the wealthy racists who’ve expressed their views on this board!

And props to all the SL students and grads who’ve contributed to this discussion—you’re more rational and knowledgeable than most others here, and I hope my daughter in a few years will benefit as much from a SLHS education as you have.

Wow, Maxwell.

Couldn't have said it any better. Nice to have a summary for all the people who have not been around for the whole discussion.

Also, for the record, many of the elementary schools under consideration are closer to SL than to their current high schools.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/15/2007 04:13PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

My summary...

Madison, Oakton, Herndon, Westfield, Chantilly - would like things to stay the way they are

South Lakes - wants to increase their enrollemnt by drawing from the schools above

All - might as well keep all the insults and inuendo to yourself, both side have heard it all before - it goes nowhere

Maxwell why don't you have about eight more kids so you can take care of the low numbers at SLHS yourself and then you can put them on the short bus for the short ride to school and then let them stay after and be members of the baseball team or the basketball team. You stay there and we will stay where we are, easy enough! Vote the right way NO redistricting.

...and you might add that thinker will pay increased taxes to subsidize the less fortunate people

...Maxwell did make some valid and factual points, although it is not politically correct to promulgate such information

...Maxwell based upon your analysis of the issues, what members of the school board do you recommend in the upcoming election? opinions on other county candidates?

(I solicit your input in all seriousness--all the political posters along the roads are annoying. And I might add, I will not vote for anyone that calls me with a recorded message.)

You won't for anyone who calls you with information about a campaign? How strange. How do you plan to personally meet all the candidates?

I am hoping that this thread, as well as the local Connection, will provide more information on the candidates. I have read a lot of "hate" campaign material sent via the mail. I tend to believe this negative campaigning, or I think it would be libelous to send out; therefore, there are two candidates I would not vote for. I hope that the League of Women Voters will send out a pro and con for each candidate. Again, Neen, meeting a candidate via an annoying tape recorded message is not satisfactory. Kudos to Mr Frey, running for county clerk, who took the time to meet voters at recent Burke craft show.

No, Maxwell, you haven't learned a thing. Most of this thread is about a group of people who don't see the need to change. We are happy with the schools/communities we have invested in, whether it be Herndon, Oakton, South Lakes or Chantilly; whether we be black/white/asian or honduran. Sure there are a few here that want to slam this school or that, but most of those involved in this boundary study are focused on the birdbrains that forced the situation. The school board who can't account for anything but their own agendas. Those who approve and spend money without a plan; who will never admit to making wrong decisions, yet are oh so williing to spend more money to fix them.

Especially one particular board member who refuses to listen to his constituents including those that attend South Lakes High School. This guy has how many non-performing schools in his district??? more than any other in the county. He has done what to fix this? Nothing. He has been in office for how long? This must be the wealthy racist you speak of.

Actually, I think Maxwell makes some excellent points - there is really very little difference between SAT scores and the like amongst the groups that would be affected by the transfer to SLHS - whites and asians. And frankly, from what I have heard, the leadership of SLHS is doing a fine job in maintaining discipline and order - because, frankly, they have to.

But let's not lose sight of what some are posting about here. As I have repeatedly stated, the academic performance in general of Fairfax County schools (save for TJ) is one of relative mediocrity, particularly when one looks at the income status of the homes that supply the students, and even more so when one looks at certain other higher income areas of the country (e.g., North Suburban Chicago schools), which do considerably better than the average school in Fairfax County in terms of academic achievement. Washington is a town of transplants - don't think that sharp, academically focused parents are not deep down aware of this state of affairs - and accordingly the success that Fairfax County does experience is due more than anything else to parental pushiness and involvement.

So to put it in perspective - concerned parents - already taxed in pushing their kids forward - just are not going to welcome the distraction that a move to SLHS represents. Like it or not - any rational parent will have to advise their kids to pay attention to a novel phenomena - that of outsize disciplinary and conduct problems. Further, and although I agree with Maxwell in that the perception is overblown - the whole discomfort of going to a school that for the most part (due to significant achievement gaps) must engage in a practice of "separate and unequal" (a phrase that Patrick Welsh at TC Williams - a brilliant chronicler of the challenges of teaching at TC and a published author) only adds to the alienation and fear that obtains.

And given this point of view- this is where I depart from Maxwell - for the most part, parents that are concerned are not "racist" - there are some very real negative behaviors that take place at SLHS - behaviors that occur at all schools but frankly with greater frequency and gravity at South Lakes. And this is not a solely a consequence of race, but of cultural factors as well that somehow have evolved to the point where fathers are absent from the home, education is not appreciated, and the nanny state (particularly in Reston) is seen by its recipients as a manipulative source of benefits rather than as any sort of authority to be respected. People do move to the suburbs to get away from these factors - and they should not be made to feel guilty about it - in fact, the incentives to raise a family in a safe and strong educational environment ought to be lauded rather than a marker of white or asian guilt.

In the end, I think the school system is doing what they have to do - they, to avoid an implosion at South Lakes, simply had to improve the physical condition of the school to accomodate imports - white and asian ones - at that - and these imports are really the only way to keep the school viable and keep the school's population from shrinking and the school from "flunking". As the Parents United case before the Supreme Court demonstrated - school success is all about race (why else would have Seattle and Louisville spent millions bringing their cases to the high court) - and white and asian students are very valuable pawns in that game. So while I think Maxwell's points are ones to be heard, they neglect to mention that the real nub of the issue - the game of racial Scrabble that school systems must play. It is the altar to which they now all pray, and it is disappointing to see once again that so few speak openly about it.

Quantum,
I am curious about your statement about the conduct problems at SL. From what I know as a SL parent, I don't hear about incidents as you describe--outsize disciplinary problems. I hear about the occasional fight, but they generally are overblown in the papers compared to what my kids and neighbors tell me.

I don't think you can just look at the statistics, either, because I'm sure there is variation in reporting depending on who the principal is. I've heard of incidences at Oakton from parents there that are not reported in the media, and I wouldn't be surprised if the school is downplaying the incidences. TRICKIE seems to think that there is massive underreporting going on across the board.

So, what are you basing these statements on?

Herndon HS PTA has a good website on the boundary process:
http://www.fcps.edu/HerndonHS/ptsa/ptsa_act/0708BoundaryChanges/BoundaryChangeCommittee.htm

If anyone cared to make such a map with school locations and capacity balances for current plus out years, put dots on for actual locations, along with current trailer counts - the public would have a better idea of what how public resources are not used. That is what I care about since I have to pay for them.

After last year I don't even see why this boundary process is occurring [waste of time and money]. My guess is no one is moving except for the Madison Island and perhaps Fox Mill. Why is Herndon in this process?

Ditto, Quantum. Where's the beef?

My kids have seen two fights in 7 years combined attendance at SLHS. One (last year) was a cafeteria fight -- quickly broken up; no one hurt -- that made the TV news here at the same time my nephew told us about a real scrap at a well-known, well-regarded FCPS high school he attends.

The word is that Bruce Butler, the SLHS Principal, reports everything and anything (and the rumor is that other schools don't...feel they need to), and he doesn't tolerate even minor infractions.

Elegant language doesn't cover the fact that you are insinuating that:

(a) "Schools with lots of racial and ethnic diversity are bad. Gangs regularly torment students at such schools."...as articulated above by Maxwell; and

(b) SLHS is a dangerous place, b/c "fathers are absent from the home, education is not appreciated, and the nanny state (particularly in Reston) is seen by its recipients as a manipulative source of benefits rather than as any sort of authority to be respected", as you state.

However, one says it (e.g., "outsize disciplinary and conduct problems"), "bluntly" or euphemistically: It just ain't so; it's misleading; and it's cracker/racist talk.

PS: I still have family and many friends in the northern Chicago suburbs, and those schools, while very good, have warts, too, and are hardly head and shoulders above the FCPS system.....even the vaunted New Trier.

Taxpayer,
I asked the question about capacity numbers--does capacity include trailers or not? If it does, then there still may be an overcapacity problem. I don't know where to find this information.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Taxpayer,
> I asked the question about capacity numbers--does
> capacity include trailers or not? If it does,
> then there still may be an overcapacity problem.
> I don't know where to find this information.



go to the CIP- in the back of the document detail sheets show the trailers supposedly for overcrowding parked at any given site:

http://www.fcps.edu/fts/cipbook2008-2012.pdf

However FCPS might have old trailers just sitting like abandonned cars at some sites yet lists them on this document. I've seen a parko for strings with infrequent use ...These things are expensive.

Who knows? best info is from kids at schools on trailer usage. CIP also does not reflect chnages in core facilities like at Lake Braddock [renovation/addition] v schools like Chantilly where they park modulars. Hughes showed 7 trailers - yet way under capacity. Hunters Woods is always a trailer park.

school locations-
http://www.fcps.edu/fts/taskforce07/documents/transportationareas07-08.pdf

http://www.fcps.edu/fts/taskforce07/documents/index.htm

fall 2006 trailer maps and possible facility utilization ignoring abandonned car effect]:

http://southcountymiddleschool.org/uploads/Total_County_2006_FCPS_Load_Map.pdf

There is no easy answer to building utilization other than treating everyone the same and using the buildings...the upside to that is lower property taxes. People do hope to bond with schools but when you're talking public schools that serve geopgraphic areas we have two types of schools: community and regional. To a watcher of school board maneuvering, they want South Lakes [Reston's community school] to NOT become a regional school [ie Westfields/Langley] but to change people's community identification. That is the problem here.

Last year they booted Lorton people out of South County which is on the Lorton prison site. meanwhile they left in FFX Station people who want to be South County community.

I think this is pretty absurd how ignorant most of the people posting on this topic are. You can look at all of the statistics all you want but you never went to South Lakes but yet all you do is comment and complain on what you believe to be. Scores maybe lower then other schools in the northern Virginia Area but there are things that have to be taken into account. SL has a great program for LD and Mentally retarded student which results in lower test scores obviously. Also the number of students who are not fluent in english obviously do not score as much. But who actually cares? True you get more funding for better scores, but if your student goes to South Lakes and actually trys! they can go anywhere they want. If your student gets good grades they can go where they want. I have close friends from the class of 2006 who went to Princeton, Berklee, Naval Academy, Air force academy, Juliard, Notre Dame, GWU, and all of the Virginia schools(UVA, W&M, Tech, etc). I know for a fact that the graduating class this year is sending people even more places. You think your student cant go places if southlakes "has a bad academic reputation" then they can stand out in their class.
Every talks about violence and gangs at south lakes. In my 4 years at South Lakes I never saw a fight at South Lakes. Which I am surprised at I must admit. But never once did I feel scared or intimidated at South Lakes. They only time I heard about fights at SL was when racial issues were the cause. Like when a white transfer student from Langley called my middle eastern friend a terrorist. I know that South Lakes does not have the same clique high school stereotype culture that other schools have. There are no jocks that making fun of nerds, or drunk kids that pick fights with kids in the hall. You havent gone to south lakes, you probably havent even been to south lakes, but yet you act like its a inner city school. Try opening your mind and stop being rich, narrow minded and try learning how to interact with all people of the world. Thats whats going to help you in the long run, not being a scared, ignorant, and naive individual which is the type of student that schools like langley produce.
Drugs on the other hand is a hugely lopsided issue. South Lakes is probably the most mild school when it comes to drugs and alcohol. I have witnessed it 1st hand and it is not a big deal at South Lakes. But schools such as mcclean and langley are where there are major problems. When your a rich kid with lots of money and no time, drugs come into play, and bad drugs at that. I have worked and talked with alot of students from other schools and they all say the same thing. While all you parents are on your high horse, your kids are out in your bmw, driving drunk and doing coke. Dont believe me, go to one of the parties that one parent allows and thats the only time you'll see kids doing lines in a bedroom. I have never seen that at a south lakes party. You read in the paper about people dying in car accidents with alcohol and drugs involved. Where do they happen and who does it happen to? I think everyone can answer that, daddys little girl or boy driving high and drunk. Its about time you educate your children in more ways then one.
South Lakes is a good school, but like every school needs improvement. They are renovating the school as we speak and Mr. Butler is/has enforced rules that will surely bring South Lakes reputation back to a widely accepted level. But dont talk about South Lakes when you know nothing about it, you have no idea.

You can judge the school by the way its former students perform. One indicator is how well they can articulate their ideas in English in the Fairfax Underground. Some students are terrific examples of native intelligence and top academics. Others are a sorrowful testament to a host of other less favorable conditions, both nature and nurturing.

Taxpayer,
It looks to me from the trailer maps like the trailers ARE included in the school's capacity numbers. If that is the case, then it would seem that many of the schools we are discussing are in fact overcrowded, because trailers don't account for lack of cafeteria or other common space. Westfield has 18 trailers. Yikes!

It looks like South Lakes will have no trailers--yay for us!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/17/2007 02:30PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

The point of me calling them abandoned cars is that sometimes FCPS leaves overcrowding related trailers at sites that are no longer in use. I don't know what they're used for at schools unless my kids are actually there. What are the trailers at Hughes? Since I called myself taxpayer, I will say that South Lakes is a good return on investment. IB is a pricey program and kids can gt the full diploma at SL's even at it's current enrollment. Small class sizes?? I did like the 2 caf dining rooms.

Langley has problems beyond those noted by SL's grad. Not a good situation and bad admins.

If they redistrict everybody they plan, SLHS will have trailers.

Cricket,
Since SL is not including trailers in its capacity numbers, it won't be adding them when it's full capacity.

They said this at Westfield when it was being built. There will eventually be trailers. It always happens. The numbers they produce from voodoo are never accurate. If you look at the targeted neighborhoods/communities they want to send to SLHS, it will be overcrowded in a year.

there are four or five trailers at hughes

It seems like South Lake's reputation has little to do with the students' opinions and experiences and more to do with parents' cocktail party bragging rights. No parent wants to explain away how their kid's school is "improving" or the value of "diversity" when they are really after the oohs and ahhs about how smart their kids must be to go to a high-performing school. Take a mid-pack kid at TJ and put her in South Lakes, and she'll get into MIT instead of Tech. This fear of putting kids in South Lakes has nothing to do with educating kids or helping them succeed and everything to do with parents living vicariously and their own social standing.

Here's a student opinion or is that an experience...
(page 2)

Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: South Lake Tyrone (IP Logged)
Date: September 02, 2007 06:28PM

Bob James Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...at least the psychodrama may lead to catharsis


I need me some vanilla meat curtains. Mmmm, mmmm, mmm.

The idea that anyone can stop the redistricting through a lawsuit is seriously delusional. Drawing the boundaries of attendance areas is a legislative act to which the courts give great deference. To prevail one would have to show that the decision was arbitrary and capricious. Even in the unlikely event that relevant admissible evidence could be presented to show the decision was arbitrary and capricious, if the School Board presents evidence to justify the reasonableness of its decision so as to make the issue fairly debatable, the School Board wins, you lose! This is an extraordinary high level of proof. The lawsuit would cost $200,000-500,000 and take three or more years to get through the trial and the appeals. Meanwhile, your kids would be going to, and graduating from, their new high school.

There are better uses of your time, energy, emotions and money than a lawsuit that has very little chance of success.

More later.

I wasn't being presumptuous. A few years back students were moved from Herndon high to Langley. NOT ONE WORD of objection. Kids moved out of Hayfield to South county, with no even a whimper. When kids are taken out of bad schools and put in better schools, there are very few objections. If South lakes kids had to go to Madison, Oakton, and Herndon, there would be very few complaints.

Kids coming from all over to TJ is not really a problem. Yes, mom and dad have to travel more to pick up their kid, for the first year or two until the student can drive himself. Most TJ parents don't mind driving across the county. Think of the diversity that their child we experience!

Why would West Field students opt in to Chantilly? Would hundreds of students do that? An academy is a good idea. They could start a bunch of academies at South Lakes, if STu Gibson won't allow a real magnet, like the parents want.

It seems to me the South Lakes community is taking a lot of pleasure in this whole process. So let's just tell it like it is.

No surrounding community wants to attend your lame ass school for all of the reasons outlined on this website. Your enrollment has declined because families avoid the South Lakes area like the plague. You created this mess with all of your project housing. You will have to deal with it without sucking in other white and asian students to bail you out on test scores - how bout those SOLs and failing feeder schools. There will be law suits and this will be stalled... arbitrary how about leaving out Langley and Madison proper - they border South Lakes. Incumbant School Board members Stu Gibson and Kathy Smith will be shown the door and given a swift kick in the ass. South Lakes is the worst school in this area as evidenced by the data on the county web site. You all should be ashamed of yourselves for sucking other into the horrendous mess you created. Like your momma told you - you make a mess, you clean it up.

whatitis and South Lake Tyrone

Race baiting doesn't help find a solution to your socioeconomic status and under achievement.

All of the Madison attendance area is part of the boundary study. Although the Langley attendance area does not directly border South Lakes, the Forestville and Great Falls attendance areas should be added to the study. The entire area west of Springvale attended Herndon not that long ago.

That would enable Aldrin and Armstrong to be added to South Lakes. Both schools attendance areas are predominantly located in Reston. Reston kids should go to Reston's high school: South Lakes.

Be advise, more kids were pupil placed into South Lakes than out of South Lakes this year. Most wanted to get into the IB program.

That still leaves Westfields overcrowded.

More later.

The only part of Madison that is included in the study is the "Madison Island"

Langey does border South Lakes currently, even more so if the "Madison Island" is eliminated

Both Madison (all) and Langley should be part of the study.

Westfield is not overcrowded. Westfield is not complaining. Westfield just had a huge addition.

This whole process would be a lot easier if they did not ignore the elephant in the room -langley and the Forestville Elementary attendance area.

Plus the Colvin Run neighborhood [Langley]that accesses Hunter Mill between the Madison Island and SL's areas.

Forestville/Langley does border Forest Edge/South Lakes for a wide stretch along Route 7.

Gibson weirdly still has his Reston HOA Field view /stones Throw people at Forestville instead of Aldrin [hugely undercapacity] and Forestville borders Herndon feeders like Dranesville also. Anyone know where the bowling alley is located? Herndon or Sterling?

Forestville got a modular building even though it is on a septic site and we have to pay pump and haul. That site was bubbling up and Gibson/Strauss gave it a modular rather than move anyone out to other schools years ago.

They could have at least parked the mobile building at a different site.

Although the Langley attendance
> area does not directly border South Lakes, the
> Forestville and Great Falls attendance areas
> should be added to the study. The entire area
> west of Springvale attended Herndon not that long
> ago.

see above on Langley boundaries - correct on Springvale - but not other point...

Went to the South Lakes PTA meeting last night. Straight from Bruce Butler--43 students placed into SL this year, 16 placed out.

Also discussed was the reasons for declining enrollment--one is that a lot of retirees have chosen to stay in Reston, not allowing turnover. Also, much of the development in Reston is of the condo variety--not bought by people with kids. Another theory is the difficulty imposed by RA on renovating homes. So, there are lots of reasons.

Gibson was asked about the Langley boundary and why Langley is not included in the study. His answer was blather, so not worth repeating, even if I could remember it.

Sounds like AP ,may be on the table.

Taxpayer,
You're posts are spot on, lots of good information.

I'm sure you know that the tax rate will be raised next year to make up for our lower assessments. Connelly would have loved to do it this year, but with the whole board up for re election, he couldn't do it. Once Connelly is re elected, he and the democrat board will be VERY happy to raise the tax rate, ASAP.

I heard this at a meeting between the school superintendent and the county executive, a year ago. People in the education community wanted the tax rate raised this year, 2008, but the county executive explained that couldn't happen until after the election. School officials were bummed. Being good democrats, they never met a tax that couldn't be increased. They can't wait to take more money out of our pockets to pay for those low performing schools that they lack the will(not money) to fix.

Yes, South Lakes will try to claim that they have an AP program, to prevent parents from using that as an avenue out.

Did Bruce Butler say that 43 students voluntarily placed into South Lakes last year? Or were sent there when they were expelled from other high schools? Or the school population simply increased by 43? Or some of them came there for one language class? I find it VERY hard to believe that 43 students want the IB program over AP. If that were true, why bother with an AP program? If that were true, all schools with IB would be increasing in population and schools with AP would be decreasing. That has never happened.

Yes, Reston has lots of problems attracting families with children, for a whole variety of reasons. That's what the people of Reston have chosen. They want more high rises, more condos, more of an urban landscape, with no new single family homes or additions on existing homes. Great! Their CHOICE. I fully support communities deciding how they want their community to be. But they should not ask others, outside of Reston, to pay for those choices. Children whose families never wanted to live in urban Reston shouldn't be forced to attend schools in Reston simply because the decisions of Reston residents result in fewer students to attend their schools. Don't make people outside of Reston pay for YOUR choices. Let them also choose their community, and their community schools.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Went to the South Lakes PTA meeting last night.
> Straight from Bruce Butler--43 students placed
> into SL this year, 16 placed out.
>
> Also discussed was the reasons for declining
> enrollment--one is that a lot of retirees have
> chosen to stay in Reston, not allowing turnover.
> Also, much of the development in Reston is of the
> condo variety--not bought by people with kids.
> Another theory is the difficulty imposed by RA on
> renovating homes. So, there are lots of reasons.
>
> Gibson was asked about the Langley boundary and
> why Langley is not included in the study. His
> answer was blather, so not worth repeating, even
> if I could remember it.
>
> Sounds like AP ,may be on the table.


Thanks for the update. I hope some of the positive info regarding SL gets out. Any more specifics on AP?

Stu Gibson and Kathy Smith and Janie Strauss have made it quite clear that Langley high school boundaries will not be involved in any redistricting. Off the table. Period. When they are re elected, Stu will decide who goes to South Lakes, and it will be NO Langley high school students. Period. Done.

When Armstrong and Aldrin are sent to South Lakes (Stu's number ONE priority), Herndon high school goes right down the drain. Adios!

Not to say that Stu cares about Herndon. He obviously doesn't, it's not his district., Apparently Janie Strauss doesn't care either since she's agreed to this plan. A deal has been made, Stu can devastate Herndon high school, as long as he doesn't touch any part of Langley district. Nice, huh? And not a darn thing that anyone can do to stop it, other than vote against the bums who have made the deal. If they're re elected, they'll get exactly what they want. They always do.

Yes, Neen, VOLUNTARILY placed in because they WANT to be there. You really are very rude, especially when FACTS get in the way of your silly arguments.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/18/2007 03:40PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, Neen, VOLUNTARILY placed in because they WANT
> to be there. You really are very rude, especially
> when FACTS get in the way of your silly arguments.

I don't dislike South Lakes - I loathe the School Board members who created this situation. Why would anyone vote for Gibson? Stu/Strauss/Zone/mendellsohn did this to South Lakes. Stu's had 12 years and now is trying to redecorate a bath while not installing a tub. What do they think people are? Stupid...

Anybody can see where people live on the boundary maps -- Sugarland to Langley? Gag me.

Neen,

You also seem to forget that Armstrong and Aldrin are part of Reston - I would be fine with all Reston schools going to South Lakes. The only time you mention it is when you refer to the impact of the loss of those schools on Herndon. These schools are part of the Reston community you so like to put down.

You would be better off sticking to why your specific neighborhood should not be changed then constantly blasting SL and Reston.

taxpayer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This whole process would be a lot easier if they
> did not ignore the elephant in the room -langley
> and the Forestville Elementary attendance area.
>
> Plus the Colvin Run neighborhood that accesses
> Hunter Mill between the Madison Island and SL's
> areas.
>
> Forestville/Langley does border Forest Edge/South
> Lakes for a wide stretch along Route 7.

Thanks for the correction on the Forest Edge/Forestville common boundary. Happy add to Colvin Run to the discussion, especially if Madison needs it to make up for losing the Wolf Trap Island.

More Later

> Gibson was asked about the Langley boundary and
> why Langley is not included in the study. His
> answer was blather, so not worth repeating,
> even if I could remember it.

Lets get both Hunter Mill and all of the at large candidates pinned down on this. If there is a difference, vote the difference. Simply put: Mr./Ms. candidate will you vote to expand the boundary study area to include Forestville, Great Falls and Colvin Run? Yes or No.

It is the single burning issue in the school system this year it should be hard to dodge.

I know at least one of the 43 placed into SLHS las year was an expellee from another school

I am an Oakton student and I come from Herndon. I like South Lakes fine. I have many friends who have gone there and come out better people for it. I just don't want to be taken out of a school where I have found my niche. It's not about White Suburbia, It's not about the upper-middle class. Considering I live in a relatively poor neighboorhood for Northern Virginia. For me it's about who I've grown up with and what team I've grown up rooting for. Go Cougars.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, South Lakes will try to claim that they have
> an AP program, to prevent parents from using that
> as an avenue out.
>
> Yes, Reston has lots of problems attracting
> families with children, for a whole variety of
> reasons. That's what the people of Reston have
> chosen. They want more high rises, more condos,
> more of an urban landscape, with no new single
> family homes or additions on existing homes.
> Great! Their CHOICE. I fully support communities
> deciding how they want their community to be. But
> they should not ask others, outside of Reston, to
> pay for those choices. Children whose families
> never wanted to live in urban Reston shouldn't be
> forced to attend schools in Reston simply because
> the decisions of Reston residents result in fewer
> students to attend their schools. Don't make
> people outside of Reston pay for YOUR choices.
> Let them also choose their community, and their
> community schools.

I'm opposed to IB too. But if more people are attracted to it than seek AP elsewhere, it means fewer kids have to have their boundary changed.

We also know that several of the out placed former SL students who claimed they were moving for AP were really trying to get away from the miserable coaching staff of too many South Lakes teams, baseball being the largest number. People do this all the time. Many of us remember Kara Lawson's odyssey around Fairfax in search of a pliable coach before she went off to Pat Summit and ESPN.

Even if one accounts for all the families who moved out of Reston to escape Railly Rodreguiz (South Lakes' former disaster of a prinicpal), it doesn’t explain the 700 child shortfall in enrollment at South Lakes. My 25 year old neighborhood gives the good explanation for this shortfall. When we moved here in 1984 there were over 24 kids in these 32 houses. Now there are three. Many of the long present homeowners are empty nesters who stayed in the neighborhood after their children left for college because They Like Reston. The other houses that were formerly occupied by families with children are now occupied by single people with roomates helping to pay the mortgage or young couple with no kids. The principal reason is that these circa 1980 “starter” homes have increase in value by 320% since we moved in and 700% since they were first built. Most of that appreciation happened during the final years of Railly's reign of terror! Families with kids get a bigger house and lot at a lower price per square foot buying a house in Winchester, Martinsburg, WV or Harrisburg, PA and that's where they are moving to. There haven’t been a significant number of new single family detached houses or townhouses built in the South Lakes or Herndon attendance areas in 15 years and there won't be either. It's a natural evolution seen in every community across the County and across the nation that started construction in 1965.

The high rises and condos contemplated near the Metro stations won't generate many kids either.

Aldrin and Armstrong are part of Reston and those kids belong at South Lakes.

If you don't want Fox Mill, McNair or Floris added to Herndon, and I'm not sure why, get Strauss to expand the study to include Forestville, Great Falls or Colvin Run. Ask her and her opponent the question before the election and vote the difference. Write a letter to the Editor of the Observer and demand a straight answer from Strauss.

More later.

Can someone tell me if theyre moving current students aswell?

Cricket Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I know at least one of the 43 placed into SLHS las
> year was an expellee from another school

The 43 were just the number who VOLUNTARILY transferred for academic reasons. The number of in-placements was many more than 43. The "expellee' was counted in another category.

More later

CT Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Can someone tell me if theyre moving current
> students aswell?

Past practice is to start with incoming freshman in September '08. If you're
already at Oakton, you'll stay at Oakton. Just get the Oakton paraphenalia out of the Glory Days at Fox Mill, if they transfer Fox Mill Elementry into SL ;-)

More later

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> democrat board

The proper adjectival form for the name of that party is "Democratic." This form of supposed clever insult was first uttered by Joe Mccarthy. Do you really mean to be in the loathsome company of a man who accused George C. Marshall (Marshall High School) of being a traitor?

More later

Thomas,
Shouldnt' they be asking the Langley question of Gibson? He is supposed to be representiing us, after all, not the Langley people. Everyone should ask it of Gibson and ask it of the at-large candidates that are running, and pin them down on it, and vote accordingly.

Thank you! Yes, The tradition of our football team at Glory Days will be destroyed. Thomas, I think you are the most helpful person on this board. :)

CT Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thank you! Yes, The tradition of our football team
> at Glory Days will be destroyed. Thomas, I think
> you are the most helpful person on this board. :)

You're most welcome and too kind.

There's a Glory Days at the Pan Am shopping Center at the corner of Nutley and Lee Hwy which is seems to be closer to Oakton High School any way. Perhaps they will be happy to host your post game celebrations. :-)

That Glory Days is in Fairfax HS territory.

Whens am I gonna be gittin' me some of that white Oakton pussy? I keeps hearin' 'bout this redistrictin' thing, but I ain't seein' no new white bitches. I needs to get my black snake in some white lobbyist's "Little Princess."

Rodney Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That Glory Days is in Fairfax HS territory.

Perfect.

FFX was the one team that South Lakes, though only half FFX's size, regularly beat when they were in the same district. FFX rarely beats any one else anyway. Thus, the Pam Am Glory Days should be empty most of the time. Go Cougars. :-)

It's the perpetutal ineptness of FFX High coaches that has their DSA pushing this ridiculous proposal to realign the Districts of the Northern region. FFX is a D-6 school by population and it's DSA should stop trying to rig the system to cover up for the inability to hire coaches who can teach the game.

Yes, it is Stu Gibson who needs to be asked the question. It was under Stu that South Lakes had that horrible principal. It was under Stu that South Lakes got stuck with the IB program that most parents don't want. It was under Stu when scores began to decline. It was under Stu's watch that a $50 million renovation was completed, with no plan for how to fill 800 empty seats. It was under Stu when Reston elementary schools began to decline and continued to decline without him doing anything to help. It is Stu who has agreed to not redistrict anyone out of Langley. The issues are Stu's, not Janie's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2007 12:50AM by Neen.

Thomas More,
Your comments are very interesting, but with a couple of caveats. What has happened in Reston, is not happening in other parts of the county, like McLean and Vienna. Their high schools are not losing students like South Lakes has. One problem is the Reston Homeowners who won't allow expansion of existing homes or new homes. Young families want homes that are more modern and larger. Single people with roommates don't care. Nor do they care about schools. Families do care. Asian families are moving into McLean and Vienna because the schools are good. Even though they could get a cheaper home in Reston, those families do not want to move to Reston because the schools are not as good. It's not just a natural evolution, if that was true, Madison, Langley, McLean and Oakton would have the same enrollment problems as South Lakes. It's the schools in Reston, and the restrictive home owners association. It's not a family friendly environment.

I'm sorry that you don't like to be called a democrat. I don't blame you, I'd object to being called that too.

Can we all vote Tyrone the teen off the forum?

>>>Aldrin and Armstrong are part of Reston and those kids belong at South Lakes.<<<

OK. The Madison 'island' is in Vienna so they should stay in Madison, Vienna's high school.

South Lakes needs an additional 700 students. From Aldrin and Armstrong they MIGHT get 100 a grade. From the island they'd be lucky to get 30, total. It hardly seems worth it to upset these communities, particularly when neither Madison or Herndon is over enrolled.

If Stu Gibson is going to force students from other areas into South Lakes, he needs to find larger elementary schools, from over crowded high schools to go there.

Look at this and tell me how it makes ANY sense to remove ANY students from Herndon high school when it will soon be under enrolled by 355 students:

http://www.fcps.edu/HerndonHS/ptsa/ptsa_act/0708BoundaryChanges/CapImpPlan2008-2012.pdf

A look at the demographics will tell you the same:

http://www.fcps.edu/HerndonHS/ptsa/ptsa_act/0708BoundaryChanges/HSDemographicsComparison.pdf

Remove Aldrin and Armstrong, and Herndon will look just like South Lakes does now, same demographics, same number of under enrolled. It hardly seems fair to shift South Lakes problems to Herndon.

Perhaps the Air Force and Navy recruitment standards were higher than the eligible graduates. I know that the Army has lowered its recruitment standards. Graduation is a rite of passage. It does signify a major accomplishment. Take to heart the commencement messages. The military does offer significant advantages and should be examined as a potential career, or at least for an enlistment. The benefits are invaluable and could send you to college.

Fairfax Citizen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Perhaps the Air Force and Navy recruitment
> standards were higher than the eligible graduates.
> I know that the Army has lowered its recruitment
> standards. Graduation is a rite of passage. It
> does signify a major accomplishment. Take to
> heart the commencement messages. The military
> does offer significant advantages and should be
> examined as a potential career, or at least for an
> enlistment. The benefits are invaluable and could
> send you to college.

This posting is relevant to the subject of this thread exactly how? Apparently Fairfax Citizen is our local Army recruiter. Thanks for playing, hope you make your quota next month.

More later.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >>>Aldrin and Armstrong are part of Reston and
> those kids belong at South Lakes.<<<
>
> OK. The Madison 'island' is in Vienna so they
> should stay in Madison, Vienna's high school.
>
> South Lakes needs an additional 700 students.
> From Aldrin and Armstrong they MIGHT get 100 a
> grade. From the island they'd be lucky to get 30,
> total. It hardly seems worth it to upset these
> communities, particularly when neither Madison or
> Herndon is over enrolled.
>
> If Stu Gibson is going to force students from
> other areas into South Lakes, he needs to find
> larger elementary schools, from over crowded high
> schools to go there.

The Wolf Trap Elementary ("Madison") Island is not within the boundaries of the Town of Vienna, though it may have a Vienna post office address. The portion of the island west of Hunter Mill is within the 1965 boundaries of Reston

South Lakes could probably do well with just an additional 500 kids.

How about let Herndon keep Armstrong, give Aldrin, Fox Mill and the island west of Hunter Mill to SL and add McNair and Floris to Herndon?

You won't get me to defend Gibson or Butler. Gibson let the Rodreguiz Reign of Terror last for too many years. She chased out the great teachers through retirement and relocation and hired sycophants, martinets, rookies, clock punchers, punks and too many teachers whose command of English was worse than hers, if thats even possible. Instead of cleaning house, Butler has promoted this bunch.

It's still so bad that the first thing every veteran teacher tells a parent within the first minute of any conversation is exactly how many days weeks and months until retirement.

More later

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Can we all vote Tyrone the teen off the forum?


You must be one of them lobbyists. Where's yo girl's phat ass?

I would vote to get rid of South Lakes Tyrone. Go for it, Neen.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would vote to get rid of South Lakes Tyrone. Go
> for it, Neen.


Yo. Don't redistrict me offa dis site, bro!

Then please don't waste people's time with dumb, obscene comments. We are here to discuss issues of real importance to our kids and communities.

Does anyone know anything about Coppermine ES, the one that begin built in the McNair area to relieve overcrowding in McNair and Floris? That might come into play here, but no one is talking about it, and I can't find anything online about it, not even where it is located. It's supposed to be built for 2009.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Neen Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > >>>Aldrin and Armstrong are part of Reston and
> > those kids belong at South Lakes.<<<

Armstrong has a lot of core herndon kids. Aldrin could undergo boundary chnages wth lake Anne and Forest Edge and clearly belongs at South Lakes. Forestville should go to Herndon and there should be a boundary change from Great Falls to Forestville of Seneca Rd while moving others out of Forestville into a combo of Dranesville/Armstrong/Aldrin/Forest Edge. Madison island and Colvin Glen should go to South Lakes along with FoxMill,

The Hughes GTC should be disbanded and the above movement wuld fill Hughes base school. The whole kit and caboodle should share busses for middle and high school since Hughes and South lakes are on the same campus despite FCPS erroneously having dricing direction maps showing them as over 1 mile apart when the reality is they are about 2 blocks apart walking/driving - both accessible via either street entrance. No grandfathering and there might be enough current transporation resources to slide the middle and high school start times for both the Herndon Pyramid and the South Lakes Pyramid. Scrap the IB.

That section of the county has to be handled differently than stuff like Madison or Oakton which do not border other school divisions that do not have bsiness relationships with FCPS [aka city of Fairfax].

As for other schools, they need to use Falls Church HS and domino into that. I heard Connelly's base school is mantua - move him out of the Woodson pyramid into falls Church.

> >
> > OK. The Madison 'island' is in Vienna so they
> > should stay in Madison, Vienna's high school.
> >
> > South Lakes needs an additional 700 students.
> > From Aldrin and Armstrong they MIGHT get 100 a
> > grade. From the island they'd be lucky to get
> 30,
> > total. It hardly seems worth it to upset these
> > communities, particularly when neither Madison
> or
> > Herndon is over enrolled.
> >
> > If Stu Gibson is going to force students from
> > other areas into South Lakes, he needs to find
> > larger elementary schools, from over crowded
> high
> > schools to go there.
>
> The Wolf Trap Elementary ("Madison") Island is not
> within the boundaries of the Town of Vienna,
> though it may have a Vienna post office address.
> The portion of the island west of Hunter Mill is
> within the 1965 boundaries of Reston
>
> South Lakes could probably do well with just an
> additional 500 kids.
>
> How about let Herndon keep Armstrong, give Aldrin,
> Fox Mill and the island west of Hunter Mill to SL
> and add McNair and Floris to Herndon?
>
> You won't get me to defend Gibson or Butler.
> Gibson let the Rodreguiz Reign of Terror last for
> too many years. She chased out the great teachers
> through retirement and relocation and hired
> sycophants, martinets, rookies, clock punchers,
> punks and too many teachers whose command of
> English was worse than hers, if thats even
> possible. Instead of cleaning house, Butler has
> promoted this bunch.
>
> It's still so bad that the first thing every
> veteran teacher tells a parent within the first
> minute of any conversation is exactly how many
> days weeks and months until retirement.
>
> More later

I'm not sure SL needs as many as 700 kids. We should leave some room for growth, with all the development being discussed for Reston. Also, I can't believe there won't be more turnover of houses to younger families soon. Gibson says they do not look at possible future growth estimates unless the developers already have permits. This probably explains why the school board's projections are often grossly wrong.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2007 10:47AM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

South Lakes doesn't need 700 kids - or 500 kids - what it needs, as Gibson has publicly stated, is an influx of the right kind of kids to get test scores up, and make the school more viable than it is in the future. This of course means that South Lakes needs more white and asian kids, and is in a competition to grab them, a competition sponsored if not driven by elements of the school board that find (as so many school systems do) racial balancing a key factor in solving problems. Don't get me wrong - some of the demographic factors about declining number of children in the district are likely accurate and have and will contribute to South Lakes decline in population, but these demographic factors are not the elephant in the room - the need to have an influx of the right kind of students is what is driving the process.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm not sure SL needs as many as 700 kids. We
> should leave some room for growth, with all the
> development being discussed for Reston. Also, I
> can't believe there won't be more turnover of
> houses to younger families soon. Gibson says they
> do not look at possible future growth estimates
> unless the developers already have permits. This
> probably explains why the school board's
> projections are often grossly wrong.

Over the last ten years, the schools staff's projections of the number of students to expect from new subdivision have marginally, but consistently, overstated the number of kids that actually show up. This trend is consistent with trends across the country where Americans as a whole, with some notable exceptions, continue the trend of having ever smaller numbers of children, even compared to numbers seen in the 1990's. Because as a nation, our fertility rate has fallen below the 2.1 replacement rate, without immigration, by mid-century America's population will actually start to decline as has already started to happened in several European countries. This trend is exacerbated in an up-scale community like Reston and is even more pronounced in the low density sprawl around Reston.

The new development projected for the metro stations is 5-10 years off at the soonest. It won't add 20% to Reston's current population of 65,000. Because it will be mostly high rise, there will be extremely small numbers of kids generated by those buildings.

Thus new development will not generate 500-700 new kids for South Lakes.

More Later

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Then please don't waste people's time with dumb,
> obscene comments. We are here to discuss issues
> of real importance to our kids and communities.


Then ignore my posts!

Quantum,
I really don't think you are looking at all of the factors at play. It's not all about test scores--if Gibson was so concerned about those, he would have done more in the last 12 years, like get rid of SL previous principal, and certainly would not have created McNair. And he could have done much more even with McNair and Dogwood to get their scores up, which many other Title 1 schools in the county have shown is possible.

For some reason, Gibson was going on about Westfield being overcrowded because they (the school board?) did a study and decided that 2000 kids is the optimal size for a high school. So he wants to bring enrollments down in schools with many more than 2000. Even though Westfield and Chantilly has the capacity, he thinks it is not optimal.

> Armstrong has a lot of core herndon kids.

What does "core herndon kids" mean. No part of Armstrong is within the boundaries of the Town of Herndon and yet large parts of Armstrong are within the boundaries of Reston.

So does "core herndon kids" refer to a SGA president, the starting quarterback or the first chair violinist? they would be moving because the changes would be implemented with incoming freshman in the fall of '08, also know as the Class of 2012.

> Forestville should go to Herndon and there should
> be a boundary change from Great Falls to
> Forestville of Seneca Rd while moving others out
> of Forestville into a combo of
> Dranesville/Armstrong/Aldrin/Forest Edge.

I just got forwarded an e-mail from Gibson to another SL parent in which Gibson says School regulations preclude the addition of Langley to the boundary study. Too bad he lacked the intestinal fortitude to say that in front of the PTA members the other night. Apparently someone wired that result.

> Scrap the IB.

Second that motion.

More later

Please forgive my typo on the last post It should have read "they won't be moving".

Your error prone servant

Thomas,
What does that mean "school regulation". Who makes this stuff up? Doesn't the school board create the regulations? Can you give us more information so that we can email Gibson about this?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2007 12:50PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

quantum Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the elephant in the
> room - the need to have an influx of the right
> kind of students is what is driving the process.

Sadly, Quantum, you have it precisely right. It's about demographic balancing so the instructional staff doesn't have to actually work hard to get the unfortunately disadvantage kids up to grade level and pass the SOLs. It appears to be all about protecting a seriously disfunctional instructional staff left to us by Railly's Reign of Terror.

But with all of the protests from Fox Mill and Crossfields, I expect our craven Hunter Mill school board member will knuckle under and leap frog McNair into South Lakes so he can get back to his preferred source of entertainment: taking on the "vast right wing conspiracy" to which he dedvotes so much of his energy. (Memo to Stu; Mychelle Brickner's nut case philosophy got her voted out of office sometime ago. You can relax now and get back to making up for all the damage your dear protege, Railly, inflict on Reston's kids for all those years. We still have the scars.)

Adding McNair to South Lakes will make SL a magnet school all right: for the all econmically disadvatage from across the western half of the County. A 21st century version of 1955 Luther Jackson High School. That should please the pretentious swells from "Oak Hill". (For those of you new to the area, Luther Jackson, over by Gallows and Lee Hwy, is the school that crackers built so that all of Fairfax's "coloreds", from Mount Vernon to Herndon, didn't have to commute to D.C. anymore. They were ever so generous to the underprivilege back then. And all this just a single year after Brown v. School Board too. My, they were so far sighted and enlightened. A heritage to be proud of here in Fairfax. Not!)

That's the idea behind the culinary academy (we all ready have two in the County: one at Marshall, another at Chantilly. So do we really need a third one at South Lakes.) See the average wage for a culinary grad., even with a degree from Johnson and Wales or the Culinary Institute, is $40-60,000. That's with experience. Dad and brother hired these guys for Sodexo. Yes, sir, those kids will be able to pay $400,000 for a townhouse in Reston real soon. But at least they can't be outsource to India.

"Why thank you 'Massa Gibson' ever so much you are so kind to us poor chillun, here in Reston."

BTW, I see in this week's Connection that some folks talk about an arts magnet at South Lakes. When you advocate that idea, remember we already have a performing arts academy at FFX High. So you'd nessarily have to advocate for a studio arts academy. But Stu made clear to the SL PTA, an academy was no alternative to attendance area reassignment. Besides, I know of no academy in the County that has 500-700 kids. If someone else does, please advise.

More later

Stu Gibson lied about the exclusion of Langley because of a reg? They have not had town meetings but last year started them on about Oct 10.

Thomas More Wrote:
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> > Armstrong has a lot of core herndon kids...

By core Herndon I was referring to Herndon PO box - some are Herndon PO box and in Hunter Mill with some Herndon PO Box/Dranesville. That circles the Herndon PO Box stuff that goes to Forestville...

I call it core not town since it is Herndon. A lot of Armstrong kids are in Reston but they are supposed to draw boundaries irregardless of Magisterial District/PO Box, etc. The fact is Aldrin/Armstrong are under capacity - concern is adding both to South Lakes is that if those schools approach capacity the Hughes/South Lakes combo would be overcrowded.

What was Gibson's reg? here's a cut and paste from the actual reg on the timeline and it's not Nov yet--

http://www.fcps.edu/Directives/R8130.pdf

The Approximate Calendar September-October: Facilities Planning Services and appropriate program staffs review enrollment projections, program requirements, and school and program capacities countywide to identify areas in which school closings, attendance area, and/or program realignments should be considered. The names of those schools that could be affected by such changes are reviewed with the affected School Board members. A letter informing parents of the need to change attendance area boundaries, and containing dates of the appropriate town meetings, will be sent from each school involved in a boundary study....

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thomas,
> What does that mean "school regulation". Who
> makes this stuff up? Doesn't the school board
> create the regulations? Can you give us more
> information so that we can email Gibson about
> this?

see the actual reg and email all the school board members [except Strauss ?]-
also complain about Langley and the administration there allowing about 200 truckloads of dirt to be dumped without permits and the removal being paid for with public money.

link to the page with the policy and the regualtions which carry out the operations of the school board policies:
http://www.fcps.edu/Directives/topicalindexB.htm#BOUN

Thomas,
You contradict yourself. First you say Gibson wants the redistricting to bring up SL stats, then you say Gibson will put McNair in SL, which would have the opposite effect. What are you trying to say?

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thomas,
> What does that mean "school regulation". Who
> makes this stuff up? Doesn't the school board
> create the regulations? Can you give us more
> information so that we can email Gibson about
> this?

Thus sayeth his craveness: "The Board's policy and regulation (8130.5) do not allow for any such modification to be made at this stage of the process."

As if the School Board couldn't vote to amend, modify or suspend their own rules and regulations whenever a majority voted for it. And he expects us to swallow this prevarication. It's a cop out to cover over that fact that Langley was left out to rig the end-result and preclude the unification of Reston into one high school.

An the coward didn't have the intestinal fortitude to tell us that to our faces at the PTA meeting the other night.

He has no respect for any of us. We are just dopes to be manipulated in pursuit of some undisclosed agenda known only to our lovely and kind "Massa Stu".

Unfortunately, More later.