SLPP, that's what I was saying and have read on the County site, that the number at Westfield will be capped down.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2007 03:39PM by SLVerity.

hmmm07 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cougarmom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > They just may try to overcompensate the number
> of
> > kids to SLHS to make up for all those they will
> > lose to pupil placing and private schools. I
> have
> > spoken to so many neighbors who plan to form
> > carpools to take kids to other schools that
> have
> > AP if we are placed at South Lakes.
> >
> > Looking at this thread, the chances of getting
> AP
> > in place before the kids come in fall of 08 is
> > nil. Also, if they only get a few AP classes
> that
> > don't overlap IB, that won't cut it for parents
> > either.
> >
> > Can't imagine all those "good test-takers" are
> > going to be much help to SL when they're taking
> > tests at other schools.
>
>
> Sounds like the American Sign Language and German
> 4,5 and AP classes at Oakton are going to fill up
> quickly the next couple of years! South Lakes
> wants more students so it can offer more classes
> like these, but it will not happen overnight and
> as long as they don't have those classes, people
> will be able to place out of there, keeping the
> enrollment lower than hoped. Vicious circle.


I don't think that placing out is going to be as easy as that. From what I understand, even if the kids who are already in high school are allowed to stay, siblings won't automatically be grandfathered. Correct me someone if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that both principals have to sign off to have a student pupil-placed. If Oakton is overenrolled at all (and I'm sure those books can be cooked), then no room at the inn. I'm sure that some creative parents will find ways to get their kids out of SLHS, but a lot will find it difficult, and the more who try it the harder it will be. Some people may decide this is a good time to move, some will apply to private schools, but I think that most of us need to assume that our safest best, besides avoiding redistricting in the first place, is to get agreements from FCPS and SLHS about solid programs. And don't tell us to go to TJ if our kids are mathies. To paraphrase, the odds there aren't good.

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm not sure that it would take as long as some
> think to add AP units.
>
> -South Lakes was an AP school until 2001 or 2002.

I believe the announcement was made in spring of 2000 and implemented starting that fall.
>
> -Many teachers are still there who taught AP prior
> to teaching IB.

Many of the AP teachers that my 2000 SL grad had have left. Who did you have in mind?

> -The principal was at an AP school for years prior
> to coming to South Lakes, and thus has a solid
> understanding of the program.

Bruce was at SL in 1999. Where was he before that and for how long? (I'm still trying to figure out what high school he went to and what sports he played.)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2007 05:26PM by Thomas More.

Cougarmom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> To South Lakes Pyramid Parent, what I meant about
> "No Man's Land" is that at this time we do not
> know if or to what school our 8th-grader will be
> redistricted. You are lucky that you know what
> school your child is slated to attend. We do not
> have that same luxury.
>
> My 8th grader wears a cougars sweatshirt to school
> every morning. So, should he wake up one day and
> put on a seahawks one? What to do, what to do....

Cougarman - I understand your point. If I told my 2 SL students they would have to attend Herndon, Oakton or Westfields next year they could call me crazy and probably wear SL sweatshirts to school everyday too (even though I think they already do).

I just wanted everyone to stop talking bad about SL without the proper information. I am very loyal to SL and understand how you could feel the same about your school. I wish for everyone there was a solution.

Actually that's a good point.

There is the possiblity that current South Lakes students could be moved to another school, if they agressively look a the boundaries. Nothing in the study precludes that. How ironic that would be.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLVerity Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm not sure that it would take as long as some
> > think to add AP units.
> >
> > -South Lakes was an AP school until 2001 or
> 2002.>
> I believe the announcement was made in spring of
> 2000 and implemented starting that fall.

I think that's right.

> >
> > -Many teachers are still there who taught AP
> prior
> > to teaching IB.>
> Many of the AP teachers that my 2000 SL grad had
> have left. Who did you have in mind?

Why do you assume they had to be at SL when your 2000 grad was there in order to have taught AP before? Many teachers who have come into the school since came from backgrounds teaching AP. Most had their IB trainig after coming to SL. Larry Ward, English, was actually there before 2000. A good majority of my childrens' teachers had formerly taught AP. Didn't you say your kids didn't take IB? You may not know the background of those teachers.
>
> > -The principal was at an AP school for years
> prior
> > to coming to South Lakes, and thus has a solid
> > understanding of the program.
>
> Bruce was at SL in 1999. Where was he before that
> and for how long? (I'm still trying to figure out
> what high school he went to and what sports he
> played.)

Bruce was an AP at Herndon prior to coming to SL, and before that he taught biology at Herndon for many years.
He did indeed attend and graduate from Flint Hill, along with his brother Larry. I have the yearbook pictures to prove it. While there he played baseball and basketball quite well. Please don't ask me to scan and post the pics. You can ask him yourself.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2007 05:49PM by SLVerity.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Actually that's a good point.
>
> There is the possiblity that current South Lakes
> students could be moved to another school, if they
> agressively look a the boundaries. Nothing in the
> study precludes that. How ironic that would be.

Actually, since part of this fight is wrapped up in the supposedly higher property values of some other school districts, I'm up for that. My kids have graduated and I could use the extra equity;)

foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hmmm07 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Cougarmom Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > They just may try to overcompensate the
> number
> > of
> > > kids to SLHS to make up for all those they
> will
> > > lose to pupil placing and private schools. I
> > have
> > > spoken to so many neighbors who plan to form
> > > carpools to take kids to other schools that
> > have
> > > AP if we are placed at South Lakes.
> > >
> > > Looking at this thread, the chances of
> getting
> > AP
> > > in place before the kids come in fall of 08
> is
> > > nil. Also, if they only get a few AP classes
> > that
> > > don't overlap IB, that won't cut it for
> parents
> > > either.
> > >
> > > Can't imagine all those "good test-takers"
> are
> > > going to be much help to SL when they're
> taking
> > > tests at other schools.
> >
> >
> > Sounds like the American Sign Language and
> German
> > 4,5 and AP classes at Oakton are going to fill
> up
> > quickly the next couple of years! South Lakes
> > wants more students so it can offer more
> classes
> > like these, but it will not happen overnight
> and
> > as long as they don't have those classes,
> people
> > will be able to place out of there, keeping the
> > enrollment lower than hoped. Vicious circle.
>
>
> I don't think that placing out is going to be as
> easy as that. From what I understand, even if the
> kids who are already in high school are allowed to
> stay, siblings won't automatically be
> grandfathered. Correct me someone if I'm wrong,
> but my understanding is that both principals have
> to sign off to have a student pupil-placed. If
> Oakton is overenrolled at all (and I'm sure those
> books can be cooked), then no room at the inn.
> I'm sure that some creative parents will find ways
> to get their kids out of SLHS, but a lot will find
> it difficult, and the more who try it the harder
> it will be. Some people may decide this is a good
> time to move, some will apply to private schools,
> but I think that most of us need to assume that
> our safest best, besides avoiding redistricting in
> the first place, is to get agreements from FCPS
> and SLHS about solid programs. And don't tell us
> to go to TJ if our kids are mathies. To
> paraphrase, the odds there aren't good.

RIght now, Oakton is "overenrolled" by 25 students. Take Fox Mill and/or Crossfield out and put the small number of Navy kids that don't already go to Oakton into Oakton and you are still way underenrolled. So there will be plenty of seats. Why would Banbury cook any books to keep good students out of Oakton? He wouldn't. His sports programs and music programs are going to suffer big time losses with either of those elementary schools being taken out. If anyone doesn't sign off on a pupil placement, it will be South Lakes, and that will certainly not be very good PR for the school if it is trying to upgrade its image.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLVerity and hmmmm07,
> I don't think it would make sense to be moving
> kids from Westfield because of overcrowding, then
> allow them to be pupil placed back to Westfield
> because there are now empty seats. They must be
> thinking about lowering the capacity numbers at
> Westfield.


They are pretty much forced to lower the capacity numbers at Westfield, because if they don't, there is no reason to move anyone out. They will be at capacity by next year and then continue to shrink until they are a few hundred students under the "current" capacity by 2012. If they don't lower their official capacity numbers, then this entire thing is all about socio-economic mixing and they are not about to put their necks out on just that.

SLParent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cougarmom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > To South Lakes Pyramid Parent, what I meant
> about
> > "No Man's Land" is that at this time we do not
> > know if or to what school our 8th-grader will
> be
> > redistricted. You are lucky that you know what
> > school your child is slated to attend. We do
> not
> > have that same luxury.
> >
> > My 8th grader wears a cougars sweatshirt to
> school
> > every morning. So, should he wake up one day
> and
> > put on a seahawks one? What to do, what to
> do....
>
> Cougarman - I understand your point. If I told my
> 2 SL students they would have to attend Herndon,
> Oakton or Westfields next year they could call me
> crazy and probably wear SL sweatshirts to school
> everyday too (even though I think they already
> do).
>
> I just wanted everyone to stop talking bad about
> SL without the proper information. I am very
> loyal to SL and understand how you could feel the
> same about your school. I wish for everyone
> there was a solution.


There is a solution. Leave everyone alone and allow people to continue to pupil place into South Lakes for the IB program. Take an academy out of Chantilly to relieve that school since it will truly be the only one over capacity in the next 2 years and everyone gets something. South Lakes fills those seats, Chantilly gets smaller without disrupting the base school for anyone else.

SL does not want an academy.

I'd been looking for this info and finally tracked it down to share with those on the blog. Historically, each housing type generates a certain ratio of kids per dwelling unit. These are the ratios most schools districts and zoning authorities use. They were developed by demographers and planners doing surveys over the decades. Although, in FFX over the last decade or so, these ratios have predicted a higher enrollment, system-wide, than has actually materialized.

These ratios are helpful in trying to predict the number of kids that the Fields of Herndon or the townhouses at Woodland Park or the high rises around the Monroe Metro stations would generate. As already noted, they are not exact.

I found them under the facilities section of the Schools division by looking at zoning comment letters for different types of development.

Single Family Detached for each house

0.4 kids in K-6
0.071 in 7-8
0.154 in 9-12

Townhouses

0.201 in K-6
0.048 in 7-8
0.102 in 9-12

Garden Apts/Condos etc.

0.170 in K-6
0.034 in 7-8
0.071 in 9-12

High Rise

0.063 K-6
0.011 7-8
0.028 9-12

Thus, 100 high rise units at the Weilhe metro stop will generate 3 kids to SL;

100 Garden apartments in McNair south of the Toll Road will generate 7 to Westfield; and

100 single family homes along Vale Road would generate 15 kids to Oakton.

In addition to the excellent history SLPP related in an earlier post, a lot of which I had forgotten and am grateful for having my memory refreshed, this is part of the reason for South Lakes' lost enrollment and why it will not get it back when and if metro redevelop with lots of high rise apartments.

In order to get 700 kids to add to SL you'd need 25,000 apartment around Weilhe and Reston Pkwy metro. Someone can check but I don't think Reston has 25,000 total dwelling units of all types now. It had 23,320 households according to the 2000 Census. Doubling that number is not in anyone's plans.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2007 06:57PM by Thomas More.

>
>
> They are pretty much forced to lower the capacity
> numbers at Westfield, because if they don't, there
> is no reason to move anyone out. They will be at
> capacity by next year and then continue to shrink
> until they are a few hundred students under the
> "current" capacity by 2012. If they don't lower
> their official capacity numbers, then this entire
> thing is all about socio-economic mixing and they
> are not about to put their necks out on just that.



And this would come on the coat tails of a recently completed addition that was justified by using the current capacity numbers.

That, Cricket, is one of the many reasons I don't trust the school board. If they were truly looking to balance out numbers that is one thing, but obviously they are not. I feel like they are playing whack-a-mole with us for political reasons.

SLParent, thanks for understanding. Maybe from now until February 28, when the final decision is made, our kids should just walk around with sweatshirts that say "FCPS". Not!

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > > -Many teachers are still there who taught AP
> > prior
> > > to teaching IB.>
> > Many of the AP teachers that my 2000 SL grad
> had
> > have left. Who did you have in mind?
>
> Why do you assume they had to be at SL when your
> 2000 grad was there in order to have taught AP
> before?

Because of the phrase "are still there" which is a thoroughly proper inference.

> Many teachers who have come into the
> school since came from backgrounds teaching AP.
> Most had their IB trainig after coming to SL.
> Larry Ward, English, was actually there before
> 2000. A good majority of my childrens' teachers
> had formerly taught AP.

My college freshman rhetoric and composition professor would have suggested that this concept would have been more readily understood if in the first posting, it had been stated "Many teachers have taught AP before coming to SL and teaching IB"

> Please don't ask me to scan and post the pics.

You're right it won't be necessary but the kids at SL might get a kick out of those scans.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2007 08:36PM by Thomas More.

?Stu Gibson's response to the McNair question:

In response to your question, staff advises that, of the 299 students at McNair who are eligible for free or reduced price lunch, 118 (39%) live north of the Dulles Toll Road, and 181 (61%) live south of the Toll Road. This confirms what I had thought.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ?Stu Gibson's response to the McNair question:
>
> In response to your question, staff advises that,
> of the 299 students at McNair who are eligible for
> free or reduced price lunch, 118 (39%) live north
> of the Dulles Toll Road, and 181 (61%) live south
> of the Toll Road. This confirms what I had
> thought.

Thanks for your concrete investigative work and for confirming what you, I, Cricket and others thought. I hope we can now put this subject to rest. Hint. Hint. TM.

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks for your concrete investigative work and
> for confirming what you, I, Cricket and others
> thought. I hope we can now put this subject to
> rest. Hint. Hint. TM.

Actually not. I'm researching some other info and will be back to you. I actually expected the number to be higher than 181 and am surprised that it is this low.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 12:05PM by Thomas More.

Nope,

Sorry we forgot that this boundary study is all about what SL wants. How could we have been so inconsiderate?

Nevermind the fact that you are displacing hundreds of students who are perfectly happy where they are, but will be forced to your sorry excuse for a FCPS. All because you can't fix your own problems.

Fox Mill to the rescue!!!

According to the FCPS latest FAQ sheet, SL is looking into offering AP courses online, for which the student has the pleasure of paying $450 for a year-long course, and $84.00 for the test, of course.

So how well is that going to go over? AP online? I have the kind of kid that works best in a classroom but hey, looks like the board just found their justification for not allowing pupil placement based on the unavailability of AP.

What is freakin next?

Cougarmom,
Can you post the link?

Here it is...

http://www.fcps.edu/fts/planning/westcoboundary/faq.htm

Actually, try to read the whole thing if you can - they've updated their numbers and their explanations to fit their latest scheme.

Correction, that's $540.00 for a yearlong course if it's in addition to 7 courses.

This link will show you all of the approved and pending development that is currently surrounding SL & Westfields, including multi-family and single-family homes. There are at least 4500 new homes surrounding SL alone - where are all these kids going to go to school?

Are these numbers being taken into consideration for redistricting or is the school board going to cross that bridge when they come to it, kind of like what they're doing now?

http://www.fcps.edu/schlbd/DullesAreaDevelopment.pdf

And don't forget about the Islamic school in McLean that the county is considering closing. They'll need somewhere to go. SL would be the perfect place since they want to be socially diverse.

Maybe SL could start up a flight school?

Cougarmom - great find! Everyone should look at the link she posted about the new housing going into the Reston/Herndon area.

This should be brought up at the meeting next week. LOUDLY! Or we will be doing this again shortly,

My take has always been they need to deal with the growth in the McNair/Coppermine area. Looks like there is significant growth in the South Lakes area too.

As an aside - the county is really trashing the area allowing for so many apartment buildings (mulitfamily). We are rapidly going from suburban to urban. And all of the associated problems (crime, decline in schools, decline in real estate values, blight) will follow soon.

Cougarmom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This link will show you all of the approved and
> pending development that is currently surrounding
> SL & Westfields, including multi-family and
> single-family homes. There are at least 4500 new
> homes surrounding SL alone - where are all these
> kids going to go to school?
>
> Are these numbers being taken into consideration
> for redistricting or is the school board going to
> cross that bridge when they come to it, kind of
> like what they're doing now?
>
> http://www.fcps.edu/schlbd/DullesAreaDevelopment.p
> df

Thank you for this gem. I'll bet the houses close to Rt. 7 will go to Langley, even though they would probably be the ones to boost test scores.

According to the latest School Division Boundary Study FAQ, the College Board hasn't offered the AP diploma in 4-5 years. FCPS does give out an AP certificate, suitable for framing, no doubt.

Also the AP on-line course charge only applies if the student is already taking 7 courses in regular school day. One of my kids took an on-line course for one of the 7 courses and there was no charge.

If a kid is taking more than 7 courses, they need to get out more.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 03:47PM by Thomas More.

Cougarmom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This link will show you all of the approved and
> pending development that is currently surrounding
> SL & Westfields, including multi-family and
> single-family homes. There are at least 4500 new
> homes surrounding SL alone - where are all these
> kids going to go to school?

when the pending, approved and under construction near SL (all are actually north of the Toll Road) are totaled, it equals 3751. I think the difference between our figures is the 586 existing multi-family.

I'm also confused by the term "pending", does that mean the rezoning is under consideration or is the project in site plan review?

Using the projection ratios posted earlier is hard only because we don't know if MF means gardens or high rise but if all of the new MF are high rise, only 105 high schoolers are projected. If all the MF are garden apts, then only 266 are projected. So its somewhere in between.

Also noticed that McNair's profile on the FCPS shows 363 free lunch kids in 2006-7. If there are only 299 now, that's a 18% drop in one year!

Too many offensive punch lines jump into my mind.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 03:48PM by Thomas More.

foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:

> Thank you for this gem. I'll bet the houses close
> to Rt. 7 will go to Langley

None of these are close to Route 7. All the Westfield developments are south of the Toll Road and all of the South Lakes developments are south of Baron Cameron. All of the pending, approved and under construction are multi-family.

SLMadre Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Maybe SL could start up a flight school?

Thank you Josephine McCarthy. Or is it Josephine Goebbels?

The total of approved, pending and under construction in Westfield east of Centreville Road is 2814, if the 1704 multi-family north of Coppermine are not existing. Again we don't know if they are gardens or high rise but they would generate between 79 and 200 high school kids.

If the 1704 are existing, then these figures fall to 31-78.

The total west of Centreville Road is 4741 and would generate between 132 and 336 high school kids.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 04:33PM by Thomas More.

The AP Diploma is as meaningless as the FCPS Advanced Diploma. Colleges look at which AP tests students took, and how they did on each test. For that matter, colleges seem to be moving away from their old focus on IB Diplomas and instead are looking more closely at which IB HL courses students took.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We are rapidly going from suburban
> to urban. And all of the associated problems
> (crime, decline in schools, decline in real estate
> values, blight) will follow soon.

With a million people already in the County, I think we pasted suburban quite some time ago and the deluge of crime and blight seems not to have overtaken us.

Arlington has an average density of 7300 people per square mile.

Fairfax is 2500 psm and the part of the County in the boundary study is part of the less dense portion of the County.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 04:34PM by Thomas More.

I think the MF housing will attact the immigrant crowd as they move up the ladder. I think you'll find more and more families with school children living there.

AP or IB mom - from visiting some of the nation's most competitive colleges recently, and looking at their coursebooks and hearing their spiels, I agree with your statements, at least as regards schools with fairly competitive admissions. The schools are looking for challenging coursework, period - and the grades that students get in them. And I might add in terms of accepting college credit, the schools I visited over the weekend in Connecticut and New Jersey do only accept AP credit and do not accept IB credits. Then again, these schools only accept 5's on the AP, and only for a limited number of courses, and are not what you would call places that Fairfax County is in the business of preparing everyone to attend - but nevertheless, for whatever reason, they do seem to favor the AP tests as far as college credit. The most cogent analysis would center around excellent, but more pluralistic places like Virginia Tech and JMU, and in those instances, AP seems, at least anecdotally, favored, at least in terms of college credit, but not, as you indicate, any one way or the other when it comes to admission, which would still be measured on the challenge and holistic achievements of the student.

I have excellent stats regarding our Virginia higher ed schools here and what they accept as far as standard IB, higher IB & AP. Unfortunately, they're on my office computer so I can't send until Monday. The other stats I posted all came from a StopRd parent, so you can bet, word, that they definetly will be brought up at the meeting.

I believe the County uses 1.2 kids per household to determine how many enter the school system, does anyone know for sure?

Cougarmom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I believe the County uses 1.2 kids per household
> to determine how many enter the school system,
> does anyone know for sure?

I posted the School system's ratios by housing type yesterday. They range from 0.4 elementary kids per sfd to 0.028 high school kids per high rise.

Stating the total school load per housing type:

SFD 0.625 kids per house

TH 0.351 kids per house

Garden apartments/condo 0.275 kids per unit

High rise 0.102 kids per unit

And these numbers produce projections that are higher than actual enrollment per Gerry Connolly.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 06:24PM by Thomas More.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think the MF housing will attact the immigrant
> crowd as they move up the ladder. I think you'll
> find more and more families with school children
> living there.

And that conjecture is based on what?

All of these ratios are high based on actual FFX experience.

I'm noticing some strange stuff on the map titled "South Lakes H.S. Area Development."

the "560 multi-family pending" that fronts on bluemont was withdrawn according to the County LDN website. That's where M&S Grille and the multi-story parking garage are located. I doubt those users are going anywhere soon.

the "457 multi-family pending" is on the same property as the Oracle office building complex and I can't find a pending application for that property on the County LDN website.

the "1443 multi-family pending" is on the Spectrum retail center running from Best Buy up to Harris Teeter and I can't find a pending application for that property on the County LDN website. Those retailers are on 20 years leases or longer and aren't going anywhere soon.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:
>
> > Thank you for this gem. I'll bet the houses
> close
> > to Rt. 7 will go to Langley
>
> None of these are close to Route 7. All the
> Westfield developments are south of the Toll Road
> and all of the South Lakes developments are south
> of Baron Cameron. All of the pending, approved
> and under construction are multi-family.


Sorry, my bad. I am just so annoyed that Langley isn't included in this process that I was too quick to snarkiness.

foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry, my bad. I am just so annoyed that Langley
> isn't included in this process that I was too
> quick to snarkiness.

No need to apologize. Most of us have written worse, especially me.

I'm with you f/c/o parent regarding Langley. The reasons they gave on the FAQ sheet about why they weren't included in the study mentioned something about their special needs population, I believe. But don't all high schools have a similar population? They also state that it has one of the smallest square footages among high schools - well, why don't they just release a portion of their robustly healthy socioecomic students to SL, which has plenty of room? Nevermind, perhaps that would indicate the board was taking fiscal responsibility, which we know is not possible.

The housing slated for Reston is either around the Reston Town Center (translation: Empty nesters and singles/young marrieds w/no kids) or near Hunters Woods Shopping Center (age restricted 50+) so I don't think that's the Plan B impediment to redistricting that some were hoping for.

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The housing slated for Reston is either around the
> Reston Town Center (translation: Empty nesters
> and singles/young marrieds w/no kids) or near
> Hunters Woods Shopping Center (age restricted 50+)
> so I don't think that's the Plan B impediment to
> redistricting that some were hoping for.


If what you say is true, then you can thank Cathy Hudgins from keeping your Reston community from being family-friendly by giving developers the green light to build for those demographics. While you're at it, realize what that does for SL - only compound the need to siphon kids from other districts whose parents have made other choices for them. Oh, wait, for a minute there I thought we still lived in America. My bad.

Cougarmom aka sourpuss wrote: blah, blah ".. giving developers the green light to build for those demographics... Oh, wait, for a minute there I thought we still lived in America. My bad."

You haven't figure it out yet, but those 50+ and DINK demographics are money in the bank for Fairfax County: no demand for service, spend scads of money locally, and dutifully pay taxes. They're the ones paying for the exotic Finno-Ugrian language immersion programs in FCPS that Cougar parents love so much.

david Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They're the ones paying for the exotic
> Finno-Ugrian language immersion programs in FCPS
> that Cougar parents love so much.

Now see, if SL could just get up to 2100 kids, it could have that exotic Finno-Ugrian language immersion program too. ;-)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 08:22PM by Thomas More.

SLMadre Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nope,
>
> Sorry we forgot that this boundary study is all
> about what SL wants. How could we have been so
> inconsiderate?
>
> Nevermind the fact that you are displacing
> hundreds of students who are perfectly happy where
> they are, but will be forced to your sorry excuse
> for a FCPS. All because you can't fix your own
> problems.
>
> Fox Mill to the rescue!!!

I will not go so far as to call South Lakes a sorry excuse for a school. However, I am beginning to feel as though any possible solutions to an underpopulation issue are being tossed aside in favor of everything working out the way South Lakes wants it to and without regard for the kids who will be told they have to leave their own schools. South Lakes does not want a magnet, they don't want academy classes, they don't want McNair students. They *want the Oakton students. WHY us? Really, most of us don't mind the drive...we knew about the drive when we bought the house. I have made that drive four times a day sometimes in the summer. I'm happy to do it. Those who hate the drive have always had the option to pupil place at South Lakes, but they haven't done so. WHy? Everyone keeps saying how great South Lakes is for their bright students, but I have yet to hear from anyone at South Lakes who has a middle of the road, average student. What is there for them at that school? WHy are there so many coaching positions open?

Cougarmom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLVerity Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The housing slated for Reston is either around
> the
> > Reston Town Center (translation: Empty nesters
> > and singles/young marrieds w/no kids) or near
> > Hunters Woods Shopping Center (age restricted
> 50+)
> > so I don't think that's the Plan B impediment
> to
> > redistricting that some were hoping for.
>
>
> If what you say is true, then you can thank Cathy
> Hudgins from keeping your Reston community from
> being family-friendly by giving developers the
> green light to build for those demographics. While
> you're at it, realize what that does for SL - only
> compound the need to siphon kids from other
> districts whose parents have made other choices
> for them. Oh, wait, for a minute there I thought
> we still lived in America. My bad.

Cougarmom, I know you are upset, but please don't be angry with me or try to put this on me. Instead of looking at the number of units being built, look at the square feet of land they will occupy. The land would accomodate about 50 single family homes. These are high-rise units that don't have a very big footprint.

THink about it this way: All of those people pay taxes and 50% of the budget for Fairfax County goes to FCPS, so in effect, these single and empty nesters are paying for your kids' education.

Proposal: Why don't we keep all of the tax receipts generated in our pyramid
(from all of the businesses and high-rise dwellers) and that money will just go to the education of students in the South Lakes Pyramid? How does that sound? You can then just fend for yourselves.

For every argument that you present, I can give you a perfectly logical response for why our boundary needs to be widened.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 10:06PM by SLVerity.

hmmm07 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> their bright students, but I have yet to hear from
> anyone at South Lakes who has a middle of the
> road, average student. What is there for them at
> that school? WHy are there so many coaching
> positions open?

I would go so far as to say that the parents posting here from SL have average to above average students and I daresay they are getting the same education as your kids. Consider looking at the scores for middle-class kids like yours, not the aggregate scores for the entire school, which include low income and ESL scores.

Perhaps the school has trouble keeping coaches when the teams are so small, or perhaps they just moved, etc. I think that's a great question for Bruce Butler, the principal.

david Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cougarmom aka sourpuss wrote: blah, blah "..
> giving developers the green light to build for
> those demographics... Oh, wait, for a minute there
> I thought we still lived in America. My bad."
>
> You haven't figure it out yet, but those 50+
> and DINK demographics are money in the bank for
> Fairfax County: no demand for service, spend scads
> of money locally, and dutifully pay taxes.
> They're the ones paying for the exotic
> Finno-Ugrian language immersion programs in FCPS
> that Cougar parents love so much.

David, get a grip on this subject - first of all, I have to assume that everyone dutifully pays taxes, if not, start another thread (btw, I know what you're really alluding to and that IS another thread). Secondly, we all spend scads of money locally, whether it's to sign up our kids for a zillion programs here or to toss a hundred bucks at the Tap Room on a Friday night. My weekly grocery bill alone would shock the living blank out of you, and yes, I pay a sales tax on that. I have to argue that parents spend way more than singles or older marrieds without kids within the County at that particular stage in their lives. Thirdly, 55+ and singles have no demand for services? Are they all in comas? Because if they're alive and kicking, they are certainly using County services, whether they realize it or not.

hmmm07 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I will not go so far as to call South Lakes a
> sorry excuse for a school. However, I am
> beginning to feel as though any possible solutions
> to an underpopulation issue are being tossed aside
> in favor of everything working out the way South
> Lakes wants it to and without regard for the kids
> who will be told they have to leave their own
> schools. South Lakes does not want a magnet, they
> don't want academy classes, they don't want McNair
> students.

Neither the SL school Administration nor the SL PTA have stated a perferred outcome for this process. Most of the SL affiliated posters have not expressed a preferred out come on this blog. So I don't know what the basis is for "everything works out the way SL wants it to . . ."

> They *want the Oakton students. WHY us?

This SL parent doesn't want any Oakton students. I want Armstong and Aldrin. I haven't read an SL affiliated poster express a desire to have Oakton students transferred to SL.

I have read lots of speculation that the School Board will move Fox Mill students into the SL pyramid but I don't remember reading any advocacy for that outcome.

Most of the posters on this blog have expressed support for grandfathering all current students to their current HS. Many have expressed support for granfathering younger siblings to avoid splitting families between two high schools.


> I have yet to hear from
> anyone at South Lakes who has a middle of the
> road, average student. What is there for them at
> that school?

My experience and that of most parents that I talk to is that FCPS pays attention to the top 10-20% academically and the bottom 10-20% and ignore the middle 60%. I've heard that from Oakton, Herndon, Robinson, Chantilly, Centerville, Lake Braddock, Madison, Marshall and SL parents. This SL parent of 4 kids in the middle certainly has felt that way far too often as I have expressed on this blog more than my SL bretheren would prefer.

> WHy are there so many coaching
> positions open?

Read my earlier posts about our DSA, Linda Jones. That will explain a lot. Chapter 3 of that saga will be posted soon.

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cougarmom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > SLVerity Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > The housing slated for Reston is either
> around
> > the
> > > Reston Town Center (translation: Empty
> nesters
> > > and singles/young marrieds w/no kids) or near
> > > Hunters Woods Shopping Center (age restricted
> > 50+)
> > > so I don't think that's the Plan B impediment
> > to
> > > redistricting that some were hoping for.
> >
> >
> > If what you say is true, then you can thank
> Cathy
> > Hudgins from keeping your Reston community from
> > being family-friendly by giving developers the
> > green light to build for those demographics.
> While
> > you're at it, realize what that does for SL -
> only
> > compound the need to siphon kids from other
> > districts whose parents have made other choices
> > for them. Oh, wait, for a minute there I
> thought
> > we still lived in America. My bad.
>
> Cougarmom, I know you are upset, but please don't
> be angry with me or try to put this on me. If you
> looked at the number of units per square foot of
> land, you would find that it would be the
> equivalent of about 50 single family homes. These
> are high-rise units that don't have a very big
> footprint.
>
> THink about it this way: all of those people pay
> taxes and 50% of the budget for Fairfax County
> goes to FCPS, so in effect, these single and empty
> nesters are paying for your kids education.
>
> Proposal: why don't we keep all of the tax
> receipts generated in our pyramid
> (from all of the businesses and high-rise
> dwellers, and that money will just go to the
> education of students in the South Lakes Pyramid.
> How does that sound? You can then just fend for
> yourselves.
>
> For every argument that you present, I can give
> you a perfectly logical response for why our
> boundary needs to be widened.


Thank you, SLVerity. People here seem to forget we all live in Fairfax County, and our tax money is spread throughout. If we had small school districts here like they have in Pa, and property taxes go directly to your district, SL would probably be the richest school in the county. As it is, we are scrounging to be able to offer all the classes we would like for our kids because of the underenrollment.

The school districts in Pa that don't have a lot of businesses have much higher taxes than surrounding districts with more businesses, and much higher taxes than we have here. So if you all in Oakton were to have to "fix your own problems", as many of you would have South Lakes do, you all would have much higher taxes. Come to think of it, we'd have much lower taxes if we didn't have to support you.

And Cougarmom, you don't seriously think that the 55+ crowd demands as many services as families with kids, do you? The schools alone make up much of the budget.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 10:09PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

Dittos, SLPP. I notice that when Cougarmom wants to kick back on a Friday night she avails herself of one of the wonderful restaurants in the Reston Town Center. It's a good thing she doesn't have to rely on FF Shopping Center for her nights out.

SL Serial Posters - Any Oakton person knows Fairfax Towne Center is the place to go.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SL Serial Posters - Any Oakton person knows
> Fairfax Towne Center is the place to go.

Oakton Serial Poster - Apparently not Cougarmom. FFX TC is a cheap imitation of RTC;), but the movie theater is better.

BTW, maybe we'll end up in the same discussion group on Monday. Lively repartee!

SLV,

Agreed. Definitely better theatre at FFX TC--can't beat stadium seating. But we still like Reston Town Center better for the overall vibe-- more like a "real" town atmosphere.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 10:17PM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

I am finding the SL posts increasingly nausiating...

I see your objections to McNair, no different than our (anyone outside your cabal) objections to South Lakes.

Should we be concerned about the number of free lunches at South Lakes?

Should we be concerned about the amount of low income housing?

Should we be sending scouts out to look at neighborhoods?

Is this going to be another long reply? Learn how to say it more concisely.

Word,
I thought you were concerned about the free lunches at SL. Isn;t that what all this anti-redistricting is really about?

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am finding the SL posts increasingly
> nausiating...

Word, I am sad that you find our posts nauseating, and just when I was starting to like you...and was being nice to you, too.

> I thought you were concerned about the free lunches at SL. Isn;t that what all this anti-redistricting is really about?

I don't think that's everything it's about, but it's part of it.

So if the answer is YES we should be concerned...
- Then it is understandable why you don't want McNair and understandable why we don't want South Lakes.

And, if the answer is NO we should not be concerned...
- Then you should be OK bringing in McNair, and we shouldn't mind going to South Lakes.

You tell me, which it is. I am just saying the "high and mighty" SL crowd is no different than the rest of us. We want what is best for our kids.

Word:

No such thing as free lunch.

Not sure why you are nauseated. (Neen ceased the Initial Caps and ALL CAPS posts).

Several SLHS posters have indicated that taking McNair S of Toll Road would work.

What might concern you about low income housing? Elaborate.

If you plan to send scouts, we will provide passwords to ensure safety in danger zones.

Seriously, Word, we already shoulder the burden of enough low income student population in this area. Just how much more do you want we 'high and mighty' to bear?

Why so testy tonight? We were just having a little fun.

It doesn't really matter what anyone wants because Stu Gibson, Janie, and Kathy have already decided what you will get. Community meetings will explain to you why you can't have what you want, why only their solution will work.

Neen, Neen..don't be so cynical. You should show up at the meetings and make your views known.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 10:59PM by SLVerity.

Not testy, just pointed.

My take is - Answering the question requires you to think about the other side of the equation.

I think we've already answered from both sides many times, and have also expressed empathy with the concerns of others.

If I sound Cavalier, it's because my kids had a fine experience at South Lakes, and I know how good it can be and how much better it will be, regardless of the outcome of these meetings and plans.

Exactly, SLVerity.

Most SLHS posters have focused on rebutting assertions about the school and community, and on trying to make the case for what the school and community really are. So, hopefully, people who have concerns and questions can make up their own minds, based on a broad range of information and perspectives.

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If I sound Cavalier, it's because my kids

went to Mr. Jefferson's country club. Yeah, we got the pun.

Thanks for the input, mi padre. I'm glad you are on our team.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLVerity Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If I sound Cavalier, it's because my kids
>
> went to Mr. Jefferson's country club. Yeah, we
> got the pun.

That was not intentional, but inadvertently funny, if I do say so myself!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2007 11:32PM by SLVerity.

SLVerity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cougarmom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > SLVerity Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > The housing slated for Reston is either
> around
> > the
> > > Reston Town Center (translation: Empty
> nesters
> > > and singles/young marrieds w/no kids) or near
> > > Hunters Woods Shopping Center (age restricted
> > 50+)
> > > so I don't think that's the Plan B impediment
> > to
> > > redistricting that some were hoping for.
> >
> >
> > If what you say is true, then you can thank
> Cathy
> > Hudgins from keeping your Reston community from
> > being family-friendly by giving developers the
> > green light to build for those demographics.
> While
> > you're at it, realize what that does for SL -
> only
> > compound the need to siphon kids from other
> > districts whose parents have made other choices
> > for them. Oh, wait, for a minute there I
> thought
> > we still lived in America. My bad.
>
> Cougarmom, I know you are upset, but please don't
> be angry with me or try to put this on me.
> Instead of looking at the number of units being
> built, look at the square feet of land they will
> occupy. The land would accomodate about 50 single
> family homes. These are high-rise units that
> don't have a very big footprint.
>
> THink about it this way: All of those people pay
> taxes and 50% of the budget for Fairfax County
> goes to FCPS, so in effect, these single and empty
> nesters are paying for your kids' education.
>
> Proposal: Why don't we keep all of the tax
> receipts generated in our pyramid
> (from all of the businesses and high-rise
> dwellers) and that money will just go to the
> education of students in the South Lakes Pyramid?
> How does that sound? You can then just fend for
> yourselves.
>
> For every argument that you present, I can give
> you a perfectly logical response for why our
> boundary needs to be widened.


Well that is not one (logical respons) of them you idiot. South lakes sucks and we will not go there, i'll pay ten grand a year to avoid that plague. I'll say what everyone else wants to say,everyone from west/chan/oakton/herndon. we are NOT sending our kids there. we will suck up the loss in property value to our homes if this takes place but we WILL also pay to avoid SLHS. Are you happy now you heard from me and there are hundreds more that will be doing the same. Fill your school some other way but leave us the *&^% alone.

I don't think the question has been answered from either side.

book worm - your answer does not count

Glad you won't be coming Bookworm. You might want to use some of that money for a remedial writing class.

Word, if all of the strawmen arguments for not coming to SL are removed, what will your answer be. Will you willingly come? Or will you follow bookworm?

I think it is perfectly acceptable for a parent to resist changes in their childs school environment that they believe would not be in their best interest.

So I would say YES (we should be concerned about free-lunches, and low income housting, etc):
- I am OK with SL parents saying putting McNair in South Lakes would not be in the best interest of their kids education.
- And I am OK with non-SL parents saying redistricting their kids to SL is not in the best interest of their kids education.

I believe both are true. If we were redistricted to SL, we would go and make the most of it. But that doesn't mean we won't put up a fight. I would expect you would do the same if McNair is sent to South Lakes.

>>>i'll pay ten grand a year to avoid that plague<<<

What will 10,000 a year get you?

>>>Neen, Neen..don't be so cynical. You should show up at the meetings and make your views known.<<<

Since I don't live in any of the effected areas, I don't think I should go to any meetings or express my opinions. The point of the meetings is to convince the community that what Stu (with Janie and Kathy consents) wants to do is the best way to do it. I know because I've been through this twice before. That's how it works. That's how public hearings, or community meetings, or whatever any government entity calls, always work, not just for schools, but any public changes. They pretend to listen, so the community feels like they've had input and have been heard, but in the end, they do what they planned to do from the beginning. If Stu, Janie, and Kathy hadn't already planned the changes, we wouldn't be about to begin the community meetings. There may be a few, tiny, changes in their plan, but nothing big. Of course if it's your neighborhood, it's not a small difference.

For those of you who are determined not to send your children to South Lakes, apply to private schools NOW. Do NOT wait until after the decision is final in February. For many private schools, that will be too late. Apply now and if you don't need the placement, you will only have lost the application fees. Remember Janie, Stu and Kathy just got re elected, they have NO incentive to do anything that the community wants, including grandfathering. Take that into consideration when you make your plans for next year. There are NO guarantees of anything.

I would ask all of you to remember that little you say will matter. Don't get angry at each other, don't fight with your friends and neighbors. I've known people who never spoke again over boundary disagreements. In the end, it didn't matter, the original plan was adopted, but the friendships had already ended. Don't let that happen. Try to remember that it really won't matter what you say or do. Staff and school board have already decided, don't lose friends over trying to change an outcome that you cannot alter.

Word said,
>>>If we were redistricted to SL, we would go and make the most of it<<< You are THE FIRST parent I have heard say that. Is that because you are fairly sure that you won't have to go to South Lakes? Or you didn't buy your house with schools in mind? Just wondering why you are so accepting of going to South Lakes when no one else is.

...just separating rhetoric from reality

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Answering the question requires you
> to think about the other side of the equation.

Try this:

FCPS is one school division. While it has 25 high schools, the attendance areas of those high schools do not constitute separate school districts.

20% of FCPS students receive free or subsidized lunch.

13% of FCPS students are in ESOL.

If a school’s population does not reflect these percentages, than its children are receiving a disproportionate share of the instructional resources of the School division because the teachers and administrators of that school do not have to deal with the extra demands of these challenged populations.

Those schools that exceed those County averages bear a disproportionate share of the burden of these challenged populations. And the kids who pay the price for these disproportionate burdens are the 60% in the middle.

South Lakes has 33% free lunch and 16% ESOL. It is past time to reduce these burdens.

Oakton has only 11% free lunch kids. It’s past time for it to pull its fair share of FCPS' burden.

Chantilly has only 11% free lunch and 9% ESOL. It’s past time for it to pull its fair share of FCPS' burdens.

Langley has only 1% free lunch and 3% ESOL Shouldn’t it be part of this burden shifting. How can it not?

FFX taxpayers are disproportionately subsidizing the kid’s education at Langley, Oakton and Chantilly to the detriment of kids at South Lakes and Herndon that meet or exceed these percentages.

How can any person justify continuing this inequality?

More Later

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> word Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >>
> South Lakes has 33% free lunch and 16% ESOL. It
> is past time to reduce these burdens.
>
> Oakton has only 11% free lunch kids. It’s past
> time for it to pull its fair share of FCPS'
> burden.
>
> Chantilly has only 11% free lunch and 9% ESOL.
> It’s past time for it to pull its fair share of
> FCPS' burdens.
>
> Langley has only 1% free lunch and 3% ESOL
> Shouldn’t it be part of this burden shifting. How
> can it not?



I guess parent(s) in Oakton,Chantilly and Langley school districts work adn tehy speak English. What a concept work to support your family and speak the language of the country one lives in.

TM - why do you think people buy their homes where they do?

THese are neighborhood schools, if you don't like your neighborhood, then move.

THe demographic thing is a hollow argument. Shuffling lines a little bit doesn't make enough of a change in the surrounding neighborhoods to significantly change the underlying situation. Here's the math:

If South Lakes has 33% free lunch kids, then that's about 485 today out of 1450 kids. Say we add 500 kids to the mix (in round numbers), and say there are zero free lunch kids in there (not sure how we do that, but let's say we do).

Now we have 485 / 1950 kids getting free lunch. That's still about 25%. In other words, we went through the whole redistricting process, and the south lakes percentage went from 33% to 25%. And sure, you can say "every little bit helps", but does it, really? All those poor kids we had before are STILL THERE. We have just padded the numbers with kids clamoring for AP classes and economics.

On the other end of the scale, if Chantilly has 11% free lunch, that's about 300 out of 2800. If we removed 500 students with no free lunch to send to South Lakes, then we are left with 300 / 2300, or about 13%. Again, is Chantilly with 13% free lunch kids noticably different from Chantilly with 11%? It's still half of South Lakes.

(Keep in mind that you won't find the zero free lunch situation in the wild, the percentages will change even less than this. South lakes will have MORE free lunch kids after redistricting, not less.)

If you really care about this, you would have to recommend moving 250 poor kids from South Lakes to Langley. :)

The Elementary schools may be 'neighborhood schools', but the High Schools (at least in FFCS) most certainly are not. And as the point was made earlier, the funding for schools comes from FFC as a whole, it is not broken up by 'high-school area'.

So everyone is prepared to come to the Town Hall with their own plan to throw their neighbors under the bus....


http://www.fcps.edu/fts/planning/westcoboundary/townmeeting11-12-07.pdf

How does that joke end? I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outun you

book worm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLVerity Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Cougarmom Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > SLVerity Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > The housing slated for Reston is either
> > around
> > > the
> > > > Reston Town Center (translation: Empty
> > nesters
> > > > and singles/young marrieds w/no kids) or
> near
> > > > Hunters Woods Shopping Center (age
> restricted
> > > 50+)
> > > > so I don't think that's the Plan B
> impediment
> > > to
> > > > redistricting that some were hoping for.
> > >
> > >
> > > If what you say is true, then you can thank
> > Cathy
> > > Hudgins from keeping your Reston community
> from
> > > being family-friendly by giving developers
> the
> > > green light to build for those demographics.
> > While
> > > you're at it, realize what that does for SL -
> > only
> > > compound the need to siphon kids from other
> > > districts whose parents have made other
> choices
> > > for them. Oh, wait, for a minute there I
> > thought
> > > we still lived in America. My bad.
> >
> > Cougarmom, I know you are upset, but please
> don't
> > be angry with me or try to put this on me.
> > Instead of looking at the number of units being
> > built, look at the square feet of land they
> will
> > occupy. The land would accomodate about 50
> single
> > family homes. These are high-rise units that
> > don't have a very big footprint.
> >
> > THink about it this way: All of those people
> pay
> > taxes and 50% of the budget for Fairfax County
> > goes to FCPS, so in effect, these single and
> empty
> > nesters are paying for your kids' education.
> >
> > Proposal: Why don't we keep all of the tax
> > receipts generated in our pyramid
> > (from all of the businesses and high-rise
> > dwellers) and that money will just go to the
> > education of students in the South Lakes
> Pyramid?
> > How does that sound? You can then just fend
> for
> > yourselves.
> >
> > For every argument that you present, I can give
> > you a perfectly logical response for why our
> > boundary needs to be widened.
>
>
> Well that is not one (logical respons) of them you
> idiot. South lakes sucks and we will not go
> there, i'll pay ten grand a year to avoid that
> plague. I'll say what everyone else wants to
> say,everyone from west/chan/oakton/herndon. we are
> NOT sending our kids there. we will suck up the
> loss in property value to our homes if this takes
> place but we WILL also pay to avoid SLHS. Are you
> happy now you heard from me and there are hundreds
> more that will be doing the same. Fill your
> school some other way but leave us the *&^% alone.


Hey, I don't want my kids to have to move either, but you are certainly not saying what "everyone else wants to say." You aren't doing a whole lot to support the case for keeping kids where they are. Then again, maybe you are just a troll trying to start something that doesn't need to be started at this point.

Neen -

For the millionth time: It is affected, not effected. Read more and you'll spell as well as my kid, who is headed to South Lakes.

Also, and more generally: shut up the eff up already.

And to the person who said they'll pay $10,000 to avoid South Lakes, I hope that's for homeschooling supplies. Flint Hill is about $23,000, and also doesn't have very many openings at the HS level.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think it is perfectly acceptable for a parent to
> resist changes in their childs school environment
> that they believe would not be in their best
> interest.
>
> So I would say YES (we should be concerned about
> free-lunches, and low income housting, etc):
> - I am OK with SL parents saying putting McNair in
> South Lakes would not be in the best interest of
> their kids education.
> - And I am OK with non-SL parents saying
> redistricting their kids to SL is not in the best
> interest of their kids education.
>
> I believe both are true. If we were redistricted
> to SL, we would go and make the most of it. But
> that doesn't mean we won't put up a fight. I would
> expect you would do the same if McNair is sent to
> South Lakes.


Word, totally agree with you.

But you have to admit that many here posted extremely hostile and bigotted things about SL without really knowing the facts or even asking SL parents what the real story is.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TM - why do you think people buy their homes where
> they do?
>
> THese are neighborhood schools, if you don't like
> your neighborhood, then move.

Seriously. That's the best you have.

Oakton parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
This is a great reply.

> Say we
> add 500 kids to the mix (in round numbers), and
> say there are zero free lunch kids in there (not
> sure how we do that, but let's say we do).

Most of the surrounding elementary school fit or nearly fit that description, Forestville has less than 1% free lunch. McNair obviously doesn't fit this description.

> Now we have 485 / 1950 kids getting free lunch.
> That's still about 25%. In other words, we went
> through the whole redistricting process, and the
> south lakes percentage went from 33% to 25%.

SL has a capacity of 2100 and if few of the new kids are free lunch, then free lunch goes down to 23% (close to the County average) and there are 12 more teachers to help all the kids.

> On the other end of the scale, if Chantilly has
> 11% free lunch, that's about 300 out of 2800. If
> we removed 500 students with no free lunch to send
> to South Lakes, then we are left with 300 / 2300,
> or about 13%. Again, is Chantilly with 13% free
> lunch kids noticably different from Chantilly with
> 11%? It's still half of South Lakes.

And fewer teachers at Chantilly

> (Keep in mind that you won't find the zero free
> lunch situation in the wild, the percentages will
> change even less than this. South lakes will have
> MORE free lunch kids after redistricting, not
> less.)

Actually Forestville and Great Falls have close to 0 free lunch.

> If you really care about this, you would have to
> recommend moving 250 poor kids from South Lakes to
> Langley. :)

The School division won't let us create a Dogwood island for Langley but that is a really delicious fantasy. How about it Janie Strauss, you claim to be a liberal and concern about the disadvamtaged! ;-)

Cricket Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So everyone is prepared to come to the Town Hall
> with their own plan to throw their neighbors under
> the bus....
>
>
> http://www.fcps.edu/fts/planning/westcoboundary/to
> wnmeeting11-12-07.pdf

Thanks again for pointing us to a great source of info, even if it makes me froth at the mouth a little. I hope everyone reads this PowerPoint.

I have to wonder what marketing genius thought it would be persuasive to show us all the great math courses and electives that we would be leaving behind. Even if parents appreciate the enrollment imbalances, how are we Oakton parents supposed to feel when we see all the opportunities our current 8th graders will miss out on. Then again, maybe there is someone on the school board staff who actually wants us to see the whole truth. If communities are going to be moved from good schools to a school that, at the very least, apparently doesn't offer nearly as many courses, teams, (etc.), then when will these courses be added? It doesn't make sense to point out all the shortcomings of the destination school without also promising to improve the school, and not just by moving in middle-class students. If anything is elitist, it's the idea that just having more "good" kids will make the school better. Are the parents supposed to teach the courses?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2007 10:51AM by foxmill/carson/oakton parent.

FCO Parent,
I think the purpose of redistricting is to be able to offer those courses at South Lakes. Do I really need to walk you through the logic? If more kids are there, as in after redistricting, South Lakes can have those courses. So what would redistricted kids be missing out on?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2007 10:52AM by South Lakes Pyramid parent.

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FCO Parent,
> I think the purpose of redistricting is to be able
> to offer those courses at South Lakes. Do I
> really need to walk you through the logic? If
> more kids are there, as in after redistricting,
> South Lakes can have those courses. So what would
> redistricted kids be missing out on?

Promises promises. Yes, please walk me through the logic. Better yet, please tell me which courses will be offered and when they will start. I'm so happy now, all my worries are over!

South Lakes Pyramid parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FCO Parent,
> I think the purpose of redistricting is to be able
> to offer those courses at South Lakes. Do I
> really need to walk you through the logic? If
> more kids are there, as in after redistricting,
> South Lakes can have those courses. So what would
> redistricted kids be missing out on?


But robbing Peter to pay Paul is going to leave Peter broke. If you take Crossfield and part of Fox Mill or vice verse out of Oakton, there goes the piano class, the guitar class and the AP Music Theory class that Oakton now has because the numbers in the program will be sufficiently cut to eliminate the assistant band director, which would then eliminate those classes. Likewise, the football team at Oakton will be cut by at about a third if you take even one of those schools. Oakton is not over capacity...it is about at capacity. Take out 300-400 students and it just shifts the problem to another school.