Tennessee firefighters stand around and watch a family's home burn to the ground, because they didn't pay a $75 fee.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39516346/ns/us_news-life/

I don't care how much you shout about in small govt/personal responsibility, this is just fucking WRONG. What the hell is wrong with people? Absolutely no ethics whatsoever. This is almost a criminal act.

Can you imagine if someone had died in the fire, or if the fire had spread to other homes?

And of course the planet's biggest asshole, Glenn Beck, went on the air and mocked the guy.

Teabaggers have some wacky ideas when it comes to government, I sure as he'll hope this ain't one of them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2010 07:56AM by TheMeeper.

In all fairness, there's more to the story. The guy said he didn't pay because he thought they'd come put out the fire anyway.

BUT the firefighters only came because a neighbor that did pay the fee called them. And they stayed around making sure the fire didn't spread to the houses of people that had paid. The guy said he'd pay the fee right then and there if they'd put out the fire and they still just watched it burn.

I have mixed feelings about this situation. I sort of equate the situation to having a car accident where you total your car and then calling the insurance company and saying "I know I didnt have an insurance policy before but I'd really like to get one now!" But at the same time, an entire family is out on the street now because they didn't pay a $75 fee and that seems ridiculous. Firefighters are supposed to protect the public regardless of whether or not they paid a fee.

This demonstrates why mandates that require people to buy health insurance aren't such a bad idea. It's one thing to say 'tough luck' to someone who dings their fender and doesn't have insurance, but as a civil society we all know that we aren't going to say the same thing to someone who ends up getting creamed by a car, or who is born with a birth defect, or gets cancer. We are going to treat those people and the whole of society will bear the costs. If this man had been required to pay for the costs of having a fire department, as we all know is necessary.

Withnf Wrote:
> I have mixed feelings about this situation. I
> sort of equate the situation to having a car
> accident where you total your car and then calling
> the insurance company and saying "I know I didnt
> have an insurance policy before but I'd really
> like to get one now!" But at the same time, an
> entire family is out on the street now because
> they didn't pay a $75 fee and that seems
> ridiculous. Firefighters are supposed to protect
> the public regardless of whether or not they paid
> a fee.

Doesn't seem too cool. At least on a humanatarian level it's somewhat akin to the final "Seinfeld" when the gang refused to aid the fat guy in the process of being robbed.

The guy is a dickwad for letting his annual expire though, and I can see how the sneaky move would be to ignore it and expect the same services that others are getting when an emergency arises.

Obviously it costs a lot more than $75 to put out a fire and this is an insurance policy so I don't see how this is much different than someone waiting to be in a car accident before demanding the coverage they haven't been paying for. And this guy is fully expecting a firetruck to be dispatched and a group of fireman to risk their lives free of charge when he knows fucking well what the rules are?

In the end, though, there should have been a mechanism that protects freeloaders and deliquents homeowners in the form of a hefty fine and billing the homeowners insurance policy. Kind of an asshole form of tough love they gave this guy.

And Meeper, I don't think think you can use this as a reflection of what us opponents of larger government want, it's a very extreme and cruel case.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

I couldn't find a picture but if you're ever in Georgetown, look for the big iron stars on some of the townhouses. That's a leftover from the days when the city had subscription fire departments, and if you didn't have a star on the house, you came home to a pile of ash.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

I read a news story years ago about this sort of thing happening. When the volunteer fire dept comes a-knocking for donations, I make sure I give them something.

WingNut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> And Meeper, I don't think think you can use this as a reflection of what us opponents of larger government want,

Based on comments made by Glenn Beck and the writers of the National Review, I'd say it's a shining example of what today's conservative movement wants. There's no such thing as "the common good" anymore in their pinheaded, selfish worldview. They want everyone to be consumers, not citizens.

By the way, his pets did die in the fire.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Can you imagine if someone had died in the fire,
> or if the fire had spread to other homes?

But if you are being a citizen, don't you have a responsibility as a citizen not to freeload? The quotes I'm reading says this guy knew he hadn't paid the fee but "thought the FD would come put out the fire anyway".

You could take it to healthcare also- what kind of citizen refuses to buy coverage, then expects treatment? Or lives on a diet of Budwieser, Marlboros and Big Macs and expects all the quality care and treatment at the same cost as someone who takes preemptive care of themselves and exercises?

And how does that fire department maintain their trucks, pay their electric bills, firefighters etc without the annual payments?

Like I said, the fire should have been put out, but it's selfish "un-citizen like" behavior by the asshole homeowner that costs society.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

Some thoughts I have on the subject:

That community decided not to go with tax based fire service, but rather a subscription based service. It's a right for an American community to self govern and decide it's own taxes and ways of operation. So a 75 subscription seems reasonable to me.

I doubt that this pertains to life safety fires where there is someone trapped in the fire. That would be criminal for the fire department not to act. However they seemed to know it was property only. It's also criminal to knowingly lie to the fire department that there is someone trapped inside, just to get them to act It's not their job to risk their life for a pile of crap on fire, especially when they aren't being paid for it somehow. (supplies, gas, training, insurance etc)

If that one citizen gets service without paying, it sets a precedent for the rest who will also not pay. Before you know it, the service charges more, less pay, and it repeats itself until no one is paying and the fire department turns upside down and collapses under it's own financial weight. Firefighting isn't cheap, and it certainly isn't free to arrange in any sized community.

Tough shit for that guy. He should have paid. If he didn't like how his fire department operated, he should have changed it with his community,
Or he should have moved to another town where they take care of free loaders.

Though I agree on the surface this seems heartless, you need to read the context of why they have that fee.

Where that guy lives is not serviced by a town or city... he lives in the middle of nowhere. There is no tax structure in the area he lives to support a fire department, a simple fact of rural living.

In order to help some of them out, an arrangement was made with a fire department in another, more populated jurisdiction that IS supported by taxpayers of that different area where, if they collected $75 from most people in the rural area it would make it financially feasible for that fire department to go out there and operate. $75 isn't the cost of a single firefighting visit, it is over ten times that. $75 across many neighbors assumes fires rarely happen but makes it possible to service incidents out there when they do happen.

If they put out his fire no one would pay the fee. And if no one pays the fee, those few rural houses would not have any fire department service AT ALL. In reality, the guy who didn't pay is the worst kind of asshole you can imagine... he let all his neighbors pay the fee assuming he'd never have a fire, and because of that he didn't get the service after not having been a supportive community member. He told all of his neighbors to suck it when he didn't pay the fee, excusing it off as he "forgot" to pay it.

If records show he paid that fee in the twenty or so years that community had that arrangement but didn't this year, then I agree the fire department was displaying assholery. If he never paid, he can suck it.

I'm sorry the "whole story" paints a different picture. But the reality is many people who choose to live in rural, remote areas need to agree to arrangements to make some things we take for granted in NoVA possible. Shit costs money, sorry. People who want to live out in the middle of nowhere need to pay it or be more careful with shit that causes fires.

And one more point: when those firefighting resources that belong to the populated town are out there in the styx, they are not available to the town during that time. The town takes a risk every time there is a call out there. I used to live in a rural area and know how this stuff works, and I know exactly the kind of selfish, dickhead asshole that "victim" is, I have seen it many times.

----------------------------------------

"She looks pretty good for 12, admit it." - WingNut, 04/24/2012

"I'm racist too. So what?" - Ellipsis 9/16/2011

"If you only knew who I was, and what I was working to do you would...have the decency to tell me I hated my nation and the way of life. I may not agree with...the government...I hate the "government"......" - Firrat 9/1/10

"there seems to be a queer...why? To try and further demean a defeated... dumb Tea party... I think we need more... far left folks on a regular basis - Louis Farakhan, Jesse Jackson...Al Sharpton" - Registered Voter, 8/19/2011

"If your computer is running slow, or you have any other problems, email me at with the problem and i am willing to fix it, for a price of course" - Taylor, spamming FFU on 04/12/2006. "N****rs as slaves again? I think so..." - Taylor, 09/20/2009




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2010 09:15AM by justsayin.

+1

This is an interesting case and I could easily see parallels of this occurring with greater frequency especially if we move towards the libertarian model of pay for services. I read something similar to this in The Atlantic Monthly (I believe) where there in parts of CA because they are bankrupt, some fire/security services have become privatised. Those that can afford the necessary protection get stellar help in the event of wildfires or other problems. Those that can't...their houses are destroyed and the protection services would do nothing to help.

What that COMMUNITY did was raise the insurance rates for all that live in that jurisdiction. The fire department should have put out the fire and then billed the guy for the call. Put out the fire and charge him $10000 or whatever. It's no different than the counties in this area that bill a person for an ambulance call.

As far as living in a rural area that requires remote firefighting service, that is what special assessments are for. If you live on a cul-de-sac that was recently paved, or if you live in an area where you get your autumn leaves vacuumed up, you probably pay a special assessment. Since you enjoy the road to nowhere and I don't get the leaf pick-up, you pay the tax, not me. There are CIVILIZED ways of dealing with these sorts of circumstances.

If I was an insurance underwriter I would refuse to underwrite a policy on any home in that town.

Britdrnva~ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
I read something
> similar to this in The Atlantic Monthly (I
> believe) where there in parts of CA because they
> are bankrupt, some fire/security services have
> become privatised. Those that can afford the
> necessary protection get stellar help in the event
> of wildfires or other problems. Those that
> can't...their houses are destroyed and the
> protection services would do nothing to help.

Wouldn't you be lead to believe by cause and effect, that something really went wrong with spending to cause the bankruptcy and lead these communities to something appearingly so heartless and mercenary?

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

Britdrnva~ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I read something
> similar to this in The Atlantic Monthly (I
> believe) where there in parts of CA because they
> are bankrupt, some fire/security services have
> become privatised. Those that can afford the
> necessary protection get stellar help in the event
> of wildfires or other problems. Those that
> can't...their houses are destroyed and the
> protection services would do nothing to help.

This case had nothing to do with privatization, and $6.25 a month for fire service is peanuts. The alternative in this case is there is no fire service for anyone in that area. Call Manassas and ask for their fire truck to come and help you here in Fairfax, it is the same thing... people who don't pay taxes into the support of a municipality asking for services from the municipality. In this case they cut a deal, a friggin cheap deal, for a group outside the municipality.

The alternative would have been no fire service at all for those people, I'm not sure why that isn't making sense. If there is no money for the service, the fire response can't leave the municipality and go out there to the styx.

Some thoughts Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Tough shit for that guy. He should have paid. If
> he didn't like how his fire department operated,
> he should have changed it with his community,
> Or he should have moved to another town where they
> take care of free loaders.



And the people that paid the fee are put at risk, along with their property, because the fire department refused to extinguish a burning home because of non-payment.

I think they showed up to prevent the fire from spreading as they were bound by the contract to protect those who'd paid.

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some thoughts Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> >
> > Tough shit for that guy. He should have paid.
> If
> > he didn't like how his fire department
> operated,
> > he should have changed it with his community,
> > Or he should have moved to another town where
> they
> > take care of free loaders.
>
>
>
> And the people that paid the fee are put at risk,
> along with their property, because the fire
> department refused to extinguish a burning home
> because of non-payment.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

This is how firefighting used to work. If you go to Old Town, you will see emblems on the buildings that had paid for firefighters. The problem with this approach is that entire cities used to burn down back in the late 1800s/early 1900s because so many people didn't pay. The Tea Baggers don't understand history, so are doomed to repeat it.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is how firefighting used to work. If you go
> to Old Town, you will see emblems on the buildings
> that had paid for firefighters. The problem with
> this approach is that entire cities used to burn
> down back in the late 1800s/early 1900s because so
> many people didn't pay. The Tea Baggers don't
> understand history, so are doomed to repeat it.

Exactly! I guess no one can recall the Great Chicago Fire. These witless fucks are probably from the same clan in Kentucky that nominated Rand Paul.

I have no problem with libertarian principles. If you use it, you should pay for it. But this case is just fucking obtuse.

Someone help me understand why a "$75 now or $10,000 when your ass is on fire and you really need it" policy would not have worked in this case.

Voter_____ wrote :
> "This demonstrates why mandates that require people
> to buy health insurance aren't such a bad idea."

NO IT DOESN'T YOU LIBERAL ASSHOLE, IT JUST SHOWS THAT
DEMOCRATS LIKE YOU ARE WILLING TO USE A PUBLIC FEAR
SITUATION LIKE GETTING YOUR DOGS SHOT BY LAW ENFORCEMENT
FOR NO REASON, OR HERE WHERE THESE PUKE-FACED 'FIRE FIGHTERS'
WHO ARE SUPPOSEDLY OFFERING A LIFE SAVING SERVICE', WILLFULLY
LET A HOME BURN TO THE GROUND OVER MONEY. THEY COULD HAVE
SAVED THE ANIMALS BUT THEY LET THEM FRY BECAUSE A POOR MAN
WAS BURNING TRASH IN HIS BACKYARD AND HAD AN ACCIDENT.
THIS IS WHY HOSPITALS CAN'T JUST TURN YOU AWAY THEY MUST
STABALIZE YOU TO SAVE YOUR LIFE, BECAUSE UNFORTUNATELY FOR
THEM THAT IS THE BUISINESS THEY ARE IN. SAME THING HERE.
THIS PRIVATE FIRE FIGHTING OPERATION SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN
AND ALL LICENSES REVOKED FOR LIFE. THEY ARE EXTREMELY LUCKY
NOBODY LOST THIER LIVES EXCEPT FOR THE POOR ANIMALS THAT IS.
THEY COULD HAVE BILLED HIM EXTRA LATE FEES LATER, OR TAKEN
PAYMENT ON THE SPOT LIKE SOMEONE SAID WAS OFFERED.

> "It's one thing to say 'tough luck' to someone who dings
> their fender and doesn't have insurance, but as a civil society
> we all know that we aren't going to say the same thing to someone
> who ends up getting creamed by a car, or who is born with a
> birth defect, or gets cancer. We are going to treat those people
> and the whole of society will bear the costs.

SHUT UP!

> "If this man had been required to pay for the costs of having
> a fire department, as we all know is necessary.

ACTUALLY I'M SURE HE PAYS PLENTY OF TAX ALREADY.
TAKE YOUR LIBERAL DEMOCRAT COMMUNISM/SOCIALISM BULLSHIT
SOMEWHERE THE FUCK ELSE.

FAGGOT.
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Teh King Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Someone help me understand why a "$75 now or
> $10,000 when your ass is on fire and you really
> need it" policy would not have worked in this
> case.

That's how I think it should have been handled, but I still have no sympathy for the guy. If someone says "You need to pay $75 or the fire department won't help you if your house is burning down," you pay that shit. That's just common sense.

It wasn't like the guy didn't know about the fee; he knew he needed to pay it and chose not to do so.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Actually, he claims he meant to pay it but forgot.

MrMephisto Wrote:
>
> It wasn't like the guy didn't know about the fee;
> he knew he needed to pay it and chose not to do
> so.

Voter____ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Actually, he claims he meant to pay it but
> forgot.

That doesn't work either. Sort of like how I can't "forget" to pay insurance and still expect companies to cover me.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

I'm not defending him, just making sure it is described accurately.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Voter____ Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Actually, he claims he meant to pay it but
> > forgot.
>
> That doesn't work either. Sort of like how I
> can't "forget" to pay insurance and still expect
> companies to cover me.

Oh, they're talking on MSNBC about the possibilty of "animal cruelty" charges against the fire department because they didn't risk their lives to rescue the mans pets.Waaahhhh.

I'm losing any sense of compassion for this deadbeat yo-yo.

It's a "teachable moment", the lesson being- find $75 a year and your house wonf't be cinders.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

'Mr. Mephisto' wrote :

> "That doesn't work either.
> Sort of like how I can't "forget" to pay insurance and
> still expect companies to cover me.

LOOK ASSMUNCH, YOUR INSURANCE COVERS YOU TILL THEY CANCEL YOU.
TWO DIFFERENT WORLDS.

THIS IS WHY ELECTIRC COMPANIES ARE *NOT* ALLOWED TO SHUT YOUR
POWER OFF IN THE WINTER MONTHS BECAUSE IT IS A LIFE THREATENING
SITUATION IF THE COMPANY CHOOSES TO DENY SERVICE.

SO GO FUCK YOURSELF IN THE ASS WITH A BROKEN BROOMSTICK
YOU FILTHY FAGGOT.
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Wow. While I think the ethical thing to do was to save his house and then bill him for the cost of the efforts, the $75 fee is really the same thing as an insurance payment. You miss it (either intentionally or my accident) and you could be really fucked. If I miss my payment to AAA and I break down, guess what? I can't use their services. If I don't have flood coverage on my home and it floods, guess what? I'm screwed. He rolled the dice and lost.

__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2010 10:56AM by Warhawk.

Fire Protection, just like Trash Removal, are *NOT* INSURANCE.
They are SERVICES.

JUST LIKE A HOSPITAL.

But trash removal is NOT a service that can result in
the loss of life if denied due to non-payment.
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Firefighters have a DUTY to save lives and extinguish fires. These guys sound like a bunch of fucking inbred hicks with no integrity whatsoever. Worst case, take the guy to court afterwards for payment, but don't let his house burn down, even if he is irresponsible.

==================================================================================================
"And if any women or children get their legs torn off, or faces caved in, well, it's tough shit for them." -2LT. Bert Stiles, 505th, 339th (On Berlin Bombardier Mission, 1944).

Troll@AOL Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fire Protection, just like Trash Removal, are
> *NOT* INSURANCE.
> They are SERVICES.
>
> JUST LIKE A HOSPITAL.

Right, because hospitals never refuse treatment if you lack the means to pay them.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Your "duty" comment just isn't true for areas outside the fire response municipality. Firefighters are there to protect their jurisdiction. This was a fee-based way to buy an exception to that rule. If the municipality has to spend money recovering $10k from each victim the service will probably disappear when the first one doesn't pay or doesn't have the money, resulting in all the rural residents having no fire service because the deal will be cut off.

With limited monetary resources you have to think realistically. I understand there is a NoVA bubble here where people just don't understand how much this stuff costs and how little money these municipalities have.

As Warhawk said, this guy rolled the dice and lost. Let's not forget that firefighting carries huge personal risk, and that those "inbred hicks" under orders not to proceed with putting out the fire know that asshole wouldn't spare $6.25 a month for their services. I wouldn't help him either, I'd pull out a five, a one and a quarter out of my pocket, hand it to him, and tell him to put out his own fucking fire.

----------------------------------------

"She looks pretty good for 12, admit it." - WingNut, 04/24/2012

"I'm racist too. So what?" - Ellipsis 9/16/2011

"If you only knew who I was, and what I was working to do you would...have the decency to tell me I hated my nation and the way of life. I may not agree with...the government...I hate the "government"......" - Firrat 9/1/10

"there seems to be a queer...why? To try and further demean a defeated... dumb Tea party... I think we need more... far left folks on a regular basis - Louis Farakhan, Jesse Jackson...Al Sharpton" - Registered Voter, 8/19/2011

"If your computer is running slow, or you have any other problems, email me at with the problem and i am willing to fix it, for a price of course" - Taylor, spamming FFU on 04/12/2006. "N****rs as slaves again? I think so..." - Taylor, 09/20/2009

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Based on comments made by Glenn Beck and the
> writers of the National Review, I'd say it's a
> shining example of what today's conservative
> movement wants. There's no such thing as "the
> common good" anymore in their pinheaded, selfish
> worldview. They want everyone to be consumers,
> not citizens.

YES. This is just bullshit. An emergency room won't turn away someone who comes through the doors with a sucking chest wound and a bullet in the head. If he has no insurance, the cost of his care will get passed along to the rest of us. I've got a mountain of medical bills, and unless I get awarded a tidy sum in court, I ain't gonna pay shit. You can't get blood out of a stone. The teabaggers will cry SOCIALISM!, but do you really want to live in a world where we just turn our backs and let people drop dead, when we could have helped them? What if someone had been trapped in that house? Meeper is right--they want America to run like a corporation--no sense of the common good, of decency, or humanity--just a cold, hard bottom line. How do I make money off this? What's in it for me? Social programs? Fuck social programs! Buncha' niggers and spics sucking the system dry is what that is, right?

Conservatives say the free market will guide itself, but jack shit trickled down to me, so fuck the free market, and fuck these 'firefighters' who just stood there with their dicks in their hands watching a house burn. Welcome to Americorp.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
I apologize to those I unfairly hurt. To Harry Tuttle in particular.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Troll@AOL Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Fire Protection, just like Trash Removal, are
> > *NOT* INSURANCE.
> > They are SERVICES.
> >
> > JUST LIKE A HOSPITAL.
>
> Right, because hospitals never refuse treatment if
> you lack the means to pay them.

I lacked means to pay them when my legs were crushed. I still got treated. And guess what---I AIN'T PAYIN' JACK FUCKIN' SHIIIIIIIT!!!! Even if I don't get a nice settlement, the hospital is NEVER going to see all of the money it took to treat me. I'll pay what I can, but like I said, you can't get blood from a stone.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
I apologize to those I unfairly hurt. To Harry Tuttle in particular.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Teabaggers have some wacky ideas when it comes to
> government, I sure as he'll hope this ain't one of
> them.

You are worried about "teabaggers" that might come into power, yet do not have a bad word to post about all of the demokrats currently in power in the state in question, under which this incident happened:

Phil Bredesen, Governor of TN, demokrat
John Tanner, their kongressman, demokrat
B. Hussein O., president of united states, demokrat

This happened under Obama's watch, he owns it.

The hospital analogy is dumb, that is used to save lives. In this case the non-payer was a deadbeat, an alive-and-well deadbeat outside watching his double-wide burn.

Another district facing this choice right now, which is what others have mentioned. If there is no money, there is no fire department WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND http://www.cbs19.tv/Global/story.asp?S=12927129

------------------------------------

twitter @EyeAmU



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2010 12:11PM by conVince.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> With limited monetary resources you have to think
> realistically. I understand there is a NoVA
> bubble here where people just don't understand how
> much this stuff costs and how little money these
> municipalities have.

Exactly. The place doesn't have enough money to have its own fire department, they need to outsource it. Unless the fire department is federalized, municipalities, towns, counties, etc. will need to provide their own fire services.

How is a rural area with a tiny population going to be able to pay for a new truck? A fire station, with utilities? Water lines? If it's between that and, say, improving the roads so you can drive into town for supplies once a month, guess which one they'll go with?

I wish the guy's house didn't have to burn down to prove such a point. People don't want to pay more taxes, but these services don't pay for themselves.

If the guy didn't have fire coverage, he shouldn't have been dicking around with fire in his backyard, anyway.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Mr. Mephisto wrote :
> "Right, because hospitals never refuse treatment if
> you lack the means to pay them."

GREAT, nothing like a STUPID IRRELEVANT TANGENT.

If you come through their doors in a -get this- LIFE THREATENING condition,
they are REQUIRED to stabilize you, then some private hospitals will put you
in a wheel chair and wheel you out of their doors.

WHY DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND THE FIRST TIME?
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

The article buried in conVince's blather actually speaks directly to this point. different municipality but similar issue... people want to save some money by defunding an organization that funds the volunteer fire department. Dopes.


"Residents in the Grand Saline area say it could happen if the emergency service district is dissolved. In November, the voters will face a decision to dissolve the ESD, which funds fire and EMS. One group of residents, called Citizens For Safety, is hoping to keep that from happening.

When this siren goes off, these volunteer firefighters answer the call. 31 volunteers make up the Grand Saline Fire Department.

"We're hometown boys, and we want to keep this hometown safe."

But, the Fire Department and EMS are in jeopardy of losing funding if the voters chose to dissolve the Emergency Service District. The ESD contributes about $200,000 a year to EMS and fire. "This has to do with taxes. They don't want to pay $80 a year."



Back to the TN incident, I read an article that it was this guy's grandson that was burning something the the back yard, and the guy's son went and actually punched the fire chief and is up on charges.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2010 12:22PM by justsayin.

Troll@AOL Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you come through their doors in a -get this-
> LIFE THREATENING condition,
> they are REQUIRED to stabilize you, then some
> private hospitals will put you
> in a wheel chair and wheel you out of their
> doors.
>
> WHY DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND THE FIRST TIME?
> .

I would not ask a firefighter to risk himself to save some cat. The owner in this case wasn't in danger, there was no human life-threatening situation here.

'Mr. Misery wrote :
> "I've got a mountain of medical bills, and unless I get
> awarded a tidy sum in court, I ain't gonna pay shit.
> You can't get blood out of a stone."

THAT'S FINE, THE TAX PAYERS WILL OBSORB YOUR DEBT
INTO THE NATIONAL DEBT.

> "The teabaggers will cry SOCIALISM!,"

BECAUSE WHAT YOU PROPOSE AS A RESPONSE TO THIS IS
KNOWN AS SOCIALISM.

> "but do you really want to live in a world where we just
> turn our backs and let people drop dead, when we could have
> helped them?

HERE WE GO WITH THE BLEEDING HEART LIBERAL APPEAL TO EMOTION.

> "What if someone had been trapped in that house?"

EXACTLY, THIS IS WHY THE COUNTY SHOULD NOT LET THESE PEOPLE
CONTINUE TO OPERATE THEIR BUISINESS WITH THEIR ATTITUDE THAT
RESULTED IN THE DESTRUCTION OF AN ENTIRE HOUSE AND DEATH OF
FAMILY PETS.

'Justsayin' wrote :
> "As Warhawk said, this guy rolled the dice and lost.
> Let's not forget that firefighting carries huge personal risk,

SO? THAT'S THE BUISINESS THEY ARE IN. AGAIN A LIFE THREATENING ONE.

> "and that those "inbred hicks" under orders not to proceed
> with putting out the fire know that asshole wouldn't spare $6.25
> a month for their services.

MAYBE HE ACTUALLY COULDN'T AFFORD IT?
SPEAKING OF PRICKS, YOU ARE DEFENDING ASSHOLES WHO LET
A MAN'S ENTIRE HOUSE BURN DOWN ***FOR A COUPLE DOLLARS***

> "I wouldn't help him either, I'd pull out a five, a one
> and a quarter out of my pocket, hand it to him, and tell him
> to put out his own fucking fire.

I WOULD SHOVE YOUR MONEY DOWN YOUR THROAT ALONG WITH YOUR TEETH.

'Convince' wrote :
> "The hospital analogy is dumb, that is used to save lives.

WHY BECAUSE YOU SAY SO? YOUR ASSERTION IS DUMB BECAUSE
BOTH ARE LIFE SAVING SERVICES.

> "In this case the non-payer was a deadbeat, an alive-and-well
> deadbeat outside watching his double-wide burn."

SO? WHAT IF HIS ELDERLY MOTHER WERE INSIDE THAT HE
STRUGGLES TO TAKE CARE OF?
ASSHOLE.

> "Another district facing this choice right now, which
> is what others have mentioned. If there is no money, there
> is no fire department WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND
[www.cbs19.tv]

AGAIN, THIS IS WHERE THE TAX PAYERS STEP IN.
MAYBE WE SHOULD STOP PAYING FOR ALL THESE FIRE COMPANIES
IN ILLEGAL MEXICAN IMMIGRANT COMMUNITIES BECAUSE
THEY DON'T PAY TAXES!
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Troll@AOL Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WHY DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND THE FIRST TIME?
> .

Probably because you're retarded.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

You forgot to look into a mirror while you said that, didn't you?

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

troll@aol - please do not talk ever again. you are making all of us look dumb. thank you

Thanks for your input anon-GAY-Libtard.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Has anybody reported that what burned down was a double wide trailer?

A man's home is his castle, even if it's a tent, but shit, I bet it has about a 30k replacement cost tops.

I am sorry about the pets though.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

OK flying f-wad. According to you it is ok to force hospitals, firefighters, utilities and others to provide services to people who can't afford to pay, but it is not ok to force YOU to do the same. BULLSHIT.

Ever wonder why it is incredibly easy to find a doctor that will restore your hair loss, give you an ass lift or treat your impotency, but it is difficult to find a doctor outside a hospital emergency room to stitch you up. It's incredibly simple. The first group of doctors get paid up front for the price they want. The second group has to settle for getting paid weeks or months later, having to haggle over their fees, and getting stiffed on a fair number of them. Naturally doctors move to those more lucrative practices rather than the other, despite ordinary rules of supply and demand.

In the long run forcing companies and individuals to provide free services simply causes them to restructure their business in order to avoid that obligation. If we are going to force companies and individuals to provide services to whoever needs them, regardless of ability to pay, then we as a society are going to have to tax ourselves to pay for them. If we are not willing to tax ourselves then we have to accept that homes are going to burn down and people are going to die.

I had some minor hair loss on my scrotum I desperately needed treatment for. And that sellfish ass son of a bitch doctor delayed my surgery almost a week because he went to Haiti to help burn victims.

Some shit really gets my goat, ya know?


Bill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> OK flying f-wad. According to you it is ok to
> force hospitals, firefighters, utilities and
> others to provide services to people who can't
> afford to pay, but it is not ok to force YOU to do
> the same. BULLSHIT.
>
> Ever wonder why it is incredibly easy to find a
> doctor that will restore your hair loss, give you
> an ass lift or treat your impotency, but it is
> difficult to find a doctor outside a hospital
> emergency room to stitch you up. It's incredibly
> simple. The first group of doctors get paid up
> front for the price they want. The second group
> has to settle for getting paid weeks or months
> later, having to haggle over their fees, and
> getting stiffed on a fair number of them.
> Naturally doctors move to those more lucrative
> practices rather than the other, despite ordinary
> rules of supply and demand.
>
> In the long run forcing companies and individuals
> to provide free services simply causes them to
> restructure their business in order to avoid that
> obligation. If we are going to force companies
> and individuals to provide services to whoever
> needs them, regardless of ability to pay, then we
> as a society are going to have to tax ourselves to
> pay for them. If we are not willing to tax
> ourselves then we have to accept that homes are
> going to burn down and people are going to die.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

Warhawk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow. While I think the ethical thing to do was to
> save his house and then bill him for the cost of
> the efforts, the $75 fee is really the same thing
> as an insurance payment. You miss it (either
> intentionally or my accident) and you could be
> really fucked. If I miss my payment to AAA and I
> break down, guess what? I can't use their
> services. If I don't have flood coverage on my
> home and it floods, guess what? I'm screwed. He
> rolled the dice and lost.

This could be remedied by a simple change in how they assess the $75 fee. They tell folks it is $75 up front for the yearly fee. If you don't pay it, that is fine, hopefully your house will not catch on fire. If you do have a fire, and you then call us to come put it out, you will be billed the cost of the call - somewhere on the order of $5K to $10K to put your fire out. That can be put in place with a simple change in either the way his rural area contracts to the other county, or by making them sign a letter that they understand the service being provided. If they don't sign the letter, and then they call - you still respond, but you bill them for double the actual amount. Then they can figure out how to pay it or have a lien placed on them. I mean there are plenty of legal ways to deal with it, and the lesson would still be learned - that for not paying $75 he now owes them $20K.

This has nothing to do with what the Tea party or folks of that ilk believe - not even sure why they were brought into it other than some hyper-obsession WTL, TheMeeper and others have with them. Like every story has a Tea Party lesson behind it or something. I don't remember anyone calling for abolishment of taxpayer provided, or volunteer, community supported fire departments.

The difference here is a house burning down affects not just the homeowner, but also the neighbors. Regarding health care - the additional costs for paying for services for the uninsured was already built in to the premiums we all paid, and the costs the hospitals billed for services. The mantra of Obamacare was to lower costs by increasing paying subscribers - instead we are seeing massive boosts in costs to cover the increased subscribers - and also we are seeing employers opting to drop coverage. So far it seems to have everything moving exactly the opposite of the promises. An Analogy to fire/rescue services doesn't even make sense other than if the person going to the hospital has the plague or a virulent flu and they have to protect the community from the person being able to spread the infection - so they opt to isolate the person without insurance and treat them for the good of the community. That is closer to being analogous to the fire department situation.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2010 09:58PM by Registered Voter.

I'm perfeclty cool with this. Pay a voluntary fee for a government service, or opt out of the service.

Just don't whine when your house burns down.

As for "ethics", this is much more ethical than forcing people to pay taxes at the point of a gun and then blowing the tax money on fucking police helicopters and a Taj Majal county government center.

Besides, I'd pay $75 if it meant lower taxes.

Back in the day, when Ben Franklin started fire companies in Philly, it was a private business. You paid your fee, and you got a "fire mark" on your house that indicated your house was to be protected. Don't pay, too bad. I guess old Ben wasn't "ethical" either?

Today, these fire marks are decorative ornaments on the front of houses; many houses in Old Town have them.

When I was a teen I saw a neighborhood house engulfed in flames. Volunteer companies from all over came to fight it. It was horrifying. The owners were away when it started, but came back hysterical. They left their toddlers in our yard while they frantically ran amongst the firefighters, screaming and shouting as everything they owned burned. It was really a nightmare and it bothered me for years. A whole house, everything they owned, all gone.

No one who saw this cared if they paid their "dues".

I can't imagine how any firefighter with firefighting equipment could stand idle through something like that. There's a point where people are just human beings, and not some kind of fee to be tallied.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When I was a teen I saw a neighborhood house
> engulfed in flames. Volunteer companies from all
> over came to fight it. It was horrifying. The
> owners were away when it started, but came back
> hysterical. They left their toddlers in our yard
> while they frantically ran amongst the
> firefighters, screaming and shouting as everything
> they owned burned. It was really a nightmare and
> it bothered me for years. A whole house,
> everything they owned, all gone.
>
> No one who saw this cared if they paid their
> "dues".
>
> I can't imagine how any firefighter with
> firefighting equipment could stand idle through
> something like that. There's a point where people
> are just human beings, and not some kind of fee to
> be tallied.

I totally agree with you on this. But fire-fighting and police services are something that has to be performed for everyone. What, if you don't pay your police services fee and you get robbed, oh well? That would be stupid and I think everyone would agree on that.

On the other hand, in most cases healthcare is not an issue that is going to affect everyone else around you. In all seriousness, and I said this back through the debates on this - if they had pushed that they were going to pass a health care 'tax' surcharge on to everyone, that would have made more sense, and could have been packaged to show how it was something to bolster medicaid. Now, I am not saying it would have passed - but the problem you had was the Democrats did not want to pass anything that had the word tax in it - since Obama had made the pledge to not raise taxes. And any tax of this nature was sure to affect everyone. So instead they passed this BS bill with mandated penalties if you didn't participate, and we ended up with a load of shit. Now they are in court arguing that they really passed a tax. What a load of crap. At least if they passed it as a tax increase to fund medicaid, it would have made more sense and put it in to comparison with the fire fighter/police analogies. Or, they just need to come up with a plan to tell the states they have to offer health services just like they provide police and fire services, and raise taxes accordingly whether they want to or not. Or, we just leave the system the way it is, and have folks that can pay for health care do that - then tell the folks with no health care - hey, fuck you, you didn't pay your insurance.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

to bring it back on point,the homeowner was criminally neglegent he didn't pay for the service and his grandson was burning trash which got out of control and burned the house down. i own rural property where the only fire protection is volunteer firefighters they relly on donations and they bill for ambulance service.it's not a new concept and if you saw any of the interviews you could tell he was a local so he new the deal and rolled the dice and lost.his fault,so play the blame game if you want,but my opinion is the fault lies clearly with the property owners,as i'm sure any arson investigator for his insurance carrier will find.if you feel that bad how bout starting a relief fund for him with your own liberal bleading heart monies instead of laying blame with a fire company that is and has been a pat for service in his area for decades.

Registered Voter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This could be remedied by a simple change in how
> they assess the $75 fee. They tell folks it is $75
> up front for the yearly fee. If you don't pay it,
> that is fine, hopefully your house will not catch
> on fire. If you do have a fire, and you then call
> us to come put it out, you will be billed the cost
> of the call - somewhere on the order of $5K to
> $10K to put your fire out.

Actually in the case of this TN area, $75 is the yearly opt-in-for-fire-protection fee, and if they respond to a fire it is a further $500 charge. Your solution, while logical, doesn't take into account that the municipality will not collect those fees. The homeowners will say the insurance company needs to pay it, the insurance companies will disagree, and the town will have to hire one or two people just to deal with the collections. Of course there is no money for that, which is why the paltry $75/yr fee was there in the first place.


I read a report that this homeowner claims he paid the fee in past years but didn't get around to paying it yet this year because the fire house is on "the other side of the town." If the town corroborates that then it was dickish of the fire department not to respond. But it also tells you the distances we're talking about... it was far enough away that this homeowner couldn't get to it yet this year, and it was end of September when the fire happened.

I bet everyone in those rural areas got their fees in this week!

----------------------------------------

"She looks pretty good for 12, admit it." - WingNut, 04/24/2012

"I'm racist too. So what?" - Ellipsis 9/16/2011

"If you only knew who I was, and what I was working to do you would...have the decency to tell me I hated my nation and the way of life. I may not agree with...the government...I hate the "government"......" - Firrat 9/1/10

"there seems to be a queer...why? To try and further demean a defeated... dumb Tea party... I think we need more... far left folks on a regular basis - Louis Farakhan, Jesse Jackson...Al Sharpton" - Registered Voter, 8/19/2011

"If your computer is running slow, or you have any other problems, email me at with the problem and i am willing to fix it, for a price of course" - Taylor, spamming FFU on 04/12/2006. "N****rs as slaves again? I think so..." - Taylor, 09/20/2009




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/07/2010 09:08AM by justsayin.

I don't think anybody wants to see somebodys house burn down. the problem is that
this fire dept was more that 20mile away probably more like 30 to 40 mile by road.
How much of a crap storm would there be if while putting out this fire a school burn down in the town? 75 dollars isn't much money even in Tenn but it would pay for more fire trucks and equipment.

Good point. You have to use resources where they are needed. But the fd did make the trip out there so that's kind of moot.

Anyone else besides me mention it was a double wide trailer? It probably wasn't worth saving after a point. I knew an investor who owned a park and the construction of those things is laughably bad and they depreciate very quickly.

Scared me into making sure all of insurance policies are up to date.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

That is why you should never judge a book by it's cover.
There could have been hundreds of thousands of dollars in family
heirloom jewelry or antique furniture passed down through the generations.
One antique painting alone, could have fetched more than you will
ever make in your lifetime, 'Wingnut'.
Not to mention, imagine if a nieghbor ran inside the house trying to
help-without anyones knowledge, and these assholes are just outside
shaking their heads at this guy over money.
A bill could have been written up with non-member penalty charges
added. If the bill never got paid, it would have been a strike on his
credit and they could even drag him into court for shits and giggles.
At the very least, cruelty to animals charges should be brought
against the owner of the company and his buisiness license should
be revoked.
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

The fire department should've cover there ass by putting the fire out. Then send him a bill for the labor and equipment useage.

"This alarms me when someone forgets why we have goverment and began treating it as a business"

If there was someone in there, I think they would have been forced out of conscious to go in after them. Wasn't the case, but can only speculate on how they'd act.

Next time they have a parade in that county, they should let the guy whose trailer burned up put on a fire hat and ride with the guys on one of the trucks. That would be fun as well as fair compensation.


Troll@AOL Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That is why you should never judge a book by it's
> cover.
> There could have been hundreds of thousands of
> dollars in family
> heirloom jewelry or antique furniture passed down
> through the generations.
> One antique painting alone, could have fetched
> more than you will
> ever make in your lifetime, 'Wingnut'.
> Not to mention, imagine if a nieghbor ran inside
> the house trying to
> help-without anyones knowledge, and these assholes
> are just outside
> shaking their heads at this guy over money.
> A bill could have been written up with non-member
> penalty charges
> added. If the bill never got paid, it would have
> been a strike on his
> credit and they could even drag him into court for
> shits and giggles.
> At the very least, cruelty to animals charges
> should be brought
> against the owner of the company and his buisiness
> license should
> be revoked.
> .

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

I have some degree of an authority on this matter - my father. Former fire chief and current resident of Bumfuck, Deep South (United States). He lives out in the middle of nowhere and pays a similar fee. The fees, while not much, contribute to the operating budget of local fire departments. They could go years without having to put out a fire in these out of the way places, so when the time comes, the cost of putting out a fire has already been "paid for", when you factor in all of the "outsider fees" collected over the years.

His position is that on the personal level the firefighters should have put it out and figured it out later, but on the administrative flip side you have to enforce these fees so people just don't pay them and then say "here's $75, come put out out my house (even though I've never paid in)". That's the system and if you don't like it, move into town and pay the municipal taxes to get that service.

The one question he has - had the homeowner paid annually before and the absence of a payment this year was out of the ordinary, thus backing up his "I forgot" story? If so, they should have put it out. They could have checked on this - they have to have some information about his address to know he wasn't current in his fees which likely means they'd have access to a payment history. If he hadn't been paying or was habitually missing payments, then it's the homeowner's fuckup and he got burned (no pun intended).

__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.

WingNut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If there was someone in there, I think they would
> have been forced out of conscious to go in after
> them. Wasn't the case, but can only speculate on
> how they'd act.
>
> Next time they have a parade in that county, they
> should let the guy whose trailer burned up put on
> a fire hat and ride with the guys on one of the
> trucks. That would be fun as well as fair
> compensation.
>
>
> Troll@AOL Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > That is why you should never judge a book by
> it's
> > cover.
> > There could have been hundreds of thousands of
> > dollars in family
> > heirloom jewelry or antique furniture passed
> down
> > through the generations.
> > One antique painting alone, could have fetched
> > more than you will
> > ever make in your lifetime, 'Wingnut'.
> > Not to mention, imagine if a nieghbor ran
> inside
> > the house trying to
> > help-without anyones knowledge, and these
> assholes
> > are just outside
> > shaking their heads at this guy over money.
> > A bill could have been written up with
> non-member
> > penalty charges
> > added. If the bill never got paid, it would
> have
> > been a strike on his
> > credit and they could even drag him into court
> for
> > shits and giggles.
> > At the very least, cruelty to animals charges
> > should be brought
> > against the owner of the company and his
> buisiness
> > license should
> > be revoked.
> > .

A parade F that
Attachments:

Cool, fireball demon.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

The fire department could have billed the insurance company after the fact. They should have put it out because now they have gained the negative publicity on the national level. Who knows the insurance company might sue the county creating a bigger mess for them. I'm sure some jew attorney is licking his chops on this one.

Assuming this fuck insured his double wide. You know, if he didn't fucking forget that too

it's incidents like these that have caused me to lose faith in mankind.

humans have become a terrible and rotten race that is fueled by hatred and contempt. only when there is a common enemy do people come together. it seems we will never change. such wasted potential.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

They should have put out the fire.

And then said.... thanks to those of you who paid for this service, we were able to put out this asshole’s fire.

a lot of excuses up in this bitch. This whole thing is horseshit, end of story. I don't want to hear anything more than that. It's BULL SHIT. WE ARE LIVING IN A SO-CIETY!!! We don't just sit and watch people's houses burn with our thumbs up our asses. That's it. I'm Audi 5000.

Mr. Misery Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WE ARE LIVING IN A SO-CIETY!!! We don't just sit and
> watch people's houses burn with our thumbs up our
> asses.

If this had been my neighbor and had I been home at the time, I would have grabbed a bucket, filled it with water and run to my neighbor's aid, because that's just the kind of neighbor I am.

Alias Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If this had been my neighbor and had I been home
> at the time, I would have grabbed a bucket, filled
> it with water and run to my neighbor's aid,
> because that's just the kind of neighbor I am.

Yes, and when your bucket of water failed to put out the raging inferno that used to be his house, maybe you could try spitting on the fire. Perhaps direct some withering insults against the fire's masculinity. Tell it an implausable story about your childhood.

I'm so unlucky to not live next to you.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Mephisto wrote :
> "I'm so unlucky to not live next to you."

Yeah, instead you live in a single room shared by another grown man.
I bet you guys sleep in the same bed also.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Gravis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> humans have become a terrible and rotten race that
> is fueled by hatred and contempt.

"Have become?" Dude, this is nothing compared to some of the atrocities we've committed against each other in the past. I understand the emotional reaction to this story, but the objective facts serve the "greater good."

Public services such as the fire department and the police department need to be funded somehow. The area this happened at can't afford its own fire department; the only way they can get this kind of service is through the $75 fee.

One person doesn't pay it, and receives the services anyway. This sets the precedent of, "Oh, we'll still help even if you don't pay." Less people pay in a timely manner, eventually the program is under-funded, and everyone's fucked.

Yeah, I wish the guy's house hadn't burned down, but in a country of 300,000,000 people, you can't coddle them all. A grown man should be aware of his responsibilities, and if he neglects something as important as paying a pittance for fire department services, he definitely shouldn't be burning shit in his back yard.

That, like laying down in the middle of a road whilst drunk, is asking for a problem.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Troll@AOL Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mephisto wrote :
> > "I'm so unlucky to not live next to you."
>
> Yeah, instead you live in a single room shared by
> another grown man.
> I bet you guys sleep in the same bed also.

Well, when you can't afford heating...

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13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Mr. Misery Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> a lot of excuses up in this bitch. This whole
> thing is horseshit, end of story. I don't want to
> hear anything more than that. It's BULL SHIT. WE
> ARE LIVING IN A SO-CIETY!!! We don't just sit and
> watch people's houses burn with our thumbs up our
> asses. That's it. I'm Audi 5000.

The firefighters couldn't watch it, they are 30 miles away. Firefighting equipment costs money, and as someone else posted the town is at risk when some hick in the styx lets his grandson burn stuff in the yard and catch the house on fire, and the only firetruck goes out on a minimum 3-hour round trip for the response, during which time something in the town, populated by the people that actually pay for the fire response that helped styx-man, can catch fire and result in human and property loss.

When you post a receipt for YOUR donation of $5000 to a rural Virginia community to fund the cost of one trip out to stop a fire for someone 30 miles from the town that isn't paying taxes there to fund that town's fire response, I'll listen to you because you have put your money where your mouth is. Or even a receipt for your donation just $5,375 to pay the unpaid fees and subsequent $500 response charge of 10 rural homeowners in that TN remote area. Otherwise your posts simply deny reality that fire response costs money. If people are charged a fee, don't pay, and get responded to anyway then NO ONE will pay the fee and the town will simply cut off the agreement and have ZERO fire response, paid or otherwise, to those people even if they are willing to pay. That is why that rural guy is an asshole for complaining. His method and the opinions of those who support him will actually lead to no fire response at all for those people. All because some dimwit is pissed because he spent $75 on his still supplies and shutgun ammo.

As for helping the neighbor who paid, how would you feel if the fire response had to let your house get damaged by the fire from your neighbor's house while they sprayed his place and not yours, if you took the time and expense to pay the fee and he didn't? If they ran out of water on his house and couldn't save yours? That is my sincere guess on why they didn't work on his house, there aren't enough firefighting resources on the truck to save everyone in the remote area, so they prioritized by the people who paid. What other method makes any sense?

----------------------------------------

"She looks pretty good for 12, admit it." - WingNut, 04/24/2012

"I'm racist too. So what?" - Ellipsis 9/16/2011

"If you only knew who I was, and what I was working to do you would...have the decency to tell me I hated my nation and the way of life. I may not agree with...the government...I hate the "government"......" - Firrat 9/1/10

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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/08/2010 10:19AM by justsayin.

Wait a minute, they burn their jet fuel all those thirty miles or so costing the taxpayers thousands of dollars in the process, just to 'prioritze' and stand there being dicks, when that act in itself could cause the loss off one of the nieghbors houses or potentially a nieghbor acting on instinct and running into the burning house to attempt to make sure there are no people inside. Not to mention the lives of animals were lost and valuables that could have been auctioned off if money was the real issue here. Wonder if race is an issue here?
If this were a BLACK family the NAACP would be all over this like some hate crime had been commited. And if these were illegal immigrants...
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Tell it an implausable story about
> your childhood.

I see eesh has brainwashed you!

> I'm so unlucky to not live next to you.

Yes, you are.

My house is aesthetically pleasing to the eye.

I throw excellent parties.

And, along with my fire fighting abilities, I’m certified in CPR and know how to properly execute the heimlick maneuver.

I guess we should go back to a Privateer navy and soldiers who bring their own weapons to war.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I guess we should go back to a Privateer navy and
> soldiers who bring their own weapons to war.

'Apple, meet Orange'

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

Alias Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> My house is aesthetically pleasing to the eye.




-
Attachments:

That's not a bad looking trailer 'eesh', how much did you pay for it?

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

Earlier I posted assuming this was a private fire company.

It seems I was mistaken. It's a government (socialized) fire department. No wonder they provided such flexible and friendly customer service.

tomahawk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It seems I was mistaken. It's a government
> (socialized) fire department. No wonder they
> provided such flexible and friendly customer
> service.

The only way to pay for a state-funded program is to spend state funds on it. State funds come from taxes. Some areas lack the population density to generate sufficient revenue to pay for certain programs. A viable alternative was provided.

If I forget to pay my registration fee and get a ticket for it, I don't get to tell the courts "I usually register my car on time every year, but I was just too busy this year to get around to it" and have them void the ticket. I pay it online, take it like a man, strive to be more diligent in the future.

Not paying for your fire protection and burning shit in your backyard is stupid to the point of negligent. Had the firefighters put it out anyway, they probably could have lost their jerbs. If other residents see they'll get service even if they don't pay, enough people will stop paying that NOBODY will be covered. Someone's house had to burn down at some point to illustrate how important it is for them to pay that shit on time.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

No HOUSE burned down.

It was a gosh-danged trailer damnit !
.

==================================================================================
"Why don't you LOSERS just pack your flower print DOUCHE BAGS
and get your stoopid @$$#$ THE FUCK OFF MY INTERNETZ!"

- 'philscamms' (the YT Watchdog) ; internet & YouTube® extraordinaire.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gravis Wrote:
> -----------------------------------------------------
> > humans have become a terrible and rotten race that
> > is fueled by hatred and contempt.
>
> "Have become?" Dude, this is nothing compared to
> some of the atrocities we've committed against
> each other in the past.

yeah, it was working out eons but in recent millennia it's really just all gone downhill.


> I understand the
> emotional reaction to this story, but the
> objective facts serve the "greater good."

you would be surprised how many terrible things have been done for "the greater good."


> Yeah, I wish the guy's house hadn't burned down,
> but in a country of 300,000,000 people, you can't
> coddle them all.

being a good neighbor does not mean one has to "coddle" people.


> A grown man should be aware of
> his responsibilities, and if he neglects something
> as important as paying a pittance for fire
> department services,

if this philosophy was applied to everything then the society would collapse.


> he definitely shouldn't be burning shit in his back yard.

+1... though it was his kid doing it.


> That, like laying down in the middle of a road
> whilst drunk, is asking for a problem.

no, it's more like driving home drunk. you might make it home ok but everything can go sideways really fast.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."