Looking at moving on from an M4 and looking at 7.62. Debating on whether 7.62x51 is too much for a rifle to be accurate (considering a SCAR 17). Saw one at the range and the dude was having trouble controlling it. The shockwave was hitting me in the next lane. Maybe I'll just be like everyone else and get an AK.

Ur fucking retarded

Pussy ass bitch.

Not only has a rock thrower, but attempts to brag about it.

Lame!

Bragging about what? Trying to get some info.

Probably the wrong place to do it. I can really smell the intellectual overload in those responses.

Internet tough guys amuse me though. :-)

Shooting at a range always exposes you to blast from other shooters.I've never done my best at a range.I prefer to shoot outdoors.
SCARS are nice.I paid $2650 for mine.It doesn't kick as hard as a HK91.
AKs are way cheaper.Most of mine were purchased for between $150 and $300.
.308 is usually easier to obtain than 7.62x39.Outside of the current amo shortage.

AK is crude but reliable. I have a AR-10 308 from JP that shoots softer than an AR-15. My JP Rifle has an adjustable gas block, a light bolt carrier and a great muzzle brake. So it all depends.

Thanks to both.

I know what you mean about shooting outdoors. Wish Clarke Brothers was closer.

Definitely going to check out the AR-10 308.

I own a FN SCAR 17S. The recoil isn't that bad at all. And that's due to the same reason that it produces a pretty strong muzzle blast: it uses a PWS FSC30 muzzle device.

http://primaryweapons.com/muzzledevices/fsc/

It's still my favorite firearm. However, the Tavor has converted me into a bullpup advocate. Bullpups are so much more comfortable to use in my opinion. Wikipedia claims that IWI is working on a Micro Tavor chambered in 7.62 NATO. But if you don't feel like waiting for it to possibly come to American gun stores some day, then you should check out an AR-10 or a VEPR.

These are my two favorite AR-10s:

http://www.dpmsinc.com/308-ORACLE-ATACS_ep_98-1.html

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_815078_-1_785153_757785_757784_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

VEPRs:

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/component/virtuemart/shipping-rifles/vepr-ak-rifle-tactical-308-russian-16-5-detail.html?Itemid=0

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/component/virtuemart/shipping-rifles/vepr-308-rifle-md2-detail.html?Itemid=0

As to AKs, I recommend an Arsenal:

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/component/virtuemart/shipping-rifles/arsenal-slr107fr-31-762x39-side-folding-rifle-detail.html?Itemid=0

You also didn't really explain why you're trying to decide between the two rounds. If you're worried about stopping power, then the 5.56 and 7.62x39 are pretty comparable.

http://www.ballistics101.com/223_remington.php

http://www.ballistics101.com/7.62x39.php

The 7.62x51/.308 is however a major upgrade in stopping power:

http://www.ballistics101.com/308_winchester.php

However, a good .223/5.56 bullet is still extremely devastating:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Msci2ciZ4yo

If you're worried about long range accuracy, then the .308 is definitely the way to go. It does a much better job of resisting the influence of wind.

First of all, Yucky24 is 16 years old, he doesn't own any firearms except for maybe a Daisy BB gun from Dick's Sporting Goods.

Second, 7.62x51 NATO is NOT the same as .308 Winchester! Yes, many people will say it is the same thing and the cartridges are interchangeable. This is not true, it is not safe to fire .308 in a rifle chambered in 7.62 NATO, and the same for vice versa.

Lastly, the 7.62x39 is not comparable to 7.62x51 NATO. The (roughly) equivalent Russian caliber is 7.62×54mmR. This is used in their old Mosin-Nagant, Dragunov, and various medium machine guns. Just as 7.62x39 and 5.56 is used in infantry rifles and light machine guns, 7.62x51 NATO and 7.62x54mmR are used in designated marksman rifles and medium machine guns.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/28/2014 01:39AM by eesh.

OP - Why would you ever come to this website for firearm advice??

Try a firearm website. Something like AR15.com.

Do some research about the different rounds. There are errors with the info that both Yuck and Eesh posted. Neither one seems to know 100% about what they posted.

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Do some research about the different rounds. There
> are errors with the info that both Yuck and Eesh
> posted. Neither one seems to know 100% about what
> they posted.




Yucky is a kid posing as a right wing nationalist.


I know what I am talking about before I post. You do not.


Bye!

Well does not seem so in this case.

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well does not seem so in this case.




LOL If you know something that is wrong, then point it out and offer your clearly superior advice.

Odd, no response. I know, you are frantically searching for other message boards and sites that support your claim that what I said was in error.

Well.. a basic Google search of "308 vs 7.62x51" brings up much reading info. Or try reading a couple of reloading manuals.

Check out this link--

http://www.fulton-armory.com/faqs/M14-FAQs/308.htm

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Odd, no response. I know, you are frantically
> searching for other message boards and sites that
> support your claim that what I said was in error.


Naw...I can make shit up and post what ever but I prefer to add links so people can read the info for themselves. Just because I post something and claim it to be real does not make it so. Add a link to the proof.

LOL In your efforts to discredit my statement, you post a link to a site that explains exactly how 7.62 NATO and .308 Winchester are not the same and how you have to watch for the differences when trying to fire the two from the same weapon.

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Second, 7.62x51 NATO is NOT the same as .308
> Winchester! Yes, many people will say it is the
> same thing and the cartridges are interchangeable.
> This is not true, it is not safe to fire .308 in a
> rifle chambered in 7.62 NATO, and the same for
> vice versa.


Lets examine what you posted above--

The first sentence is correct. The rounds are not the "same". We will the 2nd sentence as it really has merit. The third sentence is where you went wrong.

You can shoot 7.62x51 ammo just fine in a modern 308 chambered rifle. You can also shoot 308 ammo just fine in most modern rifles chambered in 7.62x51. There are a few 7.62 rifles that still use old chamber specs. Old suplus rifles in 7.62 should not shoot modern 308 ammo. Example would be a enfield in 7.62. I would never shoot 308 in this rifle.

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Naw...I can make shit up and post what ever but I
> prefer to add links so people can read the info
> for themselves. Just because I post something and
> claim it to be real does not make it so. Add a
> link to the proof.




You need links to every factual statement made?


- DC is the capital of the United States

- China is an emerging superpower

- The currency of the EU is the Euro

- Chrysler is owned by Fiat



Do you need links as proof to all the statements I just made? If you want to say any of those statements are wrong, then you need something to support it.

See how this works?

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> You can shoot 7.62x51 ammo just fine in a modern
> 308 chambered rifle. You can also shoot 308 ammo
> just fine in most modern rifles chambered in
> 7.62x51. There are a few 7.62 rifles that still
> use old chamber specs. Old suplus rifles in 7.62
> should not shoot modern 308 ammo. Example would be
> a enfield in 7.62. I would never shoot 308 in this
> rifle.



So you're saying the difference between 7.62 NATO and .308 Winchester is the same difference as 223 and 5.56? Let me know.

But lets just go with my first hand personal experience. I shoot 308 and 7.62x51 all the time in my ARs, my FAL, my 700s, and my SPR. But to be honest I shoot very very few rounds of 7.62 from my 700s and SPR. I shoot mostly high end 308 or rounds I load these rifles. I would never ever shoot any 308 in my enfield.

But yeah. I have no idea what I am talking about because you say so.

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I shoot mostly high end 308 or
> rounds I load these rifles.



What do you consider a high end .308?

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> So you're saying the difference between 7.62 NATO
> and .308 Winchester is the same difference as 223
> and 5.56? Let me know.


That's funny. Nothing I posted mentioned 223 vs 556. But if you want to go there. .223 can be shot from a 5.56 chamber just fine but 5.56 should not be used in a .223 chamber.

You want to talk about using +P+ ammo is safe to use in guns not rated for it next?

How about loading 28 rounds Vs. 30 rounds in a mag?

Grease Vs Oil on rails?

How about legal barrel lengths?

How about better to use 115gr or 158gr 9mm when wanting to stay subsonic?

We can go on all night.

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> What do you consider a high end .308?
Attachments:

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > So you're saying the difference between 7.62
> NATO
> > and .308 Winchester is the same difference as
> 223
> > and 5.56? Let me know.
>
>
> That's funny. Nothing I posted mentioned 223 vs
> 556. But if you want to go there. .223 can be shot
> from a 5.56 chamber just fine but 5.56 should not
> be used in a .223 chamber.
>
> You want to talk about using +P+ ammo is safe to
> use in guns not rated for it next?
>
> How about loading 28 rounds Vs. 30 rounds in a
> mag?
>
> Grease Vs Oil on rails?
>
> How about legal barrel lengths?
>
> How about better to use 115gr or 158gr 9mm when
> wanting to stay subsonic?
>
> We can go on all night.




You're the same person that's posting anonymously as this Debbie Democrat right now, and you're the same person that always takes the opposite view of my posts, regardless of whether or not you are familiar with the subject. You search for any website or blog or message board that fits your statements, and post them as fact. You don't know what you are talking about, plain and simple. You're even posting as this fake Baltimore police officer in the Ford Escape thread. What is wrong with you?

But this has been entertaining but time to go time some more product things. Maybe we can pick this up tomorrow.

And Black Hills and Federal premium. 168gr or 175gr but mostly 168.

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> You're the same person that's posting anonymously
> as this Debbie Democrat right now, and you're the
> same person that always takes the opposite view of
> my posts, regardless of whether or not you are
> familiar with the subject. You search for any
> website or blog or message board that fits your
> statements, and post them as fact. You don't know
> what you are talking about, plain and simple.
> You're even posting as this fake Baltimore police
> officer in the Ford Escape thread. What is wrong
> with you?


Now this is funny. First, I would never claim to be a democrat-I think all these political posts are stupid. If you go back to what I first posted, I only took issue with what you posted wrong about 308 vs 7.62x51, the rest of what you posted was pretty right on. Also I am not posting a darn thing in the ford escape thread as I do not care what the cops in Baltimore drive nor do I know what they drive. I have not been to Baltimore in four years.

And to answer your last question...There is a LOT wrong with me. Its 4am and I am posting on here.

The reasons are three..

1> Gun forums usually require you to sign up with an email
2> There have been plenty of gun threads on here in the past. Just because it's a non-gun forum doesn't mean people on here don't know what they're talking about.
3> I wanted to see what would happen. :)

eesh for President.


Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> OP - Why would you ever come to this website for
> firearm advice??
>
> Try a firearm website. Something like AR15.com.
>
> Do some research about the different rounds. There
> are errors with the info that both Yuck and Eesh
> posted. Neither one seems to know 100% about what
> they posted.

Damn, you fuks were up til 5am talking about this shit.

Real Info Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > You're the same person that's posting
> anonymously
> > as this Debbie Democrat right now, and you're
> the
> > same person that always takes the opposite view
> of
> > my posts, regardless of whether or not you are
> > familiar with the subject. You search for any
> > website or blog or message board that fits your
> > statements, and post them as fact. You don't
> know
> > what you are talking about, plain and simple.
> > You're even posting as this fake Baltimore
> police
> > officer in the Ford Escape thread. What is
> wrong
> > with you?
>
>
> Now this is funny. First, I would never claim to
> be a democrat-I think all these political posts
> are stupid. If you go back to what I first posted,
> I only took issue with what you posted wrong about
> 308 vs 7.62x51, the rest of what you posted was
> pretty right on. Also I am not posting a darn
> thing in the ford escape thread as I do not care
> what the cops in Baltimore drive nor do I know
> what they drive. I have not been to Baltimore in
> four years.
>
> And to answer your last question...There is a LOT
> wrong with me. Its 4am and I am posting on here.


How many times did you fap overnight?

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Second, 7.62x51 NATO is NOT the same as .308
> Winchester!

Very true, .308 has much higher chamber pressures


Yes, many people will say it is the
> same thing and the cartridges are interchangeable.

Dont put a 308 in a 7.62 or the metal will eventually fatigue and fail.

> This is not true, it is not safe to fire .308 in a
> rifle chambered in 7.62 NATO, and the same for
> vice versa.
>

Best to always check with the manufacture of the firearm but mostly speaking you can fire 7.62 out of any modern 308 but always check, its not worth loosing a finger or 2.

Anyone know a good site to try and find the production year of my 7.62x51

Ammo? Try AR15.com. They have an ammo section that has a lot of info. Or post a pic of the ammo and a clear picture of the head stamp. A picture of the container and the label on it would be helpful also but the head stamp should be enough to tell you what you have.