The head of the teachers' union wrote an OpEd.Here's an excerpt.

"If you pay 5 percent into VRS and still keep the 4 percent in the local plan, then you end up paying 9 percent into your retirement. Although a lofty financial goal, it’s not appropriate for teachers.

Here’s how I know:

If teachers pay 9 percent into their retirement, then they don’t have enough money to eat. (Please don’t confuse us with other professionals who are well paid). If they don’t eat, then they die. If they die, they don’t teach children particularly well, nor do they care much about their retirement — perhaps that was the General Assembly’s real plan to begin with …"

http://www.fairfaxtimes.com/article/20120525/OPINION/705259723/1065/-fake-teacher-raises-a-sign-of-much-deeper-issues&template=fairfaxTimes

Stop bitching! If you don't like your job you can leave. I know a lot of teachers in the FCPS who SHOULD retire because they suck.

stop please Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stop bitching! If you don't like your job you can
> leave. I know a lot of teachers in the FCPS who
> SHOULD retire because they suck.


And I know many who are the exact opposite.

What’s a fair wage? Starting teacher pay is $52,686 based on a full year contract. $59,193 if they have a masters. This is with no prior teaching experience. It looks like most of the contracts are only 194 days, but the salary is prorated I assume. Doesn't sound too bad for a kid right out of school.

Pay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What’s a fair wage? Starting teacher pay is
> $52,686 based on a full year contract. $59,193 if
> they have a masters. This is with no prior
> teaching experience. It looks like most of the
> contracts are only 194 days, but the salary is
> prorated I assume. Doesn't sound too bad for a kid
> right out of school.

Which scale are you looking at? I see $44,440 starting, $49,928 with a Masters. That's for 194 days.

http://fcps.edu/hr/salary/pdf/fy12/FY%202012%20194-day%20teacher.pdf

The starting pay for a teacher with a BA and 0 prior years of experience is $44,440 on the standard 194 day contract. With an MA it's 49,928.

http://www.fcps.edu/hr/salary/pdf/fy12/FY%202012%20194-day%20teacher.pdf

Pay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What’s a fair wage? Starting teacher pay is
> $52,686 based on a full year contract. $59,193 if
> they have a masters. This is with no prior
> teaching experience. It looks like most of the
> contracts are only 194 days, but the salary is
> prorated I assume. Doesn't sound too bad for a kid
> right out of school.

Random Dude Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The starting pay for a teacher with a BA and 0
> prior years of experience is $44,440 on the
> standard 194 day contract. With an MA it's
> 49,928.

Which is more than double what I made with a BS and 0 years experience at my first job workin 365 days a year and I still managed to buy a $200K townhouse in FFX County with 10% down, after 3 years of working, paying rent and saving money and not buying every whiz bang gadget I *HAD* to have because I was a fucktard piece of shit cry baby fuck.

Fuck teachers and fuck anyone under 30. Cry-baby fucks.

-jg

p.s. Oh you mad cuz I'm stylin' on you?

-
-
-

I can understand why teachers want more money. But you knew the salary going in. The gripe that you cannot afford to live where you work is not a good argument since the roads are clogged with people everyday in the same boat.

I know you hate to be reminded but you do have several months off during the summer, all regular holidays and a week at Christmas and a week at Easter. In the private sector you get two weeks vacation, maybe a few personal and sick days,thats it. In the private sector the boss would laugh if you asked if you had Columbus Day off.

Johnny Galt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Random Dude Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The starting pay for a teacher with a BA and 0
> > prior years of experience is $44,440 on the
> > standard 194 day contract. With an MA it's
> > 49,928.
>
> Which is more than double what I made with a BS
> and 0 years experience at my first job workin 365
> days a year and I still managed to buy a $200K
> townhouse in FFX County with 10% down, after 3
> years of working, paying rent and saving money and
> not buying every whiz bang gadget I *HAD* to have
> because I was a fucktard piece of shit cry baby
> fuck.
>
> Fuck teachers and fuck anyone under 30. Cry-baby
> fucks.

I wasn't posting to say the salaries were high or low. It was just to question the $52,686 number in the earlier post.

This is the pay scale for a 260 day contract.

http://fcps.edu/hr/salary/pdf/fy12/FY%202012%20260-day%20teacher.pdf

I am not sure what teacher has a 260 day contract, but this shows what a teacher would earn for a whole year if they were on contract for the entire year.

Yes, for 260 days. That makes sense. ^

School ends on June 15. It looks like the teachers work until June 20 and are off until August 27. That's 9+ weeks. If I read this right, they have a 194 day contract and teach for 180 days. So 14 days are for grading, trainging, or whatever. Do they get other days off, too, or do they have to limit their off days to when the kids are off school?

the math Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> School ends on June 15. It looks like the teachers
> work until June 20 and are off until August 27.
> That's 9+ weeks. If I read this right, they have a
> 194 day contract and teach for 180 days. So 14
> days are for grading, trainging, or whatever. Do
> they get other days off, too, or do they have to
> limit their off days to when the kids are off
> school?

194 total contract days. 183 days are student days, so that leaves 11 other contract days. June 18, 19, and 20 gets you up to 186. There are 5 contract days before the students start, which gets you up to 191. The other 3 occur during the school year and the kids are out those days.

Ok so we round that up in teacher math to 200 days of work, and you still are getting paid for a 10 hour day $22 an hour if ur making 44k a year plus benifits. Now tell me do you do nothing all summer long or do you work another job your own business etc.. Wine gripe and complain all you want there are alot of others who would leve to make that kind of money with job security and benifits.

Johnny Galt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Random Dude Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The starting pay for a teacher with a BA and 0
> > prior years of experience is $44,440 on the
> > standard 194 day contract. With an MA it's
> > 49,928.
>
> Which is more than double what I made with a BS
> and 0 years experience at my first job workin 365
> days a year and I still managed to buy a $200K
> townhouse in FFX County with 10% down, after 3
> years of working, paying rent and saving money and
> not buying every whiz bang gadget I *HAD* to have
> because I was a fucktard piece of shit cry baby
> fuck.
>
> Fuck teachers and fuck anyone under 30. Cry-baby
> fucks.


FUCK YOU!

#1 - You're a God Damn liar. You did NOT work 365 days in a year you Fuck-Munch.

#2 - I teach and am so proud of what I TRY to do.

#3 - At the job you started at 20K, did you have to buy your own supplies? I do. I have to. I buy crap that you and idiots like yourself take for granted. These are the same thing you STEAL to bring home; ink, large poster boards, pens, pencils, software, media, etc.

#4 - How about getting blamed for everything that goes wrong (child related) while no one else is culpable? You get blamed for everything where you worked while no one took responsibility?

#5 - How about the public opinion of your job? People label you "lazy", "ungrateful", etc? Outside of Used Car salesman of the '80's and '90's I can't think of a profession that is least respected as much as teachers.

#6 - Sounds like we are of the same age, given you bought a house for $200k and all, but have you ever taken the fucking time to actually compare the salaries today to 30+ years ago? And what about the cost of living? You compare that? Nope on both accounts. Because if you did you'd notice salaries haven't kept up with the COL. And that is caused by money grabbing ass holes like you.

#7 - you obviously act very much older than you actually are; with your bitterness and whatnot. You DO NOT know a single thing about teaching or even being a teacher. Hell you probably don’t have kids, BUT, if you do, they must struggle in life and with relationships. Hmph; wonder why?

#8 - I got into teaching because I felt it was a calling. And that was at the age of 30. I was a blue collar worker in shipping and receiving. What about you? What’d you do/did; was that a calling? Doubtful. You probably worked as a mid-level manager and then retired with a ridiculous Retirement Package. Or were a plumber, electrician, etc and raped people blind.

#9 - I can only guess you are not married. Can't be. You read like a grumpy old man who is mad at the world. Maybe your wife was a teacher and she left you? Not sure but I bet something along those lines is the truth.

#10 – I would love to meet you face to face so you can meet a teacher in person and say the very same thing to me – or any teacher – to my face. Then lets have a real conversation. I bet dime to a dollar you’d change your mind/view about us teachers.

If not, FUCK YOU TO!

Have a great day!

Oh and FUCK YOU again!

183 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the math Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > School ends on June 15. It looks like the
> teachers
> > work until June 20 and are off until August 27.
> > That's 9+ weeks. If I read this right, they have
> a
> > 194 day contract and teach for 180 days. So 14
> > days are for grading, trainging, or whatever.
> Do
> > they get other days off, too, or do they have
> to
> > limit their off days to when the kids are off
> > school?
>
> 194 total contract days. 183 days are student
> days, so that leaves 11 other contract days. June
> 18, 19, and 20 gets you up to 186. There are 5
> contract days before the students start, which
> gets you up to 191. The other 3 occur during the
> school year and the kids are out those days.


Teachers also get 12 sick days a year. Some of them can be used for personal reasons and not for being sick.

Hey Gault - Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> FUCK YOU!
>
> #1 - You're a God Damn liar. You did NOT work 365
> days in a year you Fuck-Munch.
>
> #2 - I teach and am so proud of what I TRY to do.
>
> #3 - At the job you started at 20K, did you have
> to buy your own supplies? I do. I have to. I
> buy crap that you and idiots like yourself take
> for granted. These are the same thing you STEAL
> to bring home; ink, large poster boards, pens,
> pencils, software, media, etc.
>
> #4 - How about getting blamed for everything that
> goes wrong (child related) while no one else is
> culpable? You get blamed for everything where you
> worked while no one took responsibility?
>
> #5 - How about the public opinion of your job?
> People label you "lazy", "ungrateful", etc?
> Outside of Used Car salesman of the '80's and
> '90's I can't think of a profession that is least
> respected as much as teachers.
>
> #6 - Sounds like we are of the same age, given you
> bought a house for $200k and all, but have you
> ever taken the fucking time to actually compare
> the salaries today to 30+ years ago? And what
> about the cost of living? You compare that?
> Nope on both accounts. Because if you did you'd
> notice salaries haven't kept up with the COL. And
> that is caused by money grabbing ass holes like
> you.
>
> #7 - you obviously act very much older than you
> actually are; with your bitterness and whatnot.
> You DO NOT know a single thing about teaching or
> even being a teacher. Hell you probably don’t
> have kids, BUT, if you do, they must struggle in
> life and with relationships. Hmph; wonder why?
>
> #8 - I got into teaching because I felt it was a
> calling. And that was at the age of 30. I was a
> blue collar worker in shipping and receiving.
> What about you? What’d you do/did; was that a
> calling? Doubtful. You probably worked as a
> mid-level manager and then retired with a
> ridiculous Retirement Package. Or were a plumber,
> electrician, etc and raped people blind.
>
> #9 - I can only guess you are not married. Can't
> be. You read like a grumpy old man who is mad at
> the world. Maybe your wife was a teacher and she
> left you? Not sure but I bet something along
> those lines is the truth.
>
> #10 – I would love to meet you face to face so
> you can meet a teacher in person and say the very
> same thing to me – or any teacher – to my
> face. Then lets have a real conversation. I bet
> dime to a dollar you’d change your mind/view
> about us teachers.
>
> If not, FUCK YOU TO!
>
> Have a great day!
>
> Oh and FUCK YOU again!


This is a teacher?

Ok, they have a 194 day contract. Take off 3 snow days and 12 sick days. So in all they’re getting paid for 179 days of work. A brand new teacher just out of college gets $44,400. That’s $248 per day or $1240 per week. It’s hard to live on that in Fairfax but the OP says that if teachers pay “9 percent into their retirement, then they don’t have enough money to eat…If they don’t eat they die.” Not sure making $1240 per week means you can’t eat when you are 22. You may need a roommate or live at home as you get started. Sounds like life.

Big Dog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ok so we round that up in teacher math to 200 days
> of work, and you still are getting paid for a 10
> hour day $22 an hour if ur making 44k a year plus
> benifits. Now tell me do you do nothing all
> summer long or do you work another job your own
> business etc.. Wine gripe and complain all you
> want there are alot of others who would leve to
> make that kind of money with job security and
> benifits.


What sucks is that many of the school MAINTENANCE guys make more money than we do! It's insane that we pay plumbers, electricians and A/C guys more money than most of the teachers. There is something seriously wrong going on here!

The problem with these arguments on both sides is that with teaching you get what you pay for- value teaching, pay teachers accordingly and you get better teachers who are teaching because thats what they want to do and are good at-pay them crap and you get people who can't do anything else. Please do not compare it with your dumbass (I have a BS degree), because this is an actually important job, not pushing dumbass government subcontractors paperwork to kill people in foreign lands. The problem with this area is that people here could care less about thier kids education...which is at least partially why this place sucks. (and before the morons start spouting off, Gordon Blvd for example, "then why don't you leave" as soon as real estate market improves I am liquidating all of my holdings and real estate here and getting the F out!!!

Question: do you know how many FCPS teachers lost their jobs because of poor performance? Through the grapevine, I heard that it was FOUR. Does anyone know if this is true?

I disagree with Waste (above)

While I do think teachers deserve good pay, I do not believe that we would necessarily get better teachers. Unless there is wholesale change in administration at FCPS, you will get the same teachers with better pay.

It begins at the top--we need someone who understands what a good teacher is. That someone is not Jack Dale.

You will never improve the quality of teachers unless you improve the quality of principals. When you have an atmosphere such as the one fostered by Dale, you do not necessarily get the best principals. Think about it, the principals are the ones who should be weeding out the sorry teachers.

Read WAPO op-ed today on TJ. Sounds like FCPS has taken an elite, successful school and "dumbed" it down. I guess the purpose was to increase diversity--however, they "dumbed" it down and didn't even increase the diversity they were aiming for. How insulting to all concerned.

If FCPS can't identify the best students for TJ, how can they identify the best teachers for the classroom?

former teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Question: do you know how many FCPS teachers lost
> their jobs because of poor performance? Through
> the grapevine, I heard that it was FOUR. Does
> anyone know if this is true?
>
> I disagree with Waste (above)
>
> While I do think teachers deserve good pay, I do
> not believe that we would necessarily get better
> teachers. Unless there is wholesale change in
> administration at FCPS, you will get the same
> teachers with better pay.
>
> It begins at the top--we need someone who
> understands what a good teacher is. That someone
> is not Jack Dale.
>
> You will never improve the quality of teachers
> unless you improve the quality of principals.
> When you have an atmosphere such as the one
> fostered by Dale, you do not necessarily get the
> best principals. Think about it, the principals
> are the ones who should be weeding out the sorry
> teachers.
>
> Read WAPO op-ed today on TJ. Sounds like FCPS has
> taken an elite, successful school and "dumbed" it
> down. I guess the purpose was to increase
> diversity--however, they "dumbed" it down and
> didn't even increase the diversity they were
> aiming for. How insulting to all concerned.
>
> If FCPS can't identify the best students for TJ,
> how can they identify the best teachers for the
> classroom?


Lots of BS here. Glad this is a "former teacher."

Which scale? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Johnny Galt Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Random Dude Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > The starting pay for a teacher with a BA and
> 0
> > > prior years of experience is $44,440 on the
> > > standard 194 day contract. With an MA it's
> > > 49,928.
> >
> > Which is more than double what I made with a BS
> > and 0 years experience at my first job workin
> 365
> > days a year and I still managed to buy a $200K
> > townhouse in FFX County with 10% down, after 3
> > years of working, paying rent and saving money
> and
> > not buying every whiz bang gadget I *HAD* to
> have
> > because I was a fucktard piece of shit cry baby
> > fuck.
> >
> > Fuck teachers and fuck anyone under 30.
> Cry-baby
> > fucks.
>
> I wasn't posting to say the salaries were high or
> low. It was just to question the $52,686 number in
> the earlier post.

Right, nobody said you were posting to say whether salaries were high or low, all I know is teachers cry all the time about their salaries as do a lot of grads who think they need to make $75K a year out of college to live around here. My point is a single person can live plenty well on a sub $40K salary IF they manage their money correctly.

But in todays society, grads do not think it's fair that they have to manage money and since the young tend to be liberal the liberals tend to try and regulate fairness which is unpossible since is all fucked up and you have 25 year old 'children' who refuse to work for a fair wage.

So my point is young people and teachers are cry-baby fucks.

-jg

p.s. Oh you mad cuz I'm stylin' on you?

-
-
-

Big Dog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ok so we round that up in teacher math to 200 days
> of work, and you still are getting paid for a 10
> hour day $22 an hour if ur making 44k a year plus
> benifits. Now tell me do you do nothing all
> summer long or do you work another job your own
> business etc.. Wine gripe and complain all you
> want there are alot of others who would leve to
> make that kind of money with job security and
> benifits.

I am the one who posted about the contract days. Not once did I complain. I have never complained about my salary, benefits, or job security. As someone else pointed out, I knew all of this going in. It seems to me that it is you who is doing the complaining.

there are more Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Teachers also get 12 sick days a year. Some of
> them can be used for personal reasons and not for
> being sick.

This is true. I personally never use but maybe a couple a year, but we do get what amounts to about 9 sick days and 3 personal.

The facts of life Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ok, they have a 194 day contract. Take off 3 snow
> days and 12 sick days. So in all they’re getting
> paid for 179 days of work. A brand new teacher
> just out of college gets $44,400. That’s $248
> per day or $1240 per week. It’s hard to live on
> that in Fairfax but the OP says that if teachers
> pay “9 percent into their retirement, then they
> don’t have enough money to eat…If they don’t
> eat they die.” Not sure making $1240 per week
> means you can’t eat when you are 22. You may
> need a roommate or live at home as you get
> started. Sounds like life.

I agree. The quotes for the editorial piece are quite an exaggeration.

former teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Question: do you know how many FCPS teachers lost
> their jobs because of poor performance? Through
> the grapevine, I heard that it was FOUR. Does
> anyone know if this is true?
>
I don't know how many nonrenewals (firings) were completed due to poor performance, but the majority don't show up on the books as such. There are actually quite a few who are not recommended for rehire, but they submit their resignation before the evaluation cycle gets that far. They resign rather than have the nonrenewal on their record so they can still have a chance to get a job in another district.

Hey Gault - Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Johnny Galt Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Random Dude Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > The starting pay for a teacher with a BA and
> 0
> > > prior years of experience is $44,440 on the
> > > standard 194 day contract. With an MA it's
> > > 49,928.
> >
> > Which is more than double what I made with a BS
> > and 0 years experience at my first job workin
> 365
> > days a year and I still managed to buy a $200K
> > townhouse in FFX County with 10% down, after 3
> > years of working, paying rent and saving money
> and
> > not buying every whiz bang gadget I *HAD* to
> have
> > because I was a fucktard piece of shit cry baby
> > fuck.
> >
> > Fuck teachers and fuck anyone under 30.
> Cry-baby
> > fucks.
>
>
> FUCK YOU!
>
> #1 - You're a God Damn liar. You did NOT work 365
> days in a year you Fuck-Munch.
>

Hour-wise I worked more actually. I got time and half and double-time on the 7th day so I worked 18 hours, 7 days a week for years. Why? Because I could and I like money more than being a cry-baby.


> #2 - I teach and am so proud of what I TRY to do.
>

I don't TRY and do shit, I get it done. TRYing is the new motto of certain generations. SUCCEEDing is an after thought and nothing to strive for for most people. People like you want accolades just for the attempt. You are fucking weak.


> #3 - At the job you started at 20K, did you have
> to buy your own supplies? I do. I have to. I
> buy crap that you and idiots like yourself take
> for granted. These are the same thing you STEAL
> to bring home; ink, large poster boards, pens,
> pencils, software, media, etc.
>

This is AMERICA cry-baby. You don't HAVE to do a fucking thing you do not want to do. You want to teach, which means you want to buy your own supplies. Don't want to buy your own supplies? Don't teach. Or maybe you don't think it's fair that you have to buy your own supplies. Life ain't fair.

I did have plenty of expenses and no summers off.


> #4 - How about getting blamed for everything that
> goes wrong (child related) while no one else is
> culpable? You get blamed for everything where you
> worked while no one took responsibility?
>

So what? This is a stupid fucking bullet point. You're feelings get hurt? That would happen with ANY FUCKING JOB!! This kind of shit happens to every one. What you should worry about is the CONSEQUENCES, which in the real world means no job and no money. For teachers, fucking up, real or imagined, yields no consequences.



> #5 - How about the public opinion of your job?
> People label you "lazy", "ungrateful", etc?
> Outside of Used Car salesman of the '80's and
> '90's I can't think of a profession that is least
> respected as much as teachers.
>

Really? I'm pretty sure anyone working in the legislative and executive branch of the govt is less respected and subject to WAY more publc opinion than teachers. And their jobs are not guaranteed so fucking up, real or imagined, yields real consequences, not just hurt feelings.


It's funny you would choose used car saleman as the analogy. It shows how you view the job YOU do. Smoke and mirrors and fake bullshit. As previsouly stated, your need for accolades just for the attempt rather than the success speaks to the used car salesman view of yourself and your skills.


> #6 - Sounds like we are of the same age, given you
> bought a house for $200k and all, but have you
> ever taken the fucking time to actually compare
> the salaries today to 30+ years ago? And what
> about the cost of living? You compare that?
> Nope on both accounts. Because if you did you'd
> notice salaries haven't kept up with the COL. And
> that is caused by money grabbing ass holes like
> you.
>

What COL? The cost for the necessities is manageable and a fresh grad will make more than $12 an hour coming out of school.

If you factor in all the bullshit people spend their money on these days like a cell phone bill, a $100+ tv bill, 3-4 yo car, entertainment expenses etc, yeah it costs more.

But like I said, I worked all the time and didnt spend my money and I didn't worry about whether it was FAIR or not that my car was older.


> #7 - you obviously act very much older than you
> actually are; with your bitterness and whatnot.
> You DO NOT know a single thing about teaching or
> even being a teacher. Hell you probably don’t
> have kids, BUT, if you do, they must struggle in
> life and with relationships. Hmph; wonder why?
>

My view of the FCPS and teachers in general is negative for sure. I am late 30's with two kids, one of whom starts kindergarten in Sept and I am scared as fuck to what his experience will be compared to mine back in the day.

Teachers today are lazy, stupid, cry-baby fucks. Mostly because they are young and think they are entitled to everything everyone else has without doing the things everyone else does.


> #8 - I got into teaching because I felt it was a
> calling. And that was at the age of 30. I was a
> blue collar worker in shipping and receiving.
> What about you? What’d you do/did; was that a
> calling? Doubtful. You probably worked as a
> mid-level manager and then retired with a
> ridiculous Retirement Package. Or were a plumber,
> electrician, etc and raped people blind.
>

I work in IT like most of the people in this area. My job isn't fair, I use my own laptop and computer at work because what was supplied was inadequate to do my job. I buy manuals to learn things I am expected to know to not get fired, I use my own money. The commute sucks but the money is fine after 15 years in the business. A teacher will make plenty if they put in the work for 15 years.

But like I said, some people want everything NOW, and they expect it NOW, and if they can't have it NOW it isn't FAIR, boo-hoo etc.

Oh, if I didn't like my job, I would get a different one.

If I couldn't get a new one because I was irresponsible with money, if I were a.) young or b.) a teacher who overspent, I would probably cry about how it isn't fair that I have no money because I spent it all and someone like the govt should bail me out.

> #9 - I can only guess you are not married. Can't
> be. You read like a grumpy old man who is mad at
> the world. Maybe your wife was a teacher and she
> left you? Not sure but I bet something along
> those lines is the truth.
>

Your logical arguments ended at #3. After that your true feelings about your 'calling' have come through. You are a simple-minded, judgemental cry-baby that realizes they made a mistake by switching careers, now regrets it, you realize you have no skills to switch careers, and probably burned some bridges leaving your last career so now you're stuck. And your degree is probably Art History or something else with no market value.

If you wind up teaching my kid, be ready, becuse intellectually you are out-gunned, and *I* will expect you to do your job and you will not be praised for TRYing, only succeeding.


> #10 – I would love to meet you face to face so
> you can meet a teacher in person and say the very
> same thing to me – or any teacher – to my
> face. Then lets have a real conversation. I bet
> dime to a dollar you’d change your mind/view
> about us teachers.
>

Just do you fucking job cry-baby, don't TRY to do it. Just do it. And stop expecting praise for acting like a citizen. That's another trait of people like you. You want rewards for fucking waking up and living life. So fucking weak.


> If not, FUCK YOU TO!
>
> Have a great day!
>
> Oh and FUCK YOU again!

You teach kids with that mouth? Golly I can't understand why anyone would question your attitude.

-jg

p.s. Oh you mad cuz I'm stylin' on you?

-
-
-

> FUCK YOU!
>
> #1 - You're a God Damn liar. You did NOT work 365
> days in a year you Fuck-Munch.
>
> #2 - I teach and am so proud of what I TRY to do.
>
> #3 - At the job you started at 20K, did you have
> to buy your own supplies? I do. I have to. I
> buy crap that you and idiots like yourself take
> for granted. These are the same thing you STEAL
> to bring home; ink, large poster boards, pens,
> pencils, software, media, etc.
>
> #4 - How about getting blamed for everything that
> goes wrong (child related) while no one else is
> culpable? You get blamed for everything where you
> worked while no one took responsibility?
>
> #5 - How about the public opinion of your job?
> People label you "lazy", "ungrateful", etc?
> Outside of Used Car salesman of the '80's and
> '90's I can't think of a profession that is least
> respected as much as teachers.
>
> #6 - Sounds like we are of the same age, given you
> bought a house for $200k and all, but have you
> ever taken the fucking time to actually compare
> the salaries today to 30+ years ago? And what
> about the cost of living? You compare that?
> Nope on both accounts. Because if you did you'd
> notice salaries haven't kept up with the COL. And
> that is caused by money grabbing ass holes like
> you.
>
> #7 - you obviously act very much older than you
> actually are; with your bitterness and whatnot.
> You DO NOT know a single thing about teaching or
> even being a teacher. Hell you probably don’t
> have kids, BUT, if you do, they must struggle in
> life and with relationships. Hmph; wonder why?
>
> #8 - I got into teaching because I felt it was a
> calling. And that was at the age of 30. I was a
> blue collar worker in shipping and receiving.
> What about you? What’d you do/did; was that a
> calling? Doubtful. You probably worked as a
> mid-level manager and then retired with a
> ridiculous Retirement Package. Or were a plumber,
> electrician, etc and raped people blind.
>
> #9 - I can only guess you are not married. Can't
> be. You read like a grumpy old man who is mad at
> the world. Maybe your wife was a teacher and she
> left you? Not sure but I bet something along
> those lines is the truth.
>
> #10 – I would love to meet you face to face so
> you can meet a teacher in person and say the very
> same thing to me – or any teacher – to my
> face. Then lets have a real conversation. I bet
> dime to a dollar you’d change your mind/view
> about us teachers.
>
> If not, FUCK YOU TO!
>
> Have a great day!
>
> Oh and FUCK YOU again!


Sounds like you have a lot of anger issues and need to see a shrink. Not sure you are a good person to deal with kids! I lay the blame with schools on the FCPS School Board who only care their liberal agenda at the expense of the majority of the students. Also look to the NEA and your teachers union - are they helping you any, or just themselves?

F U you freak!

I guess the union guy was trying to be funny, but he sounds like an idiot. Why would you want that guy representing you? This kind of whining while most everyone is still tightening their belts looks so bad.

Teaching is a profession. People on this thread treat it like it is an hourly wage type of job. It should be compared to other professions that require a 4 year degree (and many teachers actually have Master's degrees these days). I would think that 44K is comparable to what other 4 year degree people receive coming out of school who get starting jobs in their professions. If you look at any lists of what people make as professionals in our society, you will always find teaching very low on the list for salary (along with social work). Yes, many school districts tried to balance that issue by offering a more secure retirement plan. That plan is increasingly not available as a means of attracting good people.

To those who believe that you can get quality people without paying them, good luck with that thought. You might get a few martyrs, but good people are sought after by many employers who are willing to pay. People have families, student debt, etc. and the teaching profession will not see those people even though they may have been excellent teachers. My niece (who has a master's in Geology) applied at a high school in Tuscon, AZ (where she lives) on a dare from her boyfriend (she is 25 years old). He has a master's degree as well (Business), but did not receive an interview (it was a competition of sorts). She came away from the teaching job interview appalled. She said, "Geez, 60 hours a week of work for 40K?" She has since interviewed for hydrologist jobs (drilling for water in AZ is a deal) and they pay much, much more for a normal 40 hour week. I'm sure she'll take one of those jobs. She would have been a very highly qualified teacher---she was a National Merit finalist in high school and she graduated Phi Beta Kappa from college. The kids lose. Maybe some of you taxpayers win or think you win. Enjoy your win.

1221 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > FUCK YOU!
> >
> > #1 - You're a God Damn liar. You did NOT work
> 365
> > days in a year you Fuck-Munch.
> >
> > #2 - I teach and am so proud of what I TRY to
> do.
> >
> > #3 - At the job you started at 20K, did you
> have
> > to buy your own supplies? I do. I have to. I
> > buy crap that you and idiots like yourself take
> > for granted. These are the same thing you
> STEAL
> > to bring home; ink, large poster boards, pens,
> > pencils, software, media, etc.
> >
> > #4 - How about getting blamed for everything
> that
> > goes wrong (child related) while no one else is
> > culpable? You get blamed for everything where
> you
> > worked while no one took responsibility?
> >
> > #5 - How about the public opinion of your job?
> > People label you "lazy", "ungrateful", etc?
> > Outside of Used Car salesman of the '80's and
> > '90's I can't think of a profession that is
> least
> > respected as much as teachers.
> >
> > #6 - Sounds like we are of the same age, given
> you
> > bought a house for $200k and all, but have you
> > ever taken the fucking time to actually compare
> > the salaries today to 30+ years ago? And what
> > about the cost of living? You compare that?
> > Nope on both accounts. Because if you did
> you'd
> > notice salaries haven't kept up with the COL.
> And
> > that is caused by money grabbing ass holes like
> > you.
> >
> > #7 - you obviously act very much older than you
> > actually are; with your bitterness and whatnot.
>
> > You DO NOT know a single thing about teaching
> or
> > even being a teacher. Hell you probably
> don’t
> > have kids, BUT, if you do, they must struggle
> in
> > life and with relationships. Hmph; wonder why?
> >
> > #8 - I got into teaching because I felt it was
> a
> > calling. And that was at the age of 30. I was
> a
> > blue collar worker in shipping and receiving.
> > What about you? What’d you do/did; was that
> a
> > calling? Doubtful. You probably worked as a
> > mid-level manager and then retired with a
> > ridiculous Retirement Package. Or were a
> plumber,
> > electrician, etc and raped people blind.
> >
> > #9 - I can only guess you are not married.
> Can't
> > be. You read like a grumpy old man who is mad
> at
> > the world. Maybe your wife was a teacher and
> she
> > left you? Not sure but I bet something along
> > those lines is the truth.
> >
> > #10 – I would love to meet you face to face
> so
> > you can meet a teacher in person and say the
> very
> > same thing to me – or any teacher – to my
> > face. Then lets have a real conversation. I
> bet
> > dime to a dollar you’d change your mind/view
> > about us teachers.
> >
> > If not, FUCK YOU TO!
> >
> > Have a great day!
> >
> > Oh and FUCK YOU again!
>
>
> Sounds like you have a lot of anger issues and
> need to see a shrink. Not sure you are a good
> person to deal with kids! I lay the blame with
> schools on the FCPS School Board who only care
> their liberal agenda at the expense of the
> majority of the students. Also look to the NEA and
> your teachers union - are they helping you any, or
> just themselves?
>
> F U you freak!

That person's view are his own. He does not represent all of us.

Attention teachers, if you hate your job so much or feel so underpaid then quit. Go into the private sector. When you get in the private sector remind your boss you only work a half day on Mondays. You get 3/4 of the summer off. You get all holidays off, a week at Christmas and a week at Easter. In addition you want to be paid enough to live in the area you work. After your first year you also expect tenure where you cannot be fired no matter the offense.

Let us know how that goes for you.

stop the crying Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Attention teachers, if you hate your job so much
> or feel so underpaid then quit. Go into the
> private sector. When you get in the private sector
> remind your boss you only work a half day on
> Mondays. You get 3/4 of the summer off. You get
> all holidays off, a week at Christmas and a week
> at Easter. In addition you want to be paid enough
> to live in the area you work. After your first
> year you also expect tenure where you cannot be
> fired no matter the offense.
>
> Let us know how that goes for you.

Do you realize that this thread is not filled with teachers complaining about their job? As I posted earlier, I have never complained about my salary. I knew the salary, benefits, and vacation time going into the position almost 20 years ago. I've always told others, if my contract was longer I'd be paid more. I have always appreciated the time I get to spend with my family. That's the trade off. The benefits are good. Not as great as some think they are, but I'm not starving either.

On Mondays, I work a full day. Although the students leave 2.5 hours earlier, there is never an afternoon that is not scheduled with a meeting or without work. I don't have enough time with the students on Monday and would be all for adding time to the students' Monday and shaving .5 from T-F.

In the first 3 years, it is not that difficult to not renew a contract. After 3 years, there is due process, but a teacher can still be let go. It is not true that we have tenure in VA or that a teacher can't be fired, no matter the offense.

Please see this as a voice of reason and try to not only reply to the posts that seek to rile you up.

stop the crying Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Attention teachers, if you hate your job so much
> or feel so underpaid then quit. Go into the
> private sector. When you get in the private sector
> remind your boss you only work a half day on
> Mondays. You get 3/4 of the summer off. You get
> all holidays off, a week at Christmas and a week
> at Easter. In addition you want to be paid enough
> to live in the area you work. After your first
> year you also expect tenure where you cannot be
> fired no matter the offense.
>
> Let us know how that goes for you.

Here is an example from the private sector. Not a bad gig. Maybe better than the schools? My neighbor works for this company and these are the bennies taken from their website:

Medical, Dental and Vision

Our employees are our top priority. That’s why ____ pays 100% of each employee’s healthcare premium. Have a family? No problem, we pay the majority of their premium, too! And with small co-pays and low deductibles, it’s easy to make sure you and your family are in tip-top shape.

401K Matching

We believe we should take care of our employees—now AND in the future. We offer 100% matching on all 401K contributions up to 3% of an employee’s compensation and an additional 50% matching up to 5%. The maximum we will match is 4%.

Profit Sharing

_____ may make a profit sharing contribution at the end of the fiscal year, which will be divided between employee-elected accounts based on your compensation for the year. The employee must be employed on the last day of the fiscal year (9/30) to be eligible. Vesting starts after two years and an employee is 100% vested after five years.

Flexible Schedule

We realize not all our employees enjoy getting up before the birds… and that not everyone prefers to work into the evening hours. As long as your preferred schedule meets your supervisor’s approval and your projects’ needs you can choose your own schedule.

Paid Time Off (PTO)

Most new permanent, full-time employees earn 96 hours (12 days) of Paid Time Off throughout the year, which will accrue during each pay period. If you stay with the company long enough (we think you’ll like us), you could earn up to 296 hours (37 days) of PTO a year!

Holidays

Our employees enjoy the flexibility of 10 floating holidays (80 hours), which can be used at any time during the year. New employees will receive prorated holiday pay based on when in the fiscal year they join us.

Bereavement

In the event of the loss of an immediate family member, we will grant permanent employees up to five working days of bereavement leave without the loss of pay.

Disability

Permanent employees normally scheduled to work at least 20 hours per week are eligible for disability leave accrual (paid for by _____). Disability leave is accrued at the rate of one day per month (1/2 day for part-time employees). Up to 6 weeks of disability leave may be granted as maternity leave. Up to 6 additional weeks of personal leave and/or leave without pay may be taken if desired.

Tuition Assistance

We love to expand our knowledge, and we want our employees to as well. We offer tuition assistance to our employees when they are furthering their education in a field directly related to their work here at _____. Employees must complete the course with a 3.0 or better. In return, the employee will be required to work one full year beyond the completion date of the last class taken.

tgbwc Wrote:

> Do you realize that this thread is not filled with
> teachers complaining about their job? As I posted
> earlier, I have never complained about my salary.
> I knew the salary, benefits, and vacation time
> going into the position almost 20 years ago. I've
> always told others, if my contract was longer I'd
> be paid more. I have always appreciated the time I
> get to spend with my family. That's the trade off.
> The benefits are good. Not as great as some think
> they are, but I'm not starving either.
>
> On Mondays, I work a full day. Although the
> students leave 2.5 hours earlier, there is never
> an afternoon that is not scheduled with a meeting
> or without work. I don't have enough time with the
> students on Monday and would be all for adding
> time to the students' Monday and shaving .5 from
> T-F.
>
> In the first 3 years, it is not that difficult to
> not renew a contract. After 3 years, there is due
> process, but a teacher can still be let go. It is
> not true that we have tenure in VA or that a
> teacher can't be fired, no matter the offense.
>
> Please see this as a voice of reason and try to
> not only reply to the posts that seek to rile you
> up.

You sound very reasonable. I can only assume you aren’t in the union the OpEd writer represents. Do you agree his rhetoric is part of what causes image problems for the teachers?

Yes, there are lots of jobs in the private sector that pay more--but there are also a lot of new college grads (smart ones) from good schools who are working at sub-standard paying jobs--or temp jobs--these days.

With the benefits and time off, the pay for a starting teacher is not so far--and in many cases, better--than what the typical college grad is getting.
We are in a "down market".

Question: How many applicants are there for FCPS teaching jobs? I suspect there are far more applicants than jobs.

to tgbwc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>

> Do you agree his rhetoric is part of what causes
> image problems for the teachers?

Rhetoric such as this is over the top, yes. It does not help.

I also don't think a 1.25% market scale adjustment (aka COLA) is unreasonable and I think many people interpret a teacher's defense of pay/benefits as a complaint. I won't complain about my pay and benefits, but I will defend what I get. Since '08-'09 we received one year with a step increase plus 1% and next year's 1.25% w/ a step freeze. Those are not crazy increases.

If somebody goes on a tirade about how our healtcare is fully paid, I will let them know how much I pay per month. Not as a complaint, just as a correction. Often that is met with, "Well, that's still better than I get!" Of course, I never said it was or wasn't. If someone goes on about how good retirees have it, I will let them know how expensive the premiums are once we retire. People have a right to their opinions, they just need to have correct information to support them.

So the answer is to lower the starting pay for teachers? Also get rid of the retirement benefit? The argument is about adjusting to a "down market"? The private sector should always pay more for workers? Is this the basic argument? It's not about professional work for professional pay?

Please suggest a level of pay that you think is reasonable for teachers. Give starting pay as well as any steps for experience. Explain how you would structure retirement and how you would retain teachers and encourage qualified people to enter the profession. You seem to have an idea of how to do this better than it is being done.

Personally, I think the current pay scale is within reason. I would like the teachers to get more, but I think with the current economy that it is not an unreasonable scale.

If I were in charge, I would cut Gatehouse dramatically, reduce in-service training, hire more teachers to reduce classroom size, eliminate FLES,and, if there is any left, give it to the teachers.

However, I am also concerned about the ballooning elementary schools. Reed made a comment about talking with Tisdadt about closed buildings (I assume Clifton and others). In my mind, the number of trailers and modular buildings is unacceptable. I don't live in Springfield district, but I will never understand how FCPS school board could justify closing Clifton to put students on long bus rides and created schools that are bursting at the seams. I think someone needs to do a very serious audit of Tisdadt's shop.

former teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Question: do you know how many FCPS teachers lost
> their jobs because of poor performance? Through
> the grapevine, I heard that it was FOUR. Does
> anyone know if this is true?
>
> I disagree with Waste (above)
>
> While I do think teachers deserve good pay, I do
> not believe that we would necessarily get better
> teachers. Unless there is wholesale change in
> administration at FCPS, you will get the same
> teachers with better pay.
>
> It begins at the top--we need someone who
> understands what a good teacher is. That someone
> is not Jack Dale.
>
> You will never improve the quality of teachers
> unless you improve the quality of principals.
> When you have an atmosphere such as the one
> fostered by Dale, you do not necessarily get the
> best principals. Think about it, the principals
> are the ones who should be weeding out the sorry
> teachers.
>
> Read WAPO op-ed today on TJ. Sounds like FCPS has
> taken an elite, successful school and "dumbed" it
> down. I guess the purpose was to increase
> diversity--however, they "dumbed" it down and
> didn't even increase the diversity they were
> aiming for. How insulting to all concerned.
>
> If FCPS can't identify the best students for TJ,
> how can they identify the best teachers for the
> classroom?


A lot of private sector bachelor/masters professionals have been laid off - teachers fared better in government jobs. Teachers make more money than people who had to start over so the salary whining is not getting any sympathy from the general workforce.

Agree with the comment on principals - never head a good ES principal, had a good MS and now have one greener than a bean plant, HS principal was so unliked but gatehouse promoted into a higher position. One ES principal indicated the ES was an "English" based school whatever the heck that meant. When asked why kids weren't taught to spell, gave some rambling academia reply about how teaching kids to spell stifled creative writing. Knew we were in trouble then.

I have NEVER used all twelve sick days in a year...... What people don't understand is that it takes between 3-4 hours to write lesson plans for a sub for ONE day! This is for secondary school.. I'm sure elementary teachers need longer... What complicates matters further is that lessons are now totally dependent on instructional technology which subs are not allowed to access....we don't even have hard copies of textbooks anymore. Teacher wake up sick, they have to drag themselves in and write lesson plans before they can go home and rest. Don't know of any other job that this happens. Get sick during the day? Good luck trying to find someone to cover because our off times are so encumbered with stupid meetings. Doctor's appointments? Always have to be after 3:30. Yes, that is the reality of a teacher's life, but we don't have it as easy as people think. Just listen to the Moms in the grocery store within the first weeks of summer... they are going nuts with just a few kids!

Long Time Teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have NEVER used all twelve sick days in a
> year...... What people don't understand is that it
> takes between 3-4 hours to write lesson plans for
> a sub for ONE day! This is for secondary school..
> I'm sure elementary teachers need longer... What
> complicates matters further is that lessons are
> now totally dependent on instructional technology
> which subs are not allowed to access....we don't
> even have hard copies of textbooks anymore.
> Teacher wake up sick, they have to drag themselves
> in and write lesson plans before they can go home
> and rest. Don't know of any other job that this
> happens. Get sick during the day? Good luck
> trying to find someone to cover because our off
> times are so encumbered with stupid meetings.
> Doctor's appointments? Always have to be after
> 3:30. Yes, that is the reality of a teacher's
> life, but we don't have it as easy as people
> think. Just listen to the Moms in the grocery
> store within the first weeks of summer... they are
> going nuts with just a few kids!


You sound very conscientious. Thank you for your dedication. You are one of the good ones. Other teachers took endless amount of time off - one had 3 funerals and then maternity leave. Had a series of subs that year. One sub hated boys. She was such a disorganized mess that the mothers set up a schedule and went on a rotation to lend classroom support every day for remainder of the year. Another teacher had a baby early and again had 3 subs - do you know what it is like to get 3 report cards when they all say something different?

So . . . teachers aren't allowed to take maternity leave?

Listen, don't blame the teachers who are allowed to take 6 weeks of maternity leave by law. Blame the administration who does not plan to get decent subs (they know ahead of time that a teacher is pregnant!). The job is great and there are so many people applying and waiting to get into teaching (and get a foot in the door) that it should not be a problem to get decent subs.

PE teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Big Dog Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Ok so we round that up in teacher math to 200
> days
> > of work, and you still are getting paid for a
> 10
> > hour day $22 an hour if ur making 44k a year
> plus
> > benifits. Now tell me do you do nothing all
> > summer long or do you work another job your own
> > business etc.. Wine gripe and complain all you
> > want there are alot of others who would leve to
> > make that kind of money with job security and
> > benifits.
>
>
> What sucks is that many of the school MAINTENANCE
> guys make more money than we do! It's insane that
> we pay plumbers, electricians and A/C guys more
> money than most of the teachers. There is
> something seriously wrong going on here!


Lannigan, is that you? Fricking perv.

Long Time Teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have NEVER used all twelve sick days in a
> year...... What people don't understand is that it
> takes between 3-4 hours to write lesson plans for
> a sub for ONE day! This is for secondary school..
> I'm sure elementary teachers need longer... What
> complicates matters further is that lessons are
> now totally dependent on instructional technology
> which subs are not allowed to access....we don't
> even have hard copies of textbooks anymore.
> Teacher wake up sick, they have to drag themselves
> in and write lesson plans before they can go home
> and rest. Don't know of any other job that this
> happens. Get sick during the day? Good luck
> trying to find someone to cover because our off
> times are so encumbered with stupid meetings.
> Doctor's appointments? Always have to be after
> 3:30. Yes, that is the reality of a teacher's
> life, but we don't have it as easy as people
> think. Just listen to the Moms in the grocery
> store within the first weeks of summer... they are
> going nuts with just a few kids!

Same here. I have 904 hours of leave saved up. Sometimes I wonder why I'm saving it, but it is a hassle to be out. I hate to be out of the classroom for meetings, so to be out by choice I pretty much have to be sick.

I leave very different plans for a substitute teacher. The substitute wouldn't be able to manage the different reading groups, writing conferences, math groupings, etc. that I juggle every day and I wouldn't expect her to. I would have to be there to explain a lot of it. With a substitute the class kind of reverts back to old fashioned busy work and I don't want them doing that very often.

Really? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So . . . teachers aren't allowed to take maternity
> leave?
>
> Listen, don't blame the teachers who are allowed
> to take 6 weeks of maternity leave by law. Blame
> the administration who does not plan to get decent
> subs (they know ahead of time that a teacher is
> pregnant!). The job is great and there are so
> many people applying and waiting to get into
> teaching (and get a foot in the door) that it
> should not be a problem to get decent subs.


so why did they pick the one that hated boys? agree with you, poor result is from poor administration. but at the end of the blame game, who lost? the kids who lost curriculm continuity in a critical year? watched one academically gifted, highly engaged, model student put her head down on the desk out of frustration becasue the sub started 7 sentences, never finished one, couldn't clearly define the assignment. sub stayed for 3 months.

reality Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Teaching is a profession. People on this thread
> treat it like it is an hourly wage type of job.
> It should be compared to other professions that
> require a 4 year degree (and many teachers
> actually have Master's degrees these days). I
> would think that 44K is comparable to what other 4
> year degree people receive coming out of school
> who get starting jobs in their professions. If
> you look at any lists of what people make as
> professionals in our society, you will always find
> teaching very low on the list for salary (along
> with social work). Yes, many school districts
> tried to balance that issue by offering a more
> secure retirement plan. That plan is increasingly
> not available as a means of attracting good
> people.
>
> To those who believe that you can get quality
> people without paying them, good luck with that
> thought. You might get a few martyrs, but good
> people are sought after by many employers who are
> willing to pay. People have families, student
> debt, etc. and the teaching profession will not
> see those people even though they may have been
> excellent teachers. My niece (who has a master's
> in Geology) applied at a high school in Tuscon, AZ
> (where she lives) on a dare from her boyfriend
> (she is 25 years old). He has a master's degree
> as well (Business), but did not receive an
> interview (it was a competition of sorts). She
> came away from the teaching job interview
> appalled. She said, "Geez, 60 hours a week of
> work for 40K?" She has since interviewed for
> hydrologist jobs (drilling for water in AZ is a
> deal) and they pay much, much more for a normal 40
> hour week. I'm sure she'll take one of those
> jobs. She would have been a very highly qualified
> teacher---she was a National Merit finalist in
> high school and she graduated Phi Beta Kappa from
> college. The kids lose. Maybe some of you
> taxpayers win or think you win. Enjoy your win.


We don't live in Arizona and don't give a rats ass about your niece. If anyone goes into teaching to get rich, they're going to be disappointed. Teachers in FFX get to retire on a very nice full pension in their mid-50's. They work 7 hours a day, of which most have one period off. What else is someone with a degree in Liturature or History going to do? If you have a useful degree (ie. engineering, finance, etc) you'll go to work in private industry, work long hours and make good money. Apples and oranges.

Health care with prescription coverage – teacher pays about $100 a month for individual plan. FCPS pays $450 or so (based on comparison with Cobra costs)

Vision care – teacher pays $0 for united Health Care vision plan

Dental Care – teacher pays nearly $0 for dental coverage

Retirement – Teachers pay $0 into VRS. FCPS pays 5% into VRS. Teacher pays 4% into local retirement plan

*******I do not know for sure, but I have heard that a 55 year old retiree who works for 30 or more years will receive retirement benefits that equal about 75% of their highest annual salary.

Life insurance – teacher pays $0 for life insurance (2x annual income)

Long-Term Disability – teacher pays 0.28% for LTD insurance

Short-Term Disability – teacher pays $0

Sick leave – 9 days

Personal leave – 3 days

http://fcps.edu/hr/benefits/

teacher benefits Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Health care with prescription coverage – teacher
> pays about $100 a month for individual plan. FCPS
> pays $450 or so (based on comparison with Cobra
> costs)
>
> Vision care – teacher pays $0 for united Health
> Care vision plan
>
> Dental Care – teacher pays nearly $0 for dental
> coverage
>
> Retirement – Teachers pay $0 into VRS. FCPS pays
> 5% into VRS. Teacher pays 4% into local retirement
> plan
>
> *******I do not know for sure, but I have heard
> that a 55 year old retiree who works for 30 or
> more years will receive retirement benefits that
> equal about 75% of their highest annual salary.
>
> Life insurance – teacher pays $0 for life
> insurance (2x annual income)
>
> Long-Term Disability – teacher pays 0.28% for
> LTD insurance
>
> Short-Term Disability – teacher pays $0
>
> Sick leave – 9 days
>
> Personal leave – 3 days
>
> http://fcps.edu/hr/benefits/

That's pretty accurate. Next year the employee contribution to VRS increases, but the SB will pick up more of the ERFC (supplemental retirement) to help offset it. The state is also requiring districts to raise compensation to match the VRS contribution.
Dental is between $9 and 14 a month for an individual.

Here is a link to the dental and medical premiums. http://www.fcps.edu/hr/benefits/publications/2012/healthpremiums2012.pdf

Retiree healtcare premiums are very different.

Starting pay at an annual rate of 52-59K (though less cause of the short contract) with all these benefits ain't bad. You won't get rich, but should be able to take care of yourself and retire pretty comfortable while young enough to enjoy. The problem is you have to deal with parents the like of those who post here.


teacher benefits Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Health care with prescription coverage – teacher
> pays about $100 a month for individual plan. FCPS
> pays $450 or so (based on comparison with Cobra
> costs)
>
> Vision care – teacher pays $0 for united Health
> Care vision plan
>
> Dental Care – teacher pays nearly $0 for dental
> coverage
>
> Retirement – Teachers pay $0 into VRS. FCPS pays
> 5% into VRS. Teacher pays 4% into local retirement
> plan
>
> *******I do not know for sure, but I have heard
> that a 55 year old retiree who works for 30 or
> more years will receive retirement benefits that
> equal about 75% of their highest annual salary.
>
> Life insurance – teacher pays $0 for life
> insurance (2x annual income)
>
> Long-Term Disability – teacher pays 0.28% for
> LTD insurance
>
> Short-Term Disability – teacher pays $0
>
> Sick leave – 9 days
>
> Personal leave – 3 days
>
> http://fcps.edu/hr/benefits/

had an teacher who let students watch TV three times a day, every day. complaints to principal went nowhere. very unfair to other same grade teachers who worked hard at their profession. factor in that instructional time into the salary.

There's a lot more justification for giving raises to teachers than some of the other drivel that's in the school budget. I just found this in the Post:

"Elementary-level foreign language classes and immersion programs, available in dozens of schools, will expand into 10 additional schools...."

This program is a prime example of the pretentious approach to spending that's draining off dollars that should be spent to shore up academic coursework vital to students' futures. Foreign language immersion is the sort of boutique elective program that belongs in prep schools where parents are willing to pay the tab for it. I certainly didn't sign on to help foot the tab for anything that's this remote from mainstream education. It's sickening to see money wasted like this when test scores suggest that many students still need assistance in attaining acceptable English literacy. There's shouldn't be any room in the school budget for this sort of vanity.

If that’s not bad enough, the Post also reports that: “The board plans to conduct a $200,000 study of Food and Nutrition Services to find ways to serve healthier meals, and another $100,000 will go toward piloting a fresh-food school kitchen….” Apparently, there have been some gripes about the schools serving reheated food. What next? Personal chefs to prepare made to order gourmet meals?

Unless the spending spree stops, I would be extremely reluctant to criticize teachers for wanting a raise. Their demands are a lot more realistic than a lot of the frivolous stuff for which the mommies and daddies are gouging the public fisc.

You hit the nail on the head. Teachers see lots of waste and mismanagement around them and then get criticized for wondering why their pay is stagnant and their class sizes keep increasing. Parents should be wondering about this as well.

Many of us do wonder. We see them building Gate House Admin II and yet, when we have SB elections, the same turds get elected or people who think just the turds that retired. So, like everything else in this country, we get the shitty educational system that we deserve because we keep voting for it. Kathy Smith is queen of turds, yet she's whored herself to Poplar Tree and their vote gets her elected every time. Then she turns around and screws the rest of Sully in the ass with her liberal commie redistributive BS. And she'll get elected again if she runs.

If teachers REALLY want to help their cause they should speak out about the abusive waste of so many admin jobs. Jobs that do nothing but add extra paperwork on the teachers so the admins can collect stats to justify their existence.
I have yet to hear one teacher go public about all the useless burdensome admin jobs. I have heard friends who are teachers complain about it but they will not openly criticize them for fear of retribution. Certainly your union could make some effort to cut this waste.

A teacher at the end of his/her career with a master’s degree makes 90K. This doesn’t count any extra duties (coaching, yearbook, etc) that pay more or a teacher on a longer than 194 day contract. This teacher retires at 55 making 67K+ a year in retirement. If he/she is married to a teacher, they retire together making $130K+ for life. I assume most are putting money into 401K’s and the like. So with the pension plus savings, they should be in good shape for years, and then social security kicks in (if it is still there). This really is not a bad deal.

I know teachers work hard. Sure there will be a slacker here or there just like with any profession, but most of my kids teachers seem like hard working, dedicated people. But is seems like having 9 weeks off each summer, a week or two at Christmas, another week at Easter, decent pay, good benefits, and very good retirement is a pretty good deal overall.

The union guy saying that the state forcing teachers to pay 5% (almost completely offset by the school raising salaries 5%) while they also pay 4% into another plan means the teachers won’t be able to eat is just embarrassing. “If they don’t eat, they die?” This guy hurts the credibility of teachers.

I think teachers should be paid by the hour and also based on what they teach. PE teachers should be paid slightly over minimum wage. English teachers paid slightly more. Math teachers should be paid minimum wage, then add on incentives for their test results. Science teachers aren't needed anymore because technology is so advanced. Music teachers should be unpaid volunteers.

If memory serves, the median household income in Fairfax is around $105,000. Looks like two teachers married together make about this much and have months off together. If they work in the summer, even 25 year old couples probably make more. Near retirement they make way more than the median and then keep making way more in retirement without working.

About a million people live in Fairfax. Not sure why that can’t eat when they are making more money than about 500,000 other people who live here. Looking at the waistbands of Fairfax, eating enough doesn't seem to be a problem.

Do the teachers in Fairfax have to join the union? Can they say no or do they have to join?

Is it a choice? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do the teachers in Fairfax have to join the union?
> Can they say no or do they have to join?

Virginia is a "Right To Work" state. You do not have to join a union. It's an option.

Tom_Mason Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There's a lot more justification for giving raises
> to teachers than some of the other drivel that's
> in the school budget. I just found this in the
> Post:
>
> "Elementary-level foreign language classes and
> immersion programs, available in dozens of
> schools, will expand into 10 additional
> schools...."
>
> This program is a prime example of the pretentious
> approach to spending that's draining off dollars
> that should be spent to shore up academic
> coursework vital to students' futures. Foreign
> language immersion is the sort of boutique
> elective program that belongs in prep schools
> where parents are willing to pay the tab for it. I
> certainly didn't sign on to help foot the tab for
> anything that's this remote from mainstream
> education. It's sickening to see money wasted like
> this when test scores suggest that many students
> still need assistance in attaining acceptable
> English literacy. There's shouldn't be any room in
> the school budget for this sort of vanity.
>
> our kids are not "college ready" because FCPS does not teach phonics, prepositions, sentence structure or grammar beyond past present and future tenses, spelling, cursive writing, other basics to the majority of the student body because it is more important to focus on language immersion for a handful.

Not a bad deal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A teacher at the end of his/her career with a
> master’s degree makes 90K. This doesn’t count
> any extra duties (coaching, yearbook, etc) that
> pay more or a teacher on a longer than 194 day
> contract. This teacher retires at 55 making 67K+ a
> year in retirement. If he/she is married to a
> teacher, they retire together making $130K+ for
> life. I assume most are putting money into
> 401K’s and the like. So with the pension plus
> savings, they should be in good shape for years,
> and then social security kicks in (if it is still
> there). This really is not a bad deal.
>
> I know teachers work hard. Sure there will be a
> slacker here or there just like with any
> profession, but most of my kids teachers seem like
> hard working, dedicated people. But is seems like
> having 9 weeks off each summer, a week or two at
> Christmas, another week at Easter, decent pay,
> good benefits, and very good retirement is a
> pretty good deal overall.
>
> The union guy saying that the state forcing
> teachers to pay 5% (almost completely offset by
> the school raising salaries 5%) while they also
> pay 4% into another plan means the teachers
> won’t be able to eat is just embarrassing. “If
> they don’t eat, they die?” This guy hurts the
> credibility of teachers.

I am a teacher and agree 100% with your post. I have been teaching for almost 25 years, and have never had difficulty making ends meet. I have worked second jobs over the years, but that was always to have a little extra (vacations, optional spending etc.), not to pay for the basics. And, while we don't get "three months off" or get paid over the summer, it is still very nice to have the eight or nine weeks to rejuvenate and get ready for the next batch of youngsters. It is also great to be off the same time as your own children.

Would I be able to make more money outside of education? Absolutely. But I love my job, and you can't really put a price on that.

The only thing I would add is that there is much more unpaid work (work at home) in teaching than almost any other profession. It is one of the few professions that you can't be good at in the time that you are paid to do it. Proper preparation, grading, reflection, revamping etc. takes much more than the 1.5 hours a day (for high school, elementary gets far less) that you are given...especially when about 25% of that time is spent in meetings of one sort or another. There are many other professions that require more than 8 hours a day, but in most of those professions the salary is much higher and/or there are bonuses and overtime.

Again, I love my job, so I do this work at home willingly. And, I won't lie...I also do it willingly because I know that a well planned lesson is key to student engagement and good classroom management. So, in a sense, it is self preservation. :)

One final thing...my retirement plan is definitely among the best out there. I cannot tell you how grateful for it I was when the economy tanked and people around me in other careers and professions were losing their savings left and right. That being said, I know that teachers hired in the last ten years don't have nearly the benefits that us old folks got when we signed on years ago, so I can only hope that they feel as secure.

Thanks for your fair and balanced post!

kerplunk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not a bad deal Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > A teacher at the end of his/her career with a
> > master’s degree makes 90K. This doesn’t
> count
> > any extra duties (coaching, yearbook, etc) that
> > pay more or a teacher on a longer than 194 day
> > contract. This teacher retires at 55 making 67K+
> a
> > year in retirement. If he/she is married to a
> > teacher, they retire together making $130K+ for
> > life. I assume most are putting money into
> > 401K’s and the like. So with the pension plus
> > savings, they should be in good shape for
> years,
> > and then social security kicks in (if it is
> still
> > there). This really is not a bad deal.
> >
> > I know teachers work hard. Sure there will be a
> > slacker here or there just like with any
> > profession, but most of my kids teachers seem
> like
> > hard working, dedicated people. But is seems
> like
> > having 9 weeks off each summer, a week or two
> at
> > Christmas, another week at Easter, decent pay,
> > good benefits, and very good retirement is a
> > pretty good deal overall.
> >
> > The union guy saying that the state forcing
> > teachers to pay 5% (almost completely offset by
> > the school raising salaries 5%) while they also
> > pay 4% into another plan means the teachers
> > won’t be able to eat is just embarrassing.
> “If
> > they don’t eat, they die?” This guy hurts
> the
> > credibility of teachers.
>
> I am a teacher and agree 100% with your post. I
> have been teaching for almost 25 years, and have
> never had difficulty making ends meet. I have
> worked second jobs over the years, but that was
> always to have a little extra (vacations, optional
> spending etc.), not to pay for the basics. And,
> while we don't get "three months off" or get paid
> over the summer, it is still very nice to have the
> eight or nine weeks to rejuvenate and get ready
> for the next batch of youngsters. It is also great
> to be off the same time as your own children.
>
> Would I be able to make more money outside of
> education? Absolutely. But I love my job, and
> you can't really put a price on that.
>
> The only thing I would add is that there is much
> more unpaid work (work at home) in teaching than
> almost any other profession. It is one of the few
> professions that you can't be good at in the time
> that you are paid to do it. Proper preparation,
> grading, reflection, revamping etc. takes much
> more than the 1.5 hours a day (for high school,
> elementary gets far less) that you are
> given...especially when about 25% of that time is
> spent in meetings of one sort or another. There
> are many other professions that require more than
> 8 hours a day, but in most of those professions
> the salary is much higher and/or there are bonuses
> and overtime.
>
> Again, I love my job, so I do this work at home
> willingly. And, I won't lie...I also do it
> willingly because I know that a well planned
> lesson is key to student engagement and good
> classroom management. So, in a sense, it is self
> preservation. :)
>
> One final thing...my retirement plan is definitely
> among the best out there. I cannot tell you how
> grateful for it I was when the economy tanked and
> people around me in other careers and professions
> were losing their savings left and right. That
> being said, I know that teachers hired in the last
> ten years don't have nearly the benefits that us
> old folks got when we signed on years ago, so I
> can only hope that they feel as secure.
>
> Thanks for your fair and balanced post!


Thanks for being a teacher. It's clear you are very dedicated. Your students are very fortunate to have you there for them.

kerplunk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> I am a teacher and agree 100% with your post. I
> have been teaching for almost 25 years, and have
> never had difficulty making ends meet. I have
> worked second jobs over the years, but that was
> always to have a little extra (vacations, optional
> spending etc.), not to pay for the basics. And,
> while we don't get "three months off" or get paid
> over the summer, it is still very nice to have the
> eight or nine weeks to rejuvenate and get ready
> for the next batch of youngsters. It is also great
> to be off the same time as your own children.
>
> Would I be able to make more money outside of
> education? Absolutely. But I love my job, and
> you can't really put a price on that.
>
> The only thing I would add is that there is much
> more unpaid work (work at home) in teaching than
> almost any other profession. It is one of the few
> professions that you can't be good at in the time
> that you are paid to do it. Proper preparation,
> grading, reflection, revamping etc. takes much
> more than the 1.5 hours a day (for high school,
> elementary gets far less) that you are
> given...especially when about 25% of that time is
> spent in meetings of one sort or another. There
> are many other professions that require more than
> 8 hours a day, but in most of those professions
> the salary is much higher and/or there are bonuses
> and overtime.
>
> Again, I love my job, so I do this work at home
> willingly. And, I won't lie...I also do it
> willingly because I know that a well planned
> lesson is key to student engagement and good
> classroom management. So, in a sense, it is self
> preservation. :)
>
> One final thing...my retirement plan is definitely
> among the best out there. I cannot tell you how
> grateful for it I was when the economy tanked and
> people around me in other careers and professions
> were losing their savings left and right. That
> being said, I know that teachers hired in the last
> ten years don't have nearly the benefits that us
> old folks got when we signed on years ago, so I
> can only hope that they feel as secure.
>
> Thanks for your fair and balanced post!

I'm a teacher, my wife is a teacher, and we agree with your post. As I mentioned before, the time I get to spend with my son, being on the same schedule, has been priceless.

tgbwc Wrote:

> I'm a teacher, my wife is a teacher, and we agree
> with your post. As I mentioned before, the time I
> get to spend with my son, being on the same
> schedule, has been priceless.


Very cool. Sounds like good living. I wish my schedule matched my kids – I have missed too much, I know.

Never thought about it before, but this topic made me think about it. How does being the president of a teachers' union work? Does this person teach or does he just work as president of the union? If they don’t teach, do they have to have taught before or are they just experienced at union matters? Finally, if they don’t teach, who pays them? I assume the union through their dues, but just wondering.

We don't get paid much, Why don't you teach for an year? I made about 25 dollars a hour is not much. My Friend a community college graduated earns about $23 dollars an hour, and his job is not as stressful as mine.
I have to go to a room day after day after damn day, and try to read though to a branch of kids who don't want to listen, don't want to learn anything. Your parents send them to school thinking the job is done, is up to the teacher now is doesn't work that way.

Teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We don't get paid much, Why don't you teach for an
> year? I made about 25 dollars a hour is not much.
> My Friend a community college graduated earns
> about $23 dollars an hour, and his job is not as
> stressful as mine.
> I have to go to a room day after day after damn
> day, and try to read though to a branch of kids
> who don't want to listen, don't want to learn
> anything. Your parents send them to school
> thinking the job is done, is up to the teacher now
> is doesn't work that way.


Please tell me this is not a teacher. It has to be a troll.

On top of that, Virginia hasn't allowed collective bargaining for teachers since 1971. So technically it's not even a union, but rather a trade association.

tgbwc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Is it a choice? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Do the teachers in Fairfax have to join the
> union?
> > Can they say no or do they have to join?
>
> Virginia is a "Right To Work" state. You do not
> have to join a union. It's an option.

Wow, are Fairfax teachers psychotic.. what a rant!!! More trouble than the kids just not learning correctly, its what theyre learning. Proud of you Mr Teacher.

Teachers take the job knowing exactly up front what they will be paid. A year into the job they appear shocked when they discover how much they make.
If you are that stupid should you really be teaching anyone?
Attachments:

Good news that Virginia is a right to work state. Otherwise the teachers would be bitching on this forum AND striking for more money. Not being able to strike hasn’t hurt their pay and benies all that much.

so why did FCPS allow a principal to take sabbatical and also pay the way for a phD program in Blacksburg while school was in session when the principal was within 5 years of retirement? what line item is that in the mysterious budget?

Teaching sleeping
Attachments:

> > dime to a dollar you’d change your mind/view
> > about us teachers.
> >
> > If not, FUCK YOU TO!
> >
> > Have a great day!
> >
> > Oh and FUCK YOU again!
>
>
> This is a teacher?


I was thinking the same thing.

I know a couple of teachers. They love to bitch and moan about their jobs. They also talk about all the crappy kids they love to hate.

I no longer go out with these gals. They make me sad.

If you don't like your job and you can't handle the stress please move along. Our kids deserve better.

The vast majority of teachers do a good job and my kids have been well served. I have had issues with a couple teachers, but all in all, my kids have received an excellent education. I could have complained about every little thing that did not go our kids’ way. Instead, I decided to teach them that life goes that way, to learn from it (who knows, maybe they/we were wrong), and move on. Looks like some hear need to learn that lesson, too.

So your kids are now lucky to now be out of the FCPS system? Many schools are in need of repair and improvements. I want Gatehouse to start to do without. Gatehouse staff should work out of trailers.

FCPS is failing and we need to improve our school system. I have faith in our new SB. I have no faith in Jack Dale.

to: Come on people... Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So your kids are now lucky to now be out of the
> FCPS system? Many schools are in need of repair
> and improvements. I want Gatehouse to start to do
> without. Gatehouse staff should work out of
> trailers.
>
> FCPS is failing and we need to improve our school
> system. I have faith in our new SB. I have no
> faith in Jack Dale.


not sure about the new SB yet. depends on when/if the indepedent audit takes place. every single other county agency that collectively adds up to the remaining 49% balance of the taxpayers funds is subject to audit. why can't any of these academic types take a look at the sagging scores, re look at the POS, and adjust the curriculum to the modern child? private industry fires people who can't figure out what the client needs. why can't FCPS figure out how to bridge spanish? hs and ms just keep blaming each other while parents shell out tutoring money.

all this talk about teachers working on their own time. majority of professionals are leashed to a blackberry. everyone brings work home. working parents volunteer at the school and we know/appreciate which teachers spend countless hours at school after the day ends. many parents volunteer unlimited hours and other parents do nothing but show up and complain. people need to stop thinking the grass is greener on the other side and start working better together.

to: Come on people... Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So your kids are now lucky to now be out of the
> FCPS system? Many schools are in need of repair
> and improvements. I want Gatehouse to start to do
> without. Gatehouse staff should work out of
> trailers.
>
> FCPS is failing and we need to improve our school
> system. I have faith in our new SB. I have no
> faith in Jack Dale.


No, my youngest is still in school. And he currently has two of his seven classes in trailers. His school is clearly in need of renovation, but it is not in the cue as best I know. Even if it were, he would not directly benefit from it. One of our kids was in a school during a renovation and spent the better part of an entire school year in a trailer as a result. Still, she and all our kids have received a solid education.

While I don’t love the trailers, I feel I should mention that the two classes (teachers) that each of my kids has enjoyed the most were held in trailers. Lucky they all got to work with these same two teachers (AP Lit & US History).

Based on your post, I guess I should complain, but I am not sure why. We have disagreed with a teacher here or there, but all in all most have been very good and my kids have had some great opportunities (sports, interning, performing) as well. And yes, I paid the athletic fees this year and last. Wish I did not have to, but I did.

It’s fine with me if you put all the administrators in trailers. My guess is they don’t care, either. And have faith in the school board or whoever. In my humble opinion, though, I think you (and we all) may need to step back and count your blessing. We are fortunate.

On this day, where we pay respect to those who have sacrificed the most, I think we should say thanks. Let’s just say thanks. We, and our kids, are fortunate to live and learn where we do.

Not.

Thanks for closing CES Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not.


Get over CES already - what a bunch of whine bags!

Just a question or two Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Never thought about it before, but this topic made
> me think about it. How does being the president of
> a teachers' union work? Does this person teach or
> does he just work as president of the union? If
> they don’t teach, do they have to have taught
> before or are they just experienced at union
> matters? Finally, if they don’t teach, who pays
> them? I assume the union through their dues, but
> just wondering.


I think the guy is paid by FCPS but doesn't teach as the elected head of the union.

Not sure... Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> I think the guy is paid by FCPS but doesn't teach
> as the elected head of the union.

He would take leave from FCPS. They don't pay him as the President of the union. His salary would come from the union.

From Washington Examiner

What do you call a $10 million-a-year public school fund for which "no historical records" are available to document how and where the money was spent? Fairfax County Public Schools calls it the "staffing reserve." Irate parents refer to it as a slush fund.

The theory behind the staffing reserve is simple. It allows FCPS to hire additional teachers if there's an unexpected surge in enrollment. But it doesn't work that way in practice. For example, when the principal of Wolftrap Elementary asked for additional help because a third-grade class had 36 students, the school was allotted .2 teachers from the staffing reserve -- enough for one teacher to come in just one day a week.

Wolftrap is not the only Fairfax County school with classes much larger than the advertised average. Parents have painstakingly begun compiling a list after their requests for information about the staffing reserve were stonewalled by FCPS. Churchill Road, Haycock and Spring Hill elementary schools all have classes at or exceeding 30 students. This has been going on for years, even though numerous studies show academic achievement goes down when the student-teacher ratio goes up.

School Board member Elizabeth Schultz, representing the Springfield District, also hit a brick wall when she tried to find out why some classes were still so large despite the well-funded staffing reserve. But in an email exchange obtained by The Washington Examiner, FCPS Superintendent Jack Dale informed Schultz there were "no historical records" available beyond this year.

A clearly incredulous Schultz asked Dale why, if the staffing reserve is predominantly used to meet unexpected enrollment demands, it has been steadily increasing, since "the circumstances which dictate the need for an additional teacher here or there do not materially and geographically change across our entire school system every year." And because "unexpected students do not evaporate the following year," Schultz added, the need for extra teachers should be going down, not up.

FCPS allocated $9.3 million for the staffing reserve in its fiscal 2012 budget, but nearly $11 million for fiscal 2013, with no explanation. Next year's approved budget increases the staffing reserve by six full-time positions, costing taxpayers an additional $526,363.

"With no historical data of how, why and where tens of millions have been spent or on what teaching or support positions they have been allocated, continued annual growth in this category is unverifiable," Schultz told Dale, calling the staffing reserve "a $10 million untracked pool of labor."

Dale acknowledged that placing up to 240 reserve teachers involves "a large group deliberation." They receive paychecks and benefits just like other FCPS teachers. So somebody in Dale's finance office had to transfer the money from the staffing reserve account to payroll. Somebody else in the human resources office had to have known where these reserve teachers were sent, and the same applies to the administrators to whose clusters they were assigned.

But nobody in FCPS, from the superintendent on down, is willing to provide this information to an elected School Board member, the taxpayers she represents, or the parents of children stuck in a single third-grade math class with 35 other students.

When Lee District Supervisor Jeff McKay recently complained during a public session on the schools, which consume roughly half of Fairfax County's $3.5 billion budget, that "you really can't tell exactly what money is going to what school, and you really can't measure whether or not that money is being wisely used," he wasn't kidding.

When complaints about the lack of transparency are met by official obfuscation, it often means there's something to hide.

Barbara F. Hollingsworth is The Examiner's local opinion editor.

tgbwc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not sure... Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> >
> > I think the guy is paid by FCPS but doesn't
> teach
> > as the elected head of the union.
>
> He would take leave from FCPS. They don't pay him
> as the President of the union. His salary would
> come from the union.


Makes sense. I assume FCPS grants the leave and the union pays the salary. Who pays the benefits? I assume he keeps getting the benefits the teachers receive. and keeps earning credits towards retirement. Just curious.

teacher benefits Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

Looks pretty sweet to me. Here's mine running my own business:


> Health care with prescription coverage – teacher
> pays about $100 a month for individual plan. FCPS
> pays $450 or so (based on comparison with Cobra
> costs)

I pay all of mine @ $450/month for a crappy catastrophic plan with a $7,500 deductible.


>
> Vision care – teacher pays $0 for united Health
> Care vision plan

None


> Dental Care – teacher pays nearly $0 for dental
> coverage

None

>
> Retirement – Teachers pay $0 into VRS. FCPS pays
> 5% into VRS. Teacher pays 4% into local retirement
> plan
>
> *******I do not know for sure, but I have heard
> that a 55 year old retiree who works for 30 or
> more years will receive retirement benefits that
> equal about 75% of their highest annual salary.
>

None other than what I save myself and what I pay into SS (both sides as self-employed).


> Life insurance – teacher pays $0 for life
> insurance (2x annual income)
>

None


> Long-Term Disability – teacher pays 0.28% for
> LTD insurance
>

None


> Short-Term Disability – teacher pays $0
>

None


> Sick leave – 9 days
>

None


> Personal leave – 3 days
>

None.

I haven't had a vacation in over 10 years. I do have some flexibility with my time so I can take half a day here and there to go do something. Other than that I work 7 days/week every week. Holidays are for people who work for someone else.

I make more than the average teacher but not getting rich by any means. I don't even want to think about what it works out to on an hourly basis. And it's all at risk and could go *poof* any day.

Great deal huh? lmao

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

Don't like your situation? Change it.

Quit yer cryin' Wrote:
-------------------------------

> I haven't had a vacation in over 10 years. I do
> have some flexibility with my time so I can take
> half a day here and there to go do something.
> Other than that I work 7 days/week every week.
> Holidays are for people who work for someone
> else.
>
> I make more than the average teacher but not
> getting rich by any means. I don't even want to
> think about what it works out to on an hourly
> basis. And it's all at risk and could go *poof*
> any day.
>
> Great deal huh? lmao

Quit yer cryin' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> teacher benefits Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> Looks pretty sweet to me. Here's mine running my
> own business:
>
>
> > Health care with prescription coverage –
> teacher
> > pays about $100 a month for individual plan.
> FCPS
> > pays $450 or so (based on comparison with Cobra
> > costs)
>
> I pay all of mine @ $450/month for a crappy
> catastrophic plan with a $7,500 deductible.
>
>
> >
> > Vision care – teacher pays $0 for united
> Health
> > Care vision plan
>
> None
>
>
> > Dental Care – teacher pays nearly $0 for
> dental
> > coverage
>
> None
>
> >
> > Retirement – Teachers pay $0 into VRS. FCPS
> pays
> > 5% into VRS. Teacher pays 4% into local
> retirement
> > plan
> >
> > *******I do not know for sure, but I have heard
> > that a 55 year old retiree who works for 30 or
> > more years will receive retirement benefits
> that
> > equal about 75% of their highest annual salary.
>
> >
>
> None other than what I save myself and what I pay
> into SS (both sides as self-employed).
>
>
> > Life insurance – teacher pays $0 for life
> > insurance (2x annual income)
> >
>
> None
>
>
> > Long-Term Disability – teacher pays 0.28% for
> > LTD insurance
> >
>
> None
>
>
> > Short-Term Disability – teacher pays $0
> >
>
> None
>
>
> > Sick leave – 9 days
> >
>
> None
>
>
> > Personal leave – 3 days
> >
>
> None.
>
> I haven't had a vacation in over 10 years. I do
> have some flexibility with my time so I can take
> half a day here and there to go do something.
> Other than that I work 7 days/week every week.
> Holidays are for people who work for someone
> else.
>
> I make more than the average teacher but not
> getting rich by any means. I don't even want to
> think about what it works out to on an hourly
> basis. And it's all at risk and could go *poof*
> any day.
>
> Great deal huh? lmao

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmm, try one of these three things below because after 10 years if you are struggling so much you can't afford dental care you need the advice.

a.) take a fucking business class, b.) hire someone who has a clue to run your business, c.) get a job, you are not smart enough to run your own business.

and d.) stop smiling, your customers probably do not appreciate your plaque-covered yellow chiclets looking at them when they stroke a check to you.

seriously, no more smiling, austin powers.

ur welcome.

-jg

p.s. Oh you mad cuz I'm stylin' on you?

-
-
-

Quit yer cryin' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> I haven't had a vacation in over 10 years. I do
> have some flexibility with my time so I can take
> half a day here and there to go do something.
> Other than that I work 7 days/week every week.
> Holidays are for people who work for someone
> else.
>
> I make more than the average teacher but not
> getting rich by any means. I don't even want to
> think about what it works out to on an hourly
> basis. And it's all at risk and could go *poof*
> any day.
>
> Great deal huh? lmao

Do something else if it's not working out for you. You knew it would be like this starting your own business.

Random Dude Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Quit yer cryin' Wrote:
> -------------------------------
>
> > I haven't had a vacation in over 10 years. I
> do
> > have some flexibility with my time so I can
> take
> > half a day here and there to go do something.
> > Other than that I work 7 days/week every week.
> > Holidays are for people who work for someone
> > else.
> >
> > I make more than the average teacher but not
> > getting rich by any means. I don't even want
> to
> > think about what it works out to on an hourly
> > basis. And it's all at risk and could go
> *poof*
> > any day.
> >
> > Great deal huh? lmao


It's simple, here's what you do:

Get your GED.

Enroll in college and get your degree.

Take the courses for a teaching certificate.

Get on board! FCPS hires teachers pretty much constantly.

You know the old saying, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!"

stop please Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stop bitching! If you don't like your job you can
> leave. I know a lot of teachers in the FCPS who
> SHOULD retire because they suck.


You're an idiot. They love their job but they think thye deserve more money for it. A garbage man should not make more money than the person you trust with the education of your child. BUt maybe you think so. An opinion you learned from your parents no doubt. How would you feel if we started paying doctors 35K a year.

Would you still say if you don't like your job quit?!?! No, we pay them more because you want to give incentive for the most qualified and intelligent people to seek out that type of work. Its a shame we don't feel the same way about our teachers.

I think it's a miracle we have the quality of teachers we currently have.

I pray KJ is not a teacher. Yikes!

Random Dude Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
>
> Don't like your situation? Change it.
>
> Quit yer cryin' Wrote:
> -------------------------------
>
> > I haven't had a vacation in over 10 years. I
> do
> > have some flexibility with my time so I can
> take
> > half a day here and there to go do something.
> > Other than that I work 7 days/week every week.
> > Holidays are for people who work for someone
> > else.
> >
> > I make more than the average teacher but not
> > getting rich by any means. I don't even want
> to
> > think about what it works out to on an hourly
> > basis. And it's all at risk and could go
> *poof*
> > any day.
> >
> > Great deal huh? lmao


Uhhhh... I wasn't cryin. And didn't say that I didn't like my situation. Just put it out there for comparison since some here seem to think that teachers are making such a sacrifice and people are posting some gold-plated benefits deal for the private sector. My situation is about the same as that for any other small business owner. I left a well over six figure job to do what I'm doing and I'm happy with that. Not having to answer to anyone, no commute, and not having to deal with all of the administrative BS and office crap is worth a lot to me.

Johnny Galt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Ummmmmmmmmmmmmm, try one of these three things
> below because after 10 years if you are struggling
> so much you can't afford dental care you need the
> advice.
>
> a.) take a fucking business class, b.) hire
> someone who has a clue to run your business, c.)
> get a job, you are not smart enough to run your
> own business.
>
> and d.) stop smiling, your customers probably do
> not appreciate your plaque-covered yellow chiclets
> looking at them when they stroke a check to you.
>
> seriously, no more smiling, austin powers.
>
> ur welcome.

Ummmmmmm... Didn't say that I didn't have any dental care dumbass. lol I just don't have a sugar daddy paying for it like the poor FCPS teachers.

FCPS Untracked Labor Pool Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> From Washington Examiner
>
> What do you call a $10 million-a-year public
> school fund for which "no historical records" are
> available to document how and where the money was
> spent? Fairfax County Public Schools calls it the
> "staffing reserve." Irate parents refer to it as a
> slush fund.
>
> The theory behind the staffing reserve is simple.
> It allows FCPS to hire additional teachers if
> there's an unexpected surge in enrollment. But it
> doesn't work that way in practice. For example,
> when the principal of Wolftrap Elementary asked
> for additional help because a third-grade class
> had 36 students, the school was allotted .2
> teachers from the staffing reserve -- enough for
> one teacher to come in just one day a week.
>
> Wolftrap is not the only Fairfax County school
> with classes much larger than the advertised
> average. Parents have painstakingly begun
> compiling a list after their requests for
> information about the staffing reserve were
> stonewalled by FCPS. Churchill Road, Haycock and
> Spring Hill elementary schools all have classes at
> or exceeding 30 students. This has been going on
> for years, even though numerous studies show
> academic achievement goes down when the
> student-teacher ratio goes up.
>
> School Board member Elizabeth Schultz,
> representing the Springfield District, also hit a
> brick wall when she tried to find out why some
> classes were still so large despite the
> well-funded staffing reserve. But in an email
> exchange obtained by The Washington Examiner, FCPS
> Superintendent Jack Dale informed Schultz there
> were "no historical records" available beyond this
> year.
>
> A clearly incredulous Schultz asked Dale why, if
> the staffing reserve is predominantly used to meet
> unexpected enrollment demands, it has been
> steadily increasing, since "the circumstances
> which dictate the need for an additional teacher
> here or there do not materially and geographically
> change across our entire school system every
> year." And because "unexpected students do not
> evaporate the following year," Schultz added, the
> need for extra teachers should be going down, not
> up.
>
> FCPS allocated $9.3 million for the staffing
> reserve in its fiscal 2012 budget, but nearly $11
> million for fiscal 2013, with no explanation. Next
> year's approved budget increases the staffing
> reserve by six full-time positions, costing
> taxpayers an additional $526,363.
>
> "With no historical data of how, why and where
> tens of millions have been spent or on what
> teaching or support positions they have been
> allocated, continued annual growth in this
> category is unverifiable," Schultz told Dale,
> calling the staffing reserve "a $10 million
> untracked pool of labor."
>
> Dale acknowledged that placing up to 240 reserve
> teachers involves "a large group deliberation."
> They receive paychecks and benefits just like
> other FCPS teachers. So somebody in Dale's finance
> office had to transfer the money from the staffing
> reserve account to payroll. Somebody else in the
> human resources office had to have known where
> these reserve teachers were sent, and the same
> applies to the administrators to whose clusters
> they were assigned.
>
> But nobody in FCPS, from the superintendent on
> down, is willing to provide this information to an
> elected School Board member, the taxpayers she
> represents, or the parents of children stuck in a
> single third-grade math class with 35 other
> students.
>
> When Lee District Supervisor Jeff McKay recently
> complained during a public session on the schools,
> which consume roughly half of Fairfax County's
> $3.5 billion budget, that "you really can't tell
> exactly what money is going to what school, and
> you really can't measure whether or not that money
> is being wisely used," he wasn't kidding.
>
> When complaints about the lack of transparency are
> met by official obfuscation, it often means
> there's something to hide.
>
> Barbara F. Hollingsworth is The Examiner's local
> opinion editor.


so why does the Board of Supervisors keep handing over 1.6 billion dollars of tax payers funds to this group that cannot account for $9.3 million.

SO Wrote:

>
> so why does the Board of Supervisors keep handing
> over 1.6 billion dollars of tax payers funds to
> this group that cannot account for $9.3 million.

So this group can account for 1.517 billion out of 1.6 billion the Board of Supervisors appropriates or 99.42%. I thought the school budget was way over 2 billion. Who cares, we will go with your numbers. What percent ot the rest of the "tax payers funds" does the Board of Supervisors account for? I have to assume it is 100%

So, so Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SO Wrote:
>
> >
> > so why does the Board of Supervisors keep
> handing
> > over 1.6 billion dollars of tax payers funds to
> > this group that cannot account for $9.3
> million.
>
> So this group can account for 1.517 billion out of
> 1.6 billion the Board of Supervisors appropriates
> or 99.42%. I thought the school budget was way
> over 2 billion. Who cares, we will go with your
> numbers. What percent ot the rest of the "tax
> payers funds" does the Board of Supervisors
> account for? I have to assume it is 100%


you're right, mistyped the number - point is they do not show any degree of acceptable accounting for the 2 BILLION dollars - think about that amount - of the taxpayers money. the budgets that are presented look like an elementary school homework assignment. there are 177,000 students and the budget is 2 BILLION dollars, much of it wasted based on some of the contracts found and posted.

How does this work? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> tgbwc Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Not sure... Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> >
> > >
> > > I think the guy is paid by FCPS but doesn't
> > teach
> > > as the elected head of the union.
> >
> > He would take leave from FCPS. They don't pay
> him
> > as the President of the union. His salary would
> > come from the union.
>
>
> Makes sense. I assume FCPS grants the leave and
> the union pays the salary. Who pays the benefits?
> I assume he keeps getting the benefits the
> teachers receive. and keeps earning credits
> towards retirement. Just curious.


Who pays this guy’s benefits & retirement?