Not in FFX County, but since so many of us go there every year, and Fairfax County School Board Chairwoman Jane Strauss was involved in the vote...

Repeal of 'Kings Dominion law' fails again
The effort to repeal the so-called "Kings Dominion law" that prevents local schools from opening before Labor Day has died again.
http://www.wtop.com/?nid=149&sid=2768770

WASHINGTON - Don't change your vacation plans. There will be no big change in school calendars in Virginia

The effort to repeal the so-called "Kings Dominion law" that prevents local schools from opening before Labor Day has died again. The State Senate Education and Health Committee killed the repeal of the law Thursday with a 9-6 vote.

A key vote against the law came from Sen. George Barker, D-Fairfax, who has expressed concern about the loss of sales tax revenue if the schools open before Labor Day. One percent of that sales tax money goes to schools across the state.

But Fairfax County School Board Chairwoman Jane Strauss says the decision not to repeal the law is frustrating.

"School calendars really should not be held hostage by the tourism industry" she says. "We have a tremendous need to rearrange our calendar to be more in sync with the rest of the nation."

Educators say starting after Labor Day puts their students at a disadvantage on national tests like the Advanced Placement exams.

Many school districts across the state have been able to obtain waivers to open early mostly because they are in areas that get more snow and they need the extra days to make up for snow days.

Strauss says they will try again next year to get the General Assembly to repeal the law.

Good to see we have our priorities right. Unbelievable.

Disadvantage? How?? Because the kids start school a week or two later?
My kids are both on the Honor Roll. The dates are fine as they are.

They already have too many school days as is, and for most of June nobody is learning anything. They really should let out earlier.

BTW, LoCo already does start before Labor Day. They began this year only a few days before FFX, and yet they get out the first week of June, AND they have 10 snow days built into their schedule.

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"And if any women or children get their legs torn off, or faces caved in, well, it's tough shit for them." -2LT. Bert Stiles, 505th, 339th (On Berlin Bombardier Mission, 1944).

meh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Disadvantage? How?? Because the kids start
> school a week or two later?
> My kids are both on the Honor Roll. The dates are
> fine as they are.

How nice for you that YOUR kids are on the honor roll. Have you ever heard of thinking outside yourself and outside of your priorities and thinking about what is better for mankind?

How many MORE FCPS students might make the honor roll because they get 2 more weeks of school? How many more FCPS students might see a bump in their GPA enough that they land a scholarship or fuck...even get INTO college? The world needs a few less people whose lot in life is mowing your lawn and a few more people going to college.

Originally the school calendar was schedules around farming. Last checked there weren't any farms in Fairfax.

Wonder if the teachers union has anything to do with this? They sure do love their summers off. I know quite a few who left the school system to work education jobs in the private sector. Within 18 months they wanted back into the school system because they couldn't hack working 9-5 and not having summers off.

meh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Disadvantage? How?? Because the kids start
> school a week or two later?
> My kids are both on the Honor Roll. The dates are
> fine as they are.


Yet Va still has some of the best public schools in the country....so what is the problem.

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Originally the school calendar was schedules
> around farming. Last checked there weren't any
> farms in Fairfax.
>
> Wonder if the teachers union has anything to do
> with this? They sure do love their summers off. I
> know quite a few who left the school system to
> work education jobs in the private sector. Within
> 18 months they wanted back into the school system
> because they couldn't hack working 9-5 and not
> having summers off.

No because private sector education doesn't pay.

npay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hay Zeus Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Originally the school calendar was schedules
> > around farming. Last checked there weren't any
> > farms in Fairfax.
> >
> > Wonder if the teachers union has anything to do
> > with this? They sure do love their summers off.
> I
> > know quite a few who left the school system to
> > work education jobs in the private sector.
> Within
> > 18 months they wanted back into the school
> system
> > because they couldn't hack working 9-5 and not
> > having summers off.
>
> No because private sector education doesn't pay.

They worked for corporations on developing training materials, not private schools.

lamepeople Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> meh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Disadvantage? How?? Because the kids start
> > school a week or two later?
> > My kids are both on the Honor Roll. The dates
> are
> > fine as they are.
>
>
> Yet Va still has some of the best public schools
> in the country....so what is the problem.

The northern Va area also has the highest % of people with college and graduate degrees. The school system has little to do with their ranking #.

Everyone should have a chance to get their pic taken with Scooby!
Attachments:

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wonder if the teachers union has anything to do
> with this? They sure do love their summers off. I
> know quite a few who left the school system to
> work education jobs in the private sector. Within
> 18 months they wanted back into the school system
> because they couldn't hack working 9-5 and not
> having summers off.

Moron, teachers are UNEMPLOYED during the summer. It is not a vacation, and many must find summer employment. Furthermore, teachers are under contract to work so many days per year (190, I think). After that they are unemployed (but cannot collect unemployment).

Unless the school year is lengthened, teachers are still going to be out of work for 2-1/2 months or so every year. I doubt many teachers care if it's Jun-Sept or May/Aug or Apr/Jul or whatever.

I know Rush has you all foaming at the mouth and shit, but VA is a right-to-work state. There are no "teachers unions" in VA. Just "associations" that have absolutely no power to force anything, none, zip.

jeez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hay Zeus Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Wonder if the teachers union has anything to do
> > with this? They sure do love their summers off.
> I
> > know quite a few who left the school system to
> > work education jobs in the private sector.
> Within
> > 18 months they wanted back into the school
> system
> > because they couldn't hack working 9-5 and not
> > having summers off.
>
> Moron, teachers are UNEMPLOYED during the summer.
> It is not a vacation, and many must find summer
> employment. Furthermore, teachers are under
> contract to work so many days per year (190, I
> think). After that they are unemployed (but
> cannot collect unemployment).
>
> Unless the school year is lengthened, teachers are
> still going to be out of work for 2-1/2 months or
> so every year. I doubt many teachers care if it's
> Jun-Sept or May/Aug or Apr/Jul or whatever.
>
> I know Rush has you all foaming at the mouth and
> shit, but VA is a right-to-work state. There are
> no "teachers unions" in VA. Just "associations"
> that have absolutely no power to force anything,
> none, zip.

They're not unemployed, some chose to make extra money, some don't. Most prefer to be at the beach. Some teachers opt to be paid based on a 12 month schedule, others 9.

I'm sure if you surveyed teachers on which months they would like to have off Dec-Feb or June-August, it would be overwhelmingly June-August.

Just because you disagree with me does not mean you have to be nasty. If you were more civil perhaps you could even change (gasp!) my opinion.

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They're not unemployed, some chose to make extra
> money, some don't. Most prefer to be at the beach.
> Some teachers opt to be paid based on a 12 month
> schedule, others 9.


They work 10 months and they get paid for ten months. If you're jealous, you could maybe try to work out the same deal with your employer, an annual sabbatical maybe?

Oh, and the "summer pay" program where a portion of a teacher's pay is withheld throughout their contract term and paid out (without interest) in three checks during the summer is a thing of the past after this coming summer. The County abolished summer pay.

Im salivating at the mouth over a possible teachers pay debate! Ring that bell!! Lets get ready to RUMBLE!

jeez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hay Zeus Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > They're not unemployed, some chose to make
> extra
> > money, some don't. Most prefer to be at the
> beach.
> > Some teachers opt to be paid based on a 12
> month
> > schedule, others 9.
>
>
> They work 10 months and they get paid for ten
> months. If you're jealous, you could maybe try to
> work out the same deal with your employer, an
> annual sabbatical maybe?

self employed here

> Oh, and the "summer pay" program where a portion
> of a teacher's pay is withheld throughout their
> contract term and paid out (without interest) in
> three checks during the summer is a thing of the
> past after this coming summer. The County
> abolished summer pay.

You know who else often takes money out of paychecks and gives it back a year later without paying interest? The federal and state government taxing authorities.

Ok, but budgeting for 2 months without a paycheck is not difficult with a little discipline. Especailly for a group of people with college degrees, masters degrees and some cases PHD's.

when we were kids school ended at Memorial Day and started back up right after Labor Day, I think we should return to that, we need more time away from school to actually do the difficult task of being kids.

For me, this is not about whether the kid gets on honor roll or not. I would just like my kid's vacation to sync with the rest of the US. My family is spread out in about 5 different states. None of them get out as late as we do and all of them start before Labor Day. This causes problems in scheduling reunions, visits, etc. It's a pain.

jeez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Moron, teachers are UNEMPLOYED during the summer.
> It is not a vacation, and many must find summer
> employment. Furthermore, teachers are under
> contract to work so many days per year (190, I
> think). After that they are unemployed (but
> cannot collect unemployment).
>
> Unless the school year is lengthened, teachers are
> still going to be out of work for 2-1/2 months or
> so every year. I doubt many teachers care if it's
> Jun-Sept or May/Aug or Apr/Jul or whatever.
>
> I know Rush has you all foaming at the mouth and
> shit, but VA is a right-to-work state. There are
> no "teachers unions" in VA. Just "associations"
> that have absolutely no power to force anything,
> none, zip.

Yes, VA is a right-to-work state with no collective bargaining, but there are unions. The Fairfax County Federation of Teachers is a local of AFT, which is affiliated with the AFL-CIO. The Fairfax Eduation Association, the local for NEA, is an association.

Hay Zeus Wrote:
>
> I'm sure if you surveyed teachers on which months
> they would like to have off Dec-Feb or
> June-August, it would be overwhelmingly
> June-August.
>

I'm a teacher and I find that a lot of my colleagues (myself included), would like to switch to a modified calendar. FCPS used to have a handful of elementary schools on modified calendar schedules, but eliminated it a few years ago.

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Ok, but budgeting for 2 months without a paycheck
> is not difficult with a little discipline.
> Especailly for a group of people with college
> degrees, masters degrees and some cases PHD's.

You're right. It shouldn't be any big deal. I'm glad they are getting rid of witholding portions of my pay so that I can have checks cut in the summer. Easy. This fall my wife and I just started to have the bank set aside the same amount that FCPS would set aside. Any interest earned goes to me now instead of FCPS.

Modified Calendar Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hay Zeus Wrote:
> >
> > I'm sure if you surveyed teachers on which
> months
> > they would like to have off Dec-Feb or
> > June-August, it would be overwhelmingly
> > June-August.
>
> I'm a teacher and I find that a lot of my
> colleagues (myself included), would like to switch
> to a modified calendar. FCPS used to have a
> handful of elementary schools on modified calendar
> schedules, but eliminated it a few years ago.

I knew teacher at Dogwood and she really enjoyed the modified schedule. For some reason the county claimed it cost more money to operate that way without much of an explanation an reverted back to the conventional. The example i used only had two options though.

IMAGINE if the SLEEP people focused on repealing the KD law as an objective. It might actually happen.

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jeez Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Hay Zeus Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > They're not unemployed, some chose to make
> > extra
> > > money, some don't. Most prefer to be at the
> > beach.
> > > Some teachers opt to be paid based on a 12
> > month
> > > schedule, others 9.
> >
> >
> > They work 10 months and they get paid for ten
> > months. If you're jealous, you could maybe try
> to
> > work out the same deal with your employer, an
> > annual sabbatical maybe?
>
> self employed here
>
> > Oh, and the "summer pay" program where a
> portion
> > of a teacher's pay is withheld throughout their
> > contract term and paid out (without interest)
> in
> > three checks during the summer is a thing of
> the
> > past after this coming summer. The County
> > abolished summer pay.
>
> You know who else often takes money out of
> paychecks and gives it back a year later without
> paying interest? The federal and state government
> taxing authorities.
>
> Ok, but budgeting for 2 months without a paycheck
> is not difficult with a little discipline.
> Especailly for a group of people with college
> degrees, masters degrees and some cases PHD's.


Self employed here too. That makes it even easier----I work when I feel like it. If you have the right people working for you, you can too!

You get a tax refund? A competent tax professional can fix that for you.

About the old FCPS summer pay----it was never mandatory. It was an option that I never elected when I worked for them. If you can't budget for a known stretch of unemployment every year, something's wrong. EVERYBODY should have enough emergency cash stashed to live on for at least a year.

Some of you don't read well. The issue is performance on standardized tests. Our kids have 1 full month less prep time than some other states thus presenting our kids with an unnecessary disadvantage.

Curmudgeon: Heres a news flash for you- "our kids" (you probably don't have any real kids, are not sponges that you can jampack arbitrary meaningless information into until they burst, and who gives a flying fuck about standardized tests, which mean nothing in the real world, they need time away from the stupid shit of school. Studies show that more time actually recreating will create a better learner with more retention in the long run.

The SAT, ACT, AP tests.. I guess those are meaningless to you?

Curmudgeon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The SAT, ACT, AP tests.. I guess those are
> meaningless to you?


They're pretty meaningless. Once you're accepted into college they never matter again. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying.
Unless you run for public office.

Quote

Once you're accepted

Uh, that's exactly the point.

> Some teachers opt to be paid based on a 12 month schedule, others 9.

Dummy, that means that their 9-month paycheck is spreadout of 12 months.

> Some teachers opt to be paid based on a 12 month schedule, others 9.

Dummy, that means that their 9-month paycheck is spread out overt 12 months -- they are not paid 33% more.

The Kings Dominion Law is interpreted so that most Virginia school districts are granted waivers every year. That's why they can start school before Labor Day.

Fairfax County is being held hostage on this issue. Virginia resort-oriented businesses are concerned that they will earn less money if Fairfax County families have summer vacations that are better aligned with the rest of the state and other states. There's some doubt about whether that's true. It might be useful for the General Assembly to ask JLARC for an objective study.

Another factor is that Fairfax County Public Schools uses the 180-day rule instead of the 990-hour rule under Virginia law. That also has an impact on school schedules. Perhaps others would like to comment.

Finally, while SAT tests become irrelevant after students are admitted to college, that is not true for AP or IB tests. Both are used by colleges to determine if students can place out of introductory college courses. Some families use this to save money on college tuition, if the students graduate in less than 4 years. But for most students, a major benefit of having higher AP or IB test scores is that they can avoid the typically enormous introductory college classes, and start with a smaller course in the same subject. That is a valuable benefit, and if FCPS started a week or two earlier, I believe more FCPS students would do well enough on their AP and IB tests to obtain these benefits.

APorIBMom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Kings Dominion Law is interpreted so that most
> Virginia school districts are granted waivers
> every year. That's why they can start school
> before Labor Day.
>
> Fairfax County is being held hostage on this
> issue. Virginia resort-oriented businesses are
> concerned that they will earn less money if
> Fairfax County families have summer vacations that
> are better aligned with the rest of the state and
> other states. There's some doubt about whether
> that's true. It might be useful for the General
> Assembly to ask JLARC for an objective study.
>
> Another factor is that Fairfax County Public
> Schools uses the 180-day rule instead of the
> 990-hour rule under Virginia law. That also has
> an impact on school schedules. Perhaps others
> would like to comment.
>
> Finally, while SAT tests become irrelevant after
> students are admitted to college, that is not true
> for AP or IB tests. Both are used by colleges to
> determine if students can place out of
> introductory college courses. Some families use
> this to save money on college tuition, if the
> students graduate in less than 4 years. But for
> most students, a major benefit of having higher AP
> or IB test scores is that they can avoid the
> typically enormous introductory college classes,
> and start with a smaller course in the same
> subject. That is a valuable benefit, and if FCPS
> started a week or two earlier, I believe more FCPS
> students would do well enough on their AP and IB
> tests to obtain these benefits.

Moot point because I would guess that most people in this area vacation outside the state when they do go on vacation. More people probably go to OBX, Rehoboth, or OC MD then Va Beach or Williamburg

"I believe more FCPS students would do well enough on their AP and IB tests to obtain these benefits"

You do realize that later AP testing is available, and that over 90% of FCPS students who take the SAT take it (or sections) more than once? Makes the date issue moot...

The real issue is why the longer SY? LD to the end of May is long enough w/the current school day structure.

Whats it matter when a kid starts school, the odds are good that some drunk driver will kill them before 12th grade.

APorIBMom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Kings Dominion Law is interpreted so that most
> Virginia school districts are granted waivers
> every year. That's why they can start school
> before Labor Day.
>
> Fairfax County is being held hostage on this
> issue. Virginia resort-oriented businesses are
> concerned that they will earn less money if
> Fairfax County families have summer vacations that
> are better aligned with the rest of the state and
> other states. There's some doubt about whether
> that's true. It might be useful for the General
> Assembly to ask JLARC for an objective study.
>
> Another factor is that Fairfax County Public
> Schools uses the 180-day rule instead of the
> 990-hour rule under Virginia law. That also has
> an impact on school schedules. Perhaps others
> would like to comment.
>
> Finally, while SAT tests become irrelevant after
> students are admitted to college, that is not true
> for AP or IB tests. Both are used by colleges to
> determine if students can place out of
> introductory college courses. Some families use
> this to save money on college tuition, if the
> students graduate in less than 4 years. But for
> most students, a major benefit of having higher AP
> or IB test scores is that they can avoid the
> typically enormous introductory college classes,
> and start with a smaller course in the same
> subject. That is a valuable benefit, and if FCPS
> started a week or two earlier, I believe more FCPS
> students would do well enough on their AP and IB
> tests to obtain these benefits.


Some parents want the longer school year because it means 5 fewer days where dual income mommy and daddy do not have to pay for day care.

FCPS is taxpayer funded daycare. Simple as that...

-----------------------------------------------

"...your suffering will be legendary even in Hell!"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2012 09:30AM by Pinhead the Cenobite.

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Modified Calendar Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Hay Zeus Wrote:
> > >
> > > I'm sure if you surveyed teachers on which
> > months
> > > they would like to have off Dec-Feb or
> > > June-August, it would be overwhelmingly
> > > June-August.
> >
> > I'm a teacher and I find that a lot of my
> > colleagues (myself included), would like to
> switch
> > to a modified calendar. FCPS used to have a
> > handful of elementary schools on modified
> calendar
> > schedules, but eliminated it a few years ago.
>
> I knew teacher at Dogwood and she really enjoyed
> the modified schedule. For some reason the county
> claimed it cost more money to operate that way
> without much of an explanation an reverted back to
> the conventional. The example i used only had two
> options though.

Wonder if there is significantly added burden from HVAC usage in August. While HVAC is certainly used in June, August is pretty nasty.

-----------------------------------------------

"...your suffering will be legendary even in Hell!"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2012 09:33AM by Pinhead the Cenobite.

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Wonder if there is significantly added burden from
> HVAC usage in August. While HVAC is certainly
> used in June, August is pretty nasty.


Not sure if my memory is off, but I recall as a young kid getting some days or afternoons off from school in June because not all elementary schools had A/C and they wanted to make it fair or something. Can anyone back me up here?