FCPD chat with open carry people at Burke Lake

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyQXLXRFFbg&mode=related&search=

"Nerds with Guns"

Wow the people at the picnic look like the biggest nerds. Carrying around a gun is probably the only way somebody would give them attention.

You missed the start of the incident, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fh6dbWl4l_4

Duh, a bunch of people walking around with handguns in a park with kids, what did they expect?

Open Carry group eh.

They have a huge NOVA forum, people telling stories how they get looks when the open carry.

guns guns guns!

We offered them some, but they didn't accept.

What are you doing looking up information about me anyways. That's kinda creepy.

nakedshoplifter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We offered them some, but they didn't accept.
>
> What are you doing looking up information about me
> anyways. That's kinda creepy.

LOL. Just doing some work for big brother. You know, cross referencing this list with that list.

Shoplifter,

I can't find longwatch\longwater(sp?) and scheetz on my list, are they in this video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNILJAN4msU

(I'm kiddn of course)

So these guys like to pack heat and protect themselves.. Big Deal!!
The only nerds I see are those internet nerds bashing them here.

Ok, I got a question on the whole gun thing.

So say you walk down a empty parking lot, at like 11pm, and someone starts to approach you. And you pull a gun on them. Just to scare them, etc.

Is that ground for arrest?

Kiev,
yes, that is a crime, because in your scenario, the person with the gun has no reasonable explaination for self defense.

18.2-282. Pointing, holding, or brandishing firearm, air or gas operated weapon or object similar in appearance; penalty.

A. It shall be unlawful for any person to point, hold or brandish any firearm or any air or gas operated weapon or any object similar in appearance, whether capable of being fired or not, in such manner as to reasonably induce fear in the mind of another or hold a firearm or any air or gas operated weapon in a public place in such a manner as to reasonably induce fear in the mind of another of being shot or injured. However, this section shall not apply to any person engaged in excusable or justifiable self-defense. Persons violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor or, if the violation occurs upon any public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school, including buildings and grounds or upon public property within 1,000 feet of such school property, he shall be guilty of a Class 6 felony.

So if that person approaches you and says give me your money, or grabs you then you can pull your gun and its self defense right?

Just having the gun in view on your hip would discourage someone from fucking with you or anyone else when you are around.

I have another scenario for you...

So say you walk down a empty parking lot, at like 11pm, and someone starts to approach you. And you pull a gun on them. Just to scare them, etc.

The approaching stranger is a law abiding citizen and has a concealed carry permit, and you just pointed a gun at them as a cheap thrill. You wake up in Fairfax INova hospital with three holes in your body because you tried to be a dick and point a gun at someone illegally for a power trip. The district attorney commends the stranger and charges you with first degree brandishing and attempted manslaughter. You can expect a criminal trial after you recuperate from your wounds, if you live.

Any further questions?

Yes, basically, you cannot pull a gun on someone for no reason. If someone simply says give me money, that is not enough. You have to be in reasonable fear for your life/safety/etc. For example, if you could shoot someone for saying "give me money," there would be far fewer homeless people. Having a gun on your hip could also encourage a criminal to shoot first and steal later. I am not advocating getting rid of open carry, but I have seen some that would better serve the community and themselves by leaving their firearms at home.

wild west all over :-))))

back to the roots, sort of...

All on-duty police open carry all the time. how many police officers get shot everyday?

Actually, a lot of police are required to CC rather than OC...

At least when off-duty...

Class III Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So these guys like to pack heat and protect
> themselves.. Big Deal!!
> The only nerds I see are those internet nerds
> bashing them here.

Meade would fit right in with this group

Gunny Wrote:
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> "Nerds with Guns"
>Duh, a bunch of people walking around with
> handguns in a park with kids, what did they
> expect?


I don't understand what kids have to do with it. Bearing arms is a right, not a vice. I don't smoke or drink or gamble around kids, or even curse, like I do around adults. Do you? Do you pray or speak freely or vote when kids are nearby? If, as your handle suggests, you are a Marine Gunnery Sgt., you should be aware of the freedom we Marines (current and former) are supposed to be protecting and enjoy that freedom during the short time you walk this earth. (If you are not a Marine Gunny, change your handle because you are a poser).

I was the guy who got the cops called on him that day. I was walking down the access road from the picnic area to the head when two nitwit park employees, after doing 2 flybys, rolled up on me and asked me if I "needed directions", while staring at my pistol, which was securely holstered. I have been carrying openly and concealed all around NOVA for years, including in the office of Burke Lake Park in full view of their employees, and this is the first time somebody got all wet-diaper and called the cops on me. They claimed I was scaring the park visitors, but no park visitor ever gives me a second look. The only ones scared were the two nitwits in the truck, and they couldn't be too scared because they kept following me around, into the parking lot of the outhouse and back to the picnic area.

Their problem, not ours. The cops were cool about it and didn't even walk up to us until they explained to the park nitwits that we were doing nothing wrong.

I HAVE THE RIGHT to drink beers, smoke and curse around kids. Do I do smoke, drink and curse around kids NO! Just because a person HAS THE RIGHT TO doesn't make an action appropriate.

As for the these "Park employee nitwits" that were obviously concerned about you having a loaded gun and obviously asked you "Were you lost?" to check out your gun closer."

My question is if you knew this and thought these guys are going to call the cops why didn't you just simply say, "I have an open carry permit for the gun."

Why... because you need attention and that's why you where the gun in the first place.

and they will always get this attention.

Because its rather unusual for a plain dressed person to openly carry a fire arm.

I do think people who OC really do enjoy this attention.
There are endless topics on OC websites about the looks they get when the OC.

Interesting world we live in...

Why one earth would someone lie to a park official or a police officer by stating s/he has an open carry permit? In Virginia, where this occurred, there is no such thing. Laws don't give us rights; they enumerate what we cannot do.

Yes, sometimes people who open carry get odd looks, or get unwarranted action from police. Many unusual things get attention. The question should be, though, do they get attention, or harrassment? If harrassment, why from people who should know better (police).

Gunny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I HAVE THE RIGHT to drink beers, smoke and curse
> around kids. Do I do smoke, drink and curse
> around kids NO! Just because a person HAS THE
> RIGHT TO doesn't make an action appropriate.

Carrying a gun for self defense and defense of nearby children is appropriate. Drinking and cursing around children is not.

> As for the these "Park employee nitwits" that were
> obviously concerned about you having a loaded gun
> and obviously asked you "Were you lost?" to check
> out your gun closer."

Gee, you catch on quick. Since I stated exactly that fact in my post, your powers of deductive reasoning boggle the mind...

> My question is if you knew this and thought these
> guys are going to call the cops

I also stated that I have NEVER had the cops called on me before, not have I ever gotten any negative attention. One guy once asked me what the laws were because he was interested in carrying also.

> why didn't you
> just simply say, "I have an open carry permit for
> the gun."

A. They didn't ask me about the gun.

B. There is no such thing as an open carry permit. There is NO LAW that says you may carry a gun openly, just as there is no law that says you may wear a red shirt.

> Why... because you need attention and that's why
> you where the gun in the first place.

No, I wear the gun for self defense, and when it's hot out I don't feel like putting on an extra layer to conceal it. I actually prefer to conceal it. And in restaurants that serve alcohol in VA conceal carry is illegal, so you must switch to open carry or leave it in the parking lot where it is useless and subject to theft.

The attention just comes with the scenery. I consider it a good thing that people know that they are free to exercise their freedom, and that those of us who choose to carry actually exist.

So are you a real Gunny or a poser?

Kiev Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> and they will always get this attention.
>
> Because its rather unusual for a plain dressed
> person to openly carry a fire arm.
>
> I do think people who OC really do enjoy this
> attention.
> There are endless topics on OC websites about the
> looks they get when the OC.
>
> Interesting world we live in...

It's not as unusual in NOVA as you might think. Northern VA is really the hotbed of Virginia self-defense rights activism. VCDL was started here as the NVCDL years ago. I think it may be because out in rural Virginia people don't feel as threatened by local governments. Fairfax Co., Arlington, ALexandria, and Falls Church would love to go nuts and ban guns, so those of us who live here are more sensitive to the issue.

Like I said above, I actually don't like the attention, I prefer to live privately. OC is convenient when it's hot out and required where alcohol is served, even if you don't drink. I DO NOT like encounters with cops. But if my visible pistol opens people's eyes to the fact that this a freedom they also enjoy, so much the better. America is supposed stand for freedom, and Virginia should be at the leading edge of that movement.

And where did you see more than one OC website? I only know of one, which was started by two guys from NOVA, of course...

Tomahawk,

You carry for self defense. LMAO! Are you really that stupid?

Just admit you carry because you crave the attention.

Yes, Once a Marine, always a Marine!

Gunny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tomahawk,
>
> You carry for self defense. LMAO! Are you really
> that stupid?
>
> Just admit you carry because you crave the
> attention.

Look, either you believe me or you don't. Can't spell it out any plainer than I already have. My side of this story is on the thread, now, at least.


> Yes, Once a Marine, always a Marine!

As am I. When I got out, it took me a while to realize that I can actually anjoy the freedom I signed up to help secure five years earlier.

So...I do!

Semoer Fi.

Guess I need a real account so I can edit typos: Semper Fi.

Jester Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Shoplifter,
>
> I can't find longwatch\longwater(sp?) and scheetz
> on my list, are they in this video?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNILJAN4msU
>
> (I'm kiddn of course)
I was there but I don't think I made it into the videos. What list am I on?

I can't believe a *real* gunny would be such a hopolophobe. I also have a hard time understanding how a Marine would be against freedom and personal rights. What exactly did you join the Marines for? A paycheck? I served, but not for the crappy pay, I did it out of sense of duty and for my country that I love.

I have carried a gun for years, and never recieved attention from police, or anyone else until Burk Lake Park. None of us carry a handgun for attention, but it would be safe to accuse of of carrying to spread the word that it is legal and guns don't automatically mean "bad guy".

If you wanted to carry a gun for protection, than you would carry it concealed like most people. If you want to carry a gun so EVERYONE will see you are carrying a gun (enter attention seeking behavior) than you are doing so because you want everyone to know it.

If you are looking to thwart crime, than you would carry concealed so a criminal will not know you are packing. Then when a criminal attempts to victimize you or your family you can spring to action. And you are an naive for walking around, wondering why people call the cops on you, when you and your cronies walk into a restaurant, or a public park, with pistols on your hip.

I'm all about the right to bear arms, I do so everyday - concealed. If someone's life is ever in danger, I assure you, I will use it. I don't need to pin a sign on my chest, or wear a gun on my hip, to tell the world I will protect them unlike some people. You and your group stop hiding in the bushes video taping police officers who are preparing a tactical plan for approaching a GROUP of people who are all armed with guns.

So, is it just guns?

Can someone carry a rifle openly too?

Let's just say that I think people are living in a fantasy World if they think wearing a gun is "protection."

That is my opinion.

Obviously I do own a gun and have open carried before. I also have the concealed permit because I was told that the right to conceal might be taken away and I would be in a grandfather clause. I do not see need to be packing all the time in Northern Virginia.

My opinion is the same, you were all wearing your guns in the public picnic area because you wanted attention, not for protection.

Gunny wrote:
"Obviously I do own a gun and have open carried before"

Were you open carrying to garner attention and dirty looks? Obviously you were. Otherwise you would have concealed.

Seems that some people on this forum can't understand that VA law requires open carry in an establishment that serves booze. Want to eat at Applebee's? options are leave the gun in the car or OC.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2007 11:49AM by nakedshoplifter.

Dude, common.

Burke Lake park is a dangerous place

Schrute nailed it on the head (again).

Carrying concealed makes perfect sense for protection of yourself and family.

Open carry says "look at me, I got a gun". Till it is taken away from you and used on you. Then it says "look at me, I had a gun, now I have holes in me"

What you carry on your hip is an obvious attempt to make up for other "shortcomings".

Squirrels, all of them.

Good for Applebee's and other establishments that ban guns! I wish more places would advertise this fact so I would know where to go.

Huh? Applebee's does not ban guns. I've eaten there many times. You need some READING COMPREHENSION.

"Seems that some people on this forum can't understand that VA law requires open carry in an establishment that serves booze. "

Applebee's serves booze, therefore you MUST open carry or leave the gun in the car. Concealed carry is not allowed per state law.

Comprende?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2007 01:27PM by nakedshoplifter.

Watcher wrote:
Open carry says "look at me, I got a gun". Till it is taken away from you and used on you. Then it says "look at me, I had a gun, now I have holes in me"

Can you cite ONE instance where someone was open carrying and shot with their own gun? Or even had it taken from them by a criminal?

No? Ok.

You are doing no better than the "blood will run down the streets" crowd when concealed carry was enacted. Got any other irrational unfounded statements you cannot back up with history or proof?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2007 01:27PM by nakedshoplifter.

watcher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Open carry says "look at me, I got a gun". Till
> it is taken away from you and used on you. Then it
> says "look at me, I had a gun, now I have holes in
> me"

Really? And exactly how often does that happen? Or did you make up this scenario in your head?

Schrute Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you are looking to thwart crime, than you would
> carry concealed so a criminal will not know you
> are packing. Then when a criminal attempts to
> victimize you or your family you can spring to
> action.

Or, you may avoid having to "spring to action" because the thug will avoid the obviously armed man's family and go find somewhere else to pull his crap.

Open carry and concealed carry both have their advantages and disadvantages; that's a debate that goes on forever.

You say you carry concealed and understand the right to bear arms. But you fail to see you are in the same boat with those who carry openly. The antis aren't going to let you keep your guns just because you hide them. If anything, they want you to slink around and hide your freedom like a good little naif.

Fuck that. I carry concealed when I want to, and I carry openly when I feel like it. And I'll stand for your right to carry concealed if that's how you choose to do it. A lot of activists went to bat so you could carry that concealed gun, including some of the guys in that video, who over the years have spent time and money out of their own pockets to restore your right to protect your family. All I ask is that you return the favor. And feel free to show up for a burger next time out.

"Can you cite ONE instance where someone was open carrying and shot with their own gun? Or even had it taken from them by a criminal?

No? Ok."

Well actually......


http://mdn.mainichi.jp/national/news/20071005p2a00m0na019000c.html

http://www.policeone.com/police-products/body-armor/concealable-armor/articles/1270139/

http://www.nbc5.com/news/14115242/detail.html?subid=10101401

But I suppose members of VCDL are more prepared than law enforcement officers.

duh

Trying to arrest criminals is not an activity non LEOs engage in, at least I never have. So the analogy does not hold. Its like saying I'll get shot by a sniper for open carry because that happens to soldiers open carrying in wartime.

DooDah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Can you cite ONE instance where someone was open
> carrying and shot with their own gun? Or even had
> it taken from them by a criminal?
>
> No? Ok."
>
> Well actually......
>
>
> http://mdn.mainichi.jp/national/news/20071005p2a00
> m0na019000c.html
>
> http://www.policeone.com/police-products/body-armo
> r/concealable-armor/articles/1270139/
>
> http://www.nbc5.com/news/14115242/detail.html?subi
> d=10101401
>
> But I suppose members of VCDL are more prepared
> than law enforcement officers.

> Open carry says "look at me, I got a gun". Till
> it is taken away from you and used on you. Then it
> says "look at me, I had a gun, now I have holes in
> me"

Chant that to yourself the next time you're mugged on the street because you weren't carrying openly.

I'd imagine most people who are confident enough to carry openly know how to handle a firearm well enough to not be disarmed by some two-bit thief. Not every criminal is a martial arts master. This isn't the movies.

Furthermore, who the fuck cares if people open carry for attention?

Quote
Union Aerospace Corporation
Peace through superior firepower.

"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

jeicin "Furthermore, who the fuck cares if people open carry for attention?"

I don't care, I was making a statement that people that open carry are squirrels, are making up for shortcomings, and crave attention, that's all. Don't get your panties in a bunch. I know the truth hurts, but you'll be ok. Just holster up and go walk around a mall. That will make you feel all better.

I went to the open carry website. WOW. Posts like : open carried at Wendy's. No comments but got some looks.

You can tell by most of the posts they are done while the poster has their pants around their ankles, holster jiggling up and down.

protection would be a Bullet resistant vest, a gun is for defense.

having a gun is just like having insurance I'd rather have it and not need it, than the reverse.

you can hide in the corner with your dirty shorts waiting for the Police to save you!
oh wait, they aren't legal required to protect you.
your on your own.

those fine people aren't NERDS and your nothing but a internet Tought Guy, now go back to your Fantasy game.


excersice your God given Constitutionally protected rights or loss them

How come the average education level of open carry gun(OC) people is High School? Do they carry guns because they feel inferior somehow?

Agent19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> protection would be a Bullet resistant vest, a gun
> is for defense.
>
> having a gun is just like having insurance I'd
> rather have it and not need it, than the reverse.
>

Do you have a bomb shelter in your backyard also?

no, but your grandfather probably did

those who put down others do so because they need to feel superior,

go back and hide, wait for the police to save you