http://stopthefoodtax.com/

The Fairfax County Board of Supervisors is looking to levy a food tax on food and drinks prepared at restaurants, hotels, grocery stores, doughnut and coffee shops, and convenient stores across the county.

Simply put, if this tax is enacted, local families will pay more for their food and local businesses could suffer and even close, harming our local economy.

Taxed to the Maxx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://stopthefoodtax.com/
>
> The Fairfax County Board of Supervisors is looking
> to levy a food tax on food and drinks prepared at
> restaurants, hotels, grocery stores, doughnut and
> coffee shops, and convenient stores across the
> county.
>
> Simply put, if this tax is enacted, local families
> will pay more for their food and local businesses
> could suffer and even close, harming our local
> economy.

Vienna imposed a food tax, and Vienna is thriving. It is perhaps the greatest small town in America.

Meh...I'll just subtract the amount of the tax from the 10% tip I give.

I don't eat in Furfux.

The law for enacting a meals tax is different for counties and cities/towns.

Cities and towns may impose a meals tax by a vote of their governing councils.

Counties (with a few exceptions) must hold a voter referendum asking permission of the citizens they want to tax.

The last voter referendum on a meals tax in Fairfax County was in the 90s, and it was soundly defeated.

Because politics is mostly theater, the Board of Supervisors doesn't want to put another referendum on the ballot without being sure it's going to pass.

Most infuriatingly, the BoS has also tried to get the law changed so they can pass a meals tax without having to get the consent of the voters.

If a meals tax is such a wonderful idea, put it on the ballot. If it's defeated, then your constituents are sending you a clear and unambiguous message.

The Board asked for a study on the idea of a County meals tax in 2014. They decided to do nothing with it. Meanwhile, every nearby jurisdiction except the Town of Clifton already has a meals tax. Fairfax County is an outlier here. When Fairfax County residents eat elsewhere, they chip in a few cents to local revenues. When people from elsewhere eat in Fairfax County, they chip in nothing. Maybe we should level the playing field while helping to keep pressure off property tax rates.

Spot the dumbfucks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Board asked for a study on the idea of a
> County meals tax in 2014. They decided to do
> nothing with it. Meanwhile, every nearby
> jurisdiction except the Town of Clifton already
> has a meals tax. Fairfax County is an outlier
> here. When Fairfax County residents eat
> elsewhere, they chip in a few cents to local
> revenues. When people from elsewhere eat in
> Fairfax County, they chip in nothing. Maybe we
> should level the playing field while helping to
> keep pressure off property tax rates.

The reason they decided to do nothing about it is because they knew it wouldn't pass.

If it included a moratorium on raising property taxes, getting a meals tax passed would be a cakewalk. There would be a stampede to the polls in a rush to vote for a referendum that gave property owners a break.

Everyone knows that this would never happen, though.

There is another mechanism for getting a referendum on the ballot, though. All you have to do is collect about 70,000 signatures from registered voters saying they want a referendum on the ballot.

don't think so Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Taxed to the Maxx Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > http://stopthefoodtax.com/
> >
> > The Fairfax County Board of Supervisors is
> looking
> > to levy a food tax on food and drinks prepared
> at
> > restaurants, hotels, grocery stores, doughnut
> and
> > coffee shops, and convenient stores across the
> > county.
> >
> > Simply put, if this tax is enacted, local
> families
> > will pay more for their food and local
> businesses
> > could suffer and even close, harming our local
> > economy.
>
> Vienna imposed a food tax, and Vienna is thriving.
> It is perhaps the greatest small town in America.

The Mattress Tax also has a lot to do with the success of Vienna.

It is no accident that the two school board members working to get tax authority for the School Board, Patty Reed and Ted velkoff, got voted off the school board.

People think taxes are already too high and there's too much waste. $80,000 a month on travel is just plain wrong.

The plain and simple fact that assfucks and retards like you and your weak-shit website fail to fathom is that the County is in desperate need of funds. Not just to prop up our schools, but to restore other programs that were abused due to financial pressures caused by the assfuck Republicans who mismanaged us straight into the Great Bush Recession. Thankfully, the bulk of that shit is now in the rear-view mirror, and what we do NOT need at this point is some bunch of whiny ass populist retards who don't realize that they live in a LOW-TAX AREA and want to bitch on and on about how they can't afford the few extra cents in taxes that it would take to put the place back on track. This is one of the very richest counties in the entire USA, but to hear these simpering assholes talk, you'd think it was the wrong side of the tracks in East Fucking Dustburg. If you can't afford to live here, MOVE THE FUCK OUT! No one will miss your sorry asses at all.

Spot the douchebag Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The plain and simple fact that assfucks and
> retards like you and your weak-shit website fail
> to fathom is that the County is in desperate need
> of funds. Not just to prop up our schools, but to
> restore other programs that were abused due to
> financial pressures caused by the assfuck
> Republicans who mismanaged us straight into the
> Great Bush Recession. Thankfully, the bulk of
> that shit is now in the rear-view mirror, and what
> we do NOT need at this point is some bunch of
> whiny ass populist retards who don't realize that
> they live in a LOW-TAX AREA and want to bitch on
> and on about how they can't afford the few extra
> cents in taxes that it would take to put the place
> back on track. This is one of the very richest
> counties in the entire USA, but to hear these
> simpering assholes talk, you'd think it was the
> wrong side of the tracks in East Fucking Dustburg.
> If you can't afford to live here, MOVE THE FUCK
> OUT! No one will miss your sorry asses at all.

What programs were abused? The daily luncheon at Sea Pearl? Paying "Flip" Flippen $10,000 for a commencement speech? Or, maybe, the Tara Brach meditation event?

And, in the meantime, FCPS gave up new science books for turf fields and there are still kids in trailers.

Kind of scratching my head here. Not sure why they are trying to rebrand this as a "food" tax rather than as a meals tax. Not sure why this is necessary now when the Board hasn't vote for the referendum - I can see it last year when this was actively being discussed.

But hey - I'm glad somebody with some money has decided to hire a big gun lobbying firm to put this together, even if we probably don't need it.

what program was this? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What programs were abused? The daily luncheon at
> Sea Pearl? Paying "Flip" Flippen $10,000 for a
> commencement speech? Or, maybe, the Tara Brach
> meditation event?

Go fuck yourself, you worthless mealy-mouthed little douchebag. How fucking stupid can one person be? Fucking Boosterthon asshole! Go choke on a mouthful of your fucking turf field.

BrianSchoeneman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kind of scratching my head here. Not sure why they
> are trying to rebrand this as a "food" tax rather
> than as a meals tax. Not sure why this is
> necessary now when the Board hasn't vote for the
> referendum - I can see it last year when this was
> actively being discussed.

Wake up, Brian. The OP's link is way out of date.

> But hey - I'm glad somebody with some money has
> decided to hire a big gun lobbying firm to put
> this together, even if we probably don't need it.

What we need is a meals tax. Just like everybody else.

Assfucks get shat upon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> what program was this? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What programs were abused? The daily luncheon
> at
> > Sea Pearl? Paying "Flip" Flippen $10,000 for a
> > commencement speech? Or, maybe, the Tara Brach
> > meditation event?
>
> Go fuck yourself, you worthless mealy-mouthed
> little douchebag. How fucking stupid can one
> person be? Fucking Boosterthon asshole! Go choke
> on a mouthful of your fucking turf field.

Go wash your mouth out with soap, then come back and tell us which VITAL programs were so badly abused that our taxes need to go up to restore them. Until then, go post to Karen Garza's Facebook page or something.

Spot the dumbfucks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Board asked for a study on the idea of a
> County meals tax in 2014. They decided to do
> nothing with it. Meanwhile, every nearby
> jurisdiction except the Town of Clifton already
> has a meals tax. Fairfax County is an outlier
> here. When Fairfax County residents eat
> elsewhere, they chip in a few cents to local
> revenues. When people from elsewhere eat in
> Fairfax County, they chip in nothing. Maybe we
> should level the playing field while helping to
> keep pressure off property tax rates.

Just because the residents of other jurisdictions are dumb enough to "enjoy" a meals tax doesn't mean we have to. Sometimes being the "outlier" is a good thing.

Something tells me neighboring jurisdictions don't enjoy the excesses our school system does. Maybe they spend more money, but I'll bet they don't manage to engage in the wasteful entitlement of FCPS.

So, if the meals tax proponent wants everyone to be the same, either the other jurisdictions need to start wasting money on a grand scale or Fairfax needs to cut back. What's fair is fair, after all.

If you want to point the finger at a local meals tax advocate, look no farther than our own version of Marco Rubio, "Little" Marcus Simon.

The Brtitish are coming Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Wake up, Brian. The OP's link is way out of date.

OP's link has stuff from this month on it.

> What we need is a meals tax. Just like everybody
> else.

We don't really need it. Everybody else can keep theirs.

Shit don't pay for itself.
Attachments:

Deeeeerrrrppp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Shit don't pay for itself.


So, let's make a list:

1) Flip Flippen
2) Eric Jensen
3) Tara Brach
4) Turf fields
5) Buck Institute
6) School Board Conference
7) Meetings at Sea Pearl
8) FCPS retreats
9) Instructional coaches
10) Football
11) 90% of Gatehouse staff
12) Karen Garza's $2,000/month housing allowance
13) $80,000/month in travel
14) The school board raise
15) Online textbooks

etc. etc. etc.

If only schools weren't being overrun by more students then they can handle.

yes, you are correct Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Deeeeerrrrppp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Shit don't pay for itself.
>
>
> So, let's make a list:
>
> 1) Flip Flippen
> 2) Eric Jensen
> 3) Tara Brach
> 4) Turf fields
> 5) Buck Institute
> 6) School Board Conference
> 7) Meetings at Sea Pearl
> 8) FCPS retreats
> 9) Instructional coaches
> 10) Football
> 11) 90% of Gatehouse staff
> 12) Karen Garza's $2,000/month housing allowance
> 13) $80,000/month in travel
> 14) The school board raise
> 15) Online textbooks
>
> etc. etc. etc.

Marie Lemmon's legal fees. Talk about a big ticket item.

Someone's gonna pay for free luxury housing, food, education, and medical care for my beloved illegals. Now STFU and get back to work, slaves!

eloquence from an idiot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Go wash your mouth out with soap, then come back
> and tell us which VITAL programs were so badly
> abused that our taxes need to go up to restore
> them. Until then, go post to Karen Garza's
> Facebook page or something.

Blow me, you pathetic asshole. The cuts of the past decade have dug into every program. FCPS tries to prioritize, stabbing workers in the back before students and so forth, but it ain't working anymore. Neither is anything any fucking braindead anti-tax TEA Party asshole ever whined about. If you can't afford to live here...DON'T. Get the fuck out and stay out. None of you no-account dipshits will ever be missed by anyone!

Taxpayer revolt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
t because the residents of other jurisdictions are dumb enough
> to "enjoy" a meals tax doesn't mean we have to. Sometimes being
> the "outlier" is a good thing.

Wake up, Mr. Van Winkle. The plain fact is that the County needs more revenue -- for schools and for everything else. The primary courses of action here are first, to keep adding annually on top of the recent 4-cent increase in the real estate rate, and second, to enact a 4% meals tax. Keep in mind that while 100% of RE increases would be paid by County residents, some 35-40% of County meal tax revenues would be paid on our behalf by people who DO NOT live in the County, thank you very much.

yes, you are correct Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Deeeeerrrrppp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Shit don't pay for itself.
>
>
> So, let's make a list:
>
> 1) Flip Flippen
> 2) Eric Jensen
> 3) Tara Brach
> 4) Turf fields
> 5) Buck Institute
> 6) School Board Conference
> 7) Meetings at Sea Pearl
> 8) FCPS retreats
> 9) Instructional coaches
> 10) Football
> 11) 90% of Gatehouse staff
> 12) Karen Garza's $2,000/month housing allowance
> 13) $80,000/month in travel
> 14) The school board raise
> 15) Online textbooks
>
> etc. etc. etc.

The tax wouldn't go to just the schools, dumb fuck.
And your lame list is just gibberish based on your FCPS expense fetish.

1. Ping pong
2. Breakfast at McDonalds
3. Chilled water fountains
4. Teachers assemblies

Go fuck yourself, etc., etc.

don't think so Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Vienna imposed a food tax, and Vienna is thriving.
> It is perhaps the greatest small town in America.

hahaha, no one likes Vienna except for sketchy foreigners selling mattresses
Attachments:

derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> yes, you are correct Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Deeeeerrrrppp Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Shit don't pay for itself.
> >
> >
> > So, let's make a list:
> >
> > 1) Flip Flippen
> > 2) Eric Jensen
> > 3) Tara Brach
> > 4) Turf fields
> > 5) Buck Institute
> > 6) School Board Conference
> > 7) Meetings at Sea Pearl
> > 8) FCPS retreats
> > 9) Instructional coaches
> > 10) Football
> > 11) 90% of Gatehouse staff
> > 12) Karen Garza's $2,000/month housing
> allowance
> > 13) $80,000/month in travel
> > 14) The school board raise
> > 15) Online textbooks
> >
> > etc. etc. etc.
>
> The tax wouldn't go to just the schools, dumb
> fuck.
> And your lame list is just gibberish based on your
> FCPS expense fetish.
>
> 1. Ping pong
> 2. Breakfast at McDonalds
> 3. Chilled water fountains
> 4. Teachers assemblies
>
> Go fuck yourself, etc., etc.

The County wastes money too-look and the Police and Fire Games and all the money wasted on trolley car studies.

Someone seems to think the County always makes the right decision. From what has been seen of the idiocy of Dan Storck and Kathy Smith, this is clearly not the case. Taxes are too high and there is too much waste all the way around-this includes the County and the schools.

Spot the dumbfuck Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Taxpayer revolt Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> t because the residents of other jurisdictions are
> dumb enough
> > to "enjoy" a meals tax doesn't mean we have to.
> Sometimes being
> > the "outlier" is a good thing.
>
> Wake up, Mr. Van Winkle. The plain fact is that
> the County needs more revenue -- for schools and
> for everything else. The primary courses of
> action here are first, to keep adding annually on
> top of the recent 4-cent increase in the real
> estate rate, and second, to enact a 4% meals tax.
> Keep in mind that while 100% of RE increases would
> be paid by County residents, some 35-40% of County
> meal tax revenues would be paid on our behalf by
> people who DO NOT live in the County, thank you
> very much.


Wrong. Haven't I schooled you enough times on this already?

The county's own estimate is that 72% would be paid by county residents.

fracturedfairfax Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The law for enacting a meals tax is different for
> counties and cities/towns.
>
> Cities and towns may impose a meals tax by a vote
> of their governing councils.
>
> Counties (with a few exceptions) must hold a voter
> referendum asking permission of the citizens they
> want to tax.
>
> The last voter referendum on a meals tax in
> Fairfax County was in the 90s, and it was soundly
> defeated.
>
> Because politics is mostly theater, the Board of
> Supervisors doesn't want to put another referendum
> on the ballot without being sure it's going to
> pass.
>
> Most infuriatingly, the BoS has also tried to get
> the law changed so they can pass a meals tax
> without having to get the consent of the voters.
>
> If a meals tax is such a wonderful idea, put it on
> the ballot. If it's defeated, then your
> constituents are sending you a clear and
> unambiguous message.
Attachments:

someone has a fixation Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The County wastes money too-look and the Police
> and Fire Games and all the money wasted on trolley
> car studies.

Newsflash to Simpletons and Teabaggers: Just cutting taxes isn't going to make your life or the county's better.
Fairfax County spent $15 million on the World Police and Fire Games. The economic impact was estimated at $83.8 million. That's a good return.

http://www.insidenova.com/news/arlington/world-police-fire-games-had-healthy-economic-impact/article_24b2c308-3776-11e5-ae75-9f437196d144.html

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> someone has a fixation Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The County wastes money too-look and the Police
> > and Fire Games and all the money wasted on
> trolley
> > car studies.
>
> Newsflash to Simpletons and Teabaggers:
> Just cutting taxes isn't going to make your life
> or the county's better.
> Fairfax County spent $15 million on the World
> Police and Fire Games. The economic impact was
> estimated at $83.8 million. That's a good return.
>
> http://www.insidenova.com/news/arlington/world-pol
> ice-fire-games-had-healthy-economic-impact/article
> _24b2c308-3776-11e5-ae75-9f437196d144.html

Break up these numbers: what did Fairfax spend, what did Fairfax get? No one I've talked to saw any real windfall.

derp on this Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > someone has a fixation Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > The County wastes money too-look and the
> Police
> > > and Fire Games and all the money wasted on
> > trolley
> > > car studies.
> >
> > Newsflash to Simpletons and Teabaggers:
> > Just cutting taxes isn't going to make your
> life
> > or the county's better.
> > Fairfax County spent $15 million on the World
> > Police and Fire Games. The economic impact was
> > estimated at $83.8 million. That's a good
> return.
> >
> >
> http://www.insidenova.com/news/arlington/world-pol
>
> >
> ice-fire-games-had-healthy-economic-impact/article
>
> > _24b2c308-3776-11e5-ae75-9f437196d144.html
>
> Break up these numbers: what did Fairfax spend,
> what did Fairfax get? No one I've talked to saw
> any real windfall.


It's a lollipop number from the same advocates promoting the event.

It breaks down as $49.24 million in direct economic benefits, plus about $34.61 million in “induced effects” for the region (not Fairfax alone) from 10,000 participants of which 2,000 already were local residents.

The original estimates used to sell it prior to were $60 to $80 million in direct benefits. So significantly short of what was anticipated by the same proponents. The last game prior held prior in NYC in 2011 had 16,000 participants so much lower on that basis as well.

Even then the numbers seem high at what would work out to be an average of about +$6,000 total or $600/day in spending generated from each of 8,000 out-of-area participants and drag-alongs over 10 days.

At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax they probably made a little money after all costs are counted but not nearly any huge windfall.

What the fuck is fractured fairfax you faggot

lol fractured faggot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What the fuck is fractured fairfax you faggot

Health-food fagot with a bartered bride
Likes to comb his hair with a dipper ride
Once had a friend with a cloven foot
Once he called the tune in a checkered quit

Great Deceiver

In the door on the floor in a paper bag
There's a shoe-shine boy with a gin-shop slag
She raised him up and she called him son
And she canonized the ground that he walked upon

Great Deceiver

Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin Mary
Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin Mary

Cigarettes, ice cream, Cadillacs blue jeans

In the night he's a star in the Milky Way
He's a man of the world by the light of day
A golden smile and a proposition
And the breath of God smells of sweet sedition

Great Deceiver

Sing hymns make love get high fall dead
He'll bring his perfume to your bed
He'll charm your life 'til the cold winds blow
Then he'll sell your dreams to a picture show

Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin Mary
Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin Mary

Cadillacs, blue jeans, dixieland playing on the ferry
Cadillacs, blues jeans, drop a glass full of antique sherry

Try This Tone Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lol fractured faggot Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What the fuck is fractured fairfax you faggot
>
> Health-food fagot with a bartered bride
> Likes to comb his hair with a dipper ride
> Once had a friend with a cloven foot
> Once he called the tune in a checkered quit
>
> Great Deceiver
>
> In the door on the floor in a paper bag
> There's a shoe-shine boy with a gin-shop slag
> She raised him up and she called him son
> And she canonized the ground that he walked upon
>
> Great Deceiver
>
> Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin
> Mary
> Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin
> Mary
>
> Cigarettes, ice cream, Cadillacs blue jeans
>
> In the night he's a star in the Milky Way
> He's a man of the world by the light of day
> A golden smile and a proposition
> And the breath of God smells of sweet sedition
>
> Great Deceiver
>
> Sing hymns make love get high fall dead
> He'll bring his perfume to your bed
> He'll charm your life 'til the cold winds blow
> Then he'll sell your dreams to a picture show
>
> Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin
> Mary
> Cigarettes, ice cream, figurines of the Virgin
> Mary
>
> Cadillacs, blue jeans, dixieland playing on the
> ferry
> Cadillacs, blues jeans, drop a glass full of
> antique sherry


So you are a full blown idiot. That makes sense. Still fractured fairfax is the gayest thing I have ever heard of, more gay than that pile of gay guys fucking each other.

Oh god it's the guy who rides the giant dick in the meme right?

All original content on the Fractured Fairfax wiki is copyright Charles Hoffmann.

No one cares about you, only the eeshmizlizfags Die.

You can always spot the mentally retarded.

MUH TAXES!!!!!!!

> No one I've talked to saw any real windfall.
-------------------------------------------------------
> At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax they
> probably made a little money after all costs are
> counted but not nearly any huge windfall.


Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't a waste and makes tea baggers look more foolish being against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.

It put Fairfax on the map for more people and gave the local economy a lift. Even if it financially broke even, it was a success for promoting the area.

Keep on derpin' in the free world.

Spot the dumbfucks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Board asked for a study on the idea of a
> County meals tax in 2014. They decided to do
> nothing with it. Meanwhile, every nearby
> jurisdiction except the Town of Clifton already
> has a meals tax. Fairfax County is an outlier
> here. When Fairfax County residents eat
> elsewhere, they chip in a few cents to local
> revenues. When people from elsewhere eat in
> Fairfax County, they chip in nothing. Maybe we
> should level the playing field while helping to
> keep pressure off property tax rates.

It is incredible to hear someone justify an action by saying "everyone else is doing it". Doesn't that sound a bit juvenile? Answer me this: Has the Board of Supervisors or the Scool Board shown the public where they are making cuts in their spending? It is hard for me to consider a proposal which will cause me to make personal cuts in my budget without seeing where they are doing the same. Leading us into a hole does not a good leader make. Leading us out of one, does. Show me your cuts first and I will follow.

If it is true that the Board has attempted to change the law so they don't have to seek a vote... well, that's grounds for dismissal.

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > No one I've talked to saw any real windfall.
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax they
> > probably made a little money after all costs
> are
> > counted but not nearly any huge windfall.
>
>
> Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't a waste
> and makes tea baggers look more foolish being
> against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.
>
> It put Fairfax on the map for more people and gave
> the local economy a lift. Even if it financially
> broke even, it was a success for promoting the
> area.
>
> Keep on derpin' in the free world.

Put Fairfax on the map? Promoted the area? That's just goofy.

eloquence from an idiot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Assfucks get shat upon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > what program was this? Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > What programs were abused? The daily luncheon
> > at
> > > Sea Pearl? Paying "Flip" Flippen $10,000 for
> a
> > > commencement speech? Or, maybe, the Tara
> Brach
> > > meditation event?
> >
> > Go fuck yourself, you worthless mealy-mouthed
> > little douchebag. How fucking stupid can one
> > person be? Fucking Boosterthon asshole! Go
> choke
> > on a mouthful of your fucking turf field.
>
> Go wash your mouth out with soap, then come back
> and tell us which VITAL programs were so badly
> abused that our taxes need to go up to restore
> them. Until then, go post to Karen Garza's
> Facebook page or something.

1+.

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > No one I've talked to saw any real windfall.
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax they
> > probably made a little money after all costs
> are
> > counted but not nearly any huge windfall.
>
>
> Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't a waste
> and makes tea baggers look more foolish being
> against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.
>
> It put Fairfax on the map for more people and gave
> the local economy a lift. Even if it financially
> broke even, it was a success for promoting the
> area.
>
> Keep on derpin' in the free world.


Oh yes they did before. The round numbers being thrown around to sell it in Fairfax were "Only $15 million for $100 million in economic benefits!" Not even close. Realistically all in, all counted it's probably more in the single digit range as far as any direct returns. At least they didn't lose money.

It didn't put Fairfax on the map for much of anyone. Admit it - You'd never heard of these games before and you paid no attention to them. Even being here you probably wouldn't have even known about it or noticed that they were other than for controversy on this forum and a few news articles. The most coverage was over the guy who died. That applies to an even greater degree anywhere else. Beyond a very small community who were directly involved nobody paid any attention to it.

Go ahead Fairfax...implement more taxes...f'ng a-holes on the board!

I can drive 10 min south and go to PW county for dinner...or drive to Loudoun

I was at a Supervisor's town hall earlier this month. They said passing a meals tax would be extremely difficult to do, but the estimated annual revenue would be approximately $80M a year.

Dunno...if it would help the schools and public safety sectors, I'd have no problem paying an extra buck or two each time I went out to eat.

Income Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was at a Supervisor's town hall earlier this
> month. They said passing a meals tax would be
> extremely difficult to do, but the estimated
> annual revenue would be approximately $80M a
> year.
>
> Dunno...if it would help the schools and public
> safety sectors, I'd have no problem paying an
> extra buck or two each time I went out to eat.

It won't help. $80 million is the top end of the estimate under the most ideal circumstances. And won't stop there. A few years from now they'll want to raise, for the kids and police of course. Then that won't be enough so they'll need to raise it again. And so on. That shit doesn't stop. Ask any of the NJ people living here now. They've lived through it.

huh?! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > No one I've talked to saw any real windfall.
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax
> they
> > > probably made a little money after all costs
> > are
> > > counted but not nearly any huge windfall.
> >
> >
> > Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't a
> waste
> > and makes tea baggers look more foolish being
> > against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.
> >
> > It put Fairfax on the map for more people and
> gave
> > the local economy a lift. Even if it
> financially
> > broke even, it was a success for promoting the
> > area.
> >
> > Keep on derpin' in the free world.
>
> Put Fairfax on the map? Promoted the area? That's
> just goofy.

Basl/Moreno has had more press than the Police/Fire Games.

Fairfax, yeah, I know the place where they fight over a streetcar and all the school managers eat out every day.

World Police Wut? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > No one I've talked to saw any real windfall.
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax
> they
> > > probably made a little money after all costs
> > are
> > > counted but not nearly any huge windfall.
> >
> >
> > Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't a
> waste
> > and makes tea baggers look more foolish being
> > against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.
> >
> > It put Fairfax on the map for more people and
> gave
> > the local economy a lift. Even if it
> financially
> > broke even, it was a success for promoting the
> > area.
> >
> > Keep on derpin' in the free world.
>
>
> Oh yes they did before. The round numbers being
> thrown around to sell it in Fairfax were "Only $15
> million for $100 million in economic benefits!"
> Not even close. Realistically all in, all counted
> it's probably more in the single digit range as
> far as any direct returns. At least they didn't
> lose money.
>
> It didn't put Fairfax on the map for much of
> anyone. Admit it - You'd never heard of these
> games before and you paid no attention to them.
> Even being here you probably wouldn't have even
> known about it or noticed that they were other
> than for controversy on this forum and a few news
> articles. The most coverage was over the guy who
> died. That applies to an even greater degree
> anywhere else. Beyond a very small community who
> were directly involved nobody paid any attention
> to it.


- I never read anywhere your exaggerated $100 million, $84 was the highest.
- Exactly, it didn't lose money so, again, complaining about it is stupid.
- 70+ different countries were represented with 30,000+ accompanying visitors. So yeah, it did make Fairfax more known. I never said nor touted it as a huge number. It helped the local economy, it's all gravy.
- Of course I didn't pay attention to it. I don't work in the industry. Just like I don't pay attention to other bullshit events/conventions. If they help local tourism and generate revenue, who fucking cares? It wasn't intending to get tons of casual spectators or attention.

You don't understand. This is job creation. A food tax will employ people to decide what does and doesn't get taxed. The board of equalization will need to be expanded!

PKhkD Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If it is true that the Board has attempted to
> change the law so they don't have to seek a
> vote... well, that's grounds for dismissal.

Not only have they done it, they've done it multiple times.

They did it in the 2004 session with Senate Bill 643 (patron: Saslaw): http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?041+ful+SB643S1

They did it in the 2010 session with House Bill 830 (patron: Surovell):
http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?101+sum+hb830

And again in the 2013 session with House Bill 2253 (patron: Albo):
http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?131+ful+HB2253

Those are just the instances I was able to find in a half-hour or so of searching. There may be others.

The two takeaways I get from this are:

1) Fairfax County really, really wants the tax revenue from a meals tax.
2) Fairfax County will gleefully attempt an end run around their citizens in order to get a meals tax.

I'm not against a meals tax per se, as long as the justification given is honest: "We want more money, and we don't want to raise property taxes too much because we might not get reelected".

I am against trying to get a meals tax by hook or by crook, including subverting the process laid out in the law by getting the law changed.

Put a referendum on the ballot and let the voters decide.

CGbpp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wrong. Haven't I schooled you enough times on this already? The
> county's own estimate is that 72% would be paid by county residents.

Still wrong for the same dumbfuck reason. The numbers you cite are based on the County's estimate of 28% from TOURISM only. They do not include estimated revenues from out-of-county commuters or from business travelers.

Herrity will never vote for the meals tax. If the BoS has a vote on it, they're toast. Likewise, if they do much more than discuss it, they're also toast. Putting it on the ballot-well, that's a big risk. If it loses, then it will be decades before anyone would dare try it again. If it passes, property owners will rebel unless they get some relief (unlikely).

The County will be getting additional revenue. The only question is how. Should we pay for 100% of it ourselves, or should we get out-of-county folks to pitch in a healthy portion? How fucking dumb do you have to be to need to think about that one?

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> World Police Wut? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > > No one I've talked to saw any real
> windfall.
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax
> > they
> > > > probably made a little money after all
> costs
> > > are
> > > > counted but not nearly any huge windfall.
> > >
> > >
> > > Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't a
> > waste
> > > and makes tea baggers look more foolish being
> > > against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.
> > >
> > > It put Fairfax on the map for more people and
> > gave
> > > the local economy a lift. Even if it
> > financially
> > > broke even, it was a success for promoting
> the
> > > area.
> > >
> > > Keep on derpin' in the free world.
> >
> >
> > Oh yes they did before. The round numbers
> being
> > thrown around to sell it in Fairfax were "Only
> $15
> > million for $100 million in economic benefits!"
>
> > Not even close. Realistically all in, all
> counted
> > it's probably more in the single digit range as
> > far as any direct returns. At least they
> didn't
> > lose money.
> >
> > It didn't put Fairfax on the map for much of
> > anyone. Admit it - You'd never heard of these
> > games before and you paid no attention to them.
>
> > Even being here you probably wouldn't have even
> > known about it or noticed that they were other
> > than for controversy on this forum and a few
> news
> > articles. The most coverage was over the guy
> who
> > died. That applies to an even greater degree
> > anywhere else. Beyond a very small community
> who
> > were directly involved nobody paid any
> attention
> > to it.
>
>
> - I never read anywhere your exaggerated $100
> million, $84 was the highest.
> - Exactly, it didn't lose money so, again,
> complaining about it is stupid.
> - 70+ different countries were represented with
> 30,000+ accompanying visitors. So yeah, it did
> make Fairfax more known. I never said nor touted
> it as a huge number. It helped the local economy,
> it's all gravy.
> - Of course I didn't pay attention to it. I don't
> work in the industry. Just like I don't pay
> attention to other bullshit events/conventions. If
> they help local tourism and generate revenue, who
> fucking cares? It wasn't intending to get tons of
> casual spectators or attention.


"On July 8, Bill Knight, president and CEO of the 2015 World Police & Fire Games, to be held in Fairfax County, joined the NVTC Board of Directors at Sprint in Reston to discuss the games and their positive impact on the Northern Virginia region....

According to Knight, “We want to put the best foot forward for this region, and there’s no better way to do it than by honoring community leaders around the world and have them singing out our praises.” Fairfax 2015 projects that the expected economic impact of the games on Northern Virginia economy is $60-$80 million, with the total overall impact, post-competition included, is projected at more than $100 million."

That number was repeated often.

"The 2015 World Police & Fire Games Committee estimates $100 million economic impact to the area"
http://fairfax.granicus.com/MetaViewer.php?view_id=11&clip_id=1213&meta_id=41158


"The games are expected to generate between $80 and $100 million of economic activity to the National Capital Region. Barry Biggar, CEO of Visit Fairfax, said Fairfax County has never before hosted an event of this magnitude.

“It is certainly the single largest event we have ever seen,” he said. “The direct economic impact to the region is $80 million, but if you factor in the indirect economics such as the hundreds of extra people that local restaurants and hotels will employ during the games, and the money from those paychecks that will likely be spent here as well, the real figure is more like $100 million.”

Many other examples...

They're now using a base of $80 million as the selling pitch to Montreal:

"The last games brought $80 million to the town of Fairfax, Va."


If a company or charity had a revenue target for a major event that came in at less than 50% of planned would you consider that a success? Very doubtful.

Like all of these deals, they're mostly money makers for the people involved in running and promoting them. They rarely if ever meet the projections and when they do it's only by the most stretched counting. Beyond the immediate revenue generated, it had basically zero effect on anyone's impressions of Fairfax nor any future visitation. It *might* help the county in getting other similar future events.

It makes a difference because that same money very likely could be better used elsewhere.

If you had all these wonderful other ideas, you should have gone and testified about them. But you didn't because in reality, you are nothing but another know-nothing right-wing asshole.

World Police Wut? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > World Police Wut? Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > > No one I've talked to saw any real
> > windfall.
> > > >
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > >
> > > > -----
> > > > > At a $15 million declared cost to Fairfax
> > > they
> > > > > probably made a little money after all
> > costs
> > > > are
> > > > > counted but not nearly any huge windfall.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Nobody said it was a 'windfall'. It wasn't
> a
> > > waste
> > > > and makes tea baggers look more foolish
> being
> > > > against it because ...'lower taxes!!!'.
> > > >
> > > > It put Fairfax on the map for more people
> and
> > > gave
> > > > the local economy a lift. Even if it
> > > financially
> > > > broke even, it was a success for promoting
> > the
> > > > area.
> > > >
> > > > Keep on derpin' in the free world.
> > >
> > >
> > > Oh yes they did before. The round numbers
> > being
> > > thrown around to sell it in Fairfax were
> "Only
> > $15
> > > million for $100 million in economic
> benefits!"
> >
> > > Not even close. Realistically all in, all
> > counted
> > > it's probably more in the single digit range
> as
> > > far as any direct returns. At least they
> > didn't
> > > lose money.
> > >
> > > It didn't put Fairfax on the map for much of
> > > anyone. Admit it - You'd never heard of
> these
> > > games before and you paid no attention to
> them.
> >
> > > Even being here you probably wouldn't have
> even
> > > known about it or noticed that they were
> other
> > > than for controversy on this forum and a few
> > news
> > > articles. The most coverage was over the guy
> > who
> > > died. That applies to an even greater degree
> > > anywhere else. Beyond a very small community
> > who
> > > were directly involved nobody paid any
> > attention
> > > to it.
> >
> >
> > - I never read anywhere your exaggerated $100
> > million, $84 was the highest.
> > - Exactly, it didn't lose money so, again,
> > complaining about it is stupid.
> > - 70+ different countries were represented with
> > 30,000+ accompanying visitors. So yeah, it did
> > make Fairfax more known. I never said nor
> touted
> > it as a huge number. It helped the local
> economy,
> > it's all gravy.
> > - Of course I didn't pay attention to it. I
> don't
> > work in the industry. Just like I don't pay
> > attention to other bullshit events/conventions.
> If
> > they help local tourism and generate revenue,
> who
> > fucking cares? It wasn't intending to get tons
> of
> > casual spectators or attention.
>
>
> "On July 8, Bill Knight, president and CEO of the
> 2015 World Police & Fire Games, to be held in
> Fairfax County, joined the NVTC Board of Directors
> at Sprint in Reston to discuss the games and their
> positive impact on the Northern Virginia
> region....
>
> According to Knight, “We want to put the best
> foot forward for this region, and there’s no
> better way to do it than by honoring community
> leaders around the world and have them singing out
> our praises.” Fairfax 2015 projects that the
> expected economic impact of the games on Northern
> Virginia economy is $60-$80 million, with the
> total overall impact, post-competition included,
> is projected at more than $100 million."
>
> That number was repeated often.
>
> "The 2015 World Police & Fire Games Committee
> estimates $100 million economic impact to the
> area"
> http://fairfax.granicus.com/MetaViewer.php?view_id
> =11&clip_id=1213&meta_id=41158
>
>
> "The games are expected to generate between $80
> and $100 million of economic activity to the
> National Capital Region. Barry Biggar, CEO of
> Visit Fairfax, said Fairfax County has never
> before hosted an event of this magnitude.
>
> “It is certainly the single largest event we
> have ever seen,” he said. “The direct economic
> impact to the region is $80 million, but if you
> factor in the indirect economics such as the
> hundreds of extra people that local restaurants
> and hotels will employ during the games, and the
> money from those paychecks that will likely be
> spent here as well, the real figure is more like
> $100 million.”
>
> Many other examples...
>
> They're now using a base of $80 million as the
> selling pitch to Montreal:
>
> "The last games brought $80 million to the town of
> Fairfax, Va."
>
>
> If a company or charity had a revenue target for a
> major event that came in at less than 50% of
> planned would you consider that a success? Very
> doubtful.
>
> Like all of these deals, they're mostly money
> makers for the people involved in running and
> promoting them. They rarely if ever meet the
> projections and when they do it's only by the most
> stretched counting. Beyond the immediate revenue
> generated, it had basically zero effect on
> anyone's impressions of Fairfax nor any future
> visitation. It *might* help the county in getting
> other similar future events.
>
> It makes a difference because that same money very
> likely could be better used elsewhere.

> "The last games brought $80 million to the town of
> Fairfax, Va."

What a fool, he doesn't even know it is Fairfax County. The whole thing was a waste.

Spot the douchebag Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The plain and simple fact that assfucks and
> retards like you and your weak-shit website fail
> to fathom is that the County is in desperate need
> of funds. Not just to prop up our schools, but to
> restore other programs that were abused due to
> financial pressures caused by the assfuck
> Republicans who mismanaged us straight into the
> Great Bush Recession. Thankfully, the bulk of
> that shit is now in the rear-view mirror, and what
> we do NOT need at this point is some bunch of
> whiny ass populist retards who don't realize that
> they live in a LOW-TAX AREA and want to bitch on
> and on about how they can't afford the few extra
> cents in taxes that it would take to put the place
> back on track. This is one of the very richest
> counties in the entire USA, but to hear these
> simpering assholes talk, you'd think it was the
> wrong side of the tracks in East Fucking Dustburg.
> If you can't afford to live here, MOVE THE FUCK
> OUT! No one will miss your sorry asses at all.


The only "program" that I want increased is for ICE to go door-to-door and run out all the illegals. This is a "rich" county, because we are permitted to keep more of what we earn.

http://wpfg2017.com

Montreal decided NOT to host the games, wise decision, in contrast to the morons here.

Stuff it, dipshit Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you had all these wonderful other ideas, you
> should have gone and testified about them. But
> you didn't because in reality, you are nothing but
> another know-nothing right-wing asshole.


Actually I'm not.

But I am right.

Let's tax football.

1) Everyone who plays football, pays a special tax.

2) All non-FCPS employees involved, such as these supplemental band coaches, pay a football tax.

3) A % of the gate is colelcted as a tax.

4) A % of all concessions is collected as a tax.

5) The sale of school football equipment is taxed.

6) Work out what % of marching band supports football, that % of all marching band fees, including band trips and band camp, is taxed.

Football is a luxury, so it should be taxed.

Add a tax on the users and boosters of the turf fields. This tax would bring in revenue to the County and also pay the maintenance on the turf fields. If it turns out the turf fields cannot be sustained they should revert back to grass, especially since ther are health concerns about turf fields.

Montreal Got It Right Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://wpfg2017.com
>
> Montreal decided NOT to host the games, wise
> decision, in contrast to the morons here.

You are a fucking idiot.

Reason 1 why you are fucking idiot:
Taxpayer money was more than recouped. The region got some exposure. There was no additional traffic or hassles to locals. So what exactly did it hurt to host the games making it moronic?

Reason 2 why you are fucking idiot:
You have no clue why Montreal decided NOT to host the games.
They were threatened with a boycott by the Montreal Fire Department over local politics based around their pensions being cut. It wasn't the games themselves.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/montreal-pulls-out-of-2017-world-police-and-fire-games-after-unions-promise-boycott

Keep on derpin' in the free world, fucking idiot.

Why does the region need exposure?

World Police Wut? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > If a company or charity had a revenue target for a
> major event that came in at less than 50% of
> planned would you consider that a success? Very
> doubtful.

I wasn't born yesterday. Of course the projected revenue targets are exaggerated on major events. The sky is blue. Have you never read one piece on the expense of hosting the Olympics or World Cup? There was little to no infrastructure created for this event unlike other major events. The risk in investing was low. You're a complete fool to think it wasn't a success. It did what it was suppose to do.

> Like all of these deals, they're mostly money
> makers for the people involved in running and
> promoting them. They rarely if ever meet the
> projections and when they do it's only by the most
> stretched counting. Beyond the immediate revenue
> generated, it had basically zero effect on
> anyone's impressions of Fairfax nor any future
> visitation. It *might* help the county in getting
> other similar future events.

Prove that this is 'like all of these deals' and name some that are similar. Common sense would say visitors had more than 'zero effect' on their impressions of Fairfax. It's just fucking stupid to say you visit another country and have no impressions of it.

> It makes a difference because that same money very
> likely could be better used elsewhere.

Ah, yes, the old 'could be better used elsewhere'. And your dad's jizz 'very likely' could've been better used in a sock. Then you wouldn't contribute to clogging our taxpayers supported roads and schools.

exposure? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why does the region need exposure?

To attract more business and tourism that would generate tax dollars. The revenue could be used on things like infrastructure and education.

Smaller class sizes and quality educators would mean more educated citizens that wouldn't have to ask why the region needs more exposure.

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> World Police Wut? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > If a company or charity had a revenue target
> for a
> > major event that came in at less than 50% of
> > planned would you consider that a success?
> Very
> > doubtful.
>
> I wasn't born yesterday. Of course the
> projected revenue targets are exaggerated on major
> events. The sky is blue. Have you never read one
> piece on the expense of hosting the Olympics or
> World Cup? There was little to no infrastructure
> created for this event unlike other major events.
> The risk in investing was low. You're a complete
> fool to think it wasn't a success. It did what it
> was suppose to do.
>
> > Like all of these deals, they're mostly money
> > makers for the people involved in running and
> > promoting them. They rarely if ever meet the
> > projections and when they do it's only by the
> most
> > stretched counting. Beyond the immediate
> revenue
> > generated, it had basically zero effect on
> > anyone's impressions of Fairfax nor any future
> > visitation. It *might* help the county in
> getting
> > other similar future events.
>
> Prove that this is 'like all of these deals'
> and name some that are similar. Common sense would
> say visitors had more than 'zero effect' on their
> impressions of Fairfax. It's just fucking stupid
> to say you visit another country and have no
> impressions of it.
>
> > It makes a difference because that same money
> very
> > likely could be better used elsewhere.
>
> Ah, yes, the old 'could be better used
> elsewhere'. And your dad's jizz 'very likely'
> could've been better used in a sock. Then you
> wouldn't contribute to clogging our taxpayers
> supported roads and schools.


First of all, I'm not opposed to doing things that actually DO attract people and tax money to the county. It's a matter of effectiveness and return on investment.

Just as a quick local example for comparison that I happened to see the other day:

"An independent study found a 171:1 return-on-investment (ROI) for "Extraordinary Alexandria," an increase from a 130:1 ROI found by a 2010 study of the prior campaign. The new study, conducted by Destination Analysts, determined that for every dollar spent by the City of Alexandria on campaign advertising, $171 was generated in visitor spending at local businesses and $6 came back to the city in tax revenue, up from $4 in city tax revenue per ad dollar in 2010."

Now, given that these estimates also employ the same type of BS returns, I don't buy the magnitude/multipliers for them at face value either. But, granting your argument above for the moment, how much money would the $15 million be expected to generate on the same basis even dividing by 10? The games being discussed here don't even remotely approach the levels of return which would be expected from even a poorly run campaign designed to more directly attract what you're claiming as the economic benefits from these games.

None of these event-type "investments" ever live up to the abstract benefit claims. They're basically the equivalent of high school candy or mattress sales for what are at least supposed to be adults. Way too much time, money and effort than they're worth for the sponsor. You're much better off putting the money and resources toward much more direct, targeted efforts. If we were trying to attract more cops and firemen, then, yeah, maybe these games might make more sense. But doing it on the basis of some hugely inflated values and abstract third- or fourth-order benefits as a result of "impressions" and "exposure" doesn't do it. To the extent that it does anything it's an extraordinarily ineffective way to get there.

If you want to attract businesses, or tourists, or whatever, then do it directly in a more effective way and with harder metrics vs some squishy abstract BS so that you can judge whether or not it's actually paying off and adjust as necessary.

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> exposure? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Why does the region need exposure?
>
> To attract more business and tourism that would
> generate tax dollars. The revenue could be used on
> things like infrastructure and education.
>
> Smaller class sizes and quality educators would
> mean more educated citizens that wouldn't have to
> ask why the region needs more exposure.

Fairfax is hardly a tourist destination-DC yes, Alexandria sort of, but what's really in Fairfax, a few malls?

Businesses will actually be deterred from coming to Fairfax because of the high taxes.

The bottom line is that the County needs to cut back on spending.

World Police Wut? Wrote:

> First of all, I'm not opposed to doing things that
> actually DO attract people and tax money to the
> county. It's a matter of effectiveness and return
> on investment.
>
> Just as a quick local example for comparison that
> I happened to see the other day:
>
> "An independent study found a 171:1
> return-on-investment (ROI) for "Extraordinary
> Alexandria," an increase from a 130:1 ROI found by
> a 2010 study of the prior campaign. The new study,
> conducted by Destination Analysts, determined that
> for every dollar spent by the City of Alexandria
> on campaign advertising, $171 was generated in
> visitor spending at local businesses and $6 came
> back to the city in tax revenue, up from $4 in
> city tax revenue per ad dollar in 2010."
>
> Now, given that these estimates also employ the
> same type of BS returns, I don't buy the
> magnitude/multipliers for them at face value
> either. But, granting your argument above for the
> moment, how much money would the $15 million be
> expected to generate on the same basis even
> dividing by 10? The games being discussed here
> don't even remotely approach the levels of return
> which would be expected from even a poorly run
> campaign designed to more directly attract what
> you're claiming as the economic benefits from
> these games.
>
> None of these event-type "investments" ever live
> up to the abstract benefit claims. They're
> basically the equivalent of high school candy or
> mattress sales for what are at least supposed to
> be adults. Way too much time, money and effort
> than they're worth for the sponsor. You're much
> better off putting the money and resources toward
> much more direct, targeted efforts. If we were
> trying to attract more cops and firemen, then,
> yeah, maybe these games might make more sense.
> But doing it on the basis of some hugely inflated
> values and abstract third- or fourth-order
> benefits as a result of "impressions" and
> "exposure" doesn't do it. To the extent that it
> does anything it's an extraordinarily ineffective
> way to get there.
>
> If you want to attract businesses, or tourists, or
> whatever, then do it directly in a more effective
> way and with harder metrics vs some squishy
> abstract BS so that you can judge whether or not
> it's actually paying off and adjust as necessary.


You're still talking hypotheticals and false causations.
The City of Alexandria advertising campaign has nothing to do with the games. It is apples and oranges.

Practice what you're preaching.
'Do it directly in a more effective way with harder metrics vs some squishy abstract BS'.

You're saying it wasn't worth the money. Yet, you (nor I) know the actual amount of revenue generated. We know what generally reputable news agencies reported with Visit Fairfax saying it was $84 million.
http://wtop.com/fairfax-county/2015/07/supervisors-world-police-and-fire-games-offered-successful-olympics-test/

Now, you can say they are lying and it wasn't worth it. But practice what you preach and use the 'effective way with harder metrics' to prove it.

Without it, you're just throwing around 'squishy abstract BS'.

Fairfax Tourism? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Businesses will actually be deterred from coming
> to Fairfax because of the high taxes.
>
> The bottom line is that the County needs to cut
> back on spending.


Blah, derp, blah, cut taxes, blah, blah, derp.
Attachments:

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fairfax Tourism? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Businesses will actually be deterred from
> coming
> > to Fairfax because of the high taxes.
> >
> > The bottom line is that the County needs to cut
> > back on spending.
>
>
> Blah, derp, blah, cut taxes, blah, blah, derp.

They didn't say cut taxes they said cut spending.

And what do you say, derpboy? Spend, spend, spend, tax, tax, tax, turf, turf, turf, trolley, trolley, trolley, schools, schools, schools, tourism, tourism, tourism.

speaking of one trick ponies Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Fairfax Tourism? Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Businesses will actually be deterred from
> > coming
> > > to Fairfax because of the high taxes.
> > >
> > > The bottom line is that the County needs to
> cut
> > > back on spending.
> >
> >
> > Blah, derp, blah, cut taxes, blah, blah, derp.
>
> They didn't say cut taxes they said cut spending.
>
>
> And what do you say, derpboy? Spend, spend, spend,
> tax, tax, tax, turf, turf, turf, trolley, trolley,
> trolley, schools, schools, schools, tourism,
> tourism, tourism.

Do better, I know you can.

derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> World Police Wut? Wrote:
>
> > First of all, I'm not opposed to doing things
> that
> > actually DO attract people and tax money to the
> > county. It's a matter of effectiveness and
> return
> > on investment.
> >
> > Just as a quick local example for comparison
> that
> > I happened to see the other day:
> >
> > "An independent study found a 171:1
> > return-on-investment (ROI) for "Extraordinary
> > Alexandria," an increase from a 130:1 ROI found
> by
> > a 2010 study of the prior campaign. The new
> study,
> > conducted by Destination Analysts, determined
> that
> > for every dollar spent by the City of
> Alexandria
> > on campaign advertising, $171 was generated in
> > visitor spending at local businesses and $6
> came
> > back to the city in tax revenue, up from $4 in
> > city tax revenue per ad dollar in 2010."
> >
> > Now, given that these estimates also employ the
> > same type of BS returns, I don't buy the
> > magnitude/multipliers for them at face value
> > either. But, granting your argument above for
> the
> > moment, how much money would the $15 million be
> > expected to generate on the same basis even
> > dividing by 10? The games being discussed here
> > don't even remotely approach the levels of
> return
> > which would be expected from even a poorly run
> > campaign designed to more directly attract what
> > you're claiming as the economic benefits from
> > these games.
> >
> > None of these event-type "investments" ever
> live
> > up to the abstract benefit claims. They're
> > basically the equivalent of high school candy
> or
> > mattress sales for what are at least supposed
> to
> > be adults. Way too much time, money and effort
> > than they're worth for the sponsor. You're
> much
> > better off putting the money and resources
> toward
> > much more direct, targeted efforts. If we were
> > trying to attract more cops and firemen, then,
> > yeah, maybe these games might make more sense.
> > But doing it on the basis of some hugely
> inflated
> > values and abstract third- or fourth-order
> > benefits as a result of "impressions" and
> > "exposure" doesn't do it. To the extent that
> it
> > does anything it's an extraordinarily
> ineffective
> > way to get there.
> >
> > If you want to attract businesses, or tourists,
> or
> > whatever, then do it directly in a more
> effective
> > way and with harder metrics vs some squishy
> > abstract BS so that you can judge whether or
> not
> > it's actually paying off and adjust as
> necessary.
>
>
> You're still talking hypotheticals and false
> causations.
> The City of Alexandria advertising campaign has
> nothing to do with the games. It is apples
> and oranges.


Absolutely is directly related. The County has $N to spend on attracting business/tourists/whatever economic benefits that it wants to try to attract. It's a matter of how that money is best "invested" and the return on that investment.


>
> Practice what you're preaching.
> 'Do it directly in a more effective way with
> harder metrics vs some squishy abstract BS'.
>
> You're saying it wasn't worth the money. Yet, you
> (nor I) know the actual amount of revenue
> generated. We know what generally reputable news
> agencies reported with Visit Fairfax saying it was
> $84 million.
> http://wtop.com/fairfax-county/2015/07/supervisors
> -world-police-and-fire-games-offered-successful-ol
> ympics-test/
>
> Now, you can say they are lying and it wasn't
> worth it. But practice what you preach and use the
> 'effective way with harder metrics' to prove it.
>
> Without it, you're just throwing around
> 'squishy abstract BS'.


Which was approaching near half of what it was promoted to bring in. And that was for the entire region not just Fairfax. You'd also need to count all of the other public and private contributions in hard and soft money as well as secondary costs on the other side of the equation.

But forgetting all of that for the moment let's just do a quick sniff-test, best-case accepting the $84 million as given. The vast bulk of the revenue was supposedly based on lodging, meals, and transportation for the 10-12,000 people involved. Let's also assume that 100% of that is captured as directly taxed revenue. Even being so overly generous:

$84 million * ~6% tax = ~$5 million = a net loss of ~$10 million.

That's before considering that the bulk of the tax revenue would go back to the state not Fairfax. Granted there arguably might be some multiplier-type effects which could be counted but not nearly enough to make up that large of a gap especially being as generous as I was with the basis to begin with.

You don't need to go all the way to India to see the Taj Mahal, just go to Fairfax and journey out to Government Center, where you can watch county workers do pretty much nothing all day.

"I'm a libtard, I enjoy giving the government all my money."

Libtardz!

LoLz!

World Police Wut? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> But forgetting all of that for the moment let's
> just do a quick sniff-test, best-case accepting
> the $84 million as given. The vast bulk of the
> revenue was supposedly based on lodging, meals,
> and transportation for the 10-12,000 people
> involved. Let's also assume that 100% of that is
> captured as directly taxed revenue. Even being so
> overly generous:
>
> $84 million * ~6% tax = ~$5 million = a net loss
> of ~$10 million.
>
> That's before considering that the bulk of the tax
> revenue would go back to the state not Fairfax.
> Granted there arguably might be some
> multiplier-type effects which could be counted but
> not nearly enough to make up that large of a gap
> especially being as generous as I was with the
> basis to begin with.


You're still being willfully ignorant. Go look at your own words. You know a 'quick-sniff test' isn't a 'harder metric' It's silly to try and you know it.

Revenue would also be more than your 6% tax. It isn't so easy to quantify. The lodging, food, transportation companies also pay corporate taxes. They employ workers that also pay taxes. Events like this keep their businesses healthy.
Go 'sniff' so more and see that local companies were also getting valuable targeted promotions.
http://fairfax2015.com/host-info/games-combine-column/gamelist/sports-rules/press-releases-2/136-muuzii®-receives-rave-reviews-at-the-world-police-fire-games

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/russian-police-officer-arrested-at-tysons-corner-on-shoplifting-charge/2015/07/01/4852d240-2037-11e5-aeb9-a411a84c9d55_story.html

Those world police were spending tons of money all around Fairfax

Libtardz!!! LoLz!! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "I'm a libtard, I enjoy giving the government all my money."

The government doesn't take "all your money" from anyone. And especially not from you downscale right-wing dipshits who don't make jack-shit to begin with. Meanwhile, taxes are simply not enough to be a factor in the lifestyles of the well-to-do.

> Libtardz! LoLz!

Co-opted assholz! Hahahaha!

If paying someone like "Flip" Flippen in excess of $800 an hour to talk about shaking hands with kids at the beginning of the day and tell horse training stories isn't derping, then derping doesn't exist, plain and simple.

If FCPS is world class in any respect, it is with respect to derping, and Karen Garza, by definition, is a world class derper.

Thank God For Herrity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Herrity will never vote for the meals tax. If the
> BoS has a vote on it, they're toast. Likewise, if
> they do much more than discuss it, they're also
> toast. Putting it on the ballot-well, that's a big
> risk. If it loses, then it will be decades before
> anyone would dare try it again. If it passes,
> property owners will rebel unless they get some
> relief (unlikely).


Supervisor Foust's assessment: Down 5.14%
Supervisor McKay's assessment: Down 6.01%
Supervisor Herrity's assessment: Down 2.05%

Countywide average for SFH: Up 1.69% (Source: p. 13 http://connectionarchives.com/PDF/2016/032316/Springfield.pdf)
[Report Post]

Derpers gonna Derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> World Police Wut? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > But forgetting all of that for the moment let's
> > just do a quick sniff-test, best-case accepting
> > the $84 million as given. The vast bulk of the
> > revenue was supposedly based on lodging, meals,
> > and transportation for the 10-12,000 people
> > involved. Let's also assume that 100% of that
> is
> > captured as directly taxed revenue. Even being
> so
> > overly generous:
> >
> > $84 million * ~6% tax = ~$5 million = a net
> loss
> > of ~$10 million.
> >
> > That's before considering that the bulk of the
> tax
> > revenue would go back to the state not Fairfax.
>
> > Granted there arguably might be some
> > multiplier-type effects which could be counted
> but
> > not nearly enough to make up that large of a
> gap
> > especially being as generous as I was with the
> > basis to begin with.
>
>
> You're still being willfully ignorant. Go look at
> your own words. You know a 'quick-sniff test'
> isn't a 'harder metric' It's silly to try and you
> know it.
>
> Revenue would also be more than your 6% tax. It
> isn't so easy to quantify. The lodging, food,
> transportation companies also pay corporate taxes.
> They employ workers that also pay taxes. Events
> like this keep their businesses healthy.
> Go 'sniff' so more and see that local companies
> were also getting valuable targeted promotions.
> http://fairfax2015.com/host-info/games-combine-col
> umn/gamelist/sports-rules/press-releases-2/136-muu
> zii®-receives-rave-reviews-at-the-world-police-fi
> re-games


That was a very optimistic BEST CASE. Any harder analysis will just come in lower. Realistically much lower. I'm using THEIR OWN numbers for revenues. You don't seem to have any problem with their own numbers since you were touting them above. All that I've done is to apply a BEST CASE estimate of what THEIR OWN numbers would mean assuming that it ALL flows back through the revenue stream which generates the HIGHEST rate of return back to the county.

The COUNTY is relatively limited in how it recovers revenue from such "investments." Corporate taxes don't go to the county other than relatively insignificant BPOL and business property taxes for which any increase from an event like this would represent a trivial blip. Likewise individual taxes. Virtually all direct revenue would be derived from sales and use taxes and other local income, lodging, and similar taxes where applicable (i.e., not in Fairfax).

Again for comparison purposes, based on numbers from the VA Tourism Corporation in a typical year Alexandria sees about $750 million/year in total spending from visitors. Out of that it ends up claiming about $24 million in tax receipts from all sources (about 3.25% of the total). Arlington and Fairfax see about $3 billion/year in total visitor spending and end up claiming about $80 million (2.67%) and $50 million (1.67%) respectively.

So applying THEIR OWN numbers on the same basis that all other visitor spending is counted by the state, $84 million ALL spent in Fairfax and ALL coming back to it at the same rate would represent $1,402,800 in total direct receipts.

Again, I'm being very generous here. I've not distinguished between direct and indirect economic benefits within the $84 million. On a more appropriate basis, only about $45 million of that total is in the form of direct economic benefits. Assuming that all ended up in Fairfax, that would work out to be $751,500 in tax revenue back to the county.

Any third- and fourth-order kinds of indirect benefits of the type that you're trying to put some great value on will be relatively trivial versus direct receipts. The way that things work out in terms of return on "investment," in order to break even the county must receive at least about a 100:1 return for every dollar spent. For something like the example that I gave you above for Alexandria running a mobile ad campaign where it costs fractions of a cent per reached individual and each one who eventually does happen to show up spends $100s to $1,000s, then you can generate those kinds of multipliers. You cannot for direct "investments" like these games. That's much closer to a 1:1 deal and any multipliers are in the low single-digit range.

If you don't like my very generous best case estimates giving them all benefit of doubt, then let me know whatever assumptions you'd like to use and we can run through what that means in terms of real numbers.

You're in the weeds and can't see the forest for the trees.
I'm done going in there. You're still trying to compare apples and oranges without hard numbers for the actual event. VA Tourism and Alexandria tourism campaigns have no relevance to a one time international event.

And again, more importantly, it wasn't all about immediate tax revenue.

Look, it was deemed good enough for a reputable board of directors with Hall of Fame athletes known for integrity like Cal Ripken Jr. and Darryl Green and high profile government leaders, past and present, like Colin Powell, Tom Ridge, Tom Davis of the GOP, to Democrats like Sen. Warner, Sen. Kaine, Gov. McAuliffe.

http://fairfax2015.com/about#board

I'll take their word over your comparisons any day.

You people WILL pay the tax.

WE control the police, jails, courts, prisons and WE print the money!
Now STFU and pay your taxes in full and ON TIME!

Just like this school district, we could end up paying "Flip" Flippen $10,000 for a one hour speech. Who does he think he is, Hillary Clinton?

http://foxc6watchdogs.blogspot.com/2013_08_01_archive.html

(search this page for "Flippen")

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You're in the weeds and can't see the forest for
> the trees.
> I'm done going in there. You're still trying to
> compare apples and oranges without hard numbers
> for the actual event. VA Tourism and Alexandria
> tourism campaigns have no relevance to a one time
> international event.
>
> And again, more importantly, it wasn't all
> about immediate tax revenue.
>
> Look, it was deemed good enough for a reputable
> board of directors with Hall of Fame athletes
> known for integrity like Cal Ripken Jr. and Darryl
> Green and high profile government leaders, past
> and present, like Colin Powell, Tom Ridge, Tom
> Davis of the GOP, to Democrats like Sen. Warner,
> Sen. Kaine, Gov. McAuliffe.
>
> http://fairfax2015.com/about#board
>
> I'll take their word over your comparisons any
> day.


You don't have to take my word for anything. You can do the math for yourself. You are "taking their word for it" since the numbers that I gave are their own.

$84 million is their all-in, top-line gross "hard number" number for the total economic benefit derived from the games. I gave them full credit for that.

$15 million is their number for the cost. I've not even bothered to attempt to deduct any of the other direct and indirect costs involved in the same way that the benefits have been counted.

I've specifically avoided "getting into the weeds" by just granting the benefit of doubt to the county's advantage in all cases. It's a simple money-in/money-out calculation necessary to understand what we got out of the games. The county "invested" $15 million to generate $84 million in beneficial economic activity within the county.

That all looks good in the press release and people are slapping each other on the back over those numbers. You cited them so I'm assuming that you have no problem with them.

Now what they don't highlight is what that $84 million in economic activity actually means in terms of revenue back, particularly for the county which put up most of the money. Given that's how we pay for those things that you cited -- roads and schools and infrastructure and education and smaller class sizes and quality educators -- I'd think that would be a relatively important number.

$84 million * 6% = $5.04 million. Of that, $4.45 million goes to the state.
The county gets $588,000.

That's not "my word," that's math. Makes no difference whether it's these games or anything else. They took $15 million in county funds away from roads, and schools, etc., to (very optimistically) get $588,000 in tax revenue in that year.

But now you say that we can't look at it as a one time event, we have to look at all of the future revenue that it will bring in!

OK, let's do that...

Let's completely unrealistically assume that these games somehow magically continue to bring in that full $84 million in economic activity each and every year going forward even without ever being held again. That would be $588,000 returned each year.

$15 million/$588K per year = 26 years just to break even.

Again, that's math.

You can put in whatever more realistic assumptions that you want in for future tourism/business expectations and/or multipliers for secondary effects that you want. You won't get near any kind of reasonable recovery of that money. Not even worth bothering to calculate future value and opportunity costs which would further reduce that on a real basis.

If I were McAuliffe and the others on the board I'd be supporting it too. They're not paying and they end up getting more out of it than Fairfax does.

I could literally just cut and paste my last post.
- It never was all about an immediate tax revenue.
- All your math is based on nebulous numbers with no cost association. You don't know specifically how the county's money was used for the event. You say 'They took $15 million in county funds away from roads, and schools, etc.' with no clue if infrastructure improvements were part of it.

Reality: Fairfax County 2016 budget is: $3.8 Billion.
You're nitpicking over .4% of the budget spent on an international goodwill event for first responders that increased revenue for/and promoted local businesses.

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Reality: Fairfax County 2016 budget is: $3.8
> Billion.
> You're nitpicking over .4% of the budget spent
> on an international goodwill event for first
> responders that increased revenue for/and promoted
> local businesses.

Where you see 0.4% of the total county budget, I see 15% of the $100 million budget shortfall for FCPS.

The truth is that waste in government spending is rarely a significant portion of the budget for a single item. Rather, it is an accumulation of lots of little items: $100K here, $25K there, $50K for this, $10K for that.

It's death by a thousand cuts, rather than by one major wound. That's why that one shithead keeps harping on Flip Flippen's fee in every single FCPS-related thread: it's one of those thousand cuts.

The argument against the restaurant tax is that the BoS needs to get its fiscal house in order and cauterize some of the thousand wounds that it leaks money from before it demands an additional $75 million per year in taxes from its citizens.

fracturedfairfax Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Reality: Fairfax County 2016 budget is: $3.8
> > Billion.
> > You're nitpicking over .4% of the budget
> spent
> > on an international goodwill event for first
> > responders that increased revenue for/and
> promoted
> > local businesses.
>
> Where you see 0.4% of the total county budget, I
> see 15% of the $100 million budget shortfall for
> FCPS.
>
> The truth is that waste in government spending is
> rarely a significant portion of the budget for a
> single item. Rather, it is an accumulation of lots
> of little items: $100K here, $25K there, $50K for
> this, $10K for that.
>
> It's death by a thousand cuts, rather than by one
> major wound. That's why that one shithead keeps
> harping on Flip Flippen's fee in every single
> FCPS-related thread: it's one of those thousand
> cuts.
>
> The argument against the restaurant tax is that
> the BoS needs to get its fiscal house in order and
> cauterize some of the thousand wounds that it
> leaks money from before it demands an additional
> $75 million per year in taxes from its citizens.

If you were to find a multimillion dollar event, such as a Mediterranean cruise for the school board and everyone at Gatehouse, there would be a revolution.

But the death by a thousand cuts model is the right one. Adding up all the little ones, Flip Flippen's fee, the Police and Fire Games, innumerable meals at Sea Pearl, pizza parties, breakfast meetings between Garza and board members, the hall of mirrors of assistant marching band coaches, is difficult an expensive because of FCPS' lack of transparency and FOIA policies. An outside auditor might catch most if not all of it, but the average citizen, unless well resourced, will not.

That's what they count on. If Mr. X. complains about Flippen, FCPS says "it was not that much money." If Ms. Y. complains about Garza's restaurant bills, FCPS says "it is not that much money" and so on. BUT when you add it all up, it is real money.

And, the County (non-FCPS) is just as wasteful. There are too many little empires, no one wants to cut anything. If someone says "cut out the iPads for the park people" the park people say "close down one of the 8 planetariums" or "how about not sending as many people to Buck this year." Of course, if someone says "Buck Institute is a hustle" then the pro-Buck people will say "hustle? you want hustle? what about those park iPads" and so it goes on forever.

Taxed to the Maxx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://stopthefoodtax.com/
>
>

Jesus Christ, that web site is a visual abortion. I feel like I should buy one of those big text phones like the Jitterbug they sell to the old people.

Derpers gonna derp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I could literally just cut and paste my last post.
>
> - It never was all about an immediate tax
> revenue.
> - All your math is based on nebulous numbers with
> no cost association. You don't know specifically
> how the county's money was used for the
> event. You say 'They took $15 million in county
> funds away from roads, and schools, etc.' with no
> clue if infrastructure improvements were part of
> it.
>
> Reality: Fairfax County 2016 budget is: $3.8
> Billion.
> You're nitpicking over .4% of the budget spent
> on an international goodwill event for first
> responders that increased revenue for/and promoted
> local businesses.


Sure you could. And it would make as little sense as it did when you posted it the first time. All you did was deflect over hard numbers, despite me using their own numbers, and posted a picture of the board. Compelling argument. lol

We don't need "hard numbers" to know how the money was spent. All that we need to know is how much was spent and we have their own numbers for that. We also have their own number for what benefit they claim that "investment" created. The reality is that they spent $15 million in order to generate (by their own numbers) $84 million in economic benefits to the county. They aren't even arguing any of that. At the highest rate of recovery of that money and crediting all of it back to the county at the highest rate, that ends up being about $588,000 back to the county in revenue.

I addressed your point re it not being about immediate revenue. Completely unrealistically assuming that the same one-time event continues to generate that same $84 million level of economic activity each and every year going forward, it will take ~26 years just to make that money back.

Now if you really want I can make it more realistic. Only about $45 million actually was in direct benefits. And only about 70% of the activity took place in the county. If I assume BPOL and other taxes as you cited (which come in at about $.04 - $.31/$100 vs sales tax at about $.01/$1) instead of sales tax recovery, then that will reduce the amount recovered/increase time to recover substantially. I'm not even going to bother to do that. Bottom line, they effectively just gave that money away.

Now you can try to argue that it's only some small percentage of the budget but so are many other important functions. Whether you realize it or not, .4% of the total budget is a significant level. More than 10X the annual cost to pay down debt on park improvement projects. About 3X the annual pay-down on athletic field maintenance maintenance and sports projects. About 4X the annual pay-down on capital improvements for ADA (disability) projects. About 6X the capital equipment purchase budget (actually way more but only because that was cut to pretty much nothing for 2016). Almost 8X the general fund transfer payment for elderly housing. The county's contribution to Medical Care for Children's programs is only about $250K. The number of more important things that are much smaller than that amount and/or cuts made to other programs are endless. Go take a look for yourself at what $15 million buys within the county's budget.

http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/dmb/fy2016/adopted/overview.htm

hDynx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I could literally just cut and paste my last
> post.
> >
> > - It never was all about an immediate
> tax
> > revenue.
> > - All your math is based on nebulous numbers
> with
> > no cost association. You don't know
> specifically
> > how the county's money was used for the
> > event. You say 'They took $15 million in county
> > funds away from roads, and schools, etc.' with
> no
> > clue if infrastructure improvements were part
> of
> > it.
> >
> > Reality: Fairfax County 2016 budget is: $3.8
> > Billion.
> > You're nitpicking over .4% of the budget
> spent
> > on an international goodwill event for first
> > responders that increased revenue for/and
> promoted
> > local businesses.
>
>
> Sure you could. And it would make as little sense
> as it did when you posted it the first time. All
> you did was deflect over hard numbers, despite me
> using their own numbers, and posted a picture of
> the board. Compelling argument. lol
>
> We don't need "hard numbers" to know how the money
> was spent. All that we need to know is how much
> was spent and we have their own numbers for that.
> We also have their own number for what benefit
> they claim that "investment" created. The reality
> is that they spent $15 million in order to
> generate (by their own numbers) $84 million in
> economic benefits to the county. They aren't even
> arguing any of that. At the highest rate of
> recovery of that money and crediting all of it
> back to the county at the highest rate, that ends
> up being about $588,000 back to the county in
> revenue.
>
> I addressed your point re it not being about
> immediate revenue. Completely unrealistically
> assuming that the same one-time event continues to
> generate that same $84 million level of economic
> activity each and every year going forward, it
> will take ~26 years just to make that money back.
>
> Now if you really want I can make it more
> realistic. Only about $45 million actually was in
> direct benefits. And only about 70% of the
> activity took place in the county. If I assume
> BPOL and other taxes as you cited (which come in
> at about $.04 - $.31/$100 vs sales tax at
> about $.01/$1) instead of sales tax recovery, then
> that will reduce the amount recovered/increase
> time to recover substantially. I'm not even going
> to bother to do that. Bottom line, they
> effectively just gave that money away.
>
> Now you can try to argue that it's only some small
> percentage of the budget but so are many other
> important functions. Whether you realize it or
> not, .4% of the total budget is a significant
> level. More than 10X the annual cost to pay down
> debt on park improvement projects. About 3X the
> annual pay-down on athletic field maintenance
> maintenance and sports projects. About 4X the
> annual pay-down on capital improvements for ADA
> (disability) projects. About 6X the capital
> equipment purchase budget (actually way more but
> only because that was cut to pretty much nothing
> for 2016). Almost 8X the general fund transfer
> payment for elderly housing. The county's
> contribution to Medical Care for Children's
> programs is only about $250K. The number of more
> important things that are much smaller than that
> amount and/or cuts made to other programs are
> endless. Go take a look for yourself at what $15
> million buys within the county's budget.
>
> http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/dmb/fy2016/adopted/ov
> erview.htm
Attachments:

We could start by rolling back the raises the Board of Supervisors and School Board gave themselves. It is not a large sum of money, but it would send the right message.

Would this apply to pizza and buffalo wings?

A lot of taxes Wrote:
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> Would this apply to pizza and buffalo wings?


Yes. Unless they're frozen from the grocery store.

Anti-taxers are no different from anti-vaxers. Bunch of clueless, useless morons in both cases.

YdvLd Wrote:
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> Anti-taxers are no different from anti-vaxers.
> Bunch of clueless, useless morons in both cases.


The taxes are out of control because they are being paid for stupidity. Fairfax County recently bailed out Wells Fargo over $30 MILLION dollars for an art center that wasn't even owned by Fairfax County. The supervisors, including Bullova said that it would be a shame if the bank foreclosed on someone else's property, so they obligated $30+ MILLION of your tax dollars to pay Wells Fargo. And now (surprise!) they need more tax dollars. $30 MILLION buys a lot of school books, even with a typical FCPS no-bid contract.

The schools recently started high school later in the morning so the kids can sleep in. So they had to buy more buses, hire more drivers, increase the maintenance staff, etc. All at a cost of tens of millions to get started, and then recurring costs must be paid each year.

The schools routinely let huge big ticket contracts get signed on a no-bid basis. Why bother shopping for the best price? Sign up your buddies and stick the inflated bills to the taxpayers.

Why is the school board paid? Many places, it is a public service volunteer position which attracts folks who actually care about the community instead of collecting another paycheck.

Lisa Hughes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> YdvLd Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Anti-taxers are no different from anti-vaxers.
> > Bunch of clueless, useless morons in both
> cases.
>
>
> The taxes are out of control because they are
> being paid for stupidity. Fairfax County recently
> bailed out Wells Fargo over $30 MILLION dollars
> for an art center that wasn't even owned by
> Fairfax County. The supervisors, including
> Bullova said that it would be a shame if the bank
> foreclosed on someone else's property, so they
> obligated $30+ MILLION of your tax dollars to pay
> Wells Fargo. And now (surprise!) they need more
> tax dollars. $30 MILLION buys a lot of school
> books, even with a typical FCPS no-bid contract.
>
> The schools recently started high school later in
> the morning so the kids can sleep in. So they had
> to buy more buses, hire more drivers, increase the
> maintenance staff, etc. All at a cost of tens of
> millions to get started, and then recurring costs
> must be paid each year.
>
> The schools routinely let huge big ticket
> contracts get signed on a no-bid basis. Why
> bother shopping for the best price? Sign up your
> buddies and stick the inflated bills to the
> taxpayers.
>
> Why is the school board paid? Many places, it is
> a public service volunteer position which attracts
> folks who actually care about the community
> instead of collecting another paycheck.

1) They fly in Eric Jensen from Hawaii on a no bid contract. He's a former English teacher who has becoome a neuroscience expert. There are probably many more examples.

2) The school board not only gets paid but gets all sorts of benefits like free meals, travel, and golf. Plus, just look at Smith and Storck, they used it as a springboard to the Board of Supervisors.

YdvLd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anti-taxers are no different from anti-vaxers.
> Bunch of clueless, useless morons in both cases.


Yes, I should just send all my money to the government and let them invest it for me.

You might recall a program called Social Security which is the above. Remember, I as a peon, can't be trusted to handle my own finances, so the government is going to smartly invest my money for me. Guess what, the government discovered it can borrow against that money instead of investing it for you.

Sure. Send the government money. They are so clever with other people's money.

That Wells Fargo/Arts Center bailout is just disgusting. I know I'd never go all the way down there. What with trolley car studies, turf field studies, iPads and school board travel, the County sure does throw money around. A meals tax would just be more they could waste.

So many assholes! So few penises!