What are the gun laws in Virginia? I'm interested in getting a pistol to have in my home for protection. Have never owned a gun before, have owned paintball guns though. Can anyone recommend a good gun safety course or even a reliable pistol (thinking a beretta, glock, or colt 40/45). Let me know.

FireStrings85 Wrote:
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> What are the gun laws in Virginia? I'm interested
> in getting a pistol to have in my home for
> protection. Have never owned a gun before, have
> owned paintball guns though. Can anyone recommend
> a good gun safety course or even a reliable pistol
> (thinking a beretta, glock, or colt 40/45). Let
> me know.

Try calling the NRA Hq on Waples Mill Rd. Another route is to
look in the Yellow Pages under "Guns". Most dealers can tell you
where and when.

You need to be 21 to own a handgun. Other than that, I don't know about specific laws.

I would suggest AGAINST a handgun or rifle or any type of home protection.

A shotgun would be your best bet for self-defense home protection.

Not only is it easier to aim and shoot but your shot ( aka bullets) .. dont pass thru as many walls and quickly lose the impact after passing through wallboard.

This is something most people DO NOT consider when arming themselves for home defense. People never think of what is behind the intended target, and when you are in panic mode shooting, your aim WILL SUCK!!.

And 9 out of 10 times when the intruder hears unmistakable sound of you racking a round in the chamber, they have already left or just shit their pants. either way you win.

go get a cheap-o Mossberg 12 gauge and a box of buck shot. AND PLEASE GOD go to the range and and learn how to shoot it.

I own several handguns and I have a concealed permit, but for Home protection my Berreta semi-auto shotgun has served me well for both home defense and bird hunting.

Another good option
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model_870/

I think Take a Stand makes a good argument. Not only is it harder to miss and won't travel far enough to cause collateral injuries, but if you do happen to miss, the loud report will definitely send the intruder running for his life, unless he's completely whacked out on some crazy drug. Plus you can choose from a whole range of loads -- buck, bird, slug, etc.

Either way, your desire to take a gun safety course is also a good idea, no matter what you choose to buy.

I think the NRA is the best place to go. They also have an indoor range where you can go and practice.

I'm pretty sure for shotguns and rifles, you just need to be 18, or 16 with a parent present when purchasing it, and there's no waiting period or background checks.

If you have to have a hand gun for whatever reason, go with a revolver, they are easier to maintain and less likely to jam and if it misfires you just pull the trigger again until you get a good shot off.

First of all, you should definitely take a class in gun safety. Then consider a .45 ACP because of it's low muzzle velocity and immediate stopping power.
Go to the range and get lots of practice.

The 10mm Colt sidearm might not be an ideal long-distance weapon, and it's certainly no sniper's rifle, but it has the advantages of low weight and quicker target acquisition. You can reliably engage aggressors at ranges of 30 meters and more. Use a two-handed grip and brace the barrel against a night table, or use your bed as an improvised bench rest. Don't worry about "stopping power": One of those 10mm slugs opens up to about 70 caliber when it hits, leaving an exit wound you could toss a cat through, and bringing so much energy to a target that a hit in the extremities is often enough to drop the burglar in his tracks.

Trust me, however, that cleaning the carpet in the morning will be a big chore! It's best to drop the bad guy over wood or linoleum flooring, if possible.

+1 for a shotgun. I have a mossberg 500 that I got for around $200 that lives under my bed. As others have mentioned having too powerful a round will fly through walls and potentially hit neighbors. In VA there is a background check on all purchases whether rifle or handgun. 18 years old for rifles, 21 for handguns.

You can take a basic pistol course in many places (if your ever plan to get a conceal carry permit you have to take one anyway). They go over the laws and basic safety, the one I took also had live fire. I highly suggest taking a course and firing what you're thinking of buying before you buy it.

As others have said, you must be 21 to purchase a handgun in Virginia.
Anyone 18 or older may openly carry a handgun in VA with no permits of any kind. Of course, some restrictions (federal property, K-12 schools, any place with a no weapons sign) do apply.

You are allowed to carry your pistol concealed with no permits on your own property only.
If you want to carry concealed anywhere else, you must get a Concealed Handgun Permit from your County district court. To get this permit, you must prove residency, and prove competency. I took a day-long NRA class for this, but a honorable discharge from the military, along with a few other things work too.

In any case, whatever gun you pick, shotgun or pistol (I'd suggest both!), in VA you can legally own & carry pretty much whatever you want inside your home. I do suggest you take a gun safety class as well as a class on VA gun laws.

Remember, VA does not have a "castle doctrine", so someone simply breaking into your home does not necessarily warrant lethal force in the eyes of the state. Remember too that should you ever need to use lethal force to defend life (there is no other reason), there's a pretty good chance that you will be subject to prosecution & civil action, even if your actions were 100% justified.

When scheduling time to practice at the range, ask if they offer "night-firing" training. An intruder is not likely to turn on the lights, and you may not have the time to do so yourself.

Only problem with a shotgun is physical size! they should market a speciality home defense weapon that is basically flare-gun size that takes 2 or 3 standard shotgun shells.

The report would be enough to scare the crap out of them, the pattern of the shot would disperse rather quickly, and unless hitting center of mass, should only incapacitate.

take out the knees and the groin. That way they can't run and can't reproduce. Society will thank you for it.

All the above is good advice. However, I would not personally use
buckshot for home defense. (very powerful at close range and can
blow an intruder in half) (messy)

Why limit your self to just one gun though? I have several rifles, pistols,
and shotguns that provide for a variety of scenarios.

One bit of advice though. If you should need to use a firearm in self
defense, its NOT a good idea to use a really expensive one. If you do,
the police will take it as evidence pending investigation and sometimes
folks have very difficult time getting it back. Best bet is to use a
moderately priced but good quality firearm.

tj2008 Wrote:
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> Only problem with a shotgun is physical size!
> they should market a speciality home defense
> weapon that is basically flare-gun size that takes
> 2 or 3 standard shotgun shells.
>
> The report would be enough to scare the crap out
> of them, the pattern of the shot would disperse
> rather quickly, and unless hitting center of mass,
> should only incapacitate.
>
> take out the knees and the groin. That way they
> can't run and can't reproduce. Society will thank
> you for it.

Never shoot to wound, Always aim center of mass, and hope the bad guy is in a much warmer place by the time anybody arrives to take a statement. Virginia's castle doctrine is good, but not great. Avoid an extended legal battle, and just complete the task said bad guy forced upon you.

And for god's sake, hurry up and arm yourself, the zombie war is coming.

I went to YouTube and found plenty of instructional video's by
entering:

home defense pistol

They have plenty for rifles and shotguns too.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=home+defense+pistol&search_type=&aq=f

Go to www.handgunlaw.us for a fair run-down of laws.

Check out http://www.virginia1774.org/Page1.html for a well-maintained list of current law.

Here's a pretty interesting article about information on guns for home security. http://www.charlottemagazine.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5256

1. a shotgun is far too cumbersome.
2. advising not to buy a gun becuase YOU are scared is silly.
3. I had a .22 baretta that stove piped and was not safe
4. go to the NRA range after you buy a gun. You have to take a short test to shoot there and they will help.

I would suggest a 9mm semi automatic. I keep mine in a safe. I know how to shoot well enough that if I do hit a wall, it will scare the crap out of anyone near me or the bullet.

A shotgun is much more powerful, and much easier to shoot- mainly because it's a shoulder arm, not because of the multiple pellets. Be aware that at the ranges you'd use a shotgun in a home, the shot doesn't spread very far- think the size of a fist, or maybe larger if you fired down a hallway, but there's no "cone of death." You have to aim, just not as precisely as with a rifle.

The argument for a pistol is that a shotgun is unwieldy, and someone could grab it from you as you turn a corner. Of course, you would generally want to call the police and and then stay in one place, rather than trying to clear out the house yourself. The exception would would be if you have kids you want to get to, or anyone else who nees to be protected or rescued immediately.

I've heard that magnum loads in a short handgun are bad because they can give you permanent hearing damage if you fire them indoors. I don't know where a shotgun would fit into that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2008 08:43AM by Space Ghost Coast to Coast.

My father-in-law advised me to get a shotgun for home defense for much the same reasons Take a Stand did.

If you live in an apartment/townhouse area be very careful. I suspect you'd be responsible if you missed and struck someone in the next house over.

good ideas, I also have several in the house and kids too. Have safety in mind on how you store it and how quickly you can access it if needed. You will be responsible if the kids get it and hurt themselves, friends, you, etc. Safety doesn't just cover how you handle the gun, but how you store it, clean it, etc. Not a sermon, just a thought......

Every experienced gun store employee whom I have asked the best gun for protection question has expressed exactly the same views as Take a Stand - buy a good shotgun an learn how to use it.

Take a Stand Wrote:

> go get a cheap-o Mossberg 12 gauge and a box of
> buck shot. AND PLEASE GOD go to the range and and
> learn how to shoot it.

I'd say go with #8 birdshot. Buckshot will certainly penetrate walls, which is a bad option if you live in a high density housing area. see http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot17.htm

trogdor! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Take a Stand Wrote:
>
> > go get a cheap-o Mossberg 12 gauge and a box of
> > buck shot. AND PLEASE GOD go to the range and
> and
> > learn how to shoot it.
>
> I'd say go with #8 birdshot. Buckshot will
> certainly penetrate walls, which is a bad option
> if you live in a high density housing area. see
> http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot17.htm

Excellent website. Thanks for sharing. In certain circumstances, you
may actually want to penetrate the door so this is why I think a
variety of firearms is necessary. Safety all important of course
and depending on where you live. Birdshot makes a fine standard load.
I have some rural property and if someone is trying to beat the bedroom door down, its time for a 12 ga. slug or the '06. Peace through superior firepower!

Shotguns, ballistically, work fine for home defense, but their size makes them VERY easy to take away in close quarters. For this reason, I recommend handguns as home defense weapons. They are also far easier to secure against theft or small children, while remaining accessible to adults who may need them.

I keep my handgun next to my bed in a touch-combo safe.

By the way, theboxotruth.com is an excellent site. Regarding birdshot as a defense load, I would quote them in this regard:

"Birdshot as a Defense Load
I have had a lot of questions, summed up as follows: How effective is birdshot (#4, #6, #8, etc.) as a defense load?

We have done tests with various birdshot loads. Birdshot penetrated through two pieces of drywall (representing one wall) and was stopped in the paper on the front of the second wall. The problem with birdshot is that it does not penetrate enough to be effective as a defense round. Birdshot is designed to bring down little birds.

A policeman told of seeing a guy shot at close range with a load of 12 gauge birdshot, and was not even knocked down. He was still walking around when the EMTs got there. It was an ugly, shallow wound, but did not STOP the guy. And that is what we want... to STOP the bad guy from whatever he is doing. To do this, you must have a load that will reach the vitals of the bad guy. Birdshot will not do this.

In fact, tests have shown that even #4 Buckshot lacks the necessary penetration to reach the vital organs. Only 0 Buck, 00 Buck, and 000 Buck penetrate enough to reach the vital organs.

Unless you expect to be attacked by little birds, do not use birdshot. Use 00 Buck. It will do the job."

Kardinal Wrote:
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> A policeman told of seeing a guy shot at close

Why didnt the victim keep firing until his target went down?

beckoncall Wrote:
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> Kardinal Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
>
> > A policeman told of seeing a guy shot at close
>
> Why didnt the victim keep firing until his target
> went down?

Maybe it was a single-shot shotgun.

beckoncall Wrote:
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> Kardinal Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
>
> > A policeman told of seeing a guy shot at close
>
> Why didnt the victim keep firing until his target
> went down?

Who knows the situation? To be honest, I shoudl have left that out, because anecdotal evidence is no evidence at all. The focus should be on what they have TESTED, which is that bird shot does not penetrate far enough to stop human beings.

If a guy was wearing a heavy leather coat, I suspect there would be no more than skin damage with #8 bird shot.

Kardinal Wrote:
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> Shotguns, ballistically, work fine for home
> defense, but their size makes them VERY easy to
> take away in close quarters. For this reason, I
> recommend handguns as home defense weapons. They
> are also far easier to secure against theft or
> small children, while remaining accessible to
> adults who may need them.


Solution = sawed off shotgun

I agree with Bob and Strates on this one, not sure if I follow what you mean by the, "Zombie Wars" though? Explain please. I personally am looking for some assault weapons, any suggestions on a good place?

Where's the best practice range in this area?

spunky Wrote:
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> I agree with Bob and Strates on this one, not sure
> if I follow what you mean by the, "Zombie Wars"
> though? Explain please. I personally am looking
> for some assault weapons, any suggestions on a
> good place?
>
> Where's the best practice range in this area?

Any of the area gunstores handle "assault rifles", but I understand
that demand is very high right now due to paranoia over BO's agenda.

Best ranges for me are the Izaak Walton League in Centreville, (you MUST
be a member or a guest of one) and the NRA range on Waples Mill is good too.
For a nice afternoon of shooting, Clarke Bros. in Warrenton is good.
Clarke also stocks quite a few firearms and the sales staff are
extremely knowledgeable. You must purchase ammo from them to be able
to use their range though.

Kardinal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Who knows the situation? To be honest, I shoudl
> have left that out, because anecdotal evidence is
> no evidence at all. The focus should be on what
> they have TESTED, which is that bird shot does not
> penetrate far enough to stop human beings.
>
> If a guy was wearing a heavy leather coat, I
> suspect there would be no more than skin damage
> with #8 bird shot.

The important thing is to think about where you are (or might be) shooting, and what's down range.

The last thing you would want to do is successfully defend your life (or your loved one's lives) only to find out that you killed the neighbor's kid who was sleeping just beyond the wall you were firing at. That will ruin your day and the rest of your life.

Here's are some ballistic gelatin examples of different shotgun loads:

http://www.tacticalshotgun.ca/ballistics_shotgun.html


Here's another anecdotal story from (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=381023)

"Never saw birdshot in gelatin but went to a shooting where guy was shot with 71/2 birdshoot in 12 ga at a distance of 2 feet.The guy went down and never spoke another word.He was dead on arrival in 10 minutes.There was hardly any blood.The shot entered the lower stomach and intestines came out the entrance wound sealing the bleeding inside.At the hospital,the body sloshed inside while moving him to take x rays.The majority of the birdshot stayed in the stomach&chest cavity however a few of the pellets made it all the way to the neck area and also down through the legs.I saw one pellet coming through the skin by one of his ankles.The x rays showed up like many lights on a Xmas tree because the rays don't penetrate lead.I could not believe the devastation done to this guy.Yes gelatin is nice but I saw the real deal.I would not hesitate using any size birdshot for close up work.However,keeping all I have said,I would prefer #2 over 7 1/2.
Sorry for the correction.It was #9 Birdshot that was used.See it's not east getting old and forgetful."

Buy a Glock 17 or 19. Maybe consider putting a laser sight on the weapon. You will have virtual guaranteed accuracy (even for a beginner) and something that you can carry with you. Times are coming where you may need to carry a weapon with you.

I own a Glock 17 for home defense. It is a 9mm handgun that holds 17 rounds in the magazine. I would recommend a gun in .45 ACP for home defense but the reason I got one in 9mm was so that my wife would be able to shoot it should I happen to be preoccupied at the moment (or not home). All Glocks have large grips so I would not recommend them to people with small hands.
I would not recommend a shotgun as your sole weapon for home defense. As a few other people have stated above, you must use two hands to reliably wield a long gun. With a handgun you can have your cordless telephone or cell phone in one hand and your gun in the other. That way you can be in touch with the 911 operator the entire time while waiting for the police.
As far as calibers, the bigger the bullet the better the stopping power. I would not recommend any gun chambered for anything smaller than 9mm. Many people would say even 9mm isnt enough. But again, its all about your needs and circumstances. My wife couldnt handle the recoil of a .357 or a 45 ACP so we went with the G17 and keep it loaded with hollowpoints.
If you're serious about buying a gun, now is an unfortunate time for you since there is a huge spike in demand for guns with the coming Obama presidency. Sales are through the roof and prices have climbed accordingly. My advice to you is to go to the gun show this month at the Dulles Expo center. For more information go to:
www.thenationsgunshow.com
There will be hundreds of tables there with guns of all types and all prices, most of which you can pick up and hold in your hand to see what fits you best.

i see your making the right decision with regards to your current situation. You are too young to purchase a pistol and therefore a shotgun is your best option. I would say leave the area. keep mouth shut. be smart. dont be dumb. nobody fucks with a firecrotch with a shotgun. I had to do what i had to do now its your turn.

Get a handgun and go with a combat load of about 5 silver hollow points or Glaser Safety Slugs (http://www.dakotaammo.net/products/glaser/glaser.htm) and then the rest full metal jacket (ball) ammo. The rationale is that the first few rounds will be aimed at the intruder. If, for some reason it gets into a gun fight, the jacketed rounds will penetrate the wall or door the criminal is using as cover.

How about a black powder pistol? I was looking through a Cabellas catalogue and there are a ole variety of rifels,shotguns and pistols just you have to learn to use black powder. It'll still protect and you can get one through the mail with no permit or security check.

Rod Wrote:
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> How about a black powder pistol? I was looking
> through a Cabellas catalogue and there are a ole
> variety of rifels,shotguns and pistols just you
> have to learn to use black powder. It'll still
> protect and you can get one through the mail with
> no permit or security check.

All muzzle load weapons appear to be completely unregulated.

Check out youtube for the ".577 T-Rex rifle"

=
Attachments:

eesh Wrote:
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... but eesh left off the instructions for use. Sheesh. You could get someone hurt, eesh!

Hoping to ensure comrades who are afflicted with "tl:dr" syndrome won't injure themselves or their partners, here's a summary of much of the important information from the detailed instructions in the Glorious Leader's Red Book, pages 633 through 637. (Also see the exercises scattered throughout pages 1321 and 1403.)

And re(publican)tards, the pictured pistol is only available to sworn-in Party Members. Your death-delivering killing machines-pistols and rifles and shotguns-are all you can have, until we can figure out a way to ban them.

From page 633:

"This Prostho-Peni-Pistol (P3, spoken "P cubed) is approved for use only by adult members of the Democrat Party. (See page 1347 for how to use the Self-Actualizing-Self-Actuating-Nirvana-Ticket, the Party-approved captured-bolt-pistol from which the Prostho-Peni-Pistol was designed.)"

(Translation for FU fellow travelers: Be very careful not to use the Self-Actualizing-Self-Actuating-Nirvana-Ticket if you're practicing fellatio techniques. Otherwise, you could knock out your front teeth!)

From page 635:

"Do not lube the prosthetic penis until it has been loaded into the Prostho-Peni-Pistol. Too much lube on the shaft of the prosthetic penis within the 'barrel' of the P3 could cause a misfire."

(Translation for FU fellow travelers: If your current session with the prosthetic penis has included manual insertion into your partner's rectum, then carefully wipe off all butterscotch pudding, and any residual lubricant, from the ENTIRE shaft, before loading your Prostho-Peni-Pistol.)

From page 637:

"WARNING. If the anal sphincter of the recipient of a fired P3 projectile is too relaxed or stretched out, the prosthetic penis may penetrate so deeply that it is difficult to digitally remove. In such case, CAREFUL use of pliers (especially channel-locking style) and/or laxatives can help."

(Translation for FU fellow travelers: If the prosthetic penis becomes lodged in your partner's anus, it is safest to go to the emergency room for assistance. Contact your neighborhood block-warden before you go, so they can contact the block-warden responsible for the treating emergency room. If you get some snide comments from re(tard)publican medical personnel, the IRS will be notified.

HTH! Hail Glorious Leader. Down with re(tard)publican liars! Especially those that try to make mountains out of molehills, like creative immigration reform, etc. If re(tard)publicans like laws so much, then they can follow them. Party Members don't have to follow laws, unless they want to or they are useful in meeting Glorious Leader's Agenda.

(The Agenda is in an Appendix to the Glorious Leader's Red Book, and is also available to Party Members from your block-warden.)

Good. Better to shoot them than be shot by them.

Gonna go against the wisdom here and recommend a .357 revolver:

- no complicated or cumbersome magazines. Try this simple test - hand it to your wife in the store and have her demonstrate how it would be loaded and fired. Revolvers require zero training, so anyone in the family that needs to can use it
- virtually zero chance of misloading or jamming. A revolver can sit in your safe loaded for years and will go bang when you need it - not so with semi autos
- if you are buying just for home defense - like it will sit in a safe or nightstand - don't buy a ccw weapon. They are a bitch to shoot, you won't want to practice with it, and you want to be able to control it for the second shot. The more steel, the less kick
- if 6 shots ain't enough you've got bigger problems. The overwhelming use of handguns in self defense involves two shots or less. True for LEO encounters as well.
- the right frangible round will not penetrate walls. If you are buying for self defense, spend the extra few dollars for specific self defense rounds. Buy the cheap stuff to send down the range, but you need the real hollow point for self defense
- take a course
- get a ccw
- get a safe
- go the range occasionally - it's fun and you'll build the muscle memory for loading and reloading

FireStrings85 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What are the gun laws in Virginia? I'm interested
> in getting a pistol to have in my home for
> protection. Have never owned a gun before, have
> owned paintball guns though. Can anyone recommend
> a good gun safety course or even a reliable pistol
> (thinking a beretta, glock, or colt 40/45). Let
> me know.

Having a gun in the home virtually guarantees that your next suicide attemtp will succeed.

retardz

Go Ahead Dummy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Having a gun in the home virtually guarantees that
> your next suicide attemtp will succeed.


We should take up a collection to get one for eff ewe.