Is it true? Latest rumors are that Jiffy lube Live has changed their policy and is going to allow tailgating again this year.

Screw Jiffy Lube. I won't lift my liftime ban of the place.

Yeah, screw them. Putting that place there should be criminal. Screws traffic every time.

Great , I can again look forward to walking through vomit in the parking lot.

What a lube job that place is! $13 for a fuckin' 24 oz beer?! Are you fuckin' kiddin' me?!?!?!?!

Nissan Pavilion sucks. Overpriced beers, fucking pat downs going in.

Even before the "ban", a buddy of mine and I got threatened by some parking lot "professional" because we were finishing a couple beers in an empty parking lot (it was raining a bit). It wasn't like we were doing keg stands with 50 other rowdy people.

Venues like this take all the fun out of a show. First you get raped by Ticketmaster, then you pay a bunch more to park, then you get shit for having a couple beers in the parking lot, go to the gate for your pat down and if you want another brew, break out the platinum card. Unless they reincarnate John Bonham and get Led Zepp back together, it just isn't worth it.

http://www.livenation.com/Jiffy-Lube-Live-tickets-Bristow/venue/172099

According to their website (far down, bottom right) consumption of alcohol in the parking lot is not permitted. The season hasn't started yet so, keep an eye on changes.

Honestly, I doubt things will change. Many fans (myself included) don't like it but, there's clearly enough people still paying to see shows there (myself excluded) that it's not hurting business. If anything by restricting consumption in the parking lot, their $13 beer sales are likely off the chain since it's a captive audience.

NissanPavilion Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Honestly, I doubt things will change. Many fans
> (myself included) don't like it but, there's
> clearly enough people still paying to see shows
> there (myself excluded) that it's not hurting
> business. If anything by restricting consumption
> in the parking lot, their $13 beer sales are
> likely off the chain since it's a captive
> audience.

Clearly you do not see this as it is. That is ok, you are an anonymous poster.

Cellar Door Pavilion AKA Nissan Pavilion AKA Jiffy Lube Live is budgeted for 26 shows per season. How many did they have last year? The year before that? The year before that? The numbers 14 through 16 come to mind.

There are reasons for this. Wolf Trap and Merriweather get some shows that could go to Nissan but that is clearly not the reason. The reason is the acts that can sell 20,000 tickets are getting older, there are fewer of them still touring regularly, and there are not enough of them coming up the ranks to fill the void.

JLL has one strategy and it is not to sell more tickets cause they "allow" tailgating. It it to maximize revenue per fanny in the seat. Aerosmith and Jimmy Buffett fans will still go to the shows tailgating or not. This has not been proven otherwise. So get them to buy more beer, hot dogs and tee shirts while inside, and more service charges on the tickets. They will do this until the market drops.

It is their only hope of survival.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

My friend works there. There is no ban, it is that the parking lot is not part of the licensed premise for alcohol. I dont think JLL wants anyone drinking unless they are buying overpriced beer from them.

http://www.wtop.com/?sid=2693442&nid=120

I stand corrected. The ban on tailgating has indeed been lifted! I agree with not letting people into the parking lots who don't have tickets but I do not agree with the policy of no tents or canopies.

NissanPavilion Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.wtop.com/?sid=2693442&nid=120
>
> I stand corrected. The ban on tailgating has
> indeed been lifted! I agree with not letting
> people into the parking lots who don't have
> tickets but I do not agree with the policy of no
> tents or canopies.


JLL clearly could read the writing on the wall for the upcoming year - low ticket sales because of this bullshit.

__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NissanPavilion Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > Honestly, I doubt things will change. Many fans
> > (myself included) don't like it but, there's
> > clearly enough people still paying to see shows
> > there (myself excluded) that it's not hurting
> > business. If anything by restricting
> consumption
> > in the parking lot, their $13 beer sales are
> > likely off the chain since it's a captive
> > audience.
>
> Clearly you do not see this as it is. That is ok,
> you are an anonymous poster.
>
> Cellar Door Pavilion AKA Nissan Pavilion AKA Jiffy
> Lube Live is budgeted for 26 shows per season. How
> many did they have last year? The year before
> that? The year before that? The numbers 14 through
> 16 come to mind.
>
> There are reasons for this. Wolf Trap and
> Merriweather get some shows that could go to
> Nissan but that is clearly not the reason. The
> reason is the acts that can sell 20,000 tickets
> are getting older, there are fewer of them still
> touring regularly, and there are not enough of
> them coming up the ranks to fill the void.
>
> JLL has one strategy and it is not to sell more
> tickets cause they "allow" tailgating. It it to
> maximize revenue per fanny in the seat. Aerosmith
> and Jimmy Buffett fans will still go to the shows
> tailgating or not. This has not been proven
> otherwise. So get them to buy more beer, hot dogs
> and tee shirts while inside, and more service
> charges on the tickets. They will do this until
> the market drops.
>
> It is their only hope of survival.

Ah yes, the mighty REGISTERED Radiophile is once again shitting on someone's existance on the shear basis of being an unregistered user.

The validity of one's OPINION is unrelated to whether they are registered or not. We can disagree, Radiophile without being disagreeable, right?

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> JLL has one strategy and it is not to sell more
> tickets cause they "allow" tailgating. It it to
> maximize revenue per fanny in the seat. Aerosmith
> and Jimmy Buffett fans will still go to the shows
> tailgating or not. This has not been proven
> otherwise. So get them to buy more beer, hot dogs
> and tee shirts while inside, and more service
> charges on the tickets. They will do this until
> the market drops.


Everyone knows this was the reason. It was all about money inside the gates, because if they were truly concerned about drinking and driving (as the reason they gave), they'd make their venue dry. Either go dry inside and outside, or go dry inside and allow tailgaters to sober up during the shows. But they took the worst option as far as drinking and driving - by essentially allowing people pound more beer in a shorter time period. But I guess that's OK as long as it helps the bottom line.

FUCK JLL.

EDIT: They pulled this no tailgating crap AFTER the season passes and some shows were sold, so people couldn't get refunds. This year they can't blindside people like that so is it any wonder they reversed course? Nope.

__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2012 08:57PM by Warhawk.

So JifFy Lube now allows tailgating, but doesn't allow drinking in the parking lots? FU Jiffy Lube! My boycott continues.

It's against state law to drink in a parking lot you fucking retard

Bobz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's against state law to drink in a parking lot
> you fucking retard

Wow. First of all you are incorrect. It's called private property. Secondly, calling someone else a retard when your point is incorrect has to be humiliating.

Have a nice day!

This place still sucks. Tailgating will mean more PWC PD on site, and at least 2 DUI checkpoints....in the area for all your hip concert events.

The lots themselves are on public property you dipshit.

Trying to act like you know it all when you are probably getting rammed in the ass has to be humiliating.

Bobz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The lots themselves are on public property you
> dipshit.

Source? I don't see any notes that this Live Nation property is being serviced by land for parking ceded to them by the county or other public entity. Plus how could they ban a practice on public property? That would be some municipality's call, not Live Nation's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/05/2012 01:45PM by justsayin.

> Bobz Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> It's against state law to drink in a parking lot

No, it certainly is not. This statement is 100% false.

> Bobz Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> The lots themselves are on public property you dipshit.

Wrong again. You're on a roll! Good thing you're anonymous huh? That must make these public displays of ignorance less painful.

Bobz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's against state law to drink in a parking lot
> you fucking retard


Bobz - you are an absolute idiot.

How many patrons will get run over by drunk drivers like before? Given the nightmarish traffic problem out there and the crazy drunkenness, I will NEVER EVER return to Jiffy Lube for a concert.

Are you kidding me? 66 and the new intersections at Gainsville with booze as part of the deal. Hell no, staying far far away from this nightmare.

Were people really getting run over by drunks? How often did that happen? To how many people? Concert goers are still going to get drunk, they just have to pay a lot more to do it.

In all honesty, I couldn't care less. I avoid that place like the plague and will never attend a concert there.

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bobz Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It's against state law to drink in a parking
> lot
> > you fucking retard
>
> Wow. First of all you are incorrect. It's called
> private property. Secondly, calling someone else a
> retard when your point is incorrect has to be
> humiliating.
>
> Have a nice day!


The law of the land is the law of the land - private or public property.

As a general rule of thumb, does the public have access to the area without having to go past a locked door/doorman/buzzer or some other shall we call call it blocking agent? No they do not to get in the parking lot. So it is public and drinking in public is against the law without special permits etc.

Around JLL is a big fence. You go through a gate and have to have a ticket. Once you enter there then it becomes "private property" for all intents and purposes.

Think of it this way. You have a fenced in backyard with a closed gate. You can go in your back yard and drink beer all you want. You can not sit in your unfenced front yard and drink beer - that is drinking in public and against the law.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The law of the land is the law of the land -
> private or public property.

Not so. Public alcohol intoxication is not the same as private alcohol intoxication. Just as drinking in public is not the same as drinking on private property.

> As a general rule of thumb, does the public have
> access to the area without having to go past a
> locked door/doorman/buzzer or some other shall we
> call call it blocking agent? No they do not to get
> in the parking lot. So it is public and drinking
> in public is against the law without special
> permits etc.
>
> Around JLL is a big fence. You go through a gate
> and have to have a ticket. Once you enter there
> then it becomes "private property" for all intents
> and purposes.
>
> Think of it this way. You have a fenced in
> backyard with a closed gate. You can go in your
> back yard and drink beer all you want. You can not
> sit in your unfenced front yard and drink beer -
> that is drinking in public and against the law.

The parking lot for JLL is owned by cellar door, not by the state or the county. It is private property. For example, if you were to go there during off hours you could be arrested for trespassing. As such, they could allow those using their property to bring and consume alcoholic beverages if they so choose. In this case, they have chosen not to. Access is controlled by parking attendants during concerts.

Also, I sit in my front yard and drink beer all the time!!! In addition, I invite others to come and join me!!! No fence! No guard or door to get in! No permit required! And you know what? It’s perfectly legal because it’s private property. Please, call the cops, I could use a good laugh.

I live about 2 miles from JLL and hate concert days. All you fucking drunks stay as far from there as possible. Bad enough you clog up the roadways but driving drunk afterwards is even worse. Go to Wolftrap or verizon or Merriweather Post but stay off of PW roads, losers!

Local Yokel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I live about 2 miles from JLL and hate concert
> days. All you fucking drunks stay as far from
> there as possible. Bad enough you clog up the
> roadways but driving drunk afterwards is even
> worse. Go to Wolftrap or verizon or Merriweather
> Post but stay off of PW roads, losers!


That's all you see on Prince William County roads...losers. (and hispanics)

Local Yokel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Go to Wolftrap or verizon or Merriweather
> Post but stay off of PW roads, losers!

And if you DO go to JLL, do NOT stop by a fast food joint or other restaurant within the PW county lines and support jobs for their residents.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And if you DO go to JLL, do NOT stop by a fast
> food joint or other restaurant within the PW
> county lines and support jobs for their residents.

That's ok. We've already exported most of our illegals to
Fairfax where your mommies and daddies can spend their tax
dollars to educate them! You're more likely to find a white
kid working fast food in PWC than in FFX these days!
You can thank dear ol' Gerry Connelly for creating such a
welcoming county!

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The law of the land is the law of the land -
> > private or public property.
>
> Not so. Public alcohol intoxication is not the
> same as private alcohol intoxication. Just as
> drinking in public is not the same as drinking on
> private property.
>
> > As a general rule of thumb, does the public
> have
> > access to the area without having to go past a
> > locked door/doorman/buzzer or some other shall
> we
> > call call it blocking agent? No they do not to
> get
> > in the parking lot. So it is public and
> drinking
> > in public is against the law without special
> > permits etc.
> >
> > Around JLL is a big fence. You go through a
> gate
> > and have to have a ticket. Once you enter there
> > then it becomes "private property" for all
> intents
> > and purposes.
> >
> > Think of it this way. You have a fenced in
> > backyard with a closed gate. You can go in your
> > back yard and drink beer all you want. You can
> not
> > sit in your unfenced front yard and drink beer
> -
> > that is drinking in public and against the law.
>
> The parking lot for JLL is owned by cellar door,
> not by the state or the county. It is private
> property. For example, if you were to go there
> during off hours you could be arrested for
> trespassing. As such, they could allow those using
> their property to bring and consume alcoholic
> beverages if they so choose. In this case, they
> have chosen not to. Access is controlled by
> parking attendants during concerts.
>
> Also, I sit in my front yard and drink beer all
> the time!!! In addition, I invite others to come
> and join me!!! No fence! No guard or door to get
> in! No permit required! And you know what? It’s
> perfectly legal because it’s private property.
> Please, call the cops, I could use a good laugh.

Access is NOT controlled by the parking attendants. They do not control access, they guide traffic. The moron at the gate who takes your ticket controls access.

Ok you nimrod. It is not owned by Cellar Door, it is owned by Live Nation. Cellar Door Productions ceased operations many years ago.

ANONYMOUS POSTERS SUCK AND SPREAD MIS-INFORMATION. I tried to explain it to you so that your minuscule turd for a brain could understand it. Here is the code from the VA law and you can read it, decipher it, and you will find I am right. You fart breath.


"Public place" means any place, building, or conveyance to which the public has, or is permitted to have, access, including restaurants, soda fountains, hotel dining areas, lobbies and corridors of hotels, and any park, place of public resort or amusement, highway, street, lane, or sidewalk adjoining any highway, street, or lane.

The term shall not include (i) hotel or restaurant dining areas or ballrooms while in use for private meetings or private parties limited in attendance to members and guests of a particular group, association or organization; (ii) restaurants licensed by the Board in office buildings or industrial or similar facilities while such restaurant is closed to the public and in use for private meetings or parties limited in attendance to employees and nonpaying guests of the owner or a lessee of all or part of such building or facility; (iii) offices, office buildings or industrial facilities while closed to the public and in use for private meetings or parties limited in attendance to employees and nonpaying guests of the owner or a lessee of all or part of such building or facility; or (iv) private recreational or chartered boats which are not licensed by the Board and on which alcoholic beverages are not sold.


Do you have a fence in your front yard you dick sucker? No? Can someone just pretty much wander on to your front yard without any barrier to entry - besides your ugly face? Yes? Then you are breaking the law by drinking a cold one there.


A Code § 4.1-308 (2001 through Reg Session)
4.1-308. Drinking alcoholic beverages, or offering to another, in public place; penalty; exceptions.
A. If any person takes a drink of alcoholic beverages or offers a drink thereof to another, whether accepted or not, AT OR IN ANY PUBLIC PLACE (see above for definition of public place you limp dick), he shall be guilty of a Class 4 misdemeanor.
B. This section shall not prevent any person from drinking alcoholic beverages or offering a drink thereof to another in any rooms or areas approved by the Board in a licensed establishment, provided such establishment or the person who operates the same is licensed to sell alcoholic beverages at retail for on-premises consumption and the alcoholic beverages drunk or offered were purchased therein.
C. This section shall not prevent any person from drinking alcoholic beverages or offering a drink thereof to another in any room or area approved by the Board at an event for which a banquet license or mixed beverage special events license has been granted. Nor shall this section prevent, upon authorization of the licensee, any person from drinking his own lawfully acquired alcoholic beverages or offering a drink thereof to another in approved areas and locations at events for which a coliseum or stadium license has been granted.
D. This section shall not prevent any person from drinking alcoholic beverages or offering a drink thereof to another on a chartered boat being used for the transportation of passengers for compensation which is not licensed by the Board and which does not sell alcoholic beverages.
(Code 1950, 4-78; 1956, c. 23; 1972, c. 143; 1977, c. 439; 1979, c. 622; 1986, c. 113; 1988, c. 893; 1989, c. 42; 1990, c. 932; 1993, c. 866.)


I am right, you are wrong

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/05/2012 07:22PM by Radiophile.

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> The parking lot for JLL is owned by cellar door,
> not by the state or the county. It is private
> property. For example, if you were to go there
> during off hours you could be arrested for
> trespassing. As such, they could allow those using
> their property to bring and consume alcoholic
> beverages if they so choose. In this case, they
> have chosen not to. Access is controlled by
> parking attendants during concerts.
>
> Also, I sit in my front yard and drink beer all
> the time!!! In addition, I invite others to come
> and join me!!! No fence! No guard or door to get
> in! No permit required! And you know what? It’s
> perfectly legal because it’s private property.
> Please, call the cops, I could use a good laugh.


Seriously, you are a moron.Do you have any reading comprehension skills? Does your brain process information in a logical fashion?

You are so full of yourself "Please call the cops, I could use a good laugh". I mean you are really really stupid. To be ignorant is curable. Stupidity is forever. And you are stupid.

You have been clearly shown to be amazingly wrong in your analysis of the situation. And if the cops ever do give you a ticket for having a cold one in your front yard, let me know. I want to be there when you explain to the judge private versus public space. I will laugh as the judge bitch slaps you.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/05/2012 07:46PM by Radiophile.

NissanPavilion Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Ah yes, the mighty REGISTERED Radiophile is once
> again shitting on someone's existance on the shear
> basis of being an unregistered user.
>
> The validity of one's OPINION is unrelated to
> whether they are registered or not. We can
> disagree, Radiophile without being disagreeable,
> right?


As long as you are not an idiot.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

The JLL parking lot is closed to the public for events, it is only open to the limited group of paying customers. JLL said they will enforce limitation of acces to ticket holders. No one of legal drinking age is going to be arrested there unless they are being a nuisance.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am right, you are wrong

We could go back and forth on this all day because there are numerous factors that go into defining what is or is not a “public” or “private” place. It is true that your yard, or front porch may be a public place if you do not control access to it. If you allow anyone to enter, then it could be considered a public place. For example if you have a party on your front lawn and just let anyone and everyone come over, it could be considered a public place. Most people, do not do this. Perhpas you're not old enough to own a home so you're unaware of the fact.

However, most county, state, and community laws throughout the country state that if you are drinking on your own property (read “private”), you are not violating any law. Now if you are naked, driving a car, under 21 (varies by jurisdiction), or being disorderly “in view of the public”, then yes, that is illegal. Typically, public intoxication is defined not by the level of alcohol in the blood stream but rather ones behavior. But I digress…

The fact of the matter is, tailgating is a time honored tradition in parking lots all over the country. What makes it possible more than anything, is private property laws.

Anyway, you've proven yourself to be an immature name calling jerk so enjoy thinking you are right. I'll enjoy legally drinking beer on my private property.

The management and leadership of Jiffy Lube Live is a group of idiots. They should all be fired.

They made the earlier decision to ban tailgating only because of MONEY. They wanted to make all their patrons buy their outrageous $11 beers at their own insdie the gate concession stands.

The decision to undo the tailgating ban is due to MONEY. Concert attendance is down. Plus thousands of Buffet fans returned their tickets because of the ban. So now JLL is again going to allow tailgating.

For decades Wolf Trap has allowed drinking by adults with hardly any problems (and that is a friggin public National Park!).

Look put it in a solid colored cup, don't overindulge, have a designated driver, and have fun. You won't be hassled or have a problem. Cheers!

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I am right, you are wrong
>
> We could go back and forth on this all day because
> there are numerous factors that go into defining
> what is or is not a “public” or “private”
> place.

Yes and I have given you exactly what they are. All of them as it pertains to alcohol consumption.


> It is true that your yard, or front porch
> may be a public place if you do not control access
> to it. If you allow anyone to enter, then it could
> be considered a public place. For example if you
> have a party on your front lawn and just let
> anyone and everyone come over, it could be
> considered a public place.

It is. I have proven that by quoting the law in the Commonwealth in VA

> Most people, do not do
> this. Perhpas you're not old enough to own a home
> so you're unaware of the fact.

Most people do not video teenagers getting undressed at a pool party. But some do, that is why there are laws about it.

> However, most county, state, and community laws throughout the country state
> that if you are drinking on your own property (read “private”), you are not
> violating any law.

The law of the land is the law of the land. Find me one law that spells out EXACTLY you are allowed to consume alcohol at a public space....Just one.

I found you the law to prove you are a shit for brains. Now you find me one that proves you are not. Do not just say "most". Just because you believe something doesn't make it true. For instance, I believed you were a normal person with average intelligence until this thread. Now I know you have shit for brains. Now I stand corrected because all factual evidence proves that.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It is. I have proven that by quoting the law in
> the Commonwealth in VA


My yard is not a public place. Neither is a privately owned parking lot.


> Most people do not video teenagers getting
> undressed at a pool party. But some do, that is
> why there are laws about it.


Exactly my point. Your yard CAN be considered public property in some cases, according to the law. Most of the time however, it is not.


> The law of the land is the law of the land. Find
> me one law that spells out EXACTLY you are allowed
> to consume alcohol at a public space....Just one.


I'm not debating that drinking in public is legal in Virginia.


Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Public place" means any place, building, or
> conveyance to which the public has, or is
> permitted to have, access, including restaurants,
> soda fountains, hotel dining areas, lobbies and
> corridors of hotels, and any park, place of public
> resort or amusement, highway, street, lane, or
> sidewalk adjoining any highway, street, or lane.


You are not "permitted to have access" to my property unless I grant it. Likewise, you are not permitted in the JLL parking lot unless you have a ticket to the event. How that access is enforced, is up to the property owner.


Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Seriously, you are a moron.Do you have any reading
> comprehension skills? Does your brain process
> information in a logical fashion?
>
> You are so full of yourself "Please call the cops,
> I could use a good laugh". I mean you are really
> really stupid. To be ignorant is curable.
> Stupidity is forever. And you are stupid.
>
> You have been clearly shown to be amazingly wrong
> in your analysis of the situation. And if the cops
> ever do give you a ticket for having a cold one in
> your front yard, let me know. I want to be there
> when you explain to the judge private versus
> public space. I will laugh as the judge bitch
> slaps you.


I worked at a company back in the 90s that would set up beer kegs in the company parking lot once a month on Friday afternoons so the employees could get together for a few drinks. The lot was right on a public road. No permit. Didn't need one. Private property. Not selling the alcohol.


I once had the cops called to my house one 4th of July because we were lighting off fireworks at a late hour. Everyone was drinking in the front yard. No one got arrested for drinking in public because we weren't in public, we were on my (private) property.


While you may have thought you were enlightening everyone with your back yard vs front yard explanation of how you interpret public vs private, your scenario was inaccurate and overly simplistic.


Perhaps I could be considered "full of myself" as you say. Apparently, you seem to think you're pretty cool. The problem is, you're not. Insulting others with terms like "limp dick, dick sucker, fart breath, turd brain" etc, in an effort to express your point may be cool to 12 year olds, maybe. To the rest of us, it shows a remarkable lack of maturity, class, and deeply seeded feelings of inadequacy. Questioning my reading comprehension because I disagree with you? How original. Anyone who feels the need to express themselves as you have isn't cool (or very bright) in my book. Sorry.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/05/2012 11:15PM by More Complete.

More Complete -

He is right. You can be arrested for drinking in your front yard. You can even be arrested for drinking in your garage. Of course this rarely ever happens, but you can indeed be arrested for that. That is drinking in public, even if you are on your own property.

The one thing I have learned from this thread is I'd much rather tailgate with More Complete than with Radiophile. In fact if Radiophile is anywhere on the property I think the fun would be absolutely sucked out of the entire venue.

lscmlt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> More Complete -
>
> He is right. You can be arrested for drinking in
> your front yard. You can even be arrested for
> drinking in your garage. Of course this rarely
> ever happens, but you can indeed be arrested for
> that. That is drinking in public, even if you are
> on your own property.


Not so. I live in a gated community. I have 5 acres surrounded by forest. My neighbors can't see my house or yard. Front or back. Perhaps in the tiny little neighborhoods you and Radiophile live in you have a point, more so for condos and apartments. However, it's simply not as black and white as "your front yard is public property". The reason people rarley are arrested for it is because any lawyer worth his salt (don't hire radiophile) could argue that you were on your own private property, not in public and it would be a waste of resources.


justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The one thing I have learned from this thread is
> I'd much rather tailgate with More Complete than
> with Radiophile.


Thanks man. You're all right.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2012 08:07AM by More Complete.

Mre Complete Wrote

>> My yard is not a public place. Neither is a privately owned parking lot.

Yes it is. Read the definition of a public space. "Public place" means ANY PLACE, building, or conveyance TO WHICH THE PUBLIC HAS, or is permitted to have, access...
Can someone stumble onto your front yard? If so then it is a public space. Can someone drive to the parking lot of Nissan and park without going through security and presenting a ticket? If yes then it is a public space according to the law.



Exactly my point. Your yard CAN be considered public property in some cases, according to the law. Most of the time however, it is not.

You are are an idiot. There is a distinct difference between public space, private space, public property and private property. For one, private property or not has no bearing on the alcohol consumption laws. Only public and private SPACES do. You can argue "property" all you want, but it is irrelevant.


>> You are not "permitted to have access" to my property unless I grant it.

Who cares if I am permitted to or not? Can I walk on your property without going through a locked gate, doorman, or some other barrier? If I can just walk on it it is a public space. The law makes no distinction. A building lobby is a public space if anyone can just walk in, and so is your front yard.

>> Likewise, you are not permitted in the JLL parking lot unless you have a ticket >> to the event. How that access is enforced, is up to the property owner.

If you enter JLL parking lot without a ticket do they throw you in JLL Live jail? Do they check everyone's ticket? Is there a Virginia law that would prevent you entering the parking lot without a ticket? You are babbling nonsense.

>> I worked at a company back in the 90s that would set up beer kegs in the
>> company parking lot once a month on Friday afternoons so the employees could
>> get together for a few drinks. The lot was right on a public road. No permit. >> Didn't need one. Private property. Not selling the alcohol.

This has nothing to do with anything. And technically, without a permit or something if anyone could wander on that space the law would be broken.


>> I once had the cops called to my house one 4th of July because we were lighting >> off fireworks at a late hour. Everyone was drinking in the front yard. No one >> got arrested for drinking in public because we weren't in public, we were on my >> (private) property.

I was on a public space yesterday and the sign said 55 miles per hour. I drove 70 and past a cop and was not arrested. So therefore....


>> While you may have thought you were enlightening everyone with your back yard >>vs front yard explanation of how you interpret public vs private, your scenario >>was inaccurate and overly simplistic.

It was VERY accurate. I am just bewildered that you are too stupid to comprehend it.

Here is some simplistic definitions for you since you have problems comprehending.

Public Space - We discussed this above.
Private Space - NOT a public space
Public Property - Owned/maintained by Federal, State or local government
Private Property - NOT owned by the above

Private versus Public property has no relevance in this issue. Zero, nada, zilch. Private versus public space does.

>> Questioning my reading comprehension because I disagree with you?

No I am questioning your reading comprehension skills cause you have very little ability to process information.


>> The reason people rarley are arrested for it is because any lawyer worth his
>> salt (don't hire radiophile) could argue that you were on your own private
>> property, not in public and it would be a waste of resources.

Anyone who has taken a business law course or even a real estate course know the difference between Public Space and Private Space and knows Public Property and Private Property HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

And any lawyer who argued you were not in public when you were according to the legal definition above deserves you for a client.

Any legal citations you can provide would be helpful. But you cant. Cause you are an idiot.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2012 08:52AM by Radiophile.

lscmlt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> More Complete -
>
> He is right. You can be arrested for drinking in
> your front yard. You can even be arrested for
> drinking in your garage. Of course this rarely
> ever happens, but you can indeed be arrested for
> that. That is drinking in public, even if you are
> on your own property.


Thank you.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lscmlt Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > More Complete -
> >
> > He is right. You can be arrested for drinking
> in
> > your front yard. You can even be arrested for
> > drinking in your garage. Of course this rarely
> > ever happens, but you can indeed be arrested
> for
> > that. That is drinking in public, even if you
> are
> > on your own property.
>
>
> Not so. I live in a gated community. I have 5
> acres surrounded by forest. My neighbors can't see
> my house or yard. Front or back.


How many times did I clarify that front yard means no fence, no gate and the general public could just wander on your property without a doorman, buzzer or some other barrier?

If you are in a gated community with 5 acres around you, that is probably not a public space. Idiot.


> Perhaps in the
> tiny little neighborhoods you and Radiophile live
> in you have a point, more so for condos and
> apartments.

Still do not get the concept of public versus private space, do you?

> However, it's simply not as black and
> white as "your front yard is public property".

That is why I clarified it in my VERY FIRST post by saying if there are no barriers, fence, gate, doorman, buzzer, etc. JEEESH! And I said public SPACE, not property. You need to understand those meanings.

The
> reason people rarley are arrested for it is
> because any lawyer worth his salt (don't hire
> radiophile) could argue that you were on your own
> private property, not in public and it would be a
> waste of resources.
>


>> The reason people rarley are arrested for it is because any lawyer worth his
>> salt (don't hire radiophile) could argue that you were on your own private
>> property, not in public and it would be a waste of resources.

Anyone who has taken a business law course or even a real estate course know the difference between Public Space and Private Space and knows Public Property and Private Property HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

And any lawyer who argued you were not in public when you were according to the legal definition above deserves you for a client.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2012 09:15AM by Radiophile.

Will he get it?

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2012 09:11AM by Radiophile.

And I apologize for a very very slight technicality. Some states use "Public space" or "Public spaces" in their laws. Evidently, Virginia uses "Public place" or "Public places". I have always preferred the term "spaces" and that is why I used it. But for the case of this argument, the words are indeed interchangeable.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2012 09:22AM by Radiophile.

These walls of rambling text brought to you by Radiophile, a poster who claimed real estate taxes are invisible to people because for some they are included in their mortgage payment to the bank, as well as posted a new thread to this forum because he wanted to let everyone know about Google giving free broadband to everyone (a years-old April Fool's joke).

Radiophile you can solve the argument by posting links to three news articles where a person sitting on their front porch or in their yard was arrested for drinking in Virginia but not for any other reason (i.e. neighbors called because of noise or other disturbance).

If you can't do that your endless yada yada is as useless and pointless as the rest of your opinions. If you can do that then I will post back that you were right and I stand corrected.

Getting back to the subject, Jiffy Lube Live took a pass last year on a Miranda Cosgrove concert. Wolf Trap ended up booking her.

Why did JLL take a pass? My guess is the 97% tween audience wouldn't be buying $13.00 beers, so the extra money wouldn't be there.

They know where their profit centers are.


Now, a police officer most likely will not arrest you for sitting in your front yard drinking a beer. However, if you are shouting obsenities at the same time, they most likely will arrest you, and tack on the charge of drinking in public.

Get it?

Oh look, Radiophile logged in with his other registered ID. Gave up I guess.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes it is. Read the definition of a public space.
> "Public place" means ANY PLACE, building, or
> conveyance TO WHICH THE PUBLIC HAS, or is
> permitted to have , access...
> Can someone stumble onto your front yard? If so
> then it is a public space.

Read the bold. Go stand in your neighbors front yard or better yet their open garage. When they exercise their right to have you removed from their property by the police you can argue it’s public until your blue in the face. You will be will still be arrested.

> Can someone drive to
> the parking lot of Nissan and park without going
> through security and presenting a ticket? If yes
> then it is a public space according to the law.

Just because you can walk onto a space or property does not mean you are legally allowed to do so. Are you familiar with the term “trespassing”?

> Who cares if I am permitted to or not?

The law does.

> This has nothing to do with anything. And
> technically, without a permit or something if
> anyone could wander on that space the law would be
> broken.

It is relevant to the conversation. “Anyone” who walked into the parking lot could legally be asked to leave the premises on the grounds that it is not public property.

> It was VERY accurate. I am just bewildered that
> you are too stupid to comprehend it.
>
> Here is some simplistic definitions for you since
> you have problems comprehending.
>
> Public Space - We discussed this above.
> Private Space - NOT a public space
> Public Property - Owned/maintained by Federal,
> State or local government
> Private Property - NOT owned by the above

Your definitions are as simplistic and inaccurate as your backyard front yard analogy. If I own land, say a farm, it is owned by me, not by a government entity, yet it is still private property/space/place/whatever and different laws may or may not apply. For example I can drive an unregistered vehicle on said property without a license place.

> No I am questioning your reading comprehension
> skills cause you have very little ability to
> process information.

Obviously I comprehend the language. You are questioning my “skills” as you put it because I disagree with your interpretation of public vs private property.

> Anyone who has taken a business law course or even
> a real estate course know the difference between
> Public Space and Private Space and knows Public
> Property and Private Property HAVE ABSOLUTELY
> NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

While I’ve taken more law courses then I care to discuss, you don’t need a law degree to know this… It is against the law to drink in public in Virginia. JLL can allow people to drink in their parking lot if they so choose because the lot is private. Same as tailgating in parking lots all over the country.

> Bobz Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> It's against state law to drink in a parking lot
> you fucking retard

This is the statement I originally took issue with. It’s obviously incorrect. You’ve been going in circles trying to defend it and in my opinion have done a very poor job. See the following quote for an example.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The law of the land is the law of the land -
> private or public property.

This statement is not necessarily correct, even by your own explanations later in the thread. For example, it is legal in some states for persons under 21 to drink on private property if an adult is present, they cannot in public. In some cases you can shoot guns on private property, you cannot in public or on someone else’s land without permission. The variance of public or private determine whether a law is being broken.

> Idiot.

You really like this word huh? I'm not concerned with your opinion of me. I'm sure there are many things we can agree on, this just isn't one of them. I certainly didn't intend to start a pissing contest or invite your hot headed insults and don't care to debate the point any further so on that front, you win. Have a good one man (I use that term loosely ;-)).

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes it is. Read the definition of a public space.
> "Public place" means ANY PLACE, building, or
> conveyance TO WHICH THE PUBLIC HAS, or is
> permitted to have , access...
> Can someone stumble onto your front yard? If so
> then it is a public space.

> Read the bold. Go stand in your neighbors front yard or better yet their open
> garage. When they exercise their right to have you removed from their property by > the police you can argue it’s public until your blue in the face. You will be will > still be arrested.

UMMMM this is so moronic, I don't know where to begin. You claim to live on 5 acres in a gates community yet you do not have the reading comprehension of a fourth grader.


"TO WHICH THE PUBLIC HAS, OR is permitted to have , access..

Do you know the meaning of the word "or"?. And again, you do not understand the difference between public places (spaces) and public property. Places has everything to do with this argument. Property has NOTHING to do with this argument.


Then you said "Just because you can walk onto a space or property does not mean you are legally allowed to do so. Are you familiar with the term “trespassing”? "

Did I ever say you were?

Then you said "
It is relevant to the conversation. “Anyone” who walked into the parking lot could legally be asked to leave the premises on the grounds that it is not public property." Yes that is true, you could be asked to leave. So what? It is not relevant to this argument.

Then you said "Your definitions are as simplistic and inaccurate as your backyard front yard analogy. If I own land, say a farm, it is owned by me, not by a government entity, yet it is still private property/space/place/whatever and different laws may or may not apply. For example I can drive an unregistered vehicle on said property without a license place."

No, the Commonwealth of VA requires license plates etc. There are few exceptions for farm use vehicles, but buy and large you start driving your unregistered corvette around your 5 acre lot you are probably breaking the law.


Then being the brain trust you are you said "Obviously I comprehend the language. You are questioning my “skills” as you put it because I disagree with your interpretation of public vs private property"

I never debated PROPERTY. I debated "spaces" or places. Property and land ownership has NOTHING to do with this.

Then this genius said "While I’ve taken more law courses then I care to discuss, you don’t need a law degree to know this… It is against the law to drink in public in Virginia. JLL can allow people to drink in their parking lot if they so choose because the lot is private. Same as tailgating in parking lots all over the country."

The lot is NOT private, Anyone can drive on it unrestricted even if they are trespassing. It doesn't matter. Once they tear your ticket and you are inside the gate you are no longer on a public space or place and a different set of rules apply.

And the law of the land is the law of the law of the land. If you are in Va, you are subject to VA and Federal laws, statutes, regulations etc. You go to Kentucky, you are subject to Kentucky laws as well as the federal ones above.


Learn to read. You just might learn something .

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I never debated PROPERTY. I debated "spaces" or
> places. Property and land ownership has NOTHING to
> do with this.

Yes it does and yes you did.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

The law of the land is the law of the land – private or public property.


Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>Once you enter there then it becomes "private property"


Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No, the Commonwealth of VA requires license plates
> etc. There are few exceptions for farm use
> vehicles, but buy and large you start driving your
> unregistered corvette around your 5 acre lot you
> are probably breaking the law.

Probably huh? Is that a technical term? Lol. You’re really reaching. Notice you didn’t care to address the underage drinking or gun shooting private/public examples. Please, don’t bother.

> Learn to read. You just might learn something .

You should heed your own advice. Have a weekend. ;)

I stand by EVERYTHING I said 100%. I told the truth. I tried to explain the law is simple then legalese terms. You do not even understand the meaning of the word "or" .

Just another anonymous poster spreading mis-information.

I have found too many inaccuracies in your post to count. The number 1 being you do still do not understand Public Places (spaces) versus private spaces.

Second, the meaning of the word "or"

Third. the law of the land. If you are in Virginia you are subject to VA laws. If in Kentucky, their laws. Just because they are different.....

you are a moron but what should I expect. Just tell me, where did you take these law courses that did not teach you "or" both items must be satisfied?

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

Radiophile's style of arguing sounds a lot like the homeless posters in the Lamb Center thread.

Blessed are the murderous.

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Radiophile's style of arguing sounds a lot like
> the homeless posters in the Lamb Center thread.


There is no reasoning with that guy; although, you are responsible for what you do in public view on your private property ( sex, nudity, drugs, etc.), no cop in any state will arrest you for drinking a beer on your front porch (regardless if there is a fence, gate, moat, etc.).

Now, if they are called to your residence and you are in your yard acting like a fool; they can give you a drunk and disorderly or disturbing the peace. Plus, once you are off your property, they can stick you with a drunk in public.

Oh, and your car isn't private property; as a passenger, you can get a drunk in public, regardless of whether you are inside of the car or out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/07/2012 12:03AM by 12ozProphet.

12ozProphet Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Radiophile's style of arguing sounds a lot like
> > the homeless posters in the Lamb Center thread.
>
>
> There is no reasoning with that guy; although, you
> are responsible for what you do in public view on
> your private property ( sex, nudity, drugs, etc.),
> no cop in any state will arrest you for drinking a
> beer on your front porch (regardless if there is a
> fence, gate, moat, etc.).
>
> Now, if they are called to your residence and you
> are in your yard acting like a fool; they can give
> you a drunk and disorderly or disturbing the
> peace. Plus, once you are off your property, they
> can stick you with a drunk in public.
>
> Oh, and your car isn't private property; as a
> passenger, you can get a drunk in public,
> regardless of whether you are inside of the car or
> out.


Can you read?

I am so glad that you know for a fact that no cop in the state will arrest you for that (or give you a ticket) for committing a class 4 misdemeanor. That is why they have those laws on the books, so cops can not enforce them.

The point I was trying to make was that in a public place, drinking beer is illegal whether it is on "private property" or not. But i am so glad you are such an expert on it that you know such a law would never ever ever be enforced.


2841 FREDY 42 03/02/2011 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 2841 SALISBURY COURT CENTREVILLE, CENTREVILLE, VA
CABRERA VICTOR M 31 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE , ,
CABRERA VICTOR M 31 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE , ,
CABRERA VICTOR M 31 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE , ,
CABRERA VICTOR M 31 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE , ,
DAEGAL ANTHONY 30 10/01/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 5942 BROKEN ARROW DR, W, JACKSONVILLE, FL 32244
HILL TIMOTHY VINCENT 25 07/27/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 2919 WICKERSHAM WAY, T4, FALLS CHURCH, VA 22042
REDMAN JASMINE 20 06/28/2011 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 10102 GARRETT ST, VIENNA, VA 22181
REYES LUNA LUIS 23 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 2804 HOLLYWOOD, 204, FALLS CHURCH, VA 22043
REYES LUNA LUIS 23 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 2804 HOLLYWOOD, 204, FALLS CHURCH, VA 22043
REYES LUNA LUIS 23 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 2804 HOLLYWOOD, 204, FALLS CHURCH, VA 22043
REYES LUNA LUIS 23 03/28/2010 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 2804 HOLLYWOOD, 204, FALLS CHURCH, VA 22043
VASQUEZ APARICIO R 42 07/09/2011 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE 6018 VISTA DR, 301, FALLS CHURCH, VA 22041
WOOTEN JOSEPH BLAIR 49 09/06/2011 4.1-308 ALCOHOL: DRINKING/OFFER DRINK IN PUBLIC PLACE , ,

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

Arrest listings mean nothing. They don't tell the story of what happened, all of those could have been people that punched a kid with a lemonade stand, dragged a keg over, and handed beer samples out to people. That's why we need links to news stories, but mister "you can't read!" evidently has reading problems. Those don't support your "argument" at all you dolt.

Yeah, I went to a Creed concert (don't ask me why) at Jiffy Lube Live and it was one of the worst concerts I've ever been too. One of the problems I had with the show was: that they wouldn't let me go back out into the parking lot to get my drivers license (to pay for their 13 dollar beers). So, I had to put up with Creed Sober for the most part...horrible

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Arrest listings mean nothing. They don't tell the
> story of what happened, all of those could have
> been people that punched a kid with a lemonade
> stand, dragged a keg over, and handed beer samples
> out to people. That's why we need links to news
> stories, but mister "you can't read!" evidently
> has reading problems. Those don't support your
> "argument" at all you dolt.

I proved my point. Now it is your job to disprove it and your story about a lemonade stand does not cut it.


Who is going to publish a news story about some stupid person drinking a beer in a parking lot and getting a ticket? I have quoted the law. If you chose to live in your alternate universe, so be it.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I never debated PROPERTY. I debated "spaces" or
> > places. Property and land ownership has NOTHING
> to
> > do with this.
>
> Yes it does and yes you did.
>
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> The law of the land is the law of the land –
> private or public property.
>
>
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> >Once you enter there then it becomes "private
> property"
>
>
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > No, the Commonwealth of VA requires license
> plates
> > etc. There are few exceptions for farm use
> > vehicles, but buy and large you start driving
> your
> > unregistered corvette around your 5 acre lot
> you
> > are probably breaking the law.
>
> Probably huh? Is that a technical term? Lol.
> You’re really reaching. Notice you didn’t care
> to address the underage drinking or gun shooting
> private/public examples. Please, don’t bother.
>
> > Learn to read. You just might learn something .

I said "probably" cause I do not know all the details. But 95% chance you would be breaking the law.

How many time did I say your front yard without any gate, fence barrier etc and then you come back 10 posts later and say you live in a gated community.

I don't make shit up as I go along like you. I had one position, the correct one. I proved my position and you changed your story several times.

Now that you know the law, YOU call the police and ask them if it is against the law to drink a beer in your front yard (assuming you don't live in a gated community on 5 acres of land). I will laugh at you when they give you their response.
>
> You should heed your own advice. Have a weekend.
> ;)


I did address the underage drinking and shooting laws you dolt. I said when in Va you are subject to VA laws and when in Kentucky you are subject to their laws. And any federal laws win over them

The law of the land is the law of the land. You are even arguing THAT point?

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

From their website:

- The venue promises to work with police to enforce the ban on open containers. Underage drinking is, of course, forbidden.

See? Jiffy Lube Live can not ask the police to enforce THEIR POLICIES. They can only ask the police to enforce the law.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The JLL parking lot is closed to the public for
> events, it is only open to the limited group of
> paying customers. JLL said they will enforce
> limitation of acces to ticket holders. No one of
> legal drinking age is going to be arrested there
> unless they are being a nuisance.


This is the stupidest argument you have made so far. They do not limit access to "ticket holders".

1) Do they let on the parking lot buses and limos where the driver does not have a ticket? They do
2) Are parents allowed to drop off their kids? They are
3) Are persons allowed on the parking lot who are meeting their friend with the tickets? They are.
4) Can you drive on to the parking lot, park your car, and walk up to the box office and purchase a ticket? You can

And there are more than 20 other reasons to be on the parking lot without a ticket.


But since you claim JLL said "The JLL parking lot is closed to the public for
events, it is only open to the limited group of paying customers. JLL said they will enforce limitation of access to ticket holders."
I guess they will not have the box office open for day of show sales. And they are doing away with WILL CALL (damn cause I use will call all the time), and people who are on the guest list are out of luck because they are not paying - Jiffy Lube Live will not let them on the parking lot. I will take your word for this cause if you said it, it must be true.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/07/2012 03:56PM by Radiophile.

You are paying for a parking ticket to access the property. It is a portion of your per ticket price (another unfair thing -- each person pays for parking whether nor not there is between 1-6 people in your vehicle).

The property is not owned by any local, state or federal entity. It is privately owned land and you are on privately owned property when you are parked or standing on the land.

Legally astute Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are paying for a parking ticket to access the
> property. It is a portion of your per ticket
> price (another unfair thing -- each person pays
> for parking whether nor not there is between 1-6
> people in your vehicle).
>
> The property is not owned by any local, state or
> federal entity. It is privately owned land and
> you are on privately owned property when you are
> parked or standing on the land.

Again, that has NOTHING to do with this argument. The parking lot is a "public place" according to the commonwealth of VA. It doesn't matter if it is public or private property; it only matters whether it is a public place or not.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

drinking or drunk -- that is the question on private property.


Drunk in Public: Prince William County, VA


Public intoxication in Prince William County, Virginia, is covered by both state and local law.

According to § 18.2-388 of the Virginia Code, it is illegal in Virginia to curse or swear “profanely” or to be intoxicated in public whether through drugs or alcohol. In any area in which there is a court-approved detoxification center, a police officer may transport the suspect to the center in lieu of arrest, although nobody can be held at the center involuntarily. “In public” is defined as a place that is “in open view, visible to the community, and could include a defendant’s private property. The maximum penalty for a violation of this offense is a $250 fine.

Public intoxication is also covered by local code in Prince William County. Specifically, Section 16-14 of the Prince William County code prohibits anyone from being “intoxicated in public, whether such intoxication results from alcohol, narcotic drug or other intoxicant.” The penalty for violating this provision is $250 fine. Code 1965, §13.1-26; Ord. No. 01-17; 2-6-01.

Read all -- state law plus local law...

Virginia is one of 8 states that allow passengers to consume alcohol while the vehicle is in motion. Driver and Passengers must be 21+. Driver must have 0.000 alcohol level (you cannot drink and drive). Read the law:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-323.1

However, local laws may limit open containers in vehicles. Here is Fairfax County's law:

Section 5-1-25. - Possession of open alcoholic beverage containers prohibited.

It shall be unlawful for any person to possess an open alcoholic beverage container while in a public park, playground, or on a public street. Violations of this Section shall be punished as a Class 4 misdemeanor.

[It does not say while parked at Juffy Lube's parking lot].

I cannot find this prohibition in Prince William County's code:
http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=14114

Keep in mind the ban included food as well, not just drinking.

There is a lot more to tailgating than getting shitfaced. I, for one, enjoy grilling at tailgates.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> justsayin Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Arrest listings mean nothing. They don't tell
> the
> > story of what happened, all of those could have
> > been people that punched a kid with a lemonade
> > stand, dragged a keg over, and handed beer
> samples
> > out to people. That's why we need links to
> news
> > stories, but mister "you can't read!" evidently
> > has reading problems. Those don't support your
> > "argument" at all you dolt.
>
> I proved my point. Now it is your job to disprove
> it and your story about a lemonade stand does not
> cut it.

If you read, I asked for postings of a news article. You couldn't provide it, and what you did provide doesn't work for the reasons I stated.

Let me put it another way to see if it makes its may through your simple peabrain.

My statement: Tickling a woman is illegal in Virginia. Likewise, drinking in your yard even if you don't cause distraction otherwise is illegal. You will be arrested for neither.

Now, post proof that I am wrong. Arrest listings alone do not tell the story of the arrest as I already explained. If you can't prove people are arrested for doing nothing besides sipping beer in their yard while of-age, your walls of text above are all pointless.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > justsayin Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Arrest listings mean nothing. They don't
> tell
> > the
> > > story of what happened, all of those could
> have
> > > been people that punched a kid with a
> lemonade
> > > stand, dragged a keg over, and handed beer
> > samples
> > > out to people. That's why we need links to
> > news
> > > stories, but mister "you can't read!"
> evidently
> > > has reading problems. Those don't support
> your
> > > "argument" at all you dolt.
> >
> > I proved my point. Now it is your job to
> disprove
> > it and your story about a lemonade stand does
> not
> > cut it.
>
> If you read, I asked for postings of a news
> article. You couldn't provide it, and what you
> did provide doesn't work for the reasons I
> stated.
>
> Let me put it another way to see if it makes its
> may through your simple peabrain.
>
> My statement: Tickling a woman is illegal in
> Virginia. Likewise, drinking in your yard even if
> you don't cause distraction otherwise is illegal.
> You will be arrested for neither.
>
> Now, post proof that I am wrong. Arrest listings
> alone do not tell the story of the arrest as I
> already explained. If you can't prove people are
> arrested for doing nothing besides sipping beer in
> their yard while of-age, your walls of text above
> are all pointless.

I do not know where I would find a news article about someone getting a ticket or being arrested for drinking in a public place (space).

But, I have proven beyond a shadow of a doubt it is indeed illegal,the parking lot at JLL is a public place (space), and private property has NOTHING to do with it. Now if you do not understand these three points, do not change the subject by arguing you un-provable hypothesis that no cop would ever arrest you for it. That is just a moronic statement. If it is illegal, you may get a ticket or arrested for it.

You have made so many factually inaccurate statements and then you criticize me. Did you say that JLL will not allow you on the parking lot without a ticket? So therefore no vendors inside and no walk up ticket sales will happen this year. If there is an earthquake, police and firemen will not be allowed on the premisis because they do not have a ticket, according to you.

And some police will be there (hopefully they will have a ticket or they themselves will trespassing) to enforce JLL policies and throw violators in JLL jail.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The JLL parking lot is closed to the public for
> events, it is only open to the limited group of
> paying customers. JLL said they will enforce
> limitation of acces to ticket holders. No one of
> legal drinking age is going to be arrested there
> unless they are being a nuisance.


I don't know why you keep harping on this Radiophile/FUNdatard and saying what I posted above (fully quoted, not taken out of context as you have done) is misleading or incorrect.

It is the first bullet in their tailgating policy that the parking lot is _reserved_ for concert patrons ONLY. The policy states that JLL staff will patrol the lot to make sure the guidelines (which would obviously include the VERY FIRST BULLET of the policy).

I am now convinved you are funcitonally illiterate, the language is very plain.

http://www.livenation.com/jlltailgating

The fire department is not going to park in the concertgoer lot and run a really long hose up to the pavilion, they actually let those guys drive right up to where they need to be. To suggest otherwise is simply moronic (or you are just trolling).



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/09/2012 08:48AM by justsayin.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I said "probably" cause I do not know all the
> details. But 95% chance you would be breaking the
> law.

And this 95%, where did you get that? I’m sure you did some real quick probability calculations based on all the facts that you don’t know.

> I don't make shit up as I go along like you.

You just did! Several times! 95% chance! Lol!

> The law of the land is the law of the land. You
> are even arguing THAT point?

No. Never have. As far as your law of the land rants, not sure why you keep bringing it up, as no one is debating it. Saying “the law of the land is the law of the land” is kind of like saying the sky is blue. We know! However, laws do at time vary based on private vs public property/space. E.g. where you can legally shoot a gun, drink, etc.

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> See? Jiffy Lube Live can not ask the police to
> enforce THEIR POLICIES. They can only ask the
> police to enforce the law.

The law in Virginia is that you are not allowed to drink in public. Since your argument is that the JLL parking lot is a “public place/space”, no one will ever be allowed to drink there. Lol! :p

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "TO WHICH THE PUBLIC HAS, OR is permitted to have
> , access..
>
> Do you know the meaning of the word "or"?

The “or” is to delineate between a place that the public does not have access to, but is permitted to have access to, thereby making it public.

For example, a public restroom. While it may have a barrier, or a door, the public is granted access, thereby making it public. Contrast this with a place where you may have access, but are not permitted access (JLL parking lot), thereby making it private.

You’ve made it clear you believe your interpretation is the most accurate, and that there can be no other. If you can walk onto it, it’s public, and nothing else matters. Gotcha. Okay? Fair enough. We're done here.

This is what the website says:

Jiffy Lube Live parking lots are reserved for concert patrons only.

This is what you read:
" "The JLL parking lot is closed to the public for
events, it is only open to the limited group of paying customers. JLL said they will enforce limitation of access to ticket holders."

So who is funtionally illiterate.

For the last time, this if the VA definition of "public space".

"Public place" means any place, building, or conveyance to which the public has, or is permitted to have, access, including restaurants, soda fountains, hotel dining areas, lobbies and corridors of hotels, and any park, place of public resort or amusement, highway, street, lane, or sidewalk adjoining any highway, street, or lane.

Under this definition Jiffy Lube Live parking IS a public place.


The term shall not include (i) hotel or restaurant dining areas or ballrooms while in use for private meetings or private parties limited in attendance to members and guests of a particular group, association or organization; (ii) restaurants licensed by the Board in office buildings or industrial or similar facilities while such restaurant is closed to the public and in use for private meetings or parties limited in attendance to employees and nonpaying guests of the owner or a lessee of all or part of such building or facility; (iii) offices, office buildings or industrial facilities while closed to the public and in use for private meetings or parties limited in attendance to employees and nonpaying guests of the owner or a lessee of all or part of such building or facility; or (iv) private recreational or chartered boats which are not licensed by the Board and on which alcoholic beverages are not sold.


NOPE, none of these exceptions apply. So again the parking lot is a "public place" according to the commonwealth of VA.

You have mentioned private property laws that don't exist. I can not serve alcohol to minors on private property nor can I beat my wife. I can not fire a gun in my house, nor can I have a nuclear reactor on my private property. The law of the land is the law of the land, private property or not.

Fairfaxunderground rules: Lilliputions, not ok. Midgettville ok. I got it now.

Epic fail, pwn3d. Case rested.

I've tailgated at a lot of events in my life and have only been hassled at Jiffy Lube.

Who cares if it's legal. It's the enforcement that matters.