Fairfax County General :
Fairfax Underground
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
hNMdK
()
Date: February 23, 2017 06:57AM
Before any side comments or jokes, there are number of Fairfax Connector rush hour commuter connector routes that serve the park and ride lots that have other than stereotypical bus demographics, ika choice riders riding the bus because its convenient such as some express buses. I ride and have ridden some of these buses and seen it first hand.
What is concerning though on these buses and other Fairfax Connector buses in this upcoming challenging budget season, Fairfax County Department of Transportation pays its vendor MV Transit $105 per hour to run its buses. How much does the bus driver get of that? From a 15+ year bus driver veteran I learned only $15 per hour (that rare day the park and ride was otherwise empty of riders and I knew this driver to some extent, and talking with him waiting a few minutes for the bus to leave at its scheduled departure time), and those starting less than that, plus they receive no benefits such as medical. One, you wonder as taxpayers what the other $90 per hour is going for (6/7 of the $105), some for bus maintenance and gas, supervisor salaries, and other administrative costs unclear about. At the same time, for a position of responsibility, sometimes carrying dozens of passengers, the poor Fairfax Connector bus driver is only get paid $15 per hour at best, usually less. Some drivers can put on a cheerful attitude despite that, but understanding some drivers can have the less the best attitude given that with economic challenges they are facing. Going back to 2009 during the recession, there was a wider pool of drivers, but many of the better drivers have gone to drive for other transportation jobs, such as Lyft and Uber that now exist that did not exist then, with often a more pleasant passenger base than if they were driving off-peak Fairfax Connector buses. From first hand experience, Fairfax Connector drivers are from around the world, mostly 3rd world, some friendly and helpful, but others not, while county taxpayers are paying $105 per hour with the driver only getting less than 15% of that.
What is concerning though on these buses and other Fairfax Connector buses in this upcoming challenging budget season, Fairfax County Department of Transportation pays its vendor MV Transit $105 per hour to run its buses. How much does the bus driver get of that? From a 15+ year bus driver veteran I learned only $15 per hour (that rare day the park and ride was otherwise empty of riders and I knew this driver to some extent, and talking with him waiting a few minutes for the bus to leave at its scheduled departure time), and those starting less than that, plus they receive no benefits such as medical. One, you wonder as taxpayers what the other $90 per hour is going for (6/7 of the $105), some for bus maintenance and gas, supervisor salaries, and other administrative costs unclear about. At the same time, for a position of responsibility, sometimes carrying dozens of passengers, the poor Fairfax Connector bus driver is only get paid $15 per hour at best, usually less. Some drivers can put on a cheerful attitude despite that, but understanding some drivers can have the less the best attitude given that with economic challenges they are facing. Going back to 2009 during the recession, there was a wider pool of drivers, but many of the better drivers have gone to drive for other transportation jobs, such as Lyft and Uber that now exist that did not exist then, with often a more pleasant passenger base than if they were driving off-peak Fairfax Connector buses. From first hand experience, Fairfax Connector drivers are from around the world, mostly 3rd world, some friendly and helpful, but others not, while county taxpayers are paying $105 per hour with the driver only getting less than 15% of that.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
mjs
()
Date: February 23, 2017 08:06AM
you think when you go into a car dealership to have your car worked on, that the tech is getting 120 an hour?
you think when you pay your landscape company 40-50 bucks an hour, that they are really giving all that money to the H2B guys.
you think when you pay 8 bucks for that micro brew in a bar that it actually costs the restaurant 8 bucks?
a transit bus costs upwards of 250000........you don't get 20 dollar oil changes on a bus, 20 buck wont even pay for the oil.... brake drums for a transit bus start at $1500..... tires are equally as expensive.... a transit bus gets about 3-4 MPG....fuel isn't cheap....
The bus driver knows going in what he is getting paid per hour... people run a business to make as much money as possible while they can. no point in running a business if you can't take money home in your own pocket.
so since you seem all worried bout what the bus drivers make. start your own transit company pay your drivers $20 an hour, and then underbid the current contractor and let us know how it goes...
you think when you pay your landscape company 40-50 bucks an hour, that they are really giving all that money to the H2B guys.
you think when you pay 8 bucks for that micro brew in a bar that it actually costs the restaurant 8 bucks?
a transit bus costs upwards of 250000........you don't get 20 dollar oil changes on a bus, 20 buck wont even pay for the oil.... brake drums for a transit bus start at $1500..... tires are equally as expensive.... a transit bus gets about 3-4 MPG....fuel isn't cheap....
The bus driver knows going in what he is getting paid per hour... people run a business to make as much money as possible while they can. no point in running a business if you can't take money home in your own pocket.
so since you seem all worried bout what the bus drivers make. start your own transit company pay your drivers $20 an hour, and then underbid the current contractor and let us know how it goes...
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
hNMdK
()
Date: February 23, 2017 08:29AM
a transit bus costs upwards of 250000....
The capital costs of buying the buses are definitely funded with other county and state dollars, and are not part of the MV Transit contract. I am unsure who pays for the bus parts or if the bus requires a mid-level overhaul requiring many parts, though the servicing/labor of it is performed by MV Transit labor in the three garages (Herndon, Fairfax/West Ox, and Lorton) which were built and funded with taxpayer dollars and county bonds outside of the MV Transit contract.
If buses only get 3-4 miles per gallon, even if some local buses average 20 miles in an hour with stops (6 gallons of gas used) with diesel fuel at say no more than $3 a gallon, that's less than $20 per hour in gas. True, express buses with limited stops are going to use fuel differently.
Given current county budget challenges, since as taxpayers we are paying MV Transit $105 per hour of service, it would be good to see how that money is really spent, how much profit are they getting (is it over 10% or not) as every business has right to a reasonable profit, and if profits over 10% if they can raise driver pay given cost of living in this area (thinking like the Walmart or McDonalds workers). $15 an hour at best is only $30K a year, for a job with much responsibility of keeping choice and non-choice riders safe in travel.
The capital costs of buying the buses are definitely funded with other county and state dollars, and are not part of the MV Transit contract. I am unsure who pays for the bus parts or if the bus requires a mid-level overhaul requiring many parts, though the servicing/labor of it is performed by MV Transit labor in the three garages (Herndon, Fairfax/West Ox, and Lorton) which were built and funded with taxpayer dollars and county bonds outside of the MV Transit contract.
If buses only get 3-4 miles per gallon, even if some local buses average 20 miles in an hour with stops (6 gallons of gas used) with diesel fuel at say no more than $3 a gallon, that's less than $20 per hour in gas. True, express buses with limited stops are going to use fuel differently.
Given current county budget challenges, since as taxpayers we are paying MV Transit $105 per hour of service, it would be good to see how that money is really spent, how much profit are they getting (is it over 10% or not) as every business has right to a reasonable profit, and if profits over 10% if they can raise driver pay given cost of living in this area (thinking like the Walmart or McDonalds workers). $15 an hour at best is only $30K a year, for a job with much responsibility of keeping choice and non-choice riders safe in travel.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
Rockefellers cousin
()
Date: February 23, 2017 08:35AM
It's funny whenever people complain that they don't make enough money. We have a capitalist system, if don't like your pay, instead of complaining, get another job.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
NpJNV
()
Date: February 23, 2017 08:56AM
Not a bus driver myself, but a commuter passenger like many others. Agree with original poster, that some bus drivers understandably are dealing with some challenges personally and economically because of their low pay which could be a little better for the lives they are entrusted to, and is reflected in the customer experience. As a business, some of those customers, especially the choice ones, depending on experience of a particular driver, will choose to use the Connector or drive or Lyft/Uber a shorter distance. I do have to say nearly all buses are newer low floor, MV Transit monitors the buses and tries to run them as reliably can be given sometimes horrid No. VA traffic (hopefully GPS will come this spring). Though given what they pay the drivers, sometimes its hard to find good help. Plus they are raising the fares from $1.75 to $2 come July on most buses, unless something changes before now and then.
MV Transportation Inc. is privately held, so no insight how much they are profiting. What is infuriating is those companies, transportation or not, making 15-20% profit or more and hurting their customers, their revenue bread and butter, and employees. There are companies I remember that treat their customers and employees right, I worked for the former MCI (their downfall though in the late 1990's was not going from long distance landline service to owning cellular licenses), and then there are those, whose primary goal is to satisfy 1% Wall Street at the expense of customers and employees.
MV Transportation Inc. is privately held, so no insight how much they are profiting. What is infuriating is those companies, transportation or not, making 15-20% profit or more and hurting their customers, their revenue bread and butter, and employees. There are companies I remember that treat their customers and employees right, I worked for the former MCI (their downfall though in the late 1990's was not going from long distance landline service to owning cellular licenses), and then there are those, whose primary goal is to satisfy 1% Wall Street at the expense of customers and employees.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
mjs
()
Date: February 23, 2017 10:00AM
you guys are tools... allowing a company to only make 10% profit.
tally up your essential reasonable expenses. 2000 sqft home. an 8 year old honda civic, one night a week out for food, ect.
then add 10%. tell me how happy you'll feel about pocketing 10% to save for your future, or to buy a new car. go on vacation. ect....
the bus drives went into their career knowingly. no one forced them to become bus drivers.
if the company is making 15-20% so be it good for them to have a working business model.... again build your own company underbid them and see what happens
you don't like the fact that the drivers are getting so little. vote for a different candidate next time or vote with your wallet. if you are concerned that your drivers are not making enough money dig deep and throw some cash their way, or hire uber to take you where you need to go.
hell I wish I could opt out of paying taxes for the bus. I don't use the service so I shouldn't pay for it...
tally up your essential reasonable expenses. 2000 sqft home. an 8 year old honda civic, one night a week out for food, ect.
then add 10%. tell me how happy you'll feel about pocketing 10% to save for your future, or to buy a new car. go on vacation. ect....
the bus drives went into their career knowingly. no one forced them to become bus drivers.
if the company is making 15-20% so be it good for them to have a working business model.... again build your own company underbid them and see what happens
you don't like the fact that the drivers are getting so little. vote for a different candidate next time or vote with your wallet. if you are concerned that your drivers are not making enough money dig deep and throw some cash their way, or hire uber to take you where you need to go.
hell I wish I could opt out of paying taxes for the bus. I don't use the service so I shouldn't pay for it...
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
Joke Insurance
()
Date: February 23, 2017 03:00PM
Well... tell us your grand plan to fiX these issues?
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
Mike O'Meara Show Fan
()
Date: February 23, 2017 03:51PM
OP is a lying fag. Fifteen dollars an hour is just not true.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
causeican
()
Date: February 23, 2017 11:36PM
Don’t blame the company for making money. Blame yourself for not making it. The bus driver is the only one who can fix his problems and if you fcps graduates don’t fuck things up, this country will remain free and everyone can just go out and get themselves another job if they are not happy.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
NXKxb
()
Date: February 24, 2017 08:39AM
At least with their public advertising, http://www.mvtransit.com/ is better with their employees than other bus transit contractors. Question is whether the company is paying its employees a living wage, $15 hour for a 15-year bus driver veteran, many being paid less than that, with no benefits, for a job with a lot more responsibility for lives than one working in McDonald's or Walmart. The only thing I can see in changing contract negotiations FCODT with MV Transit or whoever they have as their bus contractor in the future is put a stipulation in the contract that they pay their workers a living wage. Last year, was using Loudoun County Commuter bus service ran by http://www.transdevna.com/, some of their union employees call that company evil http://www.workers.org/2015/08/17/veoliatransdev-evil-corp/ and they went on strike for a day. Also whoever Fairfax Connector had as their bus contractor in Sep-Oct 2009, the drivers went on strike for three weeks in Eastern Fairfax County. Based on the posts here, cost of bus parts, drivers, gas, etc., the $105 hourly rate is probably reasonable, but as county citizens and taxpayers we have no insight into MV Transportation Inc's profits as it is privately held and they do not release their financials publicly, and not sure if FCDOT would release contract details without a Freedom of Information Act request.
The other concern as taxpayers in a tight budget season is the millions of hours which FCDOT pays MV Transit the $105 rate. There are many bus routes through the county, mostly on the western (Chantilly/Centreville) and north ends (Reston/Tysons) particularly in off-peak hours that carry less than 10 passengers, some less than five. For one with five, that's $21 per passenger, with three, that's $35 per passenger, with the passenger only paying $1.75 and increasing to $2 in July. Details in below post: http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/read/2/2474480/2474514.html#msg-2474514 Millions in tax savings can be had with ideas also in this post such as subsidizing Uber/Lyft fares in low use area with promo codes and restrictions or reducing or eliminating service on low use bus routes.
The other concern as taxpayers in a tight budget season is the millions of hours which FCDOT pays MV Transit the $105 rate. There are many bus routes through the county, mostly on the western (Chantilly/Centreville) and north ends (Reston/Tysons) particularly in off-peak hours that carry less than 10 passengers, some less than five. For one with five, that's $21 per passenger, with three, that's $35 per passenger, with the passenger only paying $1.75 and increasing to $2 in July. Details in below post: http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/read/2/2474480/2474514.html#msg-2474514 Millions in tax savings can be had with ideas also in this post such as subsidizing Uber/Lyft fares in low use area with promo codes and restrictions or reducing or eliminating service on low use bus routes.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
YbM47
()
Date: February 24, 2017 09:06AM
This is on-topic/off-topic
Following the Christian God on which many who signed the Declaration of Independence believed, got to do what's right:
* Treat your workers fairly and with reasonable pay. There are companies that did or do this well, former MCI, Chick-fil-a, Hobby Lobby, I believe Bed Bath and Beyond, others?
* If you treat your workers right, they will as a whole provide better customer service to your business's customers. From this, revenue and profits will flow. Chick-fil-a grows revenue a few to several percent a year with better than average customer service in the industry and is privately held and does not seek to impress Wall Street. You can read reviews on the internet which companies are better to work for i.e. Lyft treats their drivers and passengers like community whereas Uber doing whatever to cut costs affecting employees (read uberpeople forum). Other chains whether fast food struggle to eak out growth, lower end retail (not to say all are bad), Lasership delivery in Tysons (Amazon uses quite a bit) who only gives their drivers $1.50 per delivery before employee expenses of running their cars, etc., look for the cheapest labor that can be had, sometimes immigrants who are struggling with English, and employees are mistreated, given poor hours, etc, and the corporation is sometimes profiting billions of dollars, at the expense of employees and poor customer service.
* FCPS and the county wasting money on LGBT initiatives and translating documents in dozens of languages. Political correctness costs millions in a tight budget season. Also additional police costs, especially in neighborhoods with lots of illegals who continue to commit crimes or offenses. I am not saying not to take care of the elderly or the truly disabled.
1. Homosexuality is morally wrong, plain and simple, to the Christian God. The derachio that hit Fairfax County in June, 2012 that knocked out the 911 system, and the earthquake in August, 2011, and of course 9/11/2001 was pretty bad with some lives lost locally at the Pentagon, all were nothing, if we do not follow God. History does repeat itself.
2. As far as immigrants, follow the process to get into the country, apply for refugee status if needed, such as the ones from Syria. Too many in one place can overwhelm available resources as we are seeing in Fairfax County. I have respect for immigrants who follow the rules, nice couple from Bolivia who cleaned my home at one time when had time struggles with a long commute at the time, hard workers, he knew English well while his wife yet trying and learning and getting better. Even many immigrants with green cards to work here, they do not want the criminals here. Follow the customs here, not playing loud music annoying the neighbors, of course, some younger whites are sometimes as bad.
* Not waste God's or county/taxpayer resources. See paragraphs above, but also Fairfax Connector bus service waste on routes that serve so few where more cost effective ways.
Following the Christian God on which many who signed the Declaration of Independence believed, got to do what's right:
* Treat your workers fairly and with reasonable pay. There are companies that did or do this well, former MCI, Chick-fil-a, Hobby Lobby, I believe Bed Bath and Beyond, others?
* If you treat your workers right, they will as a whole provide better customer service to your business's customers. From this, revenue and profits will flow. Chick-fil-a grows revenue a few to several percent a year with better than average customer service in the industry and is privately held and does not seek to impress Wall Street. You can read reviews on the internet which companies are better to work for i.e. Lyft treats their drivers and passengers like community whereas Uber doing whatever to cut costs affecting employees (read uberpeople forum). Other chains whether fast food struggle to eak out growth, lower end retail (not to say all are bad), Lasership delivery in Tysons (Amazon uses quite a bit) who only gives their drivers $1.50 per delivery before employee expenses of running their cars, etc., look for the cheapest labor that can be had, sometimes immigrants who are struggling with English, and employees are mistreated, given poor hours, etc, and the corporation is sometimes profiting billions of dollars, at the expense of employees and poor customer service.
* FCPS and the county wasting money on LGBT initiatives and translating documents in dozens of languages. Political correctness costs millions in a tight budget season. Also additional police costs, especially in neighborhoods with lots of illegals who continue to commit crimes or offenses. I am not saying not to take care of the elderly or the truly disabled.
1. Homosexuality is morally wrong, plain and simple, to the Christian God. The derachio that hit Fairfax County in June, 2012 that knocked out the 911 system, and the earthquake in August, 2011, and of course 9/11/2001 was pretty bad with some lives lost locally at the Pentagon, all were nothing, if we do not follow God. History does repeat itself.
2. As far as immigrants, follow the process to get into the country, apply for refugee status if needed, such as the ones from Syria. Too many in one place can overwhelm available resources as we are seeing in Fairfax County. I have respect for immigrants who follow the rules, nice couple from Bolivia who cleaned my home at one time when had time struggles with a long commute at the time, hard workers, he knew English well while his wife yet trying and learning and getting better. Even many immigrants with green cards to work here, they do not want the criminals here. Follow the customs here, not playing loud music annoying the neighbors, of course, some younger whites are sometimes as bad.
* Not waste God's or county/taxpayer resources. See paragraphs above, but also Fairfax Connector bus service waste on routes that serve so few where more cost effective ways.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
YbM47
()
Date: February 24, 2017 09:10AM
* Add to this greed, wrong in God's eyes, companies profiting billions while hurting employees and customers. What is greed ? - 5% profit, 10% profit, 15% profit, 20% profit, 25% profit - cannot really answer that one.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
mjs
()
Date: February 24, 2017 09:14AM
NXKxb Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Transit or whoever they have as their bus
> contractor in the future is put a stipulation in
> the contract that they pay their workers a living
> wage.
but as county citizens and
> taxpayers we have no insight into MV
> Transportation Inc's profits as it is privately
> held and they do not release their financials
> publicly,
liv·ing wage
??liviNG ?w?j/
noun
noun: living wage; plural noun: living wages
a wage that is high enough to maintain a normal standard of living.
are you telling me that you honestly believe that the high school dropout who flips burgers at mickey d' is worthy of 14.35 (living wagein fairfax) an hour? or how about the guy hanging off the back of the trash truck sometime to gotta work two jobs to make ends meet. your choices in life dictate how much money you make... Oh and Id venture to say that the person working on or repairing the bus has a greater responsibility than the knuckle dragger driving it...
And you don't get it. private companies are private for a reason...they don't want people like you dictating how they run their business.
fuckem...
living wages doens't mean shit. you choose a shitty career, you make shitty money.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2017 09:15AM by mjs.
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Transit or whoever they have as their bus
> contractor in the future is put a stipulation in
> the contract that they pay their workers a living
> wage.
but as county citizens and
> taxpayers we have no insight into MV
> Transportation Inc's profits as it is privately
> held and they do not release their financials
> publicly,
liv·ing wage
??liviNG ?w?j/
noun
noun: living wage; plural noun: living wages
a wage that is high enough to maintain a normal standard of living.
are you telling me that you honestly believe that the high school dropout who flips burgers at mickey d' is worthy of 14.35 (living wagein fairfax) an hour? or how about the guy hanging off the back of the trash truck sometime to gotta work two jobs to make ends meet. your choices in life dictate how much money you make... Oh and Id venture to say that the person working on or repairing the bus has a greater responsibility than the knuckle dragger driving it...
And you don't get it. private companies are private for a reason...they don't want people like you dictating how they run their business.
fuckem...
living wages doens't mean shit. you choose a shitty career, you make shitty money.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2017 09:15AM by mjs.
Re: Why your commuter Fairfax Connector driver may not be so cheerful?
Posted by:
Gruntled
()
Date: February 24, 2017 09:53AM
Among the bus systems I've ridden over the years, I put FFX Connectors among the bottom. The friendliest, most helpful drivers I've run into have been on the Alexandria DASH buses. MOST Metro bus drivers I've met have been at least competent at their jobs, with the exceptions generally being substitutes.
I was waiting for the S80 bus at Franconia Springfield when the striking FFX Connector drivers went by, hassling me for what they saw as crossing the picket line. When I told them that I was waiting for a METRO shuttle, one idiot claimed that I would be there a while because Metro drivers were supporting their strike. When my shuttle arrived (and I want to point out ON TIME), and I told him what the idiot had claimed, he told me they support anyone's right to strike, but not to the point where they stop working when they themselves are not on strike.
I had one idiot FFX Connector driver ask the passengers if they minded if he smoked, and lit up when he didn't hear any complaints (Why do I have to say something to tell him to follow the law?). He then challenged another driver in a bus in the next lane to a race back to the station. I didn't see him after that day. Apparently, bus driving was just to regimented for his liking, or he was fired for screwing up during his probationary period. BTW, the driver in the bus he challenged told him he wasn't going to race, and told my driver he needed to watch himself.
The only bus accident I was ever involved in was a FFX Connector. The driver thought the car in front was going through the yellow light, so he sped up so he could, too (Wrong -- he rear-ended the guy in front who changed his mind at the last minute). Apparently, either he wasn't out of his probationary period, or FFX Connector didn't like his driving record, because I never saw him again, either.
I have no idea whether the difference is due to standards, pay, or whatever.
I was waiting for the S80 bus at Franconia Springfield when the striking FFX Connector drivers went by, hassling me for what they saw as crossing the picket line. When I told them that I was waiting for a METRO shuttle, one idiot claimed that I would be there a while because Metro drivers were supporting their strike. When my shuttle arrived (and I want to point out ON TIME), and I told him what the idiot had claimed, he told me they support anyone's right to strike, but not to the point where they stop working when they themselves are not on strike.
I had one idiot FFX Connector driver ask the passengers if they minded if he smoked, and lit up when he didn't hear any complaints (Why do I have to say something to tell him to follow the law?). He then challenged another driver in a bus in the next lane to a race back to the station. I didn't see him after that day. Apparently, bus driving was just to regimented for his liking, or he was fired for screwing up during his probationary period. BTW, the driver in the bus he challenged told him he wasn't going to race, and told my driver he needed to watch himself.
The only bus accident I was ever involved in was a FFX Connector. The driver thought the car in front was going through the yellow light, so he sped up so he could, too (Wrong -- he rear-ended the guy in front who changed his mind at the last minute). Apparently, either he wasn't out of his probationary period, or FFX Connector didn't like his driving record, because I never saw him again, either.
I have no idea whether the difference is due to standards, pay, or whatever.