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Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 11:41AM


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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 11:50AM

I would love to see one US carrier(and battle group) versus the entire Iran navy........

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"...your suffering will be legendary even in Hell!"

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 11:59AM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would love to see one US carrier(and battle
> group) versus the entire Iran navy........






Yeah, the Iranian Navy is basically a glorified Coast Guard with zero combat experience.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Les ()
Date: January 03, 2012 12:04PM

Notice that there are one or more major arms sales set to go everytime we have these "confrontations". As a result, there are no more protests from the Israeli lobby that the Arabs are getting heaving armed.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 12:06PM

Actually they have a fair amount - shooting it out with the Iraqis (20 years ago). That being said, they have zero ability to withstand anti-ship missile attacks.

On the other hand going right into the teeth of an enemy with moderate air power capabilities would ideally require at least 2 carrier groups.

-----------------------------------------------

"...your suffering will be legendary even in Hell!"

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 12:09PM

I guess if the carrier turns into ash and vapor we'll have a better idea of Iran's WMD capabilities.

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http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: MrMephisto ()
Date: January 03, 2012 12:18PM

Iran wouldn't dare attack without clear provocation. As much as I hate the expression "sabre rattling," that's exactly what it is.

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13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: their navy/air force has no chance ()
Date: January 03, 2012 12:56PM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Actually they have a fair amount - shooting it out
> with the Iraqis (20 years ago). That being said,
> they have zero ability to withstand anti-ship
> missile attacks.
>
> On the other hand going right into the teeth of an
> enemy with moderate air power capabilities would
> ideally require at least 2 carrier groups.


2 carrier groups would be better for the pilots to get rest but let's be honest. Irans air power isn't anything that can touch us. They have a bunch of old tomcats most of which don't work and some other older planes. That's not even counting the fact our pilots are light years ahead in training and skill. On the ground is a different story as they have significant man power there to bog someone down

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Numbers ()
Date: January 03, 2012 01:03PM

I don't think we need to worry. If Iran does get nukes, I'm sure they'll blow themselves up accidentally. The Iranian people, for the most part, seem fairly civilized and I doubt they'd be terribly disappointed if the dopey religious funamentalist governmentwere to be blown to smithereens.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 01:04PM

I expect the Iranians to threaten the carrier with a couple of gun boats. We'll blow those fuckers out of the water and the Iranians will cry like little bitches to the UN. The Russians and Chinese will pitch a fit in the Security Council, nothing will happen and the Iranians will shut up for a while.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 01:13PM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Actually they have a fair amount - shooting it out
> with the Iraqis (20 years ago). That being said,
> they have zero ability to withstand anti-ship
> missile attacks.





The Iraqi and Iranian Navies were, and still are, a big LOL. There were very little conflicts involving naval warfare in the Iraq-Iran War. Light infantry and ballistic missile attacks (on both sides) defined that war.

Blessed are the murderous.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2012 01:14PM by eesh.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 01:15PM

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Iran wouldn't dare attack without clear
> provocation. As much as I hate the expression
> "sabre rattling," that's exactly what it is.






Especially since France (of all nations) is siding with the US and urging the rest of the EU to do the same. Everyone is tired of Iran's shit.

Blessed are the murderous.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 01:26PM

their navy/air force has no chance Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Actually they have a fair amount - shooting it
> out
> > with the Iraqis (20 years ago). That being
> said,
> > they have zero ability to withstand anti-ship
> > missile attacks.
> >
> > On the other hand going right into the teeth of
> an
> > enemy with moderate air power capabilities
> would
> > ideally require at least 2 carrier groups.
>
>
> 2 carrier groups would be better for the pilots to
> get rest but let's be honest. Irans air power
> isn't anything that can touch us. They have a
> bunch of old tomcats most of which don't work and
> some other older planes. That's not even counting
> the fact our pilots are light years ahead in
> training and skill. On the ground is a different
> story as they have significant man power there to
> bog someone down

They also have 3 or 4 squadrons of MiG-29s which is a very capable aircraft in the right hands. Remember, the USN is limited only to FA-18s now (the F-14s are bye bye). The consensus is that the USN actually lost a FA-18 in air-to-air combat in Gulf War I (Scott Speicher).

-----------------------------------------------

"...your suffering will be legendary even in Hell!"

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: their navy/air force has no chance ()
Date: January 03, 2012 02:00PM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:

> They also have 3 or 4 squadrons of MiG-29s which
> is a very capable aircraft in the right hands.
> Remember, the USN is limited only to FA-18s now
> (the F-14s are bye bye). The consensus is that
> the USN actually lost a FA-18 in air-to-air combat
> in Gulf War I (Scott Speicher).


Yes we did lose a plane in the Gulf pretty sure it was a missile attack but even if it was air to air it was it was still a single pilot. Cant always have a perfect record, sooner or later the other side is bound to get a lucky shot off. Iran may have 1 or 2 capable pilots but their guys dont come close to matching the training we have. All versions of the f-18 are a very capable plane, m-29s are no joke but i highly doubt the Iranians have been maintaining them properly and have them all in top shape. They may down 1 or 2 of our planes, but over all in just air to air combat our pilots would make short work of whatever planes they have that are flight ready.

Same thing would go for a naval battle.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: airnground combat ()
Date: January 03, 2012 02:12PM

their navy/air force has no chance Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pilots would make short work of whatever planes
> they have that are flight ready.

Cruise missiles work. Stealth drones work. Stealth fighter drones work. Don;t need no stinkin' pilots anymore.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 02:17PM

airnground combat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> their navy/air force has no chance Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > pilots would make short work of whatever planes
> > they have that are flight ready.
>
> Cruise missiles work. Stealth drones work. Stealth
> fighter drones work.

They work so well that the Iranians mananaged to comandeer one of ours get it to do a perfect landing on one of their runways...

-----------------------------------------------

"...your suffering will be legendary even in Hell!"

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: airnground combat ()
Date: January 03, 2012 02:20PM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They work so well that the Iranians mananaged to
> comandeer one of ours get it to do a perfect
> landing on one of their runways...

Nah - I suspect what happened is comm failure then "default flight envelope" til comm regained (which didn't happen), then fuel exhaustio, then glide to scraping landing.

SOP for loss of comm for IFR flights is to maintain filed course; I imagine SOP for loss of comm from the robot's POV is maintain wings level, climb, maintain course or circle, await regain,

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: their navy/air force has no chance ()
Date: January 03, 2012 02:21PM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:

>
> They work so well that the Iranians mananaged to
> comandeer one of ours get it to do a perfect
> landing on one of their runways...

Seems like someone may have been paid off for that one. But he is right the drones do work. However what he fails to realize is that turning to an all drone force would greatly weaken the military. The drones are a good tool but you still need soldiers on the ground and pilots in the air. Plus the migs would have a field day shooting down the drones

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Warhawk ()
Date: January 03, 2012 03:07PM

Irans navy consists of three 1974 Bassmaster bass boats with a AK-47 gunmounts.

__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: meh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 04:43PM

Im curious what would happen if we do get in some kind of conflict with Iran? would a ground war follow? wonder whos ship Russia/China would jump on

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 03, 2012 04:56PM

Warhawk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Irans navy consists of three 1974 Bassmaster bass
> boats with a AK-47 gunmounts.


Yes, and I can guarantee you no members of the Revolutionary Guard will be on them. It will be some luckless conscripts who have never been on a boat in their lives and who will be told to charge the carrier in the name of Allah.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: probably not ()
Date: January 03, 2012 04:58PM

meh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Im curious what would happen if we do get in some
> kind of conflict with Iran? would a ground war
> follow? wonder whos ship Russia/China would jump
> on


Ground war would be unlikely unless Iran just completely lost it and starting being a big aggressor. China wouldnt start a war with us over it as we have to much invested with trading with each other ect. Plus theyd lose a ton of money if we cut off their goods and basically nothing good could come out it. Russia is always a question mark but generally you dont start wars with countries were you could both wipe each other off the map with nukes.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: MrMephisto ()
Date: January 03, 2012 06:02PM

All bets are off if Israel gets involved. I think a lot of the Middle Eastern countries would tolerate a slap-fight between the US and Iran, but if Israel mobilized, everyone would line up to take a shot.

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13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Warhawk ()
Date: January 03, 2012 06:07PM

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All bets are off if Israel gets involved. I think
> a lot of the Middle Eastern countries would
> tolerate a slap-fight between the US and Iran, but
> if Israel mobilized, everyone would line up to
> take a shot.


THAT would be bad, bad news.

__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: they wouldnt have too ()
Date: January 03, 2012 06:13PM

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All bets are off if Israel gets involved. I think
> a lot of the Middle Eastern countries would
> tolerate a slap-fight between the US and Iran, but
> if Israel mobilized, everyone would line up to
> take a shot.


If we take the lead they dont have too. However is Paul is president who hates them they may feel the need too

Usually when they act its to do what needs to be done that we dont want to be held responsible for so we let them be the scape goat and have their back in return

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: too funny ()
Date: January 03, 2012 06:37PM

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All bets are off if Israel gets involved.


why do jews have big noses?

cuz air is free, lol

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Aki and Chavi ()
Date: January 03, 2012 07:10PM

Ahmadjenidad looks like he has the same barber as Count Chocula.

Their Tomcats don't work.

Their pilots would fly the 1st day, and then refuse to get in their planes the next day. Or, try to fly out of the country.

Scott Michael Speicher was downed, most likely, by surface to air fire, not another plane.

They are crazy enough to try anything, but not stupid enough to sustain a quickly losing battle.

They are looking to ally with Chavez and Venezuala.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: MrMephisto ()
Date: January 03, 2012 07:21PM

they wouldnt have too Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If we take the lead they dont have too. However
> is Paul is president who hates them they may feel
> the need too
>
> Usually when they act its to do what needs to be
> done that we dont want to be held responsible for
> so we let them be the scape goat and have their
> back in return

Israel is the US's BFF over there. If they provide support, that'll be viewed as an act of aggression by people who are waiting for an opportunity.

They're just being assholes. They won't risk provoking an international incident.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: woof-woof ()
Date: January 03, 2012 07:30PM

I was in the U.S. Navy in 1984: while serving on a guided missle destroyer, U.S.S. Lynde McCormick (DDG-8), now deconmissioned. We were in the Persian Gulf for two months escorting oil tankers in and out of the Gulf; I am sure the U.S. still does this. One day we were following a loaded oil tanker out through the Strait of Hormuz when an Iranian fast frigate going into the Gulf passed us. Next an officer from combat central comes running on the bridge and says the Iranians have their directors trained on us, directors were a microwave beam that a guided missle follows to its target. We turned around to go after them but they had already split.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Olde Farte ()
Date: January 03, 2012 07:37PM

their navy/air force has no chance Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Plus the migs would have a field day shooting down
> the drones


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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 07:40PM

woof-woof Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was in the U.S. Navy in 1984: while serving on a
> guided missle destroyer, U.S.S. Lynde McCormick
> (DDG-8), now deconmissioned. We were in the
> Persian Gulf for two months escorting oil tankers
> in and out of the Gulf; I am sure the U.S. still
> does this. One day we were following a loaded oil
> tanker out through the Strait of Hormuz when an
> Iranian fast frigate going into the Gulf passed
> us. Next an officer from combat central comes
> running on the bridge and says the Iranians have
> their directors trained on us, directors were a
> microwave beam that a guided missle follows to its
> target. We turned around to go after them but they
> had already split.





These countries like Iran, who base their military on Chinese and old Soviet ordnance, still use Silkworm missiles. While they are a really old design, they are still effective and devastating against naval targets.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 07:49PM

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> they wouldnt have too Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If we take the lead they dont have too.
> However
> > is Paul is president who hates them they may
> feel
> > the need too
> >
> > Usually when they act its to do what needs to
> be
> > done that we dont want to be held responsible
> for
> > so we let them be the scape goat and have their
> > back in return
>
> Israel is the US's BFF over there. If they provide
> support, that'll be viewed as an act of aggression
> by people who are waiting for an opportunity.
>
> They're just being assholes. They won't risk
> provoking an international incident.






You are definitely correct. However, during the first Gulf War, Saddam tried getting Arab support by launching Scud missiles at Israel, and nothing happened.


Israel knows that their involvement in anything would light a fuse in the Middle East.

Plus, Iran does not have the undying support of Arab countries...they are Persians, and many Arabs do not see them as brothers. Also, the Revolutionary concepts of the Ayatollahs threaten the Sheik governments typical of Arab nations.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: tomahawk ()
Date: January 03, 2012 09:55PM

A few years ago the Pentagon wargamed a confrontation between the US and Iran. A Marine general was in charge of the simulated Iranian forces. He managed to wipe out most of the US carrier task force in short order, in the process pissing off the higher-ups, who expected the sim to follow the script of "US Gallant Troops Always Beat Up on the Bad Guys".

The fact is that a carrier navy is not built to operate in a confined space like the Persian Gulf, and a power like Iran, if led well, can do a lot of damage to a cocky and stupid American commander. Antiship missiles are serious threats, and Iran has lots of them. If they had nukes, they would probably hold them back to use as a strategic deterrent just like all the rest of the crazies who get nukes, including Pakistan, India, and us.

Talking trash is fun but for all you know the Iranians may have a field commander or two who knows what he is doing. I have always viewed ships as giant metal coffins with bullseyes on the sides. One lucky missile and you're toast. Just ask the crew of the HMS Sheffield or the USS Stark.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2012 09:56PM by tomahawk.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 03, 2012 10:03PM

tomahawk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A few years ago the Pentagon wargamed a
> confrontation between the US and Iran. A Marine
> general was in charge of the simulated Iranian
> forces. He managed to wipe out most of the US
> carrier task force in short order, in the process
> pissing off the higher-ups, who expected the sim
> to follow the script of "US Gallant Troops Always
> Beat Up on the Bad Guys".





Yeah, but it was a simulation where the OPFOR had leadership with superior training and experience. In the real world, I doubt Iranian commanders have much naval warfare training, if any.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 06, 2012 02:07PM

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/06/world/meast/iran-us-navy-rescue/index.html?hpt=hp_c1




Our Navy just rescued Iranian sailors that were taken hostage by Somalis.

Blessed are the murderous.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: MrMephisto ()
Date: January 06, 2012 02:17PM

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/06/world/meast/iran-us-
> navy-rescue/index.html?hpt=hp_c1
>
>
>
>
> Our Navy just rescued Iranian sailors that were
> taken hostage by Somalis.

Beautiful. I'm sure Iran will either say that it's our fault the sailors got captured in the first place, or just flat-out say it didn't happen.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Date: January 06, 2012 02:48PM

Pinhead the Cenobite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... The consensus is that
> the USN actually lost a FA-18 in air-to-air combat
> in Gulf War I (Scott Speicher).

The Iraqi pilot who went up in his MiG-25 to shoot down the FA-18 defied orders to stand down. Instead of a pat on the back, he was canned and grounded when he returned to base.

The CIA bribed the Iraqi high command to stand down and leave Saddam exposed. We promised the equivalent of Operation Paper Clip for Iraqi senior officers to commit treason and we stabbed them all in the back after it was all over with. U.S. General Tommy Franks confessed in May 2003 with Defense Week that we bribed the high command to stand down and betray Saddam so Lord Bush could have his Short Attention Span War.

If Saddam was a decent dictator and had the loyalty of his military and people, the U.S. would have been pounded. We probably would have prevailed but, very bloodied for our impudence. I hope to God that Iranians are hard core and willing to fight like rabid dogs. Somebody has to stop the cancerous imperial monster than the U.S. has become.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: Atom ()
Date: January 06, 2012 04:21PM

If Iran's threat drives up oil Prices, but Iran never restricts the flow of oil, who keeps all that Profit?

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: hardworker ()
Date: January 06, 2012 05:32PM

fuck you.....traitor.

Don't like America then leave asshole.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: tomahawk ()
Date: January 06, 2012 08:06PM

hardworker Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fuck you.....traitor.
>
> Don't like America then leave asshole.


Fuck you traitor. Don't like free speech then leave asshole.

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: you sound like a terrorist ()
Date: January 06, 2012 08:36PM

The REAL MongOLloyd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> The Iraqi pilot who went up in his MiG-25 to shoot
> down the FA-18 defied orders to stand down.
> Instead of a pat on the back, he was canned and
> grounded when he returned to base.
>
> The CIA bribed the Iraqi high command to stand
> down and leave Saddam exposed. We promised the
> equivalent of Operation Paper Clip for Iraqi
> senior officers to commit treason and we stabbed
> them all in the back after it was all over with.
> U.S. General Tommy Franks confessed in May 2003
> with Defense Week that we bribed the high command
> to stand down and betray Saddam so Lord Bush could
> have his Short Attention Span War.
>
> If Saddam was a decent dictator and had the
> loyalty of his military and people, the U.S. would
> have been pounded. We probably would have
> prevailed but, very bloodied for our impudence. I
> hope to God that Iranians are hard core and
> willing to fight like rabid dogs. Somebody has to
> stop the cancerous imperial monster than the U.S.
> has become.


Since when did Al-Qaeda start posting here?

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Re: Pissing Match in the Persian Gulf
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: January 10, 2012 01:22PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-16493551



A second rescue now, this time by our Coast Guard stationed in the Gulf.

Blessed are the murderous.

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