FairTax.

Could it work?

If it does, would you want it to?

I could spend days trying to read up on it and still wouldn't understand it.

I'm just an average business owner but I'd really like some opinions.

Thanks

Silly Soylent. Those posters can only rehash the tag lines of their political masters. Asking for their interpretation, for them to think for themselves, is like asking your faucet to pour beer instead of water.

Fairtax is a consumption tax. It promotes a 27% tax rate, but the real tax rate is 36.9% since the 27 cents comes from the gross receipts after adding on the new tax. You're actually levying a 27 cent tax on 73 cents of final sales as currently recorded.

If you have to balance the budget using this consumption tax, the effective tax rate on purchases will probably be well in excess of 50 percent. It also has a welfare component where people are given a fixed amount (15-20K) each year to offset some of the pain.

Atom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Silly Soylent. Those posters can only rehash the
> tag lines of their political masters. Asking for
> their interpretation, for them to think for
> themselves, is like asking your faucet to pour
> beer instead of water.


Thanks Atom...I hadn't thought of asking anyone that toes the idiot line.

FYI...the people whose names I listed? ARE as smart as you believe yourself to be. While the may lean in one direction or the other is of no consequence to the question.

Now, answer the question or GTFO!

The Federal government has two main tools at its disposal for dealing with the economy. Monetary policy (the Fed) and fiscal policy (taxes and spending). I don't believe the Congress would relinquish its authority to fuck with the tax code in order to pass a Fair Tax. Is it a good thing or bad thing? I don't know. But the fact it will never be reality makes it moot.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

SoylentGreen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FairTax.
>
> Could it work?
>
> If it does, would you want it to?
>
> I could spend days trying to read up on it and
> still wouldn't understand it.
>
> I'm just an average business owner but I'd really
> like some opinions.
>
> Thanks


What about MrMisery, Conie, Tuttle, postponeck, JBass, Alias, eesh, 6X, Tomahawk,Dika-Dika, what are we, fucking idiots, why don't you include us, you snobby, stuckup, oneway bastard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you live off the grid, grow and hunt your own food, and barter services within your community, the fairtax is for you. You get free money.

The high tax rates will spawn an underground economy dealing in recycled good, as they're tax-exempt If you're skilled at remanufacturing and servicing used goods, this system is ideal for you. Your services are tax-free to the end-user as well.

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Federal government has two main tools at its
> disposal for dealing with the economy. Monetary
> policy (the Fed) and fiscal policy (taxes and
> spending). I don't believe the Congress would
> relinquish its authority to fuck with the tax code
> in order to pass a Fair Tax. Is it a good thing or
> bad thing? I don't know. But the fact it will
> never be reality makes it moot.


King George was never going to let the colonies go either.

Everything it would seem that comes out of Washington starts as some pie in the sky idea and by the time it exits...it's negotiated way down.

You don't believe the Fairtax could ever be incorporated somehow into our system?

Don't get me wrong..I'm not on board with it..just intrigued by the thought of a radical change from the system that serves us so well now (sarcasm).

What about? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about MrMisery, Conie, Tuttle, postponeck,
> JBass, Alias, eesh, 6X, Tomahawk,Dika-Dika, what
> are we, fucking idiots, why don't you include us,
> you snobby, stuckup, oneway bastard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


What about them?

Do you not believe them to be worthy of being called "anyone else"?

In case you hadn't noticed, I listed the names of those that have been particularly financially minded in the past.

But you knew that.

Les Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you live off the grid, grow and hunt your own
> food, and barter services within your community,
> the fairtax is for you. You get free money.
>
> The high tax rates will spawn an underground
> economy dealing in recycled good, as they're
> tax-exempt If you're skilled at remanufacturing
> and servicing used goods, this system is ideal for
> you. Your services are tax-free to the end-user
> as well.

I can do that now, Les. In fact, loads of people do.

The numbers in your previous post...I assume they're reflective of what we're paying now just coming from a different angle?

SoylentGreen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What about MrMisery, Conie, Tuttle, postponeck,
> > JBass, Alias, eesh, 6X, Tomahawk,Dika-Dika,
> what
> > are we, fucking idiots, why don't you include
> us,
> > you snobby, stuckup, oneway
> bastard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>
> What about them?
>
> Do you not believe them to be worthy of being
> called "anyone else"?
>
> In case you hadn't noticed, I listed the names of
> those that have been particularly financially
> minded in the past.
>
> But you knew that.


Shit!!! that's like the original Gilligan's Island ballad where they end with "and the rest, are here on Gilligan's Isle". Caused alot of hurt feelings with Mary-Anne and the Professor, but you knew that.

SoylentGreen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Don't get me wrong..I'm not on board with it..just
> intrigued by the thought of a radical change from
> the system that serves us so well now (sarcasm).


I really don't think Congress should abdicate its authority.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

@SG-The problem is whose Fair Tax proposal are we talking about. Most so-called fair tax proposals are essentially sales taxes which are inherently regressive. To minimize the regressive feature some include a rebate provision which can cause their own policy headaches. My main objection to it is the difficulty in collections, as it relies heavily on small business owners to properly report and pay over the taxes.

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> @SG-The problem is whose Fair Tax proposal are we
> talking about. Most so-called fair tax proposals
> are essentially sales taxes which are inherently
> regressive. To minimize the regressive feature
> some include a rebate provision which can cause
> their own policy headaches. My main objection to
> it is the difficulty in collections, as it relies
> heavily on small business owners to properly
> report and pay over the taxes.


I completely understand your concern re:collection.

As a small business owner I can assure you we are completely capable of collecting taxes........and do it a thousand different ways daily.

Not all actually forward those taxes to the appropriate place which in turn makes us all criminals in the eyes of the IRS.

Why does the tax code have to be so confounding? Is Fairtax (in any form) to the accounting industry like tort reform is to the legal industry?

The real problem with any change to the tax code will be what to do about Mortgage deductions and the like (for the primary home). No matter what form a reform takes, if you take the mortgage deduction out of home buying you will literally devalue the current price of homes another 30-50% within 1 year. Even taking away deductions for 2nd properties could have a debilitating effect - in particular if you keep in place taking off expenses for maintaining rental property. They act as forms of tax havens, and any change to that will further devalue the real estate market. The economy will not be able to eat that loss - and we will have a huge wave of defaults from current mortgage holders. Remember the S&L failure - this will be even bigger with the current amount of leverage tied up in all the underwater mortgages and Fannie and Freddie already.

So Fairtax - flat tax, whatever they come up with, they will have to deal with that elephant sitting in the room.

I am generally against any form of sales tax increase - I think it truly is regressive and hurts lower income families way too much. Just like higher gas prices have a much larger effect on low income families.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

I would love to see the tax code simplified I think it is a huge impediment to entrprenuers to expect random interpretations and conclusions from their tax returns. I have had many years when I do my taxes by hand or with TurboTax and then have an accountant friend check them out and I have an outcome that changes my payment up or down sometimes over a thousand dollars.

For small business people, it can be unsettling as we are not sure how to price our goods or services when we don't know how much tax we are going to wind up paying.

Get rid of a lot of deductions, even the home mortgage deduction that saves me money if you must, I would rather know what I am expected to pay instead of hving this big mystery every fucking year.

I am not that familiar with the FairTax, but I think an elimination and a move toward a consumption tax would be a good idea. The argument against it is that it is a regressive tax, but I disagree. Higher income people are buying large ticket items that lower income people aren't- ie yachts,planes, diamonds, minks etc etc.
Lower income people who are really just getting by would not be taxed for food, medicine etc and there would probably develop a good sizde underground market for used durable goods and clothing.

While we are at it, get the federal government out of a lot of the social programs and entitlements entirely. They are too big, remote and removed from the people they attempt to serve and a lot of this stuff would be much more effeciently managed at a state or county level.

When you think about it, the feds are in the "business" of a lot of things that they would love to convince you that they and onlythey can handle- total bullshit. They want a monopoly on the contracts and concessions of some of the most well intentioned and benevolent of programs for one reason only- they want the money to touch THEIR hands first before it "trickles down" to the Americans that do need a little help.

It wouldn't be perfect if the states started to administer things we're used to the feds doing, but I am certain it would run a lot smoother.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM