Dow Jones has dropped 150 points. Most gains for 2011 have been lost. BUMMER

It's called summer, learn to live with summer volatility or don't watch the markets. You were supposed to take profits in early April in order to have dry powder for summer, try again next year.

Stock Market Drops Below 12,000 Points Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dow Jones has dropped 150 points. Most gains for
> 2011 have been lost. BUMMER

Give Republicans a little control of Congress and a chance to vote on a big ticket item... The stock market drops almost immediately. Go figure.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's called summer, learn to live with summer
> volatility or don't watch the markets. You were
> supposed to take profits in early April in order
> to have dry powder for summer, try again next
> year.


It's also called ISM's report on manufacturing yesterday, personal income and spending , the PCI score and in a few minutes 3:00pm ET automobile and truck sales for July. So grow a brain fuck stool.

The market will continue to suffer under Obamas hate and punish the rich mindset. Why invest at all if you are going to be taxed on any gains at 33% or more. Investors will just park their money and ride out this guys term.
Why do you think gold is gangbusters. Safer than anything out there, even oil.

RR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's also called ISM's report on manufacturing
> yesterday, personal income and spending , the PCI
> score and in a few minutes 3:00pm ET automobile
> and truck sales for July. So grow a brain fuck
> stool.

So post your prediction that the Dow will not break 12,000 through year-end, Mr. non Fuck Stool. Odd... McSmack would call me that as he posted one wrong prediction after another. So you are probably him posting as an anonymous coward. Go ahead, document your prediction we won't see a tick above 12,000 this year on the Dow Mr. "Summers Don't Matter!!11!!!!". I dare you.

Obama is going to run out and say "cutting spending didn't work, we need to raise taxes. I was right, republicans were wrong" which is a farce because congress did not make any REAL meaningful cuts.

Can anyone of you Democratic supporters tell me EXACTLY how much we need to spend until we have spent enough? What number will satisfy you?

Slim Kramer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The market will continue to suffer under Obamas
> hate and punish the rich mindset. Why invest at
> all if you are going to be taxed on any gains at
> 33% or more. Investors will just park their money
> and ride out this guys term.
> Why do you think gold is gangbusters. Safer than
> anything out there, even oil.

Real investors won't be "parking their money" for the next six years. There is always money to be made. And if you just left the pittance that was in your 401k alone when Bush fled town, you'd have made back a shitload of the money you had lost.

I want inflation so we can have 10-15% savings interest at banks like it used to be in the 70s!

Quote

I want inflation so we can have 10-15% savings interest at banks like it used to be in the 70s!

yeah that's great until inflation hits 18 or 20%.

Real big money investors are already parking their money, just read any recent business report on it. When Bush left office gold was at $800 an ounce. It is now over $1,600. Think about it while you kneel before Obama. Three trillion more dollars spent we didnt have to stimulate a going nowhere economy. Or better yet kneel before your chinese masters who hold all the paper on us.
Just keep buying into obamas class warfare, it works so well on the simple minded such as yourself. Hate anyone more successful than yourself and see where it gets you.

That was the biggest difference between obama and Reagan. Reagan would look at a millionaire and say see if he did it you can too, America is a land of unlimited opportunity.
obama looks at a millionaire and says see what an evil country we have become when one person can control so much wealth. That my friend is the difference.

You all can kick all the Obama ass you want. But the truth is the current financial crisis is 80% the fault of Republicans. The Republicans havent made a correct economic decision in over 10 years. First it was Bush Jr. reducing taxes just when he shouldve been raising them...then the wars, that he refused to even add the cost of his personal vendetta wars to the budget, pure deficit, still he refused to raise taxes.

Now we have a bunch of rank ameatures who get elected promising jobs, jobs, jobs! ANd they probably believe that cutting govt spending will do that. The dye is cast, expect a lot worse as we implement Tea Bagger economics.

Europe debt problems haven't gone away. Italy is in crisis, as is Spain. When the Euro falls, it will add to the problems for the market.

Market also appears to be anticipating haircuts or collateral raises required for European debt (21% much too small for Greece), money market funds, US treasury debt, etc.

Hey dumbass, when obama took office the democrats controlled both houses for two years. Was Bush somehow using a Vulcan mind meld to keep obama from letting the tax cuts expire or to introduce new taxes?

Who spent a trillion dollars promising to stimulate the economy. Unemployment rates actually went up and are suspected to be closer to 20% than 9% due to those who ceased looking for a job altogether.

Keep drinking the Kool Aid and hating anyone more successful than yourself, which is probably 99% of the population.

Basic Keynsian economics says you stimluate a depressed economy. Not the opposite, but then again Tea Party economics isnt dependent on facts, just whatever makes political gain at the moment.

These teabag cuts will have unemplyment at record levels within months. A dream come true from a political party with dreams of taking the White House in 2012.

Republicans could nminate Jesus Christ himself and i wouldnt vote for him.

"but then again Tea Party economics isnt dependent on facts, just whatever makes political gain at the moment."

you mean like obama claiming eliminating tax credits on corporate jets will make our thirteen trillion dollar deficit disappear. All the guy has is class warfare. The guy is still on tv blaming Bush.

I notice you and your fellow Kool Aid drinkers ignored my question as to why obama didnt do anything his first two years when liberal democrats controlled both houses with a super majority. They could pass anything they wanted and the Republicans could not do a thing about it.

(Crickets chirping)

The people who buy into obamas class warfare are what is referered to as useful idiots. You believe every word out of his mouth, questioning nothing. What you know is there are many people out there more successful than yourselves.

But you think to yourself I am a nice guy so why shouldnt I be just as successful. So your reasoning is the rich must be terrible mean people to have accumulated so much money.

Wealth consolidation is good?

There's not as many really rich people as you think,,,The top 1% doesn't need you to lobby for them,they already got people on the payroll to do that for them,,,
Attachments:

It's stupid for people to look with envy at the wealthy or to try to formulate what an "equitable ratio" of wealth distribution will or should look like.

Some people are going to work harder, some people are going to work less, some people are going to get lucky breaks, some people are going to be unfortuante.

I think I figured this out pretty young.

Kicking up the top tax rate on the top % of wealthy Americans may do a little to help spending and the deficit, but it's not going to fix shit.

Washington could sell me on raising these rates if they would make a good faith effort to show me that they will make drastic cuts in defense, entitlements and the typical government boondoggle crap that has been feeding the Beast for way too long.

Unless they make that move first, I don't want to hear any of this class warfare shit that Obumass and Co. are trying to exploit.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

My advice is buy Greek bonds!

WingNut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's stupid for people to look with envy at the
> wealthy or to try to formulate what an "equitable
> ratio" of wealth distribution will or should look
> like.
>

Stupid! It is a simple concept. There is only so much money that a person can spend and that the accumulation of wealth by a chosen few (and the associated power that comes from that wealth) is or can be anti-republican. I would go as far as sayiong that the super accumulation of wealth is nothing more then a new royalty! The Ayn Rand worshipof the wealthy virtually implies that God has chosen these job creators and should therefor be worshipped.

> Some people are going to work harder, some people
> are going to work less, some people are going to
> get lucky breaks, some people are going to be
> unfortuante.

Of course you failed to tell the entire story. Do you assciate with working harder with success? Are there people who really dont work very hard and are successful? Say, like the children of the wealtyhy? The tranfer of wealth from generation to generation, is it healthy for the American reoublican experience? And the influence of the rich isnt just in the transfer of wealth. Donald Trump's son-in-law's parent bought their sons acceptance in an iVy League school and is honored for his accomplishment. Meanwhile a poorer man taking advantage of programs to improve himself is chastised and accused of cheating some deserving white man of his spot in the same University.
>
> I think I figured this out pretty young.
>
> Kicking up the top tax rate on the top % of
> wealthy Americans may do a little to help spending
> and the deficit, but it's not going to fix shit.

What a stupid statement. Increasing revenues means we need to cut the safety net less, means we can provide a better education to children. Money is power, money is influence, money is opportunity. Making sure all Americans have more of an opportunity for success is a tremendous accomplishment.
>
> Washington could sell me on raising these rates if
> they would make a good faith effort to show me
> that they will make drastic cuts in defense,
> entitlements and the typical government boondoggle
> crap that has been feeding the Beast for way too
> long.
>

Bullshit, Ive read your postings on here. You are a professional sceptic. One would think you have suffered in life. Instead you appear to be of the new middle class that feels he is entitled to what he has, has earned everything he has. When in reality you are a leach, merely taking advantage of the special bubble called the Washington DC money zone. Move to Dayton, OH for a year and let me hear how well your welfare ass is doing.

> Unless they make that move first, I don't want to
> hear any of this class warfare shit that Obumass
> and Co. are trying to exploit.

No one is more adapt at class warfare then Republicans. To think moving tax rates up to pre-Bush levels is a hardship is ludicrous. Every day Republicans attack women, minorities (tar-baby being just the latest example). Asking people to pay their fair share of taxes is not warfare. Attacking teachers and other civil servants is warfare. You speak rich speak, You speak "let them eat cake" speak. History has taught us many times that if you keep the barriers to opportunity high, sooner or later the Bastille will be torn down again!

Voltaire Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Of course you failed to tell the entire story. Do
> you assciate with working harder with success? Are
> there people who really dont work very hard and
> are successful? Say, like the children of the
> wealtyhy? The tranfer of wealth from generation
> to generation, is it healthy for the American
> reoublican experience?

How about instead of gazing on the wealth and fortunes of others, you take the actions needed on a get-rich-slowly basis to build your wealth and pass more on to your heirs? If you teach them proper finance, proper behavior during childhood that leads to a productive, professional career, that coupled with a financial boost will make YOUR family one of those you envy.

As I have become older I have a wiser perspective on the "who works harder should get more money, it is not fair!" argument. I would begin to agree if one can demonstrate a lifetime of working hard and taking opportunities available. Here in NoVA I have many friends who work harder at their jobs than I do but I make more than them. But when I was a teen I was the one not doing drugs, not drinking (heavily), not getting in trouble with the law. I was the one who took school seriously and saw the bigger picture that fun stuff now hurts the ability for fun stuff later.

There are some that have hard luck their whole lives. But most do have opportunities to have very rich, productive lives. Anyone can start a business, for example, but few do because they don't want or have that drive. That doesn't mean those who do should be criticized, or have their rewards for taking risks like that taken away and handed to those less deserving of success.

But that is okay. While you complain about tar baby comments, I'll be focused on continuing to build wealth for my family. And I am a pro "socialized medicine!!!!1!!!!1!" leftist. I just choose to work within the system we have and not waste energies on stupid stuff.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2011 09:43AM by justsayin.

<polite golf clap>

Volitiare

1)What is the maximum amount of money a wealthy person can spend?

2)Just because you think the new super wealthy is akin to "new royalty" does make it true

3)Working hard in itself is not the only determining factor to being wealthy. Working hard is the first step, followed by taking RISK then LUCK. Most people work hard, even fewer take risks, the few that do take risks, actually get lucky.

4)Stop worrying about the wealthy and what they do because it doesnt matter. Instead focus on yourself.

5)"What a stupid statement. Increasing revenues means we need to cut the safety net less, means we can provide a better education to children. Money is power, money is influence, money is opportunity. Making sure all Americans have more of an opportunity for success is a tremendous accomplishment."
- You're assuming the Government runs at 100% efficiency, which is simply not true. Even the best run businesses operate with inefficiencies. The government wastes resources on grants to study the mating habits of insects, rodents; prosecuting people smuggeling non-lowflow toilets from Canada; prosecuting mothers for trying to save a wood pecker; issuing hurricane relief checks that get used to buy luxury good etc, etc. Point being the government had plenty of room to cut spending and still offer "social new" services.

6)Back in the 1930's people used to move to where the job were. Thats where the term carpet bagger originated from. Wingnut took a risk, moved to DC where he saw a vibrant job market, made money and it paid off. Good for him! How about you go to Dayton and tell everyone about the great job market here.

7)"History has taught us many times that if you keep the barriers to opportunity high, sooner or later the Bastille will be torn down again!"
- That is RICH. Barriers to opportunities are REGULATIONS! Liberals and Democrats want to regulate EVERYTHING such as light-bulbs, toilets, HEALTHCARE, the foods we eat. Which is done through statutes and taxes. Just compare and contrast the different roads California, being a highly regulated and taxed state and Texas being lower regulated and taxed state, have taken over the past two decades. Which one has the more robust economy? Overwhelmingly Texas.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2011 10:12AM by Hay Zeus.

you are an idito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The people who buy into obamas class warfare are
> what is referered to as useful idiots. You believe
> every word out of his mouth, questioning nothing.
> What you know is there are many people out there
> more successful than yourselves.
>
> But you think to yourself I am a nice guy so why
> shouldnt I be just as successful. So your
> reasoning is the rich must be terrible mean people
> to have accumulated so much money.

Wow, in one post this fuckstick claims to know what other people believe, question, know, think and reason. That has got to be a record for something.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> RR Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It's also called ISM's report on manufacturing
> > yesterday, personal income and spending , the
> PCI
> > score and in a few minutes 3:00pm ET automobile
> > and truck sales for July. So grow a brain fuck
> > stool.
>
> So post your prediction that the Dow will not
> break 12,000 through year-end, Mr. non Fuck Stool.
> Odd... McSmack would call me that as he posted
> one wrong prediction after another. So you are
> probably him posting as an anonymous coward. Go
> ahead, document your prediction we won't see a
> tick above 12,000 this year on the Dow Mr.
> "Summers Don't Matter!!11!!!!". I dare you.


First of all I'll call you any fucking thing I want. Second if someone else has referred to you as a fuck stool also they are right and confirm what I have been saying about you all along.

Now as for your response to Voltaire Bravo!
However in your words "gazing on the wealth and fortunes of others" is exactly what you have to do to implement socialized medicine and any other of your favorite social safety net programs. Except you can't just "gazing on the wealth and fortunes of others" you must confiscate it at obscene and immoral rates.

You can't have it both ways. A little freedom and a little tyranny. Our welfare state, safety net, whatever you want to call it has turned into a monster and is now eating and threatening to devour the very resources needed to jump start the economy.

Not sure how you are building your families wealth but if you are employed in the public sector, gubment job however you want to put it , you are not building wealth you are sowing wealth created by others and distributing it to you .

You sound like a public employee. I hope you are not. You are one mixed up cat dude. Hope you get things figured out.

What obscene and immoral rates? By historical terms income tax rates for upper end individuals are lower today than they have been in a very long time. (Yes I know that there was a brief period of time in the late 1980s when the top marginal Federal rate was 28%, but that rate applied to ALL taxable income, including income from qualified dividends and long term capital gains.) Even if you add in the additional "Obamacare" medicare tax you are still fairly low historically. In addition if you compare the rates in the US against rates in most western developed nations, our rates are generally lower, and that includes nations like Germany that are performing well economically.

Conservatives like to say that the Liberal moto is "let someone else pay for it", but the truth is that Conservatives are doing the same thing.

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What obscene and immoral rates? By historical
> terms income tax rates for upper end individuals
> are lower today than they have been in a very long
> time. (Yes I know that there was a brief period
> of time in the late 1980s when the top marginal
> Federal rate was 28%, but that rate applied to ALL
> taxable income, including income from qualified
> dividends and long term capital gains.) Even if
> you add in the additional "Obamacare" medicare tax
> you are still fairly low historically. In
> addition if you compare the rates in the US
> against rates in most western developed nations,
> our rates are generally lower, and that includes
> nations like Germany that are performing well
> economically.
>
> Conservatives like to say that the Liberal moto is
> "let someone else pay for it", but the truth is
> that Conservatives are doing the same thing.

Does your analysis include state and local rates?

RR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not sure how you are building your families wealth
> but if you are employed in the public sector,
> gubment job however you want to put it , you are
> not building wealth you are sowing wealth created
> by others and distributing it to you .

So when a cop saves your life you are going to bitch at him for sucking on wealth. When a transportation engineer studies a bridge and determines it will fall down and kill people unless it is closed and repaired, you say that is skimming off the wealth of the country. Firefighters are drawing moneymilk from the tits of all our wealth, saving our lives with OUR MONEY!!!1!1!!1!!!!!!!

Love how simple-minded pinheads screech about government spending unless it is government spending on them. Who are the leeches?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2011 01:00PM by justsayin.

justsayin Wrote:
> So when a cop saves your life you are going to
> bitch at him for sucking on wealth. When a
> transportation engineer studies a bridge and
> determines it will fall down and kill people
> unless it is closed and repaired, you say that is
> skimming off the wealth of the country.
> Firefighters are drawing moneymilk from the tits
> of all our wealth, saving out lives with OUR
> MONEY!!!1!1!!1!!!!!!!

Yet Obama has no problem implying they and the military will be the first ones not to be paid or will be the first ones to have their jobs cut to make budget ends meet. Because we really need to make sure the essential work force of Bureau of Indian Affairs and Dept of Edu gets paid first.

To Mr. Non Fuck Stool. The summer volatility exists for real reasons. Or it's supposed to. Or that's why we use the Dow as a market indicator.

Maybe that's a Problem?

Republicans are generally douches, but they seem okay with that.

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> justsayin Wrote:
> > So when a cop saves your life you are going to
> > bitch at him for sucking on wealth. When a
> > transportation engineer studies a bridge and
> > determines it will fall down and kill people
> > unless it is closed and repaired, you say that
> is
> > skimming off the wealth of the country.
> > Firefighters are drawing moneymilk from the
> tits
> > of all our wealth, saving out lives with OUR
> > MONEY!!!1!1!!1!!!!!!!
>
> Yet Obama has no problem implying they and the
> military will be the first ones not to be paid or
> will be the first ones to have their jobs cut to
> make budget ends meet. Because we really need to
> make sure the essential work force of Bureau of
> Indian Affairs and Dept of Edu gets paid first.

I'm going to go out on a sturdy limb and suggested that he mentioned Congressional and military paychecks because those are the ones that people care about the most. At least Congress cares about their own paychecks and the American public certainly cares about making sure the military gets paid.

@ Hank

Are you suggesting people care about congress being paid on time..???

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What obscene and immoral rates? By historical
> terms income tax rates for upper end individuals
> are lower today than they have been in a very long
> time. (Yes I know that there was a brief period
> of time

You bet Bill and about 47% of you mother fuckers out there pay no federal taxes and get credit on a lot of other shit. Public sector fuckers like you are a static drag on the economy so you count just like you are on welfare when it comes to wealth creation, but here is a snapshot of where we are now.


Corporate Taxes;
Currently the Federal Corporate tax rate is 35% (highest in the world) with the highest rates among states up to 12%

Income Taxes;
35% top federal and the top state rate right now is 10.5%

Payroll taxes;
2.9-15.3% (federal, regressive)
0-2% (states, usually regressive)

various VAT's Sales and GST's (goods and services)
0-10.25% (states and local)

Then after all that Bill if you are an employer (which you are not) you get to pay all sorts of hidden and not so hidden costs thanks to all sorts of regulatory requirements from all levels of government. But you'll never have to worry about that because you are a worthless government worker who has no incentive or self initiative to do better..

Anyhow you tell me Bill. What's fair? I submit you know nothing about capitalism or free market economics and don't care to as long as you get your government issued auto-deposit every 2 weeks. You are not only an asshole you are an ungrateful asshole who feels entitled to other peoples money even though you have absolutely 0 skills to survive in the real world.

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bill N Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> Does your analysis include state and local rates?

Fair enough. As my post indicated no it does not reflect these rates. The problem with incorporating them is that you are dealing with a wide number of variables. When I started working I think the maximum Virginia rate was 5%, and I think under Baliles it went up to 5.75% where it has stayed for a very long period of time. In other states you don't see this same degree of stability.

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> @ Hank
>
> Are you suggesting people care about congress
> being paid on time..???

No, not at all. Perhaps I stuffed too much in to my statement. I'm suggesting congress cares about their paychecks and those of the military. Those are two hot button issues for them.

It was a similar situation with him saying, "Ronald Reagan wouldn't put up with this." Do you really think he was comparing himself to Reagan?

I get your cynicism but really, not everything the guy says must be extrapolated to absurd extremes.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2011 01:43PM by Hank Moody.

RR: I just love how you know so much about me and my job. Well if you want to assume that I am a Federal or state employee who knows nothing and does nothing, knock yourself out. You are just proving that your own prejudices are blinding you. But please stop feeding the BS to everyone else and start putting out some correct facts.

First, that 47% figure you love to throw out is the percentage of taxpayers who don't pay INCOME taxes. It does not reflect the percentage who pay no social security or medicare taxes. In addition it does not reflect the relative wealth of taxpayers who pay no income taxes. News flash. There are quite a few wealthy individuals who between deductions, credits, nontaxable income and favorable rates for dividends and capital gains end up in that 47% figure. And also if you had bothered to read my posts on this topic over the last couple of years you might remember that I actually favor revising the tax code so that more people are paying some income taxes.

Corporate top rates are 35% as you mention, but how many corporations actually pay anything close to that rate? Don't drag out that Such and such corporation paid 40%+ of their taxable income in Federal income taxes last year. Those figures in most instances reflect the taxes actually paid during the year, and can include taxes due on the prior year's return and income tax adjustments on returns from years before that. Yes my fellow liberals have done the same thing over the years claiming that a particular corporation paid no income taxes when the corporation in fact paid those taxes in a prior or following year. As for state rates I think Virginia has held fairly constant at 6%.

That 35% top Federal rate applies only to certain types of income, with others taxed at 25%, 20% or lower rates. Whether you actually pay 35% on any of your income depends not only on the level of your income, but also the source.

The payroll tax figure is once again misleading. First, at the moment the Federal rate for social security taxes is 10.4% meaning that the total social security and medicare is 13.3%. Second, part of that amount is paid by the employer and part by the employee. If you were an employer you would be paying 7.65% of that tax, as the balance would be paid to the employee as wages. Now you also would be paying unemployement taxes on wages as well, but for many companies that comes to .8% of the first $7,000 in wages. Third, you note that these taxes are regressive, but you choose not display them as such. A more realistic approach would be to indicate that Federal payroll rates for most companies run from 8.45% down to 1.45% As for state rates the only payroll tax I am familiar with is unemployement, which IIRC can run as high as around 6% of the first $8,000, but many employers pay less than 1% of that rate. At least in Virginia the rates are based on a variety of factors including the industry, the company's unemployment claims history and whether the fund has dropped below certain levels. You also do not mention that for owner-employees these taxes can be avoided by either treating them as "distributions" if a sub-S corporation or as "dividends" if a C corporation.

You are correct that sales taxes also figure into the equation, but quoting the rates themselves is misleading. In some states sales taxes are used in lieu of (or to reduce rates on) income taxes. In other states they are happy to pile on both at high levels and in others they have kept both low. Virginia's income tax rates have shown greater stability in my lifetime than sales tax rates. I recall them being 4%, then going to 4.5% and not 5%. However this ignores the fact that for some purchases those rates have declined to 2%. I also note that you failed to mention that sales taxes are very regressive as well, hitting lower income people (many of whom are in that 47% you complain about) harder than the higher income people you align yourself with.

Regulatory costs are a problem, but they should not all be lumped together. Some of these costs are tied to monitoring or alleviating negative aspects of certain industries and are quite often legitimate. Some are simply record keeping or reporting requirements which governments should make concerted efforts to make as easy as possible for companies to meet. As the owner of a construction company you might feel regulations requiring you to spend money in order to prevent runoff from your worksite getting into nearby streams. However if you lived downstream from that worksite and were watching the stream behind your house becoming fouled with that runoff, you might feel differently.

I see you have once again avoided my question-What is a fair maximum rate? At what point does a tax rate move from being fair to being, as you called it obscene and immoral?

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------> might feel differently.
>
> I see you have once again avoided my question-What
> is a fair maximum rate? At what point does a tax
> rate move from being fair to being, as you called
> it obscene and immoral?


Jesus H Christ Bill! your responses are rivaling the length of the tax code itself! In length and bullshit!

17% flat tax on income over 40k individual 80k couples.

And until we get this crap figured out I think we should kill all tax payer funded contributions to public sector employee pension funds. All of them. From the White House all the way down to the fucking Dog catcher. This would include you.

RR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And until we get this crap figured out I think we
> should kill all tax payer funded contributions to
> public sector employee pension funds. All of them.
> From the White House all the way down to the
> fucking Dog catcher. This would include you.

I dare you to put that on a sign and stand under it at a local police station. So brave posting anonymously on some internet forum. Go sit with that sign in front of the houses where police officers live, you know, the Clifton and Great Falls mansions. Let us know where and when you'll be protesting unmasked in front of food safety commissions so PUBLIC-PAID meat inspectors will know you are in favor of cutting their benefits.

I have a better idea, let's cut out ALL mortgage interest deductions. That is government paying people back tax money they otherwise owed. If I rent and you own, you are sucking the tit of my tax dollar by paying less taxes because you pay mortgage interest. CRIMINAL!!!!11!!1!!

The market is suffering because we have no scams left to artificially inflate it. No more massive billion dollar ponzi schemes, no more sub-prime mortgage backed securities, no more interest-only mortgages, no more stated income mortgage approvals.

The good days are over indeed!!!!

The days of easy money and a perceived sense of financial success are long gone! What is reality anyway? I just want to believe I'm successful, and then die before my assets crumble in value. That, my friend, is a successful existence on earth!

Justsayin' you have to be one of the biggest retards here defending Obama and Big Government. If you're not medicated, you should be, if you are on medication- you should quit.


You jump to the illogical conclusions that anyone who wants to trim the size of government is calling for anarchy of some kind- the outright dismantling of the FDA,EPA etc etc. Sure, asshole- anyone who wants accountabilty and trimming of the bloat must also want to remove fire extinguishers from schools and repeal child labor laws.

You are an hysterical twat playing the politics of fear, we're proud of you.

The senseless growth of federal government and the hogs gone wild feeding frenzy brought on by Bush and ramped up by Obama needs to be stopped. There are loads of cuts that could be made to the Depts of Education, Defense, HUD etc that would not only save $$ but boost confidence and trust in our government at home and abroad.

Fuck yourself cunt.

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> RR Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > And until we get this crap figured out I think
> we
> > should kill all tax payer funded contributions
> to
> > public sector employee pension funds. All of
> them.
> > From the White House all the way down to the
> > fucking Dog catcher. This would include you.
>
> I dare you to put that on a sign and stand under
> it at a local police station. So brave posting
> anonymously on some internet forum. Go sit with
> that sign in front of the houses where police
> officers live, you know, the Clifton and Great
> Falls mansions. Let us know where and when you'll
> be protesting unmasked in front of food safety
> commissions so PUBLIC-PAID meat inspectors will
> know you are in favor of cutting their benefits.
>
> I have a better idea, let's cut out ALL mortgage
> interest deductions. That is government paying
> people back tax money they otherwise owed. If I
> rent and you own, you are sucking the tit of my
> tax dollar by paying less taxes because you pay
> mortgage interest. CRIMINAL!!!!11!!1!!

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

DOW goes up 30 points and the media is hailing obama as an economic genius. They ignore the drop of -400 points just before today.
Will this guy ever stand on his own two feet?

FrostedMiniWheats Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The market is suffering because we have no scams
> left to artificially inflate it. No more massive
> billion dollar ponzi schemes, no more sub-prime
> mortgage backed securities, no more interest-only
> mortgages, no more stated income mortgage
> approvals.
>
> The good days are over indeed!!!!
>
> The days of easy money and a perceived sense of
> financial success are long gone! What is reality
> anyway? I just want to believe I'm successful,
> and then die before my assets crumble in value.
> That, my friend, is a successful existence on
> earth!

The only scams and ponzi schemes left are the ones run by the Federal Government. Most notedly Social Security, that giant unfunded liability which we are legally compelled to contribute to.

Frosted wrote "no more interest-only mortgages"

You hit it right on the head. What a disaster that was. Before that crap started you were required to have a substantial down payment plus the principal plus interest couldnt be more than 2x your salary a month.
In other words you had to earn the right to buy a home not have it given to you by the government and shady loan companies.

Voltaire Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WingNut Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It's stupid for people to look with envy at the
> > wealthy or to try to formulate what an
> "equitable
> > ratio" of wealth distribution will or should
> look
> > like.
> >
>
> Stupid! It is a simple concept. There is only so
> much money that a person can spend and that the
> accumulation of wealth by a chosen few (and the
> associated power that comes from that wealth) is
> or can be anti-republican. I would go as far as
> sayiong that the super accumulation of wealth is
> nothing more then a new royalty! The Ayn Rand
> worshipof the wealthy virtually implies that God
> has chosen these job creators and should therefor
> be worshipped.



Wealth accumulated by "a chosen few"? Besides those who inherit wealth, how are the other ones "chosen"? No hard work is ever involved, is there?

>
> > Some people are going to work harder, some
> people
> > are going to work less, some people are going
> to
> > get lucky breaks, some people are going to be
> > unfortuante.
>
> Of course you failed to tell the entire story. Do
> you assciate with working harder with success? Are
> there people who really dont work very hard and
> are successful? Say, like the children of the
> wealtyhy? The tranfer of wealth from generation
> to generation, is it healthy for the American
> reoublican experience? And the influence of the
> rich isnt just in the transfer of wealth. Donald
> Trump's son-in-law's parent bought their sons
> acceptance in an iVy League school and is honored
> for his accomplishment. Meanwhile a poorer man
> taking advantage of programs to improve himself is
> chastised and accused of cheating some deserving
> white man of his spot in the same University.
> >
> > I think I figured this out pretty young.
> >
> > Kicking up the top tax rate on the top % of
> > wealthy Americans may do a little to help
> spending
> > and the deficit, but it's not going to fix
> shit.
>
> What a stupid statement. Increasing revenues
> means we need to cut the safety net less, means we
> can provide a better education to children. Money
> is power, money is influence, money is
> opportunity. Making sure all Americans have more
> of an opportunity for success is a tremendous
> accomplishment.
> >
> > Washington could sell me on raising these rates
> if
> > they would make a good faith effort to show me
> > that they will make drastic cuts in defense,
> > entitlements and the typical government
> boondoggle
> > crap that has been feeding the Beast for way
> too
> > long.
> >
>
> Bullshit, Ive read your postings on here. You are
> a professional sceptic. One would think you have
> suffered in life.

You know me pretty good, don't you, bitch boy?


> Instead you appear to be of the
> new middle class that feels he is entitled to what
> he has, has earned everything he has. When in
> reality you are a leach, merely taking advantage
> of the special bubble called the Washington DC
> money zone. Move to Dayton, OH for a year and let
> me hear how well your welfare ass is doing.

Dayton, Ohio? Why don't you make that move, faggot? I could move if I wanted and do fine, I have one enterprise that is locally based, but everything else I make money from I could do anywhere in America. My overhead and cost of living would be less too.

>
> > Unless they make that move first, I don't want
> to
> > hear any of this class warfare shit that
> Obumass
> > and Co. are trying to exploit.
>
> No one is more adapt at class warfare then
> Republicans. To think moving tax rates up to
> pre-Bush levels is a hardship is ludicrous. Every
> day Republicans attack women, minorities (tar-baby
> being just the latest example). Asking people to
> pay their fair share of taxes is not warfare.
> Attacking teachers and other civil servants is
> warfare. You speak rich speak, You speak "let
> them eat cake" speak. History has taught us many
> times that if you keep the barriers to opportunity
> high, sooner or later the Bastille will be torn
> down again!


The Bastille will come down again? You are a drama fairy and I seriously doubt you could kick any door down physically or mentally. Che shirts and Maoist fantasy camp will only take you so far. dicksucker.

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM

WingNut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You jump to the illogical conclusions that anyone
> who wants to trim the size of government is
> calling for anarchy of some kind- the outright
> dismantling of the FDA,EPA etc etc. Sure, asshole-
> anyone who wants accountabilty and trimming of the
> bloat must also want to remove fire extinguishers
> from schools and repeal child labor laws.

Call me all the names you want, but why don't you read what I quoted and responded to? I responded to allegations that public service employees are a pure suck on our economy, pointing out things everyone forgets about.

I laugh at your name calling, you are too busy knee-jerking to read what I wrote and what I was responding too! LOL!

justsayin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WingNut Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > You jump to the illogical conclusions that
> anyone
> > who wants to trim the size of government is
> > calling for anarchy of some kind- the outright
> > dismantling of the FDA,EPA etc etc. Sure,
> asshole-
> > anyone who wants accountabilty and trimming of
> the
> > bloat must also want to remove fire
> extinguishers
> > from schools and repeal child labor laws.
>
> Call me all the names you want, but why don't you
> read what I quoted and responded to? I responded
> to allegations that public service employees are a
> pure suck on our economy, pointing out things
> everyone forgets about.
>
> I laugh at your name calling, you are too busy
> knee-jerking to read what I wrote and what I was
> responding too! LOL!

You are not only a fuck wad you are a cowardly fuck wad. No one forgot the police, firemen ect. You are just using our most valuable citizens to advance your agenda. That's all they mean to you. You use them as a pawn in your fucked up chess game of life. You should be ashamed but you have no soul. You have 0 capacity for logic, common sense or decency. For that you will burn in hell.

Let's fund them all 110% and pay for it by getting rid of dregs like you. You are a stain and a static drag on our country. You are a plague and will be stopped.

-270+

Dow Jones Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> -270+

Wow! That's SIGNIFICANT!

Not.

4 more years Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dow Jones Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > -270+
>
> Wow! That's SIGNIFICANT!
>
> Not.


a 2% drop in an hour and a half isn't significant?

How stupid are you? Seriously, do you win prizes for being that stupid?

RR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are not only a fuck wad you are a cowardly
> fuck wad. No one forgot the police, firemen ect.
> You are just using our most valuable citizens to
> advance your agenda. That's all they mean to you.
> You use them as a pawn in your fucked up chess
> game of life. You should be ashamed but you have
> no soul. You have 0 capacity for logic, common
> sense or decency. For that you will burn in hell.
>
> Let's fund them all 110% and pay for it by getting
> rid of dregs like you. You are a stain and a
> static drag on our country. You are a plague and
> will be stopped.

Do not bother with the silly demokkrats here. According to another thread we have probably run him and his liberal agenda off our forum. We know we are in the right with these demokrats and it is now time to focus on jobs and tell this demokrat Senate to get its ass in gear creating job growth instead of trying to pump more money to B. Hussein Obama's FAA.

------------------------------------

twitter @EyeAmU

If you trade stocks on a minute-to-minute basis this is important. If you invest it's just another blip.

See, for example, the dramatic decline back near the May 2010 time period - MUCH more of a blip yet still a blip. In fact, if you look at the pricing over that last two years - a short investing time frame - you'll see dramatic moves MUCH greater than what has happened over the last couple days.

Perhaps your problem is shortsightedness - you have no grasp of the long term and want results NOW NOW NOW!

Bad mistake.

I thought Obama's number 1 was focus was J-O-B-S

4 more years Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you trade stocks on a minute-to-minute basis
> this is important. If you invest it's just another
> blip.
>
> See, for example, the dramatic decline back near
> the May 2010 time period - MUCH more of a blip yet
> still a blip. In fact, if you look at the pricing
> over that last two years - a short investing time
> frame - you'll see dramatic moves MUCH greater
> than what has happened over the last couple days.
>
> Perhaps your problem is shortsightedness - you
> have no grasp of the long term and want results
> NOW NOW NOW!
>
> Bad mistake.

You are missing the systemic underlying problems causing these blips. In actuality, you are the one who is shortsighted. I feel bad for you.

2% Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are missing the systemic underlying problems
> causing these blips...

Oh. Okay.

4 more years Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 2% Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > You are missing the systemic underlying
> problems
> > causing these blips...
>
> Oh. Okay.

acknowledgement is a good first step for you. No only if we can get you off your "landslide" delusion.

Obama Failure! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I thought Obama's number 1 was focus was J-O-B-S

Uh...the "jobs" number was better than expected. Whether that means anything more about Obama than one that is "worst than expected" I would guess entirely depends on your view of those doing the estimating...I guess.

conVince Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We know
> we are in the right with these demokrats and it is
> now time to focus on jobs and tell this demokrat
> Senate to get its ass in gear creating job growth
> instead of trying to pump more money to B. Hussein
> Obama's FAA.

And your solution to job creation will be what?...Expansive tax cuts and other trickle down BS no doubt. If right wing Republican legislators actually wanted to produce job growth and believed that tax cuts were a way to do it, let them come out with tax cuts which only apply to businesses which hire new employees on a long term basis at reasonable rates, AND which are paid for with current offsetting revenue increases. THEN the U.S. can reasonably believe they are serious about creating job growth, rather than using job growth as a cover to cut taxes those right wingers don't want to pay or programs they don't like.

-352
Gold or RMB Biaatch !!

Spoke too soon. It's down. 300 points now.

BFD, huh?

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> conVince Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > We know
> > we are in the right with these demokrats and it
> is
> > now time to focus on jobs and tell this
> demokrat
> > Senate to get its ass in gear creating job
> growth
> > instead of trying to pump more money to B.
> Hussein
> > Obama's FAA.
>
> And your solution to job creation will be
> what?...Expansive tax cuts and other trickle down
> BS no doubt. If right wing Republican legislators
> actually wanted to produce job growth and believed
> that tax cuts were a way to do it, let them come
> out with tax cuts which only apply to businesses
> which hire new employees on a long term basis at
> reasonable rates, AND which are paid for with
> current offsetting revenue increases. THEN the
> U.S. can reasonably believe they are serious about
> creating job growth, rather than using job growth
> as a cover to cut taxes those right wingers don't
> want to pay or programs they don't like.

One nice thing about your gubmint job Bill is you've never looked busier since you started posting here. I'm sure your supervisor has made note and will give you an extra special flowery review to put in your personnel file.

really dude! if a tree fell on your job would it make a sound?

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And your solution to job creation will be
> what?...Expansive tax cuts and other trickle down
> BS no doubt.

No we start as RR said with voting out all of the demokrats and that will be a good start. This is their man's economy, everyone is praying for the Bush days now.

------------------------------------

twitter @EyeAmU

Gubmint too much in debt for more tax cuts and spending. Time to fend for youselves instead of asking for more handouts. Knowing debt > GDP and solvency crisis approaching for US, any money you give me go to gold and offshore. Thank you very much.

Bill N Wrote:
>
> And your solution to job creation will be
> what?...Expansive tax cuts and other trickle down
> BS no doubt. If right wing Republican legislators
> actually wanted to produce job growth and believed
> that tax cuts were a way to do it, let them come
> out with tax cuts which only apply to businesses
> which hire new employees on a long term basis at
> reasonable rates, AND which are paid for with
> current offsetting revenue increases. THEN the
> U.S. can reasonably believe they are serious about
> creating job growth, rather than using job growth
> as a cover to cut taxes those right wingers don't
> want to pay or programs they don't like.


People do not go into business to hire people, they go into business to make money. Hiring and job creation is the result of successful expanding business. Companies hire based on projected growth looking ahead between 3-5 years.

Suggesting that creating a tax incentive for business to hire just proves how ignorant you are. Such incentive will have a marginal impact on job creation at best. If business are satisfied with their current bottom lines they are not going to hire a few people to sit around and not do anything because there isn't any work for them. And thats perfectly within their rights.

If Democrats are serious about creating job growth they should stop tinkering with the economy. Stop with the spending, stop the threats of raising taxes, stop the printing of money, stop the new regulations and reduce the uncertainty.

Well RR you seem to be outposting me of late. Since you are in that productive private industry you must be sweating your boss finding out. As for me you know the work load of us dog catchers can vary. I can use the down time to respond to right wingers like you. Fortunately with all of that stimulus money Obama gave us the county was able to provide us with our own smartphones and added such wonderful items as the tax code to our dog catcher's manual. Sorry, but got to run-lunch break.

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> People do not go into business to hire people,
> they go into business to make money. Hiring and
> job creation is the result of successful expanding
> business. Companies hire based on projected growth
> looking ahead between 3-5 years.
>

Then why do Republicans call them "job creators"? Let's call them what they are, "money makers". That is their primary goal. Job creation and employees are merely side effects and largely unwanted ones at that. The Street does not reward with higher stock prices because a company hires bodies.

Your assessment of companies exercising discipline to plan hiring 3 to 5 years ahead is laughable, especially to anyone that has worked for a Fortune 500 company, or even a small to medium sized business.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/04/2011 12:26PM by Hank Moody.

Hank Moody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Then why do Republicans call them "job creators"?
> Let's call them what they are, "money makers".

I have no clue, I don't advise the Republicans.

> That is their primary goal. Job creation and
> employees are merely side effects and largely
> unwanted ones at that. The Street does not reward
> with higher stock prices because a company hires
> bodies.

Really? I used to work in public accounting and was billed out at $90hr. Did i earn $90/hr, no. The company paid me about 1/3, 1/3 went to overhead, 1/3 to the partners as pure profit. Therefore it is in the best interest of the partners to generate as much business as possible. Successfully business generation will eventually create a need for new hires as the workloads exceeds capacity. The example provided can be applied to other service oriented industries.

> Your assessment of companies exercising discipline
> to plan hiring 3 to 5 years ahead is laughable,
> especially to anyone that has worked for a Fortune
> 500 company, or even a small to medium sized
> business.

To clarify: a business will ponder "will we have enough work to sustain new hires for the next 3-5 years???". However, if you're going to disagree than please provide the correct information.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/04/2011 12:51PM by FurfaxTownie.

I'm not saying business generation won't generate jobs, especially in a pure serviced based industry you have cited. But there's no guarantee the jobs will be generated locally. Most likely they will be offshored until either the day comes that the tax code does not favor overseas profits or it becomes favorable (i.e. profitable) to hire domestically.

I work for a publicly traded Fortune 500 company. They do not ponder the demand 3 to 5 years in advance. We're lucky if we can budget and plan beyond 18 months. Anyone who can plan that far ahead is sucking on long term, most likely government, contracts. They're not responding to the changing marketplace or economy.

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well RR you seem to be outposting me of late.
> Since you are in that productive private industry
> you must be sweating your boss finding out.

Dude I'm so hap hap hap happy to inform you that,,,,,I am the boss. so you can stop worrying your pretty little head over it.

As
> for me you know the work load of us dog catchers
> can vary. I can use the down time to respond to
> right wingers like you. Fortunately with all of
> that stimulus money Obama gave us the county was
> able to provide us with our own smartphones and
> added such wonderful items as the tax code to our
> dog catcher's manual. Sorry, but got to run-lunch
> break.

Kudos Bill! we may not agree on much (however you may agree with me more than you know) but we have the same sense of humor.

And let me say this. I don't bitch slap you because of hate or anger, I bitch slap you because it's fun and I enjoy it.For that I thank you.

Now when you post stuff like;

"If Democrats are serious about creating job growth they should stop tinkering with the economy. Stop with the spending, stop the threats of raising taxes, stop the printing of money, stop the new regulations and reduce the uncertainty."

How am I suppose to bitch slap you over something like that?

Now let's look at your, "Suggesting that creating a tax incentive for business to hire just proves how ignorant you are. Such incentive will have a marginal impact on job creation at best." statement.

Remember TEFRA? 1982??

For comparison purposes, economic growth during the first seven quarters of the Reagan recovery in the 1980s boomed at an average of 7.1%. Economic growth during the first seven quarters of the Obama non-recovery has now been reduced to an average of 2.6%, barely a third as much.

I know you'll give full credit to Paul Volcker for this so go ahead.
Put your ignorance on display for all to see!

I guess the Republicans were wrong when they said that "the debate over the debt ceiling will help markets." Christ Republicans could fuck up a wet dream.

The problem is there's a huge gap created by the loss of home equity being cashed out for consumption. 3 to 6 percent of GDP is rougly 450 to 850 billion dollars. A two-year 800 billion dollar stimulus only approaches offsetting the lower end of the range.

Republicans have lost touch with reality. They want the govt back to the size it was in 1776...along with the stock market. They are dogmatic in a world that requires flexibility and agility.

In 1988, libertarian political writer Sheldon Richman described TEFRA as "the largest tax increase in American history."

The Sad Legacy of Ronald Reagan

You bet Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Republicans have lost touch with reality. They
> want the govt back to the size it was in
> 1776...along with the stock market. They are
> dogmatic in a world that requires flexibility and
> agility.

LMOA, yeah start over with the basic Constitution. Forget about all the lessons learned since 1776.

I love how we're statically comparing the economy of 30 years ago and the recovery under Reagan with that of today.

Someone educate me. I'm not old enough to remember.

What was the trade deficit as a percentage of GDP under Reagan?
What was China's GDP back in 1982?
What was the GDP of the European Union in 1982? (LOL! Trick question for some)
How leveraged with debt in terms of GDP was the economy in 1982?
What percentage of total employment were manufacturing jobs in 1982?
What percentage of of total employment were service jobs in 1982?

Good to see we are both good natured about things.

I wish I could take credit for that "If Democrats are serious about..." comment, but it wasn't mine. I do agree with much of what you right wingers write about spending having gotten out of control and the monumental eff-up that is the current tax code, although we obviously don't agree about the details. I was actually surprised that your tax proposal would exclude so many taxpayers from paying any tax, and assuming you are dumping itemized deductions and credits, that you were hitting upper incomes at a 17% rate. My preference would have been to lower the tax floor and have multiple tiers (probably 3) with a full credit for social security taxes paid-something that could result in substantial tax savings for middle class self employed individuals, but to each his own.

Funny you should mention TEFRA. I cut my teeth on the 1982, 1984 and 1986 tax acts. Yes I do give Volker some of the credit for the turnaround in the early 1980s. I give Reagan some of the credit too, and would credit part of that turnaround to other factors as well. We should remember though that the Reagan economic miracle did not affect all parts of this country, and our failure to deal with matters such as trade deficits and oil imports at that time have really come back to bite us.

Just think all we need to do is sign for an increased deficit and everything will be fine or at least that is what obama said. So we increase the deficit another two trillion dollars and down goes the market. Who would have guessed.

Oh i know its Bushs fault.

dope and change Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just think all we need to do is sign for an
> increased deficit and everything will be fine or
> at least that is what obama said. So we increase
> the deficit another two trillion dollars and down
> goes the market. Who would have guessed.
>
> Oh i know its Bushs fault.


Okay, this argument is virtually from the Twilight Zone. It ignores the basic facts of reality...for the last time, increasing the debt ceiling did not raise the deficit one penny. It merely allowed us to pay for things and services we have already bought. can you repeat that3 times idiot?

What's spooking the markets isn't the debt, it's the inability of our govt to compromise. Compromise is seen by most normal human beings as a good thing. The market sees that by only cutting we will have a different America then the one we have today. We will have an America that doesnt invest in the future. That is a new America...a teabag America, a America without dreams or goals. Congratulations teabagger, you killed the dream once called America!

Idiot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...What's spooking the markets...

This is just the Markets being the Markets - it isn't permanent, it's probably not even going to last a week. Sure, it could, but we've seen exactly the same sort of HORRIBLE-JUST-HORRIBLE-OH-GOSH action multiple times in the not-that-old-past. I personally wouldn't consider this reaction to anything other than reaction to expected reaction - that is, same old, same old w.r.t. the Markets.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=^DJA&t=2y&l=on&z=l&q=l&c=

4 more years Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=^DJA&t=2y&l=on&z=l
> &q=l&c=

Pardon, that link's broken - let's try a pure image that puts this HORRIBLE crash in a better perspective:

There has been a correction in the works for quite a while, and the issue has a lot more to do with all the problems facing Europe right now, and additionally the poor growth numbers here in the US. So this correction is much more of a global issue, and also partially to factor in the fact that growth will slow even more with no extension to unemployment benefits.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

You blame the Republicans who wanted to slow down the mad spending like obamacare and other goodies?
It was obama who got on tv at least once a day and warned if we dont keep spending and borrowing the market will fall sharply. Or did you miss that?

Well it was passed and the market went into the tank. So the dear leader had no idea what he was saying.
Let me dumb it down for you. Its the amount of spending and borrowing that is killing the U S economy.

Deny it all you want but big investors are sitting it out until this clown leaves office. With obamas threat to tax capital gains at up to 39% there is no reward in the risk and reward stock market.

You kool aid drinkers backed a guy who has zero real life business world experience and it shows. Just admit your mistake and move on promising to do better next year.

Shit down 498 shit I guess I need to go back to work.

6X Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Shit down 498 shit I guess I need to go back to
> work.

Nah, as a few (and increasing) number of talking heads are beginning to say, now is the time to buy in.

Olde Farte Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 6X Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Shit down 498 shit I guess I need to go back to
> > work.
>
> Nah, as a few (and increasing) number of talking
> heads are beginning to say, now is the time to buy
> in.


I think it will touch down near 11,000 and head back up. I have some cash on the side that I will roll in at that point.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Ignore talking heads. Like real estate agents, they're always saying now is the time to buy...

Well Bush created 5 Trillion in deficits due to his unfunded war and tax cuts. Obama's deficit is $1.4T. Everyone knows you must spend in a recession as tax revenues decrease and the private sector does not fund the economy. (Remember Dick Cheney "Deficits don't matter")

Funny how the Republicans always try to "create" the facts. Bush was the "spender" not Obama.

So I'm afraid the "kool-aid" drinkers are those that watch Fox News (a true oxymoron there!)

4 more years Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Idiot Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > ...What's spooking the markets...
>
> This is just the Markets being the Markets - it
> isn't permanent, it's probably not even going to
> last a week. Sure, it could, but we've seen
> exactly the same sort of
> HORRIBLE-JUST-HORRIBLE-OH-GOSH action multiple
> times in the not-that-old-past. I personally
> wouldn't consider this reaction to anything other
> than reaction to expected reaction - that is, same
> old, same old w.r.t. the Markets.
>
> http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=^DJA&t=2y&l=on&z=l
> &q=l&c=
Attachments:

CNBC vast wasteland Wrote:
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> Ignore talking heads. Like real estate agents,
> they're always saying now is the time to buy...

Not true - the Me-Too Media has been hopping from foot to foot with glee as they quote hedge fund after hedge fund pundit - typical is the Yahoo/Reuters "quote" that says "Markets have to decline another 5 to 8 percent" with absolutely NO justification for that pulled-from-the-air number. The hedgies are luving it.

It's refreshing, though, to read the "might wanna buy" comments from a few on the other side of the aisle.

Note, however, that the Markets are a racket and always have been. the fake hand-wringing and planted stories - regardless which side of the Market Aisle they come from - are just the way it is.

If YOU'RE in the market, buy into companies you think have a (far) future and don't even watch day to day (or, as some here are doing - moment to moment! Yikes!) moves - they're literally meaningless regardless what The Media wants to make up some news to tell you.

Olde Farte Wrote:
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> CNBC vast wasteland Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Ignore talking heads. Like real estate agents,
> > they're always saying now is the time to buy...
>
> Not true - the Me-Too Media has been hopping from
> foot to foot with glee as they quote hedge fund
> after hedge fund pundit - typical is the
> Yahoo/Reuters "quote" that says "Markets have to
> decline another 5 to 8 percent" with absolutely NO
> justification for that pulled-from-the-air number.
> The hedgies are luving it.
>
> It's refreshing, though, to read the "might wanna
> buy" comments from a few on the other side of the
> aisle.
>
> Note, however, that the Markets are a racket and
> always have been. the fake hand-wringing and
> planted stories - regardless which side of the
> Market Aisle they come from - are just the way it
> is.
>
> If YOU'RE in the market, buy into companies you
> think have a (far) future and don't even watch day
> to day (or, as some here are doing - moment to
> moment! Yikes!) moves - they're literally
> meaningless regardless what The Media wants to
> make up some news to tell you.


+1

Buy low, sell high. This is a good buying opportunity, especially for value investors. And there are plenty of companies worth investing in, especially now.

If you didn't pull some cash off the table early last week, you're probably feeling some pain.

"Funny how the Republicans always try to "create" the facts. Bush was the "spender" not Obama."

obama has spent more in two years than Bush spent in 8.

Obama can't buy a piece of good economic news - if this crap doesn't change he's toast next year. Stick a fork in him, Obama's about done.

My mother made a bunch of money today on Priceline.

Starting a list of Obama's qualifications to be CEO of the U.S. or Kip's Big Boy

1- Law Degree

2- communist organizer

3- Race baiter

4- ?

Four More YEARS!!!! Summer of Recovery II is a hit!!!!!!!!

4. State Senator.

5. US Senator.

6. President.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama

whut!? Wrote:
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> Obama can't buy a piece of good economic news - if
> this crap doesn't change he's toast next year.
> Stick a fork in him, Obama's about done.

I disagree. He is good for another four years. Half of the people working in this country pay zero in income taxes. They wont see a need to upset such a great system. Then you have the ones who will never work so he has their vote as well. Throw in a few million illegals who get around the system and vote anyway, they know which lever to pull. You have blacks who vote for him just for the stick it to whitey reasons.
Throw in the brain dead democrats who pull the lever for no other reason than they always vote democrat.
Obama plays the class warfare card to the hilt. Of course it works on the poor and stupid because he promises them a get even time for anyone rich.

RR Wrote:
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> Starting a list of Obama's qualifications to be
> CEO of the U.S. or Kip's Big Boy
>

Bush's Qualifications to be CEO of the U.S....

1. Failed CEO of Arbusto
2. Failed CEO of Harken Energy
3. Alcoholic
4. Dry Drunk
5. Fake Christian
6. Token Partner in a Baseball Team
7. Periodic Governor of a State run by the Legislature
8. Guy Most Responsible for our Current Problems

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> RR Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Starting a list of Obama's qualifications to be
> > CEO of the U.S. or Kip's Big Boy
> >
>
> Bush's Qualifications to be CEO of the U.S....
>
> 1. Failed CEO of Arbusto
> 2. Failed CEO of Harken Energy
> 3. Alcoholic
> 4. Dry Drunk
> 5. Fake Christian
> 6. Token Partner in a Baseball Team
> 7. Periodic Governor of a State run by the
> Legislature
> 8. Guy Most Responsible for our Current Problems

Psst. Bush isn't President anymore. And at this point, this is Obama's fuckup. The whole country knows it.