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Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Registered Voter ()
Date: August 02, 2011 10:54AM

Really?

This is what we are facing - your kid saves a bird from being eaten by a cat (I thought we were supposed to be teaching kids compassion), then you are trying to do the right thing to help the bird back to health to let it go, and you are fined because the bird was a protected species? This is so stupid it isn't even funny. It isn't like they were trying to take the bird to sell it - they were trying to help it. Yeah, government bureaucrats at their best.

Woodpecker-Saving Daughter Costs Mom $500, Possible Jail Time
http://wusa9.com/news/article/161065/158/Woodpecker-Saving-Daughter-Costs-Mom-500
...The problem was that the woodpecker is a protected species under the Federal Migratory Bird Act. Therefore, it is illegal to take or transport a baby woodpecker. The Capo family says they had no idea.

"I was a little bit upset because I didn't want my mom to get in trouble," said Skylar.

So as soon as the Capo family returned home, they say they opened the cage, the bird flew away, and they reported it to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

"They said that's great, that's exactly what we want to see," said Capo. "We thought that we had done everything that we could possibly do."

But roughly two weeks later, that same woman from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service showed up at Capo's front door. This time, Capo says the woman was accompanied by a state trooper....


If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: 4matic ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:17AM

I blame Obama.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Adolf ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:23AM

I blame Bush.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: FurfaxTownie ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:23AM

Here we ago again with the self-righteous, busey body, pencil pushers. Have these people no shame? I would have even accepted something such as an explination and a warning. However threatening fines and jail fines is excessive.

This is the result of too many laws. I was trying to find the exact number of Federal Laws. However. the best figure found was there is 23,000 pages of Federal code. Additional State and local laws could easily double or triple that number.

Realistically, how is anyone supposed to know and comprehend all of that? How many of those laws are redundant or archaic?

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Registered Voter ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:26AM

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here we ago again with the self-righteous, busey
> body, pencil pushers. Have these people no shame?
> I would have even accepted something such as an
> explination and a warning. However threatening
> fines and jail fines is excessive.
>
> This is the result of too many laws. I was trying
> to find the exact number of Federal Laws. However.
> the best figure found was there is 23,000 pages of
> Federal code. Additional State and local laws
> could easily double or triple that number.
>
> Realistically, how is anyone supposed to know and
> comprehend all of that? How many of those laws are
> redundant or archaic?

Exactly. And while I get the whole "ignorance of the law is no excuse" argument, clearly what these people were doing had nothing - NOTHING - to do with why the law was originally written. This lady from Wildlife and Fisheries was just showing how stupid many civil servants tend to be - she couldn't think about the circumstance and understand the distinction.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: SoylentGreen ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:26AM

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
How many of those laws are
> redundant or archaic?


How many laws were written without the use of common sense?

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: JBass ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:27AM

Ignorance of the law is not a defense. LEARN THEM ALL, or pay the price... We need more rules, regulation, oversight and red-tape! NOW

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.
Posted by: Alias ()
Date: August 02, 2011 12:09PM

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2012 03:11PM by Alias.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: BrandonVA ()
Date: August 02, 2011 01:06PM

Its situations like these that result in people being too scared to do the right thing. Why risk the lawsuit, fine, and possible jail when there really isn't anything in it for you besides doing the right thing? This is why you see people walk past people who are clearly injured or in need of some attention in public.

We can't blame younger generations for being apathetic when the authorities punish people into viewing apathy as the least risky option out there.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Get It Straight ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:30PM

There is absolutely positively nothing wrong with laws protecting animals, stoppingthem being transported. The world isnt going to sudenly improve for animals if we lift these laws. The intent of Registered Voter is to some how make the point that the law is a problem..too many laws are a problem. The fact is quite to the contrary. Many species can credit their existence to Fed Prot laws.

The futre that people like Registered Voter want is a bleak one for anyone but the rich and the strong. He assumes he will survive. He is in actuality a tine piece of shit who lingers in the dark and craves hatred and anger. May he get what he so desires.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Alcatraz ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:32PM

Alias Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The bigger the government, the more idiots with
> power.
>
> Given the bird situation.... the little girl
> should have taken her cat inside and left the bird
> where it was. It was most likely a fledgling with
> its mother nearby. You would think with all the
> nonsense they teach little kids in school today,
> they could work in a 20 minute lesson on "what to
> do when you find a baby bird".
>
> That being said, she did the same thing I would
> have done at her age; she meant well as did her
> mother. The fine and notice to appear in court
> make the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service look like
> a bunch of Nazis, which I guess is what they are.
> Why don't they spend their resources on educating
> kids rather than punishing them for doing what was
> perceived to be a good deed.... Oh, that's right,
> idiots lack common sense.


You should have as soft a spot in your heart for your family and people as you do birds.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Registered Voter ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:35PM

Get It Straight Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There is absolutely positively nothing wrong with
> laws protecting animals, stoppingthem being
> transported. The world isnt going to sudenly
> improve for animals if we lift these laws. The
> intent of Registered Voter is to some how make the
> point that the law is a problem..too many laws are
> a problem. The fact is quite to the contrary.
> Many species can credit their existence to Fed
> Prot laws.
>
> The futre that people like Registered Voter want
> is a bleak one for anyone but the rich and the
> strong. He assumes he will survive. He is in
> actuality a tine piece of shit who lingers in the
> dark and craves hatred and anger. May he get what
> he so desires.

My point had nothing to do with whatever you thought. I was pointing out that the Wildlife and Fisheries lady was an idiot for enforcing the law in this particular instance. She should have been able to use her intellectual smarts and figured out that prosecuting a child's mother over something like this was only something an idiot would do. Like yourself.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Fritz ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:39PM

They should have just let the cat eat the damned bird and be over
with it.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: The law is the law. ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:41PM

There should be not grey areas when it comes to the law. No area for finagling and obvious loopholes. That's one of the reason there is so much bullshit in the Criminal Justice system, too much arbitrary interpretations. Thelaw prohibits something that's it! No nonsensical arguments like "it happened on a Tuesday" or the "sun was not shinning that day". You break the law, you get your just desserts. Mitigating circumstances are crucial, sure, but study them closely. Amen!

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Registered Voter ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:42PM

The law is the law. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There should be not grey areas when it comes to
> the law. No area for finagling and obvious
> loopholes. That's one of the reason there is so
> much bullshit in the Criminal Justice system, too
> much arbitrary interpretations. Thelaw prohibits
> something that's it! No nonsensical arguments
> like "it happened on a Tuesday" or the "sun was
> not shinning that day". You break the law, you
> get your just desserts. Mitigating circumstances
> are crucial, sure, but study them closely. Amen!

Next time you get pulled over for speeding, remember not to plead for a warning.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: What was the outcome ()
Date: August 02, 2011 02:53PM

I guess the whole thing lies in a court of law. the judge could dismiss the case as unjust. The judge has alot of discretion. Not to change the subject, but you ever see how many protected species are in the drawers and vaults of Universities, Museums, School, and a thousand other places stuffed. I bet if these places didn't kill these animals there would be plenty aroun d. They usually kill about 100 to get 1 perfect specimen, I'll bet. It's like they shoot one and it has a blotch, "well, not good enough, got to get another one".

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: WTL Lover ()
Date: August 02, 2011 03:15PM

Where is WTL on this topic? I don't know what to think until he weighs in.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: FurfaxTownie ()
Date: August 02, 2011 04:14PM

The point is don't these people have anything else better to do? Is public really being served in this situation? the answer is NO.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: SoylentGreen ()
Date: August 02, 2011 04:34PM

Get It Straight Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There is absolutely positively nothing wrong with
> laws protecting animals, stoppingthem being
> transported. The world isnt going to sudenly
> improve for animals if we lift these laws. The
> intent of Registered Voter is to some how make the
> point that the law is a problem..too many laws are
> a problem. The fact is quite to the contrary.
> Many species can credit their existence to Fed
> Prot laws.
>
> The futre that people like Registered Voter want
> is a bleak one for anyone but the rich and the
> strong. He assumes he will survive. He is in
> actuality a tine piece of shit who lingers in the
> dark and craves hatred and anger. May he get what
> he so desires.


You live next door to RV or something? You seem to think you know them pretty well.

The plain truth is that man is trying to outsmart mother nature and has in fact outsmarted themselves.

What your comment has to do with this thread is anyone's guess though.
Attachments:
57154.gif

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.
Posted by: Alias ()
Date: August 02, 2011 05:52PM

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2012 03:08PM by Alias.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: FurfaxTownie ()
Date: August 02, 2011 06:01PM

Get It Straight Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There is absolutely positively nothing wrong with
> laws protecting animals, stoppingthem being
> transported. The world isnt going to sudenly
> improve for animals if we lift these laws. The
> intent of Registered Voter is to some how make the
> point that the law is a problem..too many laws are
> a problem. The fact is quite to the contrary.
> Many species can credit their existence to Fed
> Prot laws.


Here is an interesting fact: 99% of all species that have ever existed on Earth are extinct.

Consider that Eath is billions of years old, humans have been around for 10,000 years...who or what could have been responsible for all those extinctions??

Its not clear but it wasn't humans.

" Further, it is believed that of all species that ever inhabited the Earth over 99% of them are now extinct."


http://www.physicalgeography.net/fundamentals/9h.html

Edited to add context



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2011 01:51PM by FurfaxTownie.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: SoylentGreen ()
Date: August 02, 2011 06:04PM

FurfaxTownie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here is an interesting fact: 99% of all species
> that have ever existed on Earth are extinct.
>
> Consider that Eath is billions of years old,
> humans have been around for 10,000 years...who or
> what could have been responsible for all those
> extinctions??
>

Please pay closer attention.

The responsible party is.............George W. Bush.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: bloody blisters ()
Date: August 02, 2011 06:12PM

well the USF&WS and the family are both retarded. the family did the right thing up until reporting it to the USF&WS. there was no reason what so ever to call them and tell them what they did. clearly what the USF&WS did wrong was slap a fine. sure if they were catching dozens of woodpeckers and "nursing" them back to health, a fine and jail time would be appropriate. people will do anything, ANYTHING, to make a buck these days. i guess thats just the pecking order of things.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Hay Zeus ()
Date: August 02, 2011 08:11PM

SoylentGreen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FurfaxTownie Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Here is an interesting fact: 99% of all species
> > that have ever existed on Earth are extinct.
> >
> > Consider that Eath is billions of years old,
> > humans have been around for 10,000 years...who
> or
> > what could have been responsible for all those
> > extinctions??
> >
>
> Please pay closer attention.
>
> The responsible party is.............George W.
> Bush.

George Bush doesn't care about black people.....or woodpeckers...aight!

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Top Cat my ass ()
Date: August 02, 2011 10:50PM

The part that people are missing is keep your stinking cats inside your home. I dont want them in my yard ever. Cats tear things up and kill anything they can catch.
Letting your cat run loose doesnt do anyone any good.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: bloody blisters ()
Date: August 02, 2011 10:59PM

Top Cat my ass Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The part that people are missing is keep your
> stinking cats inside your home. I dont want them
> in my yard ever. Cats tear things up and kill
> anything they can catch.
> Letting your cat run loose doesnt do anyone any
> good.


this i agree with. if cats can roam free, pitbulls and all dogs should be able to roam free as well.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: What you can Expect ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:01PM

It is amazing to see people a bunch of people take unrelated "facts" to prove some point theyve already convinced themselves of.

So who cares that 99% of the species have already become extinct. Does that make the survival of the last 1% any less important? Maybe it's even more important. When 99% of those 99% were around, human beings werent around and werent dependent on their survival.

Are you all truly as stupid as you sound?

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: bloody blisters ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:04PM

What you can Expect Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It is amazing to see people a bunch of people take
> unrelated "facts" to prove some point theyve
> already convinced themselves of.
>
> So who cares that 99% of the species have already
> become extinct. Does that make the survival of
> the last 1% any less important? Maybe it's even
> more important. When 99% of those 99% were around,
> human beings werent around and werent dependent on
> their survival.
>
> Are you all truly as stupid as you sound?


speaking to a whole based off of one person's opinion of what the facts are doesn't make you sound too smart either.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: jerkasic park ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:05PM

bring back the T Rex. That would liven up those rush hours
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trex.JPG

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: FYI x2 ()
Date: August 02, 2011 11:20PM

FYI
if you find yourself in a similar situation you can contact these people:

http://www.wildliferescueleague.org/

Very nice people who volunteer their time and money to save wild animals. I remember reading that they have to be certified to handle and treat all different animals.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Atom ()
Date: August 03, 2011 01:25PM

Don't fuck with fish and wildlife. They are above the constitution. They can mess up your day without a warent.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: KK ()
Date: August 03, 2011 03:21PM

Alias Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>>
You would think with all the
> nonsense they teach little kids in school today,
> they could work in a 20 minute lesson on "what to
> do when you find a baby bird".
>



That's it, it's the public school system's fault for not teaching a lesson on how to treat baby birds and to know which are on the protected species list!

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: KK ()
Date: August 03, 2011 03:23PM

SoylentGreen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FurfaxTownie Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Here is an interesting fact: 99% of all species
> > that have ever existed on Earth are extinct.
> >
> > Consider that Eath is billions of years old,
> > humans have been around for 10,000 years...who
> or
> > what could have been responsible for all those
> > extinctions??
> >
>
> Please pay closer attention.
>
> The responsible party is.............George W.
> Bush.


Even worse than that....it was Ronald Regan's fault!

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: sumguy ()
Date: August 03, 2011 03:59PM

I'd ask for the bird back so I could eat it.

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.
Posted by: Alias ()
Date: August 03, 2011 05:22PM

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2012 03:06PM by Alias.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: 6X ()
Date: August 03, 2011 05:48PM

Thanks for the help....next time don't call/tell anyone.
Attachments:
WoodyWoodpecker_V2.jpg

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: 6X ()
Date: August 03, 2011 07:31PM


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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Nonsense ()
Date: August 03, 2011 10:42PM

Alias Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> KK Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Alias Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > >>
> > You would think with all the
> > > nonsense they teach little kids in school
> > today,
> > > they could work in a 20 minute lesson on
> "what
> > to
> > > do when you find a baby bird".
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > That's it, it's the public school system's
> fault
> > for not teaching a lesson on how to treat baby
> > birds and to know which are on the protected
> > species list!
>
> I didn't blame the public school system.
>
> Also, I said nothing about endangered species.

You said public schools teach a lot of nonsense. Care to back that up?

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.
Posted by: Alias ()
Date: August 04, 2011 04:20AM

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2012 03:00PM by Alias.

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Re: Don't try to save a woodpecker
Posted by: Registered Voter ()
Date: August 04, 2011 10:44AM

6X Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/03/mother-fi
> ned-daughter-save-endangered-woodpecker_n_917298.h
> tml?icid=maing-grid10%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl2%7Csec
> 1_lnk3%7C83222
>
> Oh Yeah, Thats what your to do if your find a
> endangered bird . sorry, we are dumbasses

So - the local news station ran the story, specifically with the information that the agent wen to the house with a citation and a state trooper - now the HuffPo wants us to believe that just because the agent went back to the office and MADE AN INQUIRY - that an automated system generated a citation and it was mailed to her? Really - how fucking stupid is that. It's obvious the agent had to initiate the ticket - calling up the WL&F folks and self-reporting yourself - and then having the person on the phone tell them they did the correct thing by releasing the bird ... pretty obvious the phone call the parent made is not why they were issued a citation. But hey, anything to make the WL&F agent look less heartless then she really was - and by extension the entire agency.

If you can’t model the past, where you know the answer pretty well, how can you model the future? - William Happer Cyrus Fogg Brackett Professor of Physics Princeton University

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