And thank you for cleaning up Tim Kaine's shit storm of a mess that he left in Richmond. If you were eligible for a second term, you'd have earned it.


RICHMOND, Va. (AP) -- Documents obtained by The Associated Press show that Virginia's government ended its last fiscal year on June 30 with an unspent balance of $311 million.

Gov. Bob McDonnell plans to detail how state government ended the year in the black at a Tuesday news conference.

A draft analysis of final revenues for fiscal 2011 shows the bulk of the surplus comes from individual income tax collections.

They exceeded official budgeted forecasts by nearly $200 million.

thanks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And thank you for cleaning up Tim Kaine's shit
> storm of a mess that he left in Richmond. If you
> were eligible for a second term, you'd have earned
> it.
>
>
> RICHMOND, Va. (AP) -- Documents obtained by The
> Associated Press show that Virginia's government
> ended its last fiscal year on June 30 with an
> unspent balance of $311 million.
>
> Gov. Bob McDonnell plans to detail how state
> government ended the year in the black at a
> Tuesday news conference.
>
> A draft analysis of final revenues for fiscal 2011
> shows the bulk of the surplus comes from
> individual income tax collections.
>
> They exceeded official budgeted forecasts by
> nearly $200 million.

I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT to pave our fucking roads.

Hank Moody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT to pave
> our fucking roads.

You live on a dirt road? Sorry, dude.

pan hole Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hank Moody Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT to
> pave
> > our fucking roads.
>
> You live on a dirt road? Sorry, dude.

They might as well be dirt roads for as shitty as they are.

thanks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And thank you for cleaning up Tim Kaine's shit
> storm of a mess that he left in Richmond. If you
> were eligible for a second term, you'd have earned
> it.
>
>
> RICHMOND, Va. (AP) -- Documents obtained by The
> Associated Press show that Virginia's government
> ended its last fiscal year on June 30 with an
> unspent balance of $311 million.
>
> Gov. Bob McDonnell plans to detail how state
> government ended the year in the black at a
> Tuesday news conference.
>
> A draft analysis of final revenues for fiscal 2011
> shows the bulk of the surplus comes from
> individual income tax collections.
>
> They exceeded official budgeted forecasts by
> nearly $200 million.


More like thank you Federal Government Spending and wages. Save up because the gravy train is going to get a little less gravy.

Hank Moody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pan hole Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Hank Moody Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT to
> > pave
> > > our fucking roads.
> >
> > You live on a dirt road? Sorry, dude.
>
> They might as well be dirt roads for as shitty as
> they are.

So, you are saying they are paved?

pan hole Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hank Moody Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > pan hole Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Hank Moody Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT to
> > > pave
> > > > our fucking roads.
> > >
> > > You live on a dirt road? Sorry, dude.
> >
> > They might as well be dirt roads for as shitty
> as
> > they are.
>
> So, you are saying they are paved?

Yes, cunt face. They are paved. I see the grade school territory that your simple-minded humor has traversed. To that point, I will amend my original statement: I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT to REPAVE our fucking roads.

I find it difficult to congratulate an administration that can't manage basic infrastructure maintenance. There are probably at least a half billion dollars worth of road surface to repair in northern Virginia alone. I'd like to see where the budget stands when VDOT meets their obligations to tax payers, if they ever do.

Hank Moody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pan hole Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Hank Moody Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > pan hole Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Hank Moody Wrote:
> > > >
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > >
> > > > -----
> > > > > I'd be happier if he managed to get VDOT
> to
> > > > pave
> > > > > our fucking roads.
> > > >
> > > > You live on a dirt road? Sorry, dude.
> > >
> > > They might as well be dirt roads for as
> shitty
> > as
> > > they are.
> >
> > So, you are saying they are paved?
>
> Yes, cunt face. They are paved. I see the grade
> school territory that your simple-minded humor has
> traversed. To that point, I will amend my original
> statement: I'd be happier if he managed to get
> VDOT to REPAVE our fucking roads.
>
> I find it difficult to congratulate an
> administration that can't manage basic
> infrastructure maintenance. There are probably at
> least a half billion dollars worth of road surface
> to repair in northern Virginia alone. I'd like to
> see where the budget stands when VDOT meets their
> obligations to tax payers, if they ever do.

Maybe you didn't hear about the more than $1.5B that McDonnell found after Tim Kaine and Mark Warner lost it? All that money is going to roads.

pan hole Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Maybe you didn't hear about the more than $1.5B
> that McDonnell found after Tim Kaine and Mark
> Warner lost it? All that money is going to roads.

Too little, too late and way too fucking slow for my taste. Two flat tires and a bent alloy wheel that I've suffered are a testament to that fact.

Show me the plan that describes how every foot of road surface that is riddled with pot holes will be repaired by year's end and I'll shut up.

Hank Moody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pan hole Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Maybe you didn't hear about the more than $1.5B
> > that McDonnell found after Tim Kaine and Mark
> > Warner lost it? All that money is going to
> roads.
>
> Too little, too late and way too fucking slow for
> my taste. Two flat tires and a bent alloy wheel
> that I've suffered are a testament to that fact.
>
> Show me the plan that describes how every foot of
> road surface that is riddled with pot holes will
> be repaired by year's end and I'll shut up.

Do you know how such programs work? Do you even think that feasible?

I'm not too impressed with the budget surplus issue. Virginia has traditionally done well wne it comes to keeping its spending in line with revenues. I wouldn't be surprised if they intentionally underestimated spending to avoid having to make emergency budget cuts.

The thing that McDonnell did that definitely scored points with me was re-opening the rest areas on the interstates.

pan hole Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do you know how such programs work? Do you even
> think that feasible?

Yeah, I do understand. And no, I don't think such a plan is feasible. Which means they will never catch up with the maintenance and those of us in northern Virginia will have to endure at least another year of shitty roads.


Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> The thing that McDonnell did that definitely
> scored points with me was re-opening the rest
> areas on the interstates.

LOL, man you're leaving yourself wide open for this crowd with that last statement.

Hank Moody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LOL, man you're leaving yourself wide open for
> this crowd with that last statement.


Wouldn't be the first time.

Thank you, Mr. Obama, for sending 2.5 billion bucks my way.

Bill N Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm not too impressed with the budget surplus
> issue. Virginia has traditionally done well wne
> it comes to keeping its spending in line with
> revenues. I wouldn't be surprised if they
> intentionally underestimated spending to avoid
> having to make emergency budget cuts.
>
> The thing that McDonnell did that definitely
> scored points with me was re-opening the rest
> areas on the interstates.

+1

It was stupid to close them. Great way to get people to stop on the side of the highway to take a leak. They should get corporate sponsors to fund them though.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/19/2011 07:14PM by Shadow.

OMG! I JUST GOT A GREAT DEAL ON THIS AWESOME NEW THREAD!!

YOU SHOULD GO HERE RITE NOW TO READ IT!!!

http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/read/40/628829.html

Shadow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> >
> > The thing that McDonnell did that definitely
> > scored points with me was re-opening the rest
> > areas on the interstates.
>
> +1
>
> It was stupid to close them. Great way to get
> people to stop on the side of the highway to take
> a leak. They should get corporate sponsors to
> fund them though.

I NEVER understood this. The GOP is gung ho for the free market, you can pull into any fucking McDonald's or Truck Stop to take a piss. Do we even need Rest Areas anymore?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:

> I NEVER understood this. The GOP is gung ho for
> the free market, you can pull into any fucking
> McDonald's or Truck Stop to take a piss. Do we
> even need Rest Areas anymore?

Taxes pay for the rest area so the public can use the facilities. To use a business'bathroom where that owner has to pay for the water, electricity, and other amenities is not free to him/her.

Piggy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Taxes pay for the rest area so the public can use
> the facilities. To use a business'bathroom where
> that owner has to pay for the water, electricity,
> and other amenities is not free to him/her.

I've never gone into a public restroom at a gas station or restaurant without buying something. I think most people do the same. It's called running a business.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

VA is one of th largest recipents of federal govt funding. Between the salaries paid civilian and the military stationed here we are a virtual welfare state of the federal govt. Rather then thank that useless Gov of ours you should be thanking the federal govt.

You did not imply that you had.

Piggy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You did not imply that you had.


You should have inferred it.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

The Fed Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rather then
> thank that useless Gov of ours you should be
> thanking the federal govt.


An example please of how he is useless? No political propaganda and please cite a reliable news source not some basement dwellers blog.

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Piggy Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > You did not imply that you had.
>
>
> You should have inferred it.

Nope.

sluggo mcslug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Fed Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Rather then
> > thank that useless Gov of ours you should be
> > thanking the federal govt.
>
>
> An example please of how he is useless? No
> political propaganda and please cite a reliable
> news source not some basement dwellers blog.


He is a tool of the Catholic Church
He is a hypocrate when he supports statements like Govt doesnt create jobs.
He is a Republican idealogue. VA would be in the same situation as Ohio, WI and MI if he had a Republican Senate.
He is anti-women.

^^^
thought so, nothing but personal opinions based on the voices in your head

tool of Catholic church - not really or he would never have allowed death penalty executions

government doe not create jobs is true. bottom line is private industry creates the jobs. Government can create government jobs which produce nothing.

Republican idelogue - duh, what else should he be he is a Republican. Virginia is a right to work state, until that changes we will never be like the afore mentioned states where government union workers demanded no contribution retirement plans and no contribution health care plans.

anti women - again its those voices in your head speaking to you

I knew I could expose you after a few posts but even I didnt think I could do it in one.

sluggo mcslug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ^^^
> thought so, nothing but personal opinions based on
> the voices in your head
>
> tool of Catholic church - not really or he would
> never have allowed death penalty executions
>

But he did prohibit Gay Couples from adopting children because he didnt want to upset the Catholic CHurch.

> government doe not create jobs is true. bottom
> line is private industry creates the jobs.
> Government can create government jobs which
> produce nothing.

This is the stupidest statement ever made by Republicans. Is a career in the U.S. military worthless? Is every single civil service job worthless? Of course I expect you to say yes to that last one. When Gov McDonnell recently pushed for a highway construction bill he used as justification the creation of jobs. Obama doing the same thing was ridiculed for thinking the Govt creates jobs (which they do).
>
> Republican idelogue - duh, what else should he be
> he is a Republican. Virginia is a right to work
> state, until that changes we will never be like
> the afore mentioned states where government union
> workers demanded no contribution retirement plans
> and no contribution health care plans.

Until very recently VA state employees recieved no contribution retirement benifits also. And when the Gov had an excess of money last year (our money, not his) he gave those workers a bonus! Why didnt he return those excess tax collections to the people who it belongs to? You know why? Because he is a hypocrate and only bad mouths such things when a Democrat does it.
>
> anti women - again its those voices in your head
> speaking to you

He has supported Ken Cucinnelli's plans to regulate Women's Health offices out of existence.
>
> I knew I could expose you after a few posts but
> even I didnt think I could do it in one.

You have exposed nothing.

sluggo mcslug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> knew I could expose you after a few posts but
> even I didnt think I could do it in one.

I think all you've really exposed is that Macky is back.

Virginia being reviewed for credit downgrade.

Moody’s Investors Service says it is reviewing the five states’ credit ratings because of their high risk factors. High federal employment and Medicaid percentages were cited among the factors.

“While all states are indirectly linked to the U.S. government to some degree, we have identified the five AAA-rated states that are most vulnerable to changes in the U.S. government rating," said Nicholas Samuels, a Vice President in Moody's State Ratings Team. These five states have above average exposure to several sovereign risk factors that Moody's outlined in a July 13 special comment, "Implications of a U.S. Rating Action for Aaa-Rated U.S. Municipal Credits."

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/MARYLAND-VIRGINIA-FACE-DOWNGRADE-OF-CREDIT-RATING--125893733.html

So I give my kid $25. He spends $20 and has $5 left over. Then he claims he earned the $5 on his own.

Do I give the kid credit for saving $5? Or do I scold him for lying about earning it?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So I give my kid $25. He spends $20 and has $5
> left over. Then he claims he earned the $5 on his
> own.
>
> Do I give the kid credit for saving $5? Or do I
> scold him for lying about earning it?

Your kid thinks you're a fagg.

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So I give my kid $25. He spends $20 and has $5
> left over. Then he claims he earned the $5 on his
> own.
>
> Do I give the kid credit for saving $5? Or do I
> scold him for lying about earning it?

If your son is claiming that he earned $5 by saving it then give him credit. After all, a penny saved is a penny earned.

If your son is claiming that he earned $5 as compensation for labor or as an entitlement then let the scolding begin!

He deferred pension contributions of $850 million. Is that a cumulative pension shortfall, or is he skipping just the obligation for FY2011?

http://www.politifact.com/virginia/statements/2011/jun/04/bob-mcdonnell/mcdonnell-says-virginia-among-few-state-heading-to/

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So I give my kid $25. He spends $20 and has $5
> left over. Then he claims he earned the $5 on his
> own.
>
> Do I give the kid credit for saving $5? Or do I
> scold him for lying about earning it?

Where did you get your $25? Did all your kids chip in and give you a little each to get that $25? Maybe you should be scolded for acting like you made that money on your own.

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So I give my kid $25. He spends $20 and has $5
> left over. Then he claims he earned the $5 on his
> own.
>
> Do I give the kid credit for saving $5? Or do I
> scold him for lying about earning it?


Oh goody..a thinking man's question.

Assuming the role your kid is playing in this would be that of the tax payer in Virginia..I know you're trying to pin this on the Gov but he really does speak for us no matter who the he is. And assuming your role as the benevolent Federal Government is where you were going,

I need just a bit more info before I can answer you........

Where did this money come to you from?

Did it fall from the sky? You won it in the lottery? Or did you take it from your kid to start with and are now doling back to those it belonged to in the first place?

AND bitching about what they do with the leftovers?

You are so busy trying to keep the other side from scoring points that this thread is getting silly.

Yes a good amount of the revenues raised by Virginia during the current budget cycle did come either directly or indirectly from the Federal government. Also yes there have been some games played the past couple of years to enable Virginia to avoid overspending.

Still it takes a certain amount of discipline to make a realistic budget and stick to it, especially when there are a great many demands. Virginia did it. But then again Virginia has for decades been fairly good at doing that no matter who the governor is or which party controls the legislature.

there you go, no facts just those voices in your head again

Va employees until recently paid no contributions to retirement. This was due to a concession made years ago. Employees forfeited their in step increases in exchange for no contribution funding. The state got the best of the deal because now they make emmployees contribute and they no still do not receive in step increases.

government produces jobs - still wrong dummy. Not income producing jobs. Unless the military secretly works assembling Iphones in their spare time they do not produce income. Read the whole thing not what you want to hear. Cerain jobs are neccessary yet they still do not produce income.

womens health offices - you mean me funding aboritons? Sorry you want to make babies and then end the pregnancy do it on your own dime. Is abortion a right, sure but that right should not include making others pay for your decisions.

gays adotping children - again cite your proof

BTW if you think Virginia is a union friendly state you need what little brain you have left examined

“I don’t think we ought to force Catholic Charities to make that part of their policy or other similar situated groups,’’ McDonnell said. “Many of our adoption agencies are faith-based groups that ought to be able to establish what their own policies are

http://www.gayrva.com/2011/04/05/mcdonnell-marshall-against-against-same-sex-adoption-ev-steps-up/

http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2011/02/25/134052114/abortion-clinics-in-va-face-regulation-like-hospitals

This isue has nothing to do with funding an abortion. This would deny access to healthcare services to women regardless of their ability to pay. The Republican Party that espouses that the Govt should get out of people's lives, is more then willing to do so whenever they see fit.

hmm a gay website, I am sure we are getting the "straight" story out of them. No agenda or bias right?

I voted for McDonnell and he represents my viewpoint on this issue.

Income producing jobs? Every job produces income for that person. What the fuck are you talking about? Read what? You are incoherent. If your point is the Govt does not produce an increase to the GDP you are wrong about that. Every penny spent by the Govt on the military industrial complex supports the GDP. In actuality the govt creates millions of jobs.

And I said nothing about VA's support of unions. I didnt mention unions at all. Stop hallucinating.

Requiring abortion centers to be held to health standards? How draconian of McDonnell. Contrary to biased press an abortion can be risky. Women can and do die from the procedure. To hear aborition supporters tell it removing a fetus is no more risky than removing a splinter.

Government jobs do not produce wealth it is just that simple. You can create a million government jobs, as obama has been doing, and yet not one dime will be generated as wealth from that job. A guy who flips pizzas and sells them makes more wealth than all government jobs combined. Thats the difference.

dont you read cant read Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Government jobs do not produce wealth it is just
> that simple. You can create a million government
> jobs, as obama has been doing, and yet not one
> dime will be generated as wealth from that job. A
> guy who flips pizzas and sells them makes more
> wealth than all government jobs combined. Thats
> the difference.


What you are saying is that govt jobs create no value. And like most things Republicans spout that is untrue. Doesnt the cleaner air we breathe thanks to Govt regulations add value to your life? Of course it does. Air traffic controllers...no value? You and the entire idea that the Gove cannot create jobs is wrong. In fact the govt produces some of the best jobs there are.

sorry again Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Requiring abortion centers to be held to health
> standards? How draconian of McDonnell. Contrary to
> biased press an abortion can be risky. Women can
> and do die from the procedure. To hear aborition
> supporters tell it removing a fetus is no more
> risky than removing a splinter.

There are no statistics showing an unexpected health risk to women having an abortion due to current (or previous) level of regulatory requirements. This has nothing to do with making a safe abortion available to women. It 100% about cutting off access. Cant you even tell the truth from your lies?

sorry joe Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hmm a gay website, I am sure we are getting the
> "straight" story out of them. No agenda or bias
> right?
>
> I voted for McDonnell and he represents my
> viewpoint on this issue.


It's a homophobic viewpoint and ridiculous. A gay man can still go into a Catholic Adoption service, lie about him being partnered to another man and adopt a child. All you are encouraging is a lie. You can go to any web site on the topic, it's what our Catholic Gov said.

You are a blinded Republican Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sorry again Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Requiring abortion centers to be held to health
> > standards? How draconian of McDonnell. Contrary
> to
> > biased press an abortion can be risky. Women
> can
> > and do die from the procedure. To hear
> aborition
> > supporters tell it removing a fetus is no more
> > risky than removing a splinter.
>
> There are no statistics showing an unexpected
> health risk to women having an abortion due to
> current (or previous) level of regulatory
> requirements. This has nothing to do with making
> a safe abortion available to women. It 100% about
> cutting off access. Cant you even tell the truth
> from your lies?


You're wasting your breath man, or fingers I guess. These people are hopeless. You may as well try to get your dog to bake a cake. Well, there may be a little more chance with the cake.

sluggo mcslug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> government produces jobs - still wrong dummy. Not
> income producing jobs. Unless the military
> secretly works assembling Iphones in their spare
> time they do not produce income. Read the whole
> thing not what you want to hear. Cerain jobs are
> neccessary yet they still do not produce income.
>

Macky, macky macky. You really should have spent some of your time off doing something other than reading the Right Wing Economic Bible.

Government doesn't produce jobs? Most of the roads in this country were constructed at the instigation of and were financed by governments. Those road construction projects produced a great many jobs initially when the roads were constructed, and have provided additional jobs since for those tasked with maintaining those roads. Those roads opened up economic opportunities, resulting in new hotels, restaurants, gas stations and tourist destinations, which in turn produced, you guessed it, jobs in those industries and in the industries which serviced them. Then of course all of those people with jobs are spending their income which in turn is producing even more jobs. And you can trace it all back to a government project.

Think I am BS'ing. Get out into the real America that right wingers love so much and see where much of the development has been in the last couple of decades. In historical terms look at what government projects like the TVA or the Hoover Dam did for the areas where they operated. Those projects started economic engines which kept running strongly long after the government money stopped flowing. Similar comments could be made about many other government projects. The American defense industry has been a huge economic engine, really since the late 1930s. There are many economists today who believe that it was WW2 that pulled the US out of the depression, and left it with a sufficiently strong economy to pull other nations out of their post-war economic difficulties. To my knowledge the government has never been in the business of producing iphones or computers, but it was massive government investment in the computer field that allowed the industry to develop to the point where it could make it on non-governmental sources of income.

No doubt you will say "but they are not income producing jobs". Are jobs in rec centers or public beaches that generate net profits from admissions and user fees income producing jobs? How about jobs in government owed utilities? These and other examples exist today. You don't have to go back to far in history to find a time when such government services as the post office, the courts, minting money and even prisons were job creating profit making operations.

I have an even better idea. Let the government hire half the nation to dig holes then hire the other half to fill them in. That way full 100% employment. Get the picture?

Yes you'd have full employment, but what are all of those hole diggers going to do with the money they earned? And what is the benefit of having freshly dug and filled in holes? And of course how do you pay for it all? But of course this is how most right wingers view any kind of government job.

There is a difference between "make work" and "make useful work". Just because a job isn't sufficiently important for the private sector to spend money to do it does not mean that there is no value to having it done. Example-cleaning up and maintaining the sides of our roadways may not be sexy, but it would employ a fair number of lower educated unemployed workers, and the result would make the roads safer, the adjacent neighborhoods healthier (fewer places for vermin to live) and the region a more attractive place for potential businesses, residents and tourists which in turn would raise property values and tax receipts. Meanwhile those now employed road cleaners are spending their money for goods and services, creating more jobs and more demand for goods and services, and ultimately resulting in some funds ending up in the hands of right wingers who are decrying the government's policy of employing lower educated unemployed people to clean the roadways.

And since 48% of this country pays nothing in income tax where is all the revenue coming from to pay for all these low skill workers. They will not be contributing to the income tax system and there is no national sales tax so tell me again how the government will pay their salaires? Oh thats right tax the rich. The same rich who make up 2% of the country. You can only tap that well so many times for so much money.

Did you know if you went to the top 10% wealthiest people in the U S and took everything they owned you would only pay 2% of the national debt? What then?

While obamas hate the rich and class warfare plays well to the stupid and jealous it is in fact a fairy tale. Eliminate all those hated corporate jets he goes on and on about and see how many jobs that creates.

If you read other posts I've read you would have noticed that I would favor doint away with certain Bush era tax benefits that favor the poor as well as those which favor the rich, and I also favor spending cuts as well. There is a certain benefit to having citizenry who have an economic stake not only in government benefits provided but paying for those benefits as well. That said I do believe it is misleading to look at income taxes alone. You should also remember that the poor are paying social security taxes as well as a variety of excise taxes. The issue I have with spending cuts is what programs are cut and how much is cut. Curious that the only programs on the table are the ones that the right oppose.

There are two distortions in the tax code. The poor get refundable tax credits that reduce their tax liability to zero or less. The rich don't pay the payroll tax above a certain threshold and end up with a lower effective tax rate than those in the 28% and 31% income tax brackets. The fairest thing is to remedy both. Get rid of refundable tax credits and eliminate the wage ceiling for payroll taxes.

Les Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There are two distortions in the tax code. The
> poor get refundable tax credits that reduce their
> tax liability to zero or less. The rich don't pay
> the payroll tax above a certain threshold and end
> up with a lower effective tax rate than those in
> the 28% and 31% income tax brackets. The fairest
> thing is to remedy both. Get rid of refundable
> tax credits and eliminate the wage ceiling for
> payroll taxes.


You know, those 2 suggestions alone solves 80% of the deficit problems