http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5415578059017835301&q=tomahawk+missile&hl=en

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L75Gga92WO8&mode=related&search=

I was there that day. Wasn't a cruise missle. There were plane parts all over theground. The plane also took out about 4 light poles on it's way in. A Tomahawk woudn't have done that.

would it be possible that there were explosive on the board if the plane???

Dennis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> would it be possible that there were explosive on
> the board if the plane???


THAT my friends, is how to write a sentence. English lesson over, Dennis wins.

So the smoke trailing behind the moving object that is no where near the size of the actual plane is explained how?


Watch the video again and again....its not a plane...
Attachments:

Are we still hashing this bullshit out? I was one who researched this big time, and have not seen one single explanation of how the light poles on 395 got knocked down.

I questioned the stated flight path and everything. But until someone explains how a cruise missile can physically knock out some light poles and other ground items like a ping-pong ball and still be able to blow out a side of the Pentagon I'm buying the plane.

Hey dipshit, don't forget:

1. The moon landing was shot in a studio

2. JFK was killed by CIA

3. 4 planes, the people on them, and Islamic extremists (who clearly loved the US and made martyr tapes) all disappeared in an elaborate hoax to lower gas prices and are sipping rum and cokes in Mazatlan.

Just so we're clear.

Firrat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So the smoke trailing behind the moving object
> that is no where near the size of the actual plane
> is explained how?
>
>
> Watch the video again and again....its not a
> plane...


What you see in the video is just the the nose of the plane on a so-so quality security video. If you look at the video, it is time lapse photography, not true video. What you are seeing is a photo being taken every couple of seconds. The plane was estimated to be doing somewhere close to 500 mph on impact. (Look at the Dumb Dusch post on the 200 mph camaro. If a car doing 190 mph can cover 400 feet in one second how much ground can a plane doing about 500 mph cover between frames on a security camera? Velocity is roughly speed X 1.6 do the math.) You see the nose of the plane on the one frame and the next frame the plane is in the building. The plane scrapped the ground (helipad) on its way into the building. That could have caused your smoke and lets not forget the plane was most likely at full throttle before impact and had struck several light poles. You could stand there at the point of impact and look up and to the left and the desk & chairs of the office were still sitting in place after the wall and floor collapsed next to them. Pictures were still hanging on the wall of that office. The same effect that you would have if something hit the building and punched through at a very high velocity. Not a cruise missile that is designed to explode on impact. The majority of the damage was done to the inside of the building, not the outside.

Save your conspiracy theory for Roswell and the little green men.

it finally all makes sense! Firrat is a mac user!


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

Myabe we should start a 9-11 conspiracy therioes thread.

If the gov't WAS behind the whole thing, they could have gone out any time during that day or the night before and knocked the light poles down with a truck or somthing.


Suppose it was some kind of missle designed to penetrate before it exploded (bunker buster anyone)


I have also heard that during the time that the planes dissapeard from radar, they were exchanged with other military aircraft that shot missles before hitting and were purposley crashed to test a hit on such a building

And i still haven't got an explanation for why WTC 7 collapsed and how fire melts metal.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/15/2007 08:56PM by KeepOnTruckin.

The security cam refreshes roughly every 1.5 seconds......the so so quality you call it clearly shows the size of what hit the pentagon....No where near the size of that plane....the plane traveling 500mph and the security cam catching the footage happens to be luck... But actual size of the planes nose from the distance of where the camera was located should have looked more like this if it was a plane..... look at the nose of the plane here and look at the vide....and see how much smaller it is...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2007 03:51AM by Firrat.
Attachments:

Here are more pics from 911lies.com
Attachments:

The funny part is...we can put this together as much as we want and know it was not a plane....this is infact funny and scary but we have no power .....powerless as you can see...we the people of the United States cannot even recover simple tapes from the FBI to view ourself what hit the pentagon...

Everything is controlled like a muffett to keep things under control....

Lol at impeachment even existing anymore!! :)

We the people do not have control over our country but the people we gave power to does .....

In a way its a good thing.... But bad as a citizen...

The only thing we have to fear is the Chupacabra.

I consider myself open-minded, but I've done enough research to believe the conspiracy theories exist only in the minds of complete idiots. Yes, there are a lot of unanswered questions, but the theories I've read have so many more holes. I do like your little photoshop pics above, but do you realize that someone could overlay a picture of a plane next to a mountain and convince 3-year-olds that the plane is bigger? I think the analogy is accurate.

KeepOnTruckin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Myabe we should start a 9-11 conspiracy therioes
> thread.

no.


> And i still haven't got an explanation for why WTC
> 7 collapsed and how fire melts metal.

im not sure exactly if you are talking about the building i am (the one that collapsed later in the day) but it had severe structural damage to the foundation from the impact of the targeted buildings. fire produces heat, heat melts metal... it's not a magic trick.

---

if you really suspect the government of perfectly executing such an ellaborate plan, please see this episode of South Park (no, it's not a link to a video, just info about the episode).

however, this is a hilarious video clip from the episode.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I consider myself open-minded, but I've done
> enough research to believe the conspiracy theories
> exist only in the minds of complete idiots. Yes,
> there are a lot of unanswered questions, but the
> theories I've read have so many more holes. I do
> like your little photoshop pics above, but do you
> realize that someone could overlay a picture of a
> plane next to a mountain and convince 3-year-olds
> that the plane is bigger? I think the analogy is
> accurate.


If you've done enough research please do share or prove how it was a plane.....If you can....The FBI would love to have you ;)

To belive conspiracy theories that you researched...they must have been really stupid for you to come to this conclusion cause for someone to know the truth or understand it..... they need to do the math in there own head with a little bit of common sense....

Ofcourse the ones who cannot do the math are the ones who will sit with there mouth open picking there asses still calling an object smaller than a plane "a plane"....

Why dont you do the math and show us how big the plane should look like from the distance than?

You have the size of the pentagon which is 73ft high and the boeng 757's fuselage which is roughly about 25ft tall.....the plane was seen on cam about 620ft away and hit at about 558ft away from the judicial watch.....
Attachments:

Anyone who thinks this is a cover up, i have one question

Why would you use two planes to hit the WTC and a missile to hit the pentagon?


Anyone with ANY kind of brain power would use another airplane if this was a cover up.

I totally agree with farrot,
please do elaborate your 'research', mr stinkypoon
unless you worked at the gas station monitoring the security camera on 9/11 before the FBI confiscated it, i am very reluctant to believe your 'research' holds any sacerdotal might over those 'photoshop' images

Adam Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anyone who thinks this is a cover up, i have one
> question
>
> Why would you use two planes to hit the WTC and a
> missile to hit the pentagon?
>
>
> Anyone with ANY kind of brain power would use
> another airplane if this was a cover up.


In both cases they used explosives in a different way....

world trade center they had a way of bringing it in.....and said the planes took the world trade center down...which the freefalling speed of the building with the way it fell shows clearly that it was not caused by the planes..but explosives ........

Why they didnt use a plane at the pentagon? the plane would have pretty much done nothing due to how strong it was built...infact the side it hit was built out of titanium.....


Both causing enough damage to call it an attack....

Damn, you people are nuts!

The smoke? It was the plane sliding through the dirt and grass on its way into the building. The plane was going 600+ miles per hour into a hardened and reinforced building. THAT is why there isn't much debris left. Furthermore, the plane came from Dulles, so it was full of fuel, THAT is why the explosion was so big.

Finally, no one disputes two planes flew into the WTC. Why the FUCK would the government use two planes on the WTC - flown by remote control or whatever - and THEN use a cruise missle on the Pentagon? Additionally, why would the government even bother attacking the damn Pentagon to begin with? Or flying a plane into an empty field? Wouldn't planes flying into the WTC be enough to galvanize the country for war?

You people have too much fucking time on your hands. Dumbasses.

Firrat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In both cases they used explosives in a different
> way....
>
> world trade center they had a way of bringing it
> in.....and said the planes took the world trade
> center down...which the freefalling speed of the
> building with the way it fell shows clearly that
> it was not caused by the planes..but explosives
> ........
>
> Why they didnt use a plane at the pentagon? the
> plane would have pretty much done nothing due to
> how strong it was built...infact the side it hit
> was built out of titanium.....
>
>
> Both causing enough damage to call it an
> attack....

Okay so they Hi-Jack 3 planes, somehow smuggle pounds of explosives into the WTC, wait until the first two plans hit. Detonate the explosives (I suppose they placed them on the exact floor the plane hit) because the building I saw fall started from the top, not the bottom.

Meanwhile someone has a Missile launcher on 395 shooting at the pentagon.

If I was a terriost, I think hi-jacking 4 planes and crashing them seems like the better option. If the government did it. Why pick the pentagon and WTC? I could see WTC, but blowing up your OWN military facility seems a little crazy. I can’t recall any anyone in history that destroyed their own defence systems to start a war??

There are plenty of other targets that could have gotten us into a war just as easily.

I would like to believe Conspiracy theories, but for 9/11 I think it’s safe to say terriosts did this one.

I think the WTC was the cake, and the pentagon was the icing. THe field was so that the american public would call everyone heroes.

I have haerd they used some sort of military fighter to shoot a missle at WTC before they crashed into it so that way it would collapse.

Now, I am no demolition expert, but I saw a video of a building being demolished with dynamite or similar explosive. I also saw video of the WTCenters falling down. the two look very similar.

Now, I have no idea if htese numbers are right, but I think that jet fuel burns at 800 degrees F. And Steel melts at 1250 degrees F. So, the jet fuel fires shouldnt have melted the sttle to cuase the structural damgare, right?

That makes so much sense now. All this time I thought our govt was too incompetent to do anything right, but obviously they are nefarious geniuses. Bush sitting there in that classroom on 9/11.... he wasn't a confused imbecile, but a mastermind hiding his joy behind a mask of stupidity.

Has anyone figured out why the pentagon was burning for so long? I mean, a missile can cause some explosive damage, but it would take a lot of jet fuel - I mean napalm - to get a big fireball to go up like that on impact, let alone to burn for days.

it was the terrorist
they are being lynched for their actions
but they got the wrong ones in the noose
so it seems?
the blind bird finds its way
but the deaf bird flies into the wall

All this time I thought our govt was too incompetent to do anything right, but obviously they are nefarious geniuses

Ya rly. Not to mention the level of secrecy that would be required to pull off such a conspiracy; there would have to be dozens, if not hundreds of trusted people "in the know". Do you honestly think they'd all stay quiet? Not even one leak to the press? Gimme break. This administration can't even hide secret wire tap plans from the public. The military & CIA couldn't even hide those extraordinary renditions from the press. Yet you think they could all work together seemlessly in order to conceal a vast conspiracy to kill a couple hundred American citizens in such a very public fashion?

Our government isn't functionally capable of planning and executing such a complex, large-scale clandestine operation. It's just not feasible. Why not just admit that a couple of ignorant psychotics snuck onto some planes and succeeded far beyond what they thought they could get away with.

Also, those pictures are alot of confusing nonsense, and I find it hard to believe that anyone would rely on them as "proof" of anything.

Fairfax MF---er Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Damn, you people are nuts!
>
> The smoke? It was the plane sliding through the
> dirt and grass on its way into the building. The
> plane was going 600+ miles per hour into a
> hardened and reinforced building. THAT is why
> there isn't much debris left. Furthermore, the
> plane came from Dulles, so it was full of fuel,
> THAT is why the explosion was so big.
>
> Finally, no one disputes two planes flew into the
> WTC. Why the FUCK would the government use two
> planes on the WTC - flown by remote control or
> whatever - and THEN use a cruise missle on the
> Pentagon? Additionally, why would the government
> even bother attacking the damn Pentagon to begin
> with? Or flying a plane into an empty field?
> Wouldn't planes flying into the WTC be enough to
> galvanize the country for war?
>
> You people have too much fucking time on your
> hands. Dumbasses.



haha 600 mph? no...... Sliding threw the grass? No... Look at the pentagon aftermath pics and you wont see a mark on the grass... Actually with most of the attention on the WTC they did a pretty damn good job....Attack to the pentagon made it seem more of a attack towards America due to what the pentagon symbolizes.. And due to it being a no fly zone....

If you put the flight number under wingdings format...It shows a plane attacking twin towers and a skull symbolizing death......

Let me guess, it was a Coincidence!!!!




I am researching Flight 77 hitting the Pentagon. The aircraft was a Boeing 757-200 traveling 345 mph according to the flight data recorder. Because of damage to light poles about 1500 feet from the building, the leading edge of the wing was about 15-18 feet off the ground at this location. The impact damage at the building is contained below the slab of the second floor, which is 14 feet high. Nothing hit the lawn prior to the building facade. How would ground effect have been overcome for this scenario?
- Russell Pickering

Your article on ground effect says that it comes into play at a height equivalent to the wingspan of the aircraft, or about 125 ft for a 757. If a 757 tried to fly at low altitude at 500 mph, wouldn't ground effect force it up to at least 125 ft? And if the pilot tried to force the nose down at that speed, wouldn't the aircraft become unstable? I don't think any pilot could control an aircraft like that and hit the Pentagon. No 757 could fly like that, especially the terrorist supposedly flying Flight 11 who was an unskilled amateur pilot yet magically flew with total perfection.
- S. R.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2007 11:44PM by Firrat.
Attachments:

Adam Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Firrat Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > In both cases they used explosives in a
> different
> > way....
> >
> > world trade center they had a way of bringing
> it
> > in.....and said the planes took the world trade
> > center down...which the freefalling speed of
> the
> > building with the way it fell shows clearly
> that
> > it was not caused by the planes..but explosives
> > ........
> >
> > Why they didnt use a plane at the pentagon? the
> > plane would have pretty much done nothing due
> to
> > how strong it was built...infact the side it
> hit
> > was built out of titanium.....
> >
> >
> > Both causing enough damage to call it an
> > attack....
>
> Okay so they Hi-Jack 3 planes, somehow smuggle
> pounds of explosives into the WTC, wait until the
> first two plans hit. Detonate the explosives (I
> suppose they placed them on the exact floor the
> plane hit) because the building I saw fall started
> from the top, not the bottom.
>
> Meanwhile someone has a Missile launcher on 395
> shooting at the pentagon.
>
> If I was a terriost, I think hi-jacking 4 planes
> and crashing them seems like the better option. If
> the government did it. Why pick the pentagon and
> WTC? I could see WTC, but blowing up your OWN
> military facility seems a little crazy. I can’t
> recall any anyone in history that destroyed their
> own defence systems to start a war??
>
> There are plenty of other targets that could have
> gotten us into a war just as easily.
>
> I would like to believe Conspiracy theories, but
> for 9/11 I think it’s safe to say terriosts did
> this one.



"Meanwhile someone has a Missile launcher on 395
shooting at the pentagon"

So What the hell was a C-130 bomber flying over for? Telemundo news coverage came in pretty handy once they recorded it flying over.....

Btw they reported such excersizes done in the WTC where they would close sections of the building doing unknown work.......and NO BUDDY WAS ALLOWED!.....So if you wanna call it smuggling or not..this event took place....

"There are plenty of other targets that could have
gotten us into a war just as easily"

Name a few...maybe if you come out with a better idea...they might concider having you work for them ;)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8172205003354341884&q=Olbermann&hl=en

Watch this video....

Haha it is too late though...its 2007 Bush is out @ 2008.....Due to the power our Gov has...Who will our Gov elect as president next? We do not have control over this.....

So if we the people wanted more control over our gov....what would we do? How would we gain power?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2007 11:36PM by Firrat.

If you put the flight number under wingbed format...It shows a plane attacking twin towers and a skull symbolizing death...

LOL. Were you sitting near paint fumes when you wrote this?

Q33NY

Goto Windows Word or Wordpad


Copy paste Q33NY into wordpad and copy it again to transform into wingding format....

Q33NY

Uhhhm yeah, like, I knew about that whole font thing. It's just very surprising that you would offer it as evidence to support the ridiculous point you're trying to make it.

No offense, but, how old are you?

His support for lame September 11 theories seems to indicate Firrat's somewhere between 12 and 15.

I used to do quality assurance testing on the motors for Tomahawk missiles. This was in 2003 though, so I didn't work on this one.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Q33NY
>
> Uhhhm yeah, like, I knew about that whole font
> thing. It's just very surprising that you would
> offer it as evidence to support the ridiculous
> point you're trying to make it.
>
> No offense, but, how old are you?


Yes people found out about about the Q33NY long time ago....I thought it was pretty weird at first and looked past it....But after all the numbers not adding up about 911 and where the war on terror went gave a nice lil outline on why this was done.....

Your making it seem as its the only evidence or argument i contributed....It would have been rediculous if i came forth with just Q33NY to support my point which i did not.......

I put in Q33NY in to ask the question how many flight numbers have the same coincidence where it pretty much draws out its future or destination?....

It does not offend me that you ask my age but it does offend me that out of the other information provided... you try to insult me as if this is the only peace of legit evidence or information i put in to support my point.....

The Congressman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I used to do quality assurance testing on the
> motors for Tomahawk missiles. This was in 2003
> though, so I didn't work on this one.


Nice.. Tomahawk missiles are pretty big...Since you work with them is there any way you can tell us about how big they are?

stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> His support for lame September 11 theories seems
> to indicate Firrat's somewhere between 12 and 15.


Your lame way of attacking me shows your intelligent....Your at the immature phase...please mature up so you can be put into concideration as an intelligent individual that can question facts rather than to make idiotic comments...

"Your lame way of attacking me shows your intelligent....Your at the immature phase...please mature up so you can be put into concideration as an intelligent individual that can question facts rather than to make idiotic comments..."

I know you didn't just use that disaster of a sentence to question another person's intelligence.

Not to mention you never refuted my claim of your age, so I assume I am correct... I took that one from the conspiracy theorists' playbook, genius...

Keep trying to convince people you are smart. Proper spelling is a good start.

you try to insult me

No insult intended, it's all just very, very odd.

funny... i didn't write the last two posts but i could see myself writing that. Firrat, answer my questions: was Bush sitting in the classroom on 9/11 not knowing what to do because he is a dope, or was the evil genius trying to hide his smile? what kind of missile creates a fireball like that and will leave the building smoldering for days?

Firrat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your at the immature phase...please
> mature up so you can be put into concideration as
> an intelligent individual that can question facts
> rather than to make idiotic comments...

I really wish people knew the difference between "your" and "you're."

Also, it's a good idea to know how to spell the insults you hurl at others (see "concideration).

Dumbfuck.

Firrat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Adam Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Firrat Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > In both cases they used explosives in a
> > different
> > > way....
> > >
> > > world trade center they had a way of bringing
> > it
> > > in.....and said the planes took the world
> trade
> > > center down...which the freefalling speed of
> > the
> > > building with the way it fell shows clearly
> > that
> > > it was not caused by the planes..but
> explosives
> > > ........
> > >
> > > Why they didnt use a plane at the pentagon?
> the
> > > plane would have pretty much done nothing due
> > to
> > > how strong it was built...infact the side it
> > hit
> > > was built out of titanium.....
> > >
> > >
> > > Both causing enough damage to call it an
> > > attack....
> >
> > Okay so they Hi-Jack 3 planes, somehow smuggle
> > pounds of explosives into the WTC, wait until
> the
> > first two plans hit. Detonate the explosives (I
> > suppose they placed them on the exact floor the
> > plane hit) because the building I saw fall
> started
> > from the top, not the bottom.
> >
> > Meanwhile someone has a Missile launcher on 395
> > shooting at the pentagon.
> >
> > If I was a terriost, I think hi-jacking 4
> planes
> > and crashing them seems like the better option.
> If
> > the government did it. Why pick the pentagon
> and
> > WTC? I could see WTC, but blowing up your OWN
> > military facility seems a little crazy. I can’t
> > recall any anyone in history that destroyed
> their
> > own defence systems to start a war??
> >
> > There are plenty of other targets that could
> have
> > gotten us into a war just as easily.
> >
> > I would like to believe Conspiracy theories,
> but
> > for 9/11 I think it’s safe to say terriosts did
> > this one.
>
>
>
> "Meanwhile someone has a Missile launcher on 395
> shooting at the pentagon"
>
> So What the hell was a C-130 bomber flying over
> for? Telemundo news coverage came in pretty handy
> once they recorded it flying over.....
>
> Btw they reported such excersizes done in the WTC
> where they would close sections of the building
> doing unknown work.......and NO BUDDY WAS
> ALLOWED!.....So if you wanna call it smuggling or
> not..this event took place....
>
> "There are plenty of other targets that could
> have
> gotten us into a war just as easily"
>
> Name a few...maybe if you come out with a better
> idea...they might concider having you work for
> them ;)


Holy Shit you really are clueless. A c-130 bomber? Maybe you heard the WTCs were hit first so they basically put all available aircraft in the air, not to mention it could simply be flying in or out of Andrews AFB oblivious? And the tail letters! Holy shit that proves it all! And the hole being smaller in the Pentagon? Well the wings obviously didn't go all the way through as they were not nearly as heavy as the fuselage which is circular in shape.

Go back to you NOVA intro to Poly Sci class you really need it.

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/110.html

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/084.html

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/083.html

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/082.html

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/081.html

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/080.html

Mofo, that's how they confirm their suspicions. Start with the idea: it was Bush and his asshole neoconsthat did it. Second, take every element in that chaotic day that cannot be scientifically explained by the average American idiot and contort it to meet this theory. Your pictures won't matter one bit to them.

I think there is something mentally satisfying in thinking that you have understood or solved an issue that everybody else is too stupid to figure out. Take 9/11, a no-brainer and an event absolutely unique - and let's face it, since no jet has ever hit the pentagon and thousands of gallons of jetfuel haven't engulfed skyscrapers, it's pretty easy to show a picture and say "that can't happen!" Find some 3rd rate engineers that need any exposure they can get to verify or fuel these theories and every nut will believe it.

I'm not saying there aren't unanswered quetsions, but if you have ever worked with these government agencies you know this could never happen. Look at Bush's unconstitutional wiretapping program: how long did it take for a whistleblower to say "this is not right!" And that is small beans compared to 9/11. These theorists probably have one thing in common: zero experience working within the federal government. And a low IQ.

Let's assume that the Pentagon really was hit by a missile. What happened to all of the people that were on the plane? I guess they became the inspiration for Lost? A government experiment?

stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Your lame way of attacking me shows your
> intelligent....Your at the immature phase...please
> mature up so you can be put into concideration as
> an intelligent individual that can question facts
> rather than to make idiotic comments..."
>
> I know you didn't just use that disaster of a
> sentence to question another person's
> intelligence.
>
> Not to mention you never refuted my claim of your
> age, so I assume I am correct... I took that one
> from the conspiracy theorists' playbook,
> genius...
>
> Keep trying to convince people you are smart.
> Proper spelling is a good start.


First off you dont even know me yet you call me an idiot for my questioning? Assumption....dont make an ass out of yourself...

My age isnt important, it will do you no good...Yet it will not prove anything.

My spelling is fine....Sorry that my spelling is the only thing you can attack at this point.....Do you want me to appalogize for not proof reading what i write? You understood it, did you not? Which means you critisizing my spelling is just a sorry way of you putting me down for the questions i ask and what makes sense to me...If you did put some thought into it, you can tell its a typo.

The problem with this picture is, I come forth with some questions, yet you pick out my spelling to point out i am unintelligent.....Your assumption does not impress anyone except people like you...

Please do pick out proof of what makes me so unintelligent other than a few misspelled words.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> you try to insult me
>
> No insult intended, it's all just very, very odd.


Yes there are many questions.....and 2 sides ...I am on the side that does not believe it due to how our Gov has lied and lied (war on iraq) and how they keep the truth away from us......This is one of the main reasons why i belive what i belive and i question it the way i question it.......

Our Gov does have a history of lying to our nation....

Yet whats odd is, the video tapes that would clearly show the planes crashing into the pentagon are taken away....

stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> funny... i didn't write the last two posts but i
> could see myself writing that. Firrat, answer my
> questions: was Bush sitting in the classroom on
> 9/11 not knowing what to do because he is a dope,
> or was the evil genius trying to hide his smile?
> what kind of missile creates a fireball like that
> and will leave the building smoldering for days?


His thoughts? I dont know..... Maybe you can ask someone who can read minds which i disbelive that people like that exist....

I dont believe Bush is evil....I think he is controlled like a Muppet....He is just the face of it...

But thats just what i think...

Good Speller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Firrat Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Your at the immature phase...please
> > mature up so you can be put into concideration
> as
> > an intelligent individual that can question
> facts
> > rather than to make idiotic comments...
>
> I really wish people knew the difference between
> "your" and "you're."
>
> Also, it's a good idea to know how to spell the
> insults you hurl at others (see "concideration).
>
> Dumbfuck.



Thats a good point you've made...I ll keep that in mind..

I was not taking sides with you dude. I just think it's bizarre that people can read this nonsense and interpret those photoshopped pics as proof of a conspiracy. The whole idea's just absurd.

More power to ya.

>
> Holy Shit you really are clueless. A c-130 bomber?
> Maybe you heard the WTCs were hit first so they
> basically put all available aircraft in the air,
> not to mention it could simply be flying in or out
> of Andrews AFB oblivious? And the tail letters!
> Holy shit that proves it all! And the hole being
> smaller in the Pentagon? Well the wings obviously
> didn't go all the way through as they were not
> nearly as heavy as the fuselage which is circular
> in shape.
>
> Go back to you NOVA intro to Poly Sci class you
> really need it.
>
> http://www.pentagonresearch.com/110.html
>
> http://www.pentagonresearch.com/084.html
>
> http://www.pentagonresearch.com/083.html
>
> http://www.pentagonresearch.com/082.html
>
> http://www.pentagonresearch.com/081.html
>
> http://www.pentagonresearch.com/080.html


Get into Poly Sci class? I need it?

How about you get into a class that can help you research better.....

Goto this link below...cause seems like those pics/link you sent me mean alot to your belief....

http://tomflocco.com/fs/WitnessesLink.htm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/17/2007 10:32PM by Firrat.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was not taking sides with you dude. I just
> think it's bizarre that people can read this
> nonsense and interpret those photoshopped pics as
> proof of a conspiracy. The whole idea's just
> absurd.
>
> More power to ya.

Yes your right....Its absolutely wrong to look at someones photo shopped drawings and make up your mind.....But people dont research it enough...But if they do research it...everything comes together and the info supports eachother... like a bridge ....This came together over time with continuous actions done by our government.

...everything comes together and the info supports eachother... like a bridge ....

No, it doesn't 'all come together'. You're stringing a bunch of past events together with dubious facts to arrive at a predetermined conclusion.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...everything comes together and the info supports
> eachother... like a bridge ....
>
> No, it doesn't 'all come together'. You're
> stringing a bunch of past events together with
> dubious facts to arrive at a predetermined
> conclusion.


Do you pay attention to how bush has handled other issues ? Because if you read about what he did or how he handles some situations....Sept 11 will look like a lie....Many people dont want to believe its our own government....But good questions that are answered threw facts as well as observations which have gone a long way....

I dont believe they have spent the most time on, "how they will cover up 911" but have spent more time on questions like ...what can citizens like you and me can actually do about it? What kind of power do we have to recover information kept away? We have none...Our Gov puts it as simple as this..... listen, shut up and dont ask too many questions.....

Firrat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Holy Shit you really are clueless. A c-130
> bomber?
> > Maybe you heard the WTCs were hit first so they
> > basically put all available aircraft in the
> air,
> > not to mention it could simply be flying in or
> out
> > of Andrews AFB oblivious? And the tail letters!
> > Holy shit that proves it all! And the hole
> being
> > smaller in the Pentagon? Well the wings
> obviously
> > didn't go all the way through as they were not
> > nearly as heavy as the fuselage which is
> circular
> > in shape.
> >
> > Go back to you NOVA intro to Poly Sci class you
> > really need it.
> >
> > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/110.html
> >
> > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/084.html
> >
> > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/083.html
> >
> > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/082.html
> >
> > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/081.html
> >
> > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/080.html
>
>
> Get into Poly Sci class? I need it?
>
> How about you get into a class that can help you
> research better.....
>
> Goto this link below...cause seems like those
> pics/link you sent me mean alot to your
> belief....
>
> http://tomflocco.com/fs/WitnessesLink.htm

So you are saying all of those photos are fake/doctored/conjured out of thin air and the people that took them and wrote about it are in on it? How deep does this go? Explain to me how we get fundamental extremists who hate our guts to kill themselves for us so we can invade their countries? Does that make any damned sense? Have you seen the videos where Bin laden talks about the towers coming down (his family made their millions in construction in Saudi Arabia), the suicide tapes of the hijackers, the airport footage of them, other al quaedias talking about the hijackings as their operation. Trust me, the FBI ain't all that to pull this off. IF this were a conspiracy it would require about five agencies and defense all working in perfect tandem (they all hate each other mind you) and you don't think one would have a crises of conscience over this and report it or "leak" it? I respect your viewpoints, that's part of America. And I am educated well beyond NOVA though I never had the pleasure of attending it.

Mofo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Firrat Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > >
> > > Holy Shit you really are clueless. A c-130
> > bomber?
> > > Maybe you heard the WTCs were hit first so
> they
> > > basically put all available aircraft in the
> > air,
> > > not to mention it could simply be flying in
> or
> > out
> > > of Andrews AFB oblivious? And the tail
> letters!
> > > Holy shit that proves it all! And the hole
> > being
> > > smaller in the Pentagon? Well the wings
> > obviously
> > > didn't go all the way through as they were
> not
> > > nearly as heavy as the fuselage which is
> > circular
> > > in shape.
> > >
> > > Go back to you NOVA intro to Poly Sci class
> you
> > > really need it.
> > >
> > > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/110.html
> > >
> > > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/084.html
> > >
> > > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/083.html
> > >
> > > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/082.html
> > >
> > > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/081.html
> > >
> > > http://www.pentagonresearch.com/080.html
> >
> >
> > Get into Poly Sci class? I need it?
> >
> > How about you get into a class that can help
> you
> > research better.....
> >
> > Goto this link below...cause seems like those
> > pics/link you sent me mean alot to your
> > belief....
> >
> > http://tomflocco.com/fs/WitnessesLink.htm
>
> So you are saying all of those photos are
> fake/doctored/conjured out of thin air and the
> people that took them and wrote about it are in on
> it? How deep does this go? Explain to me how we
> get fundamental extremists who hate our guts to
> kill themselves for us so we can invade their
> countries? Does that make any damned sense? Have
> you seen the videos where Bin laden talks about
> the towers coming down (his family made their
> millions in construction in Saudi Arabia), the
> suicide tapes of the hijackers, the airport
> footage of them, other al quaedias talking about
> the hijackings as their operation. Trust me, the
> FBI ain't all that to pull this off. IF this were
> a conspiracy it would require about five agencies
> and defense all working in perfect tandem (they
> all hate each other mind you) and you don't think
> one would have a crises of conscience over this
> and report it or "leak" it? I respect your
> viewpoints, that's part of America. And I am
> educated well beyond NOVA though I never had the
> pleasure of attending it.


FBI isnt the only one, CIA is involved in this as well....

here is something Mofo....
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8797525979024486145&q=9-11




WTC7 coming down the way it did.........?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5724088027792654614&q=september+11&hl=en



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2007 12:55AM by Firrat.

Hey I give Firrat credit, he is doing an admirable job sticking to the "9-11 Conspiracy Theory" script.

He still never explained where all those people on the planes went (it's always a carefully avoided topic in these discussions), but that's not relevant anyway.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2007 01:09AM by RESton Peace.

I'm sure Firrat is carefully misspelling a response as I type this.

As I read this thread, Rod Sterling keeps entering my mind

Firrat, I don't need to know you to conclude you are an idiot. You have no clue how this country's govt runs and you have trouble stinging a sentence together. Heck, you could be writing straight from the oval office (hahah wink wink lol). If there were not so much compelling evidence contrary to the 9/11 conspiracies, I could believe it was Bush and his neocons. They have no regard for our Constitution or international law and are obviously attempting to consolidate power. If something such as a single bomb going off in the Capitol happened without witnesses to the perps, yeah then I'd consider the possibility a little deeper.

However, as overwhelmingly awful as 9/11 was, the extremists did exist with the intent of harming this country and in this manner. The enemy wasn't some made-up nobody, and the method of attack was their trade craft. Our government could NOT have pulled this off. How could nobody have leaked at least one element of this plot? There is zero inside information, no collaboration, just a bunch of self-satisfying nuts and schizos looking at all real or fabricated inconsistencies and stringing them into this absurd theory.

Maybe, the government intentionally leaks things to the public so that we will think that they could not possibly keep anyhting a secret. Then, when they keep one secret, we will all say THey can't keep a secret and not believe them.

Question that need to be answered:

WHere are all the people on the planes if a passenger plane wasn't used to crash?

Why did Petagon burn for so long?

Why did WTC fall down the way it did, like a controlled demolition?

What about these times where unkown work occured?

Steel melts at approx. 2500 degree F. (source= http://education.jlab.org/qa/meltingpoint_01.html) Aviation fuel, Jet A [basically kerosene] which is what commercial airliners burn, burns at 800-1500 degrees F. How did the "steel melt"?

Heres some stuff on jet fuels and fun things like that: http://members.aol.com/afp1fire/fuels.htm

heres some stuff on the towers burning: http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/analysis/fires/severity.html



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2007 09:34PM by KeepOnTruckin.

.infact the side it hit
> was built out of titanium.....
>
>
>

Dumb Ass, the building was not built out of titanium. They were in the process of redoing the building and had reinforced that side of it. But they used Kevlar, not titanium to do so. And that was laced behind the stone work that makes up the building. And even if they used titanium in the steel beams, that wouldn't prevent a plane from breaking through the building.

Also, like I said earlier. I was there that day. I walked that field and picked up pieces of the plane. They had 50 people who were collecting pieces of the plane and placing them into a secure area.

Ask the people up in Pennsylvania how big the pieces of the plane were after it hit the ground. There was not much left.

You people need to go back on your medicine. You have been off of it too long.

Steel melts at approx. 2500 degree F. ... Aviation fuel, Jet A, burns at 800-1500 degrees F. How did the "steel melt"?

Reaching melting point would mean that the metal has completely transitioned into it's liquid phase. I would think that any support structure would lose it's strength well before it actually turned into a liquid. Shoot, heat a stainless steel utensil with a cigarette lighter for awhile and you'll see how it becomes alot more flexible, even though it's nowhere even close to it's melting point.

stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Firrat, I don't need to know you to conclude you
> are an idiot. You have no clue how this country's
> govt runs and you have trouble stinging a sentence
> together. Heck, you could be writing straight
> from the oval office (hahah wink wink lol). If
> there were not so much compelling evidence
> contrary to the 9/11 conspiracies, I could believe
> it was Bush and his neocons. They have no regard
> for our Constitution or international law and are
> obviously attempting to consolidate power. If
> something such as a single bomb going off in the
> Capitol happened without witnesses to the perps,
> yeah then I'd consider the possibility a little
> deeper.
>
> However, as overwhelmingly awful as 9/11 was, the
> extremists did exist with the intent of harming
> this country and in this manner. The enemy wasn't
> some made-up nobody, and the method of attack was
> their trade craft. Our government could NOT have
> pulled this off. How could nobody have leaked at
> least one element of this plot? There is zero
> inside information, no collaboration, just a bunch
> of self-satisfying nuts and schizos looking at all
> real or fabricated inconsistencies and stringing
> them into this absurd theory.


At first i was kinda disappointed that you were still stuck at my spelling error issue..... but then finally you put a smile on my face as i kept reading along....One small step for stinkypoon.. :)

Richard Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> .infact the side it hit
> > was built out of titanium.....
> >
> >
> >
>
> Dumb Ass, the building was not built out of
> titanium. They were in the process of redoing the
> building and had reinforced that side of it. But
> they used Kevlar, not titanium to do so. And that
> was laced behind the stone work that makes up the
> building. And even if they used titanium in the
> steel beams, that wouldn't prevent a plane from
> breaking through the building.
>
> Also, like I said earlier. I was there that day. I
> walked that field and picked up pieces of the
> plane. They had 50 people who were collecting
> pieces of the plane and placing them into a secure
> area.
>
> Ask the people up in Pennsylvania how big the
> pieces of the plane were after it hit the ground.
> There was not much left.
>
> You people need to go back on your medicine. You
> have been off of it too long.


..........................................................

The side the missile hit....Why was that the only side reinforced ? Yes there were plane parts.....But it does not match a 757...... how come those certain parts didnt melt or burn at all but yet the fuselage melts into pretty much nothing?



READ THIS
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/pentagon/plane-1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/pentagon/size.htm&h=282&w=400&sz=22&hl=en&start=69&tbnid=As-MJZ6OzkjdLM:&tbnh=87&tbnw=124&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dpentagon%2Bsize%26start%3D54%26ndsp%3D18%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26channel%3Ds%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/19/2007 01:07AM by Firrat.

What you're saying is true....Thats why they sprayed the framing of the WTC with plenty of insulation to keep that from happening...meaning the framing was protected by this material from reaching its melting point.......Yes it is Jet fuel but it still would have not got it weak to where it would collapse due to how its built...

But than again, how does that bring the whole building down again? It pretty much turned the WTC into nothing....

Amazing how he kept right on with the playbook and never addressed the issue I raised... where'd all those people go?

OK, not so amazing considering.

Sorry Reston Peace....I didnt know if you were derecting that question to me....Cause If you asked me i would say our Gov would probably tell us they melted away just like how the fuselage melted into nothing....

I'm not asking what the government would tell us. We know what your opinion is on that. You no longer need to state your case, you need to defend it. You need to directly answer the question I asked.

"Yes it is Jet fuel but it still would have not got it weak to where it would collapse due to how its built"

Please to support this dumbass comment with a reference or further explanation.

.
Attachments:

Here you go

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8797525979024486145&q=9-11

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0003-0023%28196301%2982%3A1%3C48%3ATDOBAS%3E2.0.CO%3B2-J&size=LARGE


According to facts about the human bone, there should have atleast been human bone remains left at the pentagon scene...

See, Firrat is unwilling to answer the question directly. He is smokescreening, a common tactic of the conspiracy theorist. He knows he has nothing of value to serve as an answer, so he's doing everything he can to avoid directly answering.

Now he knows he's lost, so he's using another standard tactic.. pass the baton to another theorist, and let that person's explaination cloud things even more.

Firrat, that's not an answer. Why will you not just answer this question directly?

Where are all the people from the plane?

Not where AREN'T they.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/19/2007 09:43AM by RESton Peace.

As a personal friend of firat I have had this argument with him personaly many times. I can assure you that it was indeed a plane. However I can also assure you that no amount of arguing either way will dislodge this belief from his mind. As such there is no point in worrying about it. Just live with the fact that he is wrong.

"As a personal friend of firat I have had this argument with him personaly many times. I can assure you that it was indeed a plane. However I can also assure you that no amount of arguing either way will dislodge this belief from his mind. As such there is no point in worrying about it. Just live with the fact that he is wrong."

That is a lie right there. Firrat has no friends.

hi think its an interesting argument.

btw is that mr kara your talking about? cant believe it, an old friend, well aquintance.

RESton Peace Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Firrat, that's not an answer. Why will you not
> just answer this question directly?
>
> Where are all the people from the plane?
>
> Not where AREN'T they.


The answer your looking for......

No passengers, no human remains...Not the work of terrorists....Work done by our Gov to benefit them in many different ways....

CIA smuggling drugs into the US.....They can do it...and they do..... cause they are the last people on earth we would expect of doing such a thing.

Same thing goes for Sept 11......Would make you think...why would they do it?

Champion Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
"Just live with the fact that he is wrong".


:-\

truth_seeker Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hi think its an interesting argument.
>
> btw is that mr kara your talking about? cant
> believe it, an old friend, well aquintance.


Hi, whos this?

496 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "As a personal friend of firat I have had this
> argument with him personaly many times. I can
> assure you that it was indeed a plane. However I
> can also assure you that no amount of arguing
> either way will dislodge this belief from his
> mind. As such there is no point in worrying about
> it. Just live with the fact that he is wrong."
>
> That is a lie right there. Firrat has no friends.


Actually what your saying is true...I dont have any friends and no life....

Now you know....

How about we do this....... The people who believes we were attacked by terrorists...... please write your strong beliefs that made you belive it was indeed terrorists.....The strong points, facts that has you believe what you believe ...

I want to believe it with you.... but i wanna know what are the strong points of your beliefs that has you believe the attacks were done by terrorists....

My belief is that I knew a lady on the plane and she's dead. Her husband is pretty sure he didn't agree to her hiding out somewhere for the rest of her life. He'd punch you in the nose, too, if you made any of these lame claims to his face.

well there is the multiple pieces of evidence gathered by the FBI, the transcripts and tapes of flight recorders and air traffic controllers hearing arabic chatter, The confession by Osama Yo momma Bin Laden himself as well as the three really fricken HUGE planes that crashed into the world trade center towers and the Goddamned pentagon! When 3,000 people are murdered on one day in just a few hours its a little hard to Cover up with a conspiracy.

ferfux, if the FBI shared such info and the peaces did match a 757 it would be clear....the arabic chatter can be made up....the FBI and CIA has soo much power its a terrible thing.....

If there were certain people that wanted to see and learn about this info they covered up.....they couldnt...simply cause the FBI has enough power to keep it away from you....

Tess Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My belief is that I knew a lady on the plane and
> she's dead. Her husband is pretty sure he didn't
> agree to her hiding out somewhere for the rest of
> her life. He'd punch you in the nose, too, if you
> made any of these lame claims to his face.


I am assuming she was on flight 77?

Well, maybe they didnt tell him she was going to be hidden for the rest of her life. Its like in 24 where Bauer pretends to be dead for a while so that everyone thinks hes dead.

Respectfully, i want to know more info or proof of this.....Name, Work, reason for traveling, Date the ticket was baught, credit card records, Airline confirmation #, Airline Hire date of hostess/pilot, Inspection before flight on 9/11, How much fuel was loaded from dulles and how much fuel was loaded into other planes and how much fuel was left by the end of the day...etc.


But this info i just listed can be made!!! that is the problem with this type of info..... But Videos from 9/11 can tell us alot! Reason why it was removed.....?

Or they just dont want people to see a plane hitting the pentagon?

Firrat, we need the grid coordinates of your house.

496 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Firrat, we need the grid coordinates of your
> house.


8-k-3

What do you think of Richard Clarke, our number 1 counter-terrorism expert? Was he in on this as well? Seeing as how he's an expert on these matters and doesn't believe the conspiracy, would that make him part of it then?

I also was there. First Jets do smoke, since they burn jp4 or jp5. This is a clean burning fuel. The con trails you see in the sky are actully a vapor trails not smoke. Two, The plane skipped on the ground before the strike. Actully landing gear parts were found near the light poles. Your angle of decent was far to hi, and the light poles were sheared off not knocked down. The black parts on th ground in the video is actully tire parts I know I picked them up. During the investigation.

Another component found at the Pentagon was a wheel hub--a type made by B.F.Goodrich's aerospace division. Here, Schwarz gets very specific: "They also made the wheels for the 757 but a simple proportional check of width versus diameter will easily show that the photo (left) is not a wheel hub from a 757, which has a much larger radius than width. This radius is about the same as the width of the wheel hub, and is another clue that the ' 757-crashed-into-the-Pentagon' story is a Bush lie," he said.




"If one looks very closely at the diameter versus width of the tire that was found at the Pentagon," said Schwarz, "this is the type of tire used for aircraft carrier-based and general rear wheels of smaller military planes--not commercial airlines." [The now somewhat outdated Douglas A-3 Sky Warrior "Whale" served as an aircraft carrier attack plane, capable of supporting missile platforms.]

stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What do you think of Richard Clarke, our number 1
> counter-terrorism expert? Was he in on this as
> well? Seeing as how he's an expert on these
> matters and doesn't believe the conspiracy, would
> that make him part of it then?


If he is told to be quiet, than he will sit quiet.....

If you scare something it will remain scared until it has enough power to fight back.

As long as the man in power keeps the snake apart we are powerless.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All this time I thought our govt was too
> incompetent to do anything right, but obviously
> they are nefarious geniuses
>
> Ya rly. Not to mention the level of secrecy that
> would be required to pull off such a conspiracy;
> there would have to be dozens, if not hundreds of
> trusted people "in the know". Do you honestly
> think they'd all stay quiet? Not even one leak to
> the press? Gimme break. This administration
> can't even hide secret wire tap plans from the
> public. The military & CIA couldn't even hide
> those extraordinary renditions from the press.
> Yet you think they could all work together
> seemlessly in order to conceal a vast conspiracy
> to kill a couple hundred American citizens in such
> a very public fashion?
>
> Our government isn't functionally capable of
> planning and executing such a complex, large-scale
> clandestine operation. It's just not feasible.
> Why not just admit that a couple of ignorant
> psychotics snuck onto some planes and succeeded
> far beyond what they thought they could get away
> with.
>
> Also, those pictures are alot of confusing
> nonsense, and I find it hard to believe that
> anyone would rely on them as "proof" of anything.



Better demo of what it should have looked like....

Firrat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> stinkypoon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What do you think of Richard Clarke, our number
> 1
> > counter-terrorism expert? Was he in on this as
> > well? Seeing as how he's an expert on these
> > matters and doesn't believe the conspiracy,
> would
> > that make him part of it then?
>
>
> If he is told to be quiet, than he will sit
> quiet.....
>
> If you scare something it will remain scared until
> it has enough power to fight back.
>
> As long as the man in power keeps the snake apart
> we are powerless.

He doesn't keep quiet, he writes articles and does interviews all the time. He is openly critical towards the Bush andministration's handling of this "war of terror". I'm just saying, the guy seems competent and incredibly informed, yet not very pro-Bush; so why wouldn't he enterain these theories? Probably because he sees them as having no credibility.

Firrat, after all the goofy banter and blurry images, the only point you've made so far in this thread is that you REALLY REALLY believe in a conspiracy; and you've done quite a convincing job at it! Other than that, you've proved nothing and intrigued no one.

No offense, but give it a rest. Go post something about illegal immigrants, rogue policemen, or how you once drove 300 mph in the Whole Foods parking lot, and you will be welcomed back into the group with open arms.

Firrat,
besides this lunacy of photoshop blurry photos and such, what about the tapes with osama and such saying how it went even better than planned?


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

When did he start his openly remarks towards the Bush administration? Him disagreeing with Bush means nothing....More he hates the Bush administration and agrees about 9/11 terrorist attack... the more he helps people believe cause it makes you think..... this man is good at what he does...and he hates Bush.....him not finding anything wrong about 9/11 must mean there is nothing wrong......

This could be the case or not.....But i think that info is hidden beneath him...We will not know