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Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
Big Money
()
Date: October 13, 2009 09:59AM
I've heard a lot about "jobs Americans won't do" during the immigration debates in the last few years. Could somebody name for me some of these alledged "jobs" that Americans will not do? I find it astounding that with a high unemployment rate, there are still Americans so stuck up that they would rather be unemployed than say, pick strawberries or work in a slaughterhouse. Could somebody please enlighten me?
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
TheMeeper
()
Date: October 13, 2009 10:13AM
>> "jobs Americans won't do"
Scuba Diver for Roto-Rooter
Scuba Diver for Roto-Rooter
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
MrMephisto
()
Date: October 13, 2009 10:16AM
I've never understood that, either. If I'm unemployed and need the money, I'd work any job that was available.
I know, I know, anything else might be a step up from being a janitor, but still...
--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.
I know, I know, anything else might be a step up from being a janitor, but still...
--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
pgens
()
Date: October 13, 2009 10:27AM
When unemployment extensions run out, you will then see more people going into those lower-paying jobs. Or they will be homeless. If people can survive on unemployment while still trying to look for work, they may go that route rather than take a much-lower paying job, lose unemployment, and go back to work.
I don't blame them, why take a pay cut to go to work?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2009 10:27AM by pgens.
I don't blame them, why take a pay cut to go to work?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2009 10:27AM by pgens.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
TheMeeper
()
Date: October 13, 2009 10:27AM
I think what they mean by "jobs Americans won't do", is, "jobs Americans won't do at that salary level".
Example: if I were unemployed, I wouldn't take a minimum wage retail job. I'd rather dip into savings and retirement money, even borrow on a home equity line, until I could find another job near the same salary as I was making. Sure, if it were a desparate situation, I'd take a low paying, no-skill job.
But that's not the case for me, nor are most middle-class Americans "desparate". The "jobs most Americans won't do" are really "jobs most Americans won't do until they've completely lost their ability to survive".
Example: if I were unemployed, I wouldn't take a minimum wage retail job. I'd rather dip into savings and retirement money, even borrow on a home equity line, until I could find another job near the same salary as I was making. Sure, if it were a desparate situation, I'd take a low paying, no-skill job.
But that's not the case for me, nor are most middle-class Americans "desparate". The "jobs most Americans won't do" are really "jobs most Americans won't do until they've completely lost their ability to survive".
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
pgens
()
Date: October 13, 2009 10:28AM
Beat you to it. pwn3d.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
RestonLass
()
Date: October 13, 2009 12:19PM
pgens Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If people can
> survive on unemployment while still trying to look
> for work, they may go that route rather than take
> a much-lower paying job, lose unemployment, and go
> back to work.
If the hourly rate of the job you accept is less than your unemployment benefit, you will not lose your benefit.
Your unemployment benefit will be adjusted down so the total of the adjusted benefit and hourly rate of the job equals your full benefit.
There is no reason to not accept a job that pays less than your unemployment benefit, if you are able to survive on the benefit amount. Besides, working while receiving benefits makes you look more proactive and less like a leech.
-------------------------------------------------------
> If people can
> survive on unemployment while still trying to look
> for work, they may go that route rather than take
> a much-lower paying job, lose unemployment, and go
> back to work.
If the hourly rate of the job you accept is less than your unemployment benefit, you will not lose your benefit.
Your unemployment benefit will be adjusted down so the total of the adjusted benefit and hourly rate of the job equals your full benefit.
There is no reason to not accept a job that pays less than your unemployment benefit, if you are able to survive on the benefit amount. Besides, working while receiving benefits makes you look more proactive and less like a leech.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
WashingTone-Locian
()
Date: October 13, 2009 01:25PM
We have spent the past 20 years teaching our young people that hard work is beneath them. Now we are seeing the consequences.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
ITRADE
()
Date: October 13, 2009 01:31PM
I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas - roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages. Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
With workers coming from down South who are willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created an unrealistic price point. It might great for Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50 of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can have a few more roosters, but the price point would not necessarily support a family.
So, vicious circle.
With workers coming from down South who are willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created an unrealistic price point. It might great for Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50 of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can have a few more roosters, but the price point would not necessarily support a family.
So, vicious circle.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
WashingTone-Locian
()
Date: October 13, 2009 01:33PM
ITRADE Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a
> pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas -
> roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages.
> Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going
> to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
>
> With workers coming from down South who are
> willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created
> an unrealistic price point. It might great for
> Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50
> of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can
> have a few more roosters, but the price point
> would not necessarily support a family.
>
> So, vicious circle.
There are plenty of skilled labor jobs that pay as much or more as many "careers." Unfortunately, American teens have no desire to do these jobs, so we rely on illegal immigrants to do them for us (and usually not particularly well).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a
> pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas -
> roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages.
> Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going
> to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
>
> With workers coming from down South who are
> willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created
> an unrealistic price point. It might great for
> Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50
> of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can
> have a few more roosters, but the price point
> would not necessarily support a family.
>
> So, vicious circle.
There are plenty of skilled labor jobs that pay as much or more as many "careers." Unfortunately, American teens have no desire to do these jobs, so we rely on illegal immigrants to do them for us (and usually not particularly well).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
Warhawk
()
Date: October 13, 2009 01:33PM
WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We have spent the past 20 years teaching our young
> people that hard work is beneath them. Now we are
> seeing the consequences.
+1 To quote the immortal Ted Knight from Caddyshack: "Well Danny, the world needs ditch diggers too."
__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.
-------------------------------------------------------
> We have spent the past 20 years teaching our young
> people that hard work is beneath them. Now we are
> seeing the consequences.
+1 To quote the immortal Ted Knight from Caddyshack: "Well Danny, the world needs ditch diggers too."
__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
pgens
()
Date: October 13, 2009 01:45PM
RestonLass Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your unemployment benefit will be adjusted down so
> the total of the adjusted benefit and hourly rate
> of the job equals your full benefit.
>
> There is no reason to not accept a job that pays
> less than your unemployment benefit, if you are
> able to survive on the benefit amount. Besides,
> working while receiving benefits makes you look
> more proactive and less like a leech.
As others have posted, the first paragraph you wrote answers why the second paragraph will not make sense to unemployed looking at lower-paying work. They'll just wait until they have to do it.
By the way, there is a school of thought that says this is not leeching. Unemployment insurance is paid for by employers, so it can be said that a portion of overall compensation goes toward that insurance.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2009 01:46PM by pgens.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your unemployment benefit will be adjusted down so
> the total of the adjusted benefit and hourly rate
> of the job equals your full benefit.
>
> There is no reason to not accept a job that pays
> less than your unemployment benefit, if you are
> able to survive on the benefit amount. Besides,
> working while receiving benefits makes you look
> more proactive and less like a leech.
As others have posted, the first paragraph you wrote answers why the second paragraph will not make sense to unemployed looking at lower-paying work. They'll just wait until they have to do it.
By the way, there is a school of thought that says this is not leeching. Unemployment insurance is paid for by employers, so it can be said that a portion of overall compensation goes toward that insurance.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2009 01:46PM by pgens.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
Warhawk
()
Date: October 13, 2009 01:51PM
WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There are plenty of skilled labor jobs that pay as
> much or more as many "careers." Unfortunately,
> American teens have no desire to do these jobs, so
> we rely on illegal immigrants to do them for us
> (and usually not particularly well).
That's a problem. If the world or this country underwent some sort of disaster, most of us white collar joes would be fucked with a capital F. How many people do you know that can build shelter, grow food, etc. etc. The very people that all of these self absorbed MBA/management types look down on would be the new kings.
I've told my son - if you want to do backbreaking manual labor for a living, that's fine as long as it's what you CHOOSE to do. Don't fuck off in school and have life make that choice for you. I've got one friend that does construction for a living. He busts his ass every single day, but he makes a real good living, built his own house, and loves his career.
__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.
-------------------------------------------------------
> There are plenty of skilled labor jobs that pay as
> much or more as many "careers." Unfortunately,
> American teens have no desire to do these jobs, so
> we rely on illegal immigrants to do them for us
> (and usually not particularly well).
That's a problem. If the world or this country underwent some sort of disaster, most of us white collar joes would be fucked with a capital F. How many people do you know that can build shelter, grow food, etc. etc. The very people that all of these self absorbed MBA/management types look down on would be the new kings.
I've told my son - if you want to do backbreaking manual labor for a living, that's fine as long as it's what you CHOOSE to do. Don't fuck off in school and have life make that choice for you. I've got one friend that does construction for a living. He busts his ass every single day, but he makes a real good living, built his own house, and loves his career.
__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
496
()
Date: October 13, 2009 07:51PM
TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Spalding!
25 bucks says the Smails kid picks his nose.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Spalding!
25 bucks says the Smails kid picks his nose.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
ThePackLeader
()
Date: October 13, 2009 08:17PM
Big Money Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've heard a lot about "jobs Americans won't do"
> during the immigration debates in the last few
> years. Could somebody name for me some of these
> alledged "jobs" that Americans will not do? I find
> it astounding that with a high unemployment rate,
> there are still Americans so stuck up that they
> would rather be unemployed than say, pick
> strawberries or work in a slaughterhouse. Could
> somebody please enlighten me?
It's not that Americans won't do the jobs, it's just that they can't do them at the wages being offered, because they actually need to pay taxes and bills (Unlike the illegals). I've even known hardworking legal immigrants who lost their jobs to Illegals, due to the fact that they won't let employers abuse their authority over them, whereas Illegals just shut their mouths for the most part (Unless it's an Illegal Owned business, in which case they like to over-charge Americans for the work they perform).
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've heard a lot about "jobs Americans won't do"
> during the immigration debates in the last few
> years. Could somebody name for me some of these
> alledged "jobs" that Americans will not do? I find
> it astounding that with a high unemployment rate,
> there are still Americans so stuck up that they
> would rather be unemployed than say, pick
> strawberries or work in a slaughterhouse. Could
> somebody please enlighten me?
It's not that Americans won't do the jobs, it's just that they can't do them at the wages being offered, because they actually need to pay taxes and bills (Unlike the illegals). I've even known hardworking legal immigrants who lost their jobs to Illegals, due to the fact that they won't let employers abuse their authority over them, whereas Illegals just shut their mouths for the most part (Unless it's an Illegal Owned business, in which case they like to over-charge Americans for the work they perform).
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
Gravis
()
Date: October 13, 2009 08:22PM
ITRADE Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a
> pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas -
> roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages.
> Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going
> to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
>
> With workers coming from down South who are
> willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created
> an unrealistic price point. It might great for
> Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50
> of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can
> have a few more roosters, but the price point
> would not necessarily support a family.
>
> So, vicious circle.
ha! the roosters part is hilarious and yet so true. i agree with your point but there are many contributing factors. just a theory but i think there may also be a social aspect to it: coworkers. it helps to have friends where you work because there's the thought, "this may suck but we're in this together". social bonds like this arent going to happen when they all come from a different culture and cant speak your language because they have already made bonds among themselves and nobody is interested in talking with you when it's painfully hard to communicate. yes, there are likely some that can speak the language a bit but it's much easier to make bonds with people of their native language and culture. just a theory.
"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a
> pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas -
> roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages.
> Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going
> to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
>
> With workers coming from down South who are
> willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created
> an unrealistic price point. It might great for
> Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50
> of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can
> have a few more roosters, but the price point
> would not necessarily support a family.
>
> So, vicious circle.
ha! the roosters part is hilarious and yet so true. i agree with your point but there are many contributing factors. just a theory but i think there may also be a social aspect to it: coworkers. it helps to have friends where you work because there's the thought, "this may suck but we're in this together". social bonds like this arent going to happen when they all come from a different culture and cant speak your language because they have already made bonds among themselves and nobody is interested in talking with you when it's painfully hard to communicate. yes, there are likely some that can speak the language a bit but it's much easier to make bonds with people of their native language and culture. just a theory.
"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
TefD187
()
Date: October 13, 2009 08:35PM
pgens Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When unemployment extensions run out, you will
> then see more people going into those lower-paying
> jobs. Or they will be homeless. If people can
> survive on unemployment while still trying to look
> for work, they may go that route rather than take
> a much-lower paying job, lose unemployment, and go
> back to work.
>
> I don't blame them, why take a pay cut to go to
> work?
unemployment extensions are jack shit. gluck living on $800 dollars a month, especially around here.
-------------------------------------------------------
> When unemployment extensions run out, you will
> then see more people going into those lower-paying
> jobs. Or they will be homeless. If people can
> survive on unemployment while still trying to look
> for work, they may go that route rather than take
> a much-lower paying job, lose unemployment, and go
> back to work.
>
> I don't blame them, why take a pay cut to go to
> work?
unemployment extensions are jack shit. gluck living on $800 dollars a month, especially around here.
Re: Jobs Americans Won't Do
Posted by:
Foghorn Leghorn
()
Date: October 13, 2009 08:47PM
ITRADE Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a
> pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas -
> roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages.
> Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going
> to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
>
> With workers coming from down South who are
> willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created
> an unrealistic price point. It might great for
> Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50
> of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can
> have a few more roosters, but the price point
> would not necessarily support a family.
>
> So, vicious circle.
You city dwellers crack me up. "Roosters"? Nope. If anything it would be more
hens. Rooster to hen ratio should always be one rooster for ever 20-25 hens.
If you have more than one rooster they will generally fight constantly. In
most cases to the death or one plays "chicken" and runs off. Roosters are for
sex only. Roosters cannot lay eggs or hatch them. They also do not taste nearly as good as hens.
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its not really a hard work issue. Its a
> pricing issue. Jobs in semi-skilled areas -
> roofing, welding, etc. - commanded decent wages.
> Not earth shattering, and not wages that are going
> to land you in Great Falls, but average wages.
>
> With workers coming from down South who are
> willing to weld for $9.00 an hour, you've created
> an unrealistic price point. It might great for
> Gustavo who lives in a flop house and sends $5.50
> of it to his family in Guatemala so that they can
> have a few more roosters, but the price point
> would not necessarily support a family.
>
> So, vicious circle.
You city dwellers crack me up. "Roosters"? Nope. If anything it would be more
hens. Rooster to hen ratio should always be one rooster for ever 20-25 hens.
If you have more than one rooster they will generally fight constantly. In
most cases to the death or one plays "chicken" and runs off. Roosters are for
sex only. Roosters cannot lay eggs or hatch them. They also do not taste nearly as good as hens.