http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2009/06/10/lebanon/index.html?source=rss&aim=/opinion/feature

Let's see what happens in Iran now.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

I didn't know that Obama was running for office in the Middle East.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

So Obama is no longer the president of the United States? Or does he have some kind of dual citizenship now?

Salon doesn't seem to be a reliable source of information, if they don't know Obama's the president of America.

Did he resign the presidency this morning or something?

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

He is a citizen of the world...the conNewt

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/10/2009 04:48PM by Vince(1).

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He is a citizen of the world...the conNewt

Are you drunk or something?

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

No...are you?? Did you read the article? Oh..of course not...you cant read! Well wait...you can read...you cant think...at least for yourself that is.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

Vince, your posts are starting to sound angry, not the calm cool collected idiot we have all come to know.

Is everything okay in your personal life?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton Lavey

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No...are you?? Did you read the article? Oh..of
> course not...you cant read! Well wait...you can
> read...you cant think...at least for yourself that
> is.

Yes, I read the stupid article that says Obama's speech in Cairo is the reason for Lebanon not voting in Hezbollah in their elections.

I guess this balances out Obama's speech in Cairo causing N Korea to start testing nuclear bombs again.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Obama did not explicitly call for the defeat of Hezbollah in the elections, but the Lebanese already knew where the administration's sympathies lay.

How do Obama's "sympathies" differ from Bush's "sympathies?"

I'm sure the election results had nothing to do with the "Biden warned at a news conference, 'We will evaluate the shape of our assistance programs based on the composition of the new government and the policies it advocates'" bit.

And definitely nothing to do with this:

"Even before Biden's visit and Obama's speech, most of the Lebanese public had probably already made up its mind about the arrogant and presumptuous Hezbollah-dominated opposition. The March 14 Alliance won because of the strength of the local economy, the desire for tourism, and anger at Hezbollah for streetfighting in 2008 that left 11 dead, more than a year of protests and sit-ins, and the Hezbollah bloc's ultimately successful attempt to strong-arm its way to effective veto power in the government."

And yet, you read this and think that Obama was the deciding factor in the elections? And you say I can't think for myself?

You're pathetic. Stop wasting my air.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

Just wait ass-wipe...after the elections in Iran...even a Gravis Bot like you will get it!

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

I just bookmarked this thread so I can come back and laugh at you after Iran's elections. But that's beside the point.

The point is, I can't believe you're this stupid. At your age, you should have learned something by now, but apparently not.

The article mentions the part of Obama's speech about "political moderates rejecting extremist views" being the driving factor in the election results. Isn't that what the previous administration said, too? Isn't that how we got those tribal warlords to turn against Al-Qaeda in Iraq and Afghanistan? But, I digress.

It mentions that bit about Obama's speech, and from that point on, his name appears in passing. The bulk of the article is about internal struggles in Lebanon that had an influence in the election. Do you really think that a Christian president's speech, given in another country, to the entire Middle East, had more influence on Lebanon's constituents than things actually happening in the country? Of course you do, because you want to, and you're delusional.

This is like saying Ahmadinejad's September 2008 address to the General Assembly of the United Nations was directly responsible for Obama being elected instead of McCain.

Like I said, you believe it because you want to believe it, which is the framework of any good fanatical belief.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Salon doesn't seem to be a reliable source of
> information,


FWIW, this same story was on NBC Nightly News last nite.

TheMeeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MrMephisto Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Salon doesn't seem to be a reliable source of
> > information,
>
>
> FWIW, this same story was on NBC Nightly News last
> nite.

I was being facetious, playing into the whole "He won the election and now he's running that country instead of the USA."

However, if NBC Nightly News ran this same story, then I'll posit that NBC Nightly News isn't a reliable source of information, either.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

And to burst your bubble even more, I direct you to this (if you dare to read it):

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090610/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_election

Pay attention to the part that says, "The outcome will have little direct impact on Iran's key policies — such as its nuclear program or possible acceptance of Washington's offer for dialogue — which are directly dictated by the ruling Islamic clerics."

Looks like Obama's got some more bowing to do.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

If Mahmoud Ahmadinejad looses the upcoming election it will be a major rebuke for his polocies of confrontation to the US. It will be due in good part to Obama's speech. That is the bubble you want to bust! Feel free to degrade the importance of a major speech by a president not afraid to speak directly to the Muslim world.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2009 07:12AM by Vince(1).

I have the same foreign policy experience as the rest of us - which is none, but from what I've gathered the majority of Iran's public actually disagree with Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's policies, especially his anti-Western stance. If Ahmadinejad loses the election that foundation was laid well before our duly elected Messiah even took office. And that opinion is should not be construed as an endorsement of the previous administration.

Warhawk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have the same foreign policy experience as the
> rest of us - which is none, but from what I've
> gathered the majority of Iran's public actually
> disagree with Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's policies,
> especially his anti-Western stance. If
> Ahmadinejad loses the election that foundation was
> laid well before our duly elected Messiah even
> took office. And that opinion is should not be
> construed as an endorsement of the previous
> administration.


So why did they keep electing him? Because they hated America...as in the Bush Administration...more them they hated him. Now thats changed thanks to the Messiah.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

The world only exists because I allow it to. This includes Obama's Middle East shenanigans. So technically, I won the election in Lebanon.

You guys are welcome.

Let me see what I feel like doing about Iran.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

i hope you realize that like the "royalty" in england, the president of iran is a figurehead.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

This was the first image that popped up when I clicked on Vince's link, which led me to believe that this website has absolutely no credibility whatsoever. Sorry Vince..
Attachments:

Lawman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This was the first image that popped up when I
> clicked on Vince's link, which led me to believe
> that this website has absolutely no credibility
> whatsoever. Sorry Vince..

the day vince posts a link to a credible new website to make his point is the day hell freezes over.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

Silly game of "credible" web sites....come on boys...grow up. Anf Gravis..your opinions dont count...You are a coward!

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

I likes middle East. Iz wun big Kitteh littah BOX!

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anf Gravis..your opinions dont
> count...You are a coward!

this coming from someone who dodged the draft.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

LOLcat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I likes middle East. Iz wun big Kitteh littah BOX!


+1 LOL

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton Lavey

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just bookmarked this thread so I can come back
> and laugh at you after Iran's elections.

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If Mahmoud Ahmadinejad looses the upcoming
> election it will be a major rebuke for his
> polocies of confrontation to the US. It will be
> due in good part to Obama's speech. That is the
> bubble you want to bust! Feel free to degrade the
> importance of a major speech by a president not
> afraid to speak directly to the Muslim world.

Supporters of the main election challenger to Mahmoud Ahmadinejad clashed with police and set up barricades of burning tires Saturday as authorities claimed the hard-line president was re-elected in a landslide.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.
Attachments:

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Silly game of "credible" web sites....come on
> boys...grow up.


Explain how your way of using politically biased and extremist websites is being grown-up.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton Lavey

lets see..I quote the BBC...Wikipedia....truthdig...recently newmax..other then that I just type in a topic and find a random web site. Whats so biased? What do you consider unbiased websites?

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lets see..I quote the
> BBC...Wikipedia....truthdig...recently
> newmax..other then that I just type in a topic and
> find a random web site. Whats so biased? What do
> you consider unbiased websites?

So if I find a website that says the Holocaust did not happen, I should assume it's true because it came up when I googled "Did the Holocaust really happen?"

You are one dumb motherfucker. And how do you explain the elections in Iran? Is it Bush's fault?

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

There really aren't websites that are truly unbiased. As long as a human being is writing a story or article, it will have some influence of the person's own opinion. However, there is a balance: read the same topic in more than one place, compare, and form your own opinion. I usually listen to CNN, and Fox before I make an opinion. Gives you a good balance, and you can assume that whatever is similar is the truth.

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lets see..I quote the
> BBC...Wikipedia....truthdig...recently
> newmax..other then that I just type in a topic and
> find a random web site. Whats so biased? What do
> you consider unbiased websites?

quote BBC news, the rest of those are garbage.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are one dumb motherfucker. And how do you
> explain the elections in Iran? Is it Bush's
> fault?

Like many who are knocked off their perch when facts don't go their way, Vince will simply not repost in this thread in the hope that it ends up on page 2 in a day or two.

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2009/06/10/le
> banon/index.html?source=rss&aim=/opinion/feature
>
> Let's see what happens in Iran now.

Possibly a revolution?

WashingTone Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Vince(1) Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2009/06/10/le
>
> >
> banon/index.html?source=rss&aim=/opinion/feature
> >
> > Let's see what happens in Iran now.
>
> Possibly a revolution?

Probably a massacre.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WashingTone Locian Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Vince(1) Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > >
> >
> http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2009/06/10/le
>
> >
> > >
> >
> banon/index.html?source=rss&aim=/opinion/feature
> > >
> > > Let's see what happens in Iran now.
> >
> > Possibly a revolution?
>
> Probably a massacre.

Few revolutions occur without one. I would rather have Iranians killing each other to accomplish regime change than killing American troops.

WashingTone Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Few revolutions occur without one. I would rather
> have Iranians killing each other to accomplish
> regime change than killing American troops.

Allah willing.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

bump to make the point that Vince was WRONG. Obama can't easily sway your allies (America's enemies) so easily.

Frequently wrong, but never in doubt.

As for peace, if we can't agree to do it for the Middle-East, then we should agree to do it for Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf.
.
Attachments:

conVince Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> bump to make the point that Vince was WRONG.
> Obama can't easily sway your allies (America's
> enemies) so easily.
>
> Frequently wrong, but never in doubt.


You don't think Obama's speech threw some gasoline on the fire you are seeing in Tehran now? All this helps give the reformists in Iran the support they need to sway those in government who are on the fence about the U.S.

What am I so wrong about? The jury is still out on Iran.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What am I so wrong about? The jury is still out
> on Iran.

It's politics. Iran can't come right out and say that they want to keep doing business as usual, but if Ayatollah Ali Khamenei didn't want Ahmadinejad to be president, he wouldn't be president. So of course they have to do a probe to make it look like they have some legitimacy.

America did the same thing in 2004, so it's not like this is without precedent.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

This picture best sums up MrM's agreement with Vince(1).
.
Attachments:

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Vince(1) Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What am I so wrong about? The jury is still
> out
> > on Iran.
>
> It's politics. Iran can't come right out and say
> that they want to keep doing business as usual,
> but if Ayatollah Ali Khamenei didn't want
> Ahmadinejad to be president, he wouldn't be
> president. So of course they have to do a probe
> to make it look like they have some legitimacy.
>
> America did the same thing in 2004, so it's not
> like this is without precedent.


You do mean our 2000 election...dont you?

And the difference there is we sat on our asses as that election was stolen...

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

2000, I guess. The whole Florida thing.

Either way, we are not an Islamic nation, subject to Islamic law, with a cleric holding the highest position in the government. It would be like America being a Cathoic nation, with a Cardinal or Archbishop holding a position over the President.

Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and his crew decide everything that happens in the country. For example, they want nuclear power. Would Khamenei rather have a president who is willing to speak out and say that they will not be deterred by sanctions and incentives to halt their nuclear progress, or a president who is more pro-western?

Ahmadinejad is a douchebag, but he is in line with what the religious rulers want for the country. If Khamenei said, "Tough tittie, there was no fraud, deal with it," then there would be more rioting, probably civilian deaths, and would make the country look pretty bad as they try to portray themselves as civilized people that deserve nuclear power.

So, pretend to do a probe, tell everyone that the result of the investigation is the legitimate election of Ahmadinejad, and that the democratic process has spoken. Any dissent afterwards can be put down much easier.

I don't like it, but this is how things work.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 2000, I guess. The whole Florida thing.
>
> Either way, we are not an Islamic nation, subject
> to Islamic law, with a cleric holding the highest
> position in the government. It would be like
> America being a Cathoic nation, with a Cardinal or
> Archbishop holding a position over the President.
>
> Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and his crew decide
> everything that happens in the country. For
> example, they want nuclear power. Would Khamenei
> rather have a president who is willing to speak
> out and say that they will not be deterred by
> sanctions and incentives to halt their nuclear
> progress, or a president who is more pro-western?
>
> Ahmadinejad is a douchebag, but he is in line with
> what the religious rulers want for the country.
> If Khamenei said, "Tough tittie, there was no
> fraud, deal with it," then there would be more
> rioting, probably civilian deaths, and would make
> the country look pretty bad as they try to portray
> themselves as civilized people that deserve
> nuclear power.
>
> So, pretend to do a probe, tell everyone that the
> result of the investigation is the legitimate
> election of Ahmadinejad, and that the democratic
> process has spoken. Any dissent afterwards can be
> put down much easier.
>
> I don't like it, but this is how things work.


You are probably right...but maybe not. And sometimes it takes years to know which.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

Vince(1) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MrMephisto Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > 2000, I guess. The whole Florida thing.
> >
> > Either way, we are not an Islamic nation,
> subject
> > to Islamic law, with a cleric holding the
> highest
> > position in the government. It would be like
> > America being a Cathoic nation, with a Cardinal
> or
> > Archbishop holding a position over the
> President.
> >
> > Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and his crew decide
> > everything that happens in the country. For
> > example, they want nuclear power. Would
> Khamenei
> > rather have a president who is willing to speak
> > out and say that they will not be deterred by
> > sanctions and incentives to halt their nuclear
> > progress, or a president who is more
> pro-western?
> >
> > Ahmadinejad is a douchebag, but he is in line
> with
> > what the religious rulers want for the country.
>
> > If Khamenei said, "Tough tittie, there was no
> > fraud, deal with it," then there would be more
> > rioting, probably civilian deaths, and would
> make
> > the country look pretty bad as they try to
> portray
> > themselves as civilized people that deserve
> > nuclear power.
> >
> > So, pretend to do a probe, tell everyone that
> the
> > result of the investigation is the legitimate
> > election of Ahmadinejad, and that the
> democratic
> > process has spoken. Any dissent afterwards can
> be
> > put down much easier.
> >
> > I don't like it, but this is how things work.
>
>
> You are probably right...but maybe not. And
> sometimes it takes years to know which.

Fuck you Vince, ignorant fucking mexican...go get an education and contribute something meaningful to society before I call INS on you and your family.

sigh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fuck you Vince, ignorant fucking mexican...go get
> an education and contribute something meaningful
> to society before I call INS on you and your
> family.

Stop.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sigh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Fuck you Vince, ignorant fucking mexican...go
> get
> > an education and contribute something
> meaningful
> > to society before I call INS on you and your
> > family.
>
> Stop.

NO.

sigh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MrMephisto Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > sigh Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Fuck you Vince, ignorant fucking mexican...go
> > get
> > > an education and contribute something
> > meaningful
> > > to society before I call INS on you and your
> > > family.
> >
> > Stop.
>
> NO.

You've contributed nothing to the current conversation, which makes you the thing you hate. Hopefully INS will pick you up on their way to Vince's, should you ever figure out who he is, where he lives, if he's an illegal immigrant, if he's mexican, or what the number is for INS. I imagine that a lot of this is beyond your grasp, so stop being a hypocrite.

To help you in your search for the INS number, though, I'll give you one free hint: they're not called INS anymore.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/15/2009 02:59PM by MrMephisto.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sigh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > MrMephisto Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > sigh Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Fuck you Vince, ignorant fucking
> mexican...go
> > > get
> > > > an education and contribute something
> > > meaningful
> > > > to society before I call INS on you and
> your
> > > > family.
> > >
> > > Stop.
> >
> > NO.
>
> You've contributed nothing to the current
> conversation, which makes you the thing you hate.
> Hopefully INS will pick you up on their way to
> Vince's, should you ever figure out who he is,
> where he lives, if he's an illegal immigrant, if
> he's mexican, and the number for INS. I imagine
> that a lot of this is beyond your grasp, so stop
> being a hypocrite.

I'll remember that when he replies to you with the money MrMcPissedon nickname when he gets frustrated and doesn't want to back his bullshit up. Seriously, why do you people still try to talk to this guy?

I'm trying to be less of a problem on here and more of a solution. It suddenly occurred to me last week that the incessant flame wars were probably not what Cary intended for this site, as fun as it is sometimes.

--------------------------------------------------------------
13 4826 0948 82695 25847. Yes.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm trying to be less of a problem on here and
> more of a solution. It suddenly occurred to me
> last week that the incessant flame wars were
> probably not what Cary intended for this site, as
> fun as it is sometimes.

Okay, fair enough.

MrMephisto Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm trying to be less of a problem on here and
> more of a solution. It suddenly occurred to me
> last week that the incessant flame wars were
> probably not what Cary intended for this site, as
> fun as it is sometimes.

Go scold your pal inkahootz for contributing nothing but bullshit. Never talk to me again about spreading hate when that is all this site is good for.

WashingTone Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Vince(1) Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> > http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2009/06/10/lebanon/index.html?source=rss&aim=/opinion/feature
> >
> > Let's see what happens in Iran now.
>
> Possibly a revolution?


unlikely.


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."

As usual, Vince takes an article that has nothing to do with the claim of the title and puts it up with little explanation.

Reading through the article reveals that it had little if anything to do with Obama, other than the fact that the article points out that the decision for Lebanon's election outcome (for a country that used to have a Christian majority in it until Hezbollah moved in and started blowing up and otherwise killing their opposition) had little to do with him (Obama).

Vince, time for those meds again. You accuse others here of not reading the article, and yet it is clear from reading it that you didn't really understand what it said at all.

Registered Voter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As usual, Vince takes an article that has nothing
> to do with the claim of the title and puts it up
> with little explanation.
>
> Reading through the article reveals that it had
> little if anything to do with Obama, other than
> the fact that the article points out that the
> decision for Lebanon's election outcome (for a
> country that used to have a Christian majority in
> it until Hezbollah moved in and started blowing up
> and otherwise killing their opposition) had little
> to do with him (Obama).
>
> Vince, time for those meds again. You accuse
> others here of not reading the article, and yet it
> is clear from reading it that you didn't really
> understand what it said at all.


I read it....I put it up to generate discussion....I made no claim one way or another as to the point of the article.

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.

You made the claim as to the title of the thread. You attach a link to an article that doesn't support your "statement" in the title.

FAIL

Registered Voter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You made the claim as to the title of the thread.
> You attach a link to an article that doesn't
> support your "statement" in the title.
>
> FAIL

The title of the thread was the same as the title of the article. My post was designed to generate civil conversation....PASS

Registered Voter...a Big talking coward..big man on FFXU...little man in life.