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What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Awakened ()
Date: November 04, 2008 03:21PM

Hey all.

I have a question.
Why did we go to war in Iraq?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: 4wheeler ()
Date: November 04, 2008 03:47PM

Have you tried a google search?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Awakened ()
Date: November 04, 2008 03:49PM

I'm asking YOU guys.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Vince(1) ()
Date: November 04, 2008 03:55PM

Oil

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: November 04, 2008 05:16PM

Read this.

For Immediate Release
Office of the Press Secretary
October 2, 2002

Joint Resolution to Authorize the Use of United States Armed Forces Against Iraq





Whereas in 1990 in response to Iraq's war of aggression against and illegal occupation of Kuwait, the United States forged a coalition of nations to liberate Kuwait and its people in order to defend the national security of the United States and enforce United Nations Security Council resolutions relating to Iraq;

Whereas after the liberation of Kuwait in 1991, Iraq entered into a United Nations sponsored cease-fire agreement pursuant to which Iraq unequivocally agreed, among other things, to eliminate its nuclear, biological, and chemical weapons programs and the means to deliver and develop them, and to end its support for international terrorism;

Whereas the efforts of international weapons inspectors, United States intelligence agencies, and Iraqi defectors led to the discovery that Iraq had large stockpiles of chemical weapons and a large scale biological weapons program, and that Iraq had an advanced nuclear weapons development program that was much closer to producing a nuclear weapon than intelligence reporting had previously indicated;

Whereas Iraq, in direct and flagrant violation of the cease-fire, attempted to thwart the efforts of weapons inspectors to identify and destroy Iraq's weapons of mass destruction stockpiles and development capabilities, which finally resulted in the withdrawal of inspectors from Iraq on October 31, 1998;

Whereas in 1998 Congress concluded that Iraq's continuing weapons of mass destruction programs threatened vital United States interests and international peace and security, declared Iraq to be in "material and unacceptable breach of its international obligations" and urged the President "to take appropriate action, in accordance with the Constitution and relevant laws of the United States, to bring Iraq into compliance with its international obligations" (Public Law 105-235);

Whereas Iraq both poses a continuing threat to the national security of the United States and international peace and security in the Persian Gulf region and remains in material and unacceptable breach of its international obligations by, among other things, continuing to possess and develop a significant chemical and biological weapons capability, actively seeking a nuclear weapons capability, and supporting and harboring terrorist organizations;

Whereas Iraq persists in violating resolutions of the United Nations Security Council by continuing to engage in brutal repression of its civilian population thereby threatening international peace and security in the region, by refusing to release, repatriate, or account for non-Iraqi citizens wrongfully detained by Iraq, including an American serviceman, and by failing to return property wrongfully seized by Iraq from Kuwait;

Whereas the current Iraqi regime has demonstrated its capability and willingness to use weapons of mass destruction against other nations and its own people;

Whereas the current Iraqi regime has demonstrated its continuing hostility toward, and willingness to attack, the United States, including by attempting in 1993 to assassinate former President Bush and by firing on many thousands of occasions on United States and Coalition Armed Forces engaged in enforcing the resolutions of the United Nations Security Council;

Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations, including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of American citizens;

Whereas the attacks on the United States of September 11, 2001 underscored the gravity of the threat posed by the acquisition of weapons of mass destruction by international terrorist organizations;

Whereas Iraq's demonstrated capability and willingness to use weapons of mass destruction, the risk that the current Iraqi regime will either employ those weapons to launch a surprise attack against the United States or its Armed Forces or provide them to international terrorists who would do so, and the extreme magnitude of harm that would result to the United States and its citizens from such an attack, combine to justify action by the United States to defend itself;

Whereas United Nations Security Council Resolution 678 authorizes the use of all necessary means to enforce United Nations Security Council Resolution 660 and subsequent relevant resolutions and to compel Iraq to cease certain activities that threaten international peace and security, including the development of weapons of mass destruction and refusal or obstruction of United Nations weapons inspections in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687, repression of its civilian population in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 688, and threatening its neighbors or United Nations operations in Iraq in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 949;

Whereas Congress in the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution (Public Law 102-1) has authorized the President "to use United States Armed Forces pursuant to United Nations Security Council Resolution 678 (1990) in order to achieve implementation of Security Council Resolutions 660, 661, 662, 664, 665, 666, 667, 669, 670, 674, and 677";

Whereas in December 1991, Congress expressed its sense that it "supports the use of all necessary means to achieve the goals of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687 as being consistent with the Authorization of Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution (Public Law 102-1)," that Iraq's repression of its civilian population violates United Nations Security Council Resolution 688 and "constitutes a continuing threat to the peace, security, and stability of the Persian Gulf region," and that Congress, "supports the use of all necessary means to achieve the goals of United Nations Security Council Resolution 688";

Whereas the Iraq Liberation Act (Public Law 105-338) expressed the sense of Congress that it should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove from power the current Iraqi regime and promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime;

Whereas on September 12, 2002, President Bush committed the United States to "work with the United Nations Security Council to meet our common challenge" posed by Iraq and to "work for the necessary resolutions," while also making clear that "the Security Council resolutions will be enforced, and the just demands of peace and security will be met, or action will be unavoidable";

Whereas the United States is determined to prosecute the war on terrorism and Iraq's ongoing support for international terrorist groups combined with its development of weapons of mass destruction in direct violation of its obligations under the 1991 cease-fire and other United Nations Security Council resolutions make clear that it is in the national security interests of the United States and in furtherance of the war on terrorism that all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions be enforced, including through the use of force if necessary;

Whereas Congress has taken steps to pursue vigorously the war on terrorism through the provision of authorities and funding requested by the President to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001 or harbored such persons or organizations;

Whereas the President and Congress are determined to continue to take all appropriate actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored such persons or organizations;

Whereas the President has authority under the Constitution to take action in order to deter and prevent acts of international terrorism against the United States, as Congress recognized in the joint resolution on Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107-40); and

Whereas it is in the national security of the United States to restore international peace and security to the Persian Gulf region;

Now, therefore, be it resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SEC. 1. SHORT TITLE.

This joint resolution may be cited as the "Authorization for the Use of Military Force Against Iraq".

SEC. 2. SUPPORT FOR UNITED STATES DIPLOMATIC EFFORTS

The Congress of the United States supports the efforts by the President to--

(a) strictly enforce through the United Nations Security Council all relevant Security Council resolutions applicable to Iraq and encourages him in those efforts; and

(b) obtain prompt and decisive action by the Security Council to ensure that Iraq abandons its strategy of delay, evasion and noncompliance and promptly and strictly complies with all relevant Security Council resolutions.

SEC. 3. AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF UNITED STATES ARMED FORCES.

(a) AUTHORIZATION. The President is authorized to use the Armed Forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to


(1) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and
(2) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council Resolutions regarding Iraq.

(b) PRESIDENTIAL DETERMINATION.

In connection with the exercise of the authority granted in subsection (a) to use force the President shall, prior to such exercise or as soon there after as may be feasible, but no later than 48 hours after exercising such authority, make available to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and the President pro tempore of the Senate his determination that

(1) reliance by the United States on further diplomatic or other peaceful means alone either (A) will not adequately protect the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq or (B) is not likely to lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq, and

(2) acting pursuant to this resolution is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the terrorists attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

(c) WAR POWERS RESOLUTION REQUIREMENTS. --


(1) SPECIFIC STATUTORY AUTHORIZATION. -- Consistent with section 8(a)(1) of the War Powers Resolution, the Congress declares that this section is intended to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of section 5(b) of the War Powers Resolution.
(2) APPLICABILITY OF OTHER REQUIREMENTS. -- Nothing in this resolution supersedes any requirement of the War Powers Resolution.

SEC. 4. REPORTS TO CONGRESS

(a) The President shall, at least once every 60 days, submit to the Congress a report on matters relevant to this joint resolution, including actions taken pursuant to the exercise of authority granted in section 2 and the status of planning for efforts that are expected to be required after such actions are completed, including those actions described in section 7 of Public Law 105-338 (the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998).

(b) To the extent that the submission of any report described in subsection (a) coincides with the submission of any other report on matters relevant to this joint resolution otherwise required to be submitted to Congress pursuant to the reporting requirements of Public Law 93-148 (the War Powers Resolution), all such reports may be submitted as a single consolidated report to the Congress.

(c) To the extent that the information required by section 3 of Public Law 102-1 is included in the report required by this section, such report shall be considered as meeting the requirements of section 3 of Public Law 102-1.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Army Guy ()
Date: November 04, 2008 05:23PM

Oil for Bush's buddies, it has been proven that his buddies have profited from the Iraq war. Haliburton, Blackwater, etc...

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: spunky ()
Date: November 04, 2008 05:47PM

Another reason why there were no-bid contracts, so Bush could make sure they (oil buds) make money. You do know that the "W" stands for Walker, which is the maiden name of Bushy's mom. A big share holder of Haliburton, gotta keep it in the family.

You missed me didn't ya?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: PresaCanario ()
Date: November 04, 2008 05:53PM

Both Osama Bin Laden AND the late, (may he rest in hell doused in pig guts) Zarqawi stated that Iraq was the central front in the WOT.

Our enemies stated this. And they promptly got pwned after the surge.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: spunky ()
Date: November 04, 2008 06:22PM

Terror is a mindset it can't be won through a war. Think about it the British tried and failed and they were on the same side of the ocean. Russia failed against Afganistan. But our arrogance and the act of 9-11 was allowed to cloud our judgement and we acted without a plan and without thinking, which was the beginning of the end for us before we ever started. Our leadership was absent and alot of good men and women paid the price, regretfully.

Makes you wonder why the RUSH to action?

That situation is no different then the IRAN one now.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Voter ()
Date: November 04, 2008 06:24PM

You're going to have to be more specific. Do you want:

a) the reason Bush said we were going to war before it started
b) the real reason that Bush didn't tell us before it started
c) the reason Bush said we went to war after it started and appeared to be going well
d) the reason Bush said we went to war after it started and it wasn't going so well
e) the reason Bush says now
f) the reason the neocons had and pushed behind the scenes
g) the reason Congress authorized the war
h) the reason that Bush and others had but would never actually say to anyone

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: concise ()
Date: November 04, 2008 06:40PM

The stated purpose of the war was to get rid of Saddam Hussein and leave behind a reasonably stable, friendly Iraq.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Voter ()
Date: November 04, 2008 06:56PM

See, this is what I mean. That was NOT the stated purpose of the war. The stated purpose was, that after 9/11 we couldn't allow regimes that possessed "weapons of mass destruction" and ties to terrorists. That was the stated purpose.

concise Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The stated purpose of the war was to get rid of
> Saddam Hussein and leave behind a reasonably
> stable, friendly Iraq.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: November 04, 2008 07:05PM

concise Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The stated purpose of the war was to get rid of
> Saddam Hussein and leave behind a reasonably
> stable, friendly Iraq.

Why?????? Their are at least 100 other mean and nasty dictators arouind the world. Why did we gho after this one?


When we went Invaded Irag the reasons were because WMDs posed a threat to the US and Sadam has links to terrorists. When it became we known that neither were true, Bush in speeches said things like "remove a dictator" and "bring peace to Iraq". He just changed the reasons.

Read the Joint resolution. THAT is why we were told we went in before we did.

And yes it has been reported that

"Both Osama Bin Laden AND the late, (may he rest in hell doused in pig guts) Zarqawi stated that Iraq was the central front in the WOT."

But there were no terrorists in Iraq before we invaded. We gave the terrorists a reason to go to Iraq so we could -as our fearless leader pointed out - fight them over there instead of over there.

Think of it this way....

Which came first, the traffic accident or the traffic back-up? The accident happened first then the back up occured because of the accident. Dont say the back up caused the accident.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Mofo ()
Date: November 04, 2008 07:24PM

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/2008 07:26PM by Mofo.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: concise ()
Date: November 04, 2008 07:28PM

Radiophile Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> concise Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The stated purpose of the war was to get rid of
> > Saddam Hussein and leave behind a reasonably
> > stable, friendly Iraq.
>
> Why?????? Their are at least 100 other mean and
> nasty dictators arouind the world. Why did we gho
> after this one?
>
>

Because the containment policy that was put in place at the end of the first gulf war was unraveling.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Rowsdower ()
Date: November 04, 2008 08:11PM

Radiophile Wrote:
> Why?????? Their are at least 100 other mean and
> nasty dictators arouind the world. Why did we gho
> after this one?

Because it was the easiest sell.

Additionally, the real power broker in the region is Iran. Take a look at maps of Europe and the USSR during the Cold War. The USSR was surrounded by allies or countries with which the US had influence.

Look at a map of the Iran. The US has troops or influence in countries surrounding Iran. It is another long term containment policy.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Vince(1) ()
Date: November 04, 2008 08:16PM

concise Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Radiophile Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > concise Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > The stated purpose of the war was to get rid
> of
> > > Saddam Hussein and leave behind a reasonably
> > > stable, friendly Iraq.
> >
> > Why?????? Their are at least 100 other mean and
> > nasty dictators arouind the world. Why did we
> gho
> > after this one?
> >
> >
>
> Because the containment policy that was put in
> place at the end of the first gulf war was
> unraveling.


Liar..it was not...it was working perfectly.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Bob ()
Date: November 04, 2008 09:07PM

Rowsdower Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Because it was the easiest sell.
>
> Additionally, the real power broker in the region
> is Iran. Take a look at maps of Europe and the
> USSR during the Cold War. The USSR was surrounded
> by allies or countries with which the US had
> influence.
>
> Look at a map of the Iran. The US has troops or
> influence in countries surrounding Iran. It is
> another long term containment policy.

Iran is not the power broker in the region.

The elephant in the room that the neocons and Bush and even democrats do not want to talk about is Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia and Israel are the two most important countries in that region (and they aren't even really enemies as is portrayed publicly).

Saudi Arabia funded Al Qaeda and the Mujahideen against the Soviet Union. Saudi Arabia used the "Arab A-Bomb" (their own term for oil embargos) against the US and the West for supporting Israel during the Yom Kippur War, sparking economic turmoil in the United States and Europe (and gas price spikes, shortages, etc.) Saudi Arabia educates the largest number of arabs from all corners of the region in their wahhabi controlled state-sanctioned universities. Saudi Arabia funds and controls the World Association for Muslim Youth (WAMY) and the Muslim World League and spends tens of billions on building mosques, schools, madrassas all over the world (including here in the US) to spread the most militant and hateful version of islam.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabi#International_influence

According to Western observers like Gilles Kepel, Wahhabism gained considerable influence in the Islamic world following a tripling in the price of oil in the mid-1970s. Having the world's largest reserves of oil but a relatively small population, Saudi Arabia began to spend tens of billions of dollars throughout the Islamic world promoting Wahhabism, which was sometimes referred to as "petro-Islam".[37] According to the documentary called The Qur'an aired in the UK, presenter Antony Thomas suggests the figure may be "upward of $100 billion".[38]

Its largess funded an estimated "90% of the expenses of the entire faith," throughout the Muslim world, according to journalist Dawood al-Shirian.[39] It extended to young and old, from children's maddrassas to high-level scholarship.[40] "Books, scholarships, fellowships, mosques" (for example, "more than 1500 mosques were built from Saudi public funds over the last 50 years") were paid for.[41] It rewarded journalists and academics who followed it; built satellite campuses around Egypt for Al Azhar, the oldest and very influential Islamic university.[42]

The financial power of Wahhabist advocates, according to observers like Dawood al-Shirian and Lee Kuan Yew, has done much to overwhelm less strict local interpretations of Islam [43] and has caused the Saudi interpretation to be perceived as the "gold standard" of religion in many Muslims' minds.[44]




http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A31402-2003Oct1?language=printer

Backed by money from Saudi Arabia, Wahhabis have built or taken over hundreds of mosques in North America and opened branches of Saudi universities here for the training of imams as part of the effort to spread their beliefs, which are intolerant of Christianity, Judaism and even other strains of Islam.

"A growing body of accepted evidence and expert research demonstrates that the Wahhabi ideology that dominates, finances and animates many groups here in the United States, indeed is antithetical to the values of tolerance, individualism and freedom as we conceive these things," said Sen. Jon Kyl (R-Ariz.), who has been holding hearings on Wahhabism.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: bk ()
Date: November 04, 2008 11:19PM

Bush got tired of Saddam tweaking his nose over the nuke inspections, and declared war on Iraq in a fit of temper and machoism.

But heck, it only cost us a few thousand American soldier's lives (so far); tens of thousands of soldiers sent home physical or emotional cripples, a trillion dollars or so, and (not that any one in Bush administration would even consider this a cost) a few hundred thousand Iraqis who didn't ask us to invade their country, killed.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Bob ()
Date: November 04, 2008 11:43PM

bk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bush got tired of Saddam tweaking his nose over
> the nuke inspections, and declared war on Iraq in
> a fit of temper and machoism.
>
> But heck, it only cost us a few thousand American
> soldier's lives (so far); tens of thousands of
> soldiers sent home physical or emotional cripples,
> a trillion dollars or so, and (not that any one in
> Bush administration would even consider this a
> cost) a few hundred thousand Iraqis who didn't ask
> us to invade their country, killed.

Actually, Bush was just a pawn. He made the mistake of appointing the neocons to his administration. The Project For a New American Century had already laid out their plans to invade Iraq and redraw the political map in the middle east, as well as many other things, once a "catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new pearl harbor" had occurred. And they got "lucky" when 9/11 occurred. It gave them the green light to embark on their plans for American hegemony.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf

In the Persian Gulf region, the presence of American forces, along with British and French units, has become a semipermanent fact of life. Though the immediate mission of those forces is to enforce the no-fly zones over northern and southern Iraq, they represent the long-term commitment of the United States and its major allies to a region of vital importance. Indeed, the United States has for decades sought to play a more permanent role in Gulf regional security. While the unresolved conflict with Iraq provides the immediate justification, the need for a substantial American force presence in the Gulf transcends the issue of the regime of Saddam Hussein.

Keep in mind, we were already being told to remove our forward deployed forces in Saudi Arabia, as well as our command and control centers, and had already built our new command center in Qatar well before 9/11. Invading Iraq offered us a place to build permanent bases where we could project power in the region.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: 70chip ()
Date: November 05, 2008 11:03AM

We are there for the oil. And for good reason. They have the largest reserves in the world of light sweet crude. In time of national emergency, we can be the exclusive purchaser of said oil. Iraq is our stop-gap or time-buyer until we can get onto other forms of energy. Does anybody have a clue what the implications would be if there was a land grab for oil producing countries by another super power?? Or if relations w/ Russia soured to the point where they embargo The United States from Oil exports? Gas at the pump would skyrocket to $10+ a gallon. $10/gallon gasoline would shut this economy down overnight. Furthermore the cost of food would rise so fast most of us would have to spend 50% of our income to put food on the table. Famine, Riots, poverty, and panic would engulf this nation within months. THATS why we are in Iraq. To preserve America. When we find our next source of energy, we'll drop the Middle East like a hot potato, and they'll go back to living in the stone age. IMO.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: MrMephisto ()
Date: November 05, 2008 11:05AM

How do Fairfax Country residents feel about North Korea's slow progress in dismantling their (N. Korea's) nuclear facility?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Bob ()
Date: November 05, 2008 11:28PM

70chip Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We are there for the oil. And for good reason.
> They have the largest reserves in the world of
> light sweet crude. In time of national emergency,
> we can be the exclusive purchaser of said oil.
> Iraq is our stop-gap or time-buyer until we can
> get onto other forms of energy. Does anybody have
> a clue what the implications would be if there was
> a land grab for oil producing countries by another
> super power?? Or if relations w/ Russia soured to
> the point where they embargo The United States
> from Oil exports? Gas at the pump would skyrocket
> to $10+ a gallon. $10/gallon gasoline would shut
> this economy down overnight. Furthermore the cost
> of food would rise so fast most of us would have
> to spend 50% of our income to put food on the
> table. Famine, Riots, poverty, and panic would
> engulf this nation within months. THATS why we
> are in Iraq. To preserve America. When we find
> our next source of energy, we'll drop the Middle
> East like a hot potato, and they'll go back to
> living in the stone age. IMO.

Well, that theory would at least explain why they were all hot about attacking Iran, since Iran could very easily shut down oil shipments from the entire gulf region by closing down the strait of Hormuz.

But I think us being there "for the oil" isn't that direct. It is more macro than that, more strategic -- control of the middle east, or at least having a strategic presence in order to maintain OUR version of order, so that both the US and Europe as well as Asia have access to oil on our/their terms.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Vince(1) ()
Date: November 06, 2008 06:50AM

70chip..you put it in such glorious terms. In fact, we are a society that is willing to kill it's youth so we can drive SUVs..and drive at 75mph. We decry women in distress aborting "babies" but we have no problem sending young men and women to their deaths for our lack of discipline and willingness for self sacrifice. "To preserve America"...what an f..king joke...no way...no how..just greed and ignorance.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: tj2008 ()
Date: November 06, 2008 07:32AM

you IT10Ts ACTUALLY THINK this was a war for OIL? do you KNOW what a war for oul would look like?

we'd kick ASS! we'd go there and secure the pipelines with armed troops that coule see each other the full length of the pipeline. the Navy would have the ports locked down so tight a fart couldn't get through without authorization! you'd have AA batteries around to defend vulnerable points, and troops standing by with BUCKETS to catch anything that was spilled.

some people are so fucking dumb that shooting them SHOULD be legal!

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Vince(1) ()
Date: November 06, 2008 08:52AM

with the direction the country has been on for the last 8 years your scenario isnt so outrageous...and if we were ready for the world's damnation we might have already done it. we did what we needed to do to hide our true intentions...wrapped it around rescuing the world from a mad man.

and given your scenario is there any wonder the muslim world hates us..and is actively trying to develop an atom bomb? obviously there is only one thing this country understands....mutual destruction.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: OIL yeah right. ()
Date: November 06, 2008 10:45AM

Really if it was for oil, then why am I still paying alot at the pump.
Saddam, was a bad man.
He needed to go. He did not have NUKES but he had chemeicals and he had no problem using it on his own people. This guy was like a great white shark.
Strategically, being in Iraq is a good thing.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Vince(1) ()
Date: November 06, 2008 12:31PM

OIL yeah right. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Really if it was for oil, then why am I still
> paying alot at the pump.
> Saddam, was a bad man.
> He needed to go. He did not have NUKES but he had
> chemeicals and he had no problem using it on his
> own people. This guy was like a great white
> shark.
> Strategically, being in Iraq is a good thing.


you are paying so much at the pump because the policy/the war is a failure..it has injected more doubt..more variables into the supply of oil then ever before. If he needed to go...the Iraqui people not us needed to get rid of him. I wonder what the 600k innocent civilians killed as a result of our foreign policy arrogance and stupidity think it was worth it? He had no WMDs at the time we invaded him...when he did have them..and he did use them on his own people he was a puppet government ally of the US. Iraq hasnt been worth the death or wounding of a single American soldier.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: talmagwa ()
Date: November 06, 2008 02:15PM

What's a neocon?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: November 06, 2008 04:17PM

talmagwa Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What's a neocon?


If you are serious, try asking Wiki or Google that question.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: November 06, 2008 04:21PM

70chip Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We are there for the oil. And for good reason.
> They have the largest reserves in the world of
> light sweet crude. In time of national emergency,
> we can be the exclusive purchaser of said oil.
> Iraq is our stop-gap or time-buyer until we can
> get onto other forms of energy. Does anybody have
> a clue what the implications would be if there was
> a land grab for oil producing countries by another
> super power?? Or if relations w/ Russia soured to
> the point where they embargo The United States
> from Oil exports? Gas at the pump would skyrocket
> to $10+ a gallon. $10/gallon gasoline would shut
> this economy down overnight. Furthermore the cost
> of food would rise so fast most of us would have
> to spend 50% of our income to put food on the
> table. Famine, Riots, poverty, and panic would
> engulf this nation within months. THATS why we
> are in Iraq. To preserve America. When we find
> our next source of energy, we'll drop the Middle
> East like a hot potato, and they'll go back to
> living in the stone age. IMO.

It is not wortth arguing your points except to say I read the "Joint Resolution to Authorize the Use of United States Armed Forces Against Iraq" and could not find the word "oil" in there anywhere amongst the "whereas's".

I do remember fearless leader and the man a machine operated heartbeat away from being fearless leader saying it was not for oil.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Registered Voter ()
Date: November 06, 2008 05:18PM

Bush used 9/11 as a pretext to go after countries that were state sponsors (or support) of terrorism.

In the choice between all the countries on the board after we went into Afghanistan, Iraq was the easiest choice. We were expending resources there maintaining no fly zones, there was rampant corruption in the attempts to sanction Iraq (Oil for Food) where many politicians and foreign governments were getting large kick-backs from Iraq oil deals. Saddam was paying $25K US to any family of a suicide bomber in Israel, and there were hints that he was building large bunkers under his new palaces (which he was) and facilities to produce new WMDs either in those bunkers or in mobile labs. Granted, Iraq was still reeling from a sustained war with Iran, but Russian influence in the area was growing rapidly - they were already backing the Iranians, and with the US and European (not so much) sanctions against Iraq, they were also making nice with the Iraq government.

There were obviously a number of other reasons to go into Iraq - as has been seen since the invasion. It would probably have been harder to sell a war with Iraq based on "the evil Russians", or "corrupt sanctions enforcement". It wasn't like the UN was functional - Russia, Germany and France opposed any form of strict enforcement of inspections. Saddam also didn't help his cause in how he dealt with the inspections. So, there you are.

Almost all the same arguments were used by President Clinton to justify shooting missiles into Iraq and other areas. And Congress did authorize the act. Shrug. It is done now - at this point we have to hope we can leave the place in better shape than how we found it.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: hyperventilating 'progressive' ()
Date: November 06, 2008 06:39PM

talmagwa Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What's a neocon?


That's another word for 'boogeyman'

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: November 06, 2008 08:20PM

Registered Voter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bush used 9/11 as a pretext to go after countries
> that were state sponsors (or support) of
> terrorism.
>
> In the choice between all the countries on the
> board after we went into Afghanistan, Iraq was the
> easiest choice. We were expending resources there
> maintaining no fly zones, there was rampant
> corruption in the attempts to sanction Iraq (Oil
> for Food) where many politicians and foreign
> governments were getting large kick-backs from
> Iraq oil deals. Saddam was paying $25K US to any
> family of a suicide bomber in Israel, and there
> were hints that he was building large bunkers
> under his new palaces (which he was) and
> facilities to produce new WMDs either in those
> bunkers or in mobile labs. Granted, Iraq was still
> reeling from a sustained war with Iran, but
> Russian influence in the area was growing rapidly
> - they were already backing the Iranians, and with
> the US and European (not so much) sanctions
> against Iraq, they were also making nice with the
> Iraq government.
>
> There were obviously a number of other reasons to
> go into Iraq - as has been seen since the
> invasion. It would probably have been harder to
> sell a war with Iraq based on "the evil Russians",
> or "corrupt sanctions enforcement". It wasn't like
> the UN was functional - Russia, Germany and France
> opposed any form of strict enforcement of
> inspections. Saddam also didn't help his cause in
> how he dealt with the inspections. So, there you
> are.
>
> Almost all the same arguments were used by
> President Clinton to justify shooting missiles
> into Iraq and other areas. And Congress did
> authorize the act. Shrug. It is done now - at this
> point we have to hope we can leave the place in
> better shape than how we found it.

Extreme revisioist history.

>were expending resources there
> maintaining no fly zones

So what. Except for some cat and mouse games - they were working.


> corruption in the attempts to sanction Iraq (Oil
> for Food) where many politicians and foreign
> governments were getting large kick-backs from
> Iraq oil deals.

Never bought up til AFTER the invassion.

> Saddam was paying $25K US to any
> family of a suicide bomber in Israel,

This has been widely reported and equally controversial. There is far more evidence that the Saudi's were offering this type of bounty.

> and there
> were hints that he was building large bunkers
> under his new palaces (which he was) and
> facilities to produce new WMDs either in those
> bunkers or in mobile labs.

Hints? Hints? Hints? The information was culled from a drunkard cab driver who wanted to stay in Germany. He said what the administration wanted to hear, and the administration ignored any evidence that he was lying.

Do I need to go on?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Bob ()
Date: November 06, 2008 10:05PM

hyperventilating 'progressive' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> talmagwa Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > What's a neocon?
>
>
> That's another word for 'boogeyman'

I love how people like you think that neoconservatism is something the liberals dreamed up because they are paranoid.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism


The term neoconservative was originally used as a criticism against liberals who had "moved to the right".[1][2] Michael Harrington, a democratic socialist, coined the usage of neoconservative in a 1973 Dissent magazine article concerning welfare policy.[3] According to E. J. Dionne, the nascent neoconservatives were driven by "the notion that liberalism" had failed and "no longer knew what it was talking about."[4]

The first major neoconservative to embrace the term and considered its founder is Irving Kristol, father of William Kristol, who would become the founder of the neoconservative Project for the New American Century, and wrote of his neoconservative views in the 1979 article "Confessions of a True, Self-Confessed 'Neoconservative.'"[1] Kristol's ideas had been influential since the 1950s, when he co-founded and edited Encounter magazine.[5] Another source was Norman Podhoretz, editor of Commentary magazine from 1960 to 1995. By 1982 Podhoretz was calling himself a neoconservative, in a New York Times Magazine article titled "The Neoconservative Anguish over Reagan's Foreign Policy".[6][7] The Reagan Doctrine was considered anti-Communist and in opposition to Soviet Union global influence and considered central to American foreign policy until the end of the Cold War, shortly before Bill Clinton became president of the United States. Neoconservative influence on American foreign policy later became central with the Bush Doctrine.

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Bob ()
Date: November 06, 2008 10:09PM

Radiophile Wrote:
> > Saddam was paying $25K US to any
> > family of a suicide bomber in Israel,
>
> This has been widely reported and equally
> controversial. There is far more evidence that the
> Saudi's were offering this type of bounty.
>

Not to mention that Saudi Arabia spends 10 billion a year spreading Wahhabism, the most militant and anti-christian (even anti other muslim sect) form of islam. They even spend that money here in the US building schools and mosques.

Also, since when should the United States go to war against a country because that country is giving a bounty to some other group to attack yet another group? Not our vital interests, no matter how brainwashed you are into believing that we have to fight to the death to save israel.


> > and there
> > were hints that he was building large bunkers
> > under his new palaces (which he was) and
> > facilities to produce new WMDs either in those
> > bunkers or in mobile labs.
>
> Hints? Hints? Hints? The information was culled
> from a drunkard cab driver who wanted to stay in
> Germany. He said what the administration wanted to
> hear, and the administration ignored any evidence
> that he was lying.
>
> Do I need to go on?

Didn't the intelligence services give that cab driver the code name "curveball"??

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: November 06, 2008 10:17PM

Bob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>>
> Didn't the intelligence services give that cab
> driver the code name "curveball"??


Yes. A simple google search for "CIA Codename Curveball" will tell anyone who is interested thw whole disgusting story. And his "friend" Achmed Chalabi is now working with the Iranians. Go figure. Who would have thunk that?

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Re: What do Fairfax County residents think that the Iraq War was for?
Posted by: Vince(1) ()
Date: November 06, 2008 10:32PM

Leaving Iraq in better shape than how we found it is mission impossible. What that usually means by sociopathic republikans means leaving it when it is a puppet of US interests....which basically means never. I hope the Iraquis have the will to insist on a date when we must leave...hook line and sinker. To do otherwise is a fraud!

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