Off-Topic :
Fairfax Underground
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Gaffer or Liar?
()
Date: September 26, 2008 10:04AM
Biden Fact Check: No US Diplomats In Tehran
by Aaron Bruns
CINCINNATI, OH ¡ª Big, long, dense speech from Joe Biden on McCain¡¯s foreign policy today, which I¡¯ll parse a little more in depth soon. But first, one face-off between Biden and the facts that, once again, the facts seem to have won.
Criticizing McCain for opposing negotiations with Iran, Biden said even the Bush administration now favors such talks ¡ª which Obama has long supported.
¡°After seven years, in which our senior diplomatic personnel were not allowed to make a single contact with Iranians, the Bush administration realized the absurdity of its own policy and sent our leading diplomat to Iran,¡± he said. ¡°The Assistant Secretary of State as he went to Tehran, sat down at the instruction of the President of the United States.¡±
It sounds great for Obama and Biden that the president came around to something so close to their position on talks with Iran; trouble is, the event Biden described never actually happened.
In point of fact, the one ¡°meeting¡± that has taken place was in Geneva, Switzerland, when Under Secretary of State William Burns sat in on a discussion between Iranian representatives and the other ¡°P5 +1¡å political directors involved in nuclear talks. The meeting, while a first, was not a negotiation; Burns was there merely as an observer, and had no formal role or talks with the Iranians.
So, point by point: Burns was not sent to Tehran; he did not go to Tehran; and there was no such instruction from the President.
Why the story from Biden? Turns out, he was taking a characteristic detour from his prepared text. Here¡¯s the far more factually accurate version of what he was supposed to say:
¡°After seven years in which our senior diplomat responsible for Iran was not allowed to meet a single Iranian, the Bush administration realized the absurdity of its policy and sent a leading State Department official to deal directly with Tehran.¡±
----------------
Wasn't Biden picked to shore up Obama's foreign policy shortcomings? Isn't this man chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee? Even if he was detouring from the text, shouldn't he know what the facts are?
by Aaron Bruns
CINCINNATI, OH ¡ª Big, long, dense speech from Joe Biden on McCain¡¯s foreign policy today, which I¡¯ll parse a little more in depth soon. But first, one face-off between Biden and the facts that, once again, the facts seem to have won.
Criticizing McCain for opposing negotiations with Iran, Biden said even the Bush administration now favors such talks ¡ª which Obama has long supported.
¡°After seven years, in which our senior diplomatic personnel were not allowed to make a single contact with Iranians, the Bush administration realized the absurdity of its own policy and sent our leading diplomat to Iran,¡± he said. ¡°The Assistant Secretary of State as he went to Tehran, sat down at the instruction of the President of the United States.¡±
It sounds great for Obama and Biden that the president came around to something so close to their position on talks with Iran; trouble is, the event Biden described never actually happened.
In point of fact, the one ¡°meeting¡± that has taken place was in Geneva, Switzerland, when Under Secretary of State William Burns sat in on a discussion between Iranian representatives and the other ¡°P5 +1¡å political directors involved in nuclear talks. The meeting, while a first, was not a negotiation; Burns was there merely as an observer, and had no formal role or talks with the Iranians.
So, point by point: Burns was not sent to Tehran; he did not go to Tehran; and there was no such instruction from the President.
Why the story from Biden? Turns out, he was taking a characteristic detour from his prepared text. Here¡¯s the far more factually accurate version of what he was supposed to say:
¡°After seven years in which our senior diplomat responsible for Iran was not allowed to meet a single Iranian, the Bush administration realized the absurdity of its policy and sent a leading State Department official to deal directly with Tehran.¡±
----------------
Wasn't Biden picked to shore up Obama's foreign policy shortcomings? Isn't this man chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee? Even if he was detouring from the text, shouldn't he know what the facts are?
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Registered Voter
()
Date: September 26, 2008 02:19PM
I posted this in the thread where they were bashing Palin before I read this one, but I figure this fits here to add to this thread :)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/25/AR2008082502337_pf.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/25/AR2008082502337_pf.html
Quote
...
Bush has been a polarizing figure, but most senators realize that partisanship should never trump national security. In early 2007, evidence mounted that the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps was planning terrorist activities in Iraq. An August 2007 National Intelligence Estimate found that "Iran has been intensifying aspects of its lethal support for select groups of Iraqi Shia militants" and that "Explosively formed penetrator (EFP) attacks have risen dramatically." The next month, the Senate considered a bipartisan amendment to designate the Revolutionary Guard Corps as a terrorist organization, an important step to aid nonviolent efforts to deny it funds and financing. Biden was one of only 22 senators to vote against it. "I voted against the amendment to designate Iran's Revolutionary Guard as a terrorist organization because I don't trust this administration," he said. Distrust of the U.S. president is the nature of politics, but skepticism about foreign dictators and their Brown Shirts is the backbone of judgment.
No matter. Biden's political games have made him Tehran's favorite senator. As Gen. David Petraeus struggled to unite Iraqis across the ethnic and sectarian divide, Iran's Press TV seized on Biden's plan for partitioning Iraq and featured his statements with the headline "US plans to disintegrate Iraq." Biden's attack-dog statements about U.S. policy failures emboldened Iranian hard-liners to defy diplomacy. In the Dec. 7, 2007, official sermon, Ayatollah Mohammad Kashani speaking on behalf of Iran's supreme leader, declared, "This Senator [Biden] correctly says Israel could not suppress Hizbullah in Lebanon, so how can the U.S. stand face-to-face with a nation of 70 million? This is the blessing of the Guardianship of the Jurists [the theocracy] . . . which plants such thoughts in the hearts of U.S. senators and forces them to make such confessions." The crowd met his statement with refrains of "Death to America."
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Palin is just Plain
()
Date: September 26, 2008 05:13PM
Let's check the score, shall we?
"Plain" says she can see Russia from her front porch and gaffed BIG TIME when questioned about this in her interview with Couric.
Biden is the Chair of the Foreign Relations Committee who has been re-establishing the goodwill and global reputation of America; the same goodwill and reputation lost by your pal Bush.
It looks like "Plain" is still not ready for the big time. Unless by big time, you mean moose hunter.
"Plain" says she can see Russia from her front porch and gaffed BIG TIME when questioned about this in her interview with Couric.
Biden is the Chair of the Foreign Relations Committee who has been re-establishing the goodwill and global reputation of America; the same goodwill and reputation lost by your pal Bush.
It looks like "Plain" is still not ready for the big time. Unless by big time, you mean moose hunter.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Registered Voter
()
Date: September 26, 2008 05:29PM
So.. re-establishing the good will of America is becoming the quotable politician that Iran's religious establishment can use to unite themselves to chants of "death to America"...
This is like pointing out Barney Frank and Chris Dodd as Chairmen (and previously ranking members) of their respective Finance Committees did a great job pushing through legislation to deal with oversight problems on GSEs.
Again, there is NO expectation that Palin has foreign policy experience. The MSM has played up this lack, and unfortunately the McCain campaign played right into it by trying to make it seem like she could answer them. Biden has 20+ years of experience and he still answers like a dolt. So there's experience you can count on. And then you have Obama the rockstar - let's hope we don't get attacked after he is elected, and somehow he will have to come up with a policy that will probably manage to keep the other countries pissed off at us...
Re-establishing the goodwill.. that is funny.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2008 05:30PM by Registered Voter.
This is like pointing out Barney Frank and Chris Dodd as Chairmen (and previously ranking members) of their respective Finance Committees did a great job pushing through legislation to deal with oversight problems on GSEs.
Again, there is NO expectation that Palin has foreign policy experience. The MSM has played up this lack, and unfortunately the McCain campaign played right into it by trying to make it seem like she could answer them. Biden has 20+ years of experience and he still answers like a dolt. So there's experience you can count on. And then you have Obama the rockstar - let's hope we don't get attacked after he is elected, and somehow he will have to come up with a policy that will probably manage to keep the other countries pissed off at us...
Re-establishing the goodwill.. that is funny.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2008 05:30PM by Registered Voter.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Bad Actions Speak Louder Than Words
()
Date: September 26, 2008 05:42PM
Death to America has been chanted many times over in the past 8 years.....thanks to Bush's actions and not Biden's mouth.
(Bad) Actions speak louder than words.
Re: the GSEs, and as stated in previous threads, if banks had better underwriting criteria and steeper loan loss reserves, we would not even be talking about FRE or FNM, or any need for a bailout, period. Quit being so shortsighted and look at the root of the problem first. Then again, no one is expecting you to be an economist or investment banker, so perhaps I've jumped the gun with your level of understanding.
(Bad) Actions speak louder than words.
Re: the GSEs, and as stated in previous threads, if banks had better underwriting criteria and steeper loan loss reserves, we would not even be talking about FRE or FNM, or any need for a bailout, period. Quit being so shortsighted and look at the root of the problem first. Then again, no one is expecting you to be an economist or investment banker, so perhaps I've jumped the gun with your level of understanding.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Registered Voter
()
Date: September 26, 2008 07:45PM
No, actually I have worked for banks, and know quite a bit about how bank reserves are set, and by what entity.
The underwriting criteria has been there, but when you have auditors that fail to do their jobs or participate in the problem (along with the executives trying to hide the problem) it doesn't matter much what rules you put in place. The real problem comes in setting up effective penalties to dissuade folks from being stupid in the first place. There needs to be better limits on the percentage of stock that board members can be awarded (and within a certain time frame) so that the regular stockholders actually have some ability to hold their boards accountable for executive compensation as well as the actions the board takes on the behalf of the company. Most of the times the boards vote out more and more stock every few years to dilute the stock more, and give themselves larger and larger numbers of shares - usually as "awards".
If you force loan loss reserves higher you limit the ability for banks to perform one of their primary functions. Part of why there was a credit crunch is most likely something that started when the Fed told banks to raise their reserves - and most of them had to scrounge up cash for that. Then when they couldn't lend any more money it started slowing down the business cycles - which most likely led to where we are today. One aspect of how everything fell apart - not the root cause, but most likely what started the slide.
The underwriting criteria has been there, but when you have auditors that fail to do their jobs or participate in the problem (along with the executives trying to hide the problem) it doesn't matter much what rules you put in place. The real problem comes in setting up effective penalties to dissuade folks from being stupid in the first place. There needs to be better limits on the percentage of stock that board members can be awarded (and within a certain time frame) so that the regular stockholders actually have some ability to hold their boards accountable for executive compensation as well as the actions the board takes on the behalf of the company. Most of the times the boards vote out more and more stock every few years to dilute the stock more, and give themselves larger and larger numbers of shares - usually as "awards".
If you force loan loss reserves higher you limit the ability for banks to perform one of their primary functions. Part of why there was a credit crunch is most likely something that started when the Fed told banks to raise their reserves - and most of them had to scrounge up cash for that. Then when they couldn't lend any more money it started slowing down the business cycles - which most likely led to where we are today. One aspect of how everything fell apart - not the root cause, but most likely what started the slide.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Registered Voter
()
Date: September 26, 2008 08:19PM
Bad Actions Speak Louder Than Words Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Death to America has been chanted many times over
> in the past 8 years.....thanks to Bush's actions
> and not Biden's mouth.
>
> (Bad) Actions speak louder than words.
>
They were chanting Death to America when Bill Clinton was shooting cruise missiles at them, and dropping bombs on them. They were chanting Death to America on 9/11 - and arguably at that point Bush had done very little to them.
I notice 9/11 seems to have dropped out of the mind of the liberals. It is like my other statement in another thread - folks seem to want to act like it never happened, rather than deal with it head on, embrace it as part of the bad things and figure out how to learn from it (and keep learning from it) while respecting the deaths of all those people. Pretending it never happened (another interesting MSM attempt to paint the bad economy totally on Bush policies) is pretty ridiculous - yet it surely is happening. I remember the election of 2004 the whole mantra was on all the jobs lost... we had just come out of a minor recession we still had not recovered from 9/11. Today we hear more about loss of wages from 8 years ago (I was making 6 figures before 9/11, now I am making what I made 3 years before that) and how horrible things are - that is not Bush's fault. Congress had large part to play in where we are today as well. Terrorists committed the acts of 9/11 - not Bush.
9/11 happened folks. Trying to forget it won't make it go away - and most likely will just lead to something very similar to it happening again.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2008 08:21PM by Registered Voter.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Death to America has been chanted many times over
> in the past 8 years.....thanks to Bush's actions
> and not Biden's mouth.
>
> (Bad) Actions speak louder than words.
>
They were chanting Death to America when Bill Clinton was shooting cruise missiles at them, and dropping bombs on them. They were chanting Death to America on 9/11 - and arguably at that point Bush had done very little to them.
I notice 9/11 seems to have dropped out of the mind of the liberals. It is like my other statement in another thread - folks seem to want to act like it never happened, rather than deal with it head on, embrace it as part of the bad things and figure out how to learn from it (and keep learning from it) while respecting the deaths of all those people. Pretending it never happened (another interesting MSM attempt to paint the bad economy totally on Bush policies) is pretty ridiculous - yet it surely is happening. I remember the election of 2004 the whole mantra was on all the jobs lost... we had just come out of a minor recession we still had not recovered from 9/11. Today we hear more about loss of wages from 8 years ago (I was making 6 figures before 9/11, now I am making what I made 3 years before that) and how horrible things are - that is not Bush's fault. Congress had large part to play in where we are today as well. Terrorists committed the acts of 9/11 - not Bush.
9/11 happened folks. Trying to forget it won't make it go away - and most likely will just lead to something very similar to it happening again.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2008 08:21PM by Registered Voter.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
libby
()
Date: September 26, 2008 08:28PM
Registered Voter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> 9/11 happened folks. Trying to forget it won't
> make it go away - and most likely will just lead
> to something very similar to it happening again.
Last time you started up with this topic, someone asked why Iraq instead of getting Bin Laden. You danced around a bit then finally let it drop. Round 2?
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> 9/11 happened folks. Trying to forget it won't
> make it go away - and most likely will just lead
> to something very similar to it happening again.
Last time you started up with this topic, someone asked why Iraq instead of getting Bin Laden. You danced around a bit then finally let it drop. Round 2?
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Registered Voter
()
Date: September 26, 2008 08:53PM
No, I am talking 9/11 and the economic issue. Iraq was a completely different issue that what I am talking about atm. Iraq is something that is happening now, for all sorts of good and bad reasons.
People want to cloud how 9/11 affected us with Iraq today. Two separate events and issues.
People want to cloud how 9/11 affected us with Iraq today. Two separate events and issues.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
libby
()
Date: September 26, 2008 09:02PM
Registered Voter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> People want to cloud how 9/11 affected us with
> Iraq today. Two separate events and issues.
While the two should be separate, GW made sure they weren't.
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> People want to cloud how 9/11 affected us with
> Iraq today. Two separate events and issues.
While the two should be separate, GW made sure they weren't.
Re: Biden a foreign Policy expert?
Posted by:
Vince(1)
()
Date: September 27, 2008 07:04PM
Oh...we liberals remember 9/11..that was the first Bush/Cheney disaster while they slept at the wheel...followed by the second Bush/Cheney disaster, the Iraq War....followed by the 3rd Bush/Cheney disaster the Finance Crisis!
We remember 9/11 very well...and so will history!
We remember 9/11 very well...and so will history!