Over the last couple of years there were plenty of people on this board cheering for the Springfield Town Center to fail. In fact there were a large number who guaranteed it would fail. Call me naive but every time that I drive by or go in there the parking lot is packed. The restaurants are thriving and new development is taking place in the surrounding areas. I would also like to note that I haven't seen any gang signup kiosks inside the mall and haven't once had to dodge any bullets from drive by shootings. So can the bigots please comment on what is going wrong or will go wrong?

The people hating are really people who could not succeed in ffx county at all or are not from here and choose to hate on this countys successful economic development. They are people from bumblfuck va or out of state.

Not a Yuppie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Over the last couple of years there were plenty of
> people on this board cheering for the Springfield
> Town Center to fail. In fact there were a large
> number who guaranteed it would fail. Call me naive
> but every time that I drive by or go in there the
> parking lot is packed. The restaurants are
> thriving and new development is taking place in
> the surrounding areas. I would also like to note
> that I haven't seen any gang signup kiosks inside
> the mall and haven't once had to dodge any bullets
> from drive by shootings. So can the bigots please
> comment on what is going wrong or will go wrong?

Not only is the TownCenter doing very well, but the four or five surrounding neighborhood shopping centers have all been through facelifts and had new stores and restaurants open as well. The entire area is slowly getting better and better. Just recently the Wood Ranch Grill at the mall opened and Potbelly and a Bob and Edith's opened & is opening down the road by the Hard Times. There's a new Aldi and Eleni's Greek restaurant in the newly rebuilt shopping center across from Mike's American (in the old hardware store), and the mall still has some burger place and a Dave and Busters on the way this year. There's a lot more smaller shops and restaurants still opening in the area too. And FYI, anyone house hunting: a majority of the homes in the area that have been rentals are being flipped and put on the market since rents are rising to the point that it's no longer possible to rent them as a landlord. Now is a great time to buy.

I've probably been to STC 4 times since it opened. The parking lots are much fuller, but when I get inside I wonder where everyone is.

Bill I have no idea when you're going, but every time I'm there it's packed. Hell even the Macy's is filled and that's not even new. All the restaurants have a wait almost all the time, there's almost no parking (excluding the garage, which is rather far from everything so it's usually only 1/3 full), and the stores are all doing quite well. The mall still has stores pending opening in the late summer/fall, and as far as I know the food court is still barely open, which at this point is a bit ridiculous but that's beside the point.

If you're going over by the movie theater there's really no stores at that end open yet, so maybe that's what you're seeing (the lower level lot by Target)? Unsure.

It's also having a noticeable affect on property values. One by one the rented homes in my neighborhood are being put on the market, and my property taxes and estimated home market value have risen significantly. I plan to refinance again soon, so I'll have an actual appraisal for value at that point, but I anticipate it to be significantly higher than last time even excluding updates to the property.

The only point of concern currently is the local schools. A few of them have 'temporary' trailers that have been permanent, due to volume of students most likely, but the ratings and reviews are rather poor considering FCPS is considered quite competitive locally and nationally (although you wouldn't know it from the incessant complaining from parents who think FairfaxUnderground is some sort of school-related message board, and students who think it's edgy to post meaningless things on it).

Went there the other day. Still the same. A modest number of shoppers were in Target, but probably no more than when the mall re-opened. The restaurants were fairly busy, but there were hardly any people in the mall or other stores.

I'm not sure you can give STC too much credit for rising home prices in the Springfield area. That area was hit hard when the real estate market collapsed. Being in NoVa, a rebound was going to occur even if STC hadn't re-opened.

Bill.N. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Went there the other day. Still the same. A
> modest number of shoppers were in Target, but
> probably no more than when the mall re-opened.
> The restaurants were fairly busy, but there were
> hardly any people in the mall or other stores.
>
> I'm not sure you can give STC too much credit for
> rising home prices in the Springfield area. That
> area was hit hard when the real estate market
> collapsed. Being in NoVa, a rebound was going to
> occur even if STC hadn't re-opened.

Not everyone is shopping. A lot are IN the restaurants which are usually so packed I have to wait a long time to be seated. Inside the amount of shoppers are the same as the ones at any other similar NoVa mall such as Dulles town center or Fair oaks mall.

When is Phase II supposed to start?

Have the crowds picked up any for the holidays?

Joke Insurance Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When is Phase II supposed to start?


I wonder too!

Went to the Springfield Brown Center on Saturday...first time inside since it was renovated. It looks nice enough but still has a largely scrubby-looking, non-English-speaking clientele. Wouldn't spend "a fun day of shopping" there or want to be walking to my car in the dark there. Will not go back if I can avoid it...

Secret Shopper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Went to the Springfield Brown Center on
> Saturday...first time inside since it was
> renovated. It looks nice enough but still has a
> largely scrubby-looking, non-English-speaking
> clientele. Wouldn't spend "a fun day of shopping"
> there or want to be walking to my car in the dark
> there. Will not go back if I can avoid it...
You must have a gigantic pussy! I'm just 5 feet tall 100 pounds and worked at the former springfield mall til 11pm at night every night while in school and never felt a tinge of fear!

Now that Dave & Busters is open it appears people are finally venturing past the restaurants and anchor stores. Target also seems busier.

There was an article in the Washington Business Journal with graphics and details on the new phase. Say goodbye parking lots. It is still unknown as to the date of when this project will begin. As for scruffy looking shoppers....Sounds like someone is racist. I am up there about every other weekend and the mall is has been getting busier. I went in for a haircut and there was a waiting line at several of the locations; whereas 6 8 months ago I wouldn't have had to wait. I look forward to future changes and growth.

Maybe you are a racist...stop being over critical.

MikeS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There was an article in the Washington Business
> Journal with graphics and details on the new
> phase. Say goodbye parking lots. It is still
> unknown as to the date of when this project will
> begin. As for scruffy looking shoppers....Sounds
> like someone is racist. I am up there about every
> other weekend and the mall is has been getting
> busier. I went in for a haircut and there was a
> waiting line at several of the locations; whereas
> 6 8 months ago I wouldn't have had to wait. I
> look forward to future changes and growth.


URL?

http://www.bizjournals.com/washington/breaking_ground/2016/02/goodbye-parking-lots-new-vision-released-for-a.html

I wonder if Springfield Mall will ever be able to pay off their debt. They took out a $240 million high interest loan in order to revitalize. It's funny how modern are stuck between two shitty options:

Option 1: Don't revitalize your mall, just let it die

or

Option 2: Take out huge high interest loans in order to be competitive in an oversaturated market.

@Alex the Summinator

Do you mean the Springfield Town Center (Springfield Mall)?

Not only is the current owner PREIT (Pennsylvania Real Estate Investment Trust, https://www.preit.com/) making back their money, they're making it fast enough that they're going to be initiating phase 2 of the build sooner than expected, as linked in the previous post (http://www.bizjournals.com/washington/breaking_ground/2016/02/goodbye-parking-lots-new-vision-released-for-a.html).

STC is in a good location because the closest malls are Woodbridge or Tysons (until Ballston is completed), and no one wants to drive 10+ miles to go shopping if they can avoid traffic here.

With the local shopping centers all remodeled and filled with new stores and restaurants, local craft breweries like Forge and FairWinds, and the massive St. James center already under construction, the area is doing very well, as is PREIT.

I may be mistaken but I am pretty sure Vornado took out the loan originally for $240 million but then defaulted for a lower amount of about $170 million. This was due to lower costs to remodel. In the end it doesn't matter since they sold the property for over $400 million. Go hate somewhere else.

> STC is in a good location because the closest
> malls are Woodbridge or Tysons (until Ballston is
> completed), and no one wants to drive 10+ miles to
> go shopping if they can avoid traffic here.
>
> With the local shopping centers all remodeled and
> filled with new stores and restaurants, local
> craft breweries like Forge and FairWinds, and the
> massive St. James center already under
> construction, the area is doing very well, as is
> PREIT.

You are sounding more like a shill for STC than a disinterested analyst. STCs location is the same as Springfield Malls in its declining days. Someone trying to sell it as a shopping venue would not discuss Ballston. They would discuss Pentagon City which also is on the I95-i395 corridor. St. James as you say is under construction. Whether it proves successful and whether any synergy develops between it and STC is an open question. They are not that far away as the crow flies, but not so much when you look at actual driving patterns.

STCs success so far has, like Shirlington, come from rebranding itself as a place to go to dine rather than to shop. It would be interesting to see the numbers on how the Macy's sales stack up with Tyson's or Targets numbers stack up with other NoVa locations. My guess is not so well. While traffic within the mall itself (not traffic for the restaurants on the perimeter but in the shopping areas) has picked up, it is more like what you see at Fair Oaks than what you see at successful Tyson's. To its credit STC did not suffer the fate of Landmark or Manassas Mall.

There is no arguing that rebranding as a place to go eat has caused business to pick up. However when my kids get together with friends who work or live in that area, they are still more likely to go to Alexandria, to Clarendon, to Tyson's or to DC than to STC.

What is the St James Center and where is it going to be? Thanks

http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/news2/mega-sports-fitness-and-wellness-complex-approved-for-springfield/

Demo was completed and construction has been underway for a few months now.

Thanks.