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Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Southern gentleman ()
Date: July 31, 2012 06:22PM

I've stopped counting how many random people have asked my GS level since I moved to NOVA. It's rude and the equivalent of asking someone how much money they make. These same people never inquire about my job title, what I do at my job, even if I enjoy my work. People around here seem fixated on GS levels and military rank. For those of you who haven't been taught otherwise, it's very rude to ask someone about their earnings, how much their house cost, what their GS level is, etc.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: GS 16 ()
Date: July 31, 2012 06:32PM

So what the fuck is your GS level?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Southern Asshole ()
Date: July 31, 2012 06:32PM

So...what's your GS level?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: July 31, 2012 06:42PM

DOD civilians are actually very open about their pay grade as they equate to military rank, especially GS-13 and above.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: ES-3 ()
Date: July 31, 2012 06:47PM

I'm sorry, did you say something? I generally don't pay attention to anyone who doesn't have and ES in front of their number.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: notlogdin ()
Date: July 31, 2012 07:16PM

ES-3 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sorry, did you say something? I generally
> don't pay attention to anyone who doesn't have and
> ES in front of their number.

Is that an abbreviation of SES?

All the cool kids are SIS.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: private industry ()
Date: July 31, 2012 07:42PM

OP, Since OUR taxes pay your salary, a public worker is NOT the same as private industry. You are probably being overpaid. And everyone that is asking you about you GS level, is just shaking their heads in disbelief to our government's overspending. So when they cut your job/department/agency and you go to work as a day laborer, you'll see how worthless you really are. You pretentious a-hole.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: GS'er ()
Date: July 31, 2012 08:15PM

No need to ask anymore, it is all on the Internet. just tell us your name and agency please.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: GS-99 ()
Date: July 31, 2012 08:33PM

Only low-number GS's care about being asked.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: FreddyTheFeddy ()
Date: July 31, 2012 08:36PM

Southern gentleman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've stopped counting how many random people have
> asked my GS level since I moved to NOVA. It's
> rude and the equivalent of asking someone how much
> money they make. These same people never inquire
> about my job title, what I do at my job, even if I
> enjoy my work. People around here seem fixated on
> GS levels and military rank. For those of you who
> haven't been taught otherwise, it's very rude to
> ask someone about their earnings, how much their
> house cost, what their GS level is, etc.

I retired from the Feds after 30 years and I can only recall
a couple of times being asked my grade level by someone just
being nosey. Maybe you're walking around with a sign and don't
realize it.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: I am pure water ()
Date: July 31, 2012 09:10PM

I hate when people ask for my Ph Level.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: O-10 ()
Date: July 31, 2012 09:22PM

Sorry about your penis, son...your lips are moving but, I can't hear you.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: 0tter ()
Date: July 31, 2012 09:26PM

Ahhh, I love it. 8 years ago I was laughed at by friends who thought I was crazy for not leaving the govt for a higher paying private job within the same field at their employers. Now they're asking me for an in as they wish they were in my shoes. Its a giant pendulum people. Things will swing back.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: meh ()
Date: July 31, 2012 09:30PM

Well, OP is sort of right. You can be rude about asking someone's GS level but there are also polite ways to ask.

Same goes for salary, house cost, etc

Only reason you ever find it rude is because you are ashamed of it or want to hide it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2012 11:04AM by meh.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: private industry ()
Date: July 31, 2012 09:54PM

pendulum? More like an uncontrolled ratchet that squeezes its taxpayers. Ask yourself, how easy is it to fire a government employee verses a private employer. How do you cut the government fat? The internet does make it easy to just find out your salary. Also, if you tired of people asking you about your GS level then don't tell everyone that you work for the government. Also, when you are home, take that silly ID badge hanging around your neck off!

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: ysuadvfukasebflaefbeo ()
Date: July 31, 2012 11:00PM

If you look someone up in AKO/DKO, bingo..there it is. It's not much of a secret in most government organizations sparky. You essentially work at the post office. Don't pretend that you are in the corporate world.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: eesh ()
Date: July 31, 2012 11:01PM

meh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm slowly working on my CS
> degree.



Have you taken Computer Science III?

https://encyclopediadramatica.se/Computer_Science_III

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: meh ()
Date: July 31, 2012 11:05PM

eesh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> meh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm slowly working on my CS
> > degree.
>
>
>
> Have you taken Computer Science III?
>
> https://encyclopediadramatica.se/Computer_Science_
> III

LOL no but I'm thinking that could truly help my career!

that shit is gold right there

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: GS-15 ()
Date: August 01, 2012 12:38AM

Sometimes I wonder whether I am the only GS-15 who posts here in the middle of the night.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: First Grader ()
Date: August 01, 2012 08:05AM

GS-15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sometimes I wonder whether I am the only GS-15 who
> posts here in the middle of the night.

Are you in the 15th grade? I thought grade school ender in the 12 grade.
Ah man, I'll never make it.........Where's the squirt gun

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: BEH ()
Date: August 01, 2012 08:52AM

Pardon me, but could you tell me your GS, weight, income, marital status and sexual preferance?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Public Info ()
Date: August 01, 2012 10:10AM

If they aren't working in a window-less room at the Pentagon, you can just look them up. It is public information. National security positions aren't included though.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: justsayin ()
Date: August 01, 2012 10:48AM

If I really want to know I can search names on a publicly-available database, at least for years 2008-2011. I wouldn't think of asking anyone what their pay or GS level is.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: FreddyTheFeddy ()
Date: August 01, 2012 11:01AM

private industry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pendulum? More like an uncontrolled ratchet that
> squeezes its taxpayers. Ask yourself, how easy is
> it to fire a government employee verses a private
> employer. How do you cut the government fat? The
> internet does make it easy to just find out your
> salary. Also, if you tired of people asking you
> about your GS level then don't tell everyone that
> you work for the government. Also, when you are
> home, take that silly ID badge hanging around your
> neck off!

I know full well how difficult it is to have a poorly performing
employee terminated. It stinks. Private industry would never tolerate
the things that go on in government. However, I worked for an agency
that adopted a management program called Performance Management Program.
(pay for performance) It was great. It still requires sound justification
for disciplinary actions but it sure made life easier for me. If you're
unfamiliar with PMP Google has it all. BTW, PMP also includes each
sections performance within the agency and the overall organizational
effectiveness well so it's not just for individual employees.


Obama ran on a platform that included instituting PMP government wide
but he forgot all about it the day he took office. Do you know who
opposes PMP in government? I do. It's mostly minorities who have
terrible leave abuse records and frequent disciplinary actions.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: BB*X ()
Date: August 01, 2012 11:34AM

I've been trying to get into the gov't for a while now but it seems all the positions are already earmarked for someone else because I can't even get a response when the job is with an agency that I already support and is doing less technical work than I already do. I've applied via USA Jobs, years ago I sent in resumes and all the required documentation. Out of 20 or 30 gov't jobs that I have applied for over the last 10 years the most I have ever received is an e-mail from EOP saying that my application had been received. I worked in DC at a gov't agency as a contractor and I saw people get jobs all the time just by being best friends with some GS-15 who threw a job at them. The gov't hiring system just sucks, I'm convinced the only way in is to know someone and have them write a position for you, then if someone else applies that is qualified they just close the position and re-open it in a month and hope that other person doesn't apply again, this can go on for a year or more in some cases.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Bruce ()
Date: August 01, 2012 11:44AM

BB*X Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've been trying to get into the gov't for a while
> now but it seems all the positions are already
> earmarked for someone else because I can't even
> get a response when the job is with an agency that
> I already support and is doing less technical work
> than I already do. I've applied via USA Jobs,
> years ago I sent in resumes and all the required
> documentation. Out of 20 or 30 gov't jobs that I
> have applied for over the last 10 years the most I
> have ever received is an e-mail from EOP saying
> that my application had been received. I worked
> in DC at a gov't agency as a contractor and I saw
> people get jobs all the time just by being best
> friends with some GS-15 who threw a job at them.
> The gov't hiring system just sucks, I'm convinced
> the only way in is to know someone and have them
> write a position for you, then if someone else
> applies that is qualified they just close the
> position and re-open it in a month and hope that
> other person doesn't apply again, this can go on
> for a year or more in some cases.

Agree. It is disgusting to sit onsite and see what the new hires consist of. Just another person for a contractor to prop up and cover their shortcomings.

Like you, I essentially function like a government employee with my paycheck coming from a middle man. This apparently isn't good enough to get an interview for a nearly identical position with the government.

Quite a bit of it is the push for veteran hiring. From hearing from feds who do hiring, they often don't get any decent resumes on their desk for interviews because HR weeds out all the non-vet applicants.

The one job I did get an interview for, I was selected, but then it was held up and eventually shot down by OPM because there was a vet on the list that they apparently should have hired over me. The manager pulled the listing and called me to see if there was anything he could change in the announcement to "wire" it to me. There really wasn't, so he ended up giving my name to a contractor who was a disaster in trying to recruit me, so I never went to work there.

Your best bet is to hope that the agency converts your position.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: BB*X ()
Date: August 01, 2012 11:54AM

I left that gov't agency because there was no where for me to go. All the positions above me where filled by gov't employees and since they don't leave I had almost no chance of getting in as a federal employee or being promoted as a contractor. I moved on and started working for one of the defense contractors since that is a good way to get in as well, no luck yet.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: CC student ()
Date: August 01, 2012 12:22PM

I heard NOVA offered some great courses...

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: BB*X ()
Date: August 01, 2012 12:47PM

"I heard NOVA offered some great courses..."

So you heard they used to offer some great courses, what good does that do now? Offered is past tense so it implies they no longer offer them or else you would need to say that you heard NOVA offers some great courses.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Mystery GM-15 ()
Date: August 01, 2012 03:00PM

I was a happy branch director with three sections (15 folks, 5 civ, 10 contractors). Organization re-org-ed and I positonal promoted to the division deputy under a SES deputy director. Now after the re-org we got tons of SES, GOs, 15s and O-6s walking around steppping on each other trying to figure out what they are doing. I should be happy at least I got a title called deputy but the deputy is the shit work. I do have one mission for the division and that has been mentioned and that is to convert my contractors to GS with those contractor getting the first shot. So far most the contractors are jumping ship to the govt even at a lost in pay. I do got some civlians that I plan to send to the after life, if they don't send me first.

FY13 is going to be a tough year, no civilian pay raise, expected no less than six month continuing resolution before a budget and threat from government sequestration.

I'm not blogging from work, I'm on leave at home. I would fire a contractor or civilian if I caught blogging on Govt time and Govt computer resources.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: BB*X ()
Date: August 01, 2012 03:17PM

"I'm not blogging from work, I'm on leave at home. I would fire a contractor or civilian if I caught blogging on Govt time and Govt computer resources."

First you would need to understand what blogging is. This is not a blog and therefore we are not "blogging". Plus I believe the Privacy and Ethics statement on all gov't computers makes it pretty clear what you can and can't do. While I do not see visiting this site as something constructive that can or should be done at work, I don't believe it is an offense that would constitute firing. Firing someone for visiting this site is no different than firing someone for posting a question or providing help in an Oracle forum. I agree the content of the site comes into play but by your definition anyone posting a question or response is "blogging".

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Mystery GM-15 ()
Date: August 01, 2012 04:04PM

BB*X Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "I'm not blogging from work, I'm on leave at home.
> I would fire a contractor or civilian if I caught
> blogging on Govt time and Govt computer
> resources."
>
> First you would need to understand what blogging
> is. This is not a blog and therefore we are not
> "blogging". Plus I believe the Privacy and Ethics
> statement on all gov't computers makes it pretty
> clear what you can and can't do. While I do not
> see visiting this site as something constructive
> that can or should be done at work, I don't
> believe it is an offense that would constitute
> firing. Firing someone for visiting this site is
> no different than firing someone for posting a
> question or providing help in an Oracle forum. I
> agree the content of the site comes into play but
> by your definition anyone posting a question or
> response is "blogging".


http://www.fedsmith.com/article/1301/unhappy-your-job-dont-use-government.html

Its been done before.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Ralph Pootawn ()
Date: August 01, 2012 04:48PM

I'm a GS-20, so what about it! Im not ashamed.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Facts ()
Date: August 01, 2012 05:41PM

BB*X Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I left that gov't agency because there was no
> where for me to go. All the positions above me
> where filled by gov't employees and since they
> don't leave I had almost no chance of getting in
> as a federal employee or being promoted as a
> contractor. I moved on and started working for
> one of the defense contractors since that is a
> good way to get in as well, no luck yet.

Not quite following you. You were in the civil service with a federal agency, left the feds because there was no promotion potential at your agency, went private and now want to get back in? Not being critical, just can't understanding what you did (or want to do).

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: wnrsm ()
Date: August 01, 2012 11:53PM

Mystery GM-15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BB*X Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
>
>
> http://www.fedsmith.com/article/1301/unhappy-your-
> job-dont-use-government.html
>
> Its been done before.

That guy was extremely stupid and disgruntled. He deserves a kick in the nuts for taking it to the courts.

That said, I'm glad I don't work for you and am subject to your hair-trigger firing policy. I have seen some that deserve to be fired for the amount of fucking around they do on the gov't PC, but zero tolerance is a dick move.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: BB*X ()
Date: August 02, 2012 06:37AM

"Its been done before."

This is where understanding the technology might help in your firing decisions. From reading the article it sounds to me like he was hosting the website on his gov't PC, there's a big difference between that and visiting a site and leaving a comment.

"Not quite following you. You were in the civil service with a federal agency, left the feds because there was no promotion potential at your agency, went private and now want to get back in? Not being critical, just can't understanding what you did (or want to do)."

Poor choice of words, I should have said I left that contract not that agency. I was a contractor working on-site at a federal facility, not a fed.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Wiggro ()
Date: August 02, 2012 07:05AM

My rule of thumb is the higher the GS level, the lower the level of competence.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: True that ()
Date: August 02, 2012 07:19AM

Wiggro Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My rule of thumb is the higher the GS level, the
> lower the level of competence.


The septic tank theory that the big pieces float to the top.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Wiggro ()
Date: August 02, 2012 12:17PM

The federal government has a large number of people at senior management levels who, on their own merits, couldn't be an assistant manager at a 7-11.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Wignogro ()
Date: August 02, 2012 01:49PM

And you are familiar of requirements for a management position with the Southland Corp?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Yes, Yes I Am ()
Date: August 02, 2012 02:21PM

Wignogro Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And you are familiar of requirements for a
> management position with the Southland Corp?

Actually, I went through an incredibly rigorous series of interviews with them a million years ago when I graduated from college and didn't know what I wanted to do. First interview, extensive phychological testing, panel interview with high level managers... They made it clear at the final interview that a "little girl" like me couldn't cut it with the big guys. And yes, people said things like that back then (now they just think it). Just thought I'd share.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: More Complete ()
Date: August 02, 2012 02:55PM

BB*X Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've been trying to get into the gov't for a while
> now

Why? To me, working for the fed is like saying "I give up".

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Wiggro ()
Date: August 02, 2012 03:09PM

I would love to see FU do a survey of how many IP addresses of people who are on-line all day resolve to .gov IP addresses.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Wignogro ()
Date: August 02, 2012 09:10PM

Do you post from your job?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Public Servant ()
Date: August 04, 2012 04:37PM

Southern Gentleman in case you don't know it you are a Public Servant. We do have a right to ask you since we pay you.
Unlike you I will glady give out my salary to anyone who asks because I also serve the Public and it is also Public Information. What are you hideing?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Really?! ()
Date: August 24, 2012 02:51PM

Southern Gentlemen - Yes it's very rude to ask someone what their GS level is within or without an organization. Your GS paygrade is for Civilian Geneva Categories and Equivalent Grades for POW Identification (see DoDI 1000.01, April 16, 2012).

For the rest of you dumb-asses who believe it's okay...you must be one of the overpaid, pretentious, piss poor managers who believe you are a wonderful leader! Just so you are aware, it's most likely the people who suffer under you wouldn't follow you to the shitter; and sitting around with others like yourself, calling yourselves great leaders doesn't make it so.

For those of you who believe you are entitled to know what I make because tax payers money provides my salary...well you are partially right. You are more than welcome to look it up if I am willing to give you my paygrade...which is not listed on AKO/NKO, or any other site.

Normally those who first want to know what someones paygrade is before interacting with them is a dick who gives all other federal employees a bad name.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: More Complete ()
Date: August 24, 2012 03:16PM

Really?! Wrote:
> You are
> more than welcome to look it up if I am willing to
> give you my paygrade...which is not listed on
> AKO/NKO, or any other site.

Unelss you are the FBI, CIA, Defense Department, nuclear materials, IRS, or jobs essential to national security all we need is your name.

http://php.app.com/fed_employees11/search.php

It's called FOIA so yes, us taxpayers are "entitled" to this information. Not that anyone really cares. Unless that is, you're making more than you should.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Really 2 ()
Date: August 24, 2012 03:18PM

Really, I'll bet your a GS-7 or less. Posting while at work. Tsk-Tsk. We need to cut the GS employees numbers in half.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Really 2 ()
Date: August 24, 2012 03:25PM

More Complete. That is an awesome link. Thank you.


http://php.app.com/fed_employees11/search.php

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: More Complete ()
Date: August 24, 2012 03:37PM

Really 2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> More Complete. That is an awesome link. Thank
> you.
>
>
> http://php.app.com/fed_employees11/search.php

Yes, it really is. You're welcome. :)

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Private Ryan ()
Date: August 24, 2012 03:38PM

Really?! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Normally those who first want to know what
> someones paygrade is before interacting with them
> is a dick who gives all other federal employees a
> bad name.

Yes, Colonel.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Fedboy ()
Date: August 24, 2012 03:53PM

I used to get asked my grade all the time when I went on travel. People in the field have no idea who you are or how to address you, nor do they know how to ask what your grade is tactfully. Usually it was "so, are you a 13? 14?", which came across rather boorish. Truth was I was a 15 and wan't going to go in there telling everyone because the pricks that do that make us all look bad.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: GSer Not! ()
Date: August 24, 2012 04:44PM

Really?! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Normally those who first want to know what
> someones paygrade is before interacting with them
> is a dick who gives all other federal employees a
> bad name.


No, federal employees give themselves a bad name.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: square stater ()
Date: August 24, 2012 05:26PM

Fedboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I used to get asked my grade all the time when I
> went on travel. People in the field have no idea
> who you are or how to address you, nor do they
> know how to ask what your grade is tactfully.
> Usually it was "so, are you a 13? 14?", which came
> across rather boorish. Truth was I was a 15 and
> wan't going to go in there telling everyone
> because the pricks that do that make us all look
> bad.


Yes, all those hayseeds outside the Beltway. So boorish, so lacking in tact. Just good for votes and taxes - after that, who would want to associate with them?

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: OldTimersMethod ()
Date: August 24, 2012 05:31PM

I used the link to run several names of employees in the agency I worked for and nothing showed up. Worthless. I can tell within two grades of what an employee is just by looking at their office and type of chair they have.

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Re: Etiquette tip: don't ask others their GS level
Posted by: Good God ()
Date: August 24, 2012 05:39PM

More Complete Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Really 2 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > More Complete. That is an awesome link. Thank
> > you.
> >
> >
> > http://php.app.com/fed_employees11/search.php
>
> Yes, it really is. You're welcome. :)

I just found out that my sister-in-law who teleworks as an editor makes $120k. I'm sure that's money well spent.

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