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"American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: Rowsdower ()
Date: January 28, 2008 08:31PM

Upon recently renewing my concealed carry permit I was denied by Fairfax County because I wrote “American” in the space for Race. The response from the county was that American was a nationality, not a race. Hence the form was incomplete and my permit was denied.

Being none too politically active, but with a Thoreauian disdain for purposeless government bureaucracy I generally put American, if anything at all, on forms requesting I define my race. My line of reasoning being that my family goes back at least five generations being born in America. If my lineage continues to be born here for the next 1,000 years, when will they be considered American as opposed to European American, White, Caucasoid, etc. I have never been within 3,000 miles of the Caucasus Mountain range.

Additionally, all that race stuff is unnecessary. We should all just be Americans. I am not much on fighting discrimination, mostly because I generally refrain from practicing it (Except for the Arabs. They are currently held in extreme disfavor.) There are so many other good reasons to dislike others. If the Commonwealth wanted to know the color of my skin, why don't they just put that on the form? I have no problem selecting the Crayola Peach or bleached out beige checkbox. Race doesn't even appear on the permit. It all just seems a bit capricious.

Most dictionaries will include a definition of race to include something like a group of persons related by common descent or heredity or any people united by common history, language, cultural traits, etc . That kind of sounds like American should work.

Concealed Carry Permit Form SP-248, http://www.vsp.state.va.us/downloads/SP-248_revised_07-1-2006.pdf, does not provide a checkbox or list of “races” to choose from. A free text search of the Commonwealth code does not define what is considered an approved race. So what is the problem with putting American? What is the legal basis for declaring American is not a race if it is not defined in the the Commonwealth code? You would think that I could define myself however I wanted with that First Amendment and all.

In the end I caved to the man, because I wanted to have the ability to defend myself more then my need to change a form I have to fill out once every five years.

But, to others who do not wish to put a “traditional” race, MIXED and UNKNOWN will also work just as well.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/28/2008 08:53PM by Rowsdower.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: jeicen ()
Date: January 28, 2008 08:41PM

Obviously, they wanted to know if you were black, so they could arrest you.

(I do agree, this is totally stupid.)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/28/2008 08:41PM by jeicen.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: MLKisRollingOver ()
Date: January 28, 2008 08:51PM

The whole race thing does seem to be ironic....If you have 1/100th part black, you're black. If you 'look' Asian, you're Asian (even if you're mostly Caucasian). So much for judging a person by the content of a their character.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: Radiophile ()
Date: January 28, 2008 08:53PM

When I was getting a Florida drivers license, the from asked for the "State of country of birth". I thought about it long and hard, and put "United States". The clerk got all flustered and said I needed to put the state I was born in. I told her I was born at Providence Hospital in the District of Columbia, and DC is not a "state". I would have answered the question the same way if I was born in Puerto Rico or Guam.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: ferfux ()
Date: January 28, 2008 09:05PM

just check "other" and be done with the self aggrandizing speeches.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: free loader ()
Date: January 28, 2008 09:45PM

Instead of complaining you should write a thank you letter to Fairfax County. Had it not been for them denying all concealed permits we would not be where we are today with carry on demand.
Years back Fairfax took the approach that no one needed a concealed weapon permit and also banned the gun show with their stupid local laws.

The state finally got tired of all of Fairfaxs ultra liberal crap and said from now on only the state has the authority to pass laws pertaining to firearms.

Our socialist leaders in Fairfax and the Washington Post predicted a blood bath in the streets with another Dodge City. Of course nothing like this happened but it never stops a true socialist from trying.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: duh ()
Date: January 28, 2008 10:04PM

Yeah...if somebody's got something I want, I generally don't fuck around with them. I just tell them what I know they want to hear and go on.

I'm sure they'll be talking for years about what a brilliant and insightful guy you are.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: JJ ()
Date: January 28, 2008 10:05PM

Just open carry.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: bender ()
Date: January 28, 2008 10:10PM

Duh: "Yeah...if somebody's got something I want, I generally don't fuck around with them. I just tell them what I know they want to hear and go on."


Duh, I think that is called being a wuss.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: 4wheeler ()
Date: January 29, 2008 12:11PM

if you think american is a race, then you are not smart enough to carry a gun

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: KeepOnTruckin ()
Date: January 29, 2008 02:58PM

4wheeler Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> if you think american is a race, then you are not
> smart enough to carry a gun


Obviously you define your race as American then.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: Lurker.. ()
Date: January 29, 2008 03:07PM

Original Poster Wrote:
"The response from the county was that American was a nationality, not a race. Hence the form was incomplete and my permit was denied."


It's nice see that FFX county has some intelligent employee's.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: :burpgun: ()
Date: January 29, 2008 03:19PM

You are a rebel sir... Risking your application on such an ill-reasoned and ultimately pointless principle. You must have balls that "clank" Don Quixote!

(Or perhaps you're just an idiot too immature to own a firearm responsibly...)

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: MAN ()
Date: January 29, 2008 03:57PM

You should have entered HUMAN as the race.
LOL!

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: Sgt Rock ()
Date: January 29, 2008 05:59PM

You self inflicted your own wounds. The State of Virginia takes its CCW
permits very seriously and no clowing allowed. Sounds like you belong to
the same group of half-wits who declare themselves "Citizens of the World".
You dont deserve a CCW.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: john5487 ()
Date: January 29, 2008 07:20PM

the race block there is used for identification. they cannot physically identify you as american., only as black, white, asian, etc....

that is why they want to know what color your skin is.

you are reading way too much into the state form. perhaps if you were to get off your pedestal and stop believe your are too high and mighty to answer a straight forward question. i would have denied your permit as well. American is a nationality.

if you are confused by this then i refer you to the US Census, you can chose your race off their list which should satisfy fairfax county.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: Gravis ()
Date: January 29, 2008 07:29PM

ferfux Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> just check "other" and be done with the self
> aggrandizing speeches.


agreed.


MAN Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You should have entered HUMAN as the race.
> LOL!


LOL! that is fucking hilarious. i would love to hear that conversation, "Human is not a race." "Well, I'm sure as hell not putting down 'Monkey'!"


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."095042938540

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: 4wheeler ()
Date: January 30, 2008 06:45AM

KeepOnTruckin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 4wheeler Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > if you think american is a race, then you are
> not
> > smart enough to carry a gun
>
>
> Obviously you define your race as American then.


how do you figure that?

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: ryan ()
Date: January 30, 2008 01:12PM

While i do not think we need to carry weapons at all, i do agree on the point why does race matter? i say that i am american, cacasion is stupid, most of us, including me, dont even know where that name came from!

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: KeepOnTruckin ()
Date: January 30, 2008 05:23PM

4wheeler Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> KeepOnTruckin Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > 4wheeler Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > if you think american is a race, then you are
> > not
> > > smart enough to carry a gun
> >
> >
> > Obviously you define your race as American
> then.
>
>
> how do you figure that?



I was saying that you were also not smart. You can be whatever race you want.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: ferfux ()
Date: January 30, 2008 05:36PM

KeepOnTruckin Wrote:

>
> I was saying that you were also not smart. You can
> be whatever race you want.


actually you are pretty much stuck with whatever RACE you are born into. Just ask michael jackson.

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Re: "American" Race Denied Concealed Carry by FFX County
Posted by: 4wheeler ()
Date: January 30, 2008 08:28PM

>
> I was saying that you were also not smart. You can
> be whatever race you want.


Yeap, you make a lot of sense

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