Anyone done it?
Anything particular I should watch out for?

It sounds great, but it hardly ever happens. Your best bet is finding a realtor who is willing to do it for 1 point.

Doing it wrong.

Real estate attorney to do your paper work. Good luck. It is not fun but it can be done.

`

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/14/2015 11:12PM by WingNut.

I've bought FSBOs, but ONLY if the seller is willing to share the real estate commission savings with me.

But that's rare since most FSBO sellers are cheap motherfuckers.

`

idontlikebeingrightaboutshitlikethisbutiam



Edited 21 time(s). Last edit at 5/31/1967 05:57AM by WingNut.

Last edit at 11/30/2015 01:37PM Last edit at 5/14/2015 03:52PM Last edit at 1/28/2014 05:57AM Last edit at 11/29/2015 01:10PM Last edit at 3/14/2011 11:52PM Last edit at 7/20/2012 04:07AM
Last edit at 6/29/2013 11:18PM Last edit at 3/19/2011 01:02PM Last edit at 3/26/2012 09:07PM



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/14/2015 11:13PM by WingNut.

Realtors are some of the lowest dirt bags on the planet. Just below used car salesman on the ladder of "not worth a shit" professions.

Right before, literally right before, the housing market collapsed in 2007 my pops sold his house without a realtor. Even he will admit it was simply out of luck rather than skill or personal marketing. A friend of his heard he was selling it and since it was zoned commercial he was able to get list price for it. The present owner has since made it into an office building but I honestly have to admit that it is one of the nicest offices I have ever seen and the owner did a great job keeping the frame of the house and renovating the whole interior without making it look like crap. But back on topic, ask around and see if either your friends or their friends are looking to buy. On the positive you don't pay realtor fees however on the negative my pops had to go through a lot of bureaucracy settling taxes and what not because the realtor wasn't there to do it. With all that though he still thinks it was better without a realtor.

Bad idea,,,

Like showing up to court without a lawyer,,,

RE agents can usually get more for the property and offset their commission,,,

And take care of ALL the bullshit

My Mom and Dada sold their house back in 99 without a RE agent. They said as long as it isn't complicated (divorce, special tax zone [Reston, McLean] or the house has nothing wrong with it) it should be fairly straight-forward.

From my experience, RE gents tend to muck stuff up and gum-up the process, they are just good networkers. Fuck them all.

Here's what you do. List it with forsalebyowner.com to get it on MLS (most home buyers are using websites such as Redfin to find their homes nowadays anyway), find your buyer, and then get a realtor to close it for you for a negotiated percentage (0.5% or so).

It will be easy, because any realtor would love to make $1500 (for a $300K house) for one day of work. The hard part of the realtor's job is finding the buyer.

If you are tech savy and don't need hand holding I have read about these guys that will do it for 3.75% to 4%. They take 1% and the scum bag buyer realtor will have the 3%. I AM NOT affiliated with them. If you are buying I would check out I-agent.com or redfin.com

VirginiaMLS.com Realty always provides full service real estate brokerage for Never more than 4% Total Commission.

Two Plans Same Great Service:


Full Service for 4%.

When you list your home with VirginiaMLS.com the total brokerage commission is 4% of the Sales Price. We offer a 3% commission to cooperating brokers. This means, if through the exposure of the Local MLS another cooperating real estate company sells your home, we will pay that company 3% out of the 4% total commission. VirginiaMLS.com NEVER charges any other transaction, processing, or document preparation fees. Call us today. 703-691-7878

Online Service with Full Service for 3.75%.
Use our Self Service Online Listing Tools for full service for never more than 3.75% total commission. We offer a 3% commission to cooperating brokers. This means, if through the exposure of the Local MLS another cooperating real estate company sells your home, we will pay that company 3% out of the 3.75% total commission. VirginiaMLS.com NEVER charges any other transaction, processing, or document preparation fees. Add your listing online in real time and save. When you list your property online with VirginiaMLS.com you receive the same great service as our Full Service program. Add your full service listing now.

With the way the market is starting to slow again ... and, possibly a double-dip recession, I'd personally work with an agent on this one. You want as much exposure on your place as you can get. Prices of homes are headed down - not up. On an "up" market, one can usually perform this service on their own with very few hassles. Nowadays, it's a harder process until things pick up again.

Good luck to you. BTW, I'm not an agent or affiliated with real estate in any way. But, I do watch the market.

Georgey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Realtors are some of the lowest dirt bags on the
> planet. Just below used car salesman on the ladder
> of "not worth a shit" professions.

Awwww, you sound bitter. You got dumped huh? Did she cheat on you? Hard to imagine why.

I would only try that in a sellers' market.

In this buyers' market, there simply is too much competition.

Everybody I know who's tried this w/o a RE agent has ended up hiring one after wasting 3-4 months. Typically people don't take FSBO seriously and/or low-ball the crap out of you. I've also seen people use discount brokers and/or beat the agent up to list for 1-2%. In those instances the agent does very little to actively market the home. Interview a number of agents and hire one with a decent track record, get them to give you a formal marketing plan and hold them to it. Sure, there are a lot of loser scumbag agents out there who put your home in the MLS and don't do shit. It is your job to find & hire a good one and hold them accountable. Also if you aren't willing to pay the buying agent a fee they aren't going to show clients your home. Sure you can list on craigslist, post classifieds, etc, but be prepared for every psycho in the hood to call.

Listen to GargleMyNuts (gag!). You're going to have to pay a commission (probably 3%) to the buying agent anyway if you put your home on the MLS - which you must do to get any exposure at all. And why would a buying agent in a buyer's market show you're home knowing that you're probably going to be a cheap pain in the neck to work with? If agents don't show your home, it won't sell.

Don't even think about using Craigslist to sell your home. Do you have any idea what kind of wack jobs respond to those type of ads? You'll be chasing your tail trying to work with those people, most of whom probably couldn't get to closing if their life depended on it.

It's just not worth it, especially since you are going to incur marketing expenses just like your agent would. And by the time you realize that you need an agent, you'll have missed the selling season and your home will be stale.

Two phrases for you,,,qualified buyer and Ready,willing and ABLE

That's the type of buyer a RE agent will find for you,,,

I have been an agent for 18 years and yes there are some in our industry who should be shown the door and make it bad for the majority of us who work our butt off. As mentioned several times in this thread can you do it by yourself yes will it be easy no. Any agent worth their salt can show you how they would make you more money if you hire them. I have shown homes listed with xyz realty where you pay them to list your home only and I tell my clients right off the bat the seller is trying to save money by not having a professional my job is to get the buyer the home they want and have them pay as little as possible. Sure anyone can find out what their home is worth but what are you going to do when there is a home inspection issue, hoa violations, title issues? You are not calling that company that you paid $300 to for the mls listing. Try and ask the buyer agent for help their job is to help their client. It costs you zero dollars to hire an agent you only pay them when they sell the home. My advice ask everyone you know if they have a real estate agent that they would recommend. If they say yes then ask them the last time they heard from their agent. If they haven't heard from them since the sale closed you don't want that referral. Once you have a few names interview them all. Have them over to your house ask to see their marketing plan and ask how they will market your home. Then choose one of them. Tell them you will do a 30 day listing and at the end of the 30 days if it's not sold but you feel they are working hard for you then you will extend it for 3 months which is about how long you will need in our current market if the home is priced right. If they sucked in those 30 days hire another agent.

Hunting for a new home in DC-area. Won't ever consider a property that's 'For Sale by Owner.' Too many issues crop up and learned from experience. We are and always will work with a good Realtor for selling/buying property.

I don't think most people have a problem with what real estate agents do. The problem (for those that have one) is generally that they calculate how much the real estate agents are being paid, and have a problem with the perceived work effort to payment ratio.

If housing prices were 25% of what they are today, I doubt you'd see as much complaining about what real estate agents are paid, since they are paid on commission. A $500k house generates $30k in commission split between two real estate agents (at 6%, which is 3% for each agent). Some people have a problem with paying each agent $15k for what they perceive as little work. If the same transaction happened with a house sold at $125k, the total commission would be $7.5k, or $3250 per agent. Many of the people who previously had a problem wouldn't have one, even though nothing changed but the house sale price.

The problem that the gripers have is that real estate agents are paid on commission rather than a flat fee, for high dollar value items. If the dollar value of the houses went down, or the agents were paid on a flat fee basis, we'd probably see a lot less complaining over how much real estate agents are paid for their work.

Well, I suppose we'd see the real estate agents complaining.

I CERTENly knows that CERT has good realtors who volunteer in leadership seats. Contats the PIO of CERT she is pio@fairfaxcountycert.org Let CERT sell your house and makes friends at same time. Welcome to CERt where you live.

CERTenly44544 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I CERTENly knows that CERT has good realtors who
> volunteer in leadership seats. Contats the PIO of
> CERT she is pio@fairfaxcountycert.org Let CERT
> sell your house and makes friends at same time.
> Welcome to CERt where you live.

You were warned in other threads. FUCK OFF.

I am a licensed RE Broker. As others have said, you will most likely have to pay a commission to the buyer agent or reduce the sale price so that the buyer can pay them. Now you've just cut your "savings" in half. Also, what do you do when your property does not appraise at the sale price? A year ago I saved my seller client $6800 when I called the appraiser (this is legal, it is not legal to coerce an appraiser however) and qualified value through comps and other info. My entire broker commission was less than $10k! You can do it yourself but it can be a huge PITA. If you have the time and you have an Attorney review it, it can be done. If you do use an agent, make them show you their selling history. I have sold over 90 homes in the last three years and can prove it. Make them show you their MLS sales with their name on them. 95% of licensees are doing VERY little business. Price it right, make minor repairs, de-clutter and clean, and tell the agent that you expect to see MANY photos and that it better appear in ALL of the major websites. MouseonHouse is a fantastic virtual tour. Check on the agent from different phone numbers to be sure that they answer their phone and return VM. Have a few friends act as buyers to see if they get a call back. Do your home work on these agents. If you are selling short, have it negotiated by a title company. Many agents close very few of the SS that they list.

Use a real estate lawyer.
i use:

www.charlesrainey.com

it was painless and one realizes how scummy real estate sales people are once you experience you can do it yourself.

I always looked down on homes being sold without an agent. Not sure why, i guess the cheesy sign in the front yard has something to do with it. But in the end, you can save quite a bit of cash, which is a great thing in this economy

I sold my home without Real Estate agent but make sure that you pay 3% for the buyer agent and use a real estate lawyer.

Well,People face quite a lot of difficulty in saving money these days.When it comes to selling a property,we look forward to hiring an agent to do the job.An agent is the best choice if you can afford their commission.But many people can't afford their commission as many have to buy a new home after selling their old one.They have to invest all the payment from the old one to the new one,so its quite difficult for them to pay commission as well.Now,I suggest two ways through which you can sell your home on your own.
The first way is to put a FOR SALE sign in front of your home.This is the most easiest and the most cheapest way out.As soon as people see the sign they might come at your doorstep or they might make a call.Now,out of 10 calls it might be difficult for you to identify that how many calls are from genuine buyers.Some brokers might try to hound you.They will try to buy your property for a price less than your expectation.In order to avoid the risk you I'd prefer following the second way.
There are a number of websites throughout the internet that help you sell your house without demanding any kind of commission.You can just sit at home and relax.Let them do the job.They just require a flat rate fee,rather than the 1-2% commission demanded by the broker.I don't mean any offense to the broker community,its just a tip for those people who want to sell their homes on their own.
Some famous FOR SALE BY OWNER websites include:
www.gofizzbo.com
www.fsbo.com
www.forsalebyowner.com
www.isoldmyhome.com

Just use Paypal, that way seller protection will cover you. No problem.

I was a FSBO for 2 months. Nothing... Wasted time and money trying to do it. And I had already bought another home in Fairfax. Then I caved, hired a 3% very experienced R.E.Agent. The great promo and connections my agent(s) had helped me get it sold (in <60days)! I almost lost my arse attempting to save 3% of $430K. I will never FSBO again, and do not recommend it unless you have time to kill..."Just testing the waters".

How have realtors been able to maintain and justify their 3/3% rates given that in this area most home values approximately doubled in the past 12 years and that there are many, many houses in the higher price ranges (let's say 600K+) ?

Usually given those factors, market conditions would push down average realtor commissions, but the industry still maintains 3 and 3 for the most part.

Are we just accustomed to it and give in? Is there some sort of pseudo-monopoly in place?

I just can't believe realtors take $48,000 from you if your house is 800K - and do no more work than selling a 300K house. Why are we even on a %-value based system anyway?

Indeed I have Sir-here's the website you want to use. http://netrealtynow.com/

For $300, this guy will put a sign in your yard, list your home on all the websites, and give you a lockbox for the door. You do all the paperwork and schedule the open houses yourself, which you can do with no problem. Realtors will contact your cell phone for viewings of the home. You don't need a realtor to represent you when you can do all this crap yourself.

I don't work for this company, but on my word I used this company to sell my house 2 years ago in this crappy market. Good luck.

In response to Snowdenscold's question-"How have realtors been able to maintain and justify their 3/3% rates"...quite simply-1) as costs of living have increased, as evidenced by "home values doubling in the past 12 years" so too have the realtors cost of living increased, and 2) all commissions by law are negotiable---go ahead, negotiate a lower one, or negotiate a flat rate.

A commission is typically a percentage, and not a flat rate-a percentage SHOULD work to the seller's benefit-the more the house sells for, the more the agent makes. Therefore, the agent is motivated to seek the most money for the house. But, flat rates are permissible.

A percentage commission is tied to the selling price of the house, which, logically, is tied to the cost of living in the area. So, as house prices go up, so too does the cost of living for the agent. Go ahead, hire an agent that lives in West Virginia because they can't afford to live in NoVa because they take a bunch of cut-rate listings, or some part timer who doubles as a cocktail waitress.

Or, hire some dork just out of college with a NoVa real estate license, and tell 'em you'll give them some cut rate fee. You can find somebody to do it for a cut rate. You just have to look. And then do it.

Are you sure you want to do that? Then do it. There is no board, or governing body, or anything, that will mandate that you can't. Just find some idiot, and do it.

This is America, thank god. You can pay for what you get. And, you can work as hard as you want for the pay you get.

That, my friends, is how it works.

FYI, certain realtors will not show a house to you if you use a discount place like redin or I-agent. You know what I did? Contact the owners and tell them their realtor wasnt showing the house to us. Also the opposite is true, they won't tell you about FSBO.

I've sold Three homes in the NOVA area as "for sale by owner". The only problem I had was when a buyer would come in with a RA. All the RA cared about was who was going to pay their commission. All you need to do is get a simple sales document, you can get them from Staples, Office DEPOT or off line, modify it if needed. You write the contract, request some earnest money. The would be buyer takes the contract to a Title company and Mortgage company and either of those two will let you know what you need to do to get to closing. You are not required to fill out any of the BS docs the RA has two. It is very simple.

Realtors can SUCK MY BALLS.

Yes, I understand how commissions work.

My point is that by being tied to the housing market, their commissions - or essentially their wages - increased at an astonishing rate compared to the wages of all the other workers in this area.

The cost of living for realtors did not go up any higher than the rest of the people living here.

I also realize commissions are negotiable - but am wondering why we all just suck it up and take it for the most part instead of making supply and demand work for us. Are things too firmly entrenched to make progress at this point?

There are valid arguments on both sides. Now why does the commission percentage stay around the same even though prices have doubled? The work hasn't doubled. The costs to the realtors haven't doubled. Basically, it's not in the best interests of the large brokerage houses to lower the rates. Sure, they will lose some customers who want to save money and go with a discount brokerage. But those brokerages will still earn more staying around 5-6%. On the other side, most sellers still go for the large brokerage firms. So therein lies the reason for this situation. Ultimately it's because most sellers are still willing to pay full commission. Also, there's only so much you can generally negotiate down on the seller side since it's assumed that the buyer will come in with an agent and you always want to pay the full commission (2.5-3% to the buyer depending on the State). There are other wealthy countries where sellers pay nowhere near the 6% on average. But because of the way our system is set up, it would be very hard for us to end up like that. Discount brokerages have caused average commissions to lower and caused some large brokerages to be a little bit more flexible on their commissions. But largely, they've not made a huge dent on the typical commission structure.

There is another reason I haven't seen mentioned and probably the most relevent,,,

The commission is quite often divided more than two ways, often four ways at least,,,

Salesmen work for brokers,,brokers usually get 45% of the 3%,,,if it's a large corporate realtor (Century 21 etc) they take 8%,,,there may also be a finders fee paid,,,

The salesman gets whats left,,,

---------------------------------------------------------

An axe to grind, and a motor to hate,,,



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/15/2011 11:54PM by Hatemotor.

The last 2 posts are fairly instructive.

Starting with the last first that describes how a "salesman's" commission is split up...yes, that is true, and then it goes from there...typically, agents pay for gas, their signs, and advertising. Also, many are independent contractors, and pay for all their benefits that most employees usually get...including retirement and medical. The agreement that an agent has with their company varies, but if they bring home a $20,000 commission, around half goes to the broker, then the agent pays taxes, expenses, etc...so that initial commission gets down to around $4,000 or so pretty quick.

As for any notion that it is unique for realtor's "pay to go up", while others hasn't...hmm, I don't know that to be true. I pay more for attorneys, accountants, doctors, etc. than I did 10 years ago, and I don't know that their work load has increased in a commensurate way. Heck, maybe it is easier, what with all the resources available to them on the googles.

In a way, realtors aren't charging more, the item they are selling just costs more. So why should they start charging less? The seller is making more, right?

Now, if home prices stay flat or even go down, are we going to start feeling OK if realtors start charging a higher percentage? I doubt that, but that is where the logic of "home prices are going up, why haven't their fees gone down" takes us.

I hear funny things from friends or neighbors who have sold their homes using agents. One was pissed off because their home sold "so fast" for list price, therefore, of course the agent COULDN'T have done any work, and why should they be making so much money? A friend was pissed off because their "stupid-ass agent" couldn't sell their house after 4 months...and IMHO it was priced $150 K too high, and the seller was proud to say they wouldn't budge. So, how does an agent do an acceptable job in the eyes of these consumers?

There was a comment how other countries fees haven't gone up...interesting, in some other countries, real estate fees can be structured like consulting fees...that is, you pay an agent fees for tax consultation services and the like. Even if it doesn't sell. Of course, not sure exactly what country was being referred to earlier, but understand that in places like England/Ireland/Scotland the ownership and mortgage structures can be vastly different than ours, and so the fee structure can be different. How pissed off would you be if you had to pay an agent and they didn't even sell your house?

So again, at the end of the day, you can get what you pay for. As with any "professional" I hire, I shop around. I've been tempted to step out of line and hire a "cheaper" attorney, dentist, etc...but then reality sets in, I realize that I've done my research and I am paying around market, and most likely, if I do step out of line and pay considerably less, I most likely will get some cut-rate idiot, and I will pay for it later in some fashion.

So, shop around, negotiate, etc. These fees by law are negotiable. Be the first on the block and start pushing the fees down. That is how our economy works. Don't have time to do this? Find time.

No, I am not in the residential real estate business, and I really don't have a particular reason to care about those that are. I just happen to know something about the business.

The real estate fees paid in other countries have gone up of course as real estate prices have gone up everywhere. But the percentages are often much lower. In England it costs 2-3% plus taxes and lawyers fees. If we were to re-invent the real estate business in this country to significantly lower rates, one way to do it would get rid of buyers agents. That means that sellers agents would have to do more work for the same amount of money they make. Of course there are benefits to having buyers agents, but the buyer agent's commission puts a limit on how much commissions can go down. A lot of people thought that with the internet, real estate commissions in this country would radically change. It hasn't happened the way it's happened in other businesses and industries. We have an entrenched system, for better or for worse, with the MLS and professional association monopolies. I think we've reached a sort of equilibrium where people have different choices available to them which includes discount brokerages. The big brokerages do for the most part work with the discount brokerages, as long as they pay the full percentage to the buyers agent. We've come a long way from the the time the discount companies first came out and they were viewed as a threat to the whole system.

Clearly, we have too many Realtors® for the market place. Reason? Entry level requirements are low. Big brokers make more money from new Realtors® ~ many newbies do not make money and drop out of the business. If you divide the number of properties SOLD in Fairfax County (in the MLS) by the number of Realtors®, you can do the math to determine that we probably have ten times more Realtors® than needed to support the market. The real estate market is wide open for innovation and competition. Old marketing concepts (Broker's Open, Open Houses) are no longer the most effective. A comprehensive internet strategy with multiple (30) photos of the property is most effective. There are many capable/experienced Brokers that will help you sell your home for 1% Listing Commission and 3% Selling Commission ~ Total = 4% Total Commission.

Here is the problem with most real estate agents. Their incentive is NOT to get you the lowest price, because they work on COMMISSION, therefore, the more YOU PAY, the more THEY MAKE. Hmmm, conflict of interest much? In most professions, this would be extremely unethical; for real estate agents, its par for the course.

Also, the Realtors(tm) spend a nice chunk of change maintaining their monopoly through political connections in Virginia. Look it up.

Also, think about what value an RE agent brings - maybe 25 years ago when the internet didn't exist, a real estate agent was useful for finding you properties that met your specifications. Well, the internet has solved that problem. (See also: travel agents). This is an outdated profession and the only reason it has survived is because it spends its $$ (or your $$) maintaining an MLS monopoly. RE agents should only be needed by people who are too busy/unwilling to do the research for themselves. The problem now is that people who ARE willing & able to do this for themselves (because, let's face it, how hard is it considering that the dude you know who pretty much failed HS is doing it) are BARRED from actually doing it for themselves. A truly screwed up system that the market will correct, eventually.

In response to 123456's recent post, why is it a conflict to have an agent make more money if you, the principal, makes more money? Sounds as if the two objectives should be in lockstep to me.

Now, I suppose you might be referring to a buyer agent. If so, why don't you offer to pay them hourly instead of make them work on a commission basis? I'll bet you'd get at least a few good and qualified buyer agents to bite on this.

Otherwise, they typically work on commission, and so, they don't get paid squat unless you buy a house. Sounds like a pretty favorable system to the buyer, and I am sure there are plenty of agents who would like to get paid hourly driving some numb-nut around town looking at houses.

As for the thought in the second paragraph-just what monopoly is that? Are you speaking of a license requirement? Otherwise, I don't think there is a requirement to be a realtor (tm) to hold a real estate license and practice real estate. I think such a requirement might be illegal. I suppose we should be upset at "lawyers" because they have a monopoly to practice law, or "doctors" because they are the only ones who can practice medicine. Those bastards. Are you advocating a bunch of unlicensed people running around selling houses without oversight of a governing body or association with ethical guidelines? Sounds crazy to me.

Your first sentence in the last paragraph...there are some grains of truth in that. But, the internet has made all types of information available...you can look up stuff on law, medicine, everything. So, these professionals, including real estate agents, must find new ways to continually add value besides just being fonts of knowledge. And if the consumer is stupid enough to hire somebody just on the basis of them "finding" a buyer, then shame on the consumer. Might mean that consumer didn't do their homework, and hired their drinking buddy. Do your homework as consumer.

But, how are people "BARRED" from doing it themsleves? Have you not read this thread? I know plenty of people who have bought, and sold, houses "themselves".
Nobody is barred from doing it themselves, that is patently silly, and, as it relates to "having" to pay the buyer broker fee, you can refuse. Go ahead and do that.

Folks, bottom line, if you think these people make too much, do it yourself, or, negotiate a lower fee. You might find some jewel in the rough who hasn't established themselves yet, but will work hard and smart, and do a good job...or you might not. But it is up to you, and don't blame the agent for trying to make as much as they can. You, the consumer, is trying to make as much as you can on the sale of the house, or pay the lowest on the purchase of the house...all through negotiation...so, the agent is no less entitled to their fee as you are entitled to your desire to pay less.

Do it yourself. I did.

And again, I don't care either way about residential real estate agents.

There are 1.2 million realtors in the U.S. That's a lot of people.

"I suppose we should be upset at "lawyers" because they have a monopoly to practice law, or "doctors" because they are the only ones who can practice medicine"

You can negotiate prices, there is more at stake with the above professions, in the end the realtor doesnt do shit to legalize the deal, the closing lawyer does. All the realtor does is market the house and use a standard contract for purchasing (that you can get off the internet).

Boyah Kasha:

If what you are saying in the second sentence is true (and, notice I am not saying it is or isn't), then don't hire an agent. Do it yourself.

Cap'n America Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sounds like a pretty favorable system to
> the buyer,

This is the underlying fallacy of the US realtor system - its in the short but not long-term interests of the buyer

It's a classic 'tragedy of the commons' where the commons is the affordability of housing

no-one can afford to lose 6% every time they sell a house, so the fee structure adds to inflationary pressure and accelerates/deepens housing slumps.

Over the home owning career of a typical family, a high proportion of the imagined gains have actually seeped away in rounds of realtor fees - this is especially the case when house prices are rising less than the average rate of income progression (inflation + career maturity)

The net result is a bloated realtor industry where everyone claims to make no money - yet the consumer is paying through the nose for something that is just not that hard

Its a classic market failure and ripe for restructuring and regulation





>I suppose we should be upset at "lawyers"
> because they have a monopoly to practice law, or
> "doctors" because they are the only ones who can
> practice medicine. Those bastards. Are you
> advocating a bunch of unlicensed people running
> around selling houses without oversight of a
> governing body or association with ethical
> guidelines? Sounds crazy to me.
>

sorry, are you seriously comparing skilled doctors with years of intensive specialized training and realtors?

"The net result is a bloated realtor industry where everyone claims to make no money - yet the consumer is paying through the nose for something that is just not that hard"

I don't know that either part of this sentence is true, nor do I see where it logically follows from your supporting premises, although the phrase "the net result" implies that it does.

I don't know that "everyone" claims to make no money...anecdotally, as a matter of fact, I know plenty of realtors who claim to make plenty of money, and outward appearances back this up. Big houses, nice cars. Private schools for the kids. As for sellers, I cite an earlier post on this thread, something like "home prices have doubled in the last 12 years, so why haven't realtors dropped their rates?" Well, if home prices have doubled over the last 12 years, then I would guess, sellers are making pretty good money too when they sell their house. If not, nobody to blame but the seller. How have they eaten through a 100% growth? Certainly, and mathematically, even multiple 6% realtor fees couldn't eat through 100% growth very quickly.

As for "consumers paying through the nose for something that is just not that hard". Well, dangit, who is to blame for that, if in fact that is true? I would say the consumer, since, of course, there is no law requiring the use of an agent. Just don't hire a realtor if you aren't getting anything out of it and it is so easy. As I've said before, do it yourself, in that case.

The analogy between doctors/attorneys and real estate agents was in response to a notion that real estate agents had a "monopoly" to sell real estate simply because of the requirement that they have a license. The comparison was that there are other professions that require licensure to practice their art, and that it might not be a good idea to allow unlicensed and unregulated people to run around and sell houses to the public. No other comparison was made, and sorry you missed that.