Fairfax County General :
Fairfax Underground
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
cc
()
Date: September 03, 2007 09:11PM
how awful... :(
"CENTREVILLE, Va. -- Fairfax County police identified the 5-year-old girl who drowned at a gym pool on Friday as Jana Hammad of Clifton.
Jana drowned at Life Time Fitness on Trinity Parkway just after 7 p.m. Friday, police said. Lifeguards had cleared the pool for a scheduled break. That's when the child's father realized his daughter was missing. She was found at the bottom of about 4 feet of water in the kiddie pool.
Lifeguards immediately started CPR, but the girl was pronounced dead about an hour later at Inova Fair Oaks Hospital."
http://www.nbc4.com/news/14026019/detail.html?subid=10101441
"CENTREVILLE, Va. -- Fairfax County police identified the 5-year-old girl who drowned at a gym pool on Friday as Jana Hammad of Clifton.
Jana drowned at Life Time Fitness on Trinity Parkway just after 7 p.m. Friday, police said. Lifeguards had cleared the pool for a scheduled break. That's when the child's father realized his daughter was missing. She was found at the bottom of about 4 feet of water in the kiddie pool.
Lifeguards immediately started CPR, but the girl was pronounced dead about an hour later at Inova Fair Oaks Hospital."
http://www.nbc4.com/news/14026019/detail.html?subid=10101441
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Zip
()
Date: September 03, 2007 09:20PM
Thats just sad, I go to that gym. There is a window in the weight room overlooking the pool. I always thought it was cool that they put a slide in the indoor gym pool. On the other hand there is noone but bunch of teenagers that are lifeguards there. I guess their assumptin for easy job easy money got a hold of them. Very sad. Its just one of those things that just shouldnt have happen. Could have been easily prevented but then again electing President Bush could have been easily prevented....
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
MBF
()
Date: September 04, 2007 08:55AM
Update from the FCPD Public Information Office:
UPDATE: Drowning Victim Identified
Five-year-old Jana Hammad of Clifton was pronounced dead after being pulled from the pool at Life Time Fitness shortly after 7 p.m. on Friday, August 1. Preliminary autopsy reports indicate her death was due to drowning. No foul play is suspected.
Apparent Drowning Claims a Child’s Life
Fairfax County police detectives are investigating the death of a 5-year-old girl at a private pool in Centreville. Police were called to Life Time Fitness at 5900 Trinity Parkway at 7:08 p.m. Friday evening for a report of an apparent drowning.
Lifeguards cleared the pool at 7 p.m. for a scheduled break and that’s when the child’s father realized his daughter was missing. A search of the pool and building led to the discovery of the girl at the bottom of about four feet of water in the kiddies’ pool. Lifeguards immediately started CPR, but the child was pronounced dead at 8:06 p.m. at Inova Fair Oaks Hospital.
UPDATE: Drowning Victim Identified
Five-year-old Jana Hammad of Clifton was pronounced dead after being pulled from the pool at Life Time Fitness shortly after 7 p.m. on Friday, August 1. Preliminary autopsy reports indicate her death was due to drowning. No foul play is suspected.
Apparent Drowning Claims a Child’s Life
Fairfax County police detectives are investigating the death of a 5-year-old girl at a private pool in Centreville. Police were called to Life Time Fitness at 5900 Trinity Parkway at 7:08 p.m. Friday evening for a report of an apparent drowning.
Lifeguards cleared the pool at 7 p.m. for a scheduled break and that’s when the child’s father realized his daughter was missing. A search of the pool and building led to the discovery of the girl at the bottom of about four feet of water in the kiddies’ pool. Lifeguards immediately started CPR, but the child was pronounced dead at 8:06 p.m. at Inova Fair Oaks Hospital.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 04, 2007 10:39AM
This is tragic. However, as a parent of young children myself, I would never rely on a high school-age lifeguard to keep an eye out for my kid at a crowded pool. Not sure how a kid drowns in a kiddy pool unless the dad was off somewhere.
s
Posted by:
inkahootz
()
Date: September 04, 2007 11:08AM
s
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/01/2010 11:48PM by inkahootz.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/01/2010 11:48PM by inkahootz.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Lester Burnham
()
Date: September 04, 2007 12:12PM
Both of my daughters have worked as lifeguards at LTF in Fairfax and often complained about parents who leave their young children unattended in the pool while they work out. Part of the reason for clearing the pool is to identify which children are there without a parent.
I am still amazed, however, that this type of tragedy continues to happen, especially considering how small the pool is and that the lifeguard's job at a facility like this is not too hard. They have at least two guards working when the slide is open, sometimes three. I would hate to be on staff in the coming weeks and months as LTF's corporate risk management and local operating teams put the pool staff under extra scrutiny. My daughters described this as a pretty intense environment, but there was clearly a breakdown over the weekend.
While no amount of money can make up for the accidental death of a child, this is going to result in huge damages payment to the family.
I am still amazed, however, that this type of tragedy continues to happen, especially considering how small the pool is and that the lifeguard's job at a facility like this is not too hard. They have at least two guards working when the slide is open, sometimes three. I would hate to be on staff in the coming weeks and months as LTF's corporate risk management and local operating teams put the pool staff under extra scrutiny. My daughters described this as a pretty intense environment, but there was clearly a breakdown over the weekend.
While no amount of money can make up for the accidental death of a child, this is going to result in huge damages payment to the family.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Concerned Parent
()
Date: September 04, 2007 12:21PM
cc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> how awful... :(
>
> "C
> Jana drowned at Life Time Fitness on Trinity
> Parkway just after 7 p.m. Friday, police said.
> Lifeguards had cleared the pool for a scheduled
> break. That's when the child's father realized his
> daughter was missing. She was found at the bottom
> of about 4 feet of water in the kiddie pool.
>
> 4 foot kiddie pool? I thought the depth of kiddie pools were not more than 2 feet? How sad! God bless her and her family.
-------------------------------------------------------
> how awful... :(
>
> "C
> Jana drowned at Life Time Fitness on Trinity
> Parkway just after 7 p.m. Friday, police said.
> Lifeguards had cleared the pool for a scheduled
> break. That's when the child's father realized his
> daughter was missing. She was found at the bottom
> of about 4 feet of water in the kiddie pool.
>
> 4 foot kiddie pool? I thought the depth of kiddie pools were not more than 2 feet? How sad! God bless her and her family.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
pmn
()
Date: September 04, 2007 12:33PM
If I were on a jury with this matter, I wouldn't give the father a dime. The child is his responsibility!
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 04, 2007 12:40PM
Lester Burnham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> While no amount of money can make up for the
> accidental death of a child, this is going to
> result in huge damages payment to the family.
No way in hell the facility should be held accountable for this. The welfare of the child is the legal responsibility of the father, not the facility. The facility would have to demonstrate gross negligence, and I think that would be incredibly difficult for the family to prove given the fact the dad didn't even know where his kid was.
-------------------------------------------------------
> While no amount of money can make up for the
> accidental death of a child, this is going to
> result in huge damages payment to the family.
No way in hell the facility should be held accountable for this. The welfare of the child is the legal responsibility of the father, not the facility. The facility would have to demonstrate gross negligence, and I think that would be incredibly difficult for the family to prove given the fact the dad didn't even know where his kid was.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
stinkypoon
()
Date: September 04, 2007 02:44PM
Concerned Parent Wrote:
> 4 foot kiddie pool? I thought the depth of
> kiddie pools were not more than 2 feet? How sad!
> God bless her and her family.
It's not really a kiddie pool, like the ones you see that are only 6 inches deep. It's like the shallow end of Oak Marr, that goes from 0 to 4 feet all the way across.
> 4 foot kiddie pool? I thought the depth of
> kiddie pools were not more than 2 feet? How sad!
> God bless her and her family.
It's not really a kiddie pool, like the ones you see that are only 6 inches deep. It's like the shallow end of Oak Marr, that goes from 0 to 4 feet all the way across.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 04, 2007 02:49PM
stinkypoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Concerned Parent Wrote:
> > 4 foot kiddie pool? I thought the depth of
> > kiddie pools were not more than 2 feet? How
> sad!
> > God bless her and her family.
>
> It's not really a kiddie pool, like the ones you
> see that are only 6 inches deep. It's like the
> shallow end of Oak Marr, that goes from 0 to 4
> feet all the way across.
Sounds like it is more of a family pool than a kiddie pool. Makes you sick to your stomach either way.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Concerned Parent Wrote:
> > 4 foot kiddie pool? I thought the depth of
> > kiddie pools were not more than 2 feet? How
> sad!
> > God bless her and her family.
>
> It's not really a kiddie pool, like the ones you
> see that are only 6 inches deep. It's like the
> shallow end of Oak Marr, that goes from 0 to 4
> feet all the way across.
Sounds like it is more of a family pool than a kiddie pool. Makes you sick to your stomach either way.
Death Time Fitness
Posted by:
Henry Remarko
()
Date: September 04, 2007 04:06PM
I partly agree with Lester.
First, LTF should fire those incompetent lifeguards, and hire lifeguards who take their jobs more seriously... or else they should change their name to "Death Time Fitness", or "Drown Time Fitness".
Second, at the very least, they should be held at fault for not strictly enforcing the rule that children must be accompanied by an adult.
Because, as your daughter's have said, there are so many damn kids who are left unattended, scampering around like vermins throughout the entire facility as if it's a giant indoor playground. I will totally substantiate that it's the same at the C'ville LTF. I see parents dropping their kids off at the front and leaving, as if LTF is a daycare facility, and then when I'm on the basketball courts, a little 7 year old kid chases after a ball directly into my path on a fastbreak and I have to dive over the little snotball to keep from train wrecking his 3ft frame.
I was there once about a year ago when there were a bunch of cops because of an attempted kidnapping - apparently some strange lady tried to lure an unattended child into leaving the gym with her. Luckily, the kid was smart enough not to go, but still, where the fuck was the parent at the time? On the elliptical? To a kidnapper, LTF would be like a candy store.
LTF needs to clean up their act.
First, LTF should fire those incompetent lifeguards, and hire lifeguards who take their jobs more seriously... or else they should change their name to "Death Time Fitness", or "Drown Time Fitness".
Second, at the very least, they should be held at fault for not strictly enforcing the rule that children must be accompanied by an adult.
Because, as your daughter's have said, there are so many damn kids who are left unattended, scampering around like vermins throughout the entire facility as if it's a giant indoor playground. I will totally substantiate that it's the same at the C'ville LTF. I see parents dropping their kids off at the front and leaving, as if LTF is a daycare facility, and then when I'm on the basketball courts, a little 7 year old kid chases after a ball directly into my path on a fastbreak and I have to dive over the little snotball to keep from train wrecking his 3ft frame.
I was there once about a year ago when there were a bunch of cops because of an attempted kidnapping - apparently some strange lady tried to lure an unattended child into leaving the gym with her. Luckily, the kid was smart enough not to go, but still, where the fuck was the parent at the time? On the elliptical? To a kidnapper, LTF would be like a candy store.
LTF needs to clean up their act.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 04, 2007 05:00PM
I can't speak for LTF because I've never been there. But I can't fathom why anyone would leave their kid unattended at any public facility. Maybe I'm just overprotective, but if I am at some place full of strangers, I keep my kids in view all the time. If my kid was drowning, it wouldn't take the lifeguard clearing a pool to figure it out.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Lester Burnham
()
Date: September 04, 2007 05:18PM
Fairfax MF---er Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I can't speak for LTF because I've never been
> there. But I can't fathom why anyone would leave
> their kid unattended at any public facility. Maybe
> I'm just overprotective, but if I am at some place
> full of strangers, I keep my kids in view all the
> time. If my kid was drowning, it wouldn't take the
> lifeguard clearing a pool to figure it out.
This may sound harsh, but I think that a lot (most?) parents in this area are self-absorbed IDIOTS! Some of it comes from an attitude of entitlement, some of it is plain ignorance, some of it is stupidity and it does not matter if they are born in the USA WASPs, Hispanics, Asians or whatever ethnic group you choose to target. Clearly, the family had some extra disposable income or they would not be members of LTF.
At the end of the day, the ultimate responsibility for guest safety in the pools falls on the lifeguards and I really feel badly for the poor 17-year old who needs to have this on their conscience - I cannot imagine how my daughter's would react to this. Good luck finding better lifeguards - you simply aren't going to get #1 quality employees for $8.50 per hour plus a free gym membership. Knowing a lot of kids, including my own, who lifeguard at community pools in the summer and LTF the rest of the year, I think these kids are pretty good and someone just made an awful mistake.
-------------------------------------------------------
> I can't speak for LTF because I've never been
> there. But I can't fathom why anyone would leave
> their kid unattended at any public facility. Maybe
> I'm just overprotective, but if I am at some place
> full of strangers, I keep my kids in view all the
> time. If my kid was drowning, it wouldn't take the
> lifeguard clearing a pool to figure it out.
This may sound harsh, but I think that a lot (most?) parents in this area are self-absorbed IDIOTS! Some of it comes from an attitude of entitlement, some of it is plain ignorance, some of it is stupidity and it does not matter if they are born in the USA WASPs, Hispanics, Asians or whatever ethnic group you choose to target. Clearly, the family had some extra disposable income or they would not be members of LTF.
At the end of the day, the ultimate responsibility for guest safety in the pools falls on the lifeguards and I really feel badly for the poor 17-year old who needs to have this on their conscience - I cannot imagine how my daughter's would react to this. Good luck finding better lifeguards - you simply aren't going to get #1 quality employees for $8.50 per hour plus a free gym membership. Knowing a lot of kids, including my own, who lifeguard at community pools in the summer and LTF the rest of the year, I think these kids are pretty good and someone just made an awful mistake.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Nick
()
Date: September 05, 2007 01:02PM
I too belong to Lifetime and have 3 childrens swim there. I can't imagine how difficult it is to loss a child in this manner. It is tragic and my thoughts and prayers go out to the family.
cc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> how awful... :(
>
> "CENTREVILLE, Va. -- Fairfax County police
> identified the 5-year-old girl who drowned at a
> gym pool on Friday as Jana Hammad of Clifton.
>
> Jana drowned at Life Time Fitness on Trinity
> Parkway just after 7 p.m. Friday, police said.
> Lifeguards had cleared the pool for a scheduled
> break. That's when the child's father realized his
> daughter was missing. She was found at the bottom
> of about 4 feet of water in the kiddie pool.
>
> Lifeguards immediately started CPR, but the girl
> was pronounced dead about an hour later at Inova
> Fair Oaks Hospital."
>
> http://www.nbc4.com/news/14026019/detail.html?subi
> d=10101441
cc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> how awful... :(
>
> "CENTREVILLE, Va. -- Fairfax County police
> identified the 5-year-old girl who drowned at a
> gym pool on Friday as Jana Hammad of Clifton.
>
> Jana drowned at Life Time Fitness on Trinity
> Parkway just after 7 p.m. Friday, police said.
> Lifeguards had cleared the pool for a scheduled
> break. That's when the child's father realized his
> daughter was missing. She was found at the bottom
> of about 4 feet of water in the kiddie pool.
>
> Lifeguards immediately started CPR, but the girl
> was pronounced dead about an hour later at Inova
> Fair Oaks Hospital."
>
> http://www.nbc4.com/news/14026019/detail.html?subi
> d=10101441
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 05, 2007 01:29PM
"Her father realized she was missing when lifeguards cleared the pool for a scheduled break. They found her in the kids pool in about four feet of water, according to police."
I still don't get it.
I still don't get it.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
ferfux
()
Date: September 05, 2007 01:33PM
thanks for sharing this depressing story. ass.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Julio
()
Date: September 05, 2007 02:26PM
2 issues here:
1- Dad left his 5 year old alone. Unless the kid was in a structured class or organized daycare w/in the facility, I can't imagine leaving your 5 year old alone like that.
2- Regardless of Dad's actions, the Lifeguards failed that little girl.
1- Dad left his 5 year old alone. Unless the kid was in a structured class or organized daycare w/in the facility, I can't imagine leaving your 5 year old alone like that.
2- Regardless of Dad's actions, the Lifeguards failed that little girl.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
TRICKIE
()
Date: September 05, 2007 04:32PM
I had heard that dad was nearby only he was in the hot tub very near the pool where his daughter was playing. He was not working out in another area at the time.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
allivant
()
Date: September 05, 2007 04:50PM
this is terrible. i personally would watch my kids if i had them. there is a lot going on in that pool. i go there and i see lots of people there all the time. i can't imagine it going unnoticed.
vaburbia.com
vaburbia.com
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 05, 2007 04:53PM
TRICKIE Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I had heard that dad was nearby only he was in the
> hot tub very near the pool where his daughter was
> playing. He was not working out in another area
> at the time.
I guess I shouldn't judge since I wasn't there. However, when my kid was 5 I would have been in the pool with him, not in a hot tub, even if it was nearby. If the kid was eight or nine and a good swimmer, that might be a different matter. Five? Nope.
-------------------------------------------------------
> I had heard that dad was nearby only he was in the
> hot tub very near the pool where his daughter was
> playing. He was not working out in another area
> at the time.
I guess I shouldn't judge since I wasn't there. However, when my kid was 5 I would have been in the pool with him, not in a hot tub, even if it was nearby. If the kid was eight or nine and a good swimmer, that might be a different matter. Five? Nope.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Concerned Parent
()
Date: September 05, 2007 10:24PM
Having been a member of LTF very briefly over the past year, I can speak to this issue first hand. I joined LTF for the sole purpose of having a place to bring my kids (ages 3 and 4) to swim and play in the winter. The pool was amazing and the kids had a blast. While I usually was in the pool with the boys, there was one day where I was sitting on the side watching them. I did have a suit on, but did not take off my cover up. In any case, as parents know can happen, in a brief minute I noticed my four year old had taken a step where the water drops off into the deeper area. I saw him flailing, yelled to the lifeguard (who was not even in a bathing suit) and the lifeguard turned to me, hesitated, and actually said "do you want me to go in after him"...of course by now I am running across to him with my clothes on. Needless to say, he was ok and got himself to the wall, but I was in AWE of the neglegent lifeguards. Who hesitates to save a kid in trouble? I brought the matter to the attention of management immediately and received some sort of acknowledgement about the episod... but unfortunately, this drowning did not come as a shock. Again, not sure of all the details (where was dad) but any way you cut it it is such a tragedy. Prayers are with that family.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
slinkeyts
()
Date: September 05, 2007 11:03PM
what a sad story
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
duh
()
Date: September 05, 2007 11:16PM
I'm sure Lifetime Fitness' bean counters have determined that paying damages for the rare drowning is much cheaper than paying for professional lifeguards every day....hence, the close-to-minimum wage, teenage imbeciles they call lifeguards.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 09:26AM
In reference to "Concerned Parent," it wouldn't even cross my mind to call for a lifeguard because my kid was flailing all because I didn't want to get my cover up wet. I guess we all see where your priorities are.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 09:31AM
Again, I am mystified by the attitude of people like "Concerned Parent." So you are telling me that paying a fee to go to a pool relinquishes any responsibility you have for the safety of your own child? Get in the damn pool and get your friggin' kid! God forbid you should have to put down your romance novel and get wet to save your kid's life!
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
What?
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:01AM
Wow....you actually blame the death on the lifeguard that cleared the pool and announced that it was break time? What about the father that left another kid in charge of the 5yr old while he was in the hot tub...and then left the entire pool area? This is a time for grievance..not finger pointing. I'm sure all of them feel horrible (as they should), but it isn't your place to judge them. And what does any of this have to do with Bush? Wow
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Former LTF Employee
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:05AM
i used to work at LTF and knew a lot about other departments and walking threw the building noticing a lot of things. Almost all of the lifeguards are teens and sit by the hot tub talking...ive always seen them not really pay attention..maybe they thought something like this couldn't happen or something. Parents ARE NOT allowed to leave their child unattended at the pool. Great gym but not great to their employees.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Amazed
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:15AM
"Concerned Parent".....You don't even realize that you had the SAME reaction as the Lifeguard. The only difference is ...oh...it was YOUR child and YOU saw him "flailing." I just love the "not my fault" attitude that is so prevalent here in NOVA. It really amazes me that everyone is blaming the lifeguard that put everyone on BREAK. I'm not saying they are the best or the worst...but give the kid a break. Parents should watch their children at all times...unless, as someone mentioned earlier, it is a structured environment where the intent is to leave your child with a care provider.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:21AM
Any parent who expects a minimum wage-earning teenager to watch out for the safety of their own child is a moron. All lifeguards at these pools are slack-jawed 17-year-olds. If you expect them to be the safety net between your child and eternal slumber, you are truly clueless.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:29AM
What? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow....you actually blame the death on the
> lifeguard that cleared the pool and announced that
> it was break time? What about the father that
> left another kid in charge of the 5yr old while he
> was in the hot tub...and then left the entire pool
> area?
Is that true?
I remember a few years back when that nutty Catholic family in Manassas with the 14 kids left the baby in their van and she died from heat stroke. The f-ing father blamed his teenaged daughter for it. What a f-ing tool.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow....you actually blame the death on the
> lifeguard that cleared the pool and announced that
> it was break time? What about the father that
> left another kid in charge of the 5yr old while he
> was in the hot tub...and then left the entire pool
> area?
Is that true?
I remember a few years back when that nutty Catholic family in Manassas with the 14 kids left the baby in their van and she died from heat stroke. The f-ing father blamed his teenaged daughter for it. What a f-ing tool.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Word of Mouth
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:36AM
MF---er
I go to Lifetime and the story I heard is the father left the 5yr old under the supervision of an older sibling...12yr old...while he was in the hot tub. Apparently there is a video but only police, lifetime officials, and the parents will see that. Maybe a jury if they prosecute the father for negligence.
I go to Lifetime and the story I heard is the father left the 5yr old under the supervision of an older sibling...12yr old...while he was in the hot tub. Apparently there is a video but only police, lifetime officials, and the parents will see that. Maybe a jury if they prosecute the father for negligence.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 10:45AM
Word of Mouth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MF---er
>
> I go to Lifetime and the story I heard is the
> father left the 5yr old under the supervision of
> an older sibling...12yr old...while he was in the
> hot tub. Apparently there is a video but only
> police, lifetime officials, and the parents will
> see that. Maybe a jury if they prosecute the
> father for negligence.
I don't think the father should be prosecuted. But if this were to turn out to be true, no way should the family sue Life Time Fitness.
-------------------------------------------------------
> MF---er
>
> I go to Lifetime and the story I heard is the
> father left the 5yr old under the supervision of
> an older sibling...12yr old...while he was in the
> hot tub. Apparently there is a video but only
> police, lifetime officials, and the parents will
> see that. Maybe a jury if they prosecute the
> father for negligence.
I don't think the father should be prosecuted. But if this were to turn out to be true, no way should the family sue Life Time Fitness.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
noname
()
Date: September 06, 2007 11:01AM
The father did not leave the pool area, this is fact.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Amazed
()
Date: September 06, 2007 11:03AM
"NO Name"....the father didn't go into the locker room?
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
noname
()
Date: September 06, 2007 11:18AM
No. He only went to the locker room AFTER asking the lifeguards about her, at which point they told him to look there.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Amazed
()
Date: September 06, 2007 11:28AM
noname Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No. He only went to the locker room AFTER asking
> the lifeguards about her, at which point they told
> him to look there.
Thanks for the info. Either way the situation sucks no matter how we look at it. It was preventable and never should have happened.
-------------------------------------------------------
> No. He only went to the locker room AFTER asking
> the lifeguards about her, at which point they told
> him to look there.
Thanks for the info. Either way the situation sucks no matter how we look at it. It was preventable and never should have happened.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 11:53AM
noname Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No. He only went to the locker room AFTER asking
> the lifeguards about her, at which point they told
> him to look there.
Hope he enjoyed his time in the hot tub.
Yes, it sucks being a parent and having to watch your kids all of the time. I imagine it sucks even more to have something like this happen.
-------------------------------------------------------
> No. He only went to the locker room AFTER asking
> the lifeguards about her, at which point they told
> him to look there.
Hope he enjoyed his time in the hot tub.
Yes, it sucks being a parent and having to watch your kids all of the time. I imagine it sucks even more to have something like this happen.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Tia2
()
Date: September 06, 2007 12:38PM
I don't have any children, but I do have nieces and nephews and NEVER take my eyes off of them in ANY public place!
When they are with me, they are MY RESPONSIBILITY and if anything bad should happen to them, it would be MY FAULT!
You "parents" out there may want to consider adopting the same philosophy of CHILD OWNERSHIP as you most likely do with your JOB OWNERSHIP! PRIORITIES!
When they are with me, they are MY RESPONSIBILITY and if anything bad should happen to them, it would be MY FAULT!
You "parents" out there may want to consider adopting the same philosophy of CHILD OWNERSHIP as you most likely do with your JOB OWNERSHIP! PRIORITIES!
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 12:59PM
I've noticed that this is a real problem in this country (not just this area). Parents who think someone else should watch their kid because they pay $5 to get in somewhere. These are the same folks who spend their time in back of Chuck E. Cheese yacking with other parents while their 4-year-old wanders around the place, confident that the 23-year-old non-English speaking Chuck E. Cheese worker at the front of the place with thwart potential kidnappers.
Get a clue, people. I don't care for Bill O'Reilly, but I do agree with his premise that nobody is watching out for you. They are not. It is YOUR job.
Get a clue, people. I don't care for Bill O'Reilly, but I do agree with his premise that nobody is watching out for you. They are not. It is YOUR job.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Tia2
()
Date: September 06, 2007 01:08PM
DITTO!
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
SRE
()
Date: September 06, 2007 01:14PM
Xerox!
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Tia2
()
Date: September 06, 2007 01:17PM
CTRL C!
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
dono
()
Date: September 06, 2007 01:49PM
>
> This may sound harsh, but I think that a lot
> (most?) parents in this area are self-absorbed
> IDIOTS! Some of it comes from an attitude of
> entitlement, some of it is plain ignorance, some
> of it is stupidity and it does not matter if they
> are born in the USA WASPs, Hispanics, Asians or
> whatever ethnic group you choose to target.
> Clearly, the family had some extra disposable
> income or they would not be members of LTF.
>
> At the end of the day, the ultimate responsibility
> for guest safety in the pools falls on the
> lifeguards and I really feel badly for the poor
> 17-year old who needs to have this on their
> conscience - I cannot imagine how my daughter's
> would react to this. Good luck finding better
> lifeguards - you simply aren't going to get #1
> quality employees for $8.50 per hour plus a free
> gym membership. Knowing a lot of kids, including
> my own, who lifeguard at community pools in the
> summer and LTF the rest of the year, I think these
> kids are pretty good and someone just made an
> awful mistake.
We parents do our best every day. As any fulltime parent knows we make lots of mistakes every day. This was a Big mistake - no one will be punished more than the Dad. We are just all so blessed to live in such a safe environment;its even harder when the horrible does happen.
Every moment is a gift...
> This may sound harsh, but I think that a lot
> (most?) parents in this area are self-absorbed
> IDIOTS! Some of it comes from an attitude of
> entitlement, some of it is plain ignorance, some
> of it is stupidity and it does not matter if they
> are born in the USA WASPs, Hispanics, Asians or
> whatever ethnic group you choose to target.
> Clearly, the family had some extra disposable
> income or they would not be members of LTF.
>
> At the end of the day, the ultimate responsibility
> for guest safety in the pools falls on the
> lifeguards and I really feel badly for the poor
> 17-year old who needs to have this on their
> conscience - I cannot imagine how my daughter's
> would react to this. Good luck finding better
> lifeguards - you simply aren't going to get #1
> quality employees for $8.50 per hour plus a free
> gym membership. Knowing a lot of kids, including
> my own, who lifeguard at community pools in the
> summer and LTF the rest of the year, I think these
> kids are pretty good and someone just made an
> awful mistake.
We parents do our best every day. As any fulltime parent knows we make lots of mistakes every day. This was a Big mistake - no one will be punished more than the Dad. We are just all so blessed to live in such a safe environment;its even harder when the horrible does happen.
Every moment is a gift...
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
dono
()
Date: September 06, 2007 01:57PM
By the way, we have been members at the fairfax Lifetime Fitness for a year and a half. The life guards there do not sit in the elevated chairs. They generally stand by the door of the gaurd office and talk.
While they do enforce the general rules, they absolutely do not eyeball the pool as they should. I would say they are never really 100% focused on the pool. Accordingly I have never been more than 10 feet from my kids, and I try never to take my eyes off them. Unless there was some noise involved in a drowning, I would not expect the guards at Lifetime Fairfax to be of any immediate use.
While they do enforce the general rules, they absolutely do not eyeball the pool as they should. I would say they are never really 100% focused on the pool. Accordingly I have never been more than 10 feet from my kids, and I try never to take my eyes off them. Unless there was some noise involved in a drowning, I would not expect the guards at Lifetime Fairfax to be of any immediate use.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
centreville
()
Date: September 06, 2007 04:06PM
I just have to say thank you to the people who have defended the lifeguards on this webpage. I spend a lot of time at Lifetime Fitness especially in the aquatics area. I speak to the guards frequently and happen to know that they recently (before this incident) completely redid their policies so that the pool is more effectively watched at all times. To say that these students are "slack jawed" or "lazy" is disgusting as I'm sure that they work harder than many of the name callers. They are mechanics, cleaners, and lifesavers all at once and work very hard at what they do. Don't be so quick to judge. Just because someone is young does not mean that they are lazy. Also, to those of you claiming that "the dad never left" or "the dad did this," unless you were physically there, you don't have any idea what happened along with the rest of the community so don't go spreading things as if they were fact, only to ruin some poor high school kid's reputation and future. I also happen to have personally been at Lifetime on several occassions when lifeguards dove into the pool to make saves while a parent sat in the sauna or spa. I'm disgusted by the attitude of those who seem to think that their negligence is to blame and thank you again to those of you who defend them.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
nharbor
()
Date: September 06, 2007 04:39PM
i personally know the family, very close friends to my family,
what happened, was NOT that the dad didnt know where she was, i mean kids all the time sit by the lil shallow end, somehow, no ones sure how she ended up in the deep end, but yeah, break happened, the dad didnt thought the little girl was in the bathroom, so, the dad cant go in the womens bathroom, so by the time he got some lady to go in there looking for her, and by the time the lady came back, and he was walking back...HE found her in the pool...not the lifegaurd...HE jumped in and took her out...only thing the lifegaurd did was give CPR,
so i mean...w/e the people at lifetime i personaly know are putting their own lil twists to the story saying the father was "drinking" BULL FUCKING SHIT..i know the guy...has NEVER drank or smoked...so that rules that out...i mean ok maybe the dad did leave the lil girl unattended for a little bit, he was still in the pool area, but i mean...why are there lifegaurds?...they're suppose to be there when the parent doesnt catch something like that, thats why they sit on those high fucking chairs...
it was some high school junior that goes to Centreville High School.
the family is not going to sue, because hes not a man for money, you give him a billion dollars, not gonna bring his daughter back and hes not selffish where hes gonna say "MAN, that money is gonna make me FEEL better, and thats justice!" no...what I believe should happen is this...
lifetime and every other little local pool needs to train their lifegaurds even better..and they need to take their jobs seriously...whats done is done..now lets do something to prevent this from happening.
what happened, was NOT that the dad didnt know where she was, i mean kids all the time sit by the lil shallow end, somehow, no ones sure how she ended up in the deep end, but yeah, break happened, the dad didnt thought the little girl was in the bathroom, so, the dad cant go in the womens bathroom, so by the time he got some lady to go in there looking for her, and by the time the lady came back, and he was walking back...HE found her in the pool...not the lifegaurd...HE jumped in and took her out...only thing the lifegaurd did was give CPR,
so i mean...w/e the people at lifetime i personaly know are putting their own lil twists to the story saying the father was "drinking" BULL FUCKING SHIT..i know the guy...has NEVER drank or smoked...so that rules that out...i mean ok maybe the dad did leave the lil girl unattended for a little bit, he was still in the pool area, but i mean...why are there lifegaurds?...they're suppose to be there when the parent doesnt catch something like that, thats why they sit on those high fucking chairs...
it was some high school junior that goes to Centreville High School.
the family is not going to sue, because hes not a man for money, you give him a billion dollars, not gonna bring his daughter back and hes not selffish where hes gonna say "MAN, that money is gonna make me FEEL better, and thats justice!" no...what I believe should happen is this...
lifetime and every other little local pool needs to train their lifegaurds even better..and they need to take their jobs seriously...whats done is done..now lets do something to prevent this from happening.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 04:55PM
I don't disagree that the lifeguards probably should be trained better and more procedures probably need to be added. But let's be clear. The idea that the father was so disconnected from what his five-year-old kid was doing at a public pool that he wasn't sure if she was in the restroom tells you something about how closely he was watching her. He wasn't.
The lifeguards are there to help in emergencies. Their job is not to be parents.
The lifeguards are there to help in emergencies. Their job is not to be parents.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
nharbor
()
Date: September 06, 2007 04:56PM
some corrections to above...and "the dad thought* the little girl"
and
"where was the lifegaurds"
and another thing i forgot to mention..
yes, the dad put his 13 year old son in charge, not really like...shes your responsiblity...C YA!
more like..
im gonna sit right here...a few steps away from the pool IN THE POOL AREA...while you play with your little sister...
i was at the funeral, i heard directly from the dad...all you other peole who are adding your own twists and turns and bullshit...
w/e
nows not the time to be juding something you didnt see..and w/e, just have some sorrow for a little girl that died. and theres no point on putting blame on anyone.
and
"where was the lifegaurds"
and another thing i forgot to mention..
yes, the dad put his 13 year old son in charge, not really like...shes your responsiblity...C YA!
more like..
im gonna sit right here...a few steps away from the pool IN THE POOL AREA...while you play with your little sister...
i was at the funeral, i heard directly from the dad...all you other peole who are adding your own twists and turns and bullshit...
w/e
nows not the time to be juding something you didnt see..and w/e, just have some sorrow for a little girl that died. and theres no point on putting blame on anyone.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
nharbor
()
Date: September 06, 2007 04:59PM
ok yeah, he wasnt relying on the lifegaurds 100% to be his personal daycare, and second...if your a parent and your at a pool, sitting on those benches, reading your magazine...thats the same as someone sitting a few feet away from the pool, thinking a life gaurd will save someones life...
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 06, 2007 05:02PM
nharbor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ok yeah, he wasnt relying on the lifegaurds 100%
> to be his personal daycare, and second...if your a
> parent and your at a pool, sitting on those
> benches, reading your magazine...thats the same as
> someone sitting a few feet away from the pool,
> thinking a life gaurd will save someones life...
I don't read magazines at the pool when my 5-year-old is in it. Get my drift? I watch my kid. I am in the pool. I am on the edge of the pool. I realize my child should not be left alone in 4-feet of water. I also know that a 13-year-old boy shouldn't be responsible for watching that 5-year-old. That is called being a responsible parent. Get it?
-------------------------------------------------------
> ok yeah, he wasnt relying on the lifegaurds 100%
> to be his personal daycare, and second...if your a
> parent and your at a pool, sitting on those
> benches, reading your magazine...thats the same as
> someone sitting a few feet away from the pool,
> thinking a life gaurd will save someones life...
I don't read magazines at the pool when my 5-year-old is in it. Get my drift? I watch my kid. I am in the pool. I am on the edge of the pool. I realize my child should not be left alone in 4-feet of water. I also know that a 13-year-old boy shouldn't be responsible for watching that 5-year-old. That is called being a responsible parent. Get it?
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
duh
()
Date: September 06, 2007 08:00PM
How come, in every thread about tragic deaths, several people show up to scold us for "judging people"?
Why the hell not? If you only want to hear eulogies...go to the memorial service and stay away from here!
Why the hell not? If you only want to hear eulogies...go to the memorial service and stay away from here!
Death Time Fitness
Posted by:
Henry r.
()
Date: September 06, 2007 09:10PM
I agree with judging/criticizing the employees at LTF, most of whom are teens. But more so, I blame LTF for their hiring decisions (hiring mostly teens).
All I ever see the employees do at LTF is chat and flirt with each other. I'd bet $39,104.20 that the "lifeguard" was doing just at the time.
All I ever see the employees do at LTF is chat and flirt with each other. I'd bet $39,104.20 that the "lifeguard" was doing just at the time.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Robert
()
Date: September 06, 2007 09:29PM
Thats very sad. Its also very ironic that she died in the "kiddie pool" Thats suppposed to be the safe area.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Susan
()
Date: September 06, 2007 09:35PM
I think we all agree it is a horrific situation to be in, as a parent and a private fitness club. Obviously it wouldn't have such a discussion if errors weren't identified on both parts. I am sure Lifetime is doing some type of damage control...and the family and father are grieving. These tragedies are preventable in most cases...no one was looking out for this little one and she drowned. I have had close calls with my kids and they have been swimming since toddler years....I've been in the pool with them and have rescued other kids that got caught up in the inexperience of handling themselves in water. Maybe it was her time...no one really knows...we know what we believe...pray for the family....their life is changed forever......forever is a long time without your lil' girl you love so much. Lifetime needs to change their policies...there are GOOD lifeguards out there and GOOD young kids that need training...and better managers to ensure the safety of ALL swimmers in the pool.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
KeepOnTruckin
()
Date: September 07, 2007 04:51PM
yeah
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/11/2007 03:06PM by KeepOnTruckin.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/11/2007 03:06PM by KeepOnTruckin.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Angry Parent
()
Date: September 07, 2007 11:58PM
NHarbor,
Your response literally disgusts me. You weren't there and you can't take someone's word any more than we can take the lifeguards' words. Just because you know this man personally doesn't mean we should choose to believe what he says over the words of the professionals on duty. Also, I am very close with several employees at Lifetime and am quite sure that no one is circulating ANY sort of story about the father drinking so I'm not quite sure where you pulled THAT out of. Perhaps you're just trying to cause drama?
You clearly have never even been to Lifetime Fitness since you referenced the duties of the lifeguards as to babysit your children which is far from it. Also you discussed why the lifeguards sit in "those high chairs." The lifeguards at Lifetime stand and haven't sat in chairs in almost a year. Also, your allegations that the father was the one who found the daughter and pulled her out are just as heavily balanced by allegations that the lifeguard pulled her out which is much more likely considering the father was searching for his daughter in other areas of the gym.
Also, please get your facts straight. The lifeguard is not a Junior at Centreville High School and your poor knowledge and accuracy on this fact negatees and other certainties you seem to claim.
I'm disgusted by your need for drama and attention and by the fact that you associated yourself with someone you probably don't even know.
Your response literally disgusts me. You weren't there and you can't take someone's word any more than we can take the lifeguards' words. Just because you know this man personally doesn't mean we should choose to believe what he says over the words of the professionals on duty. Also, I am very close with several employees at Lifetime and am quite sure that no one is circulating ANY sort of story about the father drinking so I'm not quite sure where you pulled THAT out of. Perhaps you're just trying to cause drama?
You clearly have never even been to Lifetime Fitness since you referenced the duties of the lifeguards as to babysit your children which is far from it. Also you discussed why the lifeguards sit in "those high chairs." The lifeguards at Lifetime stand and haven't sat in chairs in almost a year. Also, your allegations that the father was the one who found the daughter and pulled her out are just as heavily balanced by allegations that the lifeguard pulled her out which is much more likely considering the father was searching for his daughter in other areas of the gym.
Also, please get your facts straight. The lifeguard is not a Junior at Centreville High School and your poor knowledge and accuracy on this fact negatees and other certainties you seem to claim.
I'm disgusted by your need for drama and attention and by the fact that you associated yourself with someone you probably don't even know.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
factoid
()
Date: September 08, 2007 12:04AM
Just a few response to what people have said:
I am thoroughly appauled that people continue to assume that just because lifeguards are young that they are lazy or inadequate. A drowning is not necessarily a sign of an inadequate lifeguard as anyone who has taken any sort of lifeguard training knows. The lifeguards at Lifetime are some of the best I have ever seen and are constantly vigilant. The fact that someone drowned there does not discredit them as employees and to assume that they are lazy because they are in high school is a vagrant disregard of the value of youth.
Any sort of parent who has no idea where his children are for a long enough period for them to drown and not be able to be revived clearly WAS relying on the lifeguards 100%.
The accusation that the lifeguards were flirting or playing around is ridiculous. When there are only two guards on duty, jobs are taken with extra care and the pool is watched vigilantly.
The term "kiddle pool" is highly misleading in the news and in this form. Lifetime does not have a "kiddie pool." Rather, they have a family pool that reaches four feet deep and is larger than most outdoor pools.
I am thoroughly appauled that people continue to assume that just because lifeguards are young that they are lazy or inadequate. A drowning is not necessarily a sign of an inadequate lifeguard as anyone who has taken any sort of lifeguard training knows. The lifeguards at Lifetime are some of the best I have ever seen and are constantly vigilant. The fact that someone drowned there does not discredit them as employees and to assume that they are lazy because they are in high school is a vagrant disregard of the value of youth.
Any sort of parent who has no idea where his children are for a long enough period for them to drown and not be able to be revived clearly WAS relying on the lifeguards 100%.
The accusation that the lifeguards were flirting or playing around is ridiculous. When there are only two guards on duty, jobs are taken with extra care and the pool is watched vigilantly.
The term "kiddle pool" is highly misleading in the news and in this form. Lifetime does not have a "kiddie pool." Rather, they have a family pool that reaches four feet deep and is larger than most outdoor pools.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
TheMeeper
()
Date: September 08, 2007 12:16AM
The lifeguards at Lifetime are some of the best I have ever seen and are constantly vigilant.
jobs are taken with extra care and the pool is watched vigilantly.
The fact that someone drowned there does not discredit them
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2007 12:22AM by TheMeeper.
jobs are taken with extra care and the pool is watched vigilantly.
The fact that someone drowned there does not discredit them
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2007 12:22AM by TheMeeper.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 08, 2007 10:43AM
I haven't been to Lifetime, but I have been to several fitness clubs in the area and it sounds like this "kiddie" pool is actually just the shallow end of the regular pool. Any kid can go into the deep end if they aren't supervised.
It is not the job of the lifeguards to supervise kids. They are there to rescue someone who is having problems. If the father had been watching his kid, he could have gotten the attention of the lifeguards when she started having problems. That would have been the proper process here, not expecting lifeguards to be omniscient and getting mad when you figure out after a tragedy that they aren't.
It is not the job of the lifeguards to supervise kids. They are there to rescue someone who is having problems. If the father had been watching his kid, he could have gotten the attention of the lifeguards when she started having problems. That would have been the proper process here, not expecting lifeguards to be omniscient and getting mad when you figure out after a tragedy that they aren't.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 08, 2007 11:00AM
Here's a more recent article on the whole thing. You can already see that both sides are starting to point fingers. The father said he wanted to sit in a chair that he moved closer to the pool, but the lifeguards said he couldn't. The aunt is wondering about "procedures." At the same time, the Life Time folks are saying it is the responsibility of parents to watch their kids and that kids under 12 shouldn't be in the pool without an adult...
http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/article.asp?article=86999&paper=62&cat=104
...I definitely anticipate a lawsuit coming out of this. It will be interesting to see what the cops determine from the tapes.
http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/article.asp?article=86999&paper=62&cat=104
...I definitely anticipate a lawsuit coming out of this. It will be interesting to see what the cops determine from the tapes.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
duh
()
Date: September 08, 2007 11:46AM
LTF will end up paying something in a settlement...but dad better not quit his job.
My buddy is in the insurance biz and tells me that, cold as it sounds, there are widely accepted "values" placed on different types of lives...and a young child is not "worth" a great deal of money. It would cost them a lot more if dad (presumably a "breadwinner") had drowned due to a finding of negligence on LTF's part.
My buddy is in the insurance biz and tells me that, cold as it sounds, there are widely accepted "values" placed on different types of lives...and a young child is not "worth" a great deal of money. It would cost them a lot more if dad (presumably a "breadwinner") had drowned due to a finding of negligence on LTF's part.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
FYI
()
Date: September 08, 2007 12:55PM
This is a wrongful death suit...discovery is already happening...there is a great deal of $$$ on the table and they usually have a longer period of time before the statute of limitations runs out due to the age of the victim.
Lifetime would be wise to settle rather than go in front of a jury.....sympathy for the family will win......as maybe it should......
Lifetime would be wise to settle rather than go in front of a jury.....sympathy for the family will win......as maybe it should......
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 08, 2007 01:12PM
I don't think Life Time should have to pay shit. Unfortunately, I'm sure their insurer will step in at some point and offer a settlement to keep this out of court. If it does, it will be another blow against personal responsibility in this country and another knotch in the belt of the "victim society" we are fostering in the U.S.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
LTF Member
()
Date: September 08, 2007 04:38PM
WashingToneLocian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think Life Time should have to pay shit.
> Unfortunately, I'm sure their insurer will step in
> at some point and offer a settlement to keep this
> out of court. If it does, it will be another blow
> against personal responsibility in this country
> and another knotch in the belt of the "victim
> society" we are fostering in the U.S.
Your last line is so true. Actions have consequences. In this case, the apparent lack of vigilance by the father had very tragic consequences. But, how is that LTF's fault?
I have gone to this facility since the week it opened. I took four young kids there. We went swimming a lot. My wife and I always watched them until they were old enough to swim on their own. A five year old is small enough that someone who is watching the pool and not her can easily miss her.
My heart goes out to the family and to the lifeguards who probably feel like they should have seen her and saved her.
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think Life Time should have to pay shit.
> Unfortunately, I'm sure their insurer will step in
> at some point and offer a settlement to keep this
> out of court. If it does, it will be another blow
> against personal responsibility in this country
> and another knotch in the belt of the "victim
> society" we are fostering in the U.S.
Your last line is so true. Actions have consequences. In this case, the apparent lack of vigilance by the father had very tragic consequences. But, how is that LTF's fault?
I have gone to this facility since the week it opened. I took four young kids there. We went swimming a lot. My wife and I always watched them until they were old enough to swim on their own. A five year old is small enough that someone who is watching the pool and not her can easily miss her.
My heart goes out to the family and to the lifeguards who probably feel like they should have seen her and saved her.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 08, 2007 05:18PM
I don't think the father is a terrible person for this. I think he made a mistake. However, I don't believe others - the lifeguards and Life Time Fitness - should pay for that mistake.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Gravis
()
Date: September 09, 2007 04:55AM
WashingToneLocian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think the father is a terrible person for
> this. I think he made a mistake. However, I don't
> believe others - the lifeguards and Life Time
> Fitness - should pay for that mistake.
well... i would say that the one lifeguard should loose their job (im quite certain they did) as they didnt do the one thing they were there to do.
"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think the father is a terrible person for
> this. I think he made a mistake. However, I don't
> believe others - the lifeguards and Life Time
> Fitness - should pay for that mistake.
well... i would say that the one lifeguard should loose their job (im quite certain they did) as they didnt do the one thing they were there to do.
"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 09, 2007 11:56AM
Gravis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WashingToneLocian Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I don't think the father is a terrible person
> for
> > this. I think he made a mistake. However, I
> don't
> > believe others - the lifeguards and Life Time
> > Fitness - should pay for that mistake.
>
> well... i would say that the one lifeguard should
> loose their job (im quite certain they did) as
> they didnt do the one thing they were there to do.
I'm not sure how you can say that. They cleared the pool. They gave CPR. The lifeguards aren't all-knowing, all-seeing. The expectation is that parents will watch their kids. Lifeguards are not babysitters.
-------------------------------------------------------
> WashingToneLocian Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I don't think the father is a terrible person
> for
> > this. I think he made a mistake. However, I
> don't
> > believe others - the lifeguards and Life Time
> > Fitness - should pay for that mistake.
>
> well... i would say that the one lifeguard should
> loose their job (im quite certain they did) as
> they didnt do the one thing they were there to do.
I'm not sure how you can say that. They cleared the pool. They gave CPR. The lifeguards aren't all-knowing, all-seeing. The expectation is that parents will watch their kids. Lifeguards are not babysitters.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
-
()
Date: September 09, 2007 08:23PM
HENRY I AM THE LIFEGUARD THAT DID THE CPR ON THE GIRL. THERE IS MORE INFORMATION THEN HAS BEEN AVALIBLE TO BE DISCLOSED SO BOLD STATEMENTS ARE NOT A WISE THING TO SAY AND EVERYONE PLEASE STOP BLAMING THE FATHER. A CHILDS DEATH IS NOT ANYTHING ANYONE SHOULD CARRY IN LIFE AS GUILT. A NEWS PAPER CAN ONLY GIVE YOU SO MANY DETAILS AND THERE IS SOME THAT CLEAR MY MIND OF GUILT AND THAT WE CANNOT SPEAK OF. YOUR JOB AS CITIZENS AND NEIGHBORS RIGHT NOW IS TO MORN FOR THE FAMILY, NOT POINT FINGERS.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 09, 2007 09:05PM
- Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> HENRY I AM THE LIFEGUARD THAT DID THE CPR ON THE
> GIRL. THERE IS MORE INFORMATION THEN HAS BEEN
> AVALIBLE TO BE DISCLOSED SO BOLD STATEMENTS ARE
> NOT A WISE THING TO SAY AND EVERYONE PLEASE STOP
> BLAMING THE FATHER. A CHILDS DEATH IS NOT ANYTHING
> ANYONE SHOULD CARRY IN LIFE AS GUILT. A NEWS PAPER
> CAN ONLY GIVE YOU SO MANY DETAILS AND THERE IS
> SOME THAT CLEAR MY MIND OF GUILT AND THAT WE
> CANNOT SPEAK OF. YOUR JOB AS CITIZENS AND
> NEIGHBORS RIGHT NOW IS TO MORN FOR THE FAMILY, NOT
> POINT FINGERS.
So you are really a friend of the father trying to pass yourself off as the lifeguard, correct?
-------------------------------------------------------
> HENRY I AM THE LIFEGUARD THAT DID THE CPR ON THE
> GIRL. THERE IS MORE INFORMATION THEN HAS BEEN
> AVALIBLE TO BE DISCLOSED SO BOLD STATEMENTS ARE
> NOT A WISE THING TO SAY AND EVERYONE PLEASE STOP
> BLAMING THE FATHER. A CHILDS DEATH IS NOT ANYTHING
> ANYONE SHOULD CARRY IN LIFE AS GUILT. A NEWS PAPER
> CAN ONLY GIVE YOU SO MANY DETAILS AND THERE IS
> SOME THAT CLEAR MY MIND OF GUILT AND THAT WE
> CANNOT SPEAK OF. YOUR JOB AS CITIZENS AND
> NEIGHBORS RIGHT NOW IS TO MORN FOR THE FAMILY, NOT
> POINT FINGERS.
So you are really a friend of the father trying to pass yourself off as the lifeguard, correct?
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Monica
()
Date: September 10, 2007 11:38AM
This is just a tragic accident, lets stop blaming the father or the lifeguard and pray for the family. It takes a blink of an eye for these things to occur, it doesnt make him a bad father.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Tee Butt Willi
()
Date: September 10, 2007 06:28PM
I have been at that pool when just one slide is operating - a current results that can carry kids from shallow water to deeper water where they can't touch bottom. I used to stand on the deep side of that current and catch my daughter is she floated toward me.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
-
()
Date: September 10, 2007 10:23PM
No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in training and a senior at Centreville high school. You have no god given right to blame anyone and you don’t understand these types of situations because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year old has to tell you this.)
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
-
()
Date: September 10, 2007 10:26PM
tee Butt Willi the side was not open
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Lester Burnham
()
Date: September 10, 2007 11:13PM
- Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard
> that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in
> training and a senior at Centreville high school.
> You have no god given right to blame anyone and
> you don’t understand these types of situations
> because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and
> point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year
> old has to tell you this.)
If you really are a guard at LTF, I am a bit surprised that club and/or corporate management did not politely ask (demand?) that you not discuss this matter in any non-official forum unless specifically authorized and approved by LTF. I am not a lawyer, but would assume that you are reasonably well-protected as a minor, but as a potential party to a negligence lawsuit you might want to simply go back to being a relatively anonymous teenager before your emotions cause you to create more problems. Your comments here, while interesting if true, will surely come back to haunt you if you are not careful.
-------------------------------------------------------
> No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard
> that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in
> training and a senior at Centreville high school.
> You have no god given right to blame anyone and
> you don’t understand these types of situations
> because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and
> point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year
> old has to tell you this.)
If you really are a guard at LTF, I am a bit surprised that club and/or corporate management did not politely ask (demand?) that you not discuss this matter in any non-official forum unless specifically authorized and approved by LTF. I am not a lawyer, but would assume that you are reasonably well-protected as a minor, but as a potential party to a negligence lawsuit you might want to simply go back to being a relatively anonymous teenager before your emotions cause you to create more problems. Your comments here, while interesting if true, will surely come back to haunt you if you are not careful.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
-
()
Date: September 10, 2007 11:43PM
Yes it is true i am not sopposed to dissucss the situation but i saw the accusations on this site. Also i am not disclosing details so in many senses i am not breaking any rules. All i ask is that the father is left alone and accusations stop.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Lester Burnham
()
Date: September 11, 2007 09:06AM
- Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes it is true i am not sopposed to dissucss the
> situation but i saw the accusations on this site.
> Also i am not disclosing details so in many senses
> i am not breaking any rules. All i ask is that the
> father is left alone and accusations stop.
Dude, you keep digging a deeper hole, now admitting that you know that what you are doing is wrong by disregarding a direct request from your employer. Sorry to sound harsh, but it is not your job to defend the father or anyone else in this case. You should feel free to come back when the trial is over and settlement reached to share as much as you want, but right now you probably want to focus on schoolwork.
Given your openness to discuss the incident, I would hate to be one of your friends who gets served with a summons to appear for a deposition and needs to hire a lawyer at $250 per hour. I know that it is a tough lesson to learn, but if I was your parent I would explain very directly that your seemingly innocent actions may result in a civil suit against the family and we can easily lose our house and other assets.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes it is true i am not sopposed to dissucss the
> situation but i saw the accusations on this site.
> Also i am not disclosing details so in many senses
> i am not breaking any rules. All i ask is that the
> father is left alone and accusations stop.
Dude, you keep digging a deeper hole, now admitting that you know that what you are doing is wrong by disregarding a direct request from your employer. Sorry to sound harsh, but it is not your job to defend the father or anyone else in this case. You should feel free to come back when the trial is over and settlement reached to share as much as you want, but right now you probably want to focus on schoolwork.
Given your openness to discuss the incident, I would hate to be one of your friends who gets served with a summons to appear for a deposition and needs to hire a lawyer at $250 per hour. I know that it is a tough lesson to learn, but if I was your parent I would explain very directly that your seemingly innocent actions may result in a civil suit against the family and we can easily lose our house and other assets.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
-
()
Date: September 11, 2007 03:45PM
Lester your comments are repulsive in the last page. I am a good lifeguard and there is no such thing as a professional lifeguard unless its an adult who did not attend college and is trying to name him or herself a profession. There was no mistake and you need to stop judging me. I can defend my self as long as i do not disclose infromation. Re-read my last post a few times if your still unclear about what is disclosing and what is not. CLEARLY I AM NOT DISCLOSING ANYTHING and it was a stupid idea to get involved into this site becasuse i should have known that some people were going to be ignorate such as yourself.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Lester Burnham
()
Date: September 11, 2007 04:19PM
Dude,
These are my quotes..."Both of my daughters have worked as lifeguards at LTF in Fairfax and often complained about parents who leave their young children unattended in the pool while they work out. Part of the reason for clearing the pool is to identify which children are there without a parent."..."Good luck finding better lifeguards - you simply aren't going to get #1 quality employees for $8.50 per hour plus a free gym membership. Knowing a lot of kids, including my own, who lifeguard at community pools in the summer and LTF the rest of the year, I think these kids are pretty good and someone just made an awful mistake."
Not sure what you found repulsive, but I think that I was being pretty supportive of lifeguards including those at LTF. While this may be considered an accidental drowning, proper scanning technique should prevent this from happening, don't you think? I was a long-time water safety instructor and provide risk assessment and management services to businesses including swimming pools.
Now, get over yourself and invest in a spellchecker (there is no such word as 'ignorate').
These are my quotes..."Both of my daughters have worked as lifeguards at LTF in Fairfax and often complained about parents who leave their young children unattended in the pool while they work out. Part of the reason for clearing the pool is to identify which children are there without a parent."..."Good luck finding better lifeguards - you simply aren't going to get #1 quality employees for $8.50 per hour plus a free gym membership. Knowing a lot of kids, including my own, who lifeguard at community pools in the summer and LTF the rest of the year, I think these kids are pretty good and someone just made an awful mistake."
Not sure what you found repulsive, but I think that I was being pretty supportive of lifeguards including those at LTF. While this may be considered an accidental drowning, proper scanning technique should prevent this from happening, don't you think? I was a long-time water safety instructor and provide risk assessment and management services to businesses including swimming pools.
Now, get over yourself and invest in a spellchecker (there is no such word as 'ignorate').
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 11, 2007 04:26PM
Lester-
If this guy truly is the lifeguard who did CPR on the girl, then the Fairfax Police know he is talking about this and who he is. He is not anonymous.
Just the fact that he alluded to the idea that the tape exonerates both the father and Life Time Fitness constitutes the sharing of evidence in an investigation.
However, if he is the lifeguard, he will be getting deposed regardless of what he says here, should there be a civil suit out of this thing. I imagine the lawyers from both sides will be asking him what he means by his comments on this blog.
If this guy truly is the lifeguard who did CPR on the girl, then the Fairfax Police know he is talking about this and who he is. He is not anonymous.
Just the fact that he alluded to the idea that the tape exonerates both the father and Life Time Fitness constitutes the sharing of evidence in an investigation.
However, if he is the lifeguard, he will be getting deposed regardless of what he says here, should there be a civil suit out of this thing. I imagine the lawyers from both sides will be asking him what he means by his comments on this blog.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
...
()
Date: September 11, 2007 04:29PM
i went to that lifetime that night and it just was weird and empty and i had a feeling something had happened...
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
KeepOnTruckin
()
Date: September 11, 2007 05:41PM
Lol we still make fun of people for bad spelling? Lol Lester get a life.
The kid's got his ass covered. Instead of watching his, (you gay pervert!) watch yours.
The kid's got his ass covered. Instead of watching his, (you gay pervert!) watch yours.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
J Watts
()
Date: September 11, 2007 08:44PM
Hi.
I have been a member at LTF for about one year. A big reason we joined was for the family pool. We go frequently and I have NEVER EVER seen an attentive lifeguard. The guards work 15 minute shifts--you'd think that they could pay close attention for that time span.
I always go in the water with my 2 children and there is no substitute for a parent watching their own children. However, why do they even have lifeguards if not for a second set of eyes?
I wrote a complaint card to LTF a few months agon on this very issue. I asked for more attentive guards and mentioned that this is a risk for the club.
Nothing changed and I never heard from LTF on that comment.
It's very sad for the family.....
I have been a member at LTF for about one year. A big reason we joined was for the family pool. We go frequently and I have NEVER EVER seen an attentive lifeguard. The guards work 15 minute shifts--you'd think that they could pay close attention for that time span.
I always go in the water with my 2 children and there is no substitute for a parent watching their own children. However, why do they even have lifeguards if not for a second set of eyes?
I wrote a complaint card to LTF a few months agon on this very issue. I asked for more attentive guards and mentioned that this is a risk for the club.
Nothing changed and I never heard from LTF on that comment.
It's very sad for the family.....
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Gerrard
()
Date: September 11, 2007 09:31PM
I agree Jwatts. We should take justice into our own hands via mobb force and see the Lifeguards judged and punished before our own eyes, as we see fit.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Moron
()
Date: September 12, 2007 03:13PM
- Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard
> that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in
> training and a senior at Centreville high school.
> You have no god given right to blame anyone and
> you don’t understand these types of situations
> because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and
> point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year
> old has to tell you this.)
LTF depends on minors to be supervisors???
-------------------------------------------------------
> No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard
> that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in
> training and a senior at Centreville high school.
> You have no god given right to blame anyone and
> you don’t understand these types of situations
> because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and
> point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year
> old has to tell you this.)
LTF depends on minors to be supervisors???
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
Fairfax MF---er
()
Date: September 12, 2007 03:46PM
- Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard
> that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in
> training and a senior at Centreville high school.
> You have no god given right to blame anyone and
> you don’t understand these types of situations
> because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and
> point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year
> old has to tell you this.)
Seems to me you don't understand these types of situations because you are a 17-year-old without kids who has never been deposed or sued.
If you are who you say you are, you sound like a good kid. Unfortunately you don't know how perfectly nice people can turn on you in a short amount of time given the circumstances. I hope the family doesn't sue Life Time Fitness. But if they do, you will get an upclose and ugly view of finger pointing.
-------------------------------------------------------
> No I am one of the aquatics supervisors, the guard
> that performed CPR on the girl that day, an EMT in
> training and a senior at Centreville high school.
> You have no god given right to blame anyone and
> you don’t understand these types of situations
> because clearly u sit behind a computer screen and
> point fingers. ( what’s worse is that a 17 year
> old has to tell you this.)
Seems to me you don't understand these types of situations because you are a 17-year-old without kids who has never been deposed or sued.
If you are who you say you are, you sound like a good kid. Unfortunately you don't know how perfectly nice people can turn on you in a short amount of time given the circumstances. I hope the family doesn't sue Life Time Fitness. But if they do, you will get an upclose and ugly view of finger pointing.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
dddddddddda
()
Date: September 12, 2007 06:57PM
Really sad
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
dddddddda
()
Date: September 12, 2007 06:58PM
THOSE LIFE TIME GUARDS SUCK
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
this guy
()
Date: September 13, 2007 12:54PM
Wow that was some very creative and very orginal imput da...
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
this guy
()
Date: September 13, 2007 12:58PM
What people in here that say that its bad judgment for LTF to hire teenagers to lifeguard, obivously haven't managed pools before. Has anyone in here worked as a lifeguard before? I used to I made 7.50 as a lifeguard when I first started. That is less than some people at Mc Donalds. You try to manage a pool with that small of a payroll and lets see what better options you come up with to hire someone older and experinced
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
CaneCorsoLover
()
Date: September 14, 2007 01:17PM
That Dad is a moron! I would NEVER, EVER leave my 5 year old alone near water - even a freakin puddle! That man is an idiot and will burn in hell for what he did
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
bridget
()
Date: September 14, 2007 05:16PM
ive been to lifetime plenty of times and the lifeguards there all SUCK. When i go to the lifetime cafe i see the ones off duty cursing and laughing while doing absolutely nothing while i try to eat my snack wrap.
The guards should have been on top of unattended children in the pool and how the hell do you not see a body in 4ft of water i would be right on top of that shit.
thoughts and prayers to the family
The guards should have been on top of unattended children in the pool and how the hell do you not see a body in 4ft of water i would be right on top of that shit.
thoughts and prayers to the family
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
this guy
()
Date: September 15, 2007 09:43AM
"When i go to the lifetime cafe i see the ones off duty cursing and laughing while doing absolutely nothing"
"i would be right on top of that shit."
Very nice choice of telling your side while cursing about the lifeguards cursing....
"i would be right on top of that shit."
Very nice choice of telling your side while cursing about the lifeguards cursing....
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
chim chang
()
Date: September 15, 2007 10:20AM
Why do people blame Bush For everything including this
'Could have been easily prevented but then again electing President Bush could have been easily prevented'
'Could have been easily prevented but then again electing President Bush could have been easily prevented'
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 15, 2007 10:26AM
That Hammad guy is a Muslim. If Bush was really concerned about Islamo-Facism, the guy would have been in GITMO and this never would have happened.
Is that a good reason why Bush is to blame?
Is that a good reason why Bush is to blame?
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
José Diego
()
Date: September 15, 2007 11:49AM
This event is very sad. Perhaps, the father rationalizes that it's 'Allah's will.' That's his decision and if it provides solace, that's fine. It certainly is disingenuous and Muslim-baiting to say that this man's religion was a factor and to blame the President of the United States. I guess that you can extrapolate to the son who murdered his father the other day, and with Middle-Eastern names assume that it was a "vengeance killing" caused by Mr. Bush. Enough is enough. Stop this needless, malevolent discourse--this ignorant talk is not warranted and is very hurtful to those directly involved.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
WashingToneLocian
()
Date: September 15, 2007 08:42PM
José Diego Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This event is very sad. Perhaps, the father
> rationalizes that it's 'Allah's will.' That's his
> decision and if it provides solace, that's fine.
> It certainly is disingenuous and Muslim-baiting to
> say that this man's religion was a factor and to
> blame the President of the United States. I guess
> that you can extrapolate to the son who murdered
> his father the other day, and with Middle-Eastern
> names assume that it was a "vengeance killing"
> caused by Mr. Bush. Enough is enough. Stop this
> needless, malevolent discourse--this ignorant talk
> is not warranted and is very hurtful to those
> directly involved.
It was a joke. You may be new to this discussion, but several posters have been joking about finding ways to blame Bush for this. I came up with an absurd reason to blame Bush. In fact, I am one of the handful of people on this site who regularly defend Muslims from ridiculous attacks. I guess I should have noted it was a joke in the original post.
-------------------------------------------------------
> This event is very sad. Perhaps, the father
> rationalizes that it's 'Allah's will.' That's his
> decision and if it provides solace, that's fine.
> It certainly is disingenuous and Muslim-baiting to
> say that this man's religion was a factor and to
> blame the President of the United States. I guess
> that you can extrapolate to the son who murdered
> his father the other day, and with Middle-Eastern
> names assume that it was a "vengeance killing"
> caused by Mr. Bush. Enough is enough. Stop this
> needless, malevolent discourse--this ignorant talk
> is not warranted and is very hurtful to those
> directly involved.
It was a joke. You may be new to this discussion, but several posters have been joking about finding ways to blame Bush for this. I came up with an absurd reason to blame Bush. In fact, I am one of the handful of people on this site who regularly defend Muslims from ridiculous attacks. I guess I should have noted it was a joke in the original post.
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
lifeguard
()
Date: September 15, 2007 10:39PM
To those who have never been lifeguards before:
I have worked in this county as a lifeguard for going on 9 years now. I have worked in private pools, county RECenters, and Country Clubs. While SOME lifeguards are young and immature, what I have seen over the years is that for the most part, every single one of them when they get in that chair, do their job. However, there have been so many times where parents or older children babysitting younger children, say fuck it, and go do their own thing and use the lifeguard as a babysitter. While it is their job to ensure the safety of all those in the pool, they also need help from those responsible for the younger children. As hard as you try there will always be that one that you miss, unfortunately thats part of being human. I partially blame the father in this, but not having been there, I can't totally rule out that it was a freak accident. NO lifeguard ever wants to go through doing CPR, no matter how much you train for it. I've had to do it, and that was no fault of my own, kid had a diabetic seizure in the deep end(because his parents hadn't ensured he had eaten that day). Either way I will keep both the family and the lifeguards and their family in my prayers. It is a tragic loss
I have worked in this county as a lifeguard for going on 9 years now. I have worked in private pools, county RECenters, and Country Clubs. While SOME lifeguards are young and immature, what I have seen over the years is that for the most part, every single one of them when they get in that chair, do their job. However, there have been so many times where parents or older children babysitting younger children, say fuck it, and go do their own thing and use the lifeguard as a babysitter. While it is their job to ensure the safety of all those in the pool, they also need help from those responsible for the younger children. As hard as you try there will always be that one that you miss, unfortunately thats part of being human. I partially blame the father in this, but not having been there, I can't totally rule out that it was a freak accident. NO lifeguard ever wants to go through doing CPR, no matter how much you train for it. I've had to do it, and that was no fault of my own, kid had a diabetic seizure in the deep end(because his parents hadn't ensured he had eaten that day). Either way I will keep both the family and the lifeguards and their family in my prayers. It is a tragic loss
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
feli
()
Date: September 15, 2007 10:49PM
Is is true that victims vomit in your mouth when you blow air into their stomach?
Re: 5yr old girl drowns at Lifetime Fitness
Posted by:
lifeguard
()
Date: September 15, 2007 11:02PM
Feli,
First of all if you are dumb enough to believe that during CPR you blow air into their stomach then you are fucking retarded and have no clue about human anatomy. Air goes into lungs, not the stomach. Secondly, if you are a dumb shit and don't use the CPR masks, then yes you will get bodily fluid in your mouth. That is not vomit, it is the water that goes into the lungs as well as whatever fluids are in the trachaea and esophogus. Drowning occurs when someone inhales water or another fluid and they can no longer breathe. That is what comes up during CPR. Fucking morons, all of you.
First of all if you are dumb enough to believe that during CPR you blow air into their stomach then you are fucking retarded and have no clue about human anatomy. Air goes into lungs, not the stomach. Secondly, if you are a dumb shit and don't use the CPR masks, then yes you will get bodily fluid in your mouth. That is not vomit, it is the water that goes into the lungs as well as whatever fluids are in the trachaea and esophogus. Drowning occurs when someone inhales water or another fluid and they can no longer breathe. That is what comes up during CPR. Fucking morons, all of you.