HokieFan42 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think my age is relevent to this
> discussion. While my two children are not yet
> school-aged, my husband and I purposely purchased
> a townhome taking into account where we wanted our
> children educated. The idea that just after we've
> made an investment in a home, the boundaries might
> switch on us is sickening. Techie, your children
> don't seem to be affected by the redistricting
> looking at their ages (18 and 20)... So I'm not
> sure we should make this about that. I personally
> have vested interest in the future direction our
> district takes.
> I'm sure you all understand.


OMG - you have preschoolers! Wow, I agree, I think the redistricting should take that into effect. Forget the rising 9th graders, let's focus on the 4yr olds!

"You have to wonder why Fairfax County Public Schools would schedule three critical community meetings about redrawing boundary lines in November and December after an election."

Point of clarification: We were told that historically ALL boundary discussions happen in the Fall/Winter. I haven't seen anything to refute that. I also understand that having community meetings then allows parents to 1) prepare for them after summer when many don't pay attention, and 2) allows for decisions in time to implement them the following year. Did SoCo happen after an election such that the boundary process could have been seen as being manipulated? Just wondering.

And I can't believe anyone (ahem, with some confrontation-phile exceptions) would want these meetings BEFORE an election -- opening charges of flat-out politiking,influence-mongering, and perhaps the real need for riot police.

But I do agree with the Connection writer otherwise: Get involved in your community early and often and as a rule, and these things won't sneak up to haunt you (even boundary changes, which are, have been, and always will be. Amen.)

Old Timer

Are you trying to define who should be included in this discussion?

Are you shocked and upset HokieFan42 isn't an old geezer as yourself?

This redistricting garbage is affecting all of us...

We all have different motives for being involved.

So, basically, if you are starting to discriminate...

Lets keep the computer room shut down at Sunrise Living where you currently reside!

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Old Timer
>
> Are you trying to define who should be included in
> this discussion?
>
> Are you shocked and upset HokieFan42 isn't an old
> geezer as yourself?
>
> This redistricting garbage is affecting all of
> us...
>
> We all have different motives for being involved.
>
>
> So, basically, if you are starting to
> discriminate...
>
> Lets keep the computer room shut down at Sunrise
> Living where you currently reside!

You have no clue how old I am, how old my children are, or where I live. You've made some assumptions about me haven't you? Had you been on this thread a month ago, you would have known something about me.

Hokie Fan has what, a four year old? Who knows what's going to happen in the next 10 YEARS! Let's focus on the more immediate needs of the community, shall we?

I howled about the wrist awareness bracelet-what a great stocking stuffer!

I have a great idea for Dec 7th-rather than swapping shoes or whatever stupid idea they have-why not study Pearl Harbor Day! Most of these kids don't know a darn thing about history anyway-why not squeeze in some educational time?

Anyone hearing the showdown between Stu and Arakelian?

I hear that many are asking for his resignation after he violated the privacy of her kid. It is so vintage FCPS how they handled the complaint.

Lee Parent Wrote:

>
> Anyone hearing the showdown between Stu and
> Arakelian?
>
> I hear that many are asking for his resignation
> after he violated the privacy of her kid. It is
> so vintage FCPS how they handled the complaint.


What happened? This is the first I've heard of it.

Stuart Gibson in July 2007 sent letters to PTAs in Hunter Mill District and also spoke with a reporter with The FC Times about Akakelian's son who has some sort of disability. She filed a complaint against him and FCPS stating that it was a privacy violation under IDEA. Of course the imbeciles in Dale's office, rather than admitting fault, backed Stu saying he did not violate IDEA.

Well, the state DOE, in their letter of finding, stated that he and as a FCPS SB member, DID in fact violate the child's privacy. What a jerk. We try to teach our kids to step up and take responsibility when they make mistakes, but look at our leaders. It is pathetic.

For those who thought the site was hacked by a South Lakes student/parent, I am posting a notice from Cary, this site's administrator that is up on the homepage:

Statement on the recent downtime
Posted by: Cary (IP Logged)
Date: November 29, 2007 05:16PM

This website was unavailable for several hours the past two nights (11/27 and 11/28).

The interruption was caused by another service running on the same server that suddenly became extremely popular. The popularity spiked the load on the server to the point that this forum's software was no longer able to communicate with the backend database.

A server failing just as things become popular is unacceptable and as such the server will be replaced with one that can handle the load. There will be additional downtime either Friday or Saturday night between midnight and 6am for this site to be transitioned to the new server.

If you have any questions please ask them in this thread or email me at cary@fairfaxunderground.com.

Thanks and enjoy!

- Cary (the admin)

Interesting article in the Vienna/Oakton Connection about the Town of Vienna's approach to Gang activity.

http://connectionnewspapers.com/article.asp?article=90741&paper=73&cat=104

FTA: "Gangs are a regional problem; gang members don't have to live in a jurisdiction to cross into it. "I think there is some gang activity in Vienna, but it is not related to criminal events."

Note: All jurisdictions in Northern Virginia have to be aware of the problem of gang activity.

SubmissiveWiiRNot...based on my experience....recommend not discussing the hacking or lack there of......

Back to redistricting.....

Hey, I'm a south lakes student, and I'm not going to stoop down and throw insults, and I'm not going to try to use statistics which really hold no weight, but I will say that South Lakes is a good school, and if you'd open your mind a little, maybe take a tour of the school or sit in on classes (I don't know if that's possible... I'm sure it could be arranged, if you're curious enough to try and make sense of these things) you'd see that for yourself. I have NEVER, NEVER felt any presence of gangs or gang related violence, nor have I felt in danger during my entire time at south lakes (I'm a junior). I can safely say that we are pretty much a big family, and the only downside of redistricting, in my opinion, would be the possibility of diluting the tight-knittedness of our school. I believe school is essentially what you make of it (obviously making the assumption that you are at a reasonably well equipped and safe... yes South Lakes is safe) And if you have a reasonably intelligent, driven child, with your support as parents, they will get the same SAT score they would've gotten at Oakton, or Westfield, or wherever. Do not even attempt to refute the effectiveness of the IB program, or its application in South Lakes, because I, being on course to the diploma, can assure you of its intenseness and virtue. The only possible way your child could miss out on a good education due to redistricting would be a bad attitude inherited from you after this fiasco, or their inability to keep up in IB, where they could've in AP. Unless you think AP is harder... but We've had students go to Princeton with the diploma. Just my two cents, as a witness to the horror that South Lakes represents to so many of you.

-Sam, average South Lakes student...

Hello everyone-

I honestly just have to say that this is the most insulting, hurtful "blog" I have ever seen. I go to South Lakes and it is a really great school. The diversity is great- especially as preparation for the real world. In the about year and a half that I have been at SL so far, I have yet to run into any problems involving drugs, gangs, and the like. I am sure that I will never have to experience anything like this, because SL is a friendly, safe environment. Not only is it safe, everyone at South Lakes meshes together and gets a long great. As far as education goes, I can guarantee everyone that with the IB program you learn so much more than with AP- not only do you have to learn and master the information, you are required to demonstrate how to use and apply it to real life situations. I believe that this is one of the most beneficial things that IB has to offer. Also, if a child were following the "AP Path," his or her educational outcome would not be different--if you take IB classes you are still fully eligible to test out with AP! That being said, from IB you gain not only the so desired college credits, but valuable, advantageous life skills as well.
Finally, I have to ask: do those opposed to redistricting really believe that our parents, of SLHS, would really send their children to an unsafe, insecure, gang residing, drug savvy school? That is a truly hurtful thought, not only for me, but for my parents, and the parents of other South Lakes students.

Just think about that, it would mean a lot.

HatesBirds123 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hello everyone-
>
> I honestly just have to say that this is the most
> insulting, hurtful "blog" I have ever seen. I go
> to South Lakes and it is a really great school.
> The diversity is great- especially as preparation
> for the real world. In the about year and a half
> that I have been at SL so far, I have yet to run
> into any problems involving drugs, gangs, and the
> like. I am sure that I will never have to
> experience anything like this, because SL is a
> friendly, safe environment. Not only is it safe,
> everyone at South Lakes meshes together and gets a
> long great. As far as education goes, I can
> guarantee everyone that with the IB program you
> learn so much more than with AP- not only do you
> have to learn and master the information, you are
> required to demonstrate how to use and apply it to
> real life situations. I believe that this is one
> of the most beneficial things that IB has to
> offer. Also, if a child were following the "AP
> Path," his or her educational outcome would not be
> different--if you take IB classes you are still
> fully eligible to test out with AP! That being
> said, from IB you gain not only the so desired
> college credits, but valuable, advantageous life
> skills as well.
> Finally, I have to ask: do those opposed to
> redistricting really believe that our parents, of
> SLHS, would really send their children to an
> unsafe, insecure, gang residing, drug savvy
> school? That is a truly hurtful thought, not only
> for me, but for my parents, and the parents of
> other South Lakes students.
>
> Just think about that, it would mean a lot.
===========================================================
Very well put.
GO SLHS!!!

Erjon08 wrote:

"hahahha Birdlover you amaze me because personally, I think a person that does not give their name is a coward. The point is that you parents still haven't grown up yet. You Oakton parents are great role models for your kids. The way you tell them to be rascist is just wonderful........... As one person told parents, "Watch your children. Talk to your children. Don't assume that you know them." In other words, you be careful about your kids instead of our school. ...... Thank you and please at least pretend to GROW UP."

___________________________________________

Erjon,

A person posting his real name is either an idiot or a child who is not supervised.

You'd hate to have me as your mother, because:

1. There would be no internet in your bedroom. Your access to the kitchen computer would be strictly monitored and limited. Also, I would be able to check every key stroke you made.

2. There would be no T.V. during the school week; neither would you be playing on iPods, Xbox 360, Wii, PS3, etc.

3. You wouldn't get your license when your turned 16, because that is too young. You'd be lucky to be diving anything before at least 17. No cell phones until you are driving, and even then, no text messaging, camera, or internet access on that phone.

4. You wouldn't be hanging at anyone's house unless I checked out the place first. No mother there, no Erjon there. You would have chores at home and you would also volunteer your services to older neighbors who needed help, an animal shelter, etc.

5. And, I would be on you like white on rice.

6. Because, you are entitled to nothing, except that I take good care of you and that, I would do.

BirdLover Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> ___________________________________________
>
> Erjon,
>
> A person posting his real name is either an idiot
> or a child who is not supervised.
>
> You'd hate to have me as your mother, because:
>
> 1. There would be no internet in your bedroom.
> Your access to the kitchen computer would be
> strictly monitored and limited. Also, I would be
> able to check every key stroke you made.
>
> 2. There would be no T.V. during the school week;
> neither would you be playing on iPods, Xbox 360,
> Wii, PS3, etc.
>
> 3. You wouldn't get your license when your turned
> 16, because that is too young. You'd be lucky to
> be diving anything before at least 17. No cell
> phones until you are driving, and even then, no
> text messaging, camera, or internet access on that
> phone.
>
> 4. You wouldn't be hanging at anyone's house
> unless I checked out the place first. No mother
> there, no Erjon there. You would have chores at
> home and you would also volunteer your services to
> older neighbors who needed help, an animal
> shelter, etc.
>
> 5. And, I would be on you like white on rice.
>
> 6. Because, you are entitled to nothing, except
> that I take good care of you and that, I would do.


Watch out birdlover its parents like you that push their kids to the brink.

Sam Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey, I'm a south lakes student, and I'm not going
> to stoop down and throw insults, and I'm not going
> to try to use statistics which really hold no
> weight, but I will say that South Lakes is a good
> school,

I've seen many posts from SL students defending their school, which is a shame, since they shouldn't have to come here and do this. However, I've also seen very little information from the same group expounding on the reasons why SL must have more students in order to operate effectively. There should be a hardcore reason(s) why SL requires more students in order to effectively meet desired standards (which should be very high) for an FCPS high school. I would like to ask this group if they could elaborate on what forseeable problems SL will encounter if more students are not added. I am not saying there aren't any, but I find the lack of commentary on what the real need is a little confusing. I believe it is very tough to justify asking people to redistrict when serious rationale for a problem that must be fixed has not been addressed in detail. And again, the key to my question is answering why more students must be added for SL to operate effectively for the forseeable future. If there is not a problem, then I don't understand asking people to redistrict simply for the sake of having more students, addressing diversity issues if applicable, or some inefficiencies in the use of space (which are the three main reasons I have heard so far - are those the only reasons)?

Thanks and hope this didnt come across too obnoxiously - its not intended that way.

Some might think that the Connection opinion piece is saying that our school board doesn't care what the public wants and ignoring them through the scheduling of these meetings.

B-I-N-G-O

The notes from the fist meeting demonstrate how little they care about what the public wants since they chose to ignore the most requested desires of the people.

chillout,

Quite the contrary.

Too many of our kids are raising themselves. They are the ones more likely to jump off the ledge.

BirdLover Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Erjon08 wrote:
>
> "hahahha Birdlover you amaze me because
> personally, I think a person that does not give
> their name is a coward. The point is that you
> parents still haven't grown up yet. You Oakton
> parents are great role models for your kids. The
> way you tell them to be rascist is just
> wonderful........... As one person told parents,
> "Watch your children. Talk to your children. Don't
> assume that you know them." In other words, you be
> careful about your kids instead of our school.
> ...... Thank you and please at least pretend to
> GROW UP."
>
> ___________________________________________
>
> Erjon,
>
> A person posting his real name is either an idiot
> or a child who is not supervised.
>
> You'd hate to have me as your mother, because:
>
> 1. There would be no internet in your bedroom.
> Your access to the kitchen computer would be
> strictly monitored and limited. Also, I would be
> able to check every key stroke you made.
>
> 2. There would be no T.V. during the school week;
> neither would you be playing on iPods, Xbox 360,
> Wii, PS3, etc.
>
> 3. You wouldn't get your license when your turned
> 16, because that is too young. You'd be lucky to
> be diving anything before at least 17. No cell
> phones until you are driving, and even then, no
> text messaging, camera, or internet access on that
> phone.
>
> 4. You wouldn't be hanging at anyone's house
> unless I checked out the place first. No mother
> there, no Erjon there. You would have chores at
> home and you would also volunteer your services to
> older neighbors who needed help, an animal
> shelter, etc.
>
> 5. And, I would be on you like white on rice.
>
> 6. Because, you are entitled to nothing, except
> that I take good care of you and that, I would do.
================================================================
Its parents like you that drive their kids to be over rebellious, possibly drug using, emo self cutting teens. Calm down, i really hope you aren't that way to your kids. If you are i feel so bad.

>>>We were told that historically ALL boundary discussions happen in the Fall/Winter<<<

In the past they were held the end of September and October. There were NO community meetings within weeks of Christmas! Everything was pushed back this year, so that no discussions would be conducted before the election. Heaven forbid the public know what they were planning before re electing the democrats.

So how about it South Lakes students...

How would your High School experience improve if we gave you our kids?

Not a trick question...help us understand.

>>>>Stuart Gibson in July 2007 sent letters to PTAs in Hunter Mill District and also spoke with a reporter with The FC Times about Akakelian's son who has some sort of disability. She filed a complaint against him and FCPS stating that it was a privacy violation under IDEA. Of course the imbeciles in Dale's office, rather than admitting fault, backed Stu saying he did not violate IDEA.

Well, the state DOE, in their letter of finding, stated that he and as a FCPS SB member, DID in fact violate the child's privacy. What a jerk. We try to teach our kids to step up and take responsibility when they make mistakes, but look at our leaders. It is pathetic.<<<

Yes, Stu Gibson was found to have violated the law during the campaign. He violated the privacy of an 8 year old child. The state ruled against him in every instance. Is that someone we want on the school board? Stu's a lawyer, he should have known better but he did it, not just once, but again and again, even after he was told to stop. What the heck kind of example is he? A lawyer, violating a child's privacy AND breaking the law, ALL for political gain and to hurt the child's mother. He should be ashamed of himself.

What kind of protection do our children have with people like him on the school board?

Erjon,
Are you saying that is your REAL name? You'll have to pardon us if we don't believe you.

>>>Too many of our kids are raising themselves. They are the ones more likely to jump off the ledge.<<<

Or their gangs are likely to PUSH them off the ledge.

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So how about it South Lakes students...
>
> How would your High School experience improve if
> we gave you our kids?
>
> Not a trick question...help us understand.
=======================================================
Our (or their, im a SL senior) expirence would improve with the fact that we would gain new friends and meet new people. with that in mind our already great learning enviornment would improve tenfold. Friends are an important part of the high school expirence, they drive and motivate us to do better ourselves.
The fact that SL has a GREAT! acidemic background only makes it so much better.

I have a feeling that answering this question isn't going to help us or this topic get anywhere, i'm just saying what i feel. <@~

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Erjon,
> Are you saying that is your REAL name? You'll
> have to pardon us if we don't believe you.
=======================================================

Excuse me Neen.
but last i checked, people with different ethnic backgrounds tend to have DIFFERENT names!
I know erjon personally, he happens to be one of my good friends.
He is supposed to be a junior, but because SL has allowed him to excel ABOVE & BEYOND, he has been allowed to graduate with this 2008 senior class.

JaZZy Jeff Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> VaDriver Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > So how about it South Lakes students...
> >
> > How would your High School experience improve
> if
> > we gave you our kids?
> >
> > Not a trick question...help us understand.
> ==================================================
> =====
> Our (or their, im a SL senior) expirence would
> improve with the fact that we would gain new
> friends and meet new people. with that in mind our
> already great learning enviornment would improve
> tenfold. Friends are an important part of the high
> school expirence, they drive and motivate us to do
> better ourselves.
> The fact that SL has a GREAT! acidemic background
> only makes it so much better.
>
> I have a feeling that answering this question
> isn't going to help us or this topic get anywhere,
> i'm just saying what i feel. <@~
__________________________________________________________________________
Your answer is fine, Jeff. But, since your fist response involves gaining new friends and meeting new people, I hope you can understand that might not be a strong justification for turning our families lives upside down???

Anything else...and Jeff, you have sounded like a fine guy in previous posts, although, I don't think you really meant what you said to Birdlover. Having a Mom who really cares about you is a good thing... ...but anyway......

Any other points you'd care to make...many of us are headed to Monday's meeting and simply haven't heard convincing reasons re: benefit to you and your South Lakes friends.

mike Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would
> like to ask this group if they could elaborate on
> what forseeable problems SL will encounter if more
> students are not added. I am not saying there
> aren't any, but I find the lack of commentary on
> what the real need is a little confusing. I
> believe it is very tough to justify asking people
> to redistrict when serious rationale for a problem
> that must be fixed has not been addressed in
> detail. And again, the key to my question is
> answering why more students must be added for SL
> to operate effectively for the forseeable future.
> If there is not a problem, then I don't understand
> asking people to redistrict simply for the sake of
> having more students, addressing diversity issues
> if applicable, or some inefficiencies in the use
> of space (which are the three main reasons I have
> heard so far - are those the only reasons)?
>
> Thanks and hope this didnt come across too
> obnoxiously - its not intended that way.

This question has been answered by many postings on earlier posting. I'll try to summarize.

700 more kids get SL 12 more teachers and about 72 more class sections, i.e. extra classes of latin or japanese, and can get AP/IB HL Calculus BC, economics, marketing, advanced accounting, etc. Classes that other FFX high schools have.

County-wide Free and Reduced Lunch (FRL) is 20%. SL is 33%. FRL is used as a surrogate for poverty. FRL kids coming from deprive homes, frequently but not always, need extra remeidal help to achieve the cognitive development needed to be contributing members of our society.

Its unfair to the FRL kids at SL and the other kids for the limited number of teachers at SL to have to meet the higher needs of this disporportionate share of FRL.

For example, Langley has only 1% FRL. Oakton Chantilly and Westfield are all at 11%. Herndon 18%.

Hope that helps

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So how about it South Lakes students...
>
> How would your High School experience improve if
> we gave you our kids?
>
> Not a trick question...help us understand.

It's also not irrelevant that their teams would be more competitive with a large student body to draw from. Though that is not the most important reason.

BirdLover Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> chillout,
>
> Quite the contrary.
>
> Too many of our kids are raising themselves. They
> are the ones more likely to jump off the ledge.

That may be true but I've seen it happen all too many a time with children whose parents set rules like the ones you've just described. Not only drugs and alcohol but also eating disorders.

Hello Thomas...

> Its unfair to the FRL kids at SL and the other kids for the limited number of teachers at SL to have to meet the higher needs of this disporportionate share of FRL.

Adding more students does not reduce the needs of the poor performers, it just reduces the percentage. You still have the same students, if not a few more. If as suggested, the new teacher resources are used to open up high-end classes offered at other schools, I fail to see how this helps them as well.

Thomas,
There is nothing to prevent the school board from giving SL more teachers, more courses, and more classes, without adding another student.

This is all moot since the school board is obviously going to choose, options #1, #2, #3 or #4.

My odds:
Option #1, 65%
Option #2, 20%
Option #3, 35%
Option #4, 15%

Yes, they do not add up to 100%. No reason they have to.

Sorry Chillout, that's a myth. If it weren't, most of our Asian students would be druggies and drinkers. They aren't.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 700 more kids get SL 12 more teachers and about 72
> more class sections, i.e. extra classes of latin
> or japanese, and can get AP/IB HL Calculus BC,
> economics, marketing, advanced accounting, etc.
> Classes that other FFX high schools have.
>
> County-wide Free and Reduced Lunch (FRL) is 20%.
> SL is 33%. FRL is used as a surrogate for
> poverty. FRL kids coming from deprive homes,
> frequently but not always, need extra remeidal
> help to achieve the cognitive development needed
> to be contributing members of our society.
>
> Its unfair to the FRL kids at SL and the other
> kids for the limited number of teachers at SL to
> have to meet the higher needs of this
> disporportionate share of FRL.
>
> For example, Langley has only 1% FRL. Oakton
> Chantilly and Westfield are all at 11%. Herndon
> 18%.
>
> Hope that helps


Honestly, I still don't understand the logic. If 700 kids helps gain SL 12 teachers, are you assuming that those 12 teachers are going to donate their time after hours to assist remedial students? How is this going to benefit the 700 students being moved? It kind of falls in line with my previous point that if all the emphasis is put on helping those at the remedial level without staffing up specifically for that purpose, the other 700 children are not going to benefit. In fact, THEY will be left behind.

"Its parents like you that drive their kids to be over rebellious, possibly drug using, emo self cutting teens. Calm down, i really hope you aren't that way to your kids. If you are i feel so bad."

Jazzy,

Do you know kids who are cutting themselves? That's sad.

Jazzy, so you think being prevented from playing with gadgets on a school night is child abuse? Do you think a mother, checking up on that party you say you are going to, is abusive? Do you think limiting a child's access to the internet, cell phone, car... is abusive?

Well then, you'll really hate this. When my kids were younger, I cancelled cable T.V. Why? Because most of it's junk. I also removed cordless phones and installed an old fashioned corded phone in the kitchen. Why? So, I could correct my kids' phone manners.

Jazzy, it's a tough job.

It's often too late to help those kids in high school. They should be educated much earlier, at Dogwood, Teraset and McNair. The school board could force those schools to educate those kids, but they won't. Other parts of FCPS educate low income kids, why not Reston? Because Stu won't do anything about it. These kids wouldn't have the problems that they have at South Lakes if they were being educated in their elementary schools.

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> __________________________________________________
> ________________________
> Your answer is fine, Jeff. But, since your fist
> response involves gaining new friends and meeting
> new people, I hope you can understand that might
> not be a strong justification for turning our
> families lives upside down???
>
> Anything else...and Jeff, you have sounded like a
> fine guy in previous posts, although, I don't
> think you really meant what you said to Birdlover.
> Having a Mom who really cares about you is a good
> thing... ...but anyway......
>
> Any other points you'd care to make...many of us
> are headed to Monday's meeting and simply haven't
> heard convincing reasons re: benefit to you and
> your South Lakes friends.
======================================================

Having your child attend SL isn't going to turn any families lives upside down. Its a good school that constantly gets discredited for no real reason at all.
> Yes i think what said to Birdlover was out of slight rage and I do withdraw that comment.
Me and several of my peers are planning on attending the meeting and we will sure bring with us a valid agrument.

Birdlover,
I know a mom worse than you! She won't let her kids have IM or cell phones and they've never had a television in their home, EVER. Computer use only in the kitchen. Ditto phone. The children don't drive until senior year. Yet the kids are doing fabulously well with the oldest accepted to Harvard, Princeton, and MIT. They are happy and healthy, nice and polite too. How 'bout that?!

Jeff,
You guys should do a little dance routine for the crowd on Monday night, something supporting SL. That would be fun!

BirdLover Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Its parents like you that drive their kids to be
> over rebellious, possibly drug using, emo self
> cutting teens. Calm down, i really hope you aren't
> that way to your kids. If you are i feel so bad."
>
> Jazzy,
>
> Do you know kids who are cutting themselves?
> That's sad.
>
> Jazzy, so you think being prevented from playing
> with gadgets on a school night is child abuse? Do
> you think a mother, checking up on that party you
> say you are going to, is abusive? Do you think
> limiting a child's access to the internet, cell
> phone, car... is abusive?
>
> Well then, you'll really hate this. When my kids
> were younger, I cancelled cable T.V. Why? Because
> most of it's junk. I also removed cordless phones
> and installed an old fashioned corded phone in the
> kitchen. Why? So, I could correct my kids' phone
> manners.
>
> Jazzy, it's a tough job.

============================================================

Birdlover,
as i mentioned before i said that comment in a minor fit of rage and i do apologize, and withdrawl that comment.
i am not yet a parent so i can't pretend i know what it's like.
I just feel that it was a little overboard but again im not a parent.
and to answer your question; yes sadly i do personally know kids that cut themselves, and its a very painfull act to witness.

again i apologize for critisizing your parenting as it was none of my concern.

JJ - No, it's not for no reason at all.

Families that are being asked to transfer to South Lakes are looking at the ratings and test scores of the schools. SL does not compare favorably to other schools in the study when you look at the information posted on the FCPS website, GreatSchools, SchoolDigger, etc. There are valid reasons for concern.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> This question has been answered by many postings
> on earlier posting. I'll try to summarize.
>
> 700 more kids get SL 12 more teachers and about 72
> more class sections, i.e. extra classes of latin
> or japanese, and can get AP/IB HL Calculus BC,
> economics, marketing, advanced accounting, etc.
> Classes that other FFX high schools have.
>
> County-wide Free and Reduced Lunch (FRL) is 20%.
> SL is 33%. FRL is used as a surrogate for
> poverty. FRL kids coming from deprive homes,
> frequently but not always, need extra remeidal
> help to achieve the cognitive development needed
> to be contributing members of our society.
>
> Its unfair to the FRL kids at SL and the other
> kids for the limited number of teachers at SL to
> have to meet the higher needs of this
> disporportionate share of FRL.
>
> For example, Langley has only 1% FRL. Oakton
> Chantilly and Westfield are all at 11%. Herndon
> 18%.
>
> Hope that helps

Exactly. More people means more resources. Resources that we deserve to have, all around. At an over-enrolled school, I'm sure that certain classes fill up... resulting in some students not being able to take a specific course. At SL, more students would mean more class options (more electives, higher level classes, etc). This benefits both sides!

Also, higher numbers would mean healthy competition for sports teams, music and theatre parts, etc.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jeff,
> You guys should do a little dance routine for the
> crowd on Monday night, something supporting SL.
> That would be fun!

======================================================

I'm not sure if any of my other team mates are attending but i will deffinatly strive for them to come and dance. i agree it would be fun.

but if not i can always bring my own music =D

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> JJ - No, it's not for no reason at all.
>
> Families that are being asked to transfer to South
> Lakes are looking at the ratings and test scores
> of the schools. SL does not compare favorably to
> other schools in the study when you look at the
> information posted on the FCPS website,
> GreatSchools, SchoolDigger, etc. There are valid
> reasons for concern.

========================================================

ok,
But if you feel that that is the case and you feel that your children are bright, then having them attend SL would possibly boost these test scores and such, the teaching staff at south lakes is very wounerful so why scores are down im not sure, but SL really is a good school.

Jeffy,
The reason parents tend to discount what the kids say is because we all expect a student to like their school and say good things about it. If a student hated his school, chances are he wouldn't be there and he certainly wouldn't be on this forum. The fact that there are happy kids at South Lakes is not really relevant to parents. Every high school has happy students, or at least some happy ones.

People don't want their children used to boost scores, or football teams, or to cover up the education that the poor kids in Reston didn't get prior to high school. They want their kids to attend the schools that they chose for them when they moved into their neighborhoods.

The reason that scores are down at South Lakes is because they don't have enough kids who were well educated in Reston Schools prior to high school. Good teachers can only do so much if the students don't have the background they should have.

That does NOT mean that people from other areas should be forced to go to South Lakes to cover up for those students who aren't being educated before high school. The problem is something that Stu Gibson and staff need to address, and fix.

Only TJ, Oakton, and Langley are ranked in the top 100 schools:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/29/AR2007112902004.html?nav=hcmodule

No wonder Oakton parents don't want to leave!

JJ - I hear you, my feeling is SL is both a good and bad school at the same time. As you guys say, you have a real diverse mix. Depends on what you look at SAT scores which college bound kids take, or SOL scores which everyone takes.

Families asked to transfer are being asked to go from a higher rated school to a lower rated school. I do understand the ratings will change over time, but that is the reality today. These families are being asked to take a leap of faith.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> JJ - No, it's not for no reason at all.
>
> Families that are being asked to transfer to South
> Lakes are looking at the ratings and test scores
> of the schools. SL does not compare favorably to
> other schools in the study when you look at the
> information posted on the FCPS website,
> GreatSchools, SchoolDigger, etc. There are valid
> reasons for concern.

Word, many people on this forum have suggested that parents on this board not compare the aggregate scores for South Lakes against schools that have a much lower rate of FRL, like Oakton. If you were to compare the SAT and SOL scores of middle class kids at SL with those of middle class kids at Oakton, I think you would find that they are equal. Who knows, if you look, perhaps you will find that the South Lakes scores may be higher.

What if all of the schools in the western Boundary study area were equalized in such a way that they all equally bore the burden of educating children from disadvantaged families? What if each school had say, 15% of students on FRL? What would be the harm in that? Each school is touted as wonderful by the parents posting here, so would each school not be able to do a great job with all of their students?

And parents, please don't ask the students to explain policy reasons for convincing you that redistricting is necessary. That is not really their responsibility or their place. Adults on this site have spent much time going over the facts. You might want to read back through some of their posts. The fact that you have chosen to ignore them says a lot about your mindset regarding the issue.

At the public meetings it would be great if you'd wear black, chant "moratorium," chant "turn SL into a magnet," or whatever form of protest it is that you are planning to do. Meanwhile, we South Lakes parents will be answering the questions asked by the school board, and making suggestions about each scenario and our voices will be the ones being heard.

Jazzy,

Apology accepted.

You mentioned yesterday that you hoped for a career in the arts... entertaining.

Just to give you the tiniest bit of background about myself, since it's late and no one is listening.

My first degree was in Music. From the age of 7 until 22, I practiced, practiced, practiced. Was on stage after stage, playing, competing... a complete nervous wreck.... until, I started to play... then I was lost in the music. I also loved the theatre and was very involved in the drama departments, both in H.S. and college. Loved it, still do.

I wish you good luck with your dancing, but be careful. The creative mind, although, a wonderful asset, can at times, work against you. Then, with all the other creative minds bumping into yours..... WOW, is all I can say.
It's wonderful, but.....do I have stories. Ofcourse, I was also living in Manhattan, so, there are always stories.

Hey, are we still entertaining the troops Monday night?

Dear Neen, or is it Jeanine, why don't you ask one of your Vienna schools to take on a large group of under-privileged kids from one of the Reston schools and let's see how well they do at educating them? Since you chose to live in Vienna, which has an extremely low percentage of FRL kids, you've really never walked a mile in the shoes of the teachers dealing with real poverty. And what kind of power do you think Stu Gibson has, anyway? School Board Representative is a part time low paying gig. Stu's predecessor did nothing for the poor kids in Reston. In fact, he hurt them when he allowed several middle class neighborhoods to be redistricted elsewhere.

Please spare us your Mother Theresa routine. You have spent all of your time volunteering on the Gifted & Talented Committee and working with those students who least need help.

One last thing. You deride Stuart Gibson for violating the privacy of a child, yet two days ago you identified one of the students posting here by his real first name, and let everyone know that he was a GT kid. It would not be difficult for anyone to now determine his identity. So please get off your sanctimonious high horse and ride out of town.

The school board is going to ask us questions?! That would be awesome.

The School board doesn't care what anyone says at any meeting. It was decided last summer who will go to South Lakes when Stu, Janie, and Kathy made their deals.

Option #1. STick a fork in it, it's done.

BirdLover Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jazzy,
>
> Apology accepted.
>
> You mentioned yesterday that you hoped for a
> career in the arts... entertaining.
>
> Just to give you the tiniest bit of background
> about myself, since it's late and no one is
> listening.
>
> My first degree was in Music. From the age of 7
> until 22, I practiced, practiced, practiced. Was
> on stage after stage, playing, competing... a
> complete nervous wreck.... until, I started to
> play... then I was lost in the music. I also loved
> the theatre and was very involved in the drama
> departments, both in H.S. and college. Loved it,
> still do.
>
> I wish you good luck with your dancing, but be
> careful. The creative mind, although, a wonderful
> asset, can at times, work against you. Then, with
> all the other creative minds bumping into
> yours..... WOW, is all I can say.
> It's wonderful, but.....do I have stories.
> Ofcourse, I was also living in Manhattan, so,
> there are always stories.
>
> Hey, are we still entertaining the troops Monday
> night?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Thanks,
I had i long talk with my coach who i've known since i was in third grade, she said she can see it in my eyes that i love to perform, and to keep it up. I love making people smile, so i won't quit and i won't and i won't back down from my dream!!

and i hope to bring on some entertainment. i just need a ride there =D

Sub..not...

> What if all of the schools in the western Boundary study area were equalized in such a way that they all equally bore the burden of educating children from disadvantaged families? What if each school had say, 15% of students on FRL? What would be the harm in that? - pollycrappola

Deal with reality. What you are saying is, "what if we made Dogwood (eg) an Attendance Island and bussed them to another school". My take is Dogwood parents want their kids to go to SL.

Some areas of the county have higher percentages of low income families than others. It's a fact. I am all for providing resources/teachers/ESOL help for those schools that neeed it.

Smoothing over the problems with high achievers to reduce percentages only masks the problems.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hello Thomas...
>
> Adding more students does not reduce the needs of
> the poor performers, it just reduces the
> percentage. You still have the same students, if
> not a few more. If as suggested, the new teacher
> resources are used to open up high-end classes
> offered at other schools, I fail to see how this
> helps them as well.

Some of the 12 teachers and 72 class slots will go to broader class selection and some will go to more special ed. teachers. E.g. many remedial students get help by having classes that are team taught, a non-special ed teacher math and a special ed teacher also qualified in math who teaches IB/AP Calculus one period and team teaches a lower level math another.

Does that help explain it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2007 12:56AM by Thomas More.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thomas,
> There is nothing to prevent the school board from
> giving SL more teachers, more courses, and more
> classes, without adding another student.

You know better. Teacher student ratios are set by the state and the budget. Diviating from those is very difficult.

>
> This is all moot since the school board is
> obviously going to choose, options #1, #2, #3 or
> #4.
>
> My odds:
> Option #1, 65%
> Option #2, 20%
> Option #3, 35%
> Option #4, 15%
>
> Yes, they do not add up to 100%. No reason they
> have to.

Betting in Va is illegal.;-)

FME Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Honestly, I still don't understand the logic. If
> 700 kids helps gain SL 12 teachers, are you
> assuming that those 12 teachers are going to
> donate their time after hours to assist remedial
> students? How is this going to benefit the 700
> students being moved? It kind of falls in line
> with my previous point that if all the emphasis is
> put on helping those at the remedial level without
> staffing up specifically for that purpose, the
> other 700 children are not going to benefit. In
> fact, THEY will be left behind.

Read my response to word. If it's still not clear, then I'll try again if you really want to understand. If you don't want to understand, I won't waste my time.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2007 12:52AM by Thomas More.

To HatesBirds123:

How could you possible hate birds?

They're so pretty and smart. Most mate for life. Their songs are beautiful....and, at times, haunting, like the Owl, searching for a mate under the autumn moon.

I've raised tiny 2 day old birds to adult-hood. It's an experience you wouldn't believe. These little birds, which you are feeding every 20 minutes, eventually start to hop around, following you, wherever you go. Then, they start flying ... bringing you back little gifts, a tiny pebble, etc.

Hey, wait a second, I just got it. You hate me.
I think I'm relieved.

Thomas... explain 700 students / 12 teachers = about 58 per class... something is wrong

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thomas... explain 700 students / 12 teachers =
> about 58 per class... something is wrong

They teach 6 classes per day, not 1.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2007 12:59AM by Thomas More.

Good night, padre, good night, neen, good night, lee parent, good night, jazzy, good night, fme mom, good night, bird haters, everywhere, good night, all diverse people ... goodnight, Moon.


Hey, Padre, why the hell did you give me that second margarita.... or, was it the third?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2007 10:38AM by BirdLover.

Fed Up,
I bet you are fed up! Things haven't been going your way lately, have they?

You obviously have no clue who I am, but thanks for playing along anyway.

What power does Stu Gibson have? He's on the school board! They are responsible for running the schools! He has ALL the power! If he doesn't have power over schools, who do you think does?

Schools in inner city Richmond can post higher scores for poor blacks than Dogwood! So do schools in Newport News! Those districts are much more disadvantaged than Reston schools, yet they do better. They spend half what FCPS spends per pupil. Right here in our own county, Weyanoke does better, so does Annanndale Terrace, Lynbrook,Graham Road, Glenn Forest, Groveton, Mount Eagle, and Parklawn, ALL with lower demographics than Dogwood, Lake Anne, and McNair. Yet ALL those schools perform better than those Reston schools. Why don't you explain to us why that is? Why don't you ask yourself what those teachers and principals know that teachers and principals in your district don't know? Why haven't you asked yourself how things can be changed in Reston schools so that Reston schools can move up from the very bottom. Why don't you ask their school board reps how they do it with worse demographics than Dogwood, Lake Anne, and McNair? You KNOW the answer. You KNOW how Richmond does it. You KNOW how Graham Road does it. Yet the political ideology that you are so wedded to, prevents it from being done in Reston. You care more about ideology than educating poor minority kids in Dogwood, McNair, Lake Anne, and Terraset. Surely after 12 years in office, Stu Gibson has some clue why his schools aren't doing as well as other schools with more minorities and higher poverty rates. Reston schools continue to fail, not because of the test, but because Stu Gibson has done nothing to stop the failing. Throwing out NCLB will hide the failings, but that won't help the children in Reston.

UNLESS you are saying that even the best teacher can't teach low income students in Reston to read and do math and prepare them for high school. Surely you aren't saying that. It would be saying that poor kids in Reston aren't educable like poor students in Richmond, Chesterfield, South Side, Tidewater, and locally at Glen Forest, Annanndale Terrace, Parklawn, Graham Road and all the other FCPS schools. I don't think you want to claim that Reston school students are somehow 'different' than all those other schools.

Yes, I believe that EVERY child in FCPS has the right to an appropriate education, in an appropriate setting with his peers. ALL kids, including those on the bottom, those in the middle, and yes, even those on the top. But that hardly makes me Mother Theresa! But thanks anyway. lol

Are you saying that me calling a poster here by the name he uses here is comparable to Stu Gibson violating a LAW by repeatedly violating a child's right to privacy? Stu using information about a child, information that he got because he's a SCHOOL BOARD MEMBER, and giving that information to several PTA's in a letter and then giving it to the press, several times, is comparable to me calling the poster known here as Warren, Warren? And guessing that he's GT, is the same as Stu going to the press, and telling them that his opponent's child is a special needs student? And using that information in hopes of discrediting your opponent in pursuit of a political office? That's the same as me calling Warren, by the name he uses here which is Warren? And calling him gifted? Hahahaha..........Not a great argument, counselor. And the state certainly disagreed with the arguments presented, didn't they?

BTW, how do you know that Warren is his real name? (You don't have to answser, we all know the answer.)

I have totally shocked by how fast this story has caught fire. Everyone seems to have heard that the state did an investigation and ruled against Stu on every single point. Christine Arakelian won on every single issue and Stu and the school board were found in violation on every single thing. Stu violated her son's right to privacy, and he KNEW he was in violation when he did it! He did it purposely, with the sole intent of winning an election. That's just wrong, wrong, wrong, as the state DOE has now told him and the school board. Now even the democrats in the county are concerned about Stu, particularly those in Hunter Mill. Even they think he's a liability.

So, go right ahead and support and defend someone who would knowingly use a child, knowingly violate the rights of a child, to win a political campaign for what even you describe as a "low paying, part time gig". You're going to be pretty lonely out there. One would think it would not be worth it to risk everything for such a 'gig". Most people, even those in the democratic party, don't want someone charged with protecting our children to knowingly violate a child's rights to privacy. Most people find it disgusting for someone like that to be in a position charged with PROTECTING our children, someone who puts his own need for political gain against a young child's rights.

If you have any doubts, pay attention on Monday night. You'll hear more than a few folks calling for Stu's resignation, and not because of redistricting, but because of what he knowingly did to a child for his own selfish gains. Be sure to continue to defend Stu. I'm sure that Stu will appreciate your efforts, even if no one else does. And be sure to let us know how that works out for you. ;)

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Only TJ, Oakton, and Langley are ranked in the top
> 100 schools:
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/artic
> le/2007/11/29/AR2007112902004.html?nav=hcmodule
>
> No wonder Oakton parents don't want to leave!


Actually all the schools in the study made the newsweek list -- totalling 1351 schools nationwide. Oakton ranked 103, Chantilly 133, Herndon 161, Westfield 179 and South Lakes 859.

Thomas More wrote:

"word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thomas... explain 700 students / 12 teachers =
> about 58 per class... something is wrong

They teach 6 classes per day, not 1."

But assuming 700 new students show up, they all need a teacher for each class period. If there are currently 1400 students bwing taught by 100 teachers at any given time (a 14:1 ratio), then with 2100 students they will need 150 teachers to maintain the same ratio, or 50 new teachers, presumably transferred from other schools who lose students, or equivalent moving around.

I think many people would have preferred to just add 12 teachers to South Lakes to increase the number of course offerings.

The school has not said what advanced courses would be offered; they say this decision will be made based on class signups (which seems a bit circular to me?) Most of the new teachers will be needed to cover required courses for the new students, since not all the students will want advanced classes.

This discussion is meant to be about redistricting, not South Lakes bashing. South Lakes is a very good school already. It offers programs that would be the envy of many other schools throughout the state and the nation.

South Lakes' test scores and class offerings are not as good as the surrounding schools, which is highly correlated with (and perhaps caused by) the presence of a lot of kids from less affluent backgrounds.

Some see this as a problem...I see it as what you'd expect,

Why's that?

- Reston was founded based on a set of principles, one of which is the variety of housing choices...principle #2 reads:

2. That it be possible for anyone to remain in a single neighborhood throughout his life, uprooting being neither inevitable nor always desirable. By providing the fullest range of housing styles and prices -- from high-rise efficiencies to 6-bedroom townhouses and detached houses -- housing needs can be met at a variety of income levels and at different stages of family life. This kind of mixture permits residents to remain rooted in the community if they so choose -- as their particular housing needs change. As a by-product, this also results in the heterogeneity that spells a lively and varied community.

However, this conscious decision to provide a variety of housing choices, in contrast to the neighborhoods around Reston, results in the more diverse student population of the school. This is not a bad thing...but in saying that, it is not then fair to say that South Lakes is somehow being shortchanged because it has "too many" students from low income households. It has the number commensurate with the choices made by the Reston community and its residents. There is no obligation on the part of the county or the surrounding communities to disperse or dilute these students into a larger community of people, including those who want to livee in the vicinity, but who chose not to be part of the Reston community (i.e. RHA, reston sports, etc).

- to the extent that a Reston school needs more students, they should come from Reston residents. This seems like a no-brainer to me.

- the whole process becomes very complex due to conflicting desires to minimize disruption for some communities (e.g. Langley), yet meet somewhat arbitrary goals for school population size and student body makeup. (By arbitrary, I mean it doesn't really make very much difference whether Chantilly has 2300 or 2600 kids. "It's 10% easier to make the school play" is not a reason to redistrict.)

- I believe the community is justified in calling out the School Board as not acting in good faith on this, in collusion with the school administration's quesionable competence. Neither has distinguished themselves in recent decisions to fund new capacity at Westfield only to decide not use it, to enhance Langley under the false pretense that there is no other place for these students to go, or to arbitrarily shuffle south county students.

Apparently the leadership of Fox Mill Elementary knows something the rest of us don't know... I just received the following e-mail:

_____________________________________________________________________________
Advanced Placement (AP) and International Baccalaureate AP and IB Information Night.

Faye Brenner, FCPS Advanced Academic Program specialist, will provide information on the high school Advanced Placement (AP) and International Baccalaureate (IB) programs on Monday, December 10, 2007, 7:00 p.m. at South Lakes High School.
_____________________________________________________________________________

I'm going to say something funny here... guess the town hall meetings are just for show.

http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/article.asp?article=91127&paper=71&cat=104
Parents Begin Prepping for Round Two
By Mirza Kurspahic
November 29, 2007

My chosen snippets…

“Maria Allen, South Lakes High School PTSA Vice President said those who spoke against the boundary study at the first meeting created distractions…. "They were probably a minority, but they’re the loudest ones,"

She said those who have a problem with the process should have acted earlier on it.THE BOUNDARY STUDY, is not a form of social engineering or a busing scheme."

FME Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Apparently the leadership of Fox Mill Elementary
> knows something the rest of us don't know... I
> just received the following e-mail:
>
> __________________________________________________
> ___________________________
> Advanced Placement (AP) and International
> Baccalaureate AP and IB Information Night.
>
> Faye Brenner, FCPS Advanced Academic Program
> specialist, will provide information on the high
> school Advanced Placement (AP) and International
> Baccalaureate (IB) programs on Monday, December
> 10, 2007, 7:00 p.m. at South Lakes High School.
> __________________________________________________
> ___________________________
>
> I'm going to say something funny here... guess the
> town hall meetings are just for show.
________-------------------------------------------------------------------

Oakton High School parents just rec'd the same one.....
Are they playing with our minds or what?????
Maybe this is their way to get everyone to "visit" South Lakes High School!!!
Oh..the games....

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FME Mom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Apparently the leadership of Fox Mill
> Elementary
> > knows something the rest of us don't know... I
> > just received the following e-mail:
> >
> >
> __________________________________________________
>
> > ___________________________
> > Advanced Placement (AP) and International
> > Baccalaureate AP and IB Information Night.
> >
> > Faye Brenner, FCPS Advanced Academic Program
> > specialist, will provide information on the
> high
> > school Advanced Placement (AP) and
> International
> > Baccalaureate (IB) programs on Monday, December
> > 10, 2007, 7:00 p.m. at South Lakes High School.
> >
> __________________________________________________
>
> > ___________________________
> >
> > I'm going to say something funny here... guess
> the
> > town hall meetings are just for show.
> ________------------------------------------------
> -------------------------
>
> Oakton High School parents just rec'd the same
> one.....
> Are they playing with our minds or what?????
> Maybe this is their way to get everyone to "visit"
> South Lakes High School!!!
> Oh..the games....

How did the four options get decided? It seems as if most/many of the people at the first meeting wanted either 1) a moratorium 2) to start the process over, including other schools, or 3) put in a magnet school. How is it that there was a meeting, people came, and then these four options are presented? I hope that people won't stop objecting to the whole approach and get distracted into actually expressing a preference for one of these options.

I'm so disgusted with the school board that it is solidifying my objections. SL parents,there are confusing reasons given for why your school "needs" more students. However, none of the reasons realy justifies the way this whole thing is being handled. As others have pointed out, putting more middle-class students in there doesn't do much to help struggling students.

foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> putting more middle-class students in there
> doesn't do much to help struggling students.

Actually, a fair number of peer reviewed and published studies show that it does help disadvantaged kids to be surrounded by, but not overwhelmed by, larger numbers of middle-class kids.

I agree that the School Board has handled this exercise in the worst possible manner. Langley and Madison should have been part of the study. Their exclusion is shameful.

Options 1 and 4 has Fox Mill staying with Oakton. I hope you'd support Option 4.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2007 10:10AM by Thomas More.

FME Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Apparently the leadership of Fox Mill Elementary
> knows something the rest of us don't know... I
> just received the following e-mail:
>
> __________________________________________________
> ___________________________
> Advanced Placement (AP) and International
> Baccalaureate AP and IB Information Night.
>
> Faye Brenner, FCPS Advanced Academic Program
> specialist, will provide information on the high
> school Advanced Placement (AP) and International
> Baccalaureate (IB) programs on Monday, December
> 10, 2007, 7:00 p.m. at South Lakes High School.
> __________________________________________________
> ___________________________
>
> I'm going to say something funny here... guess the
> town hall meetings are just for show.


Everybody got this email not just Fox Mill.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > putting more middle-class students in there
> > doesn't do much to help struggling students.
>
> Actually a far amount of peer reviewed and
> published studies show that it does help
> disadvantaged kids to be surrounded by, but not
> overwhelmed by, larger numbers of middle-class
> kids.
>
> I agree that the School Board has handled this
> exercise in the worst possible manner. Langley and
> Madison should have been part to the study. Their
> exclusion is shameful.
>
> Options 1 and 4 has Fox Mill staying with Oakton.
> I hope you'd support Option 4.

Go to the meeting notes and immediately click on the end and go back page by page. There is a very reasoned analysis submitted by someone whose home might be moved but who has family living near Herndon HS but assigned to Langley. Madison is a whole other situation - please read any materials available on the Luther Jackson boundary process which occurred 2006-07. Madison shares boundaries with Marshall and Falls Church [extremely undercapacity] so anything relative to Madison must be considered in conjunction with the eastern boundaries. What about West Briar Island? There are variations in location/community within the huge geographic Madison Island.

The elementary schools are the building blocks in this West County process scenarios. It seems the capacity numbers and trailer counts should be analyzed there as well with no one area being re assigned that would not logically remain there. Aldrin and Armstrong? Aldrin is intertwined with Forest Edge and Lake Anne currently while Armstrong could serve a much more Herndon community oriented population [ie physically in Reston but like Crossfield draws from a different community].

foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:

>
> How did the four options get decided? It seems as
> if most/many of the people at the first meeting
> wanted either 1) a moratorium 2) to start the
> process over, including other schools, or 3) put
> in a magnet school. How is it that there was a
> meeting, people came, and then these four options
> are presented? I hope that people won't stop
> objecting to the whole approach and get distracted
> into actually expressing a preference for one of
> these options.
>
Unfortunately, everyone is distracted, because now it is "protect the turf." Of course this is the SB process that remains un-documented in their high and mighty county/SB policies.

Can anyone confirm this? Or is it just a rumor?

the South Lakes' PTA had a meeting last night to
discuss a change to Option #3. They want to present to the School Board
that Floris not McNair be redistricted in Option #3.

Question

You people have way too much time on your hands. No wonder the school board is asking for another billion dollars. They have to keep paying to entertain all of you with your stupid border issues.
Send you kids to school, tell them to shut up and listen and stop all your bitching.

Oakton Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> However, this conscious decision to provide a
> variety of housing choices, in contrast to the
> neighborhoods around Reston, results in the more
> diverse student population of the school.

You are not as well-versed on the facts as you think. The original Reston master plan did not include public housing. The first subsidized housing was brought into Reston as a result of a deal between Fairfax County and the Federal Government. When the USGS was being added to Reston, the deal was that Reston had to take the housing. Reston citizens did not make the deal, developers did. Once the camels nose was in the tent, so to speak, more public housing was added. Since Reston was not a town, citizens had no say in it.

Your area did not make a conscious decision not to add public housing, that decision was made by the County. They concentrate it in high-density areas.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> foxmill/carson/oakton parent Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > putting more middle-class students in there
> > doesn't do much to help struggling students.
>
> Actually, a fair number of peer reviewed and
> published studies show that it does help
> disadvantaged kids to be surrounded by, but not
> overwhelmed by, larger numbers of middle-class
> kids.
>

Those studies generally look at kids who are in the same classroom, not just the same school building. Yes, maybe spending some time together in the cafeteria will expose low-achieving kids to academic kids, but that seems like a pretty inefficient way to boost achievement. Once kids are in high school, they spend at least half of their day with other students who are more or less in the same scholastic boat, so I don't know how "surrounded" the disadvantaged kids would be. I think that bringing in more middle class kids would just raise the school's test scores, not really improve the outcomes of kids who need more support.

All the people I have spoken to that go the Chantilly High School from both Navy and Oak Hill WANT to stay at Chantilly.

Neen:

Great closing arguments.

Fed Up is currently throwing up.

If you visit the FCPS Website, South Lakes High School, follow the PTSA link...

Surprise!!!!!! you'll end up here in the Fairfax Underground...isn't that funny???

How circuitous! Thats for you submissive!

http://www.southlakesptsa.org/boundaries.htm

"Fairfax Underground Blog"

"Note: Comments on both sides range from cogent and convincing to silly and offensive. View at your own risk."

"WHAT CAN YOU DO TO HELP? Sign WE SUPPORT REDISTRICTING petition
Send corrections, comments or questions about this (PTSA) website to: Maria Allen.
Vice President, South Lakes PTSA"

So much for those annoying PTSA bylaws!! Fairfax County PTSA President....are you reading this blog??????

“Maria Allen, South Lakes High School PTSA Vice President said those who spoke against the boundary study at the first meeting created distractions…. "They were probably a minority, but they’re the loudest ones,"


Clearly, South Lakes needs a special ed. class for the deaf, dumb and blind.

Oooops, sorry...... Maria wasn't deaf.

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you visit the FCPS Website, South Lakes High
> School, follow the PTSA link...
>
> Surprise!!!!!! you'll end up here in the Fairfax
> Underground...isn't that funny???
>
> How circuitous! Thats for you submissive!

What's your point? Why does it matter if a link is on the webpage? The PTSA is not telling anyone what to say or even to post, just to view. Do you think we SL Parents, as private citizens don't have a right to post here?

newsweekreader Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Neen Wrote:

Only TJ, Oakton, and Langley are ranked in the
top 100 schools:
No wonder Oakton parents don't want to leave!
_________________________________________________________________________
> Actually all the schools in the study made the
> newsweek list -- totalling 1351 schools
> nationwide. Oakton ranked 103, Chantilly 133,
> Herndon 161, Westfield 179 and South Lakes 859.newsweekreader Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
_-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually, Neens right, once again. But, when the full list is published, maybe SL will be on it , who knows??

http://www.news8.net/news/stories/1107/476808.html
Breaking news…..Alert alert..12:00 Noon…Channel 8 TV Local news: Nov 30,2007

"U.S. News & World Report says America's best high school is right here in northern Virginia.

The magazine's first-ever high school rankings give the top honor to Fairfax County's elite Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology. Five other schools in the D.C. area also made the top 100 list - two in Fairfax and three in Montgomery County.

In Fairfax, Langley High was number 37, and Oakton High was ranked 87th."

Neen was talking about Newsweek (Jay Mathew's Challenge Index). This is a US News & World Report ranking. Two different reports.

Sorry but SL won't be on this list. As quoted from the article

"Schools were judged on how well students score on state reading and math tests and their participation and achievement in Advanced Placement courses"

I repeat - AP courses. Hmmmm. No mention of IB anywhere. So either SL is really elite or its just dogshit like everyone thinks.

VaDriver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you visit the FCPS Website, South Lakes High
> School, follow the PTSA link...
>
> Surprise!!!!!! you'll end up here in the Fairfax
> Underground...isn't that funny???
>
> How circuitous! Thats for you submissive!
>
> http://www.southlakesptsa.org/boundaries.htm
>
> "Fairfax Underground Blog"
>
> "Note: Comments on both sides range from cogent
> and convincing to silly and offensive. View at
> your own risk."
>
> "WHAT CAN YOU DO TO HELP? Sign WE SUPPORT
> REDISTRICTING petition
> Send corrections, comments or questions about this
> (PTSA) website to: Maria Allen.
> Vice President, South Lakes PTSA"
>
> So much for those annoying PTSA bylaws!! Fairfax
> County PTSA President....are you reading this
> blog??????


VA DRIVER - have you actually read PTA bylaws?

As stated in PTSA bylaws - the purpose of the pta is to
1) promote the welfare of children and youth in home, school, community, and place of worship.
2) raise the standards of home life
3) to secure adequate laws for the protection of youth and children
4) to bring into closer relation the home and the school, that parents and teachers may cooperate intelligently in the education of children and youth
5) to develop between educators and the general public such united efforts as will secure for all children and youth the highest advantages in physical, mental, social,and spiritual education

Explain how SL PTSA is advocating for other than the above.

All of us should be concerned about the welfare of all the children. The redistricting study as laid out in the criteria advocates for the benefit of ALL children.

Many of you are advocating for only your children and your supposed property values. Continuing to do so will ensure that you will lose.

spanky Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry but SL won't be on this list. As quoted
> from the article
>
> "Schools were judged on how well students score on
> state reading and math tests and their
> participation and achievement in Advanced
> Placement courses"
>
> I repeat - AP courses. Hmmmm. No mention of IB
> anywhere. So either SL is really elite or its
> just dogshit like everyone thinks.

Spanky, do you ever tire of posting incorrect comments. Several IB Schools are on the list, including George Mason, Marshall, and Robinson.

BTW, the only school in the West County Boundary Study to make the list was Oakton. So I guess that means Chantilly, Herndon, Westfield, and South Lakes are, as you say, dogs$%&?

spanky Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry but SL won't be on this list. As quoted
> from the article
>
> "Schools were judged on how well students score on
> state reading and math tests and their
> participation and achievement in Advanced
> Placement courses"
>
> I repeat - AP courses. Hmmmm. No mention of IB
> anywhere. So either SL is really elite or its
> just dogshit like everyone thinks.


Such nice language for a mother. Is that what you teach your children when they get home from their private school?

By the way, it's not - its - but rather it's. Isn't it a contraction of it is? I think I learned that in my public school education in third grade.

The third school on the US News list is an IB school. It is called International Baccaulareate Program. I guess they only teach AP :)

Spanky lives in the South Lakes pyramid. It's in Spanky's best interest to advocate for more students being sent to SL. Instead, Spanky chooses to put down SL at every turn. Go figure.

SubmissiveWiiRNot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Spanky lives in the South Lakes pyramid. It's in
> Spanky's best interest to advocate for more
> students being sent to SL. Instead, Spanky
> chooses to put down SL at every turn. Go figure.


Spanky's mad because Reston boys once didnt care when Spanky Jr. threatened to take his ball home if he didn't get to play goalie. Now Spanky hates soccer and RFC too and is paying $100K for Jr and siblings private ed. Go figure.

Sub,
1, 10, 100, 1000. Which number is greater?

Child Advocate,
Its baccalaureate, not baccaulareate dumb ass. Glad you aren't advocating my child.

SL parents,
The first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem. No one is buying your rosy outlook at SL, especially me, because I live among you.

'panky, I have no idea what you are talking about. Nice language, though. Both of my SL grads were accepted to colleges in the US News top 25 ranking. Not bad numbers for a dogs$^&! school.

spanky Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Child Advocate,
> Its baccalaureate, not baccaulareate dumb ass.
> Glad you aren't advocating my child.

No, we have you advocating for you child with your foul mouth.
>
> SL parents,
> The first step to recovery is admitting you have a
> problem. No one is buying your rosy outlook at
> SL, especially me, because I live among you.


After Spanky calls the children "hos," the parents "pimps," South Lakes "dog&%$*," - and now calls child advocate a "dumb*&%$," she thinks her postings and opinions carry any weight. You need to clean up your language lady!


I think I know you Spanky and you're a Langley wannabe. You live amongst us but wish you could live in Great Falls or McLean. You have to arrange playdates as your kids don't have friends in the 'hood as you're driving them to private school and back. You have no friends as everyone has figured out that you're full of hate and venom. Bet you're a hypocrite too and send your kids to parochail school.

Move Spanky, move!

RFC,
Please let me know the next time SL or RFC produces an all met soccer player. Maybe your kid can get a job cooking hotdogs for the concession stand at my kids' games. BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

alert - caniballism has struck the south lakes utopia

Spanky:

What university awards a "baccaulareate dumb ass" degree? Is that a BDA?

Neen - you bring up a good point about why it is that certain minority students in Fairfax do poorly compared to their peers in Richmond, Newport News, etc. And it really is troubling, given the the levels of income for the relevant students and their families and the general resources of Fairfax's schools far exceed those in the Commonwealth's other districts.

And while I don't think it appropriate to let Stu Gibson, the FCPS system, or anyone off the hook, so to speak, for not reaching the standards found elsewhere in the Commonwealth, I surmise, as suggested by a Washington Post article two years ago about this very same subject, that Fairfax is in a unique situation - not an excusable one, but somewhat unique. The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of Fairfax County students, and particularly the large "better half" of that majority, really can pass the SOL's more or less by osmosis, and they receive no benefit educationally from being taught "to the test". Parents of GT kids or near GT kids will confirm this - the SOL's are a nuisance event - whether through educational exposure or reading at the home, or through some other culturally infused means, these kids are going to pass the SOL's with very little effort. And because there are so many of them, Fairfax more or less caters to their demands and needs (which does support the County in its quest for recognition and acclaim), which leaves a certain minority population which could really benefit from repetitive drilling on SOL elements wanting - because teaching to the test is clearly what the the schools in Richmond and Newport News, etc. (they publicly admit it) do. And this is where I think ideology comes into play. The mostly liberal crowd in that run the schools are understandably uncomfortable about segregating kids - meaning teaching many in a certain minority group (and we are talking only about non-learning disabled kids here) differently and pulling them aside to do just that. They themselves are worried about being the stigmatizers, and stigmatizing the kids at issue. But I think the ideology hurts these kids, because while the schools with some justification claim about the lack of creativity in teaching to the test, the SOL's require mastery of a certain level of retained knowledge that is essential in today's economy, no matter how boring it may be to obtain. The SOL's, though far from perfect, do measure fundamental educational skills, and the more kids that pass them, the better off they will be. My vote is to do the uncomfortable thing and get the kids the repetitively earned skills they need, even if it means treating that population differently. I see no other choice, and calling Gibson, et. al out on the problem - as long as it is done in a constructive way - I think appropriate. It won't get better by just looking at it, and given Fairfax's resources, it is very hard to justify.

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> alert - caniballism has struck the south lakes
> utopia

Are you really putting yourself in a position of defending ...'panky? A tenuous position, at best.

U.S. News and World Report


"We are a nation that always strives to do better, and the good news should galvanize us. There are many schools on this list that educators and policymakers can learn from. These include high-performing urban charter schools and traditional public schools that are providing their students with a great education in challenging circumstances.

Take for instance Boston's MATCH school, a gold medal school at No. 99. The school serves 200 students. More than 90 percent are black or Hispanic, and most live in poverty. They generally arrive at the school below grade level, yet every student in the first three graduating classes has gone to college. MATCH's formula isn't complicated, but it is hard work: great teachers and intensive instruction, including a full-time corps of tutors who live on the top floor of the school in order to be on call for students. Unconventional? Sure. But also effective and an example of how relentless some schools will have to be."



http://www.usnews.com/articles/education/high-schools/2007/11/29/what-matters-most-in-measuring.html

SL Padre,
Only you would know the answer to that question - or maybe check with Sub. Her/his/its kids went there.

b-a-c-c-a-u-l-a-r-e-a-t-e, dumbass.......
You might want to stop drinking the water out of Lake Thoreau. Its making you delusional.