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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: stu_wishes ()
Date: May 14, 2008 08:39AM

Baffled Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Socioeconomic factors are the single greatest
> predictors of performance on standardized tests,
> he said."
>
> Seems to me that is one of the biggest goals Stu
> Gibson wanted... more top performing students to
> SL. Also why did he think socioeconomic factors
> was the single greatest predictors of performance?
> Why single?


I have two simple wishes,

a) I want to make SL the greatest school in FCPS and I think bringing in kids from middle/upper middle class (but not super rich) will do this.

b) I love the IB program and I have proof that it works because my daughter was sooo enriched with it.

Why can't people give me these 2 wishes? After all they elected me.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: quantum ()
Date: May 14, 2008 08:53AM

The problem with Gibson's statement re socio-economic factors, despite the general truth of his statement, is what it both implies and fails to explain. First, it implies a sense of fatalism, as in we really can't do anything about these lower socio-economic types (a dangerous position for an elected leader to take), and second, it fails to explain why those in the lower socio-economic categories do worse in Fairfax than in other jurisdictions of the state, despite the fact that Fairfax has many more resources than those jurisdictions. Of course, I could be taking his statements out of context, but I don't think so - there are varying levels of truth and accountability - and in this case, merely stating a statistical narrow truth doesn't plumb either notion deeply or meaningfully.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: What a Biatch... ()
Date: May 14, 2008 09:03AM

Neen must be so very insecure. She has to put others down to feel good about herself. So sad.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> What else would they say? Of course they are
> going to tell prospective students that they will
> do great at UVA. With the right major, some of
> them may do very well. Some will do less well.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: the blame game ()
Date: May 14, 2008 09:49AM

Stu Gibson is an idiot-I know, noone is shocked to hear this. Just listen to what he says in that article. He again blames the kids for the failures. They are poor, they have lousy parents, there is nothing we can do as a school system.

Someone shut these people up. When are they going to take responsibility for their failures????

I want to scream.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Berdhuis ()
Date: May 14, 2008 11:55AM

quantum Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...First, it implies a sense of
> fatalism, as in we really can't do anything about
> these lower socio-economic types (a dangerous
> position for an elected leader to take),

Do most lower socio-economic types feel that they can't do anything about it, too? I'm willing to bet so.

> and second, it fails to explain why those in the lower
> socio-economic categories do worse in Fairfax than
> in other jurisdictions of the state, despite the
> fact that Fairfax has many more resources than
> those jurisdictions.

Perhaps a relatively larger affluence gap encourages the above-mentioned fatalism. We're getting into psychology here, so I'm not going to pronounce any conclusions. But I do have my suspicions.

Your thoughts?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 14, 2008 12:49PM

Could it be that schools with IB programs are pouring their best teachers and most resources into the IB diploma program that serves a very, very small percentage of the students?

The greatest concern that parents of children who were forced into SL and whose kid could not meet the IB diploma requirements, their kid would either fall through the cracks or would not have the academic resources that were needed.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: why us? ()
Date: May 14, 2008 01:04PM

I often see other school heads quotes as saying the following:

"We need to do more for the kids who are failing"

"We have to provide an excellent education for all of our students"

"Our dropout rate is unacceptable"

"The minority achievement gaps in this school system are too high"

Now let's review some of the garbage by FCPS people.....

Jack Dale: "We can't test the ESL kids because the tests traumatize them"
(Does NCLB failures have anything to do with it??)

Kathy Smith "We need to take care of our most valuable asset-our teachers"

Tessie Wilson, "All of our schools are excellent"
(This would include the schools with 75% failure rates on SOLs)

Stu Gibson "Socioeconomic factors prevent us from educating these kids"
(aka if you are poor in FCPS you will be ignored)

FCPS needs a serious come to Jesus meeting on educational gaps within our schools and the sooner we stop blaming the kids and the parents the sooner we can get down to business.

Hone get off your ass and do something!
(Not our students???)

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Gravis ()
Date: May 14, 2008 01:44PM

come on... keep it going, we are almost at 300 pages!


"the wisdom of the wise will perish, the intelligence of the intelligent will vanish."095042938540

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 14, 2008 06:20PM

apparently the truth hurts!

it is true that the so called "bad" school is placing many more kids in the hard-to- get-into VA public schools compared to the size of the school...without taking into account the special education population at the school which

and they aren't "minority" kids as someone above conjectured

in 2006-2007, South Lakes had as many kids admitted to UVA as did Langley with a much smaller student population

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 14, 2008 06:32PM

hey did you see what happened at the Langley Madison boys' lacrosse game...you know, amongst the "good" schools?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJ-jzYauF2k

all I know is that the "young ladies" playing at the "good" schools said some really raunchy disgusting things to the SL opponents at the girls sports games this year...

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: right on target ()
Date: May 14, 2008 07:13PM

You got it right. The entire SL school is being run for those small number of IB diploma candidates.

edna Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Could it be that schools with IB programs are
> pouring their best teachers and most resources
> into the IB diploma program that serves a very,
> very small percentage of the students?
>
> The greatest concern that parents of children who
> were forced into SL and whose kid could not meet
> the IB diploma requirements, their kid would
> either fall through the cracks or would not have
> the academic resources that were needed.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 14, 2008 08:20PM

Check out the article in the Fairfax Times....

http://www.fairfaxtimes.com/news/2008/may/13/report-ranks-high-school-performance/

Report ranks high school performance
Fairfax County
By Kali Schumitz
Source: Fairfax County Times
TUESDAY, MAY 13 2008

Comparing Scores
The FairfaxCAPS report calculated a “GPA” for each magisterial district in the county, based on average 2007 Standards of Learning test scores at high schools in each district. Schools were assigned to the district where the majority of students live.




Dranesville – 3.82

Braddock – 3.55

Springfield – 3.55

Providence – 3.36

Sully – 3.36

Hunter Mill – 3.18

Mason – 2.73

Lee – 2.64

Mount Vernon – 2.36




View the full report at www.fairfaxcaps.org.

High schools in southeastern Fairfax County have lower scores on standardized tests than schools in other areas of the county, according to a “report card” published last week by the Fairfax County Coalition of Advocates for Public Schools.
The report, which was based on 2007 Virginia Standards of Learning scores, also indicates higher pass rates at schools offering Advanced Placement courses versus those offering the International Baccalaureate program. Eight of the county's 25 high schools have the IB program, and five of those eight schools are located in the southeastern part of the county.

Despite the report's focus on AP versus IB schools – a major point of contention during last year's redistricting of high schools in western Fairfax – this initial effort by FairfaxCAPS is not intended to answer the “why” of test score disparities, according to communications director Scott Chronister. He said the report is just using existing data to point out differences that the School Board tends to gloss over.

“They try to make it sound like the school system is a homogeneous institution – if you get an education in one school you're getting the same education as you would anywhere,” he said. “I think it would really strain credulity to think that there aren't differences.”

FairfaxCAPS, which was initially formed to oppose the west county redistricting and is also suing the school system over the boundary changes, hopes to continue to look at these issues and present them to the public in an easily digestible manner, Chronister said.

The report card takes the average SOL test scores in the four core subjects for each high school and converts them to a letter grade. Those grades were then averaged into a “GPA” for each school and magisterial district. Eighteen schools earned a “B” average or higher.

School Board member Stuart Gibson (Hunter Mill) said, given that FairfaxCAPS is known to oppose the IB program, it is not surprising that their methodology produced a result supporting the group's beliefs. Gibson, whose oldest daughter “was basically transformed” by her experience in South Lakes High School's IB English classes, has been a staunch defender of the program.

Judging a high school based on average SOL scores doesn't tell the full story, Gibson said, and there are many other indicators that show that the county is doing well. Socioeconomic factors are the single greatest predictors of performance on standardized tests, he said.

“If you have a high-achieving student, that student is going to succeed at any high school in Fairfax County,” Gibson said. “The challenge that we have is where the student is not getting help at home; where the parents might not even speak English.”
**************************
The challenge, Stu Gibson, is to share those precisous resources that go to the IB Diploma students, with all students.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: SB chastised for not tightening its b ()
Date: May 15, 2008 05:20AM

Hyland, McKay Offer ‘State of the Districts’
County School Board chastised for not tightening its belt.

By Chuck Hagee
Wednesday, May 07, 2008


Fairfax County's 2008 budget shortfall will look like an easy stretch compared to 2009's fiscal outlook. "Next year, we expect a $350 million hole in the budget that, at this point, can only be closed by higher real estate taxes."

That was the combined message of Supervisors Gerald Hyland (D-Mount Vernon) and Jeffrey McKay (D-Lee) to members of the Mount Vernon-Lee Chamber of Commerce during their regular monthly luncheon Tuesday, May 6, at the Belle Haven Country Club. As the featured speakers, they were delivering the annual "State of the Districts" report, which each deemed "good" in spite of the fiscal meltdown.

The Board of Supervisors raised the Commercial Real Estate tax by 11 cents this year, which enabled them to raise residential taxes by only 3 cents. And, even with that residential tax rise most homeowners will not see any dollar increase in their taxes due to declining property values, Hyland and McKay explained.

"It has been a balancing act to keep the quality of life our residents have come to expect and cut the present budget," Hyland said. It was only the escalating commercial property values along the Route 1 corridor that enabled the Board of Supervisors to raise commercial real estate taxes to balance this year’s fiscal blueprint, according to Hyland.

"The present economic situation has forced the county to reassess its services. I voted for this budget to help our older neighborhoods," said McKay, a freshman supervisor, although he served as chief of staff to former Lee District Supervisor Dana Kauffman for 12 years.

"The budget was cut for every area of county government except one — that was the schools," McKay said. "They not only didn't cut their funding request they came to us asking for $68 million more than they got last year. We gave them $48 million more."

"Schools need to look at their budget more closely and begin to control its size as everyone else has done," McKay said. To emphasize that point, McKay issued a press release on April 28 calling on the Fairfax County School Board to "engage in a rigorous line of business review that looks at every component of the school budget."

NOTING THAT county government has undertaken such a review, McKay said in his release, "I am concerned because I have not heard a similar firm commitment from our colleagues on the School Board. Education is the Board's (Supervisors) highest priority and this year 53.13 percent of our general fund has been allocated to the schools — up from 52.3 percent last year," he stated.

Hyland announced at the luncheon that he intends to ask the Board of Supervisors to put a proposal on the ballot this fall to institute a countywide meal tax. "At 3 cents on the dollar, this would raise an estimated $80 million to be used for education," he said.

Proposed once before, it failed. "It's time to let the voters decide. The last time it was proposed, Mount Vernon District came the closest of all the districts to approving it. But, it failed overall," said Hyland. He noted that other jurisdictions have such a tax and that Alexandria City just raised its meal tax by an additional 1 cent.

Hyland also noted that the Base Realignment & Closure Report (BRAC), that has substantially increased Fort Belvoir's standing in the nation's defense preparedness arena, has had "an incredibly positive impact in Mount Vernon District and even more so in Lee District." Now 19 proposed land-use changes being considered in Mount Vernon District as a result of BRAC, according to Hyland.

"BRAC is going to bring about the complete redevelopment of the Central Springfield area," McKay said. "We hope to approve a plan in the near future that will totally revamp Springfield Mall along the lines of Pentagon City and Pentagon Row. The future for the mall is very bright."

"BRAC HAS presented southeastern Fairfax County with a tremendous economic opportunity not available to the rest of the county," said McKay. "We have a lot of challenges ahead but the overall state of Lee District is good."

Hyland noted that the National Museum of the U.S. Army remains on track to be built near Fort Belvoir's Kingman Gate near the Fairfax County Parkway intersection with Route 1 . He expressed disappointment in the collapse of the Kings Crossing project, but predicted it would eventually become a viable development site.

When asked about the 1 cent set aside for affordable housing, Hyland noted that the county's original goal was to acquire 1,000 units of such housing. It has now reached 2,200 units, he said.

"We (Board of Supervisors) have provided units of affordable housing in every district of the county. The penny fund has been equitably distributed," McKay said.

Prior to the State of the Districts presentation, Tom Coyle, Fairfax County Crime Solvers, made a plea to Chamber members to volunteer their services on the non-profit organization's Board of Directors. Mount Vernon At Home and the Lorton Arts Foundations were also welcomed as new Chamber members by Chamber Vice President Jeff Todd who presided at the luncheon.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Ugliness Revealed ()
Date: May 15, 2008 08:54AM

>>It is not my intent to attack or defend affirmative action programs - but it is the case that amount of preference provided at competitive schools is very significant, and any analysis of a school such as SLHS (which thankfully does have some high achieving minority students) does need to take that into account.<<

This quote, referring to the incredible number of UVA admissions from SLHS, says it all about this thread. Absolutely nothing South Lakes High School does, has done, or will do, ever, will be enough for prejudiced people. Never. I don't believe Quantum is prejudiced, but his quote reflects the ugly underbelly of these 200 pages -- "Even when you succeed, you fail." Ugly, ugly, ugly.

I hope to God anybody who so hates that school and what it stands for will stay away, far away, and leave it alone. Take your ugliness to your lilly-white, privileged, 4.2 GPA, elitist, overcrowded schools and stay out of the real world.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Boo Hoo ()
Date: May 15, 2008 09:01AM

Sadly, Quantum probably did not take the time to look at the admitted students before making such a comment. Quantum assumes that admitted students from SL are minorities and that schools such as Oakton have no minorities admitted to those schools. I thought Quantum was smarter than that.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: formerhick76 ()
Date: May 15, 2008 09:12AM

Methinks the anti-RD folks overreached when they assumed SL students who got into UVA were all 'affirmative action' admissions.

That's an awful big assumpetion, as we have no way of knowing what percentage (0-100%) were, in fact, 'affirmative action' admissions. (and let's face it, if SL is as bad as the anti-RD crowd says it is, a 2000 from SL is probably equal to a 2100 from Langley.)

On the other hand, the pro-RD folks pretending SL is full of rainbows and is like the G/T wing of the school in the movie 'Class Act' are also delusional. Much as we should not assume 'affirmative action' in terms of SL students getting into UVA, we shouldn't assume 'ZOMG racism' in every utterance of the anti-RD crowd.

FWIW, I have no issue with giving students from bad schools a bonus in admissions, race just shouldn't be a factor. Why should a Black kid from Langley get a bonus while a White kid from Stuart (or James Wood, for that matter) not get one?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Jester ()
Date: May 15, 2008 09:28AM

Since I know many graduates of South Lakes that have attended and graduated from UVA, I can assure that the ones I knew were not minorities. UVA has always been a favorite college destination among South Lakes students.

UVA does seem to favor South Lakes. Rumor on the UVA Lawn and campus was that several South Lakes graduates were\are in one of the UVA secret societies(Seven Society, Z Society, IMP Society) and they donate heavily on behalf of South Lakes.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: quantum ()
Date: May 15, 2008 09:35AM

Berdhuis - it is difficult to speculate what is on the minds of those that do not perform well academically.

But I do think that great instruction and teaching, as well as (at least for most) an emphasis on learning "hard skills" - phonics and traditional computation - make a significant positive difference. All too often the schools resort to phony self-esteem projects in lieu of challenging instruction. And this is by and large done with good intent - but unfortunately results, and not kind intent, eventually matter.

My own view of Fairfax County teachers is generally positive. Some have been outstanding (one at Hunters Woods may be the best I have ever come across - period). But they are human, and frankly, it is not a surprise that the best teachers eventually gravitate to AP courses and the like - where they have better students and can engage in real teaching. Unfortunately, while all students deserve good teachers, the better students need them less than the lesser performing students - whose demands are not easy to meet.

The most significant thing that would help the lower socio-economic classes and their educational achievement is to vastly reduce out of wedlock births. Although I am conservative, I absolutely agree with Obama's siren call that the high incidence of out of wedlock births and the absence of fathers makes children terrifically vulnerable. Accordingly, I have no problem stigmatizing those who deviate from this tried and true principle - because frankly, the social costs are by and large borne by those of us that delay instant gratification, delay childbearing, and particularly with regard to those of us that are men, invest both emotionally and materially in our children and treat the woman in our lives with respect. Our share of the social contract is out-sized, and it cannot continue indefinitely. This of course is anathema to many progressives because stigmatizing, they assert, will hurt the self-esteem of the children affected. I remain unpersuaded, because such children already feel the pain of a father's absence no matter what sugar coating we provide them, and we need to somehow socialize just how destructive out of wedlock childbearing is - not from an simply from an emotional or values perspective - that can be left to churches, families, etc., - but from a economic and more importantly, developmental perspective. Certain strategies simply work. Amelioration of this problem would close the performance gaps to a considerable extent. Query when we will see groups like the NEA make this their foremost social issue? I would not hold my breath.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: floris_parent ()
Date: May 15, 2008 09:47AM

Ugliness Revealed Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >>It is not my intent to attack or defend
> affirmative action programs - but it is the case
> that amount of preference provided at competitive
> schools is very significant, and any analysis of a
> school such as SLHS (which thankfully does have
> some high achieving minority students) does need
> to take that into account.<<
>
> This quote, referring to the incredible number of
> UVA admissions from SLHS, says it all about this
> thread. Absolutely nothing South Lakes High School
> does, has done, or will do, ever, will be enough
> for prejudiced people. Never. I don't believe
> Quantum is prejudiced, but his quote reflects the
> ugly underbelly of these 200 pages -- "Even when
> you succeed, you fail." Ugly, ugly, ugly.
>
> I hope to God anybody who so hates that school and
> what it stands for will stay away, far away, and
> leave it alone. Take your ugliness to your
> lilly-white, privileged, 4.2 GPA, elitist,
> overcrowded schools and stay out of the real
> world.


We don't hate your school. We just don't like the fact that we were pulled from an AP school to an IB only school.

We also don't like Stu's comments when he says that IB program is great because his daughter was enriched with it. He can't decide what our kids like, can he?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: sherman's march ()
Date: May 15, 2008 10:17AM

floris_parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ugliness Revealed Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > >>It is not my intent to attack or defend
> > affirmative action programs - but it is the
> case
> > that amount of preference provided at
> competitive
> > schools is very significant, and any analysis of
> a
> > school such as SLHS (which thankfully does have
> > some high achieving minority students) does
> need
> > to take that into account.<<
> >
> > This quote, referring to the incredible number
> of
> > UVA admissions from SLHS, says it all about
> this
> > thread. Absolutely nothing South Lakes High
> School
> > does, has done, or will do, ever, will be
> enough
> > for prejudiced people. Never. I don't believe
> > Quantum is prejudiced, but his quote reflects
> the
> > ugly underbelly of these 200 pages -- "Even
> when
> > you succeed, you fail." Ugly, ugly, ugly.
> >
> > I hope to God anybody who so hates that school
> and
> > what it stands for will stay away, far away,
> and
> > leave it alone. Take your ugliness to your
> > lilly-white, privileged, 4.2 GPA, elitist,
> > overcrowded schools and stay out of the real
> > world.
>
>
> We don't hate your school. We just don't like
> the fact that we were pulled from an AP school to
> an IB only school.
>
> We also don't like Stu's comments when he says
> that IB program is great because his daughter was
> enriched with it. He can't decide what our kids
> like, can he?


Your side is the side of the uglies. Everyone who has any objectivity knows it. Hate SLHS, hate SLHS kids, hate Stu, hate IB, hate Hughes, hate SLHS kids who go to UVA, Annapolis, West Point, Air Force Academy, MIT, Princeton, JMU, Radford, NOVA, Iraq, Afghanistan, work to make ends meet.....hate on, you sad people.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: sherman's march ()
Date: May 15, 2008 10:18AM

floris_parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ugliness Revealed Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > >>It is not my intent to attack or defend
> > affirmative action programs - but it is the
> case
> > that amount of preference provided at
> competitive
> > schools is very significant, and any analysis of
> a
> > school such as SLHS (which thankfully does have
> > some high achieving minority students) does
> need
> > to take that into account.<<
> >
> > This quote, referring to the incredible number
> of
> > UVA admissions from SLHS, says it all about
> this
> > thread. Absolutely nothing South Lakes High
> School
> > does, has done, or will do, ever, will be
> enough
> > for prejudiced people. Never. I don't believe
> > Quantum is prejudiced, but his quote reflects
> the
> > ugly underbelly of these 200 pages -- "Even
> when
> > you succeed, you fail." Ugly, ugly, ugly.
> >
> > I hope to God anybody who so hates that school
> and
> > what it stands for will stay away, far away,
> and
> > leave it alone. Take your ugliness to your
> > lilly-white, privileged, 4.2 GPA, elitist,
> > overcrowded schools and stay out of the real
> > world.
>
>
> We don't hate your school. We just don't like
> the fact that we were pulled from an AP school to
> an IB only school.
>
> We also don't like Stu's comments when he says
> that IB program is great because his daughter was
> enriched with it. He can't decide what our kids
> like, can he?


Your side is the side of the uglies. Everyone who has any objectivity knows it. Hate SLHS, hate SLHS kids, hate Stu, hate IB, hate Hughes, hate SLHS kids who go to UVA, Annapolis, West Point, Air Force Academy, MIT, Princeton, VT, JMU, Radford, NOVA, Iraq, Afghanistan, work to make ends meet.....hate on, you sad people.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: formerhick76 ()
Date: May 15, 2008 11:22AM

sherman's march: why is IB something parents have to like?

quantum: I have often wondered what might happen if court-enforced child support were abolished for unmarried mothers. Would it give men an 'impregnate for free' card or would women moderate their behavior?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: sherman was a monster ()
Date: May 15, 2008 11:28AM

How absolutely prophetic for a SLHS supporter to use Sherman's March as a user name. As everyone knows, Sherman was a rapist, pillager and war criminal. It reminds me of some of the Gestapo tactics used by the SLHS crew and Gibson.

South Lakes has utterly destroyed its reputation by the immorals acts of this RD. Can you imagine if you google South Lakes what comes up???

Shame on them for not acting more honorably in this process. They won the battle but they surely lost the war.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Appomatox ()
Date: May 15, 2008 11:54AM

I speak as a true Virginian through and through, but Lee did surrender to Sherman, so Sherman actually won the battles and the war. Remember, all is fair in love and war.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: history lesson?? ()
Date: May 15, 2008 12:17PM

Sorry to lecture here, but I must correct the South Lakes parent on some Civil War history. Lee did not surrender to Sherman at Appomatox-Lee surrendered to Grant. I think this is one of the questions on the 3rd grade SOL test.

All is fair in love and war, huh? I guess you have justified the extermination of 6 million innocent Jews during Worl War II?

And of course your argument would also cover the atrocities at Andersonville?

Let's not forget the Japanese rape at Nanking.

There is a reason the Confederate flag still flys in the South 143 years later. When people feel disenfranchised by oppressive people they continue the fight years on- as will the victims of this RD.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Berdhuis ()
Date: May 15, 2008 12:26PM

quantum,

I agree that the greatest developmental gain that chould be seen in lower socio-economic class children would come from the constant and participatory presence of their fathers (assuming that their mothers are already). Schools which are lagging in achievement should look squarely at the parents of their students and entice them to get deeply involved in educating them.

That means going over all of their homework everyday, explaining lessons which are not understood, repeating exercises which are not understood, etc. I have been doing this with my children (who are academically not at risk, either) for several years and plan to do so until the last one is graduated from HS. So I can say with authority that a father can find the time to do this if the will is there.

As for SL's condition, perhaps a greater effort needs to be made on behalf of its PTSA to reach those parents of at-risk students.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: fcps_guilty_on_rd ()
Date: May 15, 2008 12:28PM

formerhick76 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sherman's march: why is IB something parents have
> to like?
>
> quantum: I have often wondered what might happen
> if court-enforced child support were abolished for
> unmarried mothers. Would it give men an
> 'impregnate for free' card or would women moderate
> their behavior?

This is probably the first time in US history that kids will be forced into an IB only school from AP school. If you ask Gibson, "Oh its an excuse. They just don't want to go to South Lakes!! "

If fcps has any guilt feeling, they should provide pupil placed students transportation and choice of AP school they can pupil place into. Till this happens, I will at least feel violated by this RD.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: study_and_kids ()
Date: May 15, 2008 12:32PM

Berdhuis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> quantum,
>
> I agree that the greatest developmental gain that
> chould be seen in lower socio-economic class
> children would come from the constant and
> participatory presence of their fathers (assuming
> that their mothers are already). Schools which are
> lagging in achievement should look squarely at the
> parents of their students and entice them to get
> deeply involved in educating them.
>
> That means going over all of their homework
> everyday, explaining lessons which are not
> understood, repeating exercises which are not
> understood, etc. I have been doing this with my
> children (who are academically not at risk,
> either) for several years and plan to do so until
> the last one is graduated from HS. So I can say
> with authority that a father can find the time to
> do this if the will is there.
>
> As for SL's condition, perhaps a greater effort
> needs to be made on behalf of its PTSA to reach
> those parents of at-risk students.


I agree 100%. Each kid is different, my son had no problem with his homework. But my daughter needs a lot of help. Either me or my wife make it a point to sit down with them and go over things. If parents don't have time to do it, kids will let it go. After all, what is the incentive for them to study when they get everything they ask for.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: quantum ()
Date: May 15, 2008 02:06PM

Sherman's March - you are taking the issues far too personally. I think it is great that SLHS gets a significant number of people in UVa. But let's at the same time be open about the issue - the number of matriculants at UVa from SLHS likely does include those that receive a very significant advantage from the affirmative action practices engaged in by UVa (one of the trustees at UVa got in hot water for merely speaking to the truth about this), and that for those statistics to be meaningful to the population at large, that fact should be considered. This is not in the interest of being contrarian, but rather it is in furtherance of being prescient - the future of affirmative action in public universities is shaky - with lots of litigation risk - and it may not be here to stay. Our increasingly pluralistic population, along with the sham that generally is racial identity politics, will some day make such preferences obsolete in any event. The admit rate for now, however, should be deemed a SLHS success story - UVa's minority graduation rate, to their credit, is one of the highest of those universities engaging in the heavy preference game (many have great admit stats, but lousy graduation statistics), so in the end, if not inclined to being defensive, you could point to a story of minority success while conceding that the ample preferences in play do skew the statistics to some degree. But that likely is too unemotional or factual approach for you, inasmuch as it doesn't accomodate the chip that appears on your shoulder.

Formerhick - I would think that enforcement of child support is in society's interest. Ironically, support in the most afflicted communities is haphazard at best because many of the fathers are in essence "judgment proof" - they have limited means to support themselves, much less children, and while the transition to a knowledge based economy has not helped them, good jobs are not easily available to those with spotty work habits and records - at the worst - a prison record - or in its lesser form, itinerant work habits. So expending resource to merely have the State initiate contempt proceedings doesn't make much sense to these mothers - struggling as they are - they have better things to do. And as imperfect as the forced march of child support is - it may cause a reluctant or immature father - particularly a middle class one with a job - to at some point play a larger role than just a monetary payment in a child's life - a crucial factor in my view to helping children establish an identity and sense of self. So child support, with all its flaws, makes sense to me in virtually every respect. You help make kids - you must support them.

Again, as much as I disagree with someone like Obama on taxation and fiscal issues, I would really like a leading politician such as Obama to come out in a campaign, as he does in his books (and it would inflame many a liberal) that the issue of unwed births (and/or the lack of prompt family formation thereafter) is the most pressing social and educational issue of our time. Social pressure and stigmatization does work - it is one of the reasons Clinton's mid-1990's welfare reform has been effective - and if our leaders - from the President on down to local politicians that oversee and administer the tremendous social costs of unwed births - began to bang this drum I do believe some helpful stigmatization would occur.

In any event, this is all fairly far afield from SLHS - which as I have related, is a place where parental concerns have been significantly overblown - because the good students there - if they find the IB program their cup of tea, can do very well and in fact do very well. And the word on the street is that the administrators there are excellent - meaning they are a cut above some of the jock centric leaders at some of the other schools, which excel due to the inertia of well off and involved parents. But the "off subject" topics are certainly what are on many of our minds with the more challenging students at not only SLHS, but at all of the schools with challenging populations in the county, and I don't fault those for asking the tough questions about their progress, particularly insofar as it affects their children.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: horrible ()
Date: May 15, 2008 02:15PM

To get an idea on the degree of alienation Stu Gibson imposed on FM and Floris - after the RD I met couple of parents that said they would not send to SLHS if that was the last school left on earth.

sherman was a monster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How absolutely prophetic for a SLHS supporter to
> use Sherman's March as a user name. As everyone
> knows, Sherman was a rapist, pillager and war
> criminal. It reminds me of some of the Gestapo
> tactics used by the SLHS crew and Gibson.
>
> South Lakes has utterly destroyed its reputation
> by the immorals acts of this RD. Can you imagine
> if you google South Lakes what comes up???
>
> Shame on them for not acting more honorably in
> this process. They won the battle but they surely
> lost the war.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 15, 2008 02:19PM

In response to:

Your side is the side of the uglies. Everyone who has any objectivity knows it. Hate SLHS, hate SLHS kids, hate Stu, hate IB, hate Hughes, hate SLHS kids who go to UVA, Annapolis, West Point, Air Force Academy, MIT, Princeton, JMU, Radford, NOVA, Iraq, Afghanistan, work to make ends meet.....hate on, you sad people.

Isn't it interesting that the group who wave the hate card and are vocal about hate include SL supporters and Gibson who wears that little button that indicates stamp out hate.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Berdhuis ()
Date: May 15, 2008 03:37PM

edna Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Could it be that schools with IB programs are
> pouring their best teachers and most resources
> into the IB diploma program that serves a very,
> very small percentage of the students?
>
> The greatest concern that parents of children who
> were forced into SL and whose kid could not meet
> the IB diploma requirements, their kid would
> either fall through the cracks or would not have
> the academic resources that were needed.


That could be. But a mitigating solution could involve orienting the community service hours for IB students into mentoring other students who need the help. No new resources needed, no new teachers, just a little sweat and a kind heart - all free!

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Gibson is a hypocrite ()
Date: May 15, 2008 04:20PM

If you go back a few years during the SB minutes for the boundary discussion on SOCO, Stu Gibson admonishes the PTAs for their interference in the boundary process. How come he actively participated with the South Lakes PTA when it suited him?

I might just ask him that question at the next community meeting he is at. I can't wait for him to fumble on an answer.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Not So Obvious ()
Date: May 15, 2008 04:32PM

Gibson is a hypocrite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you go back a few years during the SB minutes
> for the boundary discussion on SOCO, Stu Gibson
> admonishes the PTAs for their interference in the
> boundary process. How come he actively
> participated with the South Lakes PTA when it
> suited him?
>
> I might just ask him that question at the next
> community meeting he is at. I can't wait for him
> to fumble on an answer.

I think you know the answer to your own question - it suited him because it served a school in his district that his own daughters attended, a large group of Reston voters in his district, and his own self-serving vision that an RD would serve broader societal goals. I don't think he has any problem justifying it to himself, nor would I expect him to fumble on the topic at a future meeting. Just make sure you don't end up the one running for cover when he compares himself to Mother Teresa and brands you a racist for asking the question.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Berdhuis ()
Date: May 15, 2008 04:49PM

It should be interesting when some of us go through this all over again with the imminent redistricting of Floris, McNair, Hutchison and maybe others next fall as Coppermine ES is soon to open its doors.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Assumptions About Appomatox ()
Date: May 15, 2008 04:58PM

You know what they say about a-s-s-u-m-e...why would you assume the person is from SL just because they don't agree with the CAPS POV? I think we have a new verb - to South Lakes someone...broad brush and everything.

History Lesson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry to lecture here, but I must correct the
> South Lakes parent on some Civil War history. Lee
> did not surrender to Sherman at Appomatox-Lee
> surrendered to Grant. I think this is one of the
> questions on the 3rd grade SOL test.
>
> All is fair in love and war, huh? I guess you have
> justified the extermination of 6 million innocent
> Jews during Worl War II?
>
> And of course your argument would also cover the
> atrocities at Andersonville?
>
> Let's not forget the Japanese rape at Nanking.
>
> There is a reason the Confederate flag still flys
> in the South 143 years later. When people feel
> disenfranchised by oppressive people they continue
> the fight years on- as will the victims of this
> RD.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: sure about sherman ()
Date: May 15, 2008 05:26PM

1. I am damn sure Sherman's March knows nothing of Civil War history.

2. Who in their right mind would be a SLHS supporter if they had no vested interest, property or otherwise, in seeing that school be rescued?

3. Sherman needs no help looking like an A-S-S.

There are a number of parents outside of the West County area who are sympathetic to the RD crowd on the other hand, because we see how they were railroaded by the SB and PTA and want to make sure it does not happen in our district.

South Lakes has declared war on more people than they realize.

My prediction is CAPS will grow to 5000 members by year end, if not before then.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: kathy smith despiser ()
Date: May 15, 2008 06:03PM

For those who think Kathy Smith is a liar, a bad actress and is a poor representative on the school board............she is doing the circuit for Cucinelli's spot when he runs for some higher office. You can bet I will be the first in line to fundraise for her opponent. Don't let this woman who couldn't tell the truth if she tried achieve any other office. She is horrible as a school board member, can you imagine her in a spot where she would have more authority?

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Kathy Smith is a liar ()
Date: May 15, 2008 08:56PM

She was, is and will always be a bitch.


kathy smith despiser Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> For those who think Kathy Smith is a liar, a bad
> actress and is a poor representative on the school
> board............she is doing the circuit for
> Cucinelli's spot when he runs for some higher
> office. You can bet I will be the first in line
> to fundraise for her opponent. Don't let this
> woman who couldn't tell the truth if she tried
> achieve any other office. She is horrible as a
> school board member, can you imagine her in a spot
> where she would have more authority?

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Now, now, children ()
Date: May 15, 2008 09:11PM

Behave!

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 15, 2008 10:20PM

Kathy Smith has the authority to spend over 53% of your tax dollar whether you support her decisions are not. She certainly lets the public understand that "I am the one who decides."

Was Smith the board member who sent the nasty gram to a Westfield mom?

To the last poster who asked us to behave......

Why behave? Too many parents are still licking their wounds from the verbal thrashing received during the hearings and the board's decision to redistrict.

I don't know for sure, but I have heard that CAPS is looking at other issues. Maybe another REPORT CARD is in the making.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: established ()
Date: May 15, 2008 10:33PM

Anyone following the RD is by now convinced that Stu Gibson is pure evil.

Not So Obvious Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gibson is a hypocrite Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If you go back a few years during the SB
> minutes
> > for the boundary discussion on SOCO, Stu Gibson
> > admonishes the PTAs for their interference in
> the
> > boundary process. How come he actively
> > participated with the South Lakes PTA when it
> > suited him?
> >
> > I might just ask him that question at the next
> > community meeting he is at. I can't wait for
> him
> > to fumble on an answer.
>
> I think you know the answer to your own question -
> it suited him because it served a school in his
> district that his own daughters attended, a large
> group of Reston voters in his district, and his
> own self-serving vision that an RD would serve
> broader societal goals. I don't think he has any
> problem justifying it to himself, nor would I
> expect him to fumble on the topic at a future
> meeting. Just make sure you don't end up the one
> running for cover when he compares himself to
> Mother Teresa and brands you a racist for asking
> the question.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: hop ()
Date: May 15, 2008 11:13PM

300!

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: smith needs morality ()
Date: May 15, 2008 11:30PM

Yes-Smith is the one who sent the "toxic and vile" email to the PTA pres about the Westfield mom. She NEVER apologized to Jones about calling her vile and toxic-she only apologized to her that she saw it.

She lied to Wash Post reporter Marc Fisher on the apology. She needs to go. Although she did bitch slap Bradsher when the SCB whined that Springfield had no all day kindergarten programs.

I think the other members are sick of Bradsher already.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 16, 2008 01:22AM

I have not had the stomach to watch Channel 21 since the redistricting hearings. I had enough built up anger and nausea that will last a lifetime. So are the member behaving themselves?

Does anyone have an access or knowledge of how to find out how many adminstrative staff and support staff positions there are?

It seems there is a direct correlation between decreasing classroom teachers and classroom assistants,increasing class size and increasing adminstrative staff. Am I the only one that is bothered by the excess of administrative staff? I bet many of these folks command a high salary.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Moving On ()
Date: May 16, 2008 01:31AM

This is sort of like watching the odometer turn over to 100,000. Does the poster whose posting rolls over to page 300 get to tell Gibson that he really does not have a fan club?

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 03:59AM

>>>Do most lower socio-economic types feel that they can't do anything about it, too? I'm willing to bet so.<<<

That depends on their race. Recent Asian immigrants may be lower socio-economic types, but they do not intend to remain that way. Nor do they expect their children will be poor.

Blacks? That's another story. Since liberals have been telling them for 50 years that they can't possibly succeed with out lots of assistance, many have come to believe it. It's a sin and a shame.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 04:03AM

>>>Stu Gibson "Socioeconomic factors prevent us from educating these kids"
(aka if you are poor in FCPS you will be ignored)


Did Gibson really say that? Seriously? He might want to speak with educators in Richmond and Newport News, where the Black students are much poorer, the school systems spend far less per pupil, yet their Black students out perform those in FCPS. It can be done!

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 04:09AM

edna Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have not had the stomach to watch Channel 21
> since the redistricting hearings. I had enough
> built up anger and nausea that will last a
> lifetime. So are the member behaving themselves?
>
> Does anyone have an access or knowledge of how to
> find out how many adminstrative staff and support
> staff positions there are?
>
> It seems there is a direct correlation between
> decreasing classroom teachers and classroom
> assistants,increasing class size and increasing
> adminstrative staff. Am I the only one that is
> bothered by the excess of administrative staff? I
> bet many of these folks command a high salary.

No, you cannot find that information. You have to ask directly and even then you get the wrong answers. Dale says we have 22,000 employees, with 13,000 teachers. Do the math. If that were true, the average class size would be 12.7. Press him further, and he will admit that 13,000 includes social workers, psychologists, and lots of other personnel who don't teach. We have about 7,000 teachers, give or take 500. Yes, 14,000 administrators for 7,000 teachers is ridiculous. Lets make half of the administrators return to the classrooms and teach.

BTW, the 14,000 administrators does not include things like cafeteria workers, facilities workers, janitors, etc. That's a separate budget.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: word ()
Date: May 16, 2008 06:38AM

To paraphrase, Gibson said that the socio-economic kids are poor performers and there's not much we can do about that... and the smart kids will thrive regardless of their environment / school.

If that's true then why are we spending all of this money on the school system. They're just baby sitters according to Gibson.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: sherman's march ()
Date: May 16, 2008 07:47AM

sure about sherman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 1. I am damn sure Sherman's March knows nothing of
> Civil War history.
>
> 2. Who in their right mind would be a SLHS
> supporter if they had no vested interest, property
> or otherwise, in seeing that school be rescued?
>
> 3. Sherman needs no help looking like an A-S-S.
>
> There are a number of parents outside of the West
> County area who are sympathetic to the RD crowd on
> the other hand, because we see how they were
> railroaded by the SB and PTA and want to make sure
> it does not happen in our district.
>
> South Lakes has declared war on more people than
> they realize.
>
> My prediction is CAPS will grow to 5000 members by
> year end, if not before then.


The little joke is that one of the CAPS's most fangless leaders, Dan Carney, in the Great March backwards is the one who first invoked ol' William Sherman in support of the great struggle against RD and everything SL.

So piss off. He's your icon. Deal with it, scorched earth, Sun Tzu, and all the other war metaphors you choose to use. Pathetic.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: word ()
Date: May 16, 2008 08:05AM

Save the date...

Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support

The Leadership Class at South Lakes High School, in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host a thank you party for those involved in supporting South Lakes High School during the redistricting process. The party is open to the public and will take place in the high school gym on Tuesday night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more information call South Lakes High School at 703-715-4500.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: taxpayer ()
Date: May 16, 2008 08:57AM

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> To paraphrase, Gibson said that the socio-economic
> kids are poor performers and there's not much we
> can do about that... and the smart kids will
> thrive regardless of their environment / school.
>
> If that's true then why are we spending all of
> this money on the school system. They're just baby
> sitters according to Gibson.

I read that Loudoun has a math-science-tech high school program now. Prince William got a $100,000 grant from Virginia to put in a program that would be co-located at another school. Students would ride a bus like the academies and PW george Mason might be involved. Every IB diploma candidate at South Lakes could easily get transported to Marshall.

If students WERE NOT pupil placing at SL's for IB prior to redistricting then why would Gibson think they want IB now? It's fiscally irresponsible to maintain that program at all these sites.

The Loudoun school board members certainly asked a lot more questions for developing their budget. One said low profiency ESOL had class sizes as low as 3-7 students, then about 10-15. Now I don't get that. Teacher+books+20 to 25 desks is very reasonable to me especially since in Loudoun 63% speak Spanish. What are they in Fairfax? Put all Spanish ESOL together as a separate budget item.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Wesfield Mom ()
Date: May 16, 2008 10:57AM

Ugh. Thanks for the stereotyping, insults and name-calling, not to mention the behind the scenes politicking.


If you are just mean and determined enough you can push other people around for your own advantage. What a great team the SL PTA and the SL Leadership students make.

They all deserve one another.

Westfield Mom






word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Save the date...
>
> Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
>
> The Leadership Class at South Lakes High School,
> in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host a
> thank you party for those involved in supporting
> South Lakes High School during the redistricting
> process. The party is open to the public and will
> take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> information call South Lakes High School at
> 703-715-4500.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: SL Mom ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:13AM

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Save the date...
>
> Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
>
> The Leadership Class at South Lakes High School,
> in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host a
> thank you party for those involved in supporting
> South Lakes High School during the redistricting
> process. The party is open to the public and will
> take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> information call South Lakes High School at
> 703-715-4500.


Awesome! We'll be there. The party should be a lot of fun. Great idea!!

We can also talk about the new SLCAPS.org website plans.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Bigger Joke ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:18AM

Sherman-

The Hypocrisy Prize goes to the SL parent and architect of the RD whose own kid is pupil placed at Marshall HS.

Give me a royal break.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: False Facts Again? ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:28AM

Bigger Joke Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sherman-
>
> The Hypocrisy Prize goes to the SL parent and
> architect of the RD whose own kid is pupil placed
> at Marshall HS.
>
> Give me a royal break.

FALSE facts again?

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Baffled ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:30AM

SL Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> word Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Save the date...
> >
> > Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
> >
> > The Leadership Class at South Lakes High
> School,
> > in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host
> a
> > thank you party for those involved in
> supporting
> > South Lakes High School during the
> redistricting
> > process. The party is open to the public and
> will
> > take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> > night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> > information call South Lakes High School at
> > 703-715-4500.
>
>
> Awesome! We'll be there. The party should be a lot
> of fun. Great idea!!
>
> We can also talk about the new SLCAPS.org website
> plans.

Is Gibson going to be there? After all, he helped spearhead this RD with such zest.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: sherman's march ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:52AM

Bigger Joke Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sherman-
>
> The Hypocrisy Prize goes to the SL parent and
> architect of the RD whose own kid is pupil placed
> at Marshall HS.
>
> Give me a royal break.



Check your facts. First time for every thing, even on this inbred website.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Not So Obvious ()
Date: May 16, 2008 12:08PM

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Save the date...
>
> Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
>
> The Leadership Class at South Lakes High School,
> in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host a
> thank you party for those involved in supporting
> South Lakes High School during the redistricting
> process. The party is open to the public and will
> take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> information call South Lakes High School at
> 703-715-4500.

I have a lot of admiration for the SL students who held their heads high and spoke favorably of their school during the RD. I have far less admiration for parents and School Board members who supported a disruptive and flawed RD process to advance their own agendas - seemingly on the grounds that the ends justified the means. They may have prevailed in the short term, but done long-term damage to the reputation of the School Board and parents' trust in the system that will not easily be repaired. That will have real consequences for other students and other schools in the future.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Another Lurker ()
Date: May 16, 2008 12:42PM

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Save the date...
>
> Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support



If this is for real, it seems a bit premature, and perhaps in bad taste.

Hmm, there's no sign of it on the South Lakes web page. Not necessarily significant but...

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Wesfield Mom ()
Date: May 16, 2008 01:00PM

Not on the school web page, but on the PSTA/PAC page

http://www.southlakesptsa.org/



Another Lurker Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> word Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Save the date...
> >
> > Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
>
>
>
> If this is for real, it seems a bit premature, and
> perhaps in bad taste.
>
> Hmm, there's no sign of it on the South Lakes web
> page. Not necessarily significant but...

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Half empty school ()
Date: May 16, 2008 01:14PM

They can have all the partys they want in their half empty school that costs the taxpayers of this county 70 million dollars.

We could have used that money to fix the 50 schools that are in poor sharpe.



Wesfield Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not on the school web page, but on the PSTA/PAC
> page
>
> http://www.southlakesptsa.org/
>
>
>
> Another Lurker Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > word Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Save the date...
> > >
> > > Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
> >
> >
> >
> > If this is for real, it seems a bit premature,
> and
> > perhaps in bad taste.
> >
> > Hmm, there's no sign of it on the South Lakes
> web
> > page. Not necessarily significant but...

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Clown Shoe ()
Date: May 16, 2008 01:16PM

Bigger Joke Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sherman-
>
> The Hypocrisy Prize goes to the SL parent and
> architect of the RD whose own kid is pupil placed
> at Marshall HS.
>
> Give me a royal break.

So Marshall HS is the best High School in Fairfax County?

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Teacher hits student ()
Date: May 16, 2008 02:06PM

Now we have teachers hitting students.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Alexandria teacher accused of assaulting student
May 16, 2008 - 1:00pm

Kristi King, WTOP Radio

ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A local elementary school teacher is charged with assault after an incident involving a 12-year-old student.

Fairfax County Police have not released much information about the alleged assault.

Police say the incident occurred at Cameron Elementary School on Wednesday when the teacher, 42-year-old Maria Waugh, had a discussion with the student.

"Apparently, there was some discussion about the student's behavior and that ended with an alleged assault on the student," Fairfax County Police officer Camille Neville says.

The student was not injured, police say. He went home and told his parents about the incident, and they contacted police.

A Fairfax County Public Schools spokesman says Waugh is longer employed at the school.

(Copyright 2008 by WTOP. All Rights Reserved.)

Kristi King, WTOP Radio

ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A local elementary school teacher is charged with assault after an incident involving a 12-year-old student.

Fairfax County Police have not released much information about the alleged assault.

Police say the incident occurred at Cameron Elementary School on Wednesday when the teacher, 42-year-old Maria Waugh, had a discussion with the student.

"Apparently, there was some discussion about the student's behavior and that ended with an alleged assault on the student," Fairfax County Police officer Camille Neville says.

The student was not injured, police say. He went home and told his parents about the incident, and they contacted police.

A Fairfax County Public Schools spokesman says Waugh is longer employed at the school.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: quantum ()
Date: May 16, 2008 02:27PM

boo hoo - note that I did not infer that the entire group of admits (or is it matriculants?) consisted of minorities. Thankfully, SLHS has its share of higher achieving minorities, undoubtedly quite a few of which are going to take advantage of UVa's (and other top schools) very generous preferences that are accorded to certain designated minority groups. The fact that so many get admitted is of course a good thing, but given the extreme nature of top college admission statistics these days (with Ivy League schools at 10% admit rates, and UVa and the like at 30% or worse from a Northern Va perspective), significant preferences, even if not sizable in terms of raw numbers, can lead to misleading impressions. Put another way, the average family with a competitive kid moving into South Lakes or any other high school is going to want to know how the school stacks up in terms of admission for their child, and that "average" kid in this profile isn't likely going to be able to play the racial lottery to their advantage. Mentioning this common sense paradigm makes some uncomfortable, but I don't see how keeping salient facts secret (which is a linchpin of affirmative action, by the way) affords any real comfort.

A common, but facile debate technique is to grossly overstate or misstate the concise principle that the counter-party avers as opposed to addressing a point concisely and directly. That is not a big deal that you have done so - in fact - it infers that you know that there is a great deal of currency to what I am saying - but to question a person's intelligence while doing so, may encourage, let's say, an invitation to contest one's level of intelligence and education. Some of us might gladly take up that invitation (except with respect to that MIT fellow on here a while back - he self-authenticatingly made me both prudent and cautious). Let me know if you are willing. It is of course all in fun.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 16, 2008 04:57PM

ssshhhh

don't tell anyone by the admits to UVA and W&M from SLHS are by and large (gasp) WHITE!

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 16, 2008 04:58PM

of course...I meant but not by

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 16, 2008 05:01PM

and are middle and upper middle class to boot

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: disgusting ()
Date: May 16, 2008 07:03PM

SLPTSA is having a victory celebration on their RD victory!!. They are celebrating their success is forcing dozens of families out of their homes, hundreds of parents pupil placing and driving every day, thousands of broken student dreams, broken friendships. I bet Stu Gibson is behind this gloating.

http://www.southlakesptsa.org

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: SLPTSA ass holes ()
Date: May 16, 2008 07:20PM

SLPTSA ass holes and Stu Gibson can kiss my ass. I hope they are happy with a half empty school.

Parents who are RD need to do everything in their power so that their children never go to SL.



disgusting Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLPTSA is having a victory celebration on their RD
> victory!!. They are celebrating their success is
> forcing dozens of families out of their homes,
> hundreds of parents pupil placing and driving
> every day, thousands of broken student dreams,
> broken friendships. I bet Stu Gibson is behind
> this gloating.
>
> http://www.southlakesptsa.org

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Re: high school redistricting/Teacher hits studen
Posted by: Cameron Elementary Parent ()
Date: May 16, 2008 08:11PM

The incident at Cameron Elementary is very sad.

Some, not all, of our public school students feel entitled to receive a free education. They feel it is owed them.

They disregard the simple element that learning is a series of partnerships. A partnership between student and teacher, between school and home, between family and staff, etc...

How did it happen that the parents of the student went to the police first before going to speak with Mr. Towery our principle? Where is the partnership between family and school in this picture?

How can the system allow an unruly 12 year old to decide a teacher's fate? A teacher who dedicated almost a decade to giving to others?

This whole incident is so very, very sad !!!

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: xdpgoe, ()
Date: May 16, 2008 08:44PM

The incident at Cameron Elementary is very sad.

Some, not all, of our public school teachers feel entitled to receive a free living. They feel it is owed them.

They disregard the simple element that learning is a series of partnerships. A partnership between student and teacher, between school and home, between family and staff, etc...

How did it happen that the teacher of the student violently attacked the child before going to speak with Mr. Towery our principle or the parents? Where is the partnership between family and school in this picture?

How can the system allow a vicious abusive 42 year old to bully a defenseless child? A child who never harmed anyone in his life?

This whole incident is so very, very sad !!!

Excpet the miserable gutless lowlife bullying teacher got fired. That is happy news.

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Re: high school redistricting/Teacher hits studen
Posted by: Cameron Elementary Parent ()
Date: May 16, 2008 09:39PM

SHE RESIGNED !!

But gosh, why am I even here? Why should I waste my time on someone like you who is so base?

I should have figured that here are a bunch of "no action" whiners who sit and gripe about life online and do nothing to change things.

Enjoy your your "Virtual 'Happy' Lives" !

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Re: high school redistricting/Teacher hits studen
Posted by: Cameron Elementary Parent ()
Date: May 16, 2008 09:45PM

Have you met the "poor defenseless bully of a child"? If you have met the guy you wouldn't be saying what you are saying. Go find out more details first before you start saying "defenseless". The rudeness that spews forth out of some these rude, arrogant, totally not interested in learning kids is scary. Except what is really scary is that their families make them like this. Most likely this poor guy does not get the attention from his family and then goes and acts out on the teachers.

Get some facts first.

This is so disgusting!!

Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: xdpgoe, (IP Logged)
Date: May 16, 2008 08:44PM

The incident at Cameron Elementary is very sad.

Some, not all, of our public school teachers feel entitled to receive a free living. They feel it is owed them.

They disregard the simple element that learning is a series of partnerships. A partnership between student and teacher, between school and home, between family and staff, etc...

How did it happen that the teacher of the student violently attacked the child before going to speak with Mr. Towery our principle or the parents? Where is the partnership between family and school in this picture?

How can the system allow a vicious abusive 42 year old to bully a defenseless child? A child who never harmed anyone in his life?

This whole incident is so very, very sad !!!

Excpet the miserable gutless lowlife bullying teacher got fired. That is happy news.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: wonderful teachers galore ()
Date: May 16, 2008 10:32PM

WTF is this woman talking about??? Go to the principal??? That is the funniest thing I have ever seen on this blog. Let's all try to visualize what this objective, fair minded mouthpiece for the FCPS politboro would have done:

Parent: Your teacher hit my son
Principal: Well, I am sure there is a misunderstanding.
Parent: You are not listening-your teacher hit my son.
Principal: Let's talk about this another day.

Next day- teacher is shooed out of school and cloistered. Principal holds his ground and never returns parent's calls. School system circles their wagons and parent is forced to hire an attorney or go to the cops.

This happened at Saratoga Elementary School about 5 years ago. Teacher assaulted student-many students witnessed it. Principal Pat Conklin did NOTHING to protect this child-NOTHING. Teacher quietly left the school-retired with a fat pension or got sent to Gatehouse where all the other rejects go. The parent was so disgusted with this principal that she and several parents picketed outside the school. TRUE STORY.

We must protect our students-they are powerless. Teachers have their unions and the army of school attorneys to protect them. Let's not for a second, assume this child is the villain.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 16, 2008 10:32PM

Does that mean that if someone who did not support the redistricting to SL would not be permitted to attend?

The last time that I looked, SL was a public building....in fact a $63 million dollar building.

Although the message said the party is opened to the public, however, the first line states that it is a thank you for those involved in supporting SL during the redistricing process.

This sure does not sound very welcoming to me. Does someone plan on asking that nonsupporters stand to the left and refrain from eating the cookies.

Please tell me that this announcement is a spoof.

Save the date...
>
> Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
>
> The Leadership Class at South Lakes High School,
> in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host a
> thank you party for those involved in supporting
> South Lakes High School during the redistricting
> process. The party is open to the public and will
> take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> information call South Lakes High School at
> 703-715-4500.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 16, 2008 10:34PM

I find it extremely amusing that the anti-redistricting folks are expressing outrage that the SL PTA is having a thank you reception for those who provided support for SL during the RD process.

IMO the only reason the PTA felt it necessary to get involved at all was because of the organized protests by other PTAs and neighborhood groups. I attended the meetings and the SL PTA had virtually no presence at the first meeting as opposed as the other groups who were passing out talking points and came in school colors.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Just the Facts ()
Date: May 16, 2008 10:47PM

Of the 55 SL students in the IB Diploma program and the 44 who successfully received the IB diploma, what were the demographics of the students?

I have heard that SL refuses to release that information. Surely this is not the truth.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: edna ()
Date: May 16, 2008 10:58PM

Do you think they care....SLPTSA was after one thing as their leaders often said....they wanted your kids because........




disgusting Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLPTSA is having a victory celebration on their RD
> victory!!. They are celebrating their success is
> forcing dozens of families out of their homes,
> hundreds of parents pupil placing and driving
> every day, thousands of broken student dreams,
> broken friendships. I bet Stu Gibson is behind
> this gloating.
>
> http://www.southlakesptsa.org

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: who to believe ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:04PM

Hey Cameron parent-

Get in the same stupid line behind the parents who strongly supported the Centreville Elem asst principal who was growing pot in his house-what a great guy!Or the Chantilly parents who rally behind the track coach/foreign language teacher who was trolling for teenage girls on the internet and got busted. Oh and let's not forget the Chanilly teacher who was busted last week trying to buy meth.

You are an idiot. My money is on the kid.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:18PM

word Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Save the date...
>
> Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
>
> The Leadership Class at South Lakes High School,
> in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host a
> thank you party for those involved in supporting
> South Lakes High School during the redistricting
> process. The party is open to the public and will
> take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> information call South Lakes High School at
> 703-715-4500.

Hahaha........good joke.

Right? This is a joke, isn't it?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:22PM

Bigger Joke Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sherman-
>
> The Hypocrisy Prize goes to the SL parent and
> architect of the RD whose own kid is pupil placed
> at Marshall HS.
>
> Give me a royal break.

Yes, that is hilarious! She's quoted in all the papers, talking about how great South Lakes is, how everyone should be happy to go there, blah, blah, blah, and she pupil places at Marshall! She's never had a child at South Lakes! TOO funny!

I wonder how many people who supported the RD have never had a child go to South Lakes, and never will?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Charmin' ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:24PM

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> word Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Save the date...
> >
> > Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
> >
> > The Leadership Class at South Lakes High
> School,
> > in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host
> a
> > thank you party for those involved in
> supporting
> > South Lakes High School during the
> redistricting
> > process. The party is open to the public and
> will
> > take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> > night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> > information call South Lakes High School at
> > 703-715-4500.
>
> Hahaha........good joke.
>
> Right? This is a joke, isn't it?


Almost as funny as the Fairfax CAPS "victory" party scheduled after the 2/28 vote in Reston's Lake Anne....hahahahaha.....joke, wasn't it?

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:27PM

False Facts Again? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bigger Joke Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Sherman-
> >
> > The Hypocrisy Prize goes to the SL parent and
> > architect of the RD whose own kid is pupil
> placed
> > at Marshall HS.
> >
> > Give me a royal break.
>
> FALSE facts again?

Nothing false about it. Ask Caroline Hemenway, the woman so often quoted in the paper during redistricting, where her child goes to school. She has NO children at SL. She pupil placed her child at Marshall. It's the facts.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: so have you heard ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:31PM

My opinion in the whole redistricting issue is that if the County Supervisors are going to cluster lower income housing, apts, etc in certain areas of the county, it is up to the school board to ensure that the schools in those areas are not adversely impacted...plain and simple.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: mariokart ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:32PM

I don't know about you, you excited? I'm excited. We're almost to 15000 posts.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:34PM

SL Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> word Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Save the date...
> >
> > Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
> >
> > The Leadership Class at South Lakes High
> School,
> > in conjunction with parent volunteers, will host
> a
> > thank you party for those involved in
> supporting
> > South Lakes High School during the
> redistricting
> > process. The party is open to the public and
> will
> > take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> > night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> > information call South Lakes High School at
> > 703-715-4500.
>
>
> Awesome! We'll be there. The party should be a lot
> of fun. Great idea!!
>
> We can also talk about the new SLCAPS.org website
> plans.

I am sure that you and Stu will have a blast at your little party, along with the ALL the new students, all 10 of them. I hear Stu has written some great new Dr. Seuss poems for the occasion and will be leading cheers along with the PTA President, Elizabeth Aging-hippy, in her granny glasses, ever fashionable tie dyed granny dresses, and shag hair cut. What fun! We all enjoy 1960's costume parties. It's SOOOOO Reston! Be sure to take lots of pictures for us. We're all just SICK about having to miss the fun, but we need to do laundry that night, and wash our hair. Darn!

Let us know when your little website exists, since it doesn't now.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:37PM

Baffled Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SL Mom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > word Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Save the date...
> > >
> > > Appreciation Party for Redistricting Support
> > >
> > > The Leadership Class at South Lakes High
> > School,
> > > in conjunction with parent volunteers, will
> host
> > a
> > > thank you party for those involved in
> > supporting
> > > South Lakes High School during the
> > redistricting
> > > process. The party is open to the public and
> > will
> > > take place in the high school gym on Tuesday
> > > night, May 20, from 6 to 8 p.m. For more
> > > information call South Lakes High School at
> > > 703-715-4500.
> >
> >
> > Awesome! We'll be there. The party should be a
> lot
> > of fun. Great idea!!
> >
> > We can also talk about the new SLCAPS.org
> website
> > plans.
>
> Is Gibson going to be there? After all, he
> helped spearhead this RD with such zest.

Of course he will be there! He can't wait to lead the cheers and give a speech! It's his biggest victory, of course he wants to celebrate. (Don't tell him it really didn't work, and he will be VERY lucky if SL's nets an additional 200 students over the next 5 years.) Shhhhh...........don't spoil his fun.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:39PM

so have you heard Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My opinion in the whole redistricting issue is
> that if the County Supervisors are going to
> cluster lower income housing, apts, etc in certain
> areas of the county, it is up to the school board
> to ensure that the schools in those areas are not
> adversely impacted...plain and simple.

Yeah, well, that's too hard for them. They can't figure out how to do that, like the rest of state has.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: vmwq7lyn; ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:45PM

But gosh, why am I even here? Why should I waste my time on someone like you who is so base? So base and vulgar as to stupidly and blindly defend a brutal bully who mercilessly attacks helpless children.

I should have figured that here are a bunch of "no action" whiners who sit and gripe about life online and do nothing to change things.

Enjoy your your "Virtual 'Happy' Lives" !

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: utp ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:46PM

But gosh, why am I even here? Why should I waste my time on someone like you who is so base? So base and vulgar as to stupidly and blindly defend a brutal bully who mercilessly attacks helpless children.

I should have figured that here are a bunch of "no action" whiners who sit and gripe about life online and do nothing to change things.

Enjoy your your "Virtual 'Happy' Lives" !

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Not a Class Act ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:46PM

Sorry Neem the message is on their website. [www.southlakesptsa.org]

Do you think the SLPTSA will give a grieving party for all those parents: (1) who valued their child's education so much that they were willing to sell their homes at a loss in order to move into another school district; (2) or who had to tell their kids they can no longer play sports with their school friends because they now go to Reston schools but live in Vienna: (3) or they will have to go to a middle school (Hughes) or a high school (SL) where the academic ranking is much lower than the schools they were supposed to attend?

No, Neems.....SLPTSA throws a CELEBRATION IN YOUR FACE PARTY!

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:49PM

Wow, that's just pathetic, but who ever thought that those people had any class, manners, sensitivity or taste? If they cared about anyone, other than themselves, they wouldn't have forced this down the throats of so many.

What a bunch of insensitive clods. They should be embarrassed, but they know no shame.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neem ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:51PM

Not a Class Act Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry Neem the message is on their website.
>
> Do you think the SLPTSA will give a grieving party
> for all those parents: (1) who valued their
> child's education so much that they were willing
> to sell their homes at a loss in order to move
> into another school district; (2) or who had to
> tell their kids they can no longer play sports
> with their school friends because they now go to
> Reston schools but live in Vienna: (3) or they
> will have to go to a middle school (Hughes) or a
> high school (SL) where the academic ranking is
> much lower than the schools they were supposed to
> attend?
>
> No, Neems.....SLPTSA throws a CELEBRATION IN YOUR
> FACE PARTY!


It's "Neen", dumbass. She's only submitted 79,000 posts so far. And many of those kids play Reston sports and cheerlead already, btw. Boo freackin hoo.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: vbe ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:53PM

"Have you seen the "decicated teacher" berating, intimidating, and slappping her students? If you had seen the ugly attack you wouldn't be saying what you are saying. Go find out more details first before you start calling that nasty thuggish teacher "dedicated"". The appaling violence that spews forth out of some these cruel, arrogant, totally not interested in teaching adults is truly scary. Except what is really scary is that their administrstors and bureacrats rally around them and encourage this despicable behavior. Most likely this poor wretch does not get the attention from her family and then goes and acts out on the innocent student."

Get some facts first.

This is so disgusting!!

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: formerhick76 ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:53PM

Neen Wrote:
> Yeah, well, that's too hard for them. They can't
> figure out how to do that, like the rest of state
> has.

Not sure what you were arguing here.

North/South Arlington. East/West PWC. East/West Henrico. Even in Tidewater, there's VA Beach (Princess Anne and Gang er I meant Green Run), Norfolk (Maury and Norcom), etc., etc.

But in general most big jurisdictions in VA have a po' part and a rich part, and the rich part has better schools (or are you going to argue that Wakefield is better than Yorktown, Varina/Highland Springs/Henrico better than Freeman/Hermitage/Deep Run, Freedom/Hoodbridge/Gar-Field better than Osbourn Park/Brentsville, etc.?)

Fairfax is no different.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: formerhick76 ()
Date: May 16, 2008 11:57PM

Just the Facts Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Of the 55 SL students in the IB Diploma program
> and the 44 who successfully received the IB
> diploma, what were the demographics of the
> students?
>
> I have heard that SL refuses to release that
> information. Surely this is not the truth.

Why does it matter?

Let us pretend, for a moment, that they are ethnically and socioeconomically diverse. This proves that anyone can succeed at South Lakes.

Let us pretend, for a moment, that they are as White as the average rural high school in Kansas. This demonstrates that the brown people didn't hold back the high-achieving White students.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neem ()
Date: May 17, 2008 12:00AM

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow, that's just pathetic, but who ever thought
> that those people had any class, manners,
> sensitivity or taste? If they cared about anyone,
> other than themselves, they wouldn't have forced
> this down the throats of so many.
>
> What a bunch of insensitive clods. They should be
> embarrassed, but they know no shame.


Cuz Neen> I thought you were going to make sure a SL kid would not get into Princeton this year. You said it would never happen. What up, girl. You slippin'? You promised.

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Re: high school redistricting
Posted by: Neen ()
Date: May 17, 2008 12:04AM

Huh? I have no clue what you are talking about.

How would I prevent someone from going to Princeton? And why would I bother?

I sure wish that I had the power that folks in Reston think I have. That would be awesome. I could move mountains and part the seas.

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