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Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 07:47AM

My child just started MS & she loves all of her teachers, but one. I know it's early in the year, but I'd like to nip this issue in the bud. There are already several red flags, but the main problem is that this teacher is creating a hostile environment of her classroom. We've been lucky in that all of our child's previous teachers have been wonderful so I don't know how to approach this very sticky issue. Advice from teachers and parents would be appreciated, because I know there are two sides to every story.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Duchess ()
Date: September 17, 2010 07:52AM

I have 3 kids,now grown, each went through FCPS, and did not hit a teacher/bully until HS. Then, it was unbelievable when it happened- each a horror story. The school did nothing, one one terrible soul sucking teacher is still employed there, despite being transferred around and multiple complaints.

Schedule a meeting, and if you are not satisfied, demand - I mean DEMAND a change in teachers. I let them pussy foot around this too long in one case, and ended up sending my kid to private school, which worked out best actually but was pricy. The day I un-enrolled the principal came down and said to me " We could change the teacher". This was after weeks of asking and complaining to the School Board too. So don't let them tell you they cannot possibly change teachers.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:05AM

What a nightmare. The problem here is that there isn't another teacher; he is the only one who teaches this course.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: justsayin ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:40AM

What exactly is hostile, what is the behavior?

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Steve K ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:48AM

No one is giving details.

What qualifies as hostile, getting a C on a paper because your child doesn't write good?

All my children went through FCPS and never had any issues worth addressing.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:03AM

Not grades, but attitude. One example: When a child forgot his pencils, and asked someone next to him if he could borrow one, the teacher went up to him and said, "I guess you're out of luck." Needless to say, he did not allow him to borrow a pencil.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: slubdawg ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:11AM

Document the incidents that create the hostile environment, take them to the principal, and as someone else said, "DEMAND" something be done. If that teacher is the only one teaching that subject simply demand that the administration take action immediately. And, don't let them "pussy foot" around, they will. Remember you might be your child's only advocate in a situation like this. Be sure that you counsel your kid not to act out because they will then use that as the cause of the problem.

If the local shool administration won't do anything, escalate the issue. Principals do not like to have to go to the area or pryamid office, or whatever it's called now. And don't sit around and hope they do something. If the upper admin doesn't act in your behalf go to your school board member and raise hell there, and document all the time you have spent talking with the various stuffed shirts, whether it's in person or email. I'd suggest email because then you have a record of what and when it was said and to whom.

If you have the money, take your kid to a therapist and have them say the kid is depressed, or has some anxiety issues or something because of this teacher then threaten to sue. I can assure you that if you have enough money to have a lawyer just send a letter to the shcool system they will respond somehow.

Most teachers do a great job in very trying circumstances, but there are always a few nutjobs, like any line of work. I think the primary problem is that the administrors and central administration is so focused on promoting their own careers and/or agendas that they lose sight of the needs of kids and teachers. I would submit that if all the shcools administration didn't show for a week, the shcools would be fine, the teachers would continue to do the best job possible. Oh, one thing a shcool cannot do without is the secretaries, they are the ones who really run the schools.

That said there are teachers who need to find some other line of work, but for many reasons nothing can be done.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Nova_lifer ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:12AM

Probably won't come to school without a pencil again. Lesson learned. I hope this is not a complaint against a demanding teacher vs a 'nice' teacher. I have a daughter who needs teachers who are stronger willed than she is will always try to get her way.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 09:16AM

Nova_lifer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Probably won't come to school without a pencil
> again. Lesson learned. I hope this is not a
> complaint against a demanding teacher vs a 'nice'
> teacher. I have a daughter who needs teachers who
> are stronger willed than she is will always try to
> get her way.


Agreed. From this example, it doesn't sound like the teacher is being unfair or a bully, just setting high expectations.

I had a teacher in high school who insisted on consistency on everything I turned in. In other words, I couldn't go from writing "inches" to using ". At the time I thought the teacher was a dick. But it has been a life lesson that has served me well since.

Maybe you should let your kid figure this out on her own. It might make her a better person in the end.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: slubdawg ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:17AM

Nova_lifer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Probably won't come to school without a pencil
> again. Lesson learned. I hope this is not a
> complaint against a demanding teacher vs a 'nice'
> teacher. I have a daughter who needs teachers who
> are stronger willed than she is will always try to
> get her way.


The above is the answer to most of what is wrong with schools today. If all parents were as in tune with their kids and held their kids responsbile the education would be in good shape!

Does anyone really think that the kids in Japan, etc are basically smarter than any place else. I don't, but...the value of education that is put on education and the expectation of student's to excel is what drives their success.

We need to change the "culture" of education more than anything else.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 09:26AM

slubdawg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nova_lifer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Probably won't come to school without a pencil
> > again. Lesson learned. I hope this is not a
> > complaint against a demanding teacher vs a
> 'nice'
> > teacher. I have a daughter who needs teachers
> who
> > are stronger willed than she is will always try
> to
> > get her way.
>
>
> The above is the answer to most of what is wrong
> with schools today. If all parents were as in
> tune with their kids and held their kids
> responsbile the education would be in good shape!
>
>
> Does anyone really think that the kids in Japan,
> etc are basically smarter than any place else. I
> don't, but...the value of education that is put on
> education and the expectation of student's to
> excel is what drives their success.
>
> We need to change the "culture" of education more
> than anything else.


Agreed again. What do you think happens to students in Japan or China if they forget their pencil? They are shamed and embarrassed in front of their classmates...as they should be.

Because education isn't some fucking game. Do you think the OP let's her daughter go to soccer practice without her cleats? Fuck no! But going to school without a pencil? Oh yeah. That's fucking fine.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:42AM

Thanks for the advice, but I don't think I'll go to the extent of taking my child to a therapist to gain some progress in the school system!:-) I just want this to be a good experience and it's not starting out that way. My child dreads this class & it's only the 2nd week of school. I don't have a problematic kid who needs rough-handling in the classroom. In fact, my kid is very level-headed and doesn't act out at all. Earned straight As every year thus far, respects authority, etc. Having said that, I realize how tough it is on teachers to manage every kind of kid out there, but I also know there's a nice way and an abusive way to teach a child a lesson.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 09:44AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Having said that, I realize how
> tough it is on teachers to manage every kind of
> kid out there, but I also know there's a nice way
> and an abusive way to teach a child a lesson.

There's nothing abusive about a teacher expecting a kid to be prepared for class. If you consider it abusive, maybe you should be seeing the therapist.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:48AM

I'm really soliciting those who've gone through such an experience and have some sound advice.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Starchild ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:02AM

Tell your kid stop fuckin' around in class. And to use a pen.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 10:20AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm really soliciting those who've gone through
> such an experience and have some sound advice.


I have. I am giving you advice. Tell your kid to toughen up and bring a pencil next time.

Seriously, your kid is going to have to learn how to deal with difficult people. Unless the teacher is doing something that is out and out wrong, I think it is a good life lesson for your kid.

Stop being a helicopter parent and let your kid learn how to deal with life.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Nova_lifer ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:23AM

Talk to the teacher, period.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 10:24AM

Nova_lifer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Talk to the teacher, period.


I wouldn't do that. It will make the situation worse for the kid.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:33AM

For the record, it was NOT my kid who forgot a pencil. AND it has nothing to do with 'toughening up'. My kid is very tough and will endure this class whether I intervene or not. I would prefer that my child enjoy a very challenging class for a 7th grader - Algebra I - & concentrate on the academics rather than a troublesome teacher.

Back-to-School Night is next week so I'll reserve judgement until then.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Duchess ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:34AM

Its not just the pencil. I probably know this teacher.

My child was very shy, mild and meek in class and NEVER a behavior problem for any teacher ever. Not so true of my other kids, but true for this one. My daughter got "zero for the day" - get a few of those and they equal and "F" pretty fast. Her crimes?

1) Loaning a kid a pencil during class
2) Supply list asked ONLY for "index cards" she bought the wrong size +/or color
3) She brought multiple rubber bands (size and colors) to class after supply list experience outlined in #2 - and that was wrong also - so "Zero for the Day"
4) Teacher asked for an essay on "explain your astrological sign". She explained - quite eloquently in a well written essay this was an ENglish class - about her astrological sign and why she did not believe in astrology. Zero on the assignment for being an unbeliever.

We tried to schedule a meeting with the teacher- she refused to respond to us via phone, email and a letter I sent US MAIL return receipt required - which she signed. We complained to the Guidance Counselor, the VP for her grade- nothing. My daughter tried to switch to the class across the hall meeting at the same time, and was told it was because she had a crush on the new male teacher teaching that class. Request denied.

Also, this was a first period 7:15 a.m. class. Students who had this teacher later in the day reported she was not so cranky later on. After meeting her on Back to School night and being throughly unimpressed, I believe she probably was hungover daily.

So yes, there are bully teachers out there, it is not always the student.

I go back to what I said before - DEMAND satsification for the problem right away before its 2nd semester, there is a failing grade and you are shopping private schools.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:37AM

Thanks for the detailed & disturbing info (again). Isn't it funny, my kid has this teacher 1st period too.:-(

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: justsayin ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:39AM

The kid will get another lesson out of the class... not everyone in the world is put there to kiss their ass and obey their rules. The kid is not the boss in the classroom, the parent is not the boss in the classroom, the teacher is the boss.

Tell the kid to bring a pencil, obey the boss' rules, and move on. Appeasing every little complaint leads to adults that can't take care of themselves.

Please, you must admit that bringing a writing implement into a class is a very, very basic expectation.

Another part of the problem is you as a parent calling that hostile behavior. You are blowing it up way more than is appropriate. If you wanted to schedule a meeting with the principal about hostile behavior from a teacher and came in with that example, you are unfairly characterizing that employee's behavior and could jeopardize their career. I would say it is highly immoral behavior but no one seems to care about that these days.

edit to add: Rachel - we asked for an example of what happened to your child. You gave an example of what happened to someone else's child? What happened to YOUR child?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 10:45AM by justsayin.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:40AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks for the detailed & disturbing info (again).
> Isn't it funny, my kid has this teacher 1st
> period too.:-(

Does it sound like your daughter has the same teacher as Duchess' child? So far from you we have only the pencil incident, are there others that establish this teacher as UNreasonable?

Strict teachers are good.

Unreasonable teachers are not. Which is it that you're dealing with here?

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Nova_lifer ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:40AM

7th and 8th grade is teacher hell so I'd take that into consideration. Maybe ask to sit in a few classes one day to understand what they are up against. My middle school was out of control because we all had raging hormones than no one could control.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: BB*X ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:51AM

What the fuck, you give no examples other than a forgotten pencil and then tell us that your kid did not forget a pencil? Plus this is the last place I would ask anyone for advice on a serious subject like a child's education. If you want advice on how to properly fist your asshole then by all means ask away because this is the proper place for that type of advice.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:53AM

No, duchess' was an English teacher - nine Algebra I. The pencil incident was only one of many. And yes, there have been many complaints as well. As I said, I want to hold off judgement until I meet this teacher, but wanted to hear from those with similar experiences & how they dealt with it.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Teacher ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:56AM

I opened this thread expecting to see a slew of smart-assed responses and pornographic references. I am happy to see that such a question is being respectfully discussed and debated. As a teacher myself, I can offer some insight.
First of all, most teachers, especially good ones, are very strict at the start of the year to set the tone. To be honest, I don't see the teacher's comment about not having a pencil to be horrible unless the teacher really denied the kid a chance to complete an assignment that would be graded. Even then, I see the teacher's point and, as someone else said, I will bet the kid will have the pencil next time. A teacher who draws a hard line in th beginning of the year can always loosen up as the year goes on and the kids learn to toe the line. The teachers you really have to worry about are the ones who are overly permissive and lax: they are the ones who are just putting in time (and there are quite a few) and really don't care about doing a good job. Unfortunately, teaching is a non-competitive profession, and slack teachers are protected and even cherished because they will generally hand out grades. FCPS policy now says that students who SKIP a test MUST be allowed to retake the test they missed or another one: behavior can't dictate grades. Now, this of course makes no sense at all and tacitly condones and even rewards irresponsibility on the part of the student: Why NOT skip if you can get more time to prepare for a test you didn't prepare for? Anyway, my overall point is that your example seems a bit week, and you might end up being thankful for the strictness of this "mean" person.
Secondly, the era of "No Child Left Behind" has just about assured that Amrica will keep sliding down the global ladder as far as the effectiveness of education goes. Some students SHOULD and DEMAND to be left behind, but this communistic nonsense requires all teachers to lower their standards to get kids who don't deserve it a passing grade. The consequnce of setting such a low bar is that the standard of excellence slips at a commensurate level. I give As now to work I would have given Cs to ten years ago. While there are certainly mean, perverted, and ignorant teachers, sometimes the ones who seem the hardest are the ones who are doing your kid a real favor, even if the end result is a B and not an A. As you said, see this teacher for yourself then decide.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:59AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No, duchess' was an English teacher - nine Algebra
> I. The pencil incident was only one of many. And
> yes, there have been many complaints as well. As
> I said, I want to hold off judgement until I meet
> this teacher, but wanted to hear from those with
> similar experiences & how they dealt with it.

Do you have any other examples of unreasonable behavior?

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:21AM

Thanks so much for that well-thought out response 'teacher'. I really appreciate hearing both sides. As mentioned, the pencil incident was one of many, and perhaps this teacher is setting a standard for his class. True, I don't think there's a kid in that class that will ever forget a pencil again! And don't get me wrong, I love a HARD teacher, but this one is more MEAN & uninspiring than hard. I realize teachers are under a lot of pressure with red tape & problematic kids, and I would never do anything to jeopardize a teacher's job, but if it continues down a slippery slope like 'duchess'', what do you do?

BTW, there were a few of those useless/angry/pornographic responses. Call me a virgin at this - I had no idea!:-)

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Duchess ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:23AM

There is a huge difference between being strict and a mean bully.

My Mother believed the "teacher is always right" maxim, and when I had a similar 9th grade experience with a teacher (again an FCPS school) she refused to get involved. My Dad was busy working and did want to be involved either. I vowed NOT to be that way when I was a parent.

My former teacher did get his come uppance since other parents did complain - and it turned out he was an alcoholic. When he put a movie on and left class (something he did daily) he was finally caught drinking and was demoted. Not FIRED- demoted. I liked the subject he was not teaching, too and I was a motivated student and that whole year was a waste of my time in that class. I wish I had that time back or at least the education I should have received. Instead, I learned what alcoholism could do to someone, and important lesson yes, but I did not need that one played out for me over a school year.

So why should any child waste their educational time with such a soul sucking experience? Yes, they should remember their pencils, and assignments and so forth. But there are ways to do that effectively that do not involve turning their little psyches into psychotics.

And people wonder why kids skip school and/or take drugs. Geessh.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:36AM

slubdawg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nova_lifer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Probably won't come to school without a pencil
> > again. Lesson learned. I hope this is not a
> > complaint against a demanding teacher vs a
> 'nice'
> > teacher. I have a daughter who needs teachers
> who
> > are stronger willed than she is will always try
> to
> > get her way.
>
>
> The above is the answer to most of what is wrong
> with schools today. If all parents were as in
> tune with their kids and held their kids
> responsbile the education would be in good shape!
>
>
> Does anyone really think that the kids in Japan,
> etc are basically smarter than any place else. I
> don't, but...the value of education that is put on
> education and the expectation of student's to
> excel is what drives their success.
>
> We need to change the "culture" of education more
> than anything else.


Nova-lifter's answer is exactly the answer to the expectant attitudes that our kids are notorious for having today. They are influenced by the rush of technology and having everything at their fingertips, the crappy music, & reality shows that depict nothing but spoiled, whiny, irresponsible brats.

When in school, if they don't learn the basics, to reply upon yourself & to learn responsibility for one's mistakes, they will learn nothing to add to their values as a member of society when they are out in the real world. What they will learn is that there will always be someone to step on and use to get to where they want to be, instead of working for it themselves.SELF RELIANCE!

Crying about a teacher who inflicts a tough lesson learned is exactly what is wrong with today's kids & the parents who don't realize that they should be thankful for such teachers that don't feed into irresponsible kids, (and their parents).



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 12:00PM by Elle Diabla.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:39AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> For the record, it was NOT my kid who forgot a
> pencil. AND it has nothing to do with 'toughening
> up'. My kid is very tough and will endure this
> class whether I intervene or not. I would prefer
> that my child enjoy a very challenging class for a
> 7th grader - Algebra I - & concentrate on the
> academics rather than a troublesome teacher.
>
> Back-to-School Night is next week so I'll reserve
> judgement until then.


If your kid is "very tough" what does it make you, a parent who is literally whining about a teacher's lessons to teach responsibility?

Can't imagine how "tough" a kid is going to be when they have this sort of parenting. "Oh, it's OK to forget what is expected of you - just ask the person next to you."

Great philosophy...

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:43AM

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rachel Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm really soliciting those who've gone through
> > such an experience and have some sound advice.
>
>
> I have. I am giving you advice. Tell your kid to
> toughen up and bring a pencil next time.
>
> Seriously, your kid is going to have to learn how
> to deal with difficult people. Unless the teacher
> is doing something that is out and out wrong, I
> think it is a good life lesson for your kid.
>
> Stop being a helicopter parent and let your kid
> learn how to deal with life.

Exactly. Parents need to realize that the building of responsible character starts from the crib. NOT when they reach Middle School and cry about a teacher being not giving them a pencil because they, themselves can't be responsible enough to come to class prepared.

And where are you, to make sure that the kid stays on track with what supplies they need to bring each day??

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:48AM

I don't have an irresponsible kid. Period. You talk about Japanese parents who are in tuned to their kids, but then tell me to lay off a mean teacher, which you view as tough. What if I told you he shoved a student? Would you tolerate this behavior in the work force? I'm guessing you'd say you're an irresponsible worker & deserved to be treated that way.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:51AM

Duchess Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Its not just the pencil. I probably know this
> teacher.
>
> My child was very shy, mild and meek in class and
> NEVER a behavior problem for any teacher ever. Not
> so true of my other kids, but true for this one.
> My daughter got "zero for the day" - get a few of
> those and they equal and "F" pretty fast. Her
> crimes?
>
> 1) Loaning a kid a pencil during class
> 2) Supply list asked ONLY for "index cards" she
> bought the wrong size +/or color
> 3) She brought multiple rubber bands (size and
> colors) to class after supply list experience
> outlined in #2 - and that was wrong also - so
> "Zero for the Day"
> 4) Teacher asked for an essay on "explain your
> astrological sign". She explained - quite
> eloquently in a well written essay this was an
> ENglish class - about her astrological sign and
> why she did not believe in astrology. Zero on the
> assignment for being an unbeliever.
>
> We tried to schedule a meeting with the teacher-
> she refused to respond to us via phone, email and
> a letter I sent US MAIL return receipt required -
> which she signed. We complained to the Guidance
> Counselor, the VP for her grade- nothing. My
> daughter tried to switch to the class across the
> hall meeting at the same time, and was told it was
> because she had a crush on the new male teacher
> teaching that class. Request denied.
>
> Also, this was a first period 7:15 a.m. class.
> Students who had this teacher later in the day
> reported she was not so cranky later on. After
> meeting her on Back to School night and being
> throughly unimpressed, I believe she probably was
> hungover daily.
>
> So yes, there are bully teachers out there, it is
> not always the student.
>
> I go back to what I said before - DEMAND
> satsification for the problem right away before
> its 2nd semester, there is a failing grade and you
> are shopping private schools.

1. Great lesson being taught - don't feed to those who are irresponsible. Nothing wrong with this.

2. Index cards are....INDEX CARDS. They are always standard, white 3"x5", unless otherwise noted. This is does not take a genius to realize this. Why on earth would you buy your kid colored index cards and cards that are not the standard school size? This is nothing new, it's been this way for many, many, many years!

3. Again, did you not check with the standard school size/colors?

4. I doubt this.

None of the above is bullying. This is called research & responsibility. You as a parent should be making sure everything your child needs meets the standard. This can't be your first time shopping for school supplies??

Elementary school will not make such big issues about the wrong supplies, (depending on that they are), but in middle school, the assignments are more complex and require very standard, basic sizes and colors. It gets harder from here on, let this year be a lesson for the subsequent.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 11:58AM by Elle Diabla.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:55AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't have an irresponsible kid. Period. You
> talk about Japanese parents who are in tuned to
> their kids, but then tell me to lay off a mean
> teacher, which you view as tough. What if I told
> you he shoved a student? Would you tolerate this
> behavior in the work force? I'm guessing you'd
> say you're an irresponsible worker & deserved to
> be treated that way.


Who are you talking to??

In regards to this reply, you are now bringing forth an example that is far beyond a teacher being tough on a kid for forgetting a pencil.

This has nothing to do with your original complaint. Sorry that you don't like the answers here, (save for the other few, naive moms who agree with you), but bringing up an example such as a teacher being physically rough with a child is basically another universe of problems.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 11:55AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks so much for that well-thought out response
> 'teacher'. I really appreciate hearing both
> sides. As mentioned, the pencil incident was one
> of many, and perhaps this teacher is setting a
> standard for his class. True, I don't think
> there's a kid in that class that will ever forget
> a pencil again! And don't get me wrong, I love a
> HARD teacher, but this one is more MEAN &
> uninspiring than hard. I realize teachers are
> under a lot of pressure with red tape &
> problematic kids, and I would never do anything to
> jeopardize a teacher's job, but if it continues
> down a slippery slope like 'duchess'', what do you
> do?
>
> BTW, there were a few of those
> useless/angry/pornographic responses. Call me a
> virgin at this - I had no idea!:-)

I call bullshit. School has been in session two weeks and you can't name another incident. Admit it...the pencil is the ONLY incident.

Tell duchess to buck up and report to class with her shit in order.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 11:57AM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't have an irresponsible kid. Period. You
> talk about Japanese parents who are in tuned to
> their kids, but then tell me to lay off a mean
> teacher, which you view as tough. What if I told
> you he shoved a student? Would you tolerate this
> behavior in the work force? I'm guessing you'd
> say you're an irresponsible worker & deserved to
> be treated that way.


Did the teacher shove a student?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 11:57AM

By the way, Rachel, yes you DO have an irresponsible child, and you are equally irresponsible for disregarding what is expected of your child in school.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 11:58AM

Elle Diabla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> By the way, Rachel, yes you DO have an
> irresponsible child, and you are equally
> irresponsible for disregarding what is expected of
> your child in school.


Agreed. The child isn't irresponsible so much because she forgot her pencil. She is irresponsible because she won't take responsibility for her actions, asking mommy to fly in and fix it.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:03PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm really soliciting those who've gone through
> such an experience and have some sound advice.


We have kids...we are well enough qualified to provide you sound advice. You just don't want to hear that you or your kid have done anything wrong.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:07PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> For the record, it was NOT my kid who forgot a
> pencil.

You have GOT to be kidding me? (And how did I miss this little gem)?!

Your kid is in a "hostile environment" because of one teachers not giving a kid a pencil that they themselves are responsible for bringing???

Oh jeez...you are the exact parents that make back to school night a nightmare for us level-headed parents. Unbelievable...

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:11PM

Elle Diabla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rachel Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > For the record, it was NOT my kid who forgot a
> > pencil.
>
> You have GOT to be kidding me? (And how did I miss
> this little gem)?!
>
> Your kid is in a "hostile environment" because of
> one teachers not giving a kid a pencil that they
> themselves are responsible for bringing???
>
> Oh jeez...you are the exact parents that make back
> to school night a nightmare for us level-headed
> parents. Unbelievable...


You really need to go back and read the original post. You have consistently misunderstood Rachel, perhaps in pursuit of your own agenda of indignity rather than trying to be genuinely helpful.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:13PM

Kardinal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Elle Diabla Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Rachel Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > For the record, it was NOT my kid who forgot
> a
> > > pencil.
> >
> > You have GOT to be kidding me? (And how did I
> miss
> > this little gem)?!
> >
> > Your kid is in a "hostile environment" because
> of
> > one teachers not giving a kid a pencil that
> they
> > themselves are responsible for bringing???
> >
> > Oh jeez...you are the exact parents that make
> back
> > to school night a nightmare for us level-headed
> > parents. Unbelievable...
>
>
> You really need to go back and read the original
> post. You have consistently misunderstood Rachel,
> perhaps in pursuit of your own agenda of indignity
> rather than trying to be genuinely helpful.

Excuse me? The only part I "missed" was that it was not her child who forgot the pencil.

Every post I have made directly touches on her complaints of a hostile environment and her expectant attitude.

Nothing misunderstood.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:14PM

Thank you, Kardinal.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:15PM

Elle Diabla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kardinal Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Elle Diabla Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Rachel Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > For the record, it was NOT my kid who
> forgot
> > a
> > > > pencil.
> > >
> > > You have GOT to be kidding me? (And how did I
> > miss
> > > this little gem)?!
> > >
> > > Your kid is in a "hostile environment"
> because
> > of
> > > one teachers not giving a kid a pencil that
> > they
> > > themselves are responsible for bringing???
> > >
> > > Oh jeez...you are the exact parents that make
> > back
> > > to school night a nightmare for us
> level-headed
> > > parents. Unbelievable...
> >
> >
> > You really need to go back and read the
> original
> > post. You have consistently misunderstood
> Rachel,
> > perhaps in pursuit of your own agenda of
> indignity
> > rather than trying to be genuinely helpful.
>
> Excuse me? The only part I "missed" was that it
> was not her child who forgot the pencil.
>
> Every post I have made directly touches on her
> complaints of a hostile environment and her
> expectant attitude.
>
> Nothing misunderstood.


Yeah, except you seem to think, even after being corrected, that it was the teacher who was unwilling to provide the pencil. Let me repost her original post:

"When a child forgot his pencils, and asked someone next to him if he could borrow one, the teacher went up to him and said, "I guess you're out of luck." Needless to say, he did not allow him to borrow a pencil."

The child asked ANOTHER child to borrow a pencil, not the teacher.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:16PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thank you, Kardinal.

BTW, I don't think you've made a case that this teacher is unreasonable. I applaud you for being willing to give him(?) a chance and meet him before jumping to any conclusions, but I would be interested in knowing about additional examples of unreasonable behavior as well.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:16PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> Back-to-School Night is next week so I'll reserve
> judgement until then.


Nothing misunderstood here...
She herself says that she will state her views at back to school night, so my response about her representing nightmarish parents, was definitely not misdirected, either.

Try again...

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:19PM

Elle Diabla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rachel Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> >
> > Back-to-School Night is next week so I'll
> reserve
> > judgement until then.
>
>
> Nothing misunderstood here...
> She herself says that she will state her views at
> back to school night, so my response about her
> representing nightmarish parents, was definitely
> not misdirected, either.
>
> Try again...


Yes, except she said she'll reserve judgment...and then you jump all over her for her judgment.

I don't want to belabor the point any further. But I do think you're jumping all over her for a trend you're trying to shoehorn her attitude into.

And this is on top of the example of TWICE misunderstanding the example of the pencil.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 12:20PM by Kardinal.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:20PM

Kardinal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Elle Diabla Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Kardinal Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Elle Diabla Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Rachel Wrote:
> > > >
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > >
> > > > -----
> > > > > For the record, it was NOT my kid who
> > forgot
> > > a
> > > > > pencil.
> > > >
> > > > You have GOT to be kidding me? (And how did
> I
> > > miss
> > > > this little gem)?!
> > > >
> > > > Your kid is in a "hostile environment"
> > because
> > > of
> > > > one teachers not giving a kid a pencil that
> > > they
> > > > themselves are responsible for bringing???
> > > >
> > > > Oh jeez...you are the exact parents that
> make
> > > back
> > > > to school night a nightmare for us
> > level-headed
> > > > parents. Unbelievable...
> > >
> > >
> > > You really need to go back and read the
> > original
> > > post. You have consistently misunderstood
> > Rachel,
> > > perhaps in pursuit of your own agenda of
> > indignity
> > > rather than trying to be genuinely helpful.
> >
> > Excuse me? The only part I "missed" was that it
> > was not her child who forgot the pencil.
> >
> > Every post I have made directly touches on her
> > complaints of a hostile environment and her
> > expectant attitude.
> >
> > Nothing misunderstood.
>
>
> Yeah, except you seem to think, even after being
> corrected, that it was the teacher who was
> unwilling to provide the pencil. Let me repost
> her original post:
>
> "When a child forgot his pencils, and asked
> someone next to him if he could borrow one, the
> teacher went up to him and said, "I guess you're
> out of luck." Needless to say, he did not allow
> him to borrow a pencil."
>
> The child asked ANOTHER child to borrow a pencil,
> not the teacher.

That's what you got out of one phrase of my response, hey?

It does not matter if the kid provided the other with the pencil. If allowed yes, the teacher IS nurturing the kid who didn't come to class prepared, as he/she makes the rules.

So yes, it is the teacher who did not provide, because he/she did not allow the kid to obtain the pencil.

Point is, this is considered "hostile" and that is the discussion.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 12:20PM by Elle Diabla.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:24PM

Kardinal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Elle Diabla Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Rachel Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> >
> > >
> > > Back-to-School Night is next week so I'll
> > reserve
> > > judgement until then.
> >
> >
> > Nothing misunderstood here...
> > She herself says that she will state her views
> at
> > back to school night, so my response about her
> > representing nightmarish parents, was
> definitely
> > not misdirected, either.
> >
> > Try again...
>
>
> Yes, except she said she'll reserve judgment...and
> then you jump all over her for her judgment.
>
> I don't want to belabor the point any further.
> But I do think you're jumping all over her for a
> trend you're trying to shoehorn her attitude
> into.
>
> And this is on top of the example of TWICE
> misunderstanding the example of the pencil.

There is no misunderstanding the point whatsoever, and I'm not the only one in this thread...

I think YOU are misunderstanding the point of her complaint.

Calling a classroom a "hostile" environment because a teacher did not allow a child to borrow a pencil is my point, and one that I have made quite clear.

Anyone who thinks this is a hostile environment is living completely within the realm of expectancy. And that is my view of the situation.

Get to class prepared. End of story. Nothing hostile about these expectations.

By the way, "reserve judgement"? Hasn't she already stated such judgement?

And of course I'm going to reply to such judgement as this IS a public forum!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 12:26PM by Elle Diabla.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:27PM

The point of my original comment was to hear from parents who had problems with teachers & their solutions. Suddenly, I find myself in a battle of words with combative strangers who call my kid irresponsible/crazy & me a bad parent. Whatever. I'm not saying that this teacher won't prove me wrong, in fact, I hope he does; that would make life so much easier. I just simply wanted to hear from others who had bad experiences with teachers & how they handled it. I

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:30PM

Kardinal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Elle Diabla Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Rachel Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > For the record, it was NOT my kid who forgot
> a
> > > pencil.
> >
> > You have GOT to be kidding me? (And how did I
> miss
> > this little gem)?!
> >
> > Your kid is in a "hostile environment" because
> of
> > one teachers not giving a kid a pencil that
> they
> > themselves are responsible for bringing???
> >
> > Oh jeez...you are the exact parents that make
> back
> > to school night a nightmare for us level-headed
> > parents. Unbelievable...
>
>
> You really need to go back and read the original
> post. You have consistently misunderstood Rachel,
> perhaps in pursuit of your own agenda of indignity
> rather than trying to be genuinely helpful.

Right, the original post states that her child is subjected to a hostile environement.

It is followed with replies asking for examples.

She supplies the pencil incident...

Myself and a few others object to this silly example and provide opinions.
There is no "help" to provide to her as this is clearly no example of such hostility in which she claims with the original post.

/summary

Nothing misunderstood, yet again.

Options: ReplyQuote
­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:31PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:11PM by chuckhoffmann.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:31PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The point of my original comment was to hear from
> parents who had problems with teachers & their
> solutions. Suddenly, I find myself in a battle of
> words with combative strangers who call my kid
> irresponsible/crazy & me a bad parent. Whatever.
> I'm not saying that this teacher won't prove me
> wrong, in fact, I hope he does; that would make
> life so much easier. I just simply wanted to hear
> from others who had bad experiences with teachers
> & how they handled it. I

Because your example is not quite an example of this "hostile environment" that you claim your child is subjected to.

You have provided no other examples.

Yes, I do think you are irresponsible to think this way.

This teacher did nothing wrong...

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Elle Diabla ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:32PM

chuckhoffmann Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There were bully teachers in FCPS when I was in
> school, and I'll name one: Tom Sisson (I have a
> very long memory, Tommy). That asshole deserves to
> have his pension revoked for every act of bullying
> I ever saw him pull on another kid.
>
> I suspect there still are bully teachers in FCPS,
> and when I find them, I will take them apart using
> the system they love so much. I can play the game,
> too, and be funnier at it.

Lol, Chuck. Have you read the example of such "bullying?"

Options: ReplyQuote
­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:47PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:11PM by chuckhoffmann.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 12:48PM

Kardinal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
>
> Yes, except she said she'll reserve judgment...and
> then you jump all over her for her judgment.
>

To be fair, the OP has already passed judgment. Otherwise, she wouldn't claim that the teacher is creating a "hostile environment." Personally, I would want to investigate this issue first before finding all of the fault with the teacher.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 12:52PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The point of my original comment was to hear from
> parents who had problems with teachers & their
> solutions. Suddenly, I find myself in a battle of
> words with combative strangers who call my kid
> irresponsible/crazy & me a bad parent. Whatever.
> I'm not saying that this teacher won't prove me
> wrong, in fact, I hope he does; that would make
> life so much easier. I just simply wanted to hear
> from others who had bad experiences with teachers
> & how they handled it. I


You are reserving judgment, but you call him a "bad teacher." Sounds to me like he could be the best teacher your kid has ever had, but you don't agree with your princess being held to a higher standard.

Go ahead and complain to the school and the teacher. Make sure you make it as easy as possible for your kid. I'm sure in 10 years when she is in her first job and starts to cry when her boss asks her to work late that she will appreciate everything you've done for her.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 12:55PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:12PM by chuckhoffmann.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 12:58PM

chuckhoffmann Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> In short, my policy is always, "Do, then
> apologize."


That's a stupid policy in any context.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:15PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:13PM by chuckhoffmann.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: parentof4 ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:23PM

Rachel,

You received some good advice and some I hope you will just ignore. FCPS has some REAL problems w/ a number of teachers and like our US Government; to fire them requires too much red tape.

I have two sons and two daughters: my oldest is at an Ivy League college and my other three at Woodson. All are straight A students taking honors and/or AP classes only. All four are great, level heading kids that do not get into trouble...all are very academically focused.

We went through the Mantua/Frost/Woodson pyramid. We have had VERY good teachers that fostered the love of learning, respected the students, required respect back….etc, but we have run into a number of VERY bad, useless teachers that just played havoc in my children’s learning. These schools, except for Mantua with Jan Marie Fernandez, did little to nothing about the bad teachers. My complaints fell on deaf ears. The principals and counselors were always more interested in protecting the teachers and not their obligation, the students! At one point, out of total frustration w/ a problem teacher, I said to a Woodson counselor….is your job to advocate for the students or the teachers!

My sons love writing and my girls love math…..contrary to the stereotype….but in middle and high school we ran into some real problems with teachers that just didn’t like what they were doing/teaching and took it out on the kids. One of my sons in particular who has a true gift for writing now hates to write thanks to a 9th grade teacher. (I am trying real hard to turn this around and help him find that love and joy of writing again).

Trust your instincts! Trust what the kids are saying. We parents know darn well if are kids are lying or not! Go to the school and demand change! Review www.ratemyteacher.com and look up the teachers name by school. This is a great resource for parent to exchange information about teachers. I have found that the problems we have run into w/ certain teachers are reflected correctly by other parents and/or students on ratebyteacher once I look them up. I now add to this site information about teachers, good and bad, that we have run into.

Good luck.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 01:29PM

chuckhoffmann Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > That's a stupid policy in any context.
>
> It's a stupid policy in most contexts, but in this
> one the worst that will happen is a teacher will
> be fired because of my actions, or my child will
> get a different teacher. I'm willing to risk that
> damage.
>
> I'm not sorry if you lose your job because of
> something I did or do; I saw something, pointed it
> out, and your boss saw the same thing. Loudoun
> county schools are undergoing a major expansion.
> Try a farm team before you play in the bigs.


This is why U.S. education is in such a mess. It's lawyers first, learning last.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2010 01:29PM by WashingTone-Locian.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:37PM

I'm sorry to hear about your child's bad writing experience with a teacher. Let's hope the old saying is true - time heals all wounds. Like your children, my child is in the GT Center and loves school and all her teachers, but this one. As she put it, "I've had teachers who hate their jobs, but this teacher seems like he hates us."

Thank you so much, Parentof4! You're voice is the voice of reason & the one I was hoping to hear from. I will definitely check out the ratemyteacher.com!

Options: ReplyQuote
­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:39PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:14PM by chuckhoffmann.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 01:41PM

chuckhoffmann Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > This is why U.S. education is in such a mess.
> It's
> > lawyers first, learning last.
> I disagree. I think it's the tool to make a great
> educational system.
>
> I will bet you most of the rules in the Fairfax
> County Public Schools Handbook have their origins
> in some sort of trouble or difficulty that
> happened and somebody threatened to sue over.
> Good. I hope I'm able to add to that corpus with a
> few lawsuits of my own (not for the money, but to
> force the kinds of changes I want).
>
> Civil court can be as much fun as a fistfight (and
> it can be fun to get in a fistfight), if you play
> the game right.


Nope. It just creates an environment where smart people leave the teaching profession and stupid/bad people stay because they are too stupid/bad to do anything else.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 01:42PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sorry to hear about your child's bad writing
> experience with a teacher. Let's hope the old
> saying is true - time heals all wounds. Like your
> children, my child is in the GT Center and loves
> school and all her teachers, but this one. As she
> put it, "I've had teachers who hate their jobs,
> but this teacher seems like he hates us."
>
> Thank you so much, Parentof4! You're voice is the
> voice of reason & the one I was hoping to hear
> from. I will definitely check out the
> ratemyteacher.com!

It's not the voice of reason. It's the voice you wanted to hear. Why do you need someone to reaffirm what you already believe?

Go ahead and tell the teacher he is a bad asshole. I'm sure your daughter will appreciate it when she receives her grades.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: some sanity please ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:43PM

I would love to meet some of the morons who post on this site.

We are talking about 7th grade, right? 12 year olds?

Last time I checked 12 year olds don't drive cars or have jobs to pay and go get school supplies. Maybe the kid is neglected at home. Maybe, imagine this, the kid, terrified of being late for class, since most schools terrorize the kids to be there on time or else, dropped his pencil, left it in his locker or in his last class.

Who cares. The kid is 12 years old.

Any teacher who is on some sort of power trip and needs to belittle an innocent mistake BY A KID, should be sent packing.

Parents know after one week who the crappy teachers are and who the good ones are. I also have a 7th grader who LOVES her math teacher. She talks about her non-stop, rushes to do her homework, desperately wants to please her. Many of her other teachers are already described as boring....after ONE WEEK, the kid is bored.

Get real folks. We need to get rid of lousy teachers. Good for this parent for standing up. If 4-5 other parents in this class did the same, I bet this teacher would be sent to Gatehouse.

It takes courage to stand up to people. Don't listen to these idiots-go with your maternal instinct. ALL the kids in this class will benefit.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: justsayin ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:47PM

WashingTone-Locian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nope. It just creates an environment where smart
> people leave the teaching profession and
> stupid/bad people stay because they are too
> stupid/bad to do anything else.

+1

Options: ReplyQuote
­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 01:48PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:14PM by chuckhoffmann.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 02:01PM

I just looked up his rating - 1.9 out of 5.0 - the ratings were by kids and they hated his class. Apparently, he gave everyone bad grades and left the kids more confused than when they went in.

So as you say, Some Sanity Please, I went with my maternal instincts & they were correct.:-)

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 02:20PM

"some sanity please Wrote:"

That's an amusing title for this site. :)

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: parentof4 ()
Date: September 17, 2010 02:22PM

I wish more parents would go onto ratemyteacher.com and tell about their experience. We parents need this information to keep these teachers and schools accountable!

Good luck Rachel! And thanks for putting this subject on this site. It is a way for parents to start talking about their experiences w/ the schools and teachers.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 02:24PM

Rachel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just looked up his rating - 1.9 out of 5.0 - the
> ratings were by kids and they hated his class.
> Apparently, he gave everyone bad grades and left
> the kids more confused than when they went in.
>
> So as you say, Some Sanity Please, I went with my
> maternal instincts & they were correct.:-)


Mental, indeed.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Date: September 17, 2010 02:26PM

I'll give you an example of how I would address this. One of my kids had a crappy teacher last year. In fact, during one grading period, his grades went down. Do you know what I did?

I told my kid to buckle down and that I expected him to bring his grades up regardless of how crappy his teacher was.

You know what happened? He did.

As for the teacher, she is no longer there. Not because of anything I said, but because the rest of the class failed.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/13-11.htm

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 02:29PM

parentof4 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wish more parents would go onto
> ratemyteacher.com and tell about their experience.
> We parents need this information to keep these
> teachers and schools accountable!
>
> Good luck Rachel! And thanks for putting this
> subject on this site. It is a way for parents to
> start talking about their experiences w/ the
> schools and teachers.

Thank you! And thanks again for the great site! It was worth being dragged through the underground mud.:-)

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Teacher ()
Date: September 17, 2010 03:03PM

This is such an interesting view of such a major problem. There is an unspoken friction a great deal of the time between teachers and parents. Each one occasionally (or maybe more than occassionally) feels that the other is "out to get them" and, from the teacher side, I can say, sadly, that I have known some teachers who WERE out to get kids.
I have been teaching a long time, and I know colleagues who have taken a personal dislike to a student and then sought ways to reflect it academically. There aren't many like this, but there are some, and one is too many. There really isn't much that can be done to remove such a teacher- the unions will protect them unless the offense is so egregious and blatant that it can't be ignored. That rarely happens. In my career, I have known for sure of one teacher , a female, who was sleeping with two senior boys- she was allowed to resign and, last I heard, she was teaching in a private all girls school. Those types are the exceptions to the rule, but there are a great many other teachers who simply aren't interested in teaching- why tax yourself when you can give grades that will satisfy parents while showing movies? Grading, after all, is a hassle.

On the teachers' side, I will say this and it is the most telling thing of all: I have NEVER, EVER heard of a parent asking for their kid to be removed from a class that is TOO easy. The grade, after all, is king. I have two of my own children, and I can certainly see the dilemma. In the maddeningly competitive world of college applications, why put your kid in an environment where he/she may get a B when an A is so readily available? In short, parents are always looking out for their kids' best interest and many will do anything (excuse an absence, help with a paper, etc) to advance their cause, which makes the job of being a teacher hard. Some parents will come flying in for the most ridiculous reasons, creating problems they know aren't there, protecting their child regardless of his/her irresponsibility, claiming violations of 504s and IEPs all to protect their interest regardless of what that means for the teacher. And, if the administration caves in to parental demands, they earn that hatred of the teachers and open the door for more complaints- both frivolous and valid.
I have been very fortunate in my career- I work in a school where the students primarily come from wealthy families, but I have found the experience very enjoyable. After 18 years, I still love coming to work and seeing my kids. I have had very few problem parents and I think the key is that I try to see things the way the parents must be seeing things. I don't think people do that enough in general, but certainly not in a school setting. FOr example, recently I gave a quiz in my advanced class, and a few kids failed. One parent hit the panic button and wanted to know if their kid should drop out etc. I told this parent that I would drop the lowest quiz grade and the quiz was really a wake up call to convey that the kids will have to work hard and to warn those who aren't motivated to do so to drop out. That assuaged the worry that I think was created by an upset kid racing home, reporting that the situation was hopeless, that I was an ogre, etc. I think if parents will realize that even the best kid will contort the facts to make whatever they want to say about their teacher seem valid and teachers will settle down when parents have a complaint and not feel like the parent is automatically trying to usurp their authority or insinuate that they suck at teaching, a happy medium can be reached.

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­
Posted by: chuckhoffmann ()
Date: September 17, 2010 03:13PM

­



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2013 06:16PM by chuckhoffmann.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 03:19PM

Teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is such an interesting view of such a major
> problem. There is an unspoken friction a great
> deal of the time between teachers and parents.
> Each one occasionally (or maybe more than
> occassionally) feels that the other is "out to get
> them" and, from the teacher side, I can say,
> sadly, that I have known some teachers who WERE
> out to get kids.
> I have been teaching a long time, and I know
> colleagues who have taken a personal dislike to a
> student and then sought ways to reflect it
> academically. There aren't many like this, but
> there are some, and one is too many. There really
> isn't much that can be done to remove such a
> teacher- the unions will protect them unless the
> offense is so egregious and blatant that it can't
> be ignored. That rarely happens. In my career, I
> have known for sure of one teacher , a female, who
> was sleeping with two senior boys- she was allowed
> to resign and, last I heard, she was teaching in a
> private all girls school. Those types are the
> exceptions to the rule, but there are a great many
> other teachers who simply aren't interested in
> teaching- why tax yourself when you can give
> grades that will satisfy parents while showing
> movies? Grading, after all, is a hassle.
>
> On the teachers' side, I will say this and it is
> the most telling thing of all: I have NEVER, EVER
> heard of a parent asking for their kid to be
> removed from a class that is TOO easy. The grade,
> after all, is king. I have two of my own children,
> and I can certainly see the dilemma. In the
> maddeningly competitive world of college
> applications, why put your kid in an environment
> where he/she may get a B when an A is so readily
> available? In short, parents are always looking
> out for their kids' best interest and many will do
> anything (excuse an absence, help with a paper,
> etc) to advance their cause, which makes the job
> of being a teacher hard. Some parents will come
> flying in for the most ridiculous reasons,
> creating problems they know aren't there,
> protecting their child regardless of his/her
> irresponsibility, claiming violations of 504s and
> IEPs all to protect their interest regardless of
> what that means for the teacher. And, if the
> administration caves in to parental demands, they
> earn that hatred of the teachers and open the door
> for more complaints- both frivolous and valid.
> I have been very fortunate in my career- I work in
> a school where the students primarily come from
> wealthy families, but I have found the experience
> very enjoyable. After 18 years, I still love
> coming to work and seeing my kids. I have had very
> few problem parents and I think the key is that I
> try to see things the way the parents must be
> seeing things. I don't think people do that enough
> in general, but certainly not in a school setting.
> FOr example, recently I gave a quiz in my advanced
> class, and a few kids failed. One parent hit the
> panic button and wanted to know if their kid
> should drop out etc. I told this parent that I
> would drop the lowest quiz grade and the quiz was
> really a wake up call to convey that the kids will
> have to work hard and to warn those who aren't
> motivated to do so to drop out. That assuaged the
> worry that I think was created by an upset kid
> racing home, reporting that the situation was
> hopeless, that I was an ogre, etc. I think if
> parents will realize that even the best kid will
> contort the facts to make whatever they want to
> say about their teacher seem valid and teachers
> will settle down when parents have a complaint and
> not feel like the parent is automatically trying
> to usurp their authority or insinuate that they
> suck at teaching, a happy medium can be reached.


Thanks for the insight. You sound like a wonderful teacher and we need more of you out there; it's a shame that not all teachers look forward to going to school and seeing their students. Despite all the barriers, I definitely won't grow cynical, and I've told my child that while she can't control the world around her, she can control her reactions. I also told her that no one should stand in her way of a good education. Fortunately, the hubby is great in math so it's looking like he'll be her 'teacher' this year. The good news is that math scores are black & white (not subjective such as English/writing). And more good news - she loves her English teacher. Having said all of the above, it's early in the year & no one owns the future; so stay tuned........

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Duchess ()
Date: September 17, 2010 03:54PM

Elle Diablo - Index cards were not supposed to be 3X5 and white. 4 X 6 as I recall. And that was never specified on the "supply list". They were for the student's own vocabulary box to maintain, so why should the teacher care what size or color? Take my word, this teacher was a bad apple who had also fermented from alcohol and maybe some other drugs.

This same teacher destroyed my daughter's English Portfolio (it follows them all through HS from teacher to teacher, grade to grade) when she heard it was to be re-graded. I know she was supposedly disciplined for that, but I doubt it was more than a "Don't do that again!" from the Principal.

Most of my kids teachers have been great and you could not pay me enough to teach any grade or subject. I would however accept Jack Dale's salary and take over his job in a heart beat. I would then close down or shakedown Gatehouse and have schools be responisble to the communites they serve.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: parentof4 ()
Date: September 17, 2010 04:30PM

We should get Michele Rhee to take over Dr. Dale's position. She would shake up things!

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Kardinal ()
Date: September 17, 2010 04:48PM

parentof4 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We should get Michele Rhee to take over Dr. Dale's
> position. She would shake up things!

Sounds good to me. I'm figuring she'll be looking for a new job come...whenever DC's government turns over.

Unfortunately, she'll probably go out to California to be with her husband.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Jhoon Rhee ()
Date: September 17, 2010 05:07PM

From now on, that kid is going to be called a pencil moocher and bullied on the playground. It might be time to teach him some basic skills to defend himself before he gets hurt.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 06:49PM

Elle Diabla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> By the way, Rachel, yes you DO have an
> irresponsible child, and you are equally
> irresponsible for disregarding what is expected of
> your child in school.


I was merely using the pencil incident as an example of my child's teacher. I'll tell of one more incident involving my child.

As an honors class, my son gets a lot of homework on a nightly basis. He had 10 problems and didn't understand one of them, as the teacher went around checking for completeness, because he didn't attempt just one problem he got half credit.

Then two kids were talking during class and the teacher made those students write a page on why disrupting class is bad and why they are in the honors class. It's just the tone he sets, everyone is afraid of him.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Duchess ()
Date: September 17, 2010 07:42PM

FX needs someone with Chancellor powers a la Michelle Rhee. If it were I, I would fire every administrator, and have them re-apply after justifying their position and doing an updated background check. That includes investigating side businesses like shady real estate deals a la the Robinson Principal.

Then, I would go to work on the teachers, but not with the blunt ax Michelle wielded. But yes, everyone would reapply and with a background check updated and pee in a cup urine testing and maybe even a breathalyzer randomly done certain mornings in a classroom I am sure would fail.

Following that, I would follow up on some VA legislative duties like getting stupid state laws repealed that justify using Zero Tolerance/No Intelligence required policies regarding student discipline. No student would be suspended for having their birth control pills in their purse at school after that.

I think I would make an excellant FCPS Chancellor, and given that kind of power I might even do it for free, if you all will let me leave with that 1.3 million dollar Principal Education fund.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: parentof4 ()
Date: September 17, 2010 07:49PM

"because he didn't attempt just one problem he got half credit"

Instead of the teacher realizing that this was a "teaching moment" he/she penalizes the student. That is crazy but all too many times I ran into this with a few insensitive, uncaring teachers.

One of the common elements of these uncaring teachers that I have witnessed is...they don’t have children themselves! Give me a caring, loving, and understand teacher and the chances are they have children themselves. Give me an experienced teacher who is a mom herself and you have a recipe for success…..college degree, who cares!....being a mom first should be the first requirements on the resume!

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: parentof4 ()
Date: September 17, 2010 07:52PM

Duchess,

Great post!!! You have my vote!!!

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Wow! ()
Date: September 17, 2010 07:59PM

parentof4 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Give me an experienced teacher who is a mom herself and you
have a recipe for success…..college degree, who cares!....being a mom first should be the first requirements on the resume!

So weren't you voicing concern over discrimination on another thread? Gotta be a mom? Some of my best teachers were nuns.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: GMU Hokie ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:06PM

I had one truly great teacher in FCPS. Mary Kay Garwood, grade four. She encouraged me to read and she inculcated a love of local and state history that continues today.

That having been said, I had more losers than good ones.

One teacher used to keep supplies in old malt liquor cans. He tossed a board across the room and hit a kid (me) with it. He was not disciplined. The Assistant Principal said my family should be more understanding.

He was probably an alcoholic.

I had a grade school principal who, although very talented, had a strange interest in the sexual development of young boys.

My sixth grade teacher was a spinster who surely knew what he was up to. Perhaps he was blackmailing her.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: say ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:14PM

I think any teacher who is disliked by any student should be fired immediately. One strike and you're out!

Since that would mean no teachers, think of all the money that could be saved! The real estate tax rate could be cut in half overnight!

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: APorIBMom ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:23PM

Teacher,

Thank you for your very informative posts.

I agree with almost everything you wrote. But not with the one statement below. I have known many parents who have asked for their child to be switched to a more demanding teacher. By high school, some students even choose electives because they are taught only by one very demanding teacher.

Ratemyteachers.com isn't foolproof. At some schools, it appears as though the moderator for that school is protecting specific administrators, while allowing pointed criticisms of other admins or teachers.

One way to test a school's moderator is to see if there are any administrators for that school who are not well-liked, but who have surprisingly high ratings. Try to post a criticism with low ratings, and then watch to see if your post is "approved" or whether it is instead deleted.


Teacher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> On the teachers' side, I will say this and it is
> the most telling thing of all: I have NEVER, EVER
> heard of a parent asking for their kid to be
> removed from a class that is TOO easy. The grade,
> after all, is king.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: ThePackLeader ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:47PM

I ran into my first bully teacher in 1st grade, so I got used to it. Dumb lady screamed at me for bleeding from a cut on my leg, and she punished me for it. I hated school so bad for a while after that, that I remember my mom trying to get me on the bus, and I put my arms and legs out like a cartoon so that I couldn't be forced on LOL. Fortunately, somebody knocked the teacher up and she had to go on leave halfway through the year (The sub we had for the rest of the year really liked me, so it saved 1st grade from being a total failure).

==================================================================================================
"And if any women or children get their legs torn off, or faces caved in, well, it's tough shit for them." -2LT. Bert Stiles, 505th, 339th (On Berlin Bombardier Mission, 1944).

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Rachel ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:53PM

Sorry to drudge up old war wounds with all these ghost teachers of yore!

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: fcps teacher ()
Date: September 17, 2010 08:56PM

Duchess Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FX needs someone with Chancellor powers a la
> Michelle Rhee. If it were I, I would fire every
> administrator, and have them re-apply after
> justifying their position and doing an updated
> background check. That includes investigating side
> businesses like shady real estate deals a la the
> Robinson Principal.
>
> Then, I would go to work on the teachers, but not
> with the blunt ax Michelle wielded. But yes,
> everyone would reapply and with a background check
> updated and pee in a cup urine testing and maybe
> even a breathalyzer randomly done certain mornings
> in a classroom I am sure would fail.
>
> Following that, I would follow up on some VA
> legislative duties like getting stupid state laws
> repealed that justify using Zero Tolerance/No
> Intelligence required policies regarding student
> discipline. No student would be suspended for
> having their birth control pills in their purse at
> school after that.
>
> I think I would make an excellant FCPS Chancellor,
> and given that kind of power I might even do it
> for free, if you all will let me leave with that
> 1.3 million dollar Principal Education fund.


So you'd fire teachers for failed business ventures? What an ignorant thing to say. New background checks? If a teacher is arrested the system is notified. How about you let teachers do their job.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: formerhick76 ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:21PM

Wait, the OP's kid had a classmate that didn't bring a pencil, the teacher busted that kid's chops, and the OP's kid is traumatized by that?

WTF?

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Our Lady of FU ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:35PM

Kids are such pussies today. I went to Catholic school (K-12) in the '50s and '60s. The nuns back then thought nothing of going upside a kid's head for the most insignificant transgressions. And I mean they would slap the shit outta you. The nice ones would use an open hand instead of a fist, though.

In eighth grade, a kid punched a nun back. He was promptly expelled but became a legend. I still remember his name.

High school was worse. The brothers hit much harder than the nuns.

But I survived and turned out okay. What always has amazed me is the otherwise intelligent people that can't spell. You don't get out of Catholic school without learning to spell, they beat it into you (literally).

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Josey Wales ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:50PM

If you think your teacher is tough wait until you have a boss.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: Geri ()
Date: September 17, 2010 09:54PM

Not tough, abusive. I find it amusing that concern over a potentially bad teacher is a bad thing. It's as if you all find it easier to sit still in the presence of bad teachers or evil nuns.

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Re: Teacher Woes!
Posted by: platitudes ()
Date: September 17, 2010 10:14PM

Josey Wales wrote:

If you think your teacher is tough wait until you have a boss.



Yes, but you are usually an adult when you have a boss and you have the mental and emotional maturity to deal with your boss. You can even quit your job. A kid can't quit school and as several posters have written, it is next to impossible to change teachers. A cruel boss will probably fail as a boss if the cruelty is unfair. A cruel teacher will get away with unfair cruelty because the whole system is stacked to protect the teacher.

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