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Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Stand Watie ()
Date: December 17, 2019 10:55PM

The union army massacred natives on the plains before, during and after the civil war. The Confederate army promoted a native to General. In fact full blood Cherokee CSA Gen. Stand Watie was the one of the bravest of all, and the last to surrender. They don't dare teach that in school now!
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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 01:36AM

The Democrats have to rewrite history because they were the party of slavery. They've done a good job of erasing too. Hardly anyone knows about Stand Watie

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Leftist.Gorilla ()
Date: December 18, 2019 06:57AM

One...one non-white does not change the message of that flag.

What about my neighbor who flies the CSA flag? I asked him about it and he said, "I want everyone to know I hate the niggers and want them all dead..." Is he doing it wrong?

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 08:15AM

Leftist.Gorilla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One...one non-white does not change the message of
> that flag.
>
> What about my neighbor who flies the CSA flag? I
> asked him about it and he said, "I want everyone
> to know I hate the niggers and want them all
> dead..." Is he doing it wrong?

Is your neighbor a fucking General?? No. So everything you just said is horseshit

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: history reader ()
Date: December 18, 2019 10:54AM

Stand Watie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stand Watie was
> the one of the bravest of all, and the last to
> surrender. l


I know quite a bit about Civil war history and Stand Watie. Saying he was the “bravest of all” is a gigantic overstatement as there were literally thousands of confederate soldiers and officers who saw and endured more action than him. His role during the war was actually pretty limited. Nor were his troops subjected to any of the significant counter-offensives undertaken by Union forces. They were arguably the most ill-equipped and ill-trained of any of the five major confederate commands, and they were mainly in the middle of Oklahoma for most of the war, which wasn’t a state and in the middle of freaking nowhere. Sure, his was the last major command to surrender, but only because it wasn’t near any significant Union presence at the time. They basically sat around for 2 months after Appomattox, waiting to see what would happen, then they went home.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 12:07PM

history reader Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stand Watie Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Stand Watie was
> > the one of the bravest of all, and the last to
> > surrender. l
>
>
> I know quite a bit about Civil war history and
> Stand Watie. Saying he was the “bravest of
> all” is a gigantic overstatement as there were
> literally thousands of confederate soldiers and
> officers who saw and endured more action than him.
> His role during the war was actually pretty
> limited. Nor were his troops subjected to any of
> the significant counter-offensives undertaken by
> Union forces. They were arguably the most
> ill-equipped and ill-trained of any of the five
> major confederate commands, and they were mainly
> in the middle of Oklahoma for most of the war,
> which wasn’t a state and in the middle of
> freaking nowhere. Sure, his was the last major
> command to surrender, but only because it wasn’t
> near any significant Union presence at the time.
> They basically sat around for 2 months after
> Appomattox, waiting to see what would happen, then
> they went home.


I don't see Lincoln appointing any native American generals you ass. I just see him leaving slaves in border states in bondage with his BS emancipation proclamation and invading a peaceful bastion that had seceded democratically as is proper.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: history reader ()
Date: December 18, 2019 12:33PM

The only reason Watie was commissioned as a general was because the indian troops wouldn’t accept a white guy in charge. Plenty of indian troops fought for the Union, there just wasn’t a need to make one a commanding general.

I should also point out how stupid it was to post a picture of an Apache warrior at the top of this thread. Watie was not an Apache, the Apache weren't involved in the war, and it’s absurd to think that Watie was riding around shirtless like that. Him and his army wore uniforms like the rest of the army.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 12:38PM

history reader Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The only reason Watie was commissioned as a
> general was because the indian troops wouldn’t
> accept a white guy in charge. Plenty of indian
> troops fought for the Union, there just wasn’t a
> need to make one a commanding general.
>
> I should also point out how stupid it was to post
> a picture of an Apache warrior at the top of this
> thread. Watie was not an Apache, the Apache
> weren't involved in the war, and it’s absurd to
> think that Watie was riding around shirtless like
> that. Him and his army wore uniforms like the
> rest of the army.


Funny how all of Lincoln's native regiments were commanded by white men you inufferable boob... The portrait of the Apache warrior represents the spirit of resistance to Tyranny by people of ALL races, just as does the portrait of lady virtue the Amazon on our state seal!

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 12:44PM

History reader done schooled us! All of the womenfolk of the 1860's wore togas just like on our flag! What a ridiculous argument against your white supremacy delusion of persecution. pointing out that my majestic meme was only somewhat related given that both the Apaches and the Confederate Cherokee slayed Yankee bodies like wheat before the scythe!

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Bill.N. ()
Date: December 18, 2019 01:17PM

There is a certain amount of misinformation.

It wasn't "One...one non-white". A large portion of the "civilized nations" aligned themselves with the Confederacy. The Cherokee, Creek, Seminole and Choctaw nations at various times had representatives in the Confederate Congress. While primarily used in the Indian territory the troops raised among the civilized nations of the Indian territory did fight at the battle of Pea Ridge in Arkansas. Other Cherokees living in North Carolina also formed a unit that fought for the Confederacy. Seminoles in Florida also formed Confederate units that fought at Olustee. There were also some Hispanic units that fought for the Confederacy.

Now to be accurate there were three factors that influenced them to fight for the Confederacy. The first was geography. In war people tend to align themselves with their neighbors. The second was that both Indians and Hispanics owned slaves, and thus had the same financial interests as Confederate slaveholders. The third was that the Confederacy recognized early on the importance of the civilized tribes in the Indian Territory and made a major effort to gain their support.

Also to be fair Grant's military secretary Ely Parker was a Seneca and was officially promoted to Brigadier General in the Union army as the war ended, giving the Union an Indian general. The Union also had a Hispanic general, a former Mexican legislator and general who stayed in the U.S. after the Mexican War and who rose to the rank of general during the Civil War. The Confederacy like the U.S. had trouble with tribes on their frontier.

Finally slave ownership wasn't unique to prewar Democrats. Federalists, National Republicans, Whigs, "Know Nothings", Constituional Unionists and even REPUBLICANS owned slaves. Lincoln's Postmaster General was a slave owner, and his first Attorney General was a former slave owner.

History is far more complicated than some want it to be.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: abusive & uncivilized ()
Date: December 18, 2019 02:28PM

SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> and invading a peaceful bastion

The south wasn’t “peaceful” by any description. It was one of the most violent and inhumane places on earth.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: It Truly Is Bill ()
Date: December 18, 2019 03:39PM

Sadly there are those who deny history to propagandaise their political position

I am one at times but the war must be won at any cost

Which is the feelings of both major political parties today in the United States, sometimes I am wrong, but you may freely blame me for my 4th grade education for my mistakes

Your pal DAJAX

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Pog mo thoin ()
Date: December 18, 2019 07:03PM

abusive & uncivilized Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > and invading a peaceful bastion
>
> The south wasn’t “peaceful” by any
> description. It was one of the most violent and
> inhumane places on earth.

The process by which the south seceded was peaceful and democratic as the founders intended. As for endemic violence and abuse in the South, your delusions of persecution are getting the better of you again.. the truth is until this recent generation of snowflakes, white folks beat their own kids harder than they beat slaves and they beat Irish immigrants harder than any! That's right from the transcontinental railroads to the triangle shirtwaist factory the Irish faced the darkest opression of all. As a matter of fact my second-great-grandpa was a Mick brakeman on the Chicago, Burlington & Quincy railroad. In 1894 he smacked a low bridge in Iowa. His ghost has been driving his desendants to commit vehicular suicide ever since. Real live phantom brakeman neat eh?

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Phantom brakeman ()
Date: December 18, 2019 07:09PM

Before anyone wastes their time, several hundred brakemen died every year at the turn of the century. Dozens were killed in Iowa alone in 1894 and there are likely thousands of descendants of those men by then so by all means dig through all the records you please trying to ID me!

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 07:56PM

abusive & uncivilized Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > and invading a peaceful bastion
>
> The south wasn’t “peaceful” by any
> description. It was one of the most violent and
> inhumane places on earth.

You mean just like Maryland, Delaware, Kentucky and Missouri, the Yankee slave states conveniently exempted from Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation?? Face it, your delusions of persecution are just that and nothing more.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: proud moments in hisrtory ()
Date: December 18, 2019 09:44PM

SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You mean just like Maryland, Delaware, Kentucky
> and Missouri, the Yankee slave states conveniently
> exempted from Lincoln's Emancipation
> Proclamation??

It was Lincoln's effective political move to pull the rug out from under the Confederacy and turn the conflict into a single issue: the abolition of slave labor. And it worked.

The Confederate govt. lost all hope of gaining the foreign allies that they worked so hard to gain diplomatically overseas. It wasn't just a civil war after Emancipation. It was a fight to end slavery. And Lincoln's 13th amendment shortly thereafter sure sealed the deal.

Not only did the south surrender. They were forced to end their slave-based economy forever.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Date: December 18, 2019 11:14PM

proud moments in hisrtory Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > You mean just like Maryland, Delaware, Kentucky
> > and Missouri, the Yankee slave states
> conveniently
> > exempted from Lincoln's Emancipation
> > Proclamation??
>
> It was Lincoln's effective political move to pull
> the rug out from under the Confederacy and turn
> the conflict into a single issue: the abolition of
> slave labor. And it worked.
>
>

The EP was at best weak economic warfare and at worst a hypocritical propoganda laughingstock that had no influence on British/CSA relations. The Brits were still nursing the last three American wars - for you morons that's the French and Indian, American Revolution and the war of 1812. If the UK had intervened for the CSA the Yanks would have gone crying to the French again who still had their eyes on Canada 100 years after losing it... The UK didn't want another world war. Plain and simple. The Dominion of Canada was established two years after things cooled down in 1867 for a reason you know.. ain't nobody got time for civil war BS!

Even if you can ignore the blatant hipocrisy of leaving slaves in border states in bondage, the EP was still worthless. In theory slaves on Confederate plantations captured by the union army were freed from their masters but it wasn't like a free train ticket to Canada lmao. Able bodied males had already been joining Yankee regiments as they passed through long before the EP anyways. The vast majority remained on the plantations as sharecroppers until the turn of the century when mechanized agriculture drove the great migration to factory jobs in the North - just as the Southerners had predicted would happen even before the civil war broke.. I personally believe a smoother transition would have been far better than the harsh civil war that still leaves scars on this land today.

Calling it "Lincoln's 13th amendment" is an insult to his sharp white trash VP from Raleigh who understood southern politics and demographics better than Abe. As VP Johnson negotiated it all with the Yankee Senate before Lincoln was shot and then as President Andy bamboozled a few reconstruction states into ratifying 13 indisputably so he could steamroll on to 14 & the ultimate goal: 15 - and thus began the time honored tradition of carpetbaggers virtue signaling and swindling freedmen for votes!

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Bill.N. ()
Date: December 19, 2019 01:39PM

It Truly Is Bill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> but you may freely blame me for my 4th
> grade education for my mistakes
>
> Your pal DAJAX

A 4th grade education coupled with a willingness to continue learning can carry you far my friend.

Your loyal opposition

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: The Wisest Words I Ever Heard ()
Date: December 19, 2019 02:10PM

Bill N came from a young man working manual labor with me in the summer of 71. he was a college student who was returning that fall to begin medical school

As we shoveled dirt into a pickups bed I told him how intelligent I thought he was..as we discussed many subjects , he paused and told me that the more he learned.. the more he realized he needed to learn

Education is a necessary life long pursuit to allow one to understand the worlds ways around a person and life itself

DAJAX

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Oh Bill ()
Date: December 19, 2019 02:16PM

That young man was non racist open minded intelligent and dedicated to becoming a physician . Im positive he made it

DAJAX

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Bill.N. ()
Date: December 19, 2019 02:35PM

No arguments from me.

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Re: Conclusive evidence that the Confederate battle flag is not a symbol of white supremacy
Posted by: Honest Abe ()
Date: December 19, 2019 10:51PM

and I quote
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abe.jpg

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