For those of you interested in the renaming debate; I watched the 7/17 work session (at 1.5x speed on YouTube to limit the pain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1yspt1Fl1s).

Elizabeth Schultz made several cogent comments at about 1:05 and again at 2:15. Megan McLaughlin was also insightful. Others, including Tom Wilson and Karen Corbett Sanders, and Tamara Derenak Kaufax also pointed out the problems with trying to decide a name change without defining "compelling need". Tom Wilson pointed out that in the community survey there was approximately 25% of 1/3rd of the community that supported the name change - approximately 8%...

So, the FCPS Regulation on naming schools (8170.7) has not been followed; there is no indication of large support from the community, there is a broad range of "best practices" in addressing controversial name changes (including in many cases to do nothing) and there is substantial cost associated with a name change (estimated at $600K to 900K).

The Board will try to reach some agreement before the scheduled vote on the 28th. Mr. Moon, sensibly, suggested that a large majority vote was strongly preferable. We'll see... I don't get the sense from this discussion that there will be any name change for JEB Stuart, and hopefully the voices of reason will prevail and the whole debate moves to the Governance Committee and is carefully reconsidered.

Here are the "for sure" votes for the name change:
Dalia Palchik
Pat Hynes
Sandy Evans

My guess is that most will abstain. So, is it a majority of those voting, or does it have to be a majority to change the name?

Most want the name change, but realize the process has been terribly flawed (thanks, Sandy).

I don't think it merits spending the money. Here is what I would do:
do not "officially" change the name, but start referring to the School as "Stuart". In the future, as uniforms are redesigned, leave out the "Jeb" part.
Quit discussing the issue and it will go away. People will soon forget=-and pretty much never thought about it until Evans jumped on the bandwagon.

FWIW, two people running for SB (Keys-Gamarra and Michael Owens(? are on record saying the names of Confederate named schools should be changed. $$$$$$

It's just like the Redskins name change, people who have lived here long enough know that it comes up every few years.

I'm not pro-confederate, but I do like local history, and Stuart is part of that history. I remember reading the interview with the student who started this all, she was in 10th grade when she looked up who Jeb Stuart was and then started the campaign. She was in a school for 2 years before even bothering to look up who the person was, unbelievable. We learned about the Civil War in 6th grade.

I wonder how they would feel about naming it after the Commander of the Union army, Ulysses S. Grant.
After all, he was from the Union, the North, yet he owned slaves.
Robert Edward Lee owned slaves for a slight fraction of time, when he inherited them through the marriage of his wife. He soon gave them their freedom because he thought that slavery was a vile institution.
Most of them stayed working for him, because they knew how good of a person he was, and it has been documented that they "loved Massa Robert". Don't call me racist for that quote, look it up for yourself.
Grant had no problem owning slaves.
When the Civil War was over, the slaves in all of the south were free, but the slaves in the northern (Union) states were not. Including Grant's.

Look for a "compromise" solution of making it Stuart High School with a designation of and emphasis on the Stuart family. The School Board desperately wants to get this massive mistake behind them and they realize that they will have to pay for the cost of the name change if they do not want to live with this for the next three years while the funds are raised by some mystery donor (lol). A compromise appears to be a satisfactory solution for about all members with the exception of the original instigators of Evans and McElveen.

If you look into any person's past you will find something objectionable, and things that are admirable.

He's history here. Yeah, some object to some things about his past, bound to happen. Is it worth a million dollars to erase someone from all official books because someone objects to something in his past?

How about teach against the wrongdoings, praise what is good, and put the money towards the teachers. Kids will know what is wrong is wrong, and what is right is right. Use Stuart as an example, rather than try to hide him for one period/aspect of his life.

Any board member voting to spend a million bucks, which we don't have, is showing just how unwilling they are to look at the bigger picture of the situation.

Seriously, keep the name, praise what is good about him, and use it as a teaching moment to remember what was wrong about our past, and that it happened locally near JEB Stuart HS. Keeping the name is a way of guaranteeing kids will learn the past.

David in FC Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wonder how they would feel about naming it after
> the Commander of the Union army, Ulysses S. Grant.
>
> After all, he was from the Union, the North, yet
> he owned slaves.
> Robert Edward Lee owned slaves for a slight
> fraction of time, when he inherited them through
> the marriage of his wife. He soon gave them their
> freedom because he thought that slavery was a vile
> institution.
> Most of them stayed working for him, because they
> knew how good of a person he was, and it has been
> documented that they "loved Massa Robert". Don't
> call me racist for that quote, look it up for
> yourself.
> Grant had no problem owning slaves.
> When the Civil War was over, the slaves in all of
> the south were free, but the slaves in the
> northern (Union) states were not. Including
> Grant's.


Once again it is time to point out that the U.S. Civil War from 1861 - 1865 was NOT about slavery, but States Rights. Slavery was the law of the land, and was until Dec 1865.

13th Amendment Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> David in FC Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I wonder how they would feel about naming it
> after
> > the Commander of the Union army, Ulysses S.
> Grant.
> >
> > After all, he was from the Union, the North,
> yet
> > he owned slaves.
> > Robert Edward Lee owned slaves for a slight
> > fraction of time, when he inherited them
> through
> > the marriage of his wife. He soon gave them
> their
> > freedom because he thought that slavery was a
> vile
> > institution.
> > Most of them stayed working for him, because
> they
> > knew how good of a person he was, and it has
> been
> > documented that they "loved Massa Robert".
> Don't
> > call me racist for that quote, look it up for
> > yourself.
> > Grant had no problem owning slaves.
> > When the Civil War was over, the slaves in all
> of
> > the south were free, but the slaves in the
> > northern (Union) states were not. Including
> > Grant's.
>
>
> Once again it is time to point out that the U.S.
> Civil War from 1861 - 1865 was NOT about slavery,
> but States Rights. Slavery was the law of the
> land, and was until Dec 1865.


You're both wrong.

There is no evidence that Lee or Grant owned slaves.
BOTH of their Father-in-Laws owned slaves. BOTH freed the slaves as executors of their father-in-law's wills.
http://www.snopes.com/confederate-history-slave-ownership/

From the 'The Declaration of Causes of Seceding States'
https://www.civilwar.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states

Mississippi
"Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery-- the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth."

Georgia
"The people of Georgia having dissolved their political connection with the Government of the United States of America, present to their confederates and the world the causes which have led to the separation. For the last ten years we have had numerous and serious causes of complaint against our non-slave-holding confederate States with reference to the subject of African slavery."

Virginia
"the powers granted under the said Constitution were derived from the people of the United States, and might be resumed whensoever the same should be perverted to their injury and oppression; and the Federal Government, having perverted said powers, not only to the injury of the people of Virginia, but to the oppression of the Southern Slaveholding States."

Texas
"She was received as a commonwealth holding, maintaining and protecting the institution known as negro slavery-- the servitude of the African to the white race within her limits-- a relation that had existed from the first settlement of her wilderness by the white race, and which her people intended should exist in all future time. Her institutions and geographical position established the strongest ties between her and other slave-holding States of the confederacy."

South Carolina
"Those (Northern) States have assume the right of deciding upon the propriety of our domestic institutions; and have denied the rights of property established in fifteen of the States and recognized by the Constitution; they have denounced as sinful the institution of slavery; they have permitted open establishment among them of societies, whose avowed object is to disturb the peace and to eloign the property of the citizens of other States. They have encouraged and assisted thousands of our slaves to leave their homes; and those who remain, have been incited by emissaries, books and pictures to servile insurrection."

It was all about slavery, period.

that's a great compilation - thanks.

I learned a new word too - "eloign"

Ms. Evans et al really made a mess of things. Interesting to note that Ms. Mclaughlin complained that Karen Garza punted this and the Staff were nowhere to be found in advising or researching etc. Not much upside in getting involved and some real amusement to be gained from watching the 11 struggle... It's a shame to wrench the JEB Stuart community into knots over this. Could have been handled much better.

I could care less about Grant, Lee or Stuart having slaves and I do believe not in their "ownership" during the war. …don't think much about it. It was people living in their times…..
I don't agree with you especially regarding Virginia but nice job on the research.

I can't speak to all the secession docs you just posted, I need to study them, but Virginia used "Southern Slave Holding States" as a distinction to the "Northern Slave Holding States."

When the Cornerstone speech is thrown in everybody's face…once again, Stephens was making the distinction on previous US court rulings….
Stephens was not the originator of the "cornerstone" remarks; they were the words of US Supreme Court Associate Justice Henry Baldwin in an 1833 Pennsylvania case, "Johnson v. Tompkins, 13 F.Cas. 840, Baldw. 571, No. 7416 (C.C.E.D.Pa.,1833)". Stephens was quoting Baldwin's ruling to make the effective point that it was in fact the US that had legalized and defended slavery in US Courts for all of its existence. Pot can't call the kettle black. The lone reporter who wrote the often-misquoted article about what Stephens supposedly said in his Savannah speech left out the important reference to Justice Baldwin as being the originator of the "Cornerstone" remarks. Stephens' own view, like that of most of the CSA government officials, was that slavery ought to be abolished. (Read Stephens' own memoirs for this subject; the memoirs are reprinted now.)

And no….Virginia was not a Cotton State.

David Currie, professor of law at the University of Chicago Law School and a noted expert on American constitutional history.
"To oversimplify the matter, Currie said as a digression, "Virginia did not secede over slavery as the cotton states did, but over states' rights, over being asked to provide its militia to force the return of South Carolina to the Union."
https://content.law.virginia.edu/news/2002_fall/confed.htm

Virginia's attitude toward secession and slavery…Mr. Beverly Munford, his work was considered critical to understanding Virginia's position. This was written in 1910. I do believe a document well sourced that was written within 50 years of the end of the Civil war is more likely accurate then what I'm reading today.
http://www.jstor.org/stable/27532375?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

Dr. William W. Freehling, noted historian
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6QDulRyeHc&feature=youtu.be

You are correct. If we are to take a hard look at our history we would need to remove the names of most of our founding fathers, including the grand-daddy of them all, George Washington, and many other prominent people throughout our history, including many of our parents generation. Sadly, most students learned history in school but were never taught how to put it into the context of the time and environment people lived in. By hiding history future generations will be doomed to re-live it.

DVB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are correct. If we are to take a hard look at
> our history we would need to remove the names of
> most of our founding fathers, including the
> grand-daddy of them all, George Washington, and
> many other prominent people throughout our
> history, including many of our parents generation.
> Sadly, most students learned history in school but
> were never taught how to put it into the context
> of the time and environment people lived in. By
> hiding history future generations will be doomed
> to re-live it.

The problem I see is as we tear the threads out (people), we destroy the fabric, our story, our history. Why would anyone want to defend this country in the future if needed....there is no appreciation that Freedom wasn't free and isn't that why so many minorities come here in the first place?

My position is.... if we want to separate from the name of every Virginian in our history who had any relationship with slavery there wouldn't be many left.
Virginia's history is the bedrock of this nation. From colonial days, the revolution, the founding fathers, presidents, and the civil war.

Let's expand the history to be more inclusive, not bury historical figures and names to "feel" better.

Furthermore Tourism is a huge industry in Virginia...Total tourism spending in Fairfax County for 2015 reached over $2.93 billion. Within the entire Commonwealth of Virginia, Fairfax County is the #2 contributor of expenditures to Virginia's tourism industry. Tourism support 30,000 plus local jobs...restaurants, hotels etc.

People come to Virginia to see and learn our history....all of our history.

I guess it all depends on what you learned in school, and most importantly, on your own.

Education never ends.


States Rights, Northern Aggression , The election of 1860, were the root causes of the war.

13th Amendment Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I guess it all depends on what you learned in
> school, and most importantly, on your own.
>
> Education never ends.
>
>
> States Rights, Northern Aggression , The election
> of 1860, were the root causes of the war.

`
And what 'right' did states want to remain??? Slavery.
The Southern States literally stated it in the 'Declaration of Causes of Seceding States'

It's literally the second sentence in the Georgia declaration.

"The people of Georgia having dissolved their political connection with the Government of the United States of America, present to their confederates and the world the causes which have led to the separation. For the last ten years we have had numerous and serious causes of complaint against our non-slave-holding confederate States with reference to the subject of African slavery."

Virginia Confederates were stupid enough to present it as the North 'oppressing' the Southern states right to oppress black people.
"the powers granted under the said Constitution were derived from the people of the United States, and might be resumed whensoever the same should be perverted to their injury and oppression; and the Federal Government, having perverted said powers, not only to the injury of the people of Virginia, but to the oppression of the Southern Slaveholding States."

Go do more of your never-ending education.
https://www.civilwar.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states

It is amazing that 150+ years after the Civil War people still argue the issues that caused it.

Nothing like scrubbing history to rewrite your own self-serving,white bread version of it.

Former Down And Out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nothing like scrubbing history to rewrite your own
> self-serving,white bread version of it.


Suggest you read some primary sources of letters from everyday people during that time For some, it may have only been about slavery, but for many, it was a matter of their "homeland." They were not evil people. Many people who fought for the South were poor dirt farmers.

I never said it was,read before you shitpost.

Still about slavery Wrote:


> Virginia Confederates were stupid enough to
> present it as the North 'oppressing' the Southern
> states right to oppress black people.
> "the powers granted under the said Constitution
> were derived from the people of the United States,
> and might be resumed whensoever the same should be
> perverted to their injury and oppression; and
> the Federal Government, having perverted said
> powers, not only to the injury of the people of
> Virginia, but to the oppression of the Southern
> Slaveholding States."
>
> Go do more of your never-ending education.


No doubt the North would have just folded up shop overnight if the South pressured them to shut down their industrial revolution because of the environmental footprint, destroying things for future generations and possibly the world. Yeah...I'm sure that would have happened.

The guilt which beset the North, has at its roots the profits from its vast slave trading which did nothing less than finance the Industrial Revolution.

So let up with the "Southern" slave culture, there was nothing "Southern" about it.

So the argument should be are we removing the name due to him being an American hero turned tractor by siding with his home state and the south, or the fact that he was a slave owner.

Unfortunately, both are poor reasons.

Augiedog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So the argument should be are we removing the name
> due to him being an American hero turned tractor
> by siding with his home state and the south, or
> the fact that he was a slave owner.
>
> Unfortunately, both are poor reasons.

Ironically, the real problem is that the School Board does not have a politically viable reason to change the name without digging a hole for themselves of which half of them will not be able to climb out of. If they use "it is the right thing to do" they will have up to 31 schools that they may be required to change and will be up to their ears in lawsuits. It all goes back to their seat of the pants, to hell with proper procedures in which they have governed. Specifically, very important terms were not defined, the working group was not provided a mandate and parameters in which to operate, School regulations were not followed and they violated good governing practices that should have been followed by a governing Board

Seems odd that this discussion on Fairfax Underground is more intelligent than the statements being made by members of the school board.

Of course, someone will now write a snarky response just to prove me wrong.

Here is a bold prediction!

The School Board will change the SB regulation for renaming an existing school by redefining "compelling need" to precisely fit the JEB Stuart name change and change the regulation that empowers them to name the school without input from the community. They will approve the name change and name the school one of three names. Thurgood Marshall HS, Munson Hill HS or Stuart High School. Realistically it is not probable but it is a path that they would have taken in the past. Along with solving the "compelling need" problem, using FCPS funds for changing the name is one that will certainly piss almost everyone off--particularly after raising the teacher/student classroom ratios and not giving teachers the second installment of their promise to make their salaries more competitive with neighboring jurisdictions.

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here is a bold prediction!
>
> The School Board will change the SB regulation for
> renaming an existing school by redefining
> "compelling need" to precisely fit the JEB Stuart
> name change and change the regulation that
> empowers them to name the school without input
> from the community. They will approve the name
> change and name the school one of three names.
> Thurgood Marshall HS, Munson Hill HS or Stuart
> High School. Realistically it is not probable but
> it is a path that they would have taken in the
> past. Along with solving the "compelling need"
> problem, using FCPS funds for changing the name is
> one that will certainly piss almost everyone
> off--particularly after raising the
> teacher/student classroom ratios and not giving
> teachers the second installment of their promise
> to make their salaries more competitive with
> neighboring jurisdictions.

There is no current definition of "compelling need," so why would they need to redefine a term that was selected to maximize their discretion, as the body entrusted with decision-making authority over the schools?

I do agree they will rename JEB Stuart HS, a clearly inappropriate name (as evidenced by the multiple steps taken over the years to whitewash his Confederate past, such as painting over the Confederate flag on the gymnasium floor, removing the Confederate flag from uniforms, etc). If they don't, they will expose Fairfax County to enormous adverse publicity as a county that looked its legacy of racism and discrimination in the eye and then just shrugged.

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here is a bold prediction!
>
> The School Board will change the SB regulation for
> renaming an existing school by redefining
> "compelling need" to precisely fit the JEB Stuart
> name change and change the regulation that
> empowers them to name the school without input
> from the community. They will approve the name
> change and name the school one of three names.
> Thurgood Marshall HS, Munson Hill HS or Stuart
> High School. Realistically it is not probable but
> it is a path that they would have taken in the
> past. Along with solving the "compelling need"
> problem, using FCPS funds for changing the name is
> one that will certainly piss almost everyone
> off--particularly after raising the
> teacher/student classroom ratios and not giving
> teachers the second installment of their promise
> to make their salaries more competitive with
> neighboring jurisdictions.


How about Stuart Little High School?

KfLRuKYFZJFZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Inquisitive One Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Here is a bold prediction!
> >
> > The School Board will change the SB regulation
> for
> > renaming an existing school by redefining
> > "compelling need" to precisely fit the JEB
> Stuart
> > name change and change the regulation that
> > empowers them to name the school without input
> > from the community. They will approve the name
> > change and name the school one of three names.
> > Thurgood Marshall HS, Munson Hill HS or Stuart
> > High School. Realistically it is not probable
> but
> > it is a path that they would have taken in the
> > past. Along with solving the "compelling need"
> > problem, using FCPS funds for changing the name
> is
> > one that will certainly piss almost everyone
> > off--particularly after raising the
> > teacher/student classroom ratios and not giving
> > teachers the second installment of their
> promise
> > to make their salaries more competitive with
> > neighboring jurisdictions.
>
> There is no current definition of "compelling
> need," so why would they need to redefine a term
> that was selected to maximize their discretion, as
> the body entrusted with decision-making authority
> over the schools?
>
> I do agree they will rename JEB Stuart HS, a
> clearly inappropriate name (as evidenced by the
> multiple steps taken over the years to whitewash
> his Confederate past, such as painting over the
> Confederate flag on the gymnasium floor, removing
> the Confederate flag from uniforms, etc). If they
> don't, they will expose Fairfax County to enormous
> adverse publicity as a county that looked its
> legacy of racism and discrimination in the eye and
> then just shrugged

Currently the only reason that they have to change the name of the school is that it is a racially insensitive name for a school and if they use that as the "compelling need" they will not only have 31 other schools needing a name change, a HUGE bill which they have no funds to pay for the changes and about 7 or 8 lawsuits. It is a total mess that was created by Sandy Evans and totally mismanaged by Pat Hynes, of which the entire Board will have a very hard time solving without inflicting very serious damage on the cohesiveness of the entire community.

"I do agree they will rename JEB Stuart HS, a clearly inappropriate name (as evidenced by the multiple steps taken over the years to whitewash his Confederate past, such as painting over the Confederate flag on the gymnasium floor, removing the Confederate flag from uniforms, etc). If they don't, they will expose Fairfax County to enormous adverse publicity as a county that looked its legacy of racism and discrimination in the eye and then just shrugged."

They will have more bad publicity when they spend money that is supposed to educate children on renaming a school.

Do you really think this will better serve the students?

My solution: Some type of motion to educate kids on what happened. Demonizing Stuart has not bee helpful. Demonizing Woodson is just wrong--and they have done that.

Stuart had a choice: fight for the Union or fight for the Confederacy. He was told by the Union Army that he would have to fight Virginia. He was a Virginian. His family was in Virginia. It was a tough choice for him.

Sure, it was a poor choice of names--but, in Virginia it was not an unusual choice. How many schools in Virginia are named Jackson (Stonewall)--quite a number of them, I suspect. All over the South you will find schools named after Robert E. Lee.
Leave the name alone. Call it Stuart. Direct that the Jeb be removed from uniforms as they are replaced. Period.
Spend money on the classrooms--not renaming schools.

Real Americans don't celebrate traitors. This not an issue about polls. If the people support calling it Hitler High School that does not mean it should be named that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/23/2017 01:33PM by Gerrymanderer2.

Gerrymanderer2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Real Americans don't celebrate traitors. This not
> an issue about polls. If the people support
> calling it Hitler High School that does not mean
> it should be named that.


And, here we have a problem. Stuart was not Hitler, but the sB members are painting him as such.

He was a brilliant military man who was faced with a very difficult decision. Virginia or USA? Family or country?

Quit creating a false story. It is complicated--and it is expensive. The job of the school board is to be sure the kids get educated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl5FCMlWTv0

FCPS has procedures to follow for naming schools. We have gotten to this point by deviating from established rules and creating procedures that were convenient for driving an agenda. The SB would be wise to play by the rules for the duration of this mess. Otherwise, they are going to make mistakes that will cost additional scarce funds and make a situation where the FCPS will be a defendant in court.

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FCPS has procedures to follow for naming schools.
> We have gotten to this point by deviating from
> established rules and creating procedures that
> were convenient for driving an agenda. The SB
> would be wise to play by the rules for the
> duration of this mess. Otherwise, they are going
> to make mistakes that will cost additional scarce
> funds and make a situation where the FCPS will be
> a defendant in court.

And let's face it, this has angered a lot of parents who didn't see any problem with the name for decades. If the NAACP (didn't even realize they had a ffx branch) was so offended, where were their complaints in the 80s and 90s? Plus, it's awfully arrogant of them to assume that re-naming the school after a leftist activist judge would somehow be embraced by all residents. News flash, this is not PG county, which named an elementary school after Obama before he even left office (unheard of)...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/24/2017 08:16AM by metalhead.

metalhead Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Inquisitive One Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > FCPS has procedures to follow for naming
> schools.
> > We have gotten to this point by deviating from
> > established rules and creating procedures that
> > were convenient for driving an agenda. The SB
> > would be wise to play by the rules for the
> > duration of this mess. Otherwise, they are
> going
> > to make mistakes that will cost additional
> scarce
> > funds and make a situation where the FCPS will
> be
> > a defendant in court.
>
> And let's face it, this has angered a lot of
> parents who didn't see any problem with the name
> for decades. If the NAACP (didn't even realize
> they had a ffx branch) was so offended, where were
> their complaints in the 80s and 90s? Plus, it's
> awfully arrogant of them to assume that re-naming
> the school after a leftist activist judge would
> somehow be embraced by all residents. News flash,
> this is not PG county, which named an elementary
> school after Obama before he even left office
> (unheard of)...

Evans kept changing the rules on this until she got the "results" she wanted. Flawed process.

And, FWIW, FCPS would be utterly stupid if they go with a second Marshall High. That was the suggestion--from the NAACP? Nothing to do with the judge, everything to do with confusion. Symbolic of the way this whole mess has unfolded.

If they must do this--then name it Munson Hill. Do not name it after a person.

My vote: Stuart High. Don't spend money on dropping "Jeb"--just have a policy that eliminates it on future purchases.

No cost. Done.

Gerrymanderer2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Real Americans don't celebrate traitors. This not
> an issue about polls. If the people support
> calling it Hitler High School that does not mean
> it should be named that.

I don't know if you have considered that naming a HS after Adolf Hitler would create it's own set of problems.

Unwise Chioce Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gerrymanderer2 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Real Americans don't celebrate traitors. This
> not
> > an issue about polls. If the people support
> > calling it Hitler High School that does not
> mean
> > it should be named that.
>
> I don't know if you have considered that naming a
> HS after Adolf Hitler would create it's own set of
> problems.

Serious problem--and you you have lost the argument--when you compare Jeb Stuart to Hitler. Not the same thing.

And, please remember, it was a tough decision for him--one he did not want to make. He stayed with the Union army until he was told to attack his state--and, by association, his family.

not the same Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unwise Chioce Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Gerrymanderer2 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Real Americans don't celebrate traitors. This
> > not
> > > an issue about polls. If the people support
> > > calling it Hitler High School that does not
> > mean
> > > it should be named that.
> >
> > I don't know if you have considered that naming
> a
> > HS after Adolf Hitler would create it's own set
> of
> > problems.
>
> Serious problem--and you you have lost the
> argument--when you compare Jeb Stuart to Hitler.
> Not the same thing.
>
> And, please remember, it was a tough decision for
> him--one he did not want to make. He stayed with
> the Union army until he was told to attack his
> state--and, by association, his family.

Adolf Hitler was a Nazi, and the leader of the German Third Reich - Not the Union Army.

not the same Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unwise Chioce Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Gerrymanderer2 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Real Americans don't celebrate traitors. This
> > not
> > > an issue about polls. If the people support
> > > calling it Hitler High School that does not
> > mean
> > > it should be named that.
> >
> > I don't know if you have considered that naming
> a
> > HS after Adolf Hitler would create it's own set
> of
> > problems.
>
> Serious problem--and you you have lost the
> argument--when you compare Jeb Stuart to Hitler.
> Not the same thing.
>
> And, please remember, it was a tough decision for
> him--one he did not want to make. He stayed with
> the Union army until he was told to attack his
> state--and, by association, his family.

Don't encourage Ravi. It is like literally aggravating a sleeping dog.

Let's end this shit right now.

Adopt a policy that says that ALL the high schools named after individuals shall be renamed to a geographic name, unless the school is named after an individual who attended Fairfax County Public Schools. Robinson could keep its name. Jefferson, Marshall, Stuart, Edison, Madison and Lee will have to change theirs. (For purposes of this settlement we will forget that Lee is also a geographic name.) In the future it would require unanimous consent to name a school after an individual who did not graduate from Fairfax County Schools.
That way we are no longer arguing about whether it is appropriate for children to go to a school that is named after an individual who some people find unacceptable or whether name changes are being done for political reasons. It also means we won't be talking about having Thurgood Marshall, Donald Trump, Ronald Reagan or Barak Obama High School in the future. It will mean spending money that otherwise could be spent on a variety of very good programs for our students, but it will deal with the rpoblem once and for all..

^^^^^^^^^^^^

Excellent suggestion - I vote for the NYC concept for naming schools.

Example PS 182 or a letter naming method like school A, B, C,.......

Good idea, but even that would cost a bare minimum of 1 million per school. The signage alone makes it unbelievably expensive. Price out a new scoreboard and you'll see what I mean. The school board has egg on its face after their machinations have been revealed. This is what happens when people adopt a cause and don't follow proper procedures. It is an example of political posturing that we can not afford.

The problem is our school board that tries to pander to every special interest group that whines about something.

You will find something bad about any person you try to name something for. There is always something someone will complain about.

JEB Stuart was a local historical figure with ties to the location where the school is located, who has a mix of good and bad.

Focus on the good, and use the bad as a teachable moment. Save a million dollars. Our board has no concern over spending money that is not theirs. Time to reboot the board of the biggest idiots who want this change and are trying to put boys in the girls locker room.

FCPS needs to use this situation as a learning experience, and refrain from naming anymore High Schools after J.E.B. Stuart.

Dedicated To the FFX SB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl5FCMlWTv0


Excellent video.....it's obvious from the link on the school board thread it's not stopping at Jeb, not by a long shot.

This is excellent! Kudos to the creator.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl5FCMlWTv0

Well done Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dedicated To the FFX SB Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl5FCMlWTv0
>
>
> Excellent video.....it's obvious from the link on
> the school board thread it's not stopping at Jeb,
> not by a long shot.

They will not be able to stop at one because if they do Stuart they will be sued to change the name of at least three more and as many as 31 more.

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well done Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Dedicated To the FFX SB Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl5FCMlWTv0
> >
> >
> > Excellent video.....it's obvious from the link
> on
> > the school board thread it's not stopping at
> Jeb,
> > not by a long shot.
>
> They will not be able to stop at one because if
> they do Stuart they will be sued to change the
> name of at least three more and as many as 31
> more.


That's really going to help class size in FCPS! Sadly, it is likely that Karen Keys-Gamarra will be elected and is on record that she supports renaming more schools.

Do not be so presumptive about the outcome of the election. A special election is a low turnout type of election and the Democrat vote will be split 3 different ways. There is also a lot of voter discontent about how the SB has handled the name change issue and how they sometimes believe that the Regulations are for other people or changed to satisfy their needs. This case however in their haste to rig the system they were sloppy in their underhanded governance and did not define critical terms.

I'm pretty liberal but I would never give them taxing authority, the aren't trustworthy and Karen's all for having that ability. We still don't know the deal with the auditor.

I grew up in a family where money was tight....but we could afford all the basics, food etc. 67% of these kids can't afford lunch...so what's going to happen to them when the fees for everything else goes up?

I am grateful that my brothers could play sports, that's where they excelled (not academics) and made friends for life and it gave them confidence. Had there been a fee of a couple of hundred I know they wouldn't have played sports...the money wasn't there.

The school board thinks nothing of what these kids "pay to play" as sports fees will definitely go up. The long time Booster club president already says he's out of there. He is not being spiteful but seriously he has a day job, he does this from the goodness of his heart and to serve the community and he's not up to rebuilding.


Karen Keys-Gamarra says her issues are "anti-bullying". She also wants tax. If elected she'll be in good company, she's joining a group of bullies.

Between this link that was on the school board thread and the video above, it's obvious.

Read bullet point #18 on page 27…George Alber (NAACP) questions Kaufax doing her job…?
Here's a link to the FOIA evidence.
https://goo.gl/cserZN

I'm pretty liberal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm pretty liberal but I would never give them
> taxing authority, the aren't trustworthy and
> Karen's all for having that ability. We still
> don't know the deal with the auditor.
>
> I grew up in a family where money was tight....but
> we could afford all the basics, food etc. 67% of
> these kids can't afford lunch...so what's going to
> happen to them when the fees for everything else
> goes up?
>
> I am grateful that my brothers could play sports,
> that's where they excelled (not academics) and
> made friends for life and it gave them confidence.
> Had there been a fee of a couple of hundred I know
> they wouldn't have played sports...the money
> wasn't there.
>
> The school board thinks nothing of what these kids
> "pay to play" as sports fees will definitely go
> up. The long time Booster club president already
> says he's out of there. He is not being spiteful
> but seriously he has a day job, he does this from
> the goodness of his heart and to serve the
> community and he's not up to rebuilding.
>
>
> Karen Keys-Gamarra says her issues are
> "anti-bullying". She also wants tax. If elected
> she'll be in good company, she's joining a group
> of bullies.
>
> Between this link that was on the school board
> thread and the video above, it's obvious.
>
> Read bullet point #18 on page 27…George Alber
> (NAACP) questions Kaufax doing her job…?
> Here's a link to the FOIA evidence.
> https://goo.gl/cserZN

The information in that link is a well-kept secret. I'm beginning to believe the "fake news" is keeping it quiet. This shows unethical behavior on the part of Evans and Hynes (telling people to go "off line"?) It is likely to be not only unethical, but, also illegal.

I watched the workshop last week. It is clear they are concerned about the process--even worried. But, having watched these guys for years, my money is on the name change.

I do understand the concern about the name, but to created fake stories about "Massive Resistance" and to harm the names of Fairfax county officials who are long gone, is despicable. Hynes and Evans went along with this and, according to the FOIA, knew that it was a fake story a long time ago. This, to me, is more damning than the collusion with the NAACP--although it is closely related.

I'm sure they are nice people, but they just cannot look at all sides of the issue.

On another topic, Hynes and McElveen jumped on the Rolling Stone story as fact right after it was released. They wrote a public letter together condemning UVA regarding this story--which, of course, turned out to be a hoax.
That is the same with this. Lots of the stories put out about the naming of the high school have turned out to be hoaxes.

We need a new School Board.

I'm pretty liberal Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm pretty liberal but I would never give them
> taxing authority, the aren't trustworthy and
> Karen's all for having that ability. We still
> don't know the deal with the auditor.
>
> I grew up in a family where money was tight....but
> we could afford all the basics, food etc. 67% of
> these kids can't afford lunch...so what's going to
> happen to them when the fees for everything else
> goes up?
>
> I am grateful that my brothers could play sports,
> that's where they excelled (not academics) and
> made friends for life and it gave them confidence.
> Had there been a fee of a couple of hundred I know
> they wouldn't have played sports...the money
> wasn't there.
>
> The school board thinks nothing of what these kids
> "pay to play" as sports fees will definitely go
> up. The long time Booster club president already
> says he's out of there. He is not being spiteful
> but seriously he has a day job, he does this from
> the goodness of his heart and to serve the
> community and he's not up to rebuilding.
>
>
> Karen Keys-Gamarra says her issues are
> "anti-bullying". She also wants tax. If elected
> she'll be in good company, she's joining a group
> of bullies.
>
> Between this link that was on the school board
> thread and the video above, it's obvious.
>
> Read bullet point #18 on page 27…George Alber
> (NAACP) questions Kaufax doing her job…?
> Here's a link to the FOIA evidence.
> https://goo.gl/cserZN

Beginning on page one of the FOIA emails, it is clear that this had been discussed earlier.
Interesting, too, that it is Stuart AND LEE being discussed when this all started.
Who is Julie Strandlie? She suggested --I think on page one--that there was a story behind the naming of the schools that , if true, would ensure the name change. I guess she was referring to the "myth" that Woodson named them out of spite.
So, this whole exercise started on a false premise.

What a mess these people have made.

More people should read that link if they want to understand how the SB operates.

It's just really screwed up. There are other schools identified besides Lee, Stuart and Woodson. Inquisitive One is correct.

If you go to the "what's in a name Video series" put out by FCPS, you'll see how Mosby was named, it was after the community. A writer in the Washington Post said it was "chosen' for spite in an editorial this past weekend.

Just listen to the first 27 seconds....of Mosby.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYk-BpSrgqhQiHw0QcjKvyHogz0c5Joh2

who is Julie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm pretty liberal Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm pretty liberal but I would never give them
> > taxing authority, the aren't trustworthy and
> > Karen's all for having that ability. We still
> > don't know the deal with the auditor.
> >
> > I grew up in a family where money was
> tight....but
> > we could afford all the basics, food etc. 67%
> of
> > these kids can't afford lunch...so what's going
> to
> > happen to them when the fees for everything
> else
> > goes up?
> >
> > I am grateful that my brothers could play
> sports,
> > that's where they excelled (not academics) and
> > made friends for life and it gave them
> confidence.
> > Had there been a fee of a couple of hundred I
> know
> > they wouldn't have played sports...the money
> > wasn't there.
> >
> > The school board thinks nothing of what these
> kids
> > "pay to play" as sports fees will definitely go
> > up. The long time Booster club president
> already
> > says he's out of there. He is not being
> spiteful
> > but seriously he has a day job, he does this
> from
> > the goodness of his heart and to serve the
> > community and he's not up to rebuilding.
> >
> >
> > Karen Keys-Gamarra says her issues are
> > "anti-bullying". She also wants tax. If elected
> > she'll be in good company, she's joining a
> group
> > of bullies.
> >
> > Between this link that was on the school board
> > thread and the video above, it's obvious.
> >
> > Read bullet point #18 on page 27…George Alber
> > (NAACP) questions Kaufax doing her job…?
> > Here's a link to the FOIA evidence.
> > https://goo.gl/cserZN
>
> Beginning on page one of the FOIA emails, it is
> clear that this had been discussed earlier.
> Interesting, too, that it is Stuart AND LEE being
> discussed when this all started.
> Who is Julie Strandlie? She suggested --I think
> on page one--that there was a story behind the
> naming of the schools that , if true, would ensure
> the name change. I guess she was referring to the
> "myth" that Woodson named them out of spite.
> So, this whole exercise started on a false
> premise.
>
> What a mess these people have made.
>
> More people should read that link if they want to
> understand how the SB operates.

If you have followed the SB for the past five years and read the entire transcript of this sordid tale (particularly Evans getting caught conspiring with McElveen and then NAACP, then telling everyone to avoid emails due to FOIA) you end up sick to your stomach! PLEASE READ THE ENTIRE 38 PAGES OF THE LINK!!!

who is Julie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm pretty liberal Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm pretty liberal but I would never give them
> > taxing authority, the aren't trustworthy and
> > Karen's all for having that ability. We still
> > don't know the deal with the auditor.
> >
> > I grew up in a family where money was
> tight....but
> > we could afford all the basics, food etc. 67%
> of
> > these kids can't afford lunch...so what's going
> to
> > happen to them when the fees for everything
> else
> > goes up?
> >
> > I am grateful that my brothers could play
> sports,
> > that's where they excelled (not academics) and
> > made friends for life and it gave them
> confidence.
> > Had there been a fee of a couple of hundred I
> know
> > they wouldn't have played sports...the money
> > wasn't there.
> >
> > The school board thinks nothing of what these
> kids
> > "pay to play" as sports fees will definitely go
> > up. The long time Booster club president
> already
> > says he's out of there. He is not being
> spiteful
> > but seriously he has a day job, he does this
> from
> > the goodness of his heart and to serve the
> > community and he's not up to rebuilding.
> >
> >
> > Karen Keys-Gamarra says her issues are
> > "anti-bullying". She also wants tax. If elected
> > she'll be in good company, she's joining a
> group
> > of bullies.
> >
> > Between this link that was on the school board
> > thread and the video above, it's obvious.
> >
> > Read bullet point #18 on page 27…George Alber
> > (NAACP) questions Kaufax doing her job…?
> > Here's a link to the FOIA evidence.
> > https://goo.gl/cserZN
>
> Beginning on page one of the FOIA emails, it is
> clear that this had been discussed earlier.
> Interesting, too, that it is Stuart AND LEE being
> discussed when this all started.
> Who is Julie Strandlie? She suggested --I think
> on page one--that there was a story behind the
> naming of the schools that , if true, would ensure
> the name change. I guess she was referring to the
> "myth" that Woodson named them out of spite.
> So, this whole exercise started on a false
> premise.
>
> What a mess these people have made.
>
> More people should read that link if they want to
> understand how the SB operates.

I interpreted Julie Strandlie as being one of the original supporters/organizer of the school name change. Beyond that I did not pay that much attention to her role. However, the Woodson "myth" did come from someone and one of the early adopters would be as good of a source as any.

Where did Keys-Gamara's taxing statement come from? I could not find it on her website. Being an advocate of taxing authority is essentially the same as being an advocate of blowing the lid off of the FCPS budget and almost endless tax increases. They have proven that they cannot be trusted with the taxpayer's money and need the Board of Supervisors control as a check against excessive spending.

"I support the position in the School Board’s legislative program, which calls for granting taxing authority to elected school boards."

http://bluevirginia.us/2017/06/fcps-candidates-qs-meet-challenges-funding-schools-adequate-revenues

"They have proven that they cannot be trusted with the taxpayer's money and need the Board of Supervisors control as a check against excessive spending"

So what happened to the auditor. Does anybody know?

Unlimited tax dollars and no auditor? It was painfully obvious the auditor answered to the School Board anyways and not the BOS. So where's the check and balance if they are given taxing authority. They don't listen to the community as it is now.

They'll have every social program they can think of and our schools will continue to decline.

They knocked the old board for integration taking years, integration was a complex sea change and they were hampered by Richmond for 5 years.

Here the ball is totally in their court only, you have one school, one name change, and they have managed to tear the community apart, appoint a bogus "Ad Hoc committee" loaded with non community people and professional organizers from the NAACP, they know better but continue to malign Woodson and the earlier boards, and were are going on over two years.

Don't know Julie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "They have proven that they cannot be trusted with
> the taxpayer's money and need the Board of
> Supervisors control as a check against excessive
> spending"
>
> So what happened to the auditor. Does anybody
> know?
>
> Unlimited tax dollars and no auditor? It was
> painfully obvious the auditor answered to the
> School Board anyways and not the BOS. So where's
> the check and balance if they are given taxing
> authority. They don't listen to the community as
> it is now.
>
> They'll have every social program they can think
> of and our schools will continue to decline.
>
> They knocked the old board for integration taking
> years, integration was a complex sea change and
> they were hampered by Richmond for 5 years.
>
> Here the ball is totally in their court only, you
> have one school, one name change, and they have
> managed to tear the community apart, appoint a
> bogus "Ad Hoc committee" loaded with non community
> people and professional organizers from the NAACP,
> they know better but continue to malign Woodson
> and the earlier boards, and were are going on over
> two years.


If the SB was given taxing authority there would NO checks and balances and would essentially accountable to nobody since you are correct that they do not listen to the community. Currently, the SB can only spend the funds that are provided to them by the BOS. It is not much control but it is a much better situation than the SB having taxing authority.

Just posted today:

http://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/vpublic?open

"with expectation of private funding"..........

pathetic

from the agenda for Thursday meeting:

Meeting Jul 27, 2017 - Regular Meeting Category Action Items - 8 p.m. Subject JEB Stuart HS renaming Type Action Recommended Action I move that the name of J.E.B Stuart High School be changed no later than the start of the 2019 School Year. I further move that the Board direct staff to start the renaming process this fall and that as part of that process--in the spirit of compromise and in recognition of the need to minimize costs as well as the desire for continuity by alumni--staff request that the Stuart community consider “Stuart High School” as the new name.
The Board further directs staff to create a mechanism for private funding, with the expectation that private funding will pay for a substantial portion of the costs.

The School Board finds there is a compelling need to change the name of J.E.B. Stuart High School to one that better reflects Fairfax County values and diversity.
 
That compelling need is based on: 1) the fact that some of the Confederacy’s foundational principles run counter to the values of diversity, inclusion and equity that are fundamental to the mission of Fairfax County Public Schools, 2) the request by a significant number of  current students, alumni and other members of the Stuart community to provide a name with less controversial and more unifying and  inclusive associations, 3) the namesake does not have another principal legacy or contribution to the community that warrants the honor of an FCPS school name, and 4) the name was not drawn from a local magisterial, neighborhood or street name.
 
The Board finds that the school is unique in FCPS in having this combination of reasons to change the name.
 
I move that the name of J.E.B Stuart High School be changed no later than the start of the 2019 School Year. I further move that the Board direct staff to start the renaming process this fall and that as part of that process--in the spirit of compromise and in recognition of the need to minimize costs as well as the desire for continuity by alumni--staff request that the Stuart community consider “Stuart High School” as the new name.
 
The Board further directs staff to create a mechanism for private funding, with the expectation that private funding will pay for a substantial portion of the costs.
 

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If the SB was given taxing authority there would
> NO checks and balances and would essentially
> accountable to nobody since you are correct that
> they do not listen to the community. Currently,
> the SB can only spend the funds that are provided
> to them by the BOS. It is not much control but it
> is a much better situation than the SB having
> taxing authority.

An alternative argument is if the SB was given taxing authority there is the potential that taxing issues might become THE major issue in school board elections. Since the current system gives the Board of Supervisors ultimate say on how much finds the school board receives and what the tax rates will be, school board elections tend to turn on issues which primarily deal with how the schools operate. Give the school board taxing authority and open the door to candidates whose primary agenda would be lowering tax rates regardless of the affect on the quality of education.

Bill.N. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Inquisitive One Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If the SB was given taxing authority there
> would
> > NO checks and balances and would essentially
> > accountable to nobody since you are correct
> that
> > they do not listen to the community.
> Currently,
> > the SB can only spend the funds that are
> provided
> > to them by the BOS. It is not much control but
> it
> > is a much better situation than the SB having
> > taxing authority.
>
> An alternative argument is if the SB was given
> taxing authority there is the potential that
> taxing issues might become THE major issue in
> school board elections. Since the current system
> gives the Board of Supervisors ultimate say on how
> much finds the school board receives and what the
> tax rates will be, school board elections tend to
> turn on issues which primarily deal with how the
> schools operate. Give the school board taxing
> authority and open the door to candidates whose
> primary agenda would be lowering tax rates
> regardless of the affect on the quality of
> education.


Say what??????

they must have the votes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> from the agenda for Thursday meeting:
>
> Meeting Jul 27, 2017 - Regular Meeting Category
> Action Items - 8 p.m. Subject JEB Stuart HS
> renaming Type Action Recommended Action I move
> that the name of J.E.B Stuart High School be
> changed no later than the start of the 2019 School
> Year. I further move that the Board direct staff
> to start the renaming process this fall and that
> as part of that process--in the spirit of
> compromise and in recognition of the need to
> minimize costs as well as the desire for
> continuity by alumni--staff request that the
> Stuart community consider “Stuart High School”
> as the new name.
> The Board further directs staff to create a
> mechanism for private funding, with the
> expectation that private funding will pay for a
> substantial portion of the costs.
>
> The School Board finds there is a compelling need
> to change the name of J.E.B. Stuart High School to
> one that better reflects Fairfax County values and
> diversity.
>  
> That compelling need is based on: 1) the fact that
> some of the Confederacy’s foundational
> principles run counter to the values of diversity,
> inclusion and equity that are fundamental to the
> mission of Fairfax County Public Schools, 2) the
> request by a significant number of  current
> students, alumni and other members of the Stuart
> community to provide a name with less
> controversial and more unifying and  inclusive
> associations, 3) the namesake does not have
> another principal legacy or contribution to the
> community that warrants the honor of an FCPS
> school name, and 4) the name was not drawn from a
> local magisterial, neighborhood or street name.
>  
> The Board finds that the school is unique in FCPS
> in having this combination of reasons to change
> the name.
>  
> I move that the name of J.E.B Stuart High School
> be changed no later than the start of the 2019
> School Year. I further move that the Board direct
> staff to start the renaming process this fall and
> that as part of that process--in the spirit of
> compromise and in recognition of the need to
> minimize costs as well as the desire for
> continuity by alumni--staff request that the
> Stuart community consider “Stuart High School”
> as the new name.
>  
> The Board further directs staff to create a
> mechanism for private funding, with the
> expectation that private funding will pay for a
> substantial portion of the costs.
>  


This is more slight of hand work by the School Board. The only thing that will be accomplished is to get this off of the SB agenda but there will be about $15,000 raised for the name change while the athletic support will disappear. The $15,000 will come from a token donation by Bruce Cohen of about $10,000 and the community will come up with less than $5,000 because there is little or no support for the change. The rest will come from FCPS Budget AGAIN!

they must have the votes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> from the agenda for Thursday meeting:
>
> Meeting Jul 27, 2017 - Regular Meeting Category
> Action Items - 8 p.m. Subject JEB Stuart HS
> renaming Type Action Recommended Action I move
> that the name of J.E.B Stuart High School be
> changed no later than the start of the 2019 School
> Year. I further move that the Board direct staff
> to start the renaming process this fall and that
> as part of that process--in the spirit of
> compromise and in recognition of the need to
> minimize costs as well as the desire for
> continuity by alumni--staff request that the
> Stuart community consider “Stuart High School”
> as the new name.
> The Board further directs staff to create a
> mechanism for private funding, with the
> expectation that private funding will pay for a
> substantial portion of the costs.
>
> The School Board finds there is a compelling need
> to change the name of J.E.B. Stuart High School to
> one that better reflects Fairfax County values and
> diversity.
>  
> That compelling need is based on: 1) the fact that
> some of the Confederacy’s foundational
> principles run counter to the values of diversity,
> inclusion and equity that are fundamental to the
> mission of Fairfax County Public Schools, 2) the
> request by a significant number of  current
> students, alumni and other members of the Stuart
> community to provide a name with less
> controversial and more unifying and  inclusive
> associations, 3) the namesake does not have
> another principal legacy or contribution to the
> community that warrants the honor of an FCPS
> school name, and 4) the name was not drawn from a
> local magisterial, neighborhood or street name.
>  
> The Board finds that the school is unique in FCPS
> in having this combination of reasons to change
> the name.
>  
> I move that the name of J.E.B Stuart High School
> be changed no later than the start of the 2019
> School Year. I further move that the Board direct
> staff to start the renaming process this fall and
> that as part of that process--in the spirit of
> compromise and in recognition of the need to
> minimize costs as well as the desire for
> continuity by alumni--staff request that the
> Stuart community consider “Stuart High School”
> as the new name.
>  
> The Board further directs staff to create a
> mechanism for private funding, with the
> expectation that private funding will pay for a
> substantial portion of the costs.
>  

Damn! I know what the School Board is going to do before they do! The only problem is that the following post was supposed to be a proposal of absurd proportions. The only thing that is missing are the lawsuits but I have a hunch that the lawsuits for Lee HS and two others will follow soon.

Here is a bold prediction!

The School Board will change the SB regulation for renaming an existing school by redefining "compelling need" to precisely fit the JEB Stuart name change and change the regulation that empowers them to name the school without input from the community. They will approve the name change and name the school one of three names. Thurgood Marshall HS, Munson Hill HS or Stuart High School. Realistically it is not probable but it is a path that they would have taken in the past. Along with solving the "compelling need" problem, using FCPS funds for changing the name is one that will certainly piss almost everyone off--particularly after raising the teacher/student classroom ratios and not giving teachers the second installment of their promise to make their salaries more competitive with neighboring jurisdictions.

from Inquisitive One:
"This is more slight of hand work by the School Board. The only thing that will be accomplished is to get this off of the SB agenda but there will be about $15,000 raised for the name change while the athletic support will disappear. The $15,000 will come from a token donation by Bruce Cohen of about $10,000 and the community will come up with less than $5,000 because there is little or no support for the change. The rest will come from FCPS Budget AGAIN!"

Exactly. And, they think they are too cute for words. They think they have written this to avoid renaming other schools. They are wrong. It's a can of worms--unless they have a backroom agreement with the NAACP--which is possible considering the inappropriateness revealed in the FOIA.

The FOIA shows that Evans et.al. was looking to also rename Lee. Keys-Gamarra is on record that she wants to rename Lee and Woodson--in addition to being in favor of taxing authority for the Board.

Can you just imagine if these people were given taxing authority?

And, the part about expecting the funds to come privately? Inquisitive One is correct about that.
And, while it would be much cheaper if they just rename it Stuart, the group pushing for name change will not be satisfied with that. So, the cost will be substantial.
Did you notice in the FOIA how they quickly jumped on Thurgood Marshall High--without even considering that there is already a Marshall High?

response to Inquisitive One 5:48:

I think if they could, they would just call it Stuart--but they have to let the community decide the name. (The community has already said they want to keep Jeb Stuart.) Since, the SB has decided there is "compelling need" I don't understand why they cannot just drop the Jeb and be done.

My fear is that the supporters of keeping the name will be so disgusted that they will just drop out of the process and the changers will decide.

Sandy Evans should apologize to everyone for this fiasco.

This could have been done properly--had they not brought in the outsiders, the community might have reached a compromise of "Stuart". But, they had to scheme.

response to I O Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
"Sandy Evans should apologize to everyone for this fiasco."

Indeed…and apologize to the community for encouraging "angry protestors." She should apologize to the 20 or so School Board Members who served during that time (between Stuart and the renaming of Lee)

"My fear is that the supporters of keeping the name will be so disgusted that they will just drop out of the process and the changers will decide."

Doubt it, they are pretty committed.

"This could have been done properly--had they not brought in the outsiders, the community might have reached a compromise of "Stuart". But, they had to scheme."

Agree completely with this. Actually it's the NAACP who said that was totally unacceptable so this should be interesting.

Marshall High School(1962) needs to be changed as well. General George C. Marshall upheld the U.S. Army's policy of racial segregation of African Americans.

This is another example of a Fairfax County High School being named after a racist.

Another one Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Marshall High School(1962) needs to be changed as
> well. General George C. Marshall upheld the U.S.
> Army's policy of racial segregation of African
> Americans.
>
> This is another example of a Fairfax County High
> School being named after a racist.

Oh, by all means, let's rename it to Thurgood Marshall High.

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Say what??????

In a sound bite, giving school board taxing authority creates an opening for those who favor tax and spend AND for those who favor slash and burn. There are enemies on the right as well as on the left with this idea.

Another one Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Marshall High School(1962) needs to be changed as
> well. General George C. Marshall upheld the U.S.
> Army's policy of racial segregation of African
> Americans.
>
> This is another example of a Fairfax County High
> School being named after a racist.

Oh dear, where will it end? We need to make that 32 schools not 31. As stated in the link above by a dreamer ( https://goo.gl/cserZN page 25) Bruce Cohen is worth a "cool 20 million." So 32 million less 20 million...hmmm, maybe Julianne will kick in the rest.

They hope to have it covered by private funding.....Stuart couldn't afford to raise enough money for the turf on the field with very hard working booster clubs.

This board is pathetic.

What proportion of the community have been "in favor" of this name change?

The School Board is jeopardizing their integrity by favoring the small minority and acting in contravention of the Regulations of FCPS. It is too cute to draft language that suggests that "private funds" be sought to offset a "significant portion" of the costs - this is a cowardly feint. There is no prospect that the assertion that this is a "unique" case will prevent the advocacy of name changes for many other schools.

There should be a deferral of this issue. FCPS should work with the County to establish a joint committee of community members to establish "best practices" and define a "compelling need" and coordinate a joint policy that can inform future name change proposals for any buildings/parks etc in either the County or the School.

The School Board members must respect process, regulations and, ultimately, the will of the community. Anything less will lead to more community stress, divisiveness and contempt for the Board. There's enough of this already...

The document said that a "significant number" of students, alums, and "other members" of the Stuart community want a change. It does not mention that a more "significant number" wishes to keep the name.


This could be resolved by just giving guidance to the principal to drop the "Jeb" on uniforms, etc, in the future.

No need to change the name.

But, this would make sense.

FOIA CAN BITE Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Another one Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Marshall High School(1962) needs to be changed
> as
> > well. General George C. Marshall upheld the
> U.S.
> > Army's policy of racial segregation of African
> > Americans.
> >
> > This is another example of a Fairfax County
> High
> > School being named after a racist.
>
> Oh dear, where will it end? We need to make that
> 32 schools not 31. As stated in the link above by
> a dreamer ( https://goo.gl/cserZN page 25) Bruce
> Cohen is worth a "cool 20 million." So 32 million
> less 20 million...hmmm, maybe Julianne will kick
> in the rest.
>
> They hope to have it covered by private
> funding.....Stuart couldn't afford to raise enough
> money for the turf on the field with very hard
> working booster clubs.
>
> This board is pathetic.


No, sadly the proposed motion changed the tone of the game plan because there was substantial problems in phasing in the name change while the funds were being raised. That is why the phrases "with the expectation that ..." and minimization of costs is emphasized. Make no mistake, the voters of Fairfax County will be paying for this with the exception of some pocket change!

I hear you Inquisitive One...agree.

Bill.N. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Inquisitive One Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> >
> > Say what??????
>
> In a sound bite, giving school board taxing
> authority creates an opening for those who favor
> tax and spend AND for those who favor slash and
> burn. There are enemies on the right as well as
> on the left with this idea.

I hear you but realistically the probability of any slash and burn strategy for the right to be successful in a board with a maximum of 2 districts being conservative is very limited. On the other hand, another member favoring taxing authority will bring nothing but bad news.

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bill.N. Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Inquisitive One Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > >
> > >
> > > Say what??????
> >
> > In a sound bite, giving school board taxing
> > authority creates an opening for those who
> favor
> > tax and spend AND for those who favor slash and
> > burn. There are enemies on the right as well
> as
> > on the left with this idea.
>
> I hear you but realistically the probability of
> any slash and burn strategy for the right to be
> successful in a board with a maximum of 2
> districts being conservative is very limited. On
> the other hand, another member favoring taxing
> authority will bring nothing but bad news.

Taxing authority and name changing for Lee and Woodson.

What about Sidney Lanier Middle School. He was a racist Confederate officer that fought here in Virginia to keep African American in the bonds of slavery.

How many teachers could you hire for $31 million? Can of worms.

>
> Taxing authority and name changing for Lee and
> Woodson.

There are no plans to stop there.....

If only we could rename the school for a recent JEB Stuart graduate, preferably an immigrant with cultural community affiliations, who tragically died recently. Surely the Stuart community would rally behind naming the school for such a person.

Another one Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about Sidney Lanier Middle School. He was a
> racist Confederate officer that fought here in
> Virginia to keep African American in the bonds of
> slavery.

What about Walt Whitman....The man, the myth, the poet, and the accused pedophile.

Ellen Glasgow tells of a long, secret affair with a married man she had met in New York City, whom she called "Gerald B."

Is this the values that the school board supports????? I do wonder, oh, its ok, they weren't confederates.

Good thing the county shut down Green Acres Elementary - The whole barnyard animal thing could have been scandalous.

Too funny Mayor Scott....Good one!

There will be a lot of suspense about how the School Board will choose to implement the J.E.B. Stuart High School name change. Will they choose to issue boxes of White Out to the administrative offices to change the school stationary and buckets of paint to paint over the offensive language on the score boards, basketball court and turf field? Most importantly, will they issue chisels and hammers to the activists so that they can change the school name on the marble signage at the entrance to the school? Think again boys and girls, those changes along with the almost certain legal fees will be made with additional teacher reductions in the classrooms.

I'm all for renaming it to something reflecting the current Fairfax County values, but who's going to want to say that their alma mater is "Tax & Spend High School"?

Time to KICK ASS and take names! Especially take names and save them for those that should not get your vote in 2019.

watch all the fun here:

https://www.fcps.edu/school-board/school-board-meetings

starting at 7 pm tonight

WAPO article in Metro section this a.m. made it sound like SB wants to name it Stuart--but it is "up to the community"--which means we will witness a big fight to name it after a Civil Rights icon. That's already clear from some of the social media. "The community" has already made it clear that they wish to keep the current name.

Article made it sound like it isn't a done deal--that it depends on the meeting tonight--but, I think we all know that it is settled and was settled from two years ago when Evans started this.


Can of worms

the community Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WAPO article in Metro section this a.m. made it
> sound like SB wants to name it Stuart--but it is
> "up to the community"--which means we will witness
> a big fight to name it after a Civil Rights icon.
> That's already clear from some of the social
> media. "The community" has already made it clear
> that they wish to keep the current name.
>
> Article made it sound like it isn't a done
> deal--that it depends on the meeting tonight--but,
> I think we all know that it is settled and was
> settled from two years ago when Evans started
> this.
>
>
> Can of worms


No, it will be another Marshall High School unless a couple of Members realize that they may be serving their last term and stand up against Evans and the rest of the social justice crew. If you watched the meetings closely they tipped their hand by saying that ultimately they have to decide the name of the school. The key is that the NAACP will be the advocate for Thurgood Marshall and the community will select Stuart. The decision will be Marshall under claim of being the community peace keeper. There are times that I wonder how they can do this shit with a straight face. The scars on the community will last a decade from the wounds that Sandy Evans inflicted on this poor school!

Inquisitive One Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the community Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > WAPO article in Metro section this a.m. made it
> > sound like SB wants to name it Stuart--but it
> is
> > "up to the community"--which means we will
> witness
> > a big fight to name it after a Civil Rights
> icon.
> > That's already clear from some of the social
> > media. "The community" has already made it
> clear
> > that they wish to keep the current name.
> >
> > Article made it sound like it isn't a done
> > deal--that it depends on the meeting
> tonight--but,
> > I think we all know that it is settled and was
> > settled from two years ago when Evans started
> > this.
> >
> >
> > Can of worms
>
>
> No, it will be another Marshall High School unless
> a couple of Members realize that they may be
> serving their last term and stand up against Evans
> and the rest of the social justice crew. If you
> watched the meetings closely they tipped their
> hand by saying that ultimately they have to decide
> the name of the school. The key is that the NAACP
> will be the advocate for Thurgood Marshall and
> the community will select Stuart. The decision
> will be Marshall under claim of being the
> community peace keeper. There are times that I
> wonder how they can do this shit with a straight
> face. The scars on the community will last a
> decade from the wounds that Sandy Evans inflicted
> on this poor school!

Not to mention there is already a "Marshall High". Bet the Marshall kids are going to love that.

I bet nobody has counted the cost of renaming all references to "Marshall High" to include "George C".

This includes the FCPS website:

https://www.fcps.edu/school-center/marshall-high-school

Lots of references to it as only "Marshall High"

https://www.fcps.edu/search?keywords=marshall+high

As well as how it impacts real estate websites.

Imagine new homeowners realizing the house they bought doesn't go to Marshall High in Falls Church, but actually to the old JEB Stuart high.

Name it after Stewart the late night kid who ate crap off the bathroom floor.

Stuuuuuuuerrt

What names were nominated at the meeting today?

Name them HS 1, HS 2, HS 3..........

MS 1........

ES 1........

Name it a Latin gang. Its historical

How about Dave Grohl High School? Dave Grohl is from Fairfax County, is highly accomplished, and has not, as far as is known, owned slaves.

nb6pg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I bet nobody has counted the cost of renaming all
> references to "Marshall High" to include "George
> C".
>
> This includes the FCPS website:
>
> https://www.fcps.edu/school-center/marshall-high-s
> chool
>
> Lots of references to it as only "Marshall High"
>
> https://www.fcps.edu/search?keywords=marshall+high
>
>
> As well as how it impacts real estate websites.
>
>
> Imagine new homeowners realizing the house they
> bought doesn't go to Marshall High in Falls
> Church, but actually to the old JEB Stuart high.

It's gonna be tougher for the Stuart kids when they get asked if they go to the good Marshall or the shitty one, but that doesn't matter to stupid SJWs who think kids want their sports teams to be called the Justices.

nb6pg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I bet nobody has counted the cost of renaming all
> references to "Marshall High" to include "George
> C".
>
> This includes the FCPS website:
>
> https://www.fcps.edu/school-center/marshall-high-s
> chool
>
> Lots of references to it as only "Marshall High"
>
> https://www.fcps.edu/search?keywords=marshall+high
>
>
> As well as how it impacts real estate websites.
>
>
> Imagine new homeowners realizing the house they
> bought doesn't go to Marshall High in Falls
> Church, but actually to the old JEB Stuart high.

That's a stretch.. you have George Mason High and Falls Church High in between those two.

Name the school after Gen. William Tecumseh Sherman.

Million Dollar Rename Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> nb6pg Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I bet nobody has counted the cost of renaming
> all
> > references to "Marshall High" to include
> "George
> > C".
> >
> > This includes the FCPS website:
> >
> >
> https://www.fcps.edu/school-center/marshall-high-s
>
> > chool
> >
> > Lots of references to it as only "Marshall
> High"
> >
> >
> https://www.fcps.edu/search?keywords=marshall+high
>
> >
> >
> > As well as how it impacts real estate websites.
>
> >
> >
> > Imagine new homeowners realizing the house they
> > bought doesn't go to Marshall High in Falls
> > Church, but actually to the old JEB Stuart
> high.
>
> It's gonna be tougher for the Stuart kids when
> they get asked if they go to the good Marshall or
> the shitty one, but that doesn't matter to stupid
> SJWs who think kids want their sports teams to be
> called the Justices.

I can see the band now: like a SNL skit--all dressed in judge's robes. (That would be a pretty cheap uniform--all you would need would be those graduation robes. That could defray the cost of changing the name.

What about FAIRFAX County name itself? The name comes down from Thomas Fairfax whose treatment of groids would make even Jeb Stuart blush.

"Lord Thomas Fairfax owned 5,282,000 acres (2,138,000 ha; 8,253 sq mi; 21,380 km2) in Virginia. To manage these holdings, Fairfax depended on hundreds of slaves who worked among his 30 Virginia plantations. He was active in trading slaves and, despite his age, he proudly participated in a "little talked about" activity called "bedding down with a negro wench" for which Lord Fairfax would pay a fee to the person who supplied the "wench". (Colonial coal burning)

https://www.fcps.edu/renaming/communitynames

personal favorite: Evans and Hynes Institute of Public Integrity and Fiscal Responsibility