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Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: WTFFFFFF ()
Date: March 18, 2015 04:27PM

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/fairfax-schools-considers-new-grading-policy-that-would-eliminate-zeros/2015/03/18/9dd615c2-cd1e-11e4-a2a7-9517a3a70506_story.html?hpid=z4


The Fairfax County schools administration is considering sweeping changes to the grading system for middle and high school classes that could help struggling students keep their grades up.

In a message sent to thousands of teachers Tuesday, deputy superintendent Steven Lockard detailed a series of proposals under consideration to revamp the way teachers hand out grades to students and standardize exam scores across the county.

The changes could have widespread impact in the school system, affecting students’ chances of getting into college and how teachers handle homework and tests. Under the current rules, high schools in Fairfax have flexibility to decide grading scales and methods. For example an F may equal a zero at some schools, but a 50 percent at others.




“It is time to examine our current grading policies in an effort to ensure that we have consistent and equitable practices throughout our middle and high schools,” Lockard wrote.

The majority of the changes Lockard outlined in his message to teachers would aim to create consistency in how students are graded and also give those struggling in classes more opportunities to improve their scores. Under the new system, student grades could be calculated partly on their effort in the classroom as well as their test scores.

Harris LaTeef, the student representative to the school board who is a Langley High School senior, said that the changes could be beneficial to students.

“Overall, I think it makes sense for a system like [Fairfax Country Public Schools] to have a uniform grading policy,” said LaTeef. “Students should be rewarded equally for the work they do regardless of whether they attend Oakton or South County or Langley or any other school in the county.”

Braddock district school board member Megan McLaughlin, who has two sons enrolled at Woodson High School, said that the grading changes will potentially improve students’ chances when they apply to college.

McLaughlin said that since grading policies now vary school to school, Fairfax county students aren’t being fairly judged by admissions officers. (McLaughlin herself served as an admissions officer for six years at Georgetown University.)

For example, McLaughlin said, some schools allow students to retake tests to improve their grades while other schools do not.

“What happens when you apply for college and kids from other schools have higher grades?” McLaughlin said.

McLaughlin founded the parent advocacy group Fairgrade and ran for school board after she successfully lobbied Fairfax administrators to change the district’s strict grading for honors and college-level classes.

She said one proposal under consideration will allow students across the county to receive credit for submitting corrected answers to questions they got wrong on tests. McLaughlin said she also supports the proposal to replace zeros with a 50 percent for F grades.

“Digging out from a zero is a whole lot harder for kids than a 50,” McLaughlin said.

Steven Greenburg, president of the Fairfax County Federation of Teachers, said that the grading changes likely will spur a passionate response from educators. The key for the school system, Greenburg said, is getting teacher input.

The administration took the first step, Greenburg said, when Lockard sent a draft of his message about the changes to teacher group representatives. Greenburg said that he sent back remarks to Lockard about the tone and language in the note that he saw reflected in the message that landed in teachers’ inboxes Tuesday afternoon.

Greenburg said that the changes will make the grading system more transparent and help students reduce what some parents and teens call an unreasonable amount of nightly homework. In addition, it will create equity in grading for students, Greenburg said.

“In my opinion this is about getting consistency across the county,” Greenburg said. “The inconsistency in this county is so overwhelming between high schools and expectations and what things are worth that I think it’s causing a lot of problems among parents and students.”

Still, Greenburg acknowledged that grading is a hot topic discussed in schools everywhere and that the administration must address concerns from students, parents and teachers.


“This is going to be more difficult than they believe,” said Greenburg. “You're not going to get everybody to agree.”

Lockard wrote that there is no specific timeline for changing the current grading system. He also noted that the administration planned to seek comments from teachers and focus groups from around the county before committing to any plans.

Lockard wrote that the proposals include possibly “eliminating or limiting the use of ‘zeros’ in the 100 point marking system,” and instituting new rules for re-taking tests.

Other proposals include changing the weighting systems teachers use to formulate grades and also separating out grades for student effort and achievement. Lockard wrote that the earliest the changes could begin to take effect would be in the 2015-2016 school year.

“It is critically important that teacher perspective and input are heard and valued as we plan this change,” Lockard wrote.


WE NEEED TO TELL THEM WE MEAN NO

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: I LOVE U HARRIS ()
Date: March 18, 2015 04:28PM

IWISH This guy could vote on the school board and not the clowns from Texas
Thank you for reaching out. I agree that removing zeros is a bad idea for the same reasons you cited.

The headline of The Washington Post story was misleading. FCPS is still considering many different options for the standardized grading policy, some of which still include zero grades, and FCPS is working with both principals and teachers from across the county to develop it.

Regards,
Harris

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: xtchr ()
Date: March 18, 2015 10:18PM

Certainly an easier way to close the "achievement gap" that actually requiring that the students show up, do their work, study, and actually learn something. Everyone gets higher grades. It's all related, and designed to make some higher-up look good. It really has nothing to do with education. If the numbers in the newspaper are good, then everything is good.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: 2-1=0 ()
Date: March 19, 2015 01:54AM

Doesn't 0 mean you got zero answers correct and 50% means you got half correct? When does 0.0 = 0.5? Am I ssying that right? It's late.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: reader.. ()
Date: March 19, 2015 10:21AM

This will have the effect of raising grades in Title 1 schools. FCPS is failing miserably in title 1 schools - the whole "fairness" thing is just a diversion. Parents of good students will be happy that the occasional missed assignment will not be a zero, and FCPS will have less explaining to do on the failure rate at Title 1 schools. Everybody wins! (except the students)

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: xtchr ()
Date: March 19, 2015 12:10PM

reader.. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This will have the effect of raising grades in
> Title 1 schools. FCPS is failing miserably in
> title 1 schools - the whole "fairness" thing is
> just a diversion. Parents of good students will
> be happy that the occasional missed assignment
> will not be a zero, and FCPS will have less
> explaining to do on the failure rate at Title 1
> schools. Everybody wins! (except the students)


So true. If the numbers are good, everything is good.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: College bound? ()
Date: March 19, 2015 12:13PM

reader.. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This will have the effect of raising grades in
> Title 1 schools. FCPS is failing miserably in
> title 1 schools - the whole "fairness" thing is
> just a diversion. Parents of good students will
> be happy that the occasional missed assignment
> will not be a zero, and FCPS will have less
> explaining to do on the failure rate at Title 1
> schools. Everybody wins! (except the students)


And calls into question the grades of even the best performers when college admissions are looking at transcripts. They know the low grades are inflated and infer that there's pressure on the higher grades too.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: HELLLLLO ()
Date: March 19, 2015 04:24PM

reader.. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This will have the effect of raising grades in
> Title 1 schools. FCPS is failing miserably in
> title 1 schools - the whole "fairness" thing is
> just a diversion. Parents of good students will
> be happy that the occasional missed assignment
> will not be a zero, and FCPS will have less
> explaining to do on the failure rate at Title 1
> schools. Everybody wins! (except the students)
HELLLO PEOPLE MOUNT VERNON HIGH SCHOOL HAS THIS IN PLACE, LOWEST GRADE A STUDENT CAN EARN IS 53%

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: x6vwd ()
Date: March 19, 2015 05:26PM

I'm a teacher. I really don't care what they decide because ultimately, we ALL know what your kid can and cannot do. If it makes you feel better to see an A or a B on your kid's report card, then you can have it. But when you fail your SOLs or ecarts or bomb your SATs, don't come looking at me wondering why. "I don't understand...he has an A in your class, why didn't he do better on the SOL test?" I boost any failing grade my students get to a 50% but I always make a note in my gradebook what the original grade was.

And college admissions officers KNOW that FCPS grades are inflated and hold it against the students when they apply. They're not stupid.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: fourlegs ()
Date: March 19, 2015 06:55PM

Uniform grading should implemented to ensure fair judgement between students.

___________________________________________________________
“Imitation is suicide.”
-Ralph Waldo Emerson

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Rkcn ()
Date: March 19, 2015 08:07PM

Why do you do that? If a student gets a low grade he should get the low grade


x6vwd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm a teacher. I really don't care what they
> decide because ultimately, we ALL know what your
> kid can and cannot do. If it makes you feel
> better to see an A or a B on your kid's report
> card, then you can have it. But when you fail
> your SOLs or ecarts or bomb your SATs, don't come
> looking at me wondering why. "I don't
> understand...he has an A in your class, why didn't
> he do better on the SOL test?" I boost any
> failing grade my students get to a 50% but I
> always make a note in my gradebook what the
> original grade was.
>
> And college admissions officers KNOW that FCPS
> grades are inflated and hold it against the
> students when they apply. They're not stupid.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: teachhhh ()
Date: March 20, 2015 12:43AM

We do that because they MAKE us do that. If you have too many kids failing (more than 20% of your class) then you are taken in for questioning. Also, many teachers do not understand the no zero policy and assign 50% on everything a students gets. It's no zeros on major assessments. I stick to that policy and have less inflated grades, but more accurate A's, B's, and C's, but in case you weren't aware students, we ARE not allowed to fail you, so if you are failing, then you're one of maybe 1 or 2 kids in the class who has to retake it. The admins make us pass everyone AND with C's or better, else we're not doing our 'job.'

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Facepalm ()
Date: March 20, 2015 04:43AM

teachhhh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We do that because they MAKE us do that. If you
> have too many kids failing (more than 20% of your
> class) then you are taken in for questioning.
> Also, many teachers do not understand the no zero
> policy and assign 50% on everything a students
> gets. It's no zeros on major assessments. I stick
> to that policy and have less inflated grades, but
> more accurate A's, B's, and C's, but in case you
> weren't aware students, we ARE not allowed to fail
> you, so if you are failing, then you're one of
> maybe 1 or 2 kids in the class who has to retake
> it. The admins make us pass everyone AND with C's
> or better, else we're not doing our 'job.'


I commend you for what you do. Which is to say - thanks for sticking around to try and give SOME education to our kids. If it was me, I would have quit years ago from the bullshit teachers need to put up with now. I couldn't be happier that my youngest kid graduates next year and we can be done with the public school bullshit of zero tolerance, SOLs, helicopter parents, wasting resources on illegals, wasting resources on those that won't perform, and idiot administrations. Public school has become a watered down daycare.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: mdddd ()
Date: March 20, 2015 03:48PM

do you teach Middle School? I knew My Middle School had that policy but not high school.


teachhhh Wrote:


-------------------------------------------------------
> We do that because they MAKE us do that. If you
> have too many kids failing (more than 20% of your
> class) then you are taken in for questioning.
> Also, many teachers do not understand the no zero
> policy and assign 50% on everything a students
> gets. It's no zeros on major assessments. I stick
> to that policy and have less inflated grades, but
> more accurate A's, B's, and C's, but in case you
> weren't aware students, we ARE not allowed to fail
> you, so if you are failing, then you're one of
> maybe 1 or 2 kids in the class who has to retake
> it. The admins make us pass everyone AND with C's
> or better, else we're not doing our 'job.'

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Eby ()
Date: April 09, 2015 11:06AM

teachhhh

-If 20 % of your class is failing, it is a reflection that something is wrong. It does not mean it is you, it could have been their previous teacher. THANKFULLY someone cares enough to ask questions. More people need to examine the policies and ask questions. The problem could have been elementary school. Someone needs to find out WHAT the problem is and they should keep asking until the have insight.

Just maybe, you need to adjust your teaching style to teach to all learners.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: this is your 4th and final chanc ()
Date: April 09, 2015 11:16AM

Facepalm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> teachhhh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > We do that because they MAKE us do that. If you
> > have too many kids failing (more than 20% of
> your
> > class) then you are taken in for questioning.
> > Also, many teachers do not understand the no
> zero
> > policy and assign 50% on everything a students
> > gets. It's no zeros on major assessments. I
> stick
> > to that policy and have less inflated grades,
> but
> > more accurate A's, B's, and C's, but in case
> you
> > weren't aware students, we ARE not allowed to
> fail
> > you, so if you are failing, then you're one of
> > maybe 1 or 2 kids in the class who has to
> retake
> > it. The admins make us pass everyone AND with
> C's
> > or better, else we're not doing our 'job.'
>
>
> I commend you for what you do. Which is to say -
> thanks for sticking around to try and give SOME
> education to our kids. If it was me, I would have
> quit years ago from the bullshit teachers need to
> put up with now. I couldn't be happier that my
> youngest kid graduates next year and we can be
> done with the public school bullshit of zero
> tolerance, SOLs, helicopter parents, wasting
> resources on illegals, wasting resources on those
> that won't perform, and idiot administrations.
> Public school has become a watered down daycare.

The last comment is so true. So much time is put into trying to get those who really don't care, a diploma in special programs.It is really disgusting and a disservice to kids who make some effort. The system would be more efficient if they just cut to the chase and provided transportation over to McDonalds or Burger King.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: rt ()
Date: April 09, 2015 11:38AM

There are multiple view points on this issue. One which seems to be resounding through this tread is that all change is bad. However, sometimes change is good.

Parts of the county has schools whose population is hard working students. Harris LaTeef attends Langley, which is our school. It is commonly thought that the teachers have lost perspective of what is normal because so many kids have tutors helping them to do well. It inflates the knowledge base and students are judged against a very bright population students. Students who are bright, but not the brightest, get average and poor grades. My 9th grader does work harder than what I did while attending a top major university. Langley families did some research and found out that LHS AP students were getting Cs and passing the AP exam. Meanwhile 30 miles to the west in Loudoun County, AP students were getting As and Bs and failing the tests. The kids getting the As and Bs were preferred by college over the C students who actually passed the tests. You bet parents are pushing for fair grading! The kids at Langley are, for the most part, the poor kids whose parents could not spring for private school. The average private school kids of this area have much higher GPAs that the public school kids.

At Langley, they get zeros, even when work is completed and turned in. In middle school my son did not round properly on a science paper, but did all the math correctly; his grade was a ZERO and there was no fixing the rounding for extra credit. The IEP students, many of them struggle consistently. These kids could be brighter and more capable than students in other schools who are passing their classes. Very discouraging!

There absolutely needs to some level of uniformity which is encouraging to both students and teachers. A FCPS grade should have a somewhat uniform representation. Another view comes from the schools where the students are given a lot of room for error because they would fail otherwise. These students AND TEACHERS need to step it up the learning and STEP UP TEACHING UNTIL IT IS MASTERED. Students who do poorly should be given the opportunity to come back and learn the material. The grade should reflect what they learned by the end of the class, not after immediate introduction of a new chapter.

Grades should encourage learning for life long success. Hopefully you can embrace change and guide it in this direction.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Gruntled ()
Date: April 09, 2015 12:33PM

2-1=0 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Doesn't 0 mean you got zero answers correct and
> 50% means you got half correct? When does 0.0 =
> 0.5? Am I ssying that right? It's late.

I'm more concerned that it means that the student doesn't have to do anything and they still get a 50% grade. Blow off the test, still get half credit, and easier to catch up later.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Gruntled ()
Date: April 09, 2015 12:37PM

Eby Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> teachhhh
>
> -If 20 % of your class is failing, it is a
> reflection that something is wrong. It does not
> mean it is you, it could have been their previous
> teacher. THANKFULLY someone cares enough to ask
> questions. More people need to examine the
> policies and ask questions. The problem could
> have been elementary school. Someone needs to
> find out WHAT the problem is and they should keep
> asking until the have insight.
>
> Just maybe, you need to adjust your teaching style
> to teach to all learners.

It doesn't have to be the previous teacher. If they don't have parents that will "motivate" them to get the work done, the slackers just won't do it.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 09, 2015 01:07PM

The program tested in Rocky Run in 7th Grade Science. Difficult to not get good grade.

How it works =

A. Do not know answers on test = Look on boards in class.
B. Absent = Take the test home. Open book.
C. Fail or Want better grade = Retest.
D. Retest = Same exact test. Look up answers at home.
E. All of the Above not working = Xtra credit with Magic School Bus.
F. Xtra credit = 1 or 2 letter grades higher. D is a B. C is A.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: notagenedder ()
Date: April 09, 2015 01:25PM

RAMsConquer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The program tested in Rocky Run in 7th Grade
> Science. Difficult to not get good grade.
>
> How it works =
>
> A. Do not know answers on test = Look on boards
> in class.
> B. Absent = Take the test home. Open book.
> C. Fail or Want better grade = Retest.
> D. Retest = Same exact test. Look up answers at
> home.
> E. All of the Above not working = Xtra credit
> with Magic School Bus.
> F. Xtra credit = 1 or 2 letter grades higher. D
> is a B. C is A.

You must be in the Gen.Ed. because that is not how the AAP works there.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 09, 2015 01:37PM

Class = 7th Grade Science Honors.
New Program = Mr. Sejour is testing.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 09, 2015 03:00PM

To Teacher x6vwd, the information about ecart is not correct with New Program.

How it works =

A. Student take ecard on paper form.
B. Week later teacher reviews or gives back.
C. Corrected paper form.
D. Scanned.

Ask any student of New Program to raise grade.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 09, 2015 03:06PM

Homework =

A. Teacher Loses Homework = F Interim.
B. Parent Complain = Perfect Score.
C. Student Homework Not Lost = Perfect Score.
D. Perfect Score = Done, Not Done Right.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Legacy of Lockard ()
Date: April 09, 2015 03:23PM

Under this ridiculous scheme, kids will get good grades. They will, however, crash and burn when it comes to important tests.

They won't get in to college. You will find them at Cutco, Vector, and Zerin talking about what good students they were, and how unfair the world is.

Lockard will relax in his Gatehouse office, eyeing the superintendent's job when Garza is inevitably forced out.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 10, 2015 01:21PM

Franklin Teacher = Teacher of Year, not Rocky Run

7th Grade Honors Science =

Do not answer email to students or parents.
Do not post grades for ever, post zero a F.
Too much use less homework it do not make smarter students

Quarter over next week = When will grades fixed and post?

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Fed up with Teaching ()
Date: April 10, 2015 04:09PM

My experience is that when a student is assigned a 0 for no work, the work is made up, but if they are given 50% of the points they will not make it up. The only way they will learn the material is to DO the work. What FCPS is doing is not to benefit the kids but to make themselves look good. It will boost graduation rates and make it look like the minority groups do well here. It is all smoke and mirrors and not at all the way the world works.
(Douglas Reese - the man who wrote the book on this was convicted and served time for securities fraud! Seems like he knows how to cook the books!)
As a teacher I feel that my job is to prepare my students for the world beyond the school walls. If they do no work at their job, they will be fired - but right now they are learning that doing no work is okay.
I still give 0s!!

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 10, 2015 04:34PM

Why everyone always get one to two of same one wrong? Teacher teach wrong to blame.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: odd ()
Date: April 10, 2015 05:56PM

"As a teacher I feel that my job is to prepare my students for the world beyond the school walls. If they do no work at their job, they will be fired - but right now they are learning that doing no work is okay.
I still give 0s!!"

50% is an "F". It's an "F" It's pretty far down in the F range.

I don't understand random teachers who are gung-ho on giving - - something lower than an F. What is it you want - - you want to be able to give "A SUPER F" ?

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Admissions Officer ()
Date: April 10, 2015 06:23PM

College admissions committees look at class rank and standardized test scores, not GPA. Those two measures eliminate the differences within and across school districts.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP ()
Date: April 14, 2015 12:39PM

Admissions Officer? Really? Then you must know that FCPS does not give out class rank.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: xyzpdq ()
Date: April 14, 2015 12:50PM

Fed up with Teaching -
It would be nice if ALL student in the county were given opportunities to make up zeros regardless of which school they attend or which teacher they have. Then, the zero would be worthwhile. In an ideal world, students would be able to keep trying to learn ALL material and would be rewarded for doing so. Imagine if all the students could retake a test until they master the material. That is what a grade is supposed to represent, right; mastery? Does it matter if they have to go back and restudy? The ones who study well the first time get the benefit of not having to restudy. But, right now in some schools, with certain teachers ( yes multiple), and entire subject area departments, some students get zeros and they stick. The schools justify this by calling it "college prep." What it really does is cut off mastery of the material.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: dwbJ9 ()
Date: April 14, 2015 01:07PM

RAMsConquer _ I understand your point, however, our school district is a little different.

You wrote:
Homework =

A. Teacher Loses Homework = F Interim.
B. Parent Complain = Perfect Score.
C. Student Homework Not Lost = Perfect Score.
D. Perfect Score = Done, Not Done Right.

At Cooper, parents have absolutely NO SAY. Unless you have an IEP or similar, there is no make up work, tests, homework. Math quizzes have a limited time and then they are done, whether or not the student has time to be done. It is the school of hard knocks. School does not care what parents say. Parents ask for guidance/ advice; does not matter. The teachers give all number grades below 53, very willingly. Taking a course which counts for HS credit; this does not matter, either. Kid could not understand the material, class moves on. Teachers are perfect and the do not lose homework.

The school actually believes parents who are eager to help their students learn are the problem. They are quick to tell the parents to go get a tutor because teacher should not be bothered with teaching kids who do not easily get the material.

THIS IS ALL DONE IN BECAUSE IT IS FAIR.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: April 14, 2015 01:33PM

^^^ dwbJ9

Rocky Run = Good School

Rocky Run = Good Teachers

Rocky Run = One Bad Apple

One Bad Apple = Provisional Teacher

Provisional Teacher = High School Coach

High School Coach = Made leave room and other brought in to teach for test

Question =

How can teacher get IEP?

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: dwbJ9 ()
Date: April 14, 2015 03:14PM

RAMsConquer --

? Not sure of your message. One teacher does not make a school.

Kids learn differently. Not every teacher is right for every kid.



This forum is about uniform FCPS policies. Some want rigid grading.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Tbt ()
Date: April 14, 2015 04:13PM

Mastery: does it mean actually knowing and understanding the material? Or does it mean continuing to take enough assessments so that you know every question and thus the answers. The bottom line is that certain people really want the A.If they wanted mastery they would not be advocating for innumerable re-dos until the A is given. I say given, and not earned. Most of the teachers I work with go above and beyond to help students learn. If they are mandated to follow a grade design to make students and parents happy, they would not be doing their jobs.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: xyzpdq ()
Date: April 14, 2015 04:53PM

Tbt -

Why can't the tests be different? Although the teachers may complain that this is more work.

So, who knows the material better, the student who takes two different tests and gets gets 95% the second time or the student who takes a test and gets it 95% correct the first time? Isn't this similar passing the CPA or bar exam?
,
Has anyone in this forum witnessed the process in private schools? How about observing home schooling where the student does not move on until the material is well know?

So, wanting all As and working at it until it is reached is bad. Chances are that some students will get tired of taking the tests over and over and they will be happy with a B, just because there are other things in life to do.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Tbt ()
Date: April 14, 2015 07:41PM

AP teachers have a certain number of released tests they can give students to prepare them for the national exams, thus giving different tests is not merely more work, it is impossible to create meaningful assessments that truly test mastery. With regard to retakes, we have had students refuse to take tests saying "I am just going to wait for the retake." Although professionals sit multiple times for the bar or the CPA test, high school students are taking seven courses. Comparing their assessments to those instruments is not really valid. There is a real difference in a student who gets the 95 the first go round with one who gets it the second time if it is the same test. The grade is the only thing that is the same and far too many students and parents care only about the grade. I don't know of any quality private school in this area that routinely allows retests and bans all low grades.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: xyzpdq ()
Date: April 15, 2015 01:59PM

TbT - You make good points. I was referring to standard high school courses. AP should be treated as an AP course.

As far was having students wait to take a retake, then you must actually allow them on occasion. This is not the same everywhere.

There are always 'gamers' of the system. Having tutors also puts students at an advantage over students who cannot afford it, should that be disallowed? Sometimes the game works against the gamers. But, I think FCPS is striving to help students who are not necessarily in AP. It would require the student to study. Curse those students for failing in the first place, but maybe their families can't afford a tutor and / or loads summer learning camps. Or, maybe they have a learning disability which just makes learning in the current large class size a little tougher for certain subjects, but they are still capable of fully functioning, if given the chance.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Fed up with teaching ()
Date: April 16, 2015 02:47PM

Don't let this game fool you - it is all about graduation rates of demographic groups. We (FCPS) are not trying to educate, we are trying to look good. As much as students hate the SATs, they will become the only assessment of a student's knowledge and will be the only thing college admission officers will be able to use to select their students. The grades my students will be "given" will not be a based on their knowledge/work production/abilities. If 1/2 the points will be earned by doing nothing then the grades of those who do work will be minimized. How well do you think these "do-nothing" students will do on the SATs?

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Change is part of life ()
Date: April 20, 2015 05:11PM

Imagine if private schools acted the same as FCPS; just failed a handful of students and then moved on to teach the next subject material, parents would all pull their kids quickly. Yes, helping kids to graduate would be really bad for society. They would be able to get jobs and work at a living wage. We should not allow it! They might take the jobs of people who can out think them --- probably not.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP ()
Date: April 22, 2015 12:08PM

The FCPS idea is a good one; grades should reflect how much the students knows. Students should get a chance to learn the material, even if it means learning after the first test. So, if FCPS can teach more effectively, then grades should rise. Unfortunately, some teachers will probably just grade easier. But, if teachers follow the intention of the idea, it could be a good one. It is just more work for the teachers and class sizes are large.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: May 19, 2015 06:33PM

One bad apple = 60 students lined up
60 students lined up = missing homework
Missing homework = teacher gave back because not what he wanted
Not what he wanted = students dont know what he wanted
Students hand in anything second time = A
A = students are smart
Students are smart = false belief
false belief = students no know science 7 honors
no know science 7 honors = handed in something he dont even look at it

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: title 1 ()
Date: May 19, 2015 08:03PM

reader.. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This will have the effect of raising grades in
> Title 1 schools. FCPS is failing miserably in
> title 1 schools - the whole "fairness" thing is
> just a diversion. Parents of good students will
> be happy that the occasional missed assignment
> will not be a zero, and FCPS will have less
> explaining to do on the failure rate at Title 1
> schools. Everybody wins! (except the students)


pls list the title 1 schools

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: bTNdT ()
Date: May 20, 2015 09:44AM

title 1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> reader.. Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > This will have the effect of raising grades in
> > Title 1 schools. FCPS is failing miserably in
> > title 1 schools - the whole "fairness" thing is
> > just a diversion. Parents of good students
> will
> > be happy that the occasional missed assignment
> > will not be a zero, and FCPS will have less
> > explaining to do on the failure rate at Title 1
> > schools. Everybody wins! (except the students)
>
>
> pls list the title 1 schools

http://www.fcps.edu/is/titlei/schools.shtml

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: May 21, 2015 05:23PM

Our school not = Title 1
One bad apple = bad for students
Bad for students = not fixed and learn nothing
Students have missing homework = on progress report again
Teacher keeps losing it = Nothing done
Nothing done = Who should hand in to?
Hand in to = Principal?
Principal = Teach 7th Grade Honors okay?

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: May 23, 2015 06:58AM

Weekend = Perfect
Perfect = Busch Gardens
Busch Gardens = Band
Band = No Science 7 Honors
No Science 7 Honors = No Missing Homework
Missing Homework = On Progress Report
Progress Report = Wrong Again
Wrong Again = Upset Parents
Upset Parents = Good For One Day
One Day = Busch Gardens Band Trip

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: June 01, 2015 08:09AM

Science 7 Honors teacher = Out on Friday
Out on Friday = EXPLORE presentation due.
Teacher = High School Sport Event
High School Sport Events = No time to teach or grade papers
No graded papers = no idea how bad on assignments
No idea = Tests are still a mess and all Cs and Ds.
A mess = All have missing assignments or lost or not graded
Good sports coach = no one fixes Science 7 Honors!

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: Grade Inflator ()
Date: June 04, 2015 11:14PM

odd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "As a teacher I feel that my job is to prepare my
> students for the world beyond the school walls. If
> they do no work at their job, they will be fired -
> but right now they are learning that doing no work
> is okay.
> I still give 0s!!"
>
> 50% is an "F". It's an "F" It's pretty far down in
> the F range.
>
> I don't understand random teachers who are gung-ho
> on giving - - something lower than an F. What is
> it you want - - you want to be able to give "A
> SUPER F" ?

Because repeat offenders -- students who only do half of the overall assignments -- can earn an overall C grade. It's just basic math. About 10% of my students barely do anything, but they still pass the class because the 50 percent boosts the overall average. Kids totally play this system. The middle schools have had these policies in effect for over five years now, and I swear, the grade inflation is insane. Kids who can barely read or string five words together to make a sentence end up with C averages.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: teachhhh ()
Date: June 05, 2015 12:40AM

Eby Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> teachhhh
>
> -If 20 % of your class is failing, it is a
> reflection that something is wrong. It does not
> mean it is you, it could have been their previous
> teacher. THANKFULLY someone cares enough to ask
> questions. More people need to examine the
> policies and ask questions. The problem could
> have been elementary school. Someone needs to
> find out WHAT the problem is and they should keep
> asking until the have insight.
>
> Just maybe, you need to adjust your teaching style
> to teach to all learners.


Well, let's take a look. My AP scores are outstanding, so no, I don't need to adjust myteaching style so that everyone feels better and has an A or B. Students who reach my level are not babies they rise to the occaision by the time they take the exam, so obviosly what I am doing is working.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: teachhhh ()
Date: June 05, 2015 12:43AM

teachhhh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Eby Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > teachhhh
> >
> > -If 20 % of your class is failing, it is a
> > reflection that something is wrong. It does
> not
> > mean it is you, it could have been their
> previous
> > teacher. THANKFULLY someone cares enough to
> ask
> > questions. More people need to examine the
> > policies and ask questions. The problem could
> > have been elementary school. Someone needs to
> > find out WHAT the problem is and they should
> keep
> > asking until the have insight.
> >
> > Just maybe, you need to adjust your teaching
> style
> > to teach to all learners.
>
>
> Well, let's take a look. My AP scores are
> outstanding, so no, I don't need to adjust
> myteaching style so that everyone feels better and
> has an A or B. Students who reach my level are not
> babies they rise to the occaision by the time they
> take the exam, so obviosly what I am doing is
> working.

Apologies for not editing before posting. It's late.

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Re: Fairfax schools consider new grading policy
Posted by: RAMsConquer ()
Date: June 05, 2015 07:26AM

Science 7 Honors = Only Class to Have to Take Final
Only Class to Have to Take Final = Teacher Not Like to Present as Child
Teacher Not Like to Present as Child = Cannot Teach as Adult
Cannot Teach as Adult = Students Not Learn
Students Not Learn = Have to Retake Science in Summer
Science in Summer = Not go Away to Beach
Not go Away = Year Round School

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