Fairfax County has posted its 2009 real estate assessments as of this afternoon. You can look up your home here:

http://icare.fairfaxcounty.gov/Search/GenericSearch.aspx?mode=ADDRESS

Dropped 21.5%, not bad.

dropped alot

I'm only down 9.2%. Bet I pay more in taxes than last year.

I dropped 24.8%. Damn.

Down by 10%.

Down 8.8%

-8.6%

Mine is only down 2.7%. Good and bad.

Mine is good because they went _up_ on me from 2007 to 2008. Now I guess I get to catch up on taxes I shouldn't have paid.

I have one property that went down 16% and another 43%. Both good drops since they were never worth the old assessment.

Anyone see what Gatehouse II is worth now?

$25,743,920

Considerably less than that 45K they had talked about paying.

Oaktonmom - I'm guessing you live in a fairly expensive house in Oakton - is that the case? I think the upper-bracket assessments didn't decline so much (more like 3-5%) because the market for sales of more expensive properties has largely frozen and there are fewer comparables out there.

It doesn't necessarily mean you'd be able to sell at the assessed value if you tried to sell now, but you'll still have to pay more taxes...How is this good?

Mine went down 20%.

It needed to go down 35% to reach reality.

Fuckers

oaktonmom's home?

No, actually a lower priced home for the area. The homes in my neighborhood have continued to sell fairly well. They are approx 30 years old on decent lots. We have lived here for over 15 years so even though the value is down, we still have equity. FYI - Most of the McMansions were built after we moved here.

We would be able to sell. Just saying that even though we have taken a bit of a hit, we haven't been decimated like my friends in Ashburn.



Soaked, Too Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Oaktonmom - I'm guessing you live in a fairly
> expensive house in Oakton - is that the case? I
> think the upper-bracket assessments didn't decline
> so much (more like 3-5%) because the market for
> sales of more expensive properties has largely
> frozen and there are fewer comparables out there.
>
>
> It doesn't necessarily mean you'd be able to sell
> at the assessed value if you tried to sell now,
> but you'll still have to pay more taxes...How is
> this good?

Back to 2003-2004 level. Seems decent.

20peeerrrcent down

Houses on my street all went down $11,000, (except for the one that recently sold) first drop in 3 years, but such a small percentage. Can't complain, depending on how much they raise the tax rates.

It seems houses on each street went down the same amount. Everything on my street dropped $11,000. Another street in Vienna dropped over $200,000! A couple of streets in Reston dropped $70-80,000. Rather large amounts for small homes. I suppose that makes sense that the whole street would drop the same amount since the assessment is based on comparable neighborhood sales.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Houses on my street all went down $11,000, (except
> for the one that recently sold) first drop in 3
> years, but such a small percentage. Can't
> complain, depending on how much they raise the tax
> rates.
>
> It seems houses on each street went down the same
> amount. Everything on my street dropped $11,000.
> Another street in Vienna dropped over $200,000! A
> couple of streets in Reston dropped $70-80,000.
> Rather large amounts for small homes. I suppose
> that makes sense that the whole street would drop
> the same amount since the assessment is based on
> comparable neighborhood sales.


Budget show by Griffin yesterday:
residential rate total=1.055 [1.04+.015 separate for stormwater]
advertised total=1.085 [1.07+.015 separate for stormwater]

The .92 included .01 for stormwater.

Many will be paying a lot more to FX.

The sully guy was complaining about athletic fees going up 200%. I DON"T CARE. Make that even higher IMHO and charge full load for AP /IB. Not just the IB tests. Stupid school board and South County middle school plus gatehouse.

Stick 'em in trailers on the extra 3 acre lot. Go to the crapper in gatehouse 1.

Suburbanite Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have one property that went down 16% and another
> 43%. Both good drops since they were never worth
> the old assessment.
>
> Anyone see what Gatehouse II is worth now?
>
> $25,743,920
>
> Considerably less than that 45K they had talked
> about paying.

This explains the timing of the announcement.

Neen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Houses on my street all went down $11,000, (except
> for the one that recently sold) first drop in 3
> years, but such a small percentage. Can't
> complain, depending on how much they raise the tax
> rates.
>
> It seems houses on each street went down the same
> amount. Everything on my street dropped $11,000.
> Another street in Vienna dropped over $200,000! A
> couple of streets in Reston dropped $70-80,000.
> Rather large amounts for small homes. I suppose
> that makes sense that the whole street would drop
> the same amount since the assessment is based on
> comparable neighborhood sales.

Well, dropping a huge amount isn't that surprising since a few years ago the prices jumped up equally as high and even higher from one year to the next. It was insane and stupid.

house value went down 10%
proposed tax rate up 12%

my loss of 2% - damn...looks like my property taxes along with my mortgage payment is going to increase.

In the comps that fairfax used (according to their website) 2 properties were listed as "distressed" sales - does anyone know if the distressed sales are included in determining the assessed value or are they ignored like forclosed sales prices.

Down 5.4% in an older section of Vienna (1950s vintage ramblers and split levels, some with additions). Looks like my taxes are going up, again.

3.1 percent down here. Pretty good considering...

Damn, we went down $40,000.

Which in Huntington should mean about 50%

ouch. I'm down about 33%. My house is now valued at just a few thousand more than what I purchased it for back in 03.

Actually, I have lived in Huntington for the past 7 years and it isn't as bad as the rap it gets. It's very diverse; young first time buyers, families, singles, and retirees. Less crime reports than the West Springfield district that I grew up in. Walk to Metro, right off the highway, minutes to Old Town and DC.

Yah, I used to live by there (Huntington Gateway) and it was a hole in the mid 90s and still looks like a hole today.

Our neighborhood is down about 30-35%, which is not accurate -- 10-15% would be fair. We haven't had any sales in 2008 and only a couple of foreclosures, so the comps used for us are from crummy communities a few miles away. Those communities were full of subprime loans and now our values are being calculated on their problems! Note: you can click on the "neighborhood sales" icon on your tax record on the FFxCo tax website and see your comparables. County never gets anything right.

walkman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > does anyone know if the distressed sales are included in determining the assessed value or are they ignored like forclosed sales prices.< <

The Va. Constitution requires assessment based on fair market value which means the price paid by a willing seller to a willing buyer.

"Distressed sales" would seem not to fall within the definition of fair market value.

If you look in the column headed "market value" it says yes or no. Relocation company sales are not considered market value nor are foreclosure sales.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2009 09:37PM by Thomas More.

Yikes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Our neighborhood is down about 30-35%, which is
> not accurate -- 10-15% would be fair. We haven't
> had any sales in 2008 and only a couple of
> foreclosures, so the comps used for us are from
> crummy communities a few miles away. Those
> communities were full of subprime loans and now
> our values are being calculated on their problems!
> Note: you can click on the "neighborhood sales"
> icon on your tax record on the FFxCo tax website
> and see your comparables. County never gets
> anything right.


You can appeal your assessment, you know.

While most appeals are to lower the assessment (mostly with limited success), I'm sure an an appeal to raise your assessment would be approved immediately (after they stop laughing, that is).

I'm down about 30% on one of my props. The assessed value is now about 15K more than I paid, though I owe less than the value.

There's been about a dozen foreclosures in the complex over the last year +. Is that taken into consideration when assessing the property value? I've got friends with nearby properties that are of comparable size, age and construction that didn't drop nearly as much.

Yikes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Our neighborhood is down about 30-35%, which is
> not accurate -- 10-15% would be fair. We haven't
> had any sales in 2008 and only a couple of
> foreclosures, so the comps used for us are from
> crummy communities a few miles away. Those
> communities were full of subprime loans and now
> our values are being calculated on their problems!
> Note: you can click on the "neighborhood sales"
> icon on your tax record on the FFxCo tax website
> and see your comparables. County never gets
> anything right.

Surely you are not complaining. You get to pay way less in taxes.

My house in Vienna went down a little less than 2%. Our taxes will go way up. I'd rather be in your shoes.

Who wants to pay the county more money?

Merritt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ouch. I'm down about 33%. My house is now valued
> at just a few thousand more than what I purchased
> it for back in 03.

Would you mind telling us where that is? It seems strange to me that Vienna dropped so little, while other neighborhoods like yours went down so much. My house hasn't changed values much at all in the last 4 years, less than $30,000 since 2005. Similar houses in other areas have lost $175,000 and more, since 2005. I do not get it.

Same here, Mom of Four. My assessment went down 2%, first time it went down in three years. I don't know why Vienna houses don't seem to lose as much value as other parts of the county. Makes no sense to me either.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> walkman Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > does anyone know if the distressed sales are
> included in determining the assessed value or are
> they ignored like forclosed sales prices.< <
>
> The Va. Constitution requires assessment based on
> fair market value which means the price paid by a
> willing seller to a willing buyer.
>
> "Distressed sales" would seem not to fall within
> the definition of fair market value.
>
> If you look in the column headed "market value" it
> says yes or no. Relocation company sales are not
> considered market value nor are foreclosure sales.


So why aren't FMV sales dollar amounts used for the assessment? Why are some streets included in different areas for comps even when they are near each other [same neighbirhood]?

wtf. Still worth more than when I bought the property in 2003, but it's starting to get damn close. One more major fall like this last one and I'll be under and I bought when prices were still realistic.

RE comps Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So why aren't FMV sales dollar amounts used for the assessment?<

The reason a particular sales wasn't used as a comp. is explained in the column marked "sales notes."

> Why are some streets included in different areas for comps even when they are near each other ?<

Not sure. It looks like they wanted comps with houses built the same year.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> RE comps Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > So why aren't FMV sales dollar amounts used for
> the assessment?<
>
> The reason a particular sales wasn't used as a
> comp. is explained in the column marked "sales
> notes."
>
> > Why are some streets included in different
> areas for comps even when they are near each other
> ?<
>


Question 1-I meant for the sold property
Question 2- no. the ages are all over plus there are odd situations with islands that are similar to surroundings in ALL respects

Why doesn't hudgins try to get other areas of the county to have special tax districts. She has reston and Vienna where people are getting the shaft by higher county taxes to fund what should also be local stuff.

Vienna Mom of four Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Merritt Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > ouch. I'm down about 33%. My house is now
> valued
> > at just a few thousand more than what I
> purchased
> > it for back in 03.
>
> Would you mind telling us where that is? It seems
> strange to me that Vienna dropped so little, while
> other neighborhoods like yours went down so much.
> My house hasn't changed values much at all in the
> last 4 years, less than $30,000 since 2005.
> Similar houses in other areas have lost $175,000
> and more, since 2005. I do not get it.


I'm in Chantilly. Neighborhood is at Chantilly Rd / Rt 50. Just a few miles from 28, 7100, 66, etc. Great location for me, decent neighborhood.

Last year's assessment was 271k, this year is 184k.

The street names in my development (if you care to look up values)- Spring Run, Flowing Brook, Summer Hollow, Autumn Vale, Dawn Valley, Winter Harbor, Pleasant Meadow, Weeping Willow, Placid Lake (all names end with Ct).

http://maps.google.com/maps/mm?ie=UTF8&hl=en&ll=38.895041,-77.421341&spn=0.015097,0.027637&z=15



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/25/2009 02:04PM by Merritt.

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> walkman Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > does anyone know if the distressed sales are
> included in determining the assessed value or are
> they ignored like forclosed sales prices.< <
>
> The Va. Constitution requires assessment based on
> fair market value which means the price paid by a
> willing seller to a willing buyer.
>
> "Distressed sales" would seem not to fall within
> the definition of fair market value.
>
> If you look in the column headed "market value" it
> says yes or no. Relocation company sales are not
> considered market value nor are foreclosure sales.


Sorry...I should have said "duress...liquidation, forced sale" and not distressed. You are right anyway the properties were not used to determine the value.

is using the term "duress..." a new tactic to try and boost the assessed values by not being able to use those homes considered sold under "duress". IMO the homes listed under duress were sold at FMV...the homes were overpriced and sat on the market for a very long time. The homes sold when the listing price dropped to what the market could bear...thus FMV

walkman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > Sorry...I should have said "duress...liquidation, forced sale" and not distressed. You are right anyway the properties were not used to determine the value.< <

No need to apologize both terms are used to describe sales that are not willing seller- willing buyer, no compunction, arms length transactions.
>
> > is using the term "duress..." a new tactic to try and boost the assessed values by not being able to use those homes considered sold under "duress". IMO the homes listed under duress were sold at FMV...the homes were overpriced and sat on the market for a very long time. The homes sold when the listing price dropped to what the market could bear...thus FMV< <

Definitions of "fair market value" have developed over centuries through case law in multiple circumstances, assessments, eminent domain, property damage claims.

The results are fairly uniform: what will a willing buyer pay a willing seller in an arms length transaction where neither party is under pressure to buy or sell.

A relocation company sale is a seller under pressure to unload and will take less. A forclosure is a forced sale where the lender frequently bids in only the outstanding balance of the loan. Neither sale reflects FMV.

bought a condo in 2007 for $295K. assessed in 2008 at $288K.

got the 2009 assessment yesterday--$239K. wonderful....

There was a discussion on NPR last night - They were talking to someone in real estate in Manassas - much worse off than most of Fairfax - One of the points was what to use for FMV if 10 % of the housing stock has been foreclosed in the last 2 years and all of the sales in the last year are of foreclosed property. The properties sold for about 260-300K 2 years ago & the foreclosure sales are 40-65K...

Answer on FMV - No one has a clue so Manassas is making it up...

Thomas More Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> walkman Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > Sorry...I should have said
> "duress...liquidation, forced sale" and not
> distressed. You are right anyway the properties
> were not used to determine the value.< <
>
> No need to apologize both terms are used to
> describe sales that are not willing seller-
> willing buyer, no compunction, arms length
> transactions.
> >
> > > is using the term "duress..." a new tactic to
> try and boost the assessed values by not being
> able to use those homes considered sold under
> "duress". IMO the homes listed under duress were
> sold at FMV...the homes were overpriced and sat
> on the market for a very long time. The homes sold
> when the listing price dropped to what the market
> could bear...thus FMV< <
>
> Definitions of "fair market value" have developed
> over centuries through case law in multiple
> circumstances, assessments, eminent domain,
> property damage claims.
>
> The results are fairly uniform: what will a
> willing buyer pay a willing seller in an arms
> length transaction where neither party is under
> pressure to buy or sell.
>
> A relocation company sale is a seller under
> pressure to unload and will take less. A
> forclosure is a forced sale where the lender
> frequently bids in only the outstanding balance of
> the loan. Neither sale reflects FMV.

Can someone tell me what the term "sale from lender" means? Are these short sales? From what I have been able to find - it seems like this is basically a foreclosure that didn't go all the way to foreclosure. After looking at the details of the 4 that were among the comps for my neighborhood it appears that they were properties “bought back” by the lender at a much lower price and then sold for an even lower price – 1 step away from a foreclosure and in essence – likely the same result (i.e., final sales price). It appears, therefore, that these 4 should not have factored into the equation either. (and I think these are in fact 'short sales' meaning the lender accepted less than what was owed.... I know, likely bought at very inflated prices to begin with but I don't think it was 28% more!)

So homes in my neighborhood went down 28% and there are 12 properties they used for comps: 2 foreclosures, 4 sale from lender (and they say are "Valid Sales Price" but I can tell you they are NOT they are around the same as the foreclosures), 1 was a "handyman special" (wtf?) ,2 “transfers of convenience,” appear to be between lenders after buying from defaulted owner, 1 "property exch/not market value" (land only)

If you are keeping track - this means that TWO of the 12 used were what I would consider valid sales and fair market price (questionable for one, actually - the owner was under time constraint to sell and ultimately took much less than it should have sold for - also sold in December - not a good time to sell). And I swear I do not live in a slummy area! It's also complicated in that NONE Of the houses in my neighborhood are like the others - they are pretty much ALL different styles, building materials, etc. It's a weird neighborhood that way.

Normally I would be happy to pay less taxes (altho when they increase the rate it will not be much less in real dollars, I suspect) - but we are looking to move and sell our house in the next couple years. NO WAY would I take what they have now assessed it at. I won't argue it went way up beyond what it EVER should have been valued at.... and the last few years I've been saying how this has all got to stop at some point (and I am completely ignorant of economics, even *I* could see this was going to all come crashing down.) But what it is assessed at now - is really below what it should be.

Ugh. so I'm trying to decide whether to appeal. I've done a quick analysis of the comps, what the % broke out to be, etc. - and basically what they did is take the sales prices of all, and lower the assessed value to about 90% of that! so even LESS than the recent sales prices. I think they just went w/ a straight formula according to their SOP - but my argument is that almost NONE of these sales were really valid prices.

I also made the mistake of opening my retirement statement to find I lost pretty much half of what was there in the beginning of the year - YOWCH. Someone just feed me cyanide already ;-)

My place dropped over 120K!

Wildtwins wrote.

>Can someone tell me what the term "sale from lender" means?

It means that a bank sold the property it owned to another party. Usually, this means that the property was foreclosed on earlier.

Thomas More Wrote:

> The Va. Constitution requires assessment based on
> fair market value which means the price paid by a
> willing seller to a willing buyer.
>
> "Distressed sales" would seem not to fall within
> the definition of fair market value.

True. One problem that I have seen is that Fairfax County seems to be playing fast and loose with the term "Distressed Sales." For example, a sale between a lender and another party should fall under the "willing seller to a willing buyer" model. And yet only some of these transactions are considered by the County to be "valid and verified." I have seen several cases where a "sale from lender" transaction had been declared "invalid" and not included in the assessment pool. I think, though I can't prove, that Fairfax County is trying boost the assessed value of homes by excluding certain transactions. My guess is that any lender to buyer sale that falls outside the mean by a certain percent is excluded.

Of course, I might be just paranoid.

Mine went down by $95K, about a 30% drop (from $320K to $225K). I paid 155K for it in '01, just as the market was heating up, so I think mine will not go below my purchase price, thank goodness. I can't remember how much it went down last year, but my taxes went down about $20, even though the rate went up.

I do worry for those who bought more recently than I did. Two neighbors bought 18 months ago for $325K and $330K. One night last week the one who paid $330K had her car repossessed. How do you live in this area without a car?