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It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: News hound dog ()
Date: February 13, 2014 11:17PM

http://www.miamiherald.com/2014/02/13/3934241/va-judge-same-sex-marriage-unconstitutional.html


A federal judge ruled Thursday that Virginia's ban on same-sex marriage is unconstitutional, making it the first state in the South to have its voter-approved prohibition overturned.

U.S. District Judge Arenda Wright Allen issued a stay of her order while it is appealed, meaning that gay couples in Virginia will still not be able to marry until the case is ultimately resolved. Both sides believe the case won't be settled until the Supreme Court decides to hear it or one like it.

Allen's ruling makes Virginia the second state in the South to issue a ruling recognizing the legality of gay marriages.

A judge in Kentucky ruled Wednesday that the state must recognize same-sex marriages performed in other states. It did not rule on the constitutionality of same-sex marriages inside the state, however. The Virginia judge's ruling also follows similar decisions in Utah and Oklahoma federal courts.

The Virginia Attorney General's Office took the unusual step of not defending the law because it believes the ban violates the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment. However, it asked for the judge to stay her order to avoid a situation like what happened in Utah after a federal judge declared that state's ban on gay marriages unconstitutional.

More than 1,000 gay and lesbian couples were married in the days after the ruling before the U.S. Supreme Court granted the state an emergency stay, halting the weddings and creating a cloud of uncertainty for the status of the married couples. Soon after, a federal judge also declared Oklahoma's ban unconstitutional. That ruling is also on hold while it is appealed.

In a movement that began with Massachusetts in 2004, 17 states and the District of Columbia now allow gay marriage, most of them clustered in the Northeast. None of them is in the old Confederacy.

The Virginia case centered on a gay Norfolk couple that were denied a marriage license by the Norfolk Circuit Court in July, shortly after the Supreme Court struck down the federal Defense of Marriage Act. A Chesterfield County couple that married in California and is raising a teenage daughter also later joined the lawsuit, seeking to have their marriage recognized in Virginia. The attorneys representing the plaintiffs are the same ones who successfully challenged California's voter-approved ban on gay marriages in court.

Opponents of the Virginia ban say the issue resonates in Virginia in particular because of a landmark 1967 U.S. Supreme Court decision involving a Virginia couple and interracial marriage.

Mildred and Richard Loving were married in Washington, D.C., and were living in Virginia when police raided their home in 1958 and charged them with violating the state's Racial Integrity law. They were convicted but prevailed before the Supreme Court.

During verbal arguments in the case, Virginia Solicitor General Stuart Raphael said that the ban on gay marriage is legally indistinguishable from the ban on same-sex marriage. He said the same arguments to defend the ban now are the same ones that were used back then, including that marriage between two people of the same sex has never been historically allowed. Raphael also said supporters have failed to prove how allowing gay marriage would make heterosexual couples less likely to marry.

In defending the law, the attorney for the Norfolk clerk said that the issue is best left for the General Assembly and the voters to decide.

Nationwide, there are more than a dozen states with federal lawsuits challenging state bans on same-sex marriage.

——

Brock Vergakis can be reached at www.twitter.com/BrockVergakis

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: 7vedW ()
Date: February 13, 2014 11:34PM

Same sex =/= gay.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Bill.N. ()
Date: February 14, 2014 08:06AM

It is not legal for same sex couples to get married in Virginia. What the court did was throw out Virginia's ban on gay marriage. Since the judge also stayed the ruling though, no clerk's office is currently authorized by statute or forced by the judge's ruling to issue marriage licenses to gay couples.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Language... ()
Date: February 14, 2014 08:14AM

is important. There's no such thing as a "ban" on "gay marriage" - it's that such an arrangement is not recognized by the Commonwealth.
You can marry your favorite porn if you want, rings and all.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: RangerRikki ()
Date: February 14, 2014 09:25AM

Just as long as everyone understands that over and above the debate on gay marriage, voters' rights just got thrown under the bus and deemed invalid by ONE (UNELECTED) PERSON. We all understand the danger of this precedent, correct?

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: TheLoneRanger ()
Date: February 14, 2014 09:32AM

Can I marry my hand while this goes to appeal?

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: T ()
Date: February 14, 2014 10:00AM

Actually you are wrong. It was deemed inconsistent with the basic foundation of our nation's legal framework. A legislative majority may pass whatever laws it will, but only the constitutional ones can stick. The message is that most Virginians, or the legislators who voted for that bill, and the governor who signed it, and the AG who defended it, did not understand our Constitution.

RangerRikki Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just as long as everyone understands that over and
> above the debate on gay marriage, voters' rights
> just got thrown under the bus and deemed invalid
> by ONE (UNELECTED) PERSON. We all understand the
> danger of this precedent, correct?

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Bill.N. ()
Date: February 14, 2014 10:54AM

You are correct Language. My bad.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Charles darwin ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:12PM

14th amendment trumps 10th amendment?

Also, the 14th amendment addressed racial discrimination and didn't deal with anything near this topic. the 14th amendment did nothing to change women's rights and was not meant to be anywhere near homosexual rights.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: What's next ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:30PM

I want to marry my dog. Don't say I can't because that is against progress. Although we can't have kids it is my constitutional right to marry my animal.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Flying Spag Monster ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:31PM

Charles darwin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 14th amendment trumps 10th amendment?
>
> Also, the 14th amendment addressed racial
> discrimination and didn't deal with anything near
> this topic. the 14th amendment did nothing to
> change women's rights and was not meant to be
> anywhere near homosexual rights.

There's only ONE reason to oppose gay marriage -- because the Bible tells you so.

So your holy book is a good enough reason to tell gay people they can't get married.

Don't think so.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Married my kangaroo ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:38PM

Flying Spag Monster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Charles darwin Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > 14th amendment trumps 10th amendment?
> >
> > Also, the 14th amendment addressed racial
> > discrimination and didn't deal with anything
> near
> > this topic. the 14th amendment did nothing to
> > change women's rights and was not meant to be
> > anywhere near homosexual rights.
>
> There's only ONE reason to oppose gay marriage --
> because the Bible tells you so.
>
> So your holy book is a good enough reason to tell
> gay people they can't get married.
>
> Don't think so.


Hey, you better watch it. You're talking about the son of man, the man of sun, the man on the moon, and a few other things.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Brother Jacob ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:38PM

Flying Spag Monster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There's only ONE reason to oppose gay marriage --
> because the Bible tells you so.

Or some people just think it is grotesque and isn't right. Come on, you know what I mean bro? Right? It just seems wrong doesn't it? Yep, deep down you know it is wrong. Just admit it.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: cant do that. sorry ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:41PM

What's next Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I want to marry my dog. Don't say I can't because
> that is against progress. Although we can't have
> kids it is my constitutional right to marry my
> animal.


you cant marry your dog. sorry that's not allowed. this court decision was only about homosexical marriage.
Attachments:
Gay-Marriage-Should-Not-Be-a-Federal-Issue1.jpg
gay 2.jpg
gay 3.jpg
pope.jpg
gay 4.jpg
gay 5.jpg
gay 6.jpg

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Uh huh... ()
Date: February 14, 2014 12:45PM

Brother Jacob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Flying Spag Monster Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > There's only ONE reason to oppose gay marriage
> --
> > because the Bible tells you so.
>
> Or some people just think it is grotesque and
> isn't right. Come on, you know what I mean bro?
> Right? It just seems wrong doesn't it? Yep, deep
> down you know it is wrong. Just admit it.

Well, I think ignorant homophobic hillbilly pig fuckers are grotesque, but I'm not telling you what to do in your personal life.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Brother Jacob ()
Date: February 14, 2014 03:07PM

Nice ad hom attack. Nope. My shaft only goes in the [real] wet vaginas of willing women. Nope. You figured wrong. I am just a regular non religious dude who just thinks it is wrong.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Closeted Republicans ()
Date: February 14, 2014 03:17PM

Ut's no longer okay to be gay and marry a straight person. Gay marriage no longer outlawed in Va.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: splainmeLucy ()
Date: February 14, 2014 03:23PM

I know it is almost impossible to have an intelligent discussion on FFXU, particularly on a subject that is so polarizing. But here goes anyway.

Can someone please explain to me why the state (or feds) have any interest in marriage at all? Isn't a religious concept and thus left to the people? I understand the need for civil union (both straight and gay) but not marriage?

P.S. I would love to see this discussed w/o calling libitards and republitards or whatever derogatives you have for each other.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: civvies ()
Date: February 14, 2014 03:29PM

You have a lot of rights that aren't automatically conveyed to a civil union that are already written into law for marriages. You'd have to create new laws for each of those areas, such as taxes, estates, adoptions, property rights, etc. It was mostly covered by Suze Orman.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: It's all about the money ()
Date: February 14, 2014 03:35PM

splainmeLucy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I know it is almost impossible to have an
> intelligent discussion on FFXU, particularly on a
> subject that is so polarizing. But here goes
> anyway.
>
> Can someone please explain to me why the state (or
> feds) have any interest in marriage at all? Isn't
> a religious concept and thus left to the people?
> I understand the need for civil union (both
> straight and gay) but not marriage?
>
> P.S. I would love to see this discussed w/o
> calling libitards and republitards or whatever
> derogatives you have for each other.


It really comes down to the money: wills, benefits, entitlements. And of course, being able to say "we're different than what you're used to but you must accept us because we're the same". They want to have it both ways.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: splainmeLucy ()
Date: February 14, 2014 04:00PM

It's all about the money Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> It really comes down to the money: wills,
> benefits, entitlements. And of course, being able
> to say "we're different than what you're used to
> but you must accept us because we're the same".
> They want to have it both ways.


Civil unions covers all that and the State has a legitimate interest in that. It has no interest, and should not be involved, in marriage.

The basic principle of the founding fathers was that government was inherently bad and the more power vesting directly in the people the better - this concept is now foreign to most Americans who expect/want the government to be and do everything for them. Sad.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: vares ()
Date: February 14, 2014 04:11PM

there is a screw loose in a guys head when they want to put their dick on another guys ass.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: too late ()
Date: February 14, 2014 04:26PM

Marital status is written into a lot of laws and regulations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rights_and_responsibilities_of_marriages_in_the_United_States

The more people are involved, the more laws are needed to resolve possible disputes.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: hot dog ()
Date: February 14, 2014 05:02PM

What's next Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I want to marry my dog. Don't say I can't because
> that is against progress. Although we can't have
> kids it is my constitutional right to marry my
> animal.


Is you dog hot?

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Reality ()
Date: February 14, 2014 05:06PM

"Marital status is written into a lot of laws and regulations"

Bullshit. There are very few real (codified) laws that set up actual preferences for marriage (the vast majority of so called thirteen hundred married "benefits" are additional pay issues). Those specific laws should be struck down, of course...

"married" should be 100% to "single" under the law. Solves all of the problems, so of course won't happen.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: Liberal Logic 005 ()
Date: February 14, 2014 05:35PM

splainmeLucy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I know it is almost impossible to have an
> intelligent discussion on FFXU, particularly on a
> subject that is so polarizing. But here goes
> anyway.
>
> Can someone please explain to me why the state (or
> feds) have any interest in marriage at all? Isn't
> a religious concept and thus left to the people?
> I understand the need for civil union (both
> straight and gay) but not marriage?
>
> P.S. I would love to see this discussed w/o
> calling libitards and republitards or whatever
> derogatives you have for each other.

The initial interest was that there was a governmental interest in supporting reproduction of the population. That ensures the country continues and ideally a new generation of tax payers.

Over time its become much more about money, but you can still see that initial reason embedded in the issue with tax credits for kids ect. The only purpose of that is to encourage married couples to have kids. Again though thats broken down with more and more people having kids out of wedlock.

Obviously none of that applies to gays. From a marriage standpoint the government has no interest in it other than to push an agenda and shove it in the faces of people who arent following along with it. The could accomplish the exact same monetary benefits just calling it something else but thats not enough for ideologues.

The entire argument is hypocritical as well. They say love is love yet they themselves discriminate against polygamy.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: dX7WY ()
Date: February 14, 2014 06:20PM

There is a stay on the federal judge's decision ... no gay marriages.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: SRres ()
Date: February 14, 2014 06:46PM

The stay is just on issuing licenses pending any appeal.

I think it's funny/sad that the judge confused the Declaration of Independence with the Constitution in her opinion ("all men are created equal" is the Declaration, not the Constitution, as she mistakenly said. And what about...women? lol)

Makes it seem like she was in a hurry to get it out for Valentine's Day so it could be more "meaningful" or something.

Just makes it look careless (and political, if it was a rush for the date), which it shouldn't if she takes it seriously as something important.

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Re: It's ok to be gay in VA and get married. Gay marriage no longer illegal in VA.
Posted by: kny6x ()
Date: February 14, 2014 09:13PM

Of course there's a solution to all this, but the government will never do it because it would involve LESS law on the books.

We already have contract laws.

We already have an interstate commerce act.

What's a marriage (in the legal sense)? It's simply and fundamentally a contract between two entities.

The only persons who make the rules in a contract are the parties to the contract (as long as the terms are within the statutes). Everyone or anyone can enter into a contract with another without the government's permission (as long as it doesn't break any statutes).

Why the hell the government ever got involved in marriages in the first place is beyond me. Yes, it is in the interest of the state to have folks enter into marriages; but keep it at that - just have marriages in the interest of the state.

Get government completely out of regulating who enters into a contract. Just let government enforce the contract of marriage/civil unions/slegehammers (what it's called is irrelevant...it's a fucking contract between two entities) like government enforces (or ends) other contracts.

But, of course, this solution is too simple AND it would involve...gasp...revoking laws.

No way any politician (D or R) would go for that.

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