I live in West Springfield. This past Saturday a neighbor thought their dryer was on fire. A white ladder truck from the Greater Springfield Volunteer fire department showed up, but it was staffed with paid Fairfax County Fire Department Personnel (at least according to their shirts). A Yellowish Green Fire Engine showed up from the Burke Volunteer Fire Department and it was staffed with volunteers. A red fire engine showed up from the Fairfax County Fire and Rescue Department (FS 427) and it was staffed with Fairfax County Fire and Rescue Dept. personnel. An ambulance showed up from the Greater Springfield Volunteer Fire Department and it was staffed with Volunteer personnel who could not fight fires but could only administer emergency medical services, according to one of the young girls who hopped off the ambulance. This reminds me of rural PA! I mean WTF? My tax dollars are paid to Fairfax County who has line items in their budget for several million dollars for the Fire and Rescue Department. Why are all these different colored engines, trucks, and ambulances showing up on emergency calls some with volunteers and some with Fairfax County Fire and Rescue personnel. Not sure I want to put my life or property in the hands of some volunteer.

Something like 75% of firefighters are volunteers and close to that for EMTs. The big paid units are the exception other than in larger population areas. Be glad that the volunteers are there or you'd be paying a lot more.

"Not sure I want to put my life or property in the hands of some volunteer."

That is because you don't know the definition of the word "volunteer."

In the context of fire departments, "volunteer" simply means that they are not employees of the city or county. They still go through all of the same training and use all of the same equipment.

Fairfax County has 37 stations staffed 24/7 with full-time, paid firefighters who are responsible for providing fire, rescue and EMS services. All are minimum qualified as EMTs as well and every shift has at least one person who is ALS-certified. There should be an ALS provider on every engine and many stations have a dedicated ALS ambulance as well.

In addition, there are 12 volunteer fire companies co-resident at stations in Annandale, Burke, Centerville, Fair Oaks, Bailey's Crossroads, Dunn Loring, Franconia, Lorton, Springfield, McLean and Vienna (http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/fr/deptinfo/volorg.htm). At one time, FXCO was served almost entirely by volunteer firefighters who owned the land, buildings and apparatus. Over time, however as FXCO grew and developed, the department transitioned to the hybrid model we have today.

The reason that you see a 'slime lime' ambulance from Burke (Station 14) is that this unit was purchased and is owned by the volunteer organization for use by the county. Volunteers provide supplemental staffing on front-line units (engines, rescue squads and ambulances), but can also put additional units in service. For example, there can be an all-volunteer crew running a BLS ambulance in Burke which can be used on calls like the one you described which allows the ALS provider to be available for other calls. This results in a net win for FXCO residents and taxpayers since there is a higher service availability without significant additional cost.

"An ambulance showed up from the Greater Springfield Volunteer Fire Department and it was staffed with Volunteer personnel who could not fight fires but could only administer emergency medical services, according to one of the young girls who hopped off the ambulance."

FXCO has an EMS-only program for volunteers who want to provide medical care, but are not interested in fire fighting and this option helps to develop a strong cadre of skilled BLS and ALS providers who might not otherwise be there if required to complete the fire academy.

Unlike rural PA and other states where volunteers often hang around the firehouse shooting pool and having a cold one while waiting for the tones to go off, the expectation is that volunteers and career staff work together as a seamless unit regardless of what color the vehicle is. Now, some people might argue that citizens are at risk with "inferior" staff, but I don't know of any research or analysis that supports this.

Why do you think there's a lot of "fire departments"?

hint: it takes a lot of apparatus to block all lanes of a multi-lane highway for a fender bender. Lots of fender benders require lots of vehicles. Understand?

I'm not concerned. Just be happy you live where we have some of the best emergency responders in the world and pay half the taxes of places like westchester County, NY.

Fairfax City has a seperate department from Fairfax County. Volunteers own one station of two and most equipment.

RUConcerned Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I live in West Springfield. This past Saturday a
> neighbor thought their dryer was on fire. A white
> ladder truck from the Greater Springfield
> Volunteer fire department showed up, but it was
> staffed with paid Fairfax County Fire Department
> Personnel (at least according to their shirts). A
> Yellowish Green Fire Engine showed up from the
> Burke Volunteer Fire Department and it was staffed
> with volunteers. A red fire engine showed up from
> the Fairfax County Fire and Rescue Department (FS
> 427) and it was staffed with Fairfax County Fire
> and Rescue Dept. personnel. An ambulance showed up
> from the Greater Springfield Volunteer Fire
> Department and it was staffed with Volunteer
> personnel who could not fight fires but could only
> administer emergency medical services, according
> to one of the young girls who hopped off the
> ambulance. This reminds me of rural PA! I mean
> WTF? My tax dollars are paid to Fairfax County
> who has line items in their budget for several
> million dollars for the Fire and Rescue
> Department. Why are all these different colored
> engines, trucks, and ambulances showing up on
> emergency calls some with volunteers and some with
> Fairfax County Fire and Rescue personnel. Not
> sure I want to put my life or property in the
> hands of some volunteer.

Here's a link to the Fairfax County Board of Supervisors meeting page...

http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/government/board/meetings/

Please go and tell them all about this injustice. Your message needs to be heard.

Please let us know when you're going. I really want to be there for it.

"You don't want to put your life or property in the hands of a 'volunteer'"??????

The volunteer firefighters in Fairfax County go through the exact same training as the career firefighters. The only difference between the recruit school for the career staff and the fire school for the volunteers is that the volunteer school take a month longer due to having to schedule training around their paying jobs. Next time you see a firefighter in full turn out gear about to run into your burning house, let us know if you can tell the difference between a career and a volunteer firefighter.
Remember that little storm we had last week? Perhaps you should do some fact-finding and see exactly how many units running calls were volunteers. Find out how many of those lowly volunteers left their damaged homes, or left their families in a 90+ degree home because they didn't have any power, to hop on an engine or an ambulance to serve the citizens in their community.
Next time you want to come on to a public forum and chastise the volunteer system, perhaps you should visit one of the 12 volunteer stations and see how things run. This is NOT rural PA, or WV, or southwestern VA where the "good old boys" drink beer while sitting in front of the firehouse or run around with flashing lights on their pickup trucks running to calls when their pager goes off. (If this doesn't happen in the rural areas, I apologize and meant no offense)

Boo...why are there so many places in this county dedicated to my well being? If I want to light my house on fire to collect the insurance money because my mortgage is under water I should be able to do so without all of these pesky fire departments showing up and salvaging my property and, potentially, saving the lives and property of those around my house.

:'(

doop Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why do you think there's a lot of "fire
> departments"?
>
> hint: it takes a lot of apparatus to block all
> lanes of a multi-lane highway for a fender bender.
> Lots of fender benders require lots of vehicles.
> Understand?

Best post of the day

JoMaRo wrote:

"This is NOT rural PA, or WV, or southwestern VA where the "good old boys" drink beer while sitting in front of the firehouse or run around with flashing lights on their pickup trucks running to calls when their pager goes off. (If this doesn't happen in the rural areas, I apologize and meant no offense)"


In the rural area I am from the small towns and bust ass poor counties cant afford anything close to a paid Fire Department or ambulance. These volunteers have to run calls all day and night because the area is full of old folks who constantly have heart conditions and other ailments. The volunteers drop what they are doing and respond. They receive nothing in return other than the satisfaction of helping others.

They have a hard time making ends meet with decent equipment as the residents are poor to lower middle class but when the time comes they pony up money at benefit dinners and auctions.

Well, we found out last week how well prepared these mega-dollar "public safety" departments are.

What was it, three hours before they even noticed that nobody was calling 911?

Ridiculous.

Coming soon the Sharon Bulova mega dollar public safety tax.

Simple answer-its a big fucking county. 399 square miles, and 1.2 million peeps.

Be glad you dont live in bumass va where the fire trucks show up when the foundation is all that is left

Isn't there only one fire department in Fairfax County, that being the Fairfax County Fire Department?

Just Wondering... Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Isn't there only one fire department in Fairfax
> County, that being the Fairfax County Fire
> Department?

Dude prolly meant fire stations.

Because there are fires?

Lester Burnham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fairfax County has 37 stations staffed 24/7 with
> full-time, paid firefighters who are responsible
> for providing fire, rescue and EMS services. All
> are minimum qualified as EMTs as well and every
> shift has at least one person who is
> ALS-certified. There should be an ALS provider on
> every engine and many stations have a dedicated
> ALS ambulance as well.
>
> In addition, there are 12 volunteer fire companies
> co-resident at stations in Annandale, Burke,
> Centerville, Fair Oaks, Bailey's Crossroads, Dunn
> Loring, Franconia, Lorton, Springfield, McLean and
> Vienna
> (http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/fr/deptinfo/volorg.h
> tm). At one time, FXCO was served almost entirely
> by volunteer firefighters who owned the land,
> buildings and apparatus. Over time, however as
> FXCO grew and developed, the department
> transitioned to the hybrid model we have today.
>
> The reason that you see a 'slime lime' ambulance
> from Burke (Station 14) is that this unit was
> purchased and is owned by the volunteer
> organization for use by the county. Volunteers
> provide supplemental staffing on front-line units
> (engines, rescue squads and ambulances), but can
> also put additional units in service. For
> example, there can be an all-volunteer crew
> running a BLS ambulance in Burke which can be used
> on calls like the one you described which allows
> the ALS provider to be available for other calls.
> This results in a net win for FXCO residents and
> taxpayers since there is a higher service
> availability without significant additional cost.


All true. Also worth mentioning is that the volunteers receive the same training as the career people, at the same academy, just at night and on weekends, I believe. In other parts of the country, you don't know what you're getting with the volunteers - some can only drive, others can't go interior, and can just do surround and drown, others still are only trained for what is in their district. If they give mutual aid, they might not be trained for the types of incidents that neighboring jurisdictions run.

Volunteer departments in other areas may not have duty crews (on shift at the station), and may respond from home to the station, and get to the scene just in time to save your foundation or pronounce you dead on an EMS call.

You're lucky that you have a paramedic ambulance and a paramedic engine in every station - in rural areas, you're lucky to get an EMT-Enhanced, let alone an EMT-
I or medic at all.

doop Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why do you think there's a lot of "fire
> departments"?
>
> hint: it takes a lot of apparatus to block all
> lanes of a multi-lane highway for a fender bender.
> Lots of fender benders require lots of vehicles.
> Understand?


There are numerous accounts of motorists killing firefighters and EMS workers on roads and highways. There are numerous accounts of motorists ramming into parked apparatus on a highway accident scene at full speed both in night and also broad daylight. These collisions would have also killed emergency services workers onscene.

I've also worked numerous rear-end collisions where it's obvious that the driver striking the stopped car (at a light, or in a traffic jam), was distracted, presumably on their phone or messing with their i-pod. These same drivers are on the highways as well. Did you see the incident at the off ramp in Texas last week where the van plowed the stopped car at full speed? You're damn straight we're going to take all lanes involved plus an extra lane on each side! Too bad if you're too self-important to understand the rationale behind how we operate.

When you meet a Fairfax paid firefigher thank them for supporting Connolly every time he is up for election.

no one in command who gets to a fire or accident who determines the level of response
seems like a waste of money and energy
cops also over respond

suppose we get situation with multiple disasters and the fire and cops respond like a chinese fire drill

No.

There are so many because each department covers a certain amount of sq ft as their first due. I sure as hell wouldn't want a fire engine to come from the other end of the county to put a fire out because someone just wanted a few.

Also, there are so many of different colors because other stations cover areas already covered by the primary station as second due in the event that something major breaks out. You wouldn't want 1 fire engine to put out a massive house fire?

Lastly, they have an EMS ambulance that does not partake in the fire fighting to assess the fire fighters' vitals to make sure they aren't exhausted and won't die from heat exhaustion. Firefighter junkies get addicted to fighting fires, not realizing it might be detrimental to their health. Also, having an exhausted junkie treat another exhausted junkie is like have a drug dealer preach about going drug free.

ps - I am not going to reiterate the comment about volunteers vs career or taking up too many lanes for auto crashes.

The Burke Volunteer Clown Fire Department...is that the one whose fire house burned down while they were out on a call? Do they really have hoses or just use super soakers?

Fireman Bill and OP are two of the biggest dumbfucks I ever seen on this site...................and that's saying a lot.

@Bill - just cause they are fire personnel doesnt mean they have a magical ability to simply make a fire not occur. It can kinda happen at any time in any place

@OP - only a COMPLETE STUPID DUMBFUCK would complain that they have too much life saving equipment around. So ok, how much DOES a human soul cost to you? Wait a second - dont bother answering cause nobody gives a FUCK what you think you cant even figure out that Volunteer Firefighters have more skill in their little pinkies when it comes to rescue and safety than you do in yr entire anatomie...........

pic unrelated
Attachments:

Fireman Bill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Burke Volunteer Clown Fire Department...is
> that the one whose fire house burned down while
> they were out on a call? Do they really have
> hoses or just use super soakers?

Actually, BVD's RS experienced an electrical malfuction that caused the fire. Forturnately, all personnel escaped without injury.

Fireman Bill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Burke Volunteer Clown Fire Department...is
> that the one whose fire house burned down while
> they were out on a call? Do they really have
> hoses or just use super soakers?


Actually, RS 14 experienced an electrical malfuction that caused the fire. Forturnately, all personnel escaped without injury.

Stop complaining! If you don't like it tell them not to come to your house in an emergency.

Fireman Bill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Burke Volunteer Clown Fire Department...is
> that the one whose fire house burned down while
> they were out on a call? Do they really have
> hoses or just use super soakers?

Adding to Gordon's comment, the fire started at night due to an electrical system issue on the rescue squad. The apparatus bay did not have smoke/fire detectors and the fire was discovered when someone got out of bed to grab a smoke. It has been a while, but my recollection is that the entire bay area was full of black smoke and entire shift was able to escape the building safely through the back stairs. Unfortunately, there was no way to easily open the bay doors and all of the apparatus - quint (ladder truck), squad and two ambulances - were severely damaged.

Feel free to make this into a volunteer issue, but it was one of those freak things that could have happened anywhere.

Lester Burnham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fireman Bill Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The Burke Volunteer Clown Fire Department...is
> > that the one whose fire house burned down while
> > they were out on a call? Do they really have
> > hoses or just use super soakers?
>
> Adding to Gordon's comment, the fire started at
> night due to an electrical system issue on the
> rescue squad. The apparatus bay did not have
> smoke/fire detectors and the fire was discovered
> when someone got out of bed to grab a smoke. It
> has been a while, but my recollection is that the
> entire bay area was full of black smoke and entire
> shift was able to escape the building safely
> through the back stairs. Unfortunately, there was
> no way to easily open the bay doors and all of the
> apparatus - quint (ladder truck), squad and two
> ambulances - were severely damaged.
>
> Feel free to make this into a volunteer issue, but
> it was one of those freak things that could have
> happened anywhere.

It also didn't help that the building looked like Jed Clampett's shanty from the opening of Beverly Hillbillies. I'm surprised that place hadn't collapsed long before the fire took it out.

Ruconcerned why dont you go fucking volunteer your self and find outwhat training they go to. Fuck you from a volunteer of 13 years i could save your sorry bitching ass just as easly as a paid firefighter you cock sucking pussy go grow up asshole

fireman703 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ruconcerned why dont you go fucking volunteer
> your self and find outwhat training they go to.
> Fuck you from a volunteer of 13 years i could save
> your sorry bitching ass just as easly as a paid
> firefighter you cock sucking pussy go grow up
> asshole




Way to represent the firefighting brotherhood there, buddy....
Way to go....

Hold it together my 13 year salty dog! I guess OP doesn't feel he pays enough taxes.

JoMaRo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "You don't want to put your life or property in
> the hands of a 'volunteer'"??????
>
> The volunteer firefighters in Fairfax County go
> through the exact same training as the career
> firefighters. The only difference between the
> recruit school for the career staff and the fire
> school for the volunteers is that the volunteer
> school take a month longer due to having to
> schedule training around their paying jobs. Next
> time you see a firefighter in full turn out gear
> about to run into your burning house, let us know
> if you can tell the difference between a career
> and a volunteer firefighter.
> Remember that little storm we had last week?
> Perhaps you should do some fact-finding and see
> exactly how many units running calls were
> volunteers. Find out how many of those lowly
> volunteers left their damaged homes, or left their
> families in a 90+ degree home because they didn't
> have any power, to hop on an engine or an
> ambulance to serve the citizens in their
> community.
> Next time you want to come on to a public forum
> and chastise the volunteer system, perhaps you
> should visit one of the 12 volunteer stations and
> see how things run. This is NOT rural PA, or WV,
> or southwestern VA where the "good old boys" drink
> beer while sitting in front of the firehouse or
> run around with flashing lights on their pickup
> trucks running to calls when their pager goes off.
> (If this doesn't happen in the rural areas, I
> apologize and meant no offense)



I was a volunteer for five years in Connecticut. I thought, "Hey, I'm the same as that full time firefighter over there.". I moved back home to DC and applied to departments around here. I got in. Let me tell you WITHOUT QUESTION there is a HUGE ASS difference between a volunteer and a full time firefighter.

The training IS NOT the same and the hours are not the same. Anyone who says volunteers are the same as full time firefighters are ALWAYS volunteers. I know because I've been both.

I'll give you a very simple example:

A volunteer firefighter may go on 5-6 calls a month. A full time firefighter will go on 150 calls a month. Which one do you think is more proficient? If your love one was dying who do you want responding? That guy who's ridden the firetruck to a REAL emergency 2-3 times in the last 6 months? Or that guy who's been going to REAL emergencies 20-25 times in the last 6 months?

Yeah. Thought so.

The fire department is great and gives us training. The volunteers are nice to us too. No complaints.

With respect to FD11, the training that a volunteer FF/EMT goes thru in Fairfax County is EXACTLY the same as the career folk, with one exception: The career folk do it for 4 months 8hrs a day, 5-days a week, where the volunteers do it for a little over 5 months, 30hrs a week, 4 days a week. The volunteer FF's are qualified to replace a career FF if the need arises. Fortunately, that need has not happened in a long time due to the abundance of overtime.

FD11 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'll give you a very simple example:
>
> A volunteer firefighter may go on 5-6 calls a
> month. A full time firefighter will go on 150
> calls a month. Which one do you think is more
> proficient? If your love one was dying who do you
> want responding? That guy who's ridden the
> firetruck to a REAL emergency 2-3 times in the
> last 6 months? Or that guy who's been going to
> REAL emergencies 20-25 times in the last 6
> months?
>
> Yeah. Thought so.

With all due respect, if you are working the typical 12-14 days per month that is around 10 calls per shift, but how many are actually "calls"? You know, the ones where you pull 400' of hose, raise the stick, or break out the Hurst tool. Just a handful with rest a lot of alarm problems and food on the stove. Still, the volunteers who choose to ride engines, trucks and squads have the skills to stand up to their friends in the IAFF.

On the EMS side, however, there is enough BLS and ALS call activity to keep the MAJORITY of volunteer who ride regularly to provide an equivalent quality of care, possibly better at the BLS level.

If I am wrong please feel free to cite any qualitative data proving your point.

"A full time firefighter will go on 150
> calls a month."

I call BS unless you count shopping at Giant a call.

I hope you guys dont hurt your arm patting yourself on the back. NYFD you aint so stop the BS stories, only old people and kids believe your tall tales anymore.

Exactly, They are still trained the same way, fed the same way, SERVING the same way. Don't judge volunteers... When Station 415 is involved which is Chantilly Fire Station it always responds with side Station 421 Fair Oaks Volunteer Station. I always wondered why FS-421 and not FS-436 Which is way closer. But im still glad they send 2 Stations.

Smokey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Something like 75% of firefighters are volunteers
> and close to that for EMTs. The big paid units
> are the exception other than in larger population
> areas. Be glad that the volunteers are there or
> you'd be paying a lot more.

your a fucking liar

fire fighers are not only paid but overpaid and maybe overtime too

chiefs of fire in counties get $ 1/4 million to $ 1/2 million a year SALARY

i never met a firefighter who didn't admit they were paid

i found students taking fire fighting classes (weren't paying with their own money) getting in "volunteer" to help secure their future job

but also these same peopel had family connectiosn with fx co gov workers - they knew "the path" to take

THEY GET PAID YOU LIE

Ticks rarely ride or go on calls in Fairfax. They should be embarassed.

me want more more more!!!!