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Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Listen Folks ()
Date: October 31, 2013 05:22PM

The A.C.A. is already affecting locals with higher insurance premiums and higher deductibles. The website launch is embarrassing, but the big story is that this bill will cost YOU cash and lots of it! Be smart! Support Cuccinelli. McAuliffe is in Obama's hip pocket. He is an enthusiastic supporter of the A.C.A. Go to his website and check it out! You can't afford to make a mistake on this!

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Hay Zeus ()
Date: October 31, 2013 05:33PM

McAullife is not interested in governing the commonwealth of Va, he is only interested in imposing the Democratic National Party platform at the state level which effectively will raise the cost of living via higher energy costs, raise taxes, provide safe haven for criminal illegal immigrants and encroach on 2nd amendment rights of law abiding citizens.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Independent ()
Date: October 31, 2013 05:48PM

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> McAullife is not interested in governing the
> commonwealth of Va, he is only interested in
> imposing the Democratic National Party platform at
> the state level which effectively will raise the
> cost of living via higher energy costs, raise
> taxes, provide safe haven for criminal illegal
> immigrants and encroach on 2nd amendment rights of
> law abiding citizens.

And you don't believe in science but "Jesus"

You are a tool to allow Rich like CEO Rich to have their minimal taxes compared to the 1950's drastically cut.

At the same time you want the social structure of the country to revert back to the 50's (i.e. women barefoot and pregnant - all men (if you were white) had jobs) etc. etc.......

Times have changed. The party of no is now a joke.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: imbiker ()
Date: October 31, 2013 05:55PM

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> McAullife is not interested in governing the
> commonwealth of Va, he is only interested in
> imposing the Democratic National Party platform at
> the state level which effectively will raise the
> cost of living via higher energy costs, raise
> taxes, provide safe haven for criminal illegal
> immigrants and encroach on 2nd amendment rights of
> law abiding citizens.


Correct with the following addition:

McAwful purpose in life is to get elected guv and run a 24/7 campaign for hillary in Virginia, Virginia be dammed. Once mz hillary is inaugurated, McAwful resigns and moves on to a white house slot.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Hay Zeus ()
Date: October 31, 2013 06:07PM

Independent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hay Zeus Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > McAullife is not interested in governing the
> > commonwealth of Va, he is only interested in
> > imposing the Democratic National Party platform
> at
> > the state level which effectively will raise
> the
> > cost of living via higher energy costs, raise
> > taxes, provide safe haven for criminal illegal
> > immigrants and encroach on 2nd amendment rights
> of
> > law abiding citizens.
>
> And you don't believe in science but "Jesus"

What?
>
> You are a tool to allow Rich like CEO Rich to have
> their minimal taxes compared to the 1950's
> drastically cut.

Huh?
>
> At the same time you want the social structure of
> the country to revert back to the 50's (i.e. women
> barefoot and pregnant - all men (if you were
> white) had jobs) etc. etc.......

I said that?
>
> Times have changed. The party of no is now a
> joke.

Amazing, a response that has nothing to do with what I said!

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Independunce ()
Date: October 31, 2013 06:27PM

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Independent Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Hay Zeus Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > McAullife is not interested in governing the
> > > commonwealth of Va, he is only interested in
> > > imposing the Democratic National Party
> platform
> > at
> > > the state level which effectively will raise
> > the
> > > cost of living via higher energy costs, raise
> > > taxes, provide safe haven for criminal
> illegal
> > > immigrants and encroach on 2nd amendment
> rights
> > of
> > > law abiding citizens.
> >
> > And you don't believe in science but "Jesus"
>
> What?
> >
> > You are a tool to allow Rich like CEO Rich to
> have
> > their minimal taxes compared to the 1950's
> > drastically cut.
>
> Huh?
> >
> > At the same time you want the social structure
> of
> > the country to revert back to the 50's (i.e.
> women
> > barefoot and pregnant - all men (if you were
> > white) had jobs) etc. etc.......
>
> I said that?
> >
> > Times have changed. The party of no is now a
> > joke.
>
> Amazing, a response that has nothing to do with
> what I said!


Let it go... He's a die-hard Progressive pretending to be an independent and vomiting talking points. You'll just trigger more spewage.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: yeah ()
Date: October 31, 2013 08:04PM

Listen Folks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The A.C.A. is already affecting locals with higher
> insurance premiums and higher deductibles. The
> website launch is embarrassing, but the big story
> is that this bill will cost YOU cash and lots of
> it! Be smart! Support Cuccinelli. McAuliffe is
> in Obama's hip pocket. He is an enthusiastic
> supporter of the A.C.A. Go to his website and
> check it out! You can't afford to make a mistake
> on this!


Wow, so Cuccinelli can make Obamacare go away?

If so, he's got my vote!

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Ben Dover ()
Date: October 31, 2013 09:49PM

Cuccinelli says that next week's election is a referendum by Virginia on Obamacare.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/29/cuccinelli-ties-mcauliffe-to-obamacare/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS

Virginia Attorney General Kenneth T. Cuccinelli II is now billing his race against Democrat Terry McAuliffe as a referendum on President Obama’s health care overhaul



I guess we'll see soon what directions that Virginia wants to go.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: yeah ()
Date: October 31, 2013 10:27PM

Ben Dover Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cuccinelli says that next week's election is a
> referendum by Virginia on Obamacare.
>
> http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/29/cu
> ccinelli-ties-mcauliffe-to-obamacare/?utm_source=R
> SS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS
>
> Virginia Attorney General Kenneth T. Cuccinelli II
> is now billing his race against Democrat Terry
> McAuliffe as a referendum on President Obama’s
> health care overhaul
>
>
>
> I guess we'll see soon what directions that
> Virginia wants to go.


So it's true, Cuccinelli, if elected, can scrap Obamacare!

I had no idea that the Governor of Virginia can override the Congress, the President, and the Supreme Court. That would make the Governor of Virginia the most powerful office in the Country!

Ken, you have my vote!

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: control freaks ()
Date: November 01, 2013 05:48AM

As Obama keeps telling us, there's alot governors and other legislators can do to thwart our beautiful, glorious, affordable, healthy, voluntary, sustainable future in "healthcare".

That's why, he says, it isn't working now--a few dead-enders are resisting. Its the fault of the tea party that all the problems that were pointed out before Democrats rammed through his "law" have come home to roost.

So apparently Cuccinelli can still have an effect. Vote Cuccinelli!

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: op=trollbait ()
Date: November 01, 2013 07:56AM

fuck off you broke dick shit fucker

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: op is a bitch ()
Date: November 01, 2013 08:05AM

Just because you put the word "local" in your faggot ass post does not make it appropriate to post that shit in Fairfax General.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: ExPat ()
Date: November 01, 2013 08:20AM

Seems to me that the op is simply stating facts, not trolling. Costs will go up. The website roll-out is a complete, unmitigated failure. People will lose coverage. All true.

Conservatives warned us. They said people would lose coverage. They said a lot of people will not be able to keep their doctor. They said rates for the middle class will double. But they were shouted down as simply being racist or ignorant. So a lot of people just tuned them out.

So when the same people who correctly warned us about the ACA 4 years ago now get viciously attacked, I wonder if people tune them out again.

I doubt it.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Hmmmmmm ()
Date: November 01, 2013 10:06AM

ExPat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Conservatives warned us.

No, conservatives as usual foamed at the mouth over utter nonsense. There are no death panels. There are no takeovers. An individual mandate is constitutional.

Meanwhile, termination of a substandard policy by an insurance company will result in a GAIN in coverage. There is no list of doctors that people are not allowed to see. And the middle class is more than some recluse fucking loser in a cabin somewhere in the mountains of Montana.

Conservatives are just plain worthless liars and dumbfucks.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Real talking ()
Date: November 01, 2013 11:58AM

Hmmmmmm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ExPat Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Conservatives warned us.
>
> No, conservatives as usual foamed at the mouth
> over utter nonsense. There are no death panels.
> There are no takeovers. An individual mandate is
> constitutional.
>

There is the Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB) which serves to develop guidelines for which services are available to participants in the program which will affect availability of treatments based on cost/value independent of doctor/patient considerations. Which for the same basic reasons is opposed by such "right wingers" as Howard Dean. But apparently you're too stupid to understand such things beyond the level of talking points so I won't try to explain further.


> Meanwhile, termination of a substandard policy by
> an insurance company will result in a GAIN in
> coverage. There is no list of doctors that people
> are not allowed to see. And the middle class is
> more than some recluse fucking loser in a cabin
> somewhere in the mountains of Montana.
>
> Conservatives are just plain worthless liars and
> dumbfucks.

Not if people can't afford to pay double the cost for the insurance. There are reasons why people buy "substandard" type insurance, much of which isn't actually substandard other than it doesn't match what someone else believes the standard should be. For one, they can't afford anything more. Making a "better" plan available to them at an even higher cost doesn't really help much even factoring in some nominal subsidies via tax credits.

In my own case, I choose to carry a higher deductible because that's the most cost-effective way to get better insurance in the event something does happen versus paying a lot more for a crappy policy with a lower deductible and guaranteeing that I'll incur the full cost even if nothing happens. But even though it makes more economic sense for most people, that approach doesn't match the "standard" that advocates of preventive health for the poor want so it's not permitted. Therefore, for the same cost, rather than 90/10 coverage and low co-pays, I'll pay more for a lousy 60/40 "Bronze" plan with higher out-of-pocket costs. And, no, I cannot keep my plan.

Your "list of doctors that people aren't allowed to see" is a completely disingenuous twisting of the fact that most all policies are restricted in terms of participating doctors/hospitals and that the act has caused the scope for most networks to become more restrictive.

The ACA wasn't done to help the "middle class." It is designed primarily to provide health coverage to the lower end and poor and those otherwise without insurance. For the most part, the middle class will pay more in order to subsidize them.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: ExPat ()
Date: November 01, 2013 01:19PM

"No, conservatives as usual foamed at the mouth over utter nonsense... .

... And the middle class is more than some recluse fucking loser in a cabin somewhere in the mountains of Montana.

Conservatives are just plain worthless liars and dumbfucks."

Did you just accuse someone else, besides yourself, of foaming at the mouth over utter nonsense. Yes, yes. I beleive you did. Facinating.

Blame the conservative for everything, and do so with a foul mouth. Sounds familiar. Here is a little parable for you, then:

"A woman in a hot air balloon realized she was lost. She lowered her altitude and spotted a man in a boat below. She shouted to him, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised a friend I would meet him an hour ago, but I don't know where I am."

The man consulted his portable GPS and replied, "You're in a hot air balloon, approximately 30 feet above ground elevation of 2,346 feet above sea level. You are at 31 degrees, 14.97 minutes north latitude and 100 degrees, 49.09 minutes west longitude.

She rolled her eyes and said, "You must be a Republican.

"I am," replied the man. "How did you know?"

"Well," answered the balloonist, "everything you told me is technically correct. But I have no idea what to do with your information, and I'm still lost. Frankly, you've not been much help to me."

The man smiled and responded, "You must be an Obama-Democrat."

"I am," replied the balloonist. "How did you know?"

"Well," said the man, "you don't know where you are -- or where you are going. You've risen to where you are, due to a large quantity of hot air. You made a promise you have no idea how to keep, and you expect me to solve your problem. You're in exactly the same position you were in before we met, but somehow, now it's my fault ! "

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Global Xing ()
Date: November 01, 2013 02:06PM

A.C.A. is really written as C.A.C.A. - the first "C" is silent.

Where is McToolius on this stunning 'suck cess' of Obamacare website? And calling it "just a website" is a euphemism - it's probably the world's biggest "IT" project at this point. I already got a discontinuation notice from my group insurance plan (effective new year). The fun of this new 'law' is yet to come and will make the website failures look like a picnic.

Those of you who voted for Obama, enjoy it! You got the government you deserved!

How's the fundamental transformation working out for Virginia? You feel transformed yet? Distributed? Transposed? Inverted? or just plained F'd ?

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Inquisitive One ()
Date: November 01, 2013 02:20PM

Hay Zeus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> McAullife is not interested in governing the
> commonwealth of Va, he is only interested in
> imposing the Democratic National Party platform at
> the state level which effectively will raise the
> cost of living via higher energy costs, raise
> taxes, provide safe haven for criminal illegal
> immigrants and encroach on 2nd amendment rights of
> law abiding citizens.


Very true point. Just off the cuff O'Mally in Maryland has imposed taxes on electricity (Montgomery County surcharge that was supposed to be short term-surprise still in effect), sewage for discouraging development, renewable energy tax for renewable portfolio standard on utilities, still to be imposed fee for off shore development. As a general rule, a democratic administration does not dislike any opportunity to increase taxes.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Just Wow ()
Date: November 01, 2013 02:32PM

This thread just confirms what most Americans already know. That conservatives are really stupid and scare quite easily.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Rachel Carson ()
Date: November 01, 2013 02:37PM

The insurance companies are using the ACA as a foil to raise rates. What will it be next year...dandelion pollen?

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Listen Folks ()
Date: November 02, 2013 04:27PM

So...from what we are reading the A.C.A. will be injurious financially to the middle class. Adding millions of uninjured or underinjured individuals to insurance roles had to cost plenty of money. The middle class will foot the bill! It does no good to blame the insurance companies. (No doubt the Democrats will do just that.) Use your vote to express your outrage. Vote Cuccinelli. He spoke out against the bill. Make your voice heard on Tuesday!

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: The Cooch heads to the chipper ()
Date: November 02, 2013 05:14PM

Listen Folks Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So...from what we are reading the A.C.A. will be
> injurious financially to the middle class. Adding
> millions of uninjured or underinjured individuals
> to insurance roles had to cost plenty of money.
> The middle class will foot the bill! It does no
> good to blame the insurance companies. (No doubt
> the Democrats will do just that.) Use your vote
> to express your outrage. Vote Cuccinelli. He
> spoke out against the bill. Make your voice
> heard on Tuesday!


You are clearly an idiot

It makes no sense to have un- or under-insured people who end up using the most expensive possible emergency or remedial care just because they haven't had access to cost-slashing preventative and chronic management care along the way.

The middle class already pay for the poor yet expensive care that the poor receive, mostly because the rich have had tax cut after tax cut.

Good healthcare for working and poor makes economic sense. The issue is that insurance and care providers have very weak incentives to manage the complexity and excess paperwork that leads to unnecessary costs.

If the republicans were serious about fixing healthcare, they'd have proposed something - but didn't, and they've blocked any reasonable change.

Cuccinelli is a far right, religious, misogynistic, ant-science fanatic who'll be consigned to the political waste bin where he belongs next week

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Time will tell ()
Date: November 02, 2013 05:30PM

The Cooch heads to the chipper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Listen Folks Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > So...from what we are reading the A.C.A. will
> be
> > injurious financially to the middle class.
> Adding
> > millions of uninjured or underinjured
> individuals
> > to insurance roles had to cost plenty of money.
>
> > The middle class will foot the bill! It does
> no
> > good to blame the insurance companies. (No
> doubt
> > the Democrats will do just that.) Use your
> vote
> > to express your outrage. Vote Cuccinelli. He
> > spoke out against the bill. Make your voice
> > heard on Tuesday!
>
>
> You are clearly an idiot
>
> It makes no sense to have un- or under-insured
> people who end up using the most expensive
> possible emergency or remedial care just because
> they haven't had access to cost-slashing
> preventative and chronic management care along the
> way.
>
> The middle class already pay for the poor yet
> expensive care that the poor receive, mostly
> because the rich have had tax cut after tax cut.
>
> Good healthcare for working and poor makes
> economic sense. The issue is that insurance and
> care providers have very weak incentives to manage
> the complexity and excess paperwork that leads to
> unnecessary costs.
>
> If the republicans were serious about fixing
> healthcare, they'd have proposed something - but
> didn't, and they've blocked any reasonable
> change.
>
> Cuccinelli is a far right, religious,
> misogynistic, ant-science fanatic who'll be
> consigned to the political waste bin where he
> belongs next week

We shall see. We shall also see what this ridiculous health care law costs in the long run. It is neither reasonable nor affordable.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Global Xing ()
Date: November 02, 2013 07:35PM

My group UHC Choice Plus PPO plan was not substandard, nevertheless it's getting cancelled effective new year's due to [C]ACA .

Why?


The heavy trolling of Obama/McTool zombies here is self evident.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Date: November 02, 2013 07:56PM

Wait till the rising unemployment forces more and more people out of full time jobs. When they see the "new improved" insurance offerings on the exchange that really don't fit their modest means, they will just pay the fine and stay out.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Global Xing ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:03PM

Then all the O'Bummer sycophants who thought they wanted [C]ACA will have to get 2 or 3 part-time jobs to 'compensate' for the full-time jobs they lost.

Dear Leader will just say 'this is not optimal' that you can't find a full-time job in the Brave New World of O'Care. He will tell you to 'Shop Around' and jet off to a golf game with his pals at a nominal cost to the Treasury of a couple hundred million $$$. He's soooo bored with all this [C]ACA -- can't you little people just stop complaining already?!?!?! He has more important things to focus on -- like am nasty for the illegal Vandal invaders or his 2nd Peace Prize or gay pet discrimination or whatever.




SicSemperTyrannis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wait till the rising unemployment forces more and
> more people out of full time jobs. When they see
> the "new improved" insurance offerings on the
> exchange that really don't fit their modest means,
> they will just pay the fine and stay out.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: The Cooch heads to the chipper ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:07PM

Global Xing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My group UHC Choice Plus PPO plan was not
> substandard, nevertheless it's getting cancelled
> effective new year's due to [C]ACA .
>
> Why?
>
>
> The heavy trolling of Obama/McTool zombies here is
> self evident.

Some employers are dropping PPO's and moving to high deductibles etc. This has nothing to do with the ACA - even if they use this as an excuse

The underlying reason for this is that they have been unable to manage the rise in costs because they have been unwilling to coordinate amongst themselves to better manage the rise in healthcare costs arising from the inefficient relationship between healthcare providers, insurers and management companies.

They have convinced themselves, incorrectly, that passing the responsibility to their employees will drive down costs. This is clearly stupid - companies employ experts to do the job of finding their way through the system, employees are unlikely to be more effective at driving down costs especially when there is so little price transparency.

The issue here is that the insurers have no long term stake in policy holders health and have strong short term incentives just to refuse and mess up reimbursement. Similarly providers have increasingly outsourced billing adding hugely to consumer complexity

ACA is not the problem - the market failure it starts to address is

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Global Xing ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:17PM

Dear Chipper Fodder:

The cancellation notice came from UHC, not my employer. My employer has extra headaches now scrambling to find new [C]ACA compliant policies along with a 40% premium increase.

If the goal was to create a competitive nation-wide insurance exchange, then they should let insurance companies compete accross state lines. And how is this different than having insurance brokers?

Us little people are getting fucked 7 ways to sunday in this government-insurance company collusion sandwich.





The Cooch heads to the chipper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Global Xing Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > My group UHC Choice Plus PPO plan was not
> > substandard, nevertheless it's getting
> cancelled
> > effective new year's due to [C]ACA .
> >
> > Why?
> >
> >
> > The heavy trolling of Obama/McTool zombies here
> is
> > self evident.
>
> Some employers are dropping PPO's and moving to
> high deductibles etc. This has nothing to do with
> the ACA - even if they use this as an excuse
>
> The underlying reason for this is that they have
> been unable to manage the rise in costs because
> they have been unwilling to coordinate amongst
> themselves to better manage the rise in healthcare
> costs arising from the inefficient relationship
> between healthcare providers, insurers and
> management companies.
>
> They have convinced themselves, incorrectly, that
> passing the responsibility to their employees will
> drive down costs. This is clearly stupid -
> companies employ experts to do the job of finding
> their way through the system, employees are
> unlikely to be more effective at driving down
> costs especially when there is so little price
> transparency.
>
> The issue here is that the insurers have no long
> term stake in policy holders health and have
> strong short term incentives just to refuse and
> mess up reimbursement. Similarly providers have
> increasingly outsourced billing adding hugely to
> consumer complexity
>
> ACA is not the problem - the market failure it
> starts to address is

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: A.C.A. costs
Date: November 02, 2013 08:20PM

Unless the government itself offered a low cost health plan
as an alternative against more scamming by companies, this system
is the worst of all worlds. People talk about how great the
health care is in European countries. We do not have that.
Instead we've just made a set of laws that enable companies
to jack up their rates on everyone.

That apparently is just "market forces". Half assed plans...
make the laws but don't enforce anti-gouging laws. After
a natural disaster the government has laws to prevent price
manipulation and hoarding. That is what is happening now, in effect.
Everybody is charging whatever they please because nobody
knows how this crappy system will work and there (once again)
is NO fucking oversight of the plans. Just like the shitty
web site.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2013 08:22PM by SicSemperTyrannis.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Actually, it is directly ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:23PM

The Cooch heads to the chipper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> ACA is not the problem - the market failure it
> starts to address is


“The Departments’ mid-range estimate is that 66 percent of small employer plans and 45 percent of large employer plans will relinquish their grandfather status by the end of 2013,” wrote the administration on page 34,552 of the Register. All in all, more than half of employer-sponsored plans will lose their “grandfather status” and become illegal. According to the Congressional Budget Office, 156 million Americans—more than half the population—was covered by employer-sponsored insurance in 2013.

Another 25 million people, according to the CBO, have “nongroup and other” forms of insurance; that is to say, they participate in the market for individually-purchased insurance. In this market, the administration projected that “40 to 67 percent” of individually-purchased plans would lose their Obamacare-sanctioned “grandfather status” and become illegal, solely due to the fact that there is a high turnover of participants and insurance arrangements in this market. (Plans purchased after March 23, 2010 do not benefit from the “grandfather” clause.) The real turnover rate would be higher, because plans can lose their grandfather status for a number of other reasons.

How many people are exposed to these problems? 60 percent of Americans have private-sector health insurance—precisely the number that Jay Carney dismissed. As to the number of people facing cancellations, 51 percent of the employer-based market plus 53.5 percent of the non-group market (the middle of the administration’s range) amounts to 93 million Americans.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Global Xing ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:28PM

Maybe their ultimate goal is a single insurance system -- i.e. put everyone on Medicare. This is Team-O's goal -- he mentioned it in '07 and that it would take 10 to 15 years to get to it in steps.

Or better yet, may be he would like to make all doctors, nurses, and hospitals government employees and property and pay them government wages.

And make private healthcare transactions illegal.

Everyone is entitled to healthcare, said Team-O/McToolius, they forgot to mention that it was going to be 'shitty'. There is only a certain amount of $$$ available to divide accross 310 million citizens and 50 million illegals or whatever. Divide equally, re-distribute for the common people, and you get what? Well, you can also just run the debt to infinity and hope other sovereign nations want to buy your t-bills.



SicSemperTyrannis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unless the government itself offered a low cost
> health plan
> as an alternative against more scamming by
> companies, this system
> is the worst of all worlds. People talk about how
> great the
> health care is in European countries. We do not
> have that.
> Instead we've just made a set of laws that enable
> companies
> to jack up their rates on everyone.
>
> That apparently is just "market forces". Half
> assed plans...
> make the laws but don't enforce anti-gouging laws.
> After
> a natural disaster the government has laws to
> prevent price
> manipulation and hoarding. That is what is
> happening now, in effect.
> Everybody is charging whatever they please
> because nobody
> knows how this crappy system will work and there
> (once again)
> is NO fucking oversight of the plans. Just like
> the shitty
> web site.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: He lied ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:37PM

Actually, it is directly Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Cooch heads to the chipper Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > ACA is not the problem - the market failure it
> > starts to address is
>
>
> “The Departments’ mid-range estimate is that
> 66 percent of small employer plans and 45 percent
> of large employer plans will relinquish their
> grandfather status by the end of 2013,” wrote
> the administration on page 34,552 of the Register.
> All in all, more than half of employer-sponsored
> plans will lose their “grandfather status” and
> become illegal. According to the Congressional
> Budget Office, 156 million Americans—more than
> half the population—was covered by
> employer-sponsored insurance in 2013.
>
> Another 25 million people, according to the CBO,
> have “nongroup and other” forms of insurance;
> that is to say, they participate in the market for
> individually-purchased insurance. In this market,
> the administration projected that “40 to 67
> percent” of individually-purchased plans would
> lose their Obamacare-sanctioned “grandfather
> status” and become illegal, solely due to the
> fact that there is a high turnover of participants
> and insurance arrangements in this market. (Plans
> purchased after March 23, 2010 do not benefit from
> the “grandfather” clause.) The real turnover
> rate would be higher, because plans can lose their
> grandfather status for a number of other reasons.
>
> How many people are exposed to these problems? 60
> percent of Americans have private-sector health
> insurance—precisely the number that Jay Carney
> dismissed. As to the number of people facing
> cancellations, 51 percent of the employer-based
> market plus 53.5 percent of the non-group market
> (the middle of the administration’s range)
> amounts to 93 million Americans.

Anyone who cannot admit that Obama lied is truly ignorant. He basically admitted so this week at his Umpteenth million "campaign rally" in Massachusetts. His lies are catching up with him.

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Re: A.C.A. costs
Posted by: Global Xing ()
Date: November 02, 2013 08:48PM

O'Bummer this week at a random campaign event in auto-pilot mode:

"...blah blah blah ... lie lie lie... And if you like your healthcare, There are a few bad apples. Just shop around. That's what the exchange is for"

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