NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Boosterthon is great! Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > For every 1 person that doesn't like
> Boosterthon
> > there are 100 or more that love it.
>
> Change the PTA standards, then.
> Oughtta be a slam-dunk.
> Let us know how it goes...?
>
> "And children should never
> be exploited or used as fundraisers."

> "The anticipation of a successful fundraising
> event should not cloud the judgment of the PTA or
> be exploited by those outside the PTA who may have
> something to gain privately."

> "Children should not be the primary means of
> soliciting within fundraising activities."
> http://www.pta.org/mobile/OCArticle.cfm?ItemNumber
> =4192
>
> Comments about chronic complainers are ad hominem
> comments.

Did you know it's dark outside? Thanks for your dumbass comment Captain Obvious!

complaining? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We'll see complaining when some parent feels their
> son has been unduly traumatized by threats of
> having to wear a dress and makeup.
>
> It is interesting that these pro-Boosterthon
> people never address specifics, they just talk
> about how great Boosterthon is and how it is
> expanding. Maybe it is not a coincidence that
> Scientology does the same thing. Scientology is
> certainly a cult and Boosterthon seems to incline
> in that direction.

I feel sorry for your kids.

And yes Boosterthon must be a cult...that's fooling principals and teachers all over the country. You're an idiot. Our school hasn't used Boosterthon but I'm smart enough not to compare them to a cult. Watch out!!!! The boosterzombies are brainwashing everyone. Aaaaahhhh! lol

I think it's funny how NewHorizon, aka John Koch (real name), and in other places Donald Harvey or "working daddy" and the list goes on just keeps repeating the same things in every comment section he can find in pro-Booster articles.

We can all play the "post the news article" game. But here, instead of reposting the same couple news articles over and over like you all are and repeating the same rhetoric over and over, because honestly you have nothing new, I'll post some pro-booster articles so you can stop claiming that it's just Boosterthon employees posting on this site. Our school used them and we LOVE Bosterthon!

http://www.blufftontoday.com/bluffton-news/2015-03-27/cross-schools-fun-run-raises-more-21k#.VTMOfi4xvwo

http://www.bradenton.com/2015/03/13/5687137/mcneal-students-boosterthon-raises.html

http://www.timesherald.com/general-news/20150216/elementary-students-in-limerick-run-laps-to-raise-money-for-their-school

Oh...and here's one that shows the Boosterthon team doesn't even have to be on campus or in class for the program to do well! http://www.enterprisenews.com/article/20150416/NEWS/150416811/12741/NEWS

I thought somebody calculated out that it costs the taxpayers $13.60 per hour per child to do Boosterthon during the school day. Is there any talk of recovering that from the PTA's or the salaries of the principals who allow this waste?

1) Develop a clear procedure for opting out of Boosterthon that does not involve missing real school activities.

2) Make Boosterthon "do its thing" off campus and outside of school hours.

3) Full disclosure of what is in their "lessons" and how their people are qualified to teach them (no more graduates of unaccredited schools or dropouts).

That would do it. But, the question is, is Dr. Garza smart enough to fix this problem, or is she going to let it fix her?

GhiiyRtEdgJoo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I thought somebody calculated out that it costs
> the taxpayers $13.60 per hour per child to do
> Boosterthon during the school day. Is there any
> talk of recovering that from the PTA's or the
> salaries of the principals who allow this waste?


Here we go with that argument again. Sheesh.

The entire program takes up 2 hours total over two weeks and doesn't cost $13.60 per child per hour. That math is way off. Let the kids have some fun.

a solution, at last! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 1) Develop a clear procedure for opting out of
> Boosterthon that does not involve missing real
> school activities.
>
> 2) Make Boosterthon "do its thing" off campus and
> outside of school hours.
>
> 3) Full disclosure of what is in their "lessons"
> and how their people are qualified to teach them
> (no more graduates of unaccredited schools or
> dropouts).
>
> That would do it. But, the question is, is Dr.
> Garza smart enough to fix this problem, or is she
> going to let it fix her?

Have any of you taken the time to go to your child's school while Boosterthon is there to watch one of the class lessons? Have you introduced yourself to the Boosterthon people to see what type of people they are? Have you asked your child's teacher, who sees them firsthand, what she thinks of the program?

And don't just answer this by posting quotes from other people. Did YOU go to the school, or are you just going off of what other people you can find on the internet said?

Round and Round Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> GhiiyRtEdgJoo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I thought somebody calculated out that it costs
> > the taxpayers $13.60 per hour per child to do
> > Boosterthon during the school day. Is there any
> > talk of recovering that from the PTA's or the
> > salaries of the principals who allow this
> waste?
>
>
> Here we go with that argument again. Sheesh.
>
> The entire program takes up 2 hours total over two
> weeks and doesn't cost $13.60 per child per hour.
> That math is way off. Let the kids have some fun.


It makes sense to me. Good solid math analysis. How do you figure that it does NOT cost that?

Hj8$)|{]|)$-;: Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Round and Round Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > GhiiyRtEdgJoo Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I thought somebody calculated out that it
> costs
> > > the taxpayers $13.60 per hour per child to do
> > > Boosterthon during the school day. Is there
> any
> > > talk of recovering that from the PTA's or the
> > > salaries of the principals who allow this
> > waste?
> >
> >
> > Here we go with that argument again. Sheesh.
> >
> > The entire program takes up 2 hours total over
> two
> > weeks and doesn't cost $13.60 per child per
> hour.
> > That math is way off. Let the kids have some
> fun.
>
>
> It makes sense to me. Good solid math analysis.
> How do you figure that it does NOT cost that?


It's just a skewed way of looking at it. Kids leave the classroom to eat lunch. The 10 minutes they spend per day going to and from the lunchroom equates to about 2 hours over two weeks. Going to and from recess, lunch, the bathroom, the library etc. add all that time up and by your math it's a waste of tens of thousands every two weeks. Why don't we have lunch, bathroom, recess, and library in the classroom instead of wasting tens of thousands of dollars walking. Then the kids could spend that time as instructional time instead of wasting it. Right? You know what, lunch should only be 5 minutes. Who needs longer to eat. Lunch is a waste of instructional time. So is recess. What do they learn while they're "playing". Let's do away with recess. Such a waste of instructional time.

It's ok for kids to have fun sometimes. School shouldn't be nazi camp like it sounds like you want it to be.

But lunch and recess are a required part of the school day and factored in.

Problem with fundraising during the school day is that once they start with it, there is no end to it. Where do you draw the line.

The line has already been drawn. Fundraisers are not supposed to interrupt the instructional program. That is a school regulation.

I personally do not find Boosterthon during the school day to be fun. I don't let my kids beg for money. So, they have to sit there and feel like they are left out.

but///////// Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But lunch and recess are a required part of the
> school day and factored in.


But why not have lunch and recess in the classroom so kids don't waste instructional time walking?

Extras like Boosterthon are also factored in. It falls under "programs". Assemblies are also factored in.

But the other persons post doesn't argue whether something is factored in or not. It just addresses waste of "$13.60 per hour per student" or whatever. If that's the case why not do everything in the classroom so you don't waste instructional time walking? You know why?...because if your child's school said they were going to start doing everything in the classroom so they don't waste instructional time walking you all would throw a fit. Because it doesn't really matter what they do, you'll complain anyways

GhiiyRtEdgJoo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I thought somebody calculated out that it costs
> the taxpayers $13.60 per hour per child to do
> Boosterthon during the school day. Is there any
> talk of recovering that from the PTA's or the
> salaries of the principals who allow this waste?

Recovering? Waste? You're missing the other half of the equation.
The students collect more than whatever the cost is.

And then if we convert even more school time (not just 2 hours) into fundraising time,
we can eventually get to the point where the kids fund their own K-6 education.
No more talk of underfunded schools!
This is a great life lesson for the kids - many of whom will need to face paying for their college education.

Hehzhdb Wrote:
> You know why?...because if your
> child's school said they were going to start doing
> everything in the classroom so they don't waste
> instructional time walking you all would throw a
> fit. Because it doesn't really matter what they
> do, you'll complain anyways

Precisely.

"And then if we convert even more school time (not just 2 hours) into fundraising time,
we can eventually get to the point where the kids fund their own K-6 education.
No more talk of underfunded schools!
This is a great life lesson for the kids - many of whom will need to face paying for their college education."

=========================
This is the problem. You have the kids raising money instead of doing their schoolwork. It just leads to more and more of it. Of course they would rather run and play and things instead of doing their work.
Fundraisers are not supposed to interrupt the instructional program. That also means that the instructional program is not supposed to be organized around fundraisers.

alskdjfhuwE Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "And then if we convert even more school time (not
> just 2 hours) into fundraising time,
> we can eventually get to the point where the kids
> fund their own K-6 education.
> No more talk of underfunded schools!
> This is a great life lesson for the kids - many
> of whom will need to face paying for their college
> education."
>
> =========================
> This is the problem. You have the kids raising
> money instead of doing their schoolwork. It just
> leads to more and more of it. Of course they would
> rather run and play and things instead of doing
> their work.
> Fundraisers are not supposed to interrupt the
> instructional program. That also means that the
> instructional program is not supposed to be
> organized around fundraisers.

Taking a half day for a fun run isn't a big deal. They have a ton of fun and it's exercise. No one is fundraising at school. Parents create the pledge page at home and ask for pledges or choose to get their kids involved by asking for pledges. Nothing wrong with that.

If you don't want to participate in the fundraiser you don't have to. All the other parents will so your child can benefit from the technology, field trips etc that's purchased from the proceeds. Things that benefit all kids. We'll take care of it..you just sit this one out. Oh and regardless of if you choose to participate in the fundraiser your kid will still get to participate in the character lessons, get a tshirt and run in the fun run so they don't feel left out. But if you're going to make that choice please pull out your check book and support your school and PTA that way. But I'm guessing none of you have done that either. And probably the same people that complain about a proposed tax increase when the school system needs more money.

Do you know why schools do fundraisers? Because when they do a check writing campaign barely anyone steps up. At least this fundraiser is all inclusive, healthy and has a positive message. But in the end you can't please everyone

I have already paid tons of taxes to support the school system and pay for the staff and infrastructure so that you get on your high horse and claim that taking what I have paid for and using it to fundraise instead of doing their schoolwork is OK.

Schools and other groups have done fundraisers for a long time and that won't change. I would much prefer this one over all others. I think the people on here are way overreacting and probably have never seen it in person as the other poster said. I noticed no one replied to "have any of you taken the time to go to your child's school while Boosterthon is there to watch one of the class lessons? Have you introduced yourself to the Boosterthon people to see what type of people they are? Have you asked your child's teacher, who sees them firsthand, what she thinks of the program?"

Scrambling for higher moral ground Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have already paid tons of taxes to support the
> school system and pay for the staff and
> infrastructure so that you get on your high horse
> and claim that taking what I have paid for and
> using it to fundraise instead of doing their
> schoolwork is OK.


And I probably pay more taxes than a lot of the people in this county. And I don't like seeing them going towards subsidizing fundraisers during the school day when they are supposed to be used to teach our kids. And I don't apologize for that.

Scrambling for higher moral ground Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have already paid tons of taxes to support the
> school system and pay for the staff and
> infrastructure so that you get on your high horse
> and claim that taking what I have paid for and
> using it to fundraise instead of doing their
> schoolwork is OK.


You're basing your argument on a skewed perspective of $13.60 per hour or whatever. Your logic is completely flawed. And they aren't fundraising at school so I think you're confused there. Have you actually gone to the school and seen in person in class what Boosterthon is doing? I'm going to guess no. You're reading a few posts on the Internet from other people who haven't gone up to the school either and using those posts as a basis to your argument. That's called mob mentality. So why don't you put down your torches and pitchfork and think for yourself. Go see it for yourself. Watch a class lesson, introduce yourself to the Boosterthon team and ask questions and ask your child's teacher what she thinks.

Or don't and just keep following the mob

and........ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Scrambling for higher moral ground Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I have already paid tons of taxes to support
> the
> > school system and pay for the staff and
> > infrastructure so that you get on your high
> horse
> > and claim that taking what I have paid for and
> > using it to fundraise instead of doing their
> > schoolwork is OK.
>
>
> And I probably pay more taxes than a lot of the
> people in this county. And I don't like seeing
> them going towards subsidizing fundraisers during
> the school day when they are supposed to be used
> to teach our kids. And I don't apologize for that.


What does the amount of taxes you pay have anything to do with it? You pay the same amount in relation to income that everyone else does. I'm glad you wanted to point out to the people on an online forum that you make a lot of money. You must be someone really special.

I pay more taxes (state, local, and federal) than some and I don't apologize for that. No I am not special. But, if I am told to shell out thousands of dollars a year for the school system then they need to do what they are required to do.

Scrambling Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I pay more taxes (state, local, and federal) than
> some and I don't apologize for that. No I am not
> special. But, if I am told to shell out thousands
> of dollars a year for the school system then they
> need to do what they are required to do.


So you pay more than "a lot of the people in this country", or just "some"? You sound like you're full of yourself.

If you don't like what the school system does, vote. Simple as that. Or spend Sunday complaining on an online forum all while pointing out how much more you pay than everyone else. You are so great and wonderful. Is that what you were looking for?

Go back to complaining about NewHorizon.

Seems like a scam to me. Boosterthon smells like Amway:

http://www.leescornerpta.org/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=354:boosterthon&catid=44:fundraising&Itemid=78

-------------------------------------------------
“We don’t have any rude, unpleasant people here. We’re different!”

Dane Bramage Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Seems like a scam to me. Boosterthon smells like
> Amway:
>
> http://www.leescornerpta.org/joomla/index.php?opti
> on=com_content&view=article&id=354:boosterthon&cat
> id=44:fundraising&Itemid=78


Add one more school to the list of schools Boosterthon serves!! Like I said, Boosterthon is growing because people like the program :)

I'm sure New Horizon is on the case already. Be sure to email the PTA person your usual garbage. She's already been told to expect it

Coming soon to a Barnes and Noble near you…Amway, with Chris Carneal and Brett Trapp of Boosterthon!

Bdhehdgeh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Like I said, Boosterthon is
> growing because people like the program :)

Nope, not growing and parents definitely don't like the program. It's only a matter of time before the company crashes and burns.
http://www.athleticbusiness.com/more-news/firm-s-48-percent-take-of-fun-run-proceeds-criticized.html

qwerty rulez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bdhehdgeh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Like I said, Boosterthon is
> > growing because people like the program :)
>
> Nope, not growing and parents definitely don't
> like the program. It's only a matter of time
> before the company crashes and burns.
> http://www.athleticbusiness.com/more-news/firm-s-4
> 8-percent-take-of-fun-run-proceeds-criticized.html

Your statement is not correct. Boosterthon is growing, has every year, and has been in business for over a decade. A business doesn't last that long if people don't like the product. No matter what there will always be a few people that don't like something but by far people support Boosterthon.

qwerty rulez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bdhehdgeh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Like I said, Boosterthon is
> > growing because people like the program :)
>
> Nope, not growing and parents definitely don't
> like the program. It's only a matter of time
> before the company crashes and burns.
> http://www.athleticbusiness.com/more-news/firm-s-4
> 8-percent-take-of-fun-run-proceeds-criticized.html


A quote from that article:

"Couvillion said there were some parent complaints, but not a huge number. She thought the complaints came in because the concept is so new, she said. And she said the experience engaged the student body.

"The kids were extremely proud of themselves," she said."

And the commenter on that article "Donald Harvey" is NewHorizon (John Koch) from this message board. "Donald Harvey" is saying verbatim the things NewHorizon says on this board. Making it appear as if there are more parent complaints on the Internet than what there really are. John Koch must have a lot of time on his hands if he has the time to post all over the Internet as if he's different people, just trying to stir up controversy.

What is the way that a PTA contract gets the Boosterthon people access to the school and kids?

This is Boosterthon getting tax paid resources for free. Much better than an Obamaphone if you happen to ask me.

And last what is the role of these trips to Atlanta?

I want to know! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What is the way that a PTA contract gets the


-------->The principal allows them in the door.


> Boosterthon people access to the school and kids?
>
> This is Boosterthon getting tax paid resources for
> free. Much better than an Obamaphone if you happen
> to ask me.

---------->Exactly. Which is why the PTA or the principal needa to write a check to the county to cover the overhead on these Fun(d) Runs.
>
> And last what is the role of these trips to
> Atlanta?

-----------> Don't have the answer to that one.

I want to know! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> And last what is the role of these trips to
> Atlanta?

I think those act in the same manner as the Rolex watch McDonnell was wearing. Or the $180K loan - wink, wink.

-------------------------------------------------
“We don’t have any rude, unpleasant people here. We’re different!”

I have seen it in person. I have met the young men who run it. Good group of guys. Great salesmen. In my opinion, Boosterthon is a joke. As the president of our PTO, I can not in good conscience ask families to give our school money knowing that less than 1/2 of what they donate will go to our projects and they get nothing in return. I don't care that everyone got a tshirt that will shrink and they will outgrow the following year. At least when we do run catalog sales, families actually receive a tangible product and we keep 40% of the sales.

How can I tell our parents that we collected $28,000 from our community (which is on 80% free/reduced lunch) and only got to keep less than $13,000 of it? It makes me sick to my stomach to think about it. We are blessed with a caring group of volunteers and staff, and we are going to try to go at it alone. I would much rather earn $5,000 knowing that we are keeping $5,000!

PTO MOM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How can I tell our parents that we collected
> $28,000 from our community (which is on 80%
> free/reduced lunch) and only got to keep less than
> $13,000 of it?

If your PTO has the desire to be open and transparent (if they don't, you've got a bigger problem than Boosterthon), then you might have success in proposing that the contributors are informed at the time they pledge about what percentage actually goes to the PTO/school. This could be accomplished by replacing Booster's pre-printed pitch that the kids use with your own.

You and I know this may result in negative feedback during the Boosterthon as the contributors are made aware. Not necessarily a bad thing.

If you're wanting your PTO to make a different choice altogether, you'll probably have an easier less difficult time of it if you propose viable alternatives. That's a far more time-consuming course of action for you - lots of Googling, etc - and perhaps all for naught. But if you're pissed off enough...

Maybe start with ideas from here: http://www.pta.org/mobile/OCArticle.cfm?ItemNumber=4192

creepy stuff Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You mean they go to lunch with the kids? This is
> weird. Why are they allowing fundraisers to lurk
> around the children and rope them in? "Mom-they
> ATE LUNCH with us. I have to get some pledges."
> God help us all.

Well it could be worse. Apex people, "high five the kids as they come to school in the morning and play with them on the playground at recess, lunch, and PE. They also high-five the kids as they leave school at the end of the day."
http://www.bizbuysell.com/Business-Opportunity/Apex-Fun-Run-Fundraiser-for-Elementary-Schools/1170651/

The Boosterthon people play with the kids too. Someday, Boosterthon's version of Laurence Einuis will go a little too far, that will be the end of Boosterthon.

http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/read/2/1849964.html

New Horizon (John Koch) has now taken to Facebook as "Donald Harvey" blasting Boosterthon on every school Facebook page he can find. Schools have already been notified and others PM'd with info of who this person really is and regarding his agenda.

John Koch should be rewarded. Boosterthon is evil, a waste of money, and a breeding ground for corruption.

PTA/PTO officers who have the power to sign up Boosterthon get "focus group trips" to Atlanta. No telling what really goes on down there, no one will talk about it, at all.

They sign up Boosterthon and some how the Boosterthon contract signed by the PTA/PTO gives them access to the schools. Principals lack the moral fiber to stand up to the PTA/PTO and Boosterthon. So, for the cost of a plane ticket and nice hotel room, Boosterthon gets to pillage our schools. Garza and McElveen won't comment, Atwater thinks the matter is closed, Lockard thinks Boosterthon is a great fundraiser. All of them need to go.

Give John Koch An Award Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> John Koch should be rewarded. Boosterthon is evil,
> a waste of money, and a breeding ground for
> corruption.
>
> PTA/PTO officers who have the power to sign up
> Boosterthon get "focus group trips" to Atlanta. No
> telling what really goes on down there, no one
> will talk about it, at all.
>
> They sign up Boosterthon and some how the
> Boosterthon contract signed by the PTA/PTO gives
> them access to the schools. Principals lack the
> moral fiber to stand up to the PTA/PTO and
> Boosterthon. So, for the cost of a plane ticket
> and nice hotel room, Boosterthon gets to pillage
> our schools. Garza and McElveen won't comment,
> Atwater thinks the matter is closed, Lockard
> thinks Boosterthon is a great fundraiser. All of
> them need to go.

You need to go. You just keep repeating the same things. Do you ever think maybe, just maybe, you're the one on the wrong side of the argument? The reason none of those people will comment and say the matter is closed is because you're just one of the many complainers they deal with daily complaining about this or that. You're all riled up about a fundraiser that most people really like. They have better things to do than listen to you and a couple of your friends complain. Eventually your kids will graduate and you'll go away.

Get a life Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> You need to go. You just keep repeating the same
> things. Do you ever think maybe, just maybe,
> you're the one on the wrong side of the argument?
> The reason none of those people will comment and
> say the matter is closed is because you're just
> one of the many complainers they deal with daily
> complaining about this or that. You're all riled
> up about a fundraiser that most people really
> like. They have better things to do than listen to
> you and a couple of your friends complain.
> Eventually your kids will graduate and you'll go
> away.

Just a guess, you either work for Boosterthon, or are otherwise financially enriched by the fundraisers.

C'mon, some transparency, please.

-------------------------------------------------
“We don’t have any rude, unpleasant people here. We’re different!”

Dane Bramage Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Get a life Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > You need to go. You just keep repeating the
> same
> > things. Do you ever think maybe, just maybe,
> > you're the one on the wrong side of the
> argument?
> > The reason none of those people will comment
> and
> > say the matter is closed is because you're just
> > one of the many complainers they deal with
> daily
> > complaining about this or that. You're all
> riled
> > up about a fundraiser that most people really
> > like. They have better things to do than listen
> to
> > you and a couple of your friends complain.
> > Eventually your kids will graduate and you'll
> go
> > away.
>
> Just a guess, you either work for Boosterthon, or
> are otherwise financially enriched by the
> fundraisers.
>
> C'mon, some transparency, please.

Nope. Just a parent that liked the fundraiser. I think you folks are way overreacting to the whole thing. Who are you?

Transparency Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > C'mon, some transparency, please.
>
> Nope. Just a parent that liked the fundraiser. I
> think you folks are way overreacting to the whole
> thing. Who are you?

Funny, there aren't any parents liking the fundraiser in my neighborhood, but have at it.

I'm someone who isn't giving half of a donation away to a for-profit company enriching their executives. I don't think shedding light on boosterthon is over reaction, it's what charity watchdogs do.

-------------------------------------------------
“We don’t have any rude, unpleasant people here. We’re different!”

Transparency Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Who are you?

Aaaaand we descend into a predictable circular back-and-forth.

Booster offers both positives and negatives - each affecting the children we ALL love and the contributors who care.

As for the negatives, IMO our kids and contributors don't deserve them.
(People just now looking in and unfamiliar with the negatives this - https://fundraisingaps.wordpress.com/parents-testimonials/ - is but a start.)

Meanwhile, disparaging remarks about individuals are to be expected on the internet - especially here at FFXU! :)
But they're still just ad hominems.

Dane Bramage Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Transparency Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > >
> > > C'mon, some transparency, please.
> >
> > Nope. Just a parent that liked the fundraiser.
> I
> > think you folks are way overreacting to the
> whole
> > thing. Who are you?
>
> Funny, there aren't any parents liking the
> fundraiser in my neighborhood, but have at it.
>
> I'm someone who isn't giving half of a donation
> away to a for-profit company enriching their
> executives. I don't think shedding light on
> boosterthon is over reaction, it's what charity
> watchdogs do.

All businesses have costs. Boosterthon pays for everything out of their %. Cookie dough takes 60% then buys cookie dough to give you. Boosterthon takes less than half and gives the kids an experience, plus tshirts, prizes, supplies, team member pay etc. like every other company in the world they have costs. The difference is, most of the costs are for things that go right back to the kids.

Boostertoon relies on easy access to the kids and school facilities. This happens, somehow, from the PTA contracts and consent of principals. Dr. Lockard has been asked about this and he refuses to answer. What is being hidden?

If Boosterthon had to have its own facilities for the run, it would cost them more. If they had to have express consent from every parent to involve their kid in the character sessions, there would be fewer kids and therefore less money.

Boosterthon gets a boost Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Boostertoon relies on easy access to the kids and
> school facilities. This happens, somehow, from the
> PTA contracts and consent of principals. Dr.
> Lockard has been asked about this and he refuses
> to answer. What is being hidden?
>
> If Boosterthon had to have its own facilities for
> the run, it would cost them more. If they had to
> have express consent from every parent to involve
> their kid in the character sessions, there would
> be fewer kids and therefore less money.

Nothing is being hidden! You're probably just annoying him by trying to create controversy where none exists. He has better things to do than to deal with your ridiculousness

Euruthdudb Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Boosterthon gets a boost Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Boostertoon relies on easy access to the kids
> and
> > school facilities. This happens, somehow, from
> the
> > PTA contracts and consent of principals. Dr.
> > Lockard has been asked about this and he
> refuses
> > to answer. What is being hidden?
> >
> > If Boosterthon had to have its own facilities
> for
> > the run, it would cost them more. If they had
> to
> > have express consent from every parent to
> involve
> > their kid in the character sessions, there
> would
> > be fewer kids and therefore less money.
>
> Nothing is being hidden! You're probably just
> annoying him by trying to create controversy where
> none exists. He has better things to do than to
> deal with your ridiculousness

If nothing is being hidden, why does he refuse to discuss the matter?

And, what does he have that's better to do, sign up for another conference in Orlando? Confer with Angela Atwater, Ed.D., on the latest peer review articles on deeming matters closed?

Orlando Travel Consultants LLC Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Euruthdudb Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Boosterthon gets a boost Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Boostertoon relies on easy access to the kids
> > and
> > > school facilities. This happens, somehow,
> from
> > the
> > > PTA contracts and consent of principals. Dr.
> > > Lockard has been asked about this and he
> > refuses
> > > to answer. What is being hidden?
> > >
> > > If Boosterthon had to have its own facilities
> > for
> > > the run, it would cost them more. If they had
> > to
> > > have express consent from every parent to
> > involve
> > > their kid in the character sessions, there
> > would
> > > be fewer kids and therefore less money.
> >
> > Nothing is being hidden! You're probably just
> > annoying him by trying to create controversy
> where
> > none exists. He has better things to do than to
> > deal with your ridiculousness
>
> If nothing is being hidden, why does he refuse to
> discuss the matter?
>
> And, what does he have that's better to do, sign
> up for another conference in Orlando? Confer with
> Angela Atwater, Ed.D., on the latest peer review
> articles on deeming matters closed?


He refuses to discuss it because he already has and you weren't satisfied with the answer. It's a school fundraiser, that's it. Not some grand conspiracy and if he and the others continue to waste their time discussing it you'll just continue beating the same dead horse. The subject, and you, are a waste of their time

It wasn't a school fundraiser for many of them. It was a Pta or PTO fundraiser. There is a big difference.
I agree whover this is has lost their allure with their tactics. I think their energy could be used far more productively on telling the school system how messed up the draft of their new fundraising regulation is, because it is a disaster.

4346895312479 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It wasn't a school fundraiser for many of them. It
> was a Pta or PTO fundraiser. There is a big
> difference.
> I agree whover this is has lost their allure with
> their tactics. I think their energy could be used
> far more productively on telling the school system
> how messed up the draft of their new fundraising
> regulation is, because it is a disaster.


Explain, please, how it is that a PTA/PTO contract can provide access to schools and students, especially when those aren't controlled by the PTA/PTO? It has beed admitted that principals provide a verbal OK for this to happen.Therefore, the schools are taking at least partial ownership.

Yes, the new fundraising regulations are a disaster.

All of this slander about boosterthon is crazy. How many of you have participated in fundraising before? When a service and/or product is provided in any fundraiser there are costs associated with the product and costs associated with the business associated with that product. You think it's great to have your kids knocking on stranger's doors to sell gift wrap, cookie dough, magazines or other items that no one wants and no student enjoys doing? Is this teaching or benefiting our kids other than the money? These fun runs leave the school with a lot more money per dollar raised than 90% of other fundraising stuff. The kids are physically active and there really is a positive message being taught.
Fundraising for a cause (like a school) doesn't have to be just selling junk, it can be fun and it can be more financially rewarding to the school- these are good things. Fundraising is part of our society, embrace it and be positive. Research fundraising - click here: https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=8195#.VUUVU_lViko and maybe you'll learn something. Fundraising is time consuming and expensive. Naturally if we all just raised our taxes to a level the didn't require schools to fundraise, we would not be having this discussion. Stop complaining and help fundraise, in any manner you want- but just get of your computer and do something positive for our children.

R U Kidding me? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All of this slander about boosterthon is crazy.
> How many of you have participated in fundraising
> before? When a service and/or product is provided
> in any fundraiser there are costs associated with
> the product and costs associated with the business
> associated with that product. You think it's
> great to have your kids knocking on stranger's
> doors to sell gift wrap, cookie dough, magazines
> or other items that no one wants and no student
> enjoys doing? Is this teaching or benefiting our
> kids other than the money? These fun runs leave
> the school with a lot more money per dollar raised
> than 90% of other fundraising stuff. The kids are
> physically active and there really is a positive
> message being taught.
> Fundraising for a cause (like a school) doesn't
> have to be just selling junk, it can be fun and it
> can be more financially rewarding to the school-
> these are good things. Fundraising is part of our
> society, embrace it and be positive. Research
> fundraising - click here:
> https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=sea
> rch.summary&orgid=8195#.VUUVU_lViko and maybe
> you'll learn something. Fundraising is time
> consuming and expensive. Naturally if we all just
> raised our taxes to a level the didn't require
> schools to fundraise, we would not be having this
> discussion. Stop complaining and help fundraise,
> in any manner you want- but just get of your
> computer and do something positive for our
> children.

Where's the slander? People are asking questions that are not being answered.

If taxes were raised to the level where schools did not have to fundraise, taxes would equal your income. FCPS is out of control. Let them take some of the responsibility for things.

If you want to pay extra money, the County will take it. Most of the residents feel that they are overtaxed, and half of the tax money goes to the schools. The schools, as we all know, are spending money on instructional coaches, trips to Orlando, and unqualified consultants.

Angela the Attorney
>
> Explain, please, how it is that a PTA/PTO contract
> can provide access to schools and students,
> especially when those aren't controlled by the
> PTA/PTO? It has beed admitted that principals
> provide a verbal OK for this to happen.Therefore,
> the schools are taking at least partial
> ownership.

That was pointed this out pages and pages ago. These people are only allowed in the door during the school day because the principal says it is OK. How can you say it is OK when you don't even hold the active contract with them? A group of volunteers does. There is no intelligent explanation for this. There is no definition of this type of ownership anywhere in the school regulations. It sounds like they initially said the parent groups were doing this under the community use regulation. But, that only applies to things that are outside of school hours, because, guess what? The school system retains all the liability for what happens during the school day and to continue doing things like this is a recipe for a liability nightmare. If anything went wrong during the event the school system would try to make the parent group assume the liability, when in all actuality, they hold the ultimate responsibility for who gets in the front door during the school day and deals with the children. This is crap.
>
> Yes, the new fundraising regulations are a
> disaster.

Yes. There are still major conflicts between the 1370, the 5810, the audit, and the RM-34. The idea of volunteers fundraising "on behalf" of a school and then putting the money into their own bank account is ludicrous. You have no guarantee it will ever get to the school. Trying to track this is crazy. You fundraise under the name of whoevers bank account the money is going into. You can tell people you want to do this or that, but it could all be empty promises.

The idea of taking hours that we pay for that are supposed to be used for instructional purposes and use them to raise funds is nuts.

R U Kidding me? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm...

Speaking of which:
"Charity Navigator holds that outside fundraising firms should get no more than 25 percent of the money they raise..."

http://www.richmond.com/news/local/education/article_f4ba1b6d-ced8-5966-8755-3a188648e2ad.html

To solve only the overhead issue, a PTA/O can buy Boosterthon supplies at http://herosteps.com (still overpriced, but whatever), a local run club can probably be found put on the run event itself, and school counselors are qualified to present quality character-building lessons. If you give the counselors a cut of the savings in overhead, they can probably do a bang-up job.

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> R U Kidding me? Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm...
>
> Speaking of which:
> "Charity Navigator holds
> that outside fundraising firms should get no more
> than 25 percent of the money they
> raise..."
>
> http://www.richmond.com/news/local/education/artic
> le_f4ba1b6d-ced8-5966-8755-3a188648e2ad.html
>
> To solve only the overhead issue, a PTA/O
> can buy Boosterthon supplies at
> http://herosteps.com (still overpriced, but
> whatever), a local run club can probably be found
> put on the run event itself, and school counselors
> are qualified to present quality
> character-building lessons. If you give the
> counselors a cut of the savings in overhead, they
> can probably do a bang-up job.

The Boosterthon materials are part of the problem. That's how Boosterthon gets away with saying they are a leadership teaching organization. There has been no proper review of these materials. Buying them from Boosterthon (Herosteps, whatever) helps but does not get to the root cause of the problem. Continued use of these materials reinforces the right wing, evangelical, fraternity ideology of this questionable company.

Castigator of Koch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NewHorizon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > R U Kidding me? Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm...
> >
> > Speaking of which:
> > "Charity Navigator holds
> > that outside fundraising firms should get no
> more
> > than 25 percent of the money they
> > raise..."
> >
> >
> http://www.richmond.com/news/local/education/artic
>
> > le_f4ba1b6d-ced8-5966-8755-3a188648e2ad.html
> >
> > To solve only the overhead issue, a
> PTA/O
> > can buy Boosterthon supplies at
> > http://herosteps.com (still overpriced, but
> > whatever), a local run club can probably be
> found
> > put on the run event itself, and school
> counselors
> > are qualified to present quality
> > character-building lessons. If you give the
> > counselors a cut of the savings in overhead,
> they
> > can probably do a bang-up job.
>
> The Boosterthon materials are part of the problem.
> That's how Boosterthon gets away with saying they
> are a leadership teaching organization. There has
> been no proper review of these materials. Buying
> them from Boosterthon (Herosteps, whatever) helps
> but does not get to the root cause of the problem.
> Continued use of these materials reinforces the
> right wing, evangelical, fraternity ideology of
> this questionable company.

The people posting on here are all utterly insane. And you wonder why the people you've gone to just ignore you. It's a fundraiser that it. Get a life

Quite a few Virginia parents NOT IN SUPPORT OF Boosterthon active in this thread here:



http://www.topix.com/forum/city/alpharetta-ga/TVBT0QPP6DL4FM3BN/p28

Virginia Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Quite a few Virginia parents NOT IN SUPPORT OF
> Boosterthon active in this thread here:
>
>
>
> http://www.topix.com/forum/city/alpharetta-ga/TVBT
> 0QPP6DL4FM3BN/p28


So they calculated out 3.3 hours of lost instructional time for this? That is up from the 2 hour estimate. 700 kids X $13.60 per hour X 3.3 hours= $31,416 of overhead for this thing in this area. Per school. Our taxes at work. 1,000 kids is $44,880.

"So they calculated out 3.3 hours of lost instructional time for this? That is up from the 2 hour estimate. 700 kids X $13.60 per hour X 3.3 hours= $31,416 of overhead for this thing in this area. Per school. Our taxes at work. 1,000 kids is $44,880."

If Dr. Garza disagrees with the nature of this analysis, let her explain what's happening. Even at the lower hour figure, this is out of line.

I stand behind my calculations. Just how can you explain this away???????

Can anybody post a copy of the full-color Booster pledge card that the kids take home?
I neglected to hang on to a copy earlier. TIA.

Does the Boosterthon Fun Run detract from school time?

The Boosterthon Fun Run exists to positively impact students by enhancing and improving America’s schools. The average student spends about 1300 hours a year in school. The three parts of the Boosterthon Fun Run—pep rally, team huddle days, kickoff—combine to last about two hours. Of that two hours, about 75% of that time is spent emphasizing character or fitness. That leaves about 30 minutes, stretched over 9 days, spent on the fundraising component. That means that a school can accomplish most/all of its annual fundraising using .0004% of the school year! This is a tiny amount of time compared to the lasting benefits students receive from Boosterthon Fun Run funds–funds that provide new computers, sports equipment, art supplies, field trips, books, classroom resources and much more.

Doesn't take up much time Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does the Boosterthon Fun Run detract from school
> time? ...

Source: http://www.boosterthon.com/about-us/faq/

Straight from the Boosterthon site:

"Where do you get so much energy from?

This is the most common question asked of our team, and we love it! Boosterthon Fun Run team members endure a rigorous application, background check, and hiring process. We carefully select each one to ensure that they are the right fit to work with students. The primary non-negotiable for a prospective team member is that they have a track record of integrity. After that, we look for someone who is positive, enthusiastic, and encouraging. Our team members are excited about impacting students and we love it when our friends on campus notice!"

Note that the question was about energy. Somehow the answer addresses integrity.

In most school systems, that would get a failing grade.

I've got to ask, how much integrity can a guy have who took 5 years to get a degree in English? His "excuse" was that he was heavily involved in the Alpha Tau Omega fraternity.

Who is this person? None other than Brett Trapp, Boosterthon VP for "Client Experience" (whatever that means) and spokesperson.

Fraternity. Integrity. Somehow those don't go together. What did one fraternity sign say? "no means yes, yes means anal" now that's integrity for you. Just the people we want teaching our kids character.

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Doesn't take up much time Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Does the Boosterthon Fun Run detract from
> school
> > time? ...
>
> Source: http://www.boosterthon.com/about-us/faq/

Thanks for quoting the source. I thought it was a well worded explanation and that's where I got the info from, and it's true.

Integrity = Energy? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Straight from the Boosterthon site:
>
> "Where do you get so much energy from?
>
> This is the most common question asked of our
> team, and we love it! Boosterthon Fun Run team
> members endure a rigorous application, background
> check, and hiring process. We carefully select
> each one to ensure that they are the right fit to
> work with students. The primary non-negotiable for
> a prospective team member is that they have a
> track record of integrity. After that, we look for
> someone who is positive, enthusiastic, and
> encouraging. Our team members are excited about
> impacting students and we love it when our friends
> on campus notice!"
>
> Note that the question was about energy. Somehow
> the answer addresses integrity.
>
> In most school systems, that would get a failing
> grade.
>
> I've got to ask, how much integrity can a guy have
> who took 5 years to get a degree in English? His
> "excuse" was that he was heavily involved in the
> Alpha Tau Omega fraternity.
>
> Who is this person? None other than Brett Trapp,
> Boosterthon VP for "Client Experience" (whatever
> that means) and spokesperson.
>
> Fraternity. Integrity. Somehow those don't go
> together. What did one fraternity sign say? "no
> means yes, yes means anal" now that's integrity
> for you. Just the people we want teaching our kids
> character.

You are an absolute moron

Question: "Do you support Boosterthon?"

If the answer is anything but "no" then the person is a moron. Only a moron supports that shoddy mix of hucksterism, homespun theology, and Animal House ethics.

Simple Moron Test Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Question: "Do you support Boosterthon?"
>
> If the answer is anything but "no" then the person
> is a moron. Only a moron supports that shoddy mix
> of hucksterism, homespun theology, and Animal
> House ethics.

You have no facts to support your statements, so they are moronic statements.

Simpler moron test Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Simple Moron Test Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Question: "Do you support Boosterthon?"
> >
> > If the answer is anything but "no" then the
> person
> > is a moron. Only a moron supports that shoddy
> mix
> > of hucksterism, homespun theology, and Animal
> > House ethics.
>
> You have no facts to support your statements, so
> they are moronic statements.


hucksterism: cheap Boosterthon prizes, lack of transparency, staff not qualified to teach, refusal to discuss basis of so-called character lessons.

homespun theology: Chris Carneal's "Change the World Foundation" is an evangelical organization, he has admitted both it and Boosterthon are run according to the same principles.

Animal House ethics: already stated, but, how about trips to Atlanta for school board members?

If you don't like the facts, go somewhere else.

Doesn't take up much time Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NewHorizon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Doesn't take up much time Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Does the Boosterthon Fun Run detract from
> > school
> > > time? ...
> >
> > Source:
> http://www.boosterthon.com/about-us/faq/
>
> Thanks for quoting the source. I thought it was a
> well worded explanation and that's where I got the
> info from, and it's true.

Also true: the Virginia PTA Local Unit Resource Guide, in its section on fundraising, reads,
"The regular school day schedule should not be disrupted, nor should the children be expected to give up their free time."
http://www.vapta.org/new-unit-document-package/doc_download/2345-section-04-financial-management.html (PDF)

I imagine they put that in there for a reason...

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Doesn't take up much time Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > NewHorizon Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Doesn't take up much time Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Does the Boosterthon Fun Run detract from
> > > school
> > > > time? ...
> > >
> > > Source:
> > http://www.boosterthon.com/about-us/faq/
> >
> > Thanks for quoting the source. I thought it was
> a
> > well worded explanation and that's where I got
> the
> > info from, and it's true.
>
> Also true: the Virginia PTA Local Unit Resource
> Guide, in its section on fundraising, reads,
> "The regular school day
> schedule should not be disrupted, nor should the
> children be expected to give up their free
> time."
> http://www.vapta.org/new-unit-document-package/doc
> _download/2345-section-04-financial-management.htm
> l (PDF)
>
> I imagine they put that in there for a reason...

You're misinterpreting the meaning of that. Just like you were misinterpreting, and misrepresenting, National PTA standards. Nat PTA basically told you to go away because of that. VA PTA is next...

Boosterthon supporters = Morons Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Simpler moron test Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Simple Moron Test Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Question: "Do you support Boosterthon?"
> > >
> > > If the answer is anything but "no" then the
> > person
> > > is a moron. Only a moron supports that shoddy
> > mix
> > > of hucksterism, homespun theology, and Animal
> > > House ethics.
> >
> > You have no facts to support your statements,
> so
> > they are moronic statements.
>
>
> hucksterism: cheap Boosterthon prizes, lack of
> transparency, staff not qualified to teach,
> refusal to discuss basis of so-called character
> lessons.
>
> homespun theology: Chris Carneal's "Change the
> World Foundation" is an evangelical organization,
> he has admitted both it and Boosterthon are run
> according to the same principles.
>
> Animal House ethics: already stated, but, how
> about trips to Atlanta for school board members?
>
> If you don't like the facts, go somewhere else.

Here are the facts:

Prizes are always inexpensive items. Fundraisers aren't toy stores. If you want nice toys go to Toys R Us and buy toys. Inexpensive prizes means more money goes back to the school. If the fundraising company had fancy prizes and therefore had to take a higher % of the funds to cover the increased cost you would complain about that.

How is Boosterthon lacking in transparency? I think you're pointing the finger in the wrong direction on that one.

Who said anyone that teaches needs a teaching degree? School teachers do but there are plenty of people that are trained to teach plenty of things, that don't hold a teaching degree. The character lessons are more of a positive message, and promoting a positive message doesn't require and shouldn't require a teaching degree.

In regards to your Change the World comment. Yes, it and Boosterthon are run on the same principles. Things like helping others, encouraging your friends, doing good things for your community and helping those less fortunate than you. Those are in no way bad messages and yet you are trying to put a negative connotation on that. The world actually needs more of that, not less.

Regarding the "animal house ethics" comment you made. That one doesn't even deserve a response because you're really reaching there and you have no facts to back up your comment. Plenty of well known and very well respected people have belonged to fraternities and every once in a while a frat house does something questionable. That doesn't make every member that's ever belonged to that frat a bad person.

The trips to Atlanta are a small group of people and the purpose of those trips is to have a think tank of educators, parents and school employees to help develop the following years character theme and lessons. That kind of input is actually a good thing and help ensures that the lessons stay current and relevant.

You are way off Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Boosterthon supporters = Morons Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Simpler moron test Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Simple Moron Test Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Question: "Do you support Boosterthon?"
> > > >
> > > > If the answer is anything but "no" then the
> > > person
> > > > is a moron. Only a moron supports that
> shoddy
> > > mix
> > > > of hucksterism, homespun theology, and
> Animal
> > > > House ethics.
> > >
> > > You have no facts to support your statements,
> > so
> > > they are moronic statements.
> >
> >
> > hucksterism: cheap Boosterthon prizes, lack of
> > transparency, staff not qualified to teach,
> > refusal to discuss basis of so-called character
> > lessons.
> >
> > homespun theology: Chris Carneal's "Change the
> > World Foundation" is an evangelical
> organization,
> > he has admitted both it and Boosterthon are run
> > according to the same principles.
> >
> > Animal House ethics: already stated, but, how
> > about trips to Atlanta for school board
> members?
> >
> > If you don't like the facts, go somewhere else.
>
> Here are the facts:
>
> Prizes are always inexpensive items. Fundraisers
> aren't toy stores. If you want nice toys go to
> Toys R Us and buy toys. Inexpensive prizes means
> more money goes back to the school. If the
> fundraising company had fancy prizes and therefore
> had to take a higher % of the funds to cover the
> increased cost you would complain about that.
>
> How is Boosterthon lacking in transparency? I
> think you're pointing the finger in the wrong
> direction on that one.
>
> Who said anyone that teaches needs a teaching
> degree? School teachers do but there are plenty of
> people that are trained to teach plenty of things,
> that don't hold a teaching degree. The character
> lessons are more of a positive message, and
> promoting a positive message doesn't require and
> shouldn't require a teaching degree.
>
> In regards to your Change the World comment. Yes,
> it and Boosterthon are run on the same principles.
> Things like helping others, encouraging your
> friends, doing good things for your community and
> helping those less fortunate than you. Those are
> in no way bad messages and yet you are trying to
> put a negative connotation on that. The world
> actually needs more of that, not less.
>
> Regarding the "animal house ethics" comment you
> made. That one doesn't even deserve a response
> because you're really reaching there and you have
> no facts to back up your comment. Plenty of well
> known and very well respected people have belonged
> to fraternities and every once in a while a frat
> house does something questionable. That doesn't
> make every member that's ever belonged to that
> frat a bad person.
>
> The trips to Atlanta are a small group of people
> and the purpose of those trips is to have a think
> tank of educators, parents and school employees to
> help develop the following years character theme
> and lessons. That kind of input is actually a good
> thing and help ensures that the lessons stay
> current and relevant.

How many educators attend these so-called think tanks? Who pays for their travel?

Do these so-called think tanks publish their results, or does Boosterthon just crank out the same old stuff every year, with a few changes?

Whoever wrote this stuff is either a Boosterthon insider or has a very good imagination. It is probably time for a FOIA request on travel to Atlanta.

FCPS will have serious problems if it turns out school employees are getting paid to go to these things, or if their travel is covered.

think tank? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are way off Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Boosterthon supporters = Morons Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Simpler moron test Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Simple Moron Test Wrote:
> > > >
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > >
> > > > -----
> > > > > Question: "Do you support Boosterthon?"
> > > > >
> > > > > If the answer is anything but "no" then
> the
> > > > person
> > > > > is a moron. Only a moron supports that
> > shoddy
> > > > mix
> > > > > of hucksterism, homespun theology, and
> > Animal
> > > > > House ethics.
> > > >
> > > > You have no facts to support your
> statements,
> > > so
> > > > they are moronic statements.
> > >
> > >
> > > hucksterism: cheap Boosterthon prizes, lack
> of
> > > transparency, staff not qualified to teach,
> > > refusal to discuss basis of so-called
> character
> > > lessons.
> > >
> > > homespun theology: Chris Carneal's "Change
> the
> > > World Foundation" is an evangelical
> > organization,
> > > he has admitted both it and Boosterthon are
> run
> > > according to the same principles.
> > >
> > > Animal House ethics: already stated, but, how
> > > about trips to Atlanta for school board
> > members?
> > >
> > > If you don't like the facts, go somewhere
> else.
> >
> > Here are the facts:
> >
> > Prizes are always inexpensive items.
> Fundraisers
> > aren't toy stores. If you want nice toys go to
> > Toys R Us and buy toys. Inexpensive prizes
> means
> > more money goes back to the school. If the
> > fundraising company had fancy prizes and
> therefore
> > had to take a higher % of the funds to cover
> the
> > increased cost you would complain about that.
> >
> > How is Boosterthon lacking in transparency? I
> > think you're pointing the finger in the wrong
> > direction on that one.
> >
> > Who said anyone that teaches needs a teaching
> > degree? School teachers do but there are plenty
> of
> > people that are trained to teach plenty of
> things,
> > that don't hold a teaching degree. The
> character
> > lessons are more of a positive message, and
> > promoting a positive message doesn't require
> and
> > shouldn't require a teaching degree.
> >
> > In regards to your Change the World comment.
> Yes,
> > it and Boosterthon are run on the same
> principles.
> > Things like helping others, encouraging your
> > friends, doing good things for your community
> and
> > helping those less fortunate than you. Those
> are
> > in no way bad messages and yet you are trying
> to
> > put a negative connotation on that. The world
> > actually needs more of that, not less.
> >
> > Regarding the "animal house ethics" comment you
> > made. That one doesn't even deserve a response
> > because you're really reaching there and you
> have
> > no facts to back up your comment. Plenty of
> well
> > known and very well respected people have
> belonged
> > to fraternities and every once in a while a
> frat
> > house does something questionable. That doesn't
> > make every member that's ever belonged to that
> > frat a bad person.
> >
> > The trips to Atlanta are a small group of
> people
> > and the purpose of those trips is to have a
> think
> > tank of educators, parents and school employees
> to
> > help develop the following years character
> theme
> > and lessons. That kind of input is actually a
> good
> > thing and help ensures that the lessons stay
> > current and relevant.
>
> How many educators attend these so-called think
> tanks? Who pays for their travel?
>
> Do these so-called think tanks publish their
> results, or does Boosterthon just crank out the
> same old stuff every year, with a few changes?
>
> Whoever wrote this stuff is either a Boosterthon
> insider or has a very good imagination. It is
> probably time for a FOIA request on travel to
> Atlanta.
>
> FCPS will have serious problems if it turns out
> school employees are getting paid to go to these
> things, or if their travel is covered.

About 40 people nationwide attend the think tank. Travel is paid for by Boosterthon. It's a 3 day trip done when school is not in session.

The think tank is basically an input session. "What character lesson topics would you like to see?". "Do you think these ideas cover relevant issues?". That sort of stuff. The best people to ask for input are parents, educators, and counsellors. Believe it or not there is actually research done and input included when developing the next years curriculum.

Lots of companies consult with different people when it comes to their products. It's how you ensure you have the best product.

If what's said here is true, then it should not be difficult to get information on these sessions and their work product?

The paradox, though is that apart from furtive references to the trips to Atlanta as "focus groups" this is not much discussed-certainly not on the Boosterthon website.

One has to wonder how, if at all, Mr. Carneal and Mr. Trapp would respond to an inquiry for information on this?

I guess somebody misrepresented somewhere along the line about what a "focus group" is...
"...Boosterthon invited a couple of the board members to an all-expense trip to Atlanta to learn more about Boosterthon’s plans for 2014 on from Jan 26-28th (Sunday afternoon-Tuesday afternoon)."
http://stenwoodpta.org/Portals/0/DocumentsSecure/ExecBoard/Meeting/January%202014%20Stenwood%20PTA%20Executive%20Board%20Meeting%20Final%20Minutes.pdf

an absolute certainty/paradox Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If what's said here is true, then it should not be
> difficult to get information on these sessions and
> their work product?
>
> The paradox, though is that apart from furtive
> references to the trips to Atlanta as "focus
> groups" this is not much discussed-certainly not
> on the Boosterthon website.
>
> One has to wonder how, if at all, Mr. Carneal and
> Mr. Trapp would respond to an inquiry for
> information on this?

The sessions are part of lesson planning and product offering design. Boosterthon is a private company, not a government agency. They have no obligation to discuss with you or send you information on their processes. A private company's processes are proprietary and give them a competitive advantage. Call up Walmart, Best Buy etc and ask them to discuss with you and send you info about their proprietary processes and let me know what answer they give you.

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I guess somebody misrepresented somewhere along
> the line about what a "focus group" is...
> "...Boosterthon invited a
> couple of the board members to an all-expense trip
> to Atlanta to learn more about Boosterthon’s
> plans for 2014 on from Jan 26-28th (Sunday
> afternoon-Tuesday afternoon)."
> http://stenwoodpta.org/Portals/0/DocumentsSecure/E
> xecBoard/Meeting/January%202014%20Stenwood%20PTA%2
> 0Executive%20Board%20Meeting%20Final%20Minutes.pdf

That was pertaining to this, which is the think tank I mentioned:

http://www.boosterthon.com/2014/02/boosterthons-all-time-favorite-question-to-answer/

If I don't like what Best Buy does, I don't have to shop there.

As a Fairfax taxpayer, I am kind of stuck with Boosterthon. To me, these "all expenses paid" trips to Atlanta seem suspicious. If school employees or elected officials are going, then that's a problem.

Don't forget, FCPS has entered into a contract with Boosterthon, so the door to disclosure has been opened. If that door closes, what will that say about Boosterthon. What could they be trying to hide?

You're being unreasonable Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> company, not a government agency. They have no
> obligation to discuss with you or send you
> information on their processes.

They should stay away from our kids if so intent on hiding information. Pretty shady company.

-------------------------------------------------
“We don’t have any rude, unpleasant people here. We’re different!”

Shady is Boosterthon on their best day.

What are they hiding? Angela Atwater says the matter is closed. Steve Lockard refuses to take questions.

Fun questions for school board campaign sessions.

And you wonder why the people at FCPS wont discuss the matter with you all anymore. It's not because they're hiding anything. It's because you are never satisfied with any answer they give you. And that's obvious from reading the posts on here. Someone gives you an answer and you twist it around like its some grand conspiracy. People at FCPS have stopped wasting their time with you, National PTA have stopped wasting their time with you, people at Boosterthon are done wasting their time with you. Everyone from all those places has tried to answer your questions but it's useless because you just continue twisting every answer you get so you can keep fanning the flames of this discussion because you obviously have nothing better to do with your lives.

I'm done with you people.

Someone is trying to make it look like FCPS has answered questions about Boosterthon. This is not the case.

For example, a copy of the Boosterthon contract with FCPS was sent, along with questions, to a school board member. This was referred to Dr. Lockard for action.

Dr. Lockard responded, but admitted that not all of the questions would be answered.

That's what's really going on here, selective responses. FCPS does not want to admit that the "character lessons" from Boosterthon are crap, that Boosterthon eats up school time, and that there are serious questions about the backgrounds of some of the Boosterthon people.

Instead of addressing these issues, Lockard, a career bureaucrat, simply refuses to engage them.

They are trying to use the "asked and answered" approach, but the truth is "asked" (yes) but "answered" (no).

Small wonder Gatehouse and Government Center will be very different places come November.

For example, a copy of the Boosterthon contract with FCPS was sent, along with questions, to a school board member. This was referred to Dr. Lockard for action.

Dr. Lockard responded, but admitted that not all of the questions would be answered.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What questions did you ask? Hopefully they included>

1. Why didn't the school system use the contract that we paid to have researched and prepared? Mr. McRae used a brand new contract that we paid even more to have analyzed and researched and prepared. The parent groups technically put their homes on the line doing up yet another contract, so the school system could transfer their liability to the parents.
2. Why are children being used to fundraise for a private corporation or the school system while they are prisoners during the school day?
3. Why are we using tens of thousands of dollars of taxpayer funded instructional time TO RAISE MONEY FOR THE PTA? Per school.
4. Why are we using tens of thousands of dollars of taxpayer funded instructional time to raise money for the school system? Per school.
5. How does a principal allow a whole bunch of people in their front door to be in direct contact with the children during the school day and then say this isn't their responsibility?

Yes, those questions capture what was asked and NOT answered.

Boosterthon is the "Cult of Chris Carneal" using "character lessons" (of dubious content, quality, and origin) to gain access to school premises to conduct fundraising, of which Boosterthon keeps a hefty percentage.

more or less Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, those questions capture what was asked and
> NOT answered.
>



Wonder if anybody will EVER answer these questions. From the looks of the fundraising draft, somehow I doubt it.

more or less Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, those questions capture what was asked and
> NOT answered.
>
> Boosterthon is the "Cult of Chris Carneal" using
> "character lessons" (of dubious content, quality,
> and origin) to gain access to school premises to
> conduct fundraising, of which Boosterthon keeps a
> hefty percentage.


How do you come up with Boosterthon "keeping a hefty percentage"? A majority of the percentage that goes to Boosterthon is used to pay for t-shirts for all students, prizes, class awards, printed materials, and team member salary JUST FOR THAT SCHOOL. If a school puts on their own run they have to purchase those things out of the money they raise (aside from team member pay), but because a school or PTA can't buy in bulk they pay higher prices for all those things if they put on their own run.

So the arguement of Boosterthon "keeping a hefty percentage" just isn't true. A lot of their cut is spent on items for that school...no different that a school or PTA taking money that's raised and purchasing those things on their own

Booster doesn't "keep a hefty %" Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> more or less Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Yes, those questions capture what was asked and
> > NOT answered.
> >
> > Boosterthon is the "Cult of Chris Carneal"
> using
> > "character lessons" (of dubious content,
> quality,
> > and origin) to gain access to school premises
> to
> > conduct fundraising, of which Boosterthon keeps
> a
> > hefty percentage.
>
>
> How do you come up with Boosterthon "keeping a
> hefty percentage"? A majority of the percentage
> that goes to Boosterthon is used to pay for
> t-shirts for all students, prizes, class awards,
> printed materials, and team member salary JUST FOR
> THAT SCHOOL. If a school puts on their own run
> they have to purchase those things out of the
> money they raise (aside from team member pay), but
> because a school or PTA can't buy in bulk they pay
> higher prices for all those things if they put on
> their own run.
>
> So the arguement of Boosterthon "keeping a hefty
> percentage" just isn't true. A lot of their cut is
> spent on items for that school...no different that
> a school or PTA taking money that's raised and
> purchasing those things on their own

And further to that there are the costs of web development and maintenance (which without the web system schools or PTA's could not raise near as much), there is curriculum development, team member training and development, insurance and other business costs that are necessary to run the program.

There are also a ton of costs that you wouldn't consider unless you saw firthand what it takes to run a fun run program. Things like cups, lap marking sharpees, race equipment and maintenance, sound equipment, paper, ink, and a lot more random stuff that doesn't seem like much but it all adds up.

When a school puts on their own run to this magnitude, to raise as much as this program does, it costs a fortune. With Boosterthon EVERYTHING is paid for out of their percentage. They are able to profit most schools more than they could on their own, even after paying Boosterthon. And in addition to profiting more, the schools get a lot back from it and so do the kids and Boosterthon pays for all of it.

Fundraising is necessary in most schools and all of the kids benefit from the things the school or PTA buys with the money raised. The whole program takes 2 hours out of the school year, but I think most people on here aren't considering the benefit to all students that comes from the technology, programs and supplies that are purchased with the proceeds.

Charity Navigator holds that outside fundraising firms should get no more than 25 percent of the money they raise, she said. CharityWatch, another watchdog group, says fundraising costs shouldn’t be more than 35 percent.
http://www.richmond.com/news/local/education/article_f4ba1b6d-ced8-5966-8755-3a188648e2ad.html

But in any case, Booster would get fewer complaints if more people weren't taken by surprise about the percentage which goes to Booster.

"So they calculated out 3.3 hours of lost instructional time for this? That is up from the 2 hour estimate. 700 kids X $13.60 per hour X 3.3 hours= $31,416 of overhead for this thing in this area. Per school. Our taxes at work. 1,000 kids is $44,880."

If Dr. Garza disagrees with the nature of this analysis, let her explain what's happening. Even at the lower hour figure, this is out of line.

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Charity Navigator holds that
> outside fundraising firms should get no more than
> 25 percent of the money they raise, she
> said. CharityWatch, another watchdog group, says
> fundraising costs shouldn’t be more than 35
> percent.
> http://www.richmond.com/news/local/education/artic
> le_f4ba1b6d-ced8-5966-8755-3a188648e2ad.html
>
> But in any case, Booster would get fewer
> complaints if more people weren't taken by
> surprise about the percentage which goes to
> Booster.


This was already posted on this thread of Feb. 19...but you must have overlooked that. This is the parent letter that Boosterthon sent home at the kickoff to the program for all their schools this year. It tells parents what the % is. Numbers were UP at schools this year that have been served previously.
Attachments:

They do publish % Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This was already posted on this thread of Feb.
> 19...but you must have overlooked that.

I reposted because the person who asked,
"How do you come up with Boosterthon 'keeping a hefty percentage'?"
must've overlooked it.

Parent letter - thanks - but do you have one which reflects the new LIVE pricing scale for *this* school year?

> Numbers were UP at schools this year that have been served previously.

I see. So everything's ok.

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They do publish % Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > This was already posted on this thread of Feb.
> > 19...but you must have overlooked that.
>
> I reposted because the person who asked,
> "How do you come up with Boosterthon 'keeping a
> hefty percentage'?"
> must've overlooked it.
>
> Parent letter - thanks - but do you have one which
> reflects the new LIVE pricing scale for *this*
> school year?
>
> > Numbers were UP at schools this year that have
> been served previously.
>
> I see. So everything's ok.

Here's one that reflects the scale. By the way, I know the scale starts at 35% to the school but no school would ever fall that low on the Live scale. Boosterthon has a different program for schools that wouldn't raise very much and that program has lower costs and therefore has a 50%-65% to the school scale similar to the Live program. The Live scale starting at 35% to the school is simply to enable Booster to cover costs should a school for some reason raise significantly less that estimated. And I mean significantly less. That would be a very rare occurrence. The sliding scale is a way to be fair. That way the more a school raises, the higher % they keep. It enables costs to be covered while giving back as much as possible to the school or PTA
Attachments:

http://www.boosterthon.com/about-us/our-team/

Why no details on the people behind Boosterthon?

What is being hidden?

The whole thing seems like a cult, led by Chris Carneal and with five year senior, "frat man" Brett Trapp running the propaganda end of things.

I couldn't confirm, but I understand McNeil ES of McKinney, Texas took in $10,000 and change while Booster got a little under $15,000 in child-generated revenue. Don't know if that includes the $2K fee or not. One of those very rare occurrences, I suppose.

Don't know why that flyer wasn't seen at our school. In any case, it was pretty clear at our PTA meeting after the Fun Run that nothing beyond the children's Booster-prepared pitch was disclosed to the contributors. My PTA president said revenue would be lower if there was full disclosure to the contributors. But the Fun Run was lucrative - so, I gather, it's ok.

But about the kids. The PTA/Os sign a Booster-supplied contract which offers nothing in the way of the child protections carefully drawn up in the FCPS-Booster contract which, in turn, isn't in force when the PTA/Os engage Booster. Kind of a biggie.

Then there's turning our children rabid over the incentives with highly-charged pep rallies, free sno-cones https://www.pinterest.com/pin/154529830936456080/ , and engaging the students during lunch and recess https://www.facebook.com/notes/boosterthon/a-day-in-the-life-of-a-boosterthon-fun-run-team-member/169477546439485 . All in the name of revenue.

And I don't suppose Booster will find out for themselves (because, ya know, I misrepresent stuff all the time) the PTA's stance on children making the ask...? I mean, wouldn't it make business sense to get up to speed on that...?

"So they calculated out 3.3 hours of lost instructional time for this? That is up from the 2 hour estimate. 700 kids X $13.60 per hour X 3.3 hours= $31,416 of overhead for this thing in this area. Per school. Our taxes at work. 1,000 kids is $44,880."

If Dr. Garza disagrees with the nature of this analysis, let her explain what's happening. Even at the lower hour figure, this is out of line.

NewHorizon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I couldn't confirm, but I understand McNeil ES of
> McKinney, Texas took in $10,000 and change while
> Booster got a little under $15,000 in
> child-generated revenue. Don't know if that
> includes the $2K fee or not. One of those very
> rare occurrences, I suppose.
>
> Don't know why that flyer wasn't seen at our
> school. In any case, it was pretty clear at our
> PTA meeting after the Fun Run that nothing beyond
> the children's Booster-prepared pitch was
> disclosed to the contributors. My PTA president
> said revenue would be lower if there was full
> disclosure to the contributors. But the Fun Run
> was lucrative - so, I gather, it's ok.
>
> But about the kids. The PTA/Os sign a
> Booster-supplied contract which offers nothing in
> the way of the child protections carefully drawn
> up in the FCPS-Booster contract which, in turn,
> isn't in force when the PTA/Os engage Booster.
> Kind of a biggie.
>
> Then there's turning our children rabid over the
> incentives with highly-charged pep rallies, free
> sno-cones
> https://www.pinterest.com/pin/154529830936456080/
> , and engaging the students during lunch and
> recess
> https://www.facebook.com/notes/boosterthon/a-day-i
> n-the-life-of-a-boosterthon-fun-run-team-member/16
> 9477546439485 . All in the name of revenue.
>
> And I don't suppose Booster will find out for
> themselves (because, ya know, I misrepresent stuff
> all the time) the PTA's stance on children making
> the ask...? I mean, wouldn't it make business
> sense to get up to speed on that...?

If you can't confirm it, why are you writing it? You folks are getting to the point to where you're making things up now just to further your agenda because you're running out of arguments to make.

How many times now have you mentioned "my PTA president said..." Rinse, repeat, rinse, repeat. I'm getting dizzy from the round and round in circles game.

John Koch, you seriously have no life.

AaAaAa Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "So they calculated out 3.3 hours of lost
> instructional time for this? That is up from the 2
> hour estimate. 700 kids X $13.60 per hour X 3.3
> hours= $31,416 of overhead for this thing in this
> area. Per school. Our taxes at work. 1,000 kids is
> $44,880."
>
> If Dr. Garza disagrees with the nature of this
> analysis, let her explain what's happening. Even
> at the lower hour figure, this is out of line.

Rinse, repeat, rinse, repeat. You're just reposting an exact comment from a few days ago. And the same ol stuff that keeps getting repeated.

Some of the people on here are just crazy. Some of the people on here are just trying to create controversy where none exists. Possibly because local elections are coming soon??

And the rest of the people just have no life and they post on here to feel important.