Fairfax County General :
Fairfax Underground
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
PRIVATIZE ABC
()
Date: January 09, 2013 10:37PM
The governor campaigned on doing this back in 2009 during his campaign. Has he reneged on this and if so, for what reason?
My Liquor Barn back home>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>limited ABC Store.
My Liquor Barn back home>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>limited ABC Store.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
Jack Dniels
()
Date: January 09, 2013 10:42PM
Uh, maybe because almost everybody and both parties think it's a bad idea.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
PRIVATIZE ABC
()
Date: January 09, 2013 10:59PM
Ummm... why? Coming from the same state that just recently legalized (ZOMG)SANGRIA, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
Gerald Ford
()
Date: January 09, 2013 11:02PM
Like most Repbulicans, Old McDonald ran on a platform of smoke and mirrors. Once elected, they return to status quo and party line politics. Other than trans-vaginal examinations, Old McDonald is just another quack governor.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
A bird in the hand...
()
Date: January 09, 2013 11:09PM
I thought the studies indicated privatizing liquor stores would generate some short term revenue at the expense of an ongoing revenue stream. I'm not a huge fan of ABC stores, but it still seems shortsighted to blow VA's liquor load, as it were.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
Dumb
()
Date: January 10, 2013 05:07AM
Even the GOP'ers came to their senses and realized it was stupid.
Privitizing had momentum for two reason: 1) VA has no money and 2) "Free marketers" and "small government" types believe the state has no business owning liquor stores.
I can actually agree with #2, but we are too far gone on #1. The ABC store's income would need to be replaced to the penny, or else the budget would suffer. Old Bob's plan was similar to you making $100k a year and agreeing to get a lump sum of $200k now, and then only make $50k after that. After 5 years you only have $450k instead of $500k and the loss just grows as the years go on. Other states have done similar measures: selling highways to become toll roads, selling buildings and then leasing them back and the plan always ends up fucking the taxpayer in the end for that short term "high".
Privitizing had momentum for two reason: 1) VA has no money and 2) "Free marketers" and "small government" types believe the state has no business owning liquor stores.
I can actually agree with #2, but we are too far gone on #1. The ABC store's income would need to be replaced to the penny, or else the budget would suffer. Old Bob's plan was similar to you making $100k a year and agreeing to get a lump sum of $200k now, and then only make $50k after that. After 5 years you only have $450k instead of $500k and the loss just grows as the years go on. Other states have done similar measures: selling highways to become toll roads, selling buildings and then leasing them back and the plan always ends up fucking the taxpayer in the end for that short term "high".
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
BelowMe
()
Date: January 10, 2013 06:09AM
^+1
Virginia would have lost in excess of $100 Million in annual profit/income generated from ABC Store liquor sales if McDonnell's stupid Privatization plan had gone through.
Scary that a fundamentalist GOP nut job can become Governor of Virginia on half baked ideas and yet he can't do basic linear math.
What's even worse, McDonnell didn't have the common sense to understand that his Privatization effort pitted him against some of the biggest GOP donors and supporters across the state - the beer and wine wholesalers and distributors.
Large scale brick & mortar stores like WalMart, Giant, Safeway, CostCo, etc. backed Privatization and attempted to hijack McDonnell's Privatization effort so that they too could sell liquor, beer, and wine and thereby bypass the beer and wine wholesaler/distribution franchises.
Obviously the wholesaler/distributors fought like hell to prevent this from ruining their regional monopolies on beer and wine sales. They poured tons of money into lobbying against the Privatization effort.
McDonnell got his ass handed to him by his own party as a result.
Besides, the GOP had more important fish to fry anyway - like their insane focus on a trans vaginal pipeline through the wombs of mothers, sisters, and daughters across Virginia.
Virginia would have lost in excess of $100 Million in annual profit/income generated from ABC Store liquor sales if McDonnell's stupid Privatization plan had gone through.
Scary that a fundamentalist GOP nut job can become Governor of Virginia on half baked ideas and yet he can't do basic linear math.
What's even worse, McDonnell didn't have the common sense to understand that his Privatization effort pitted him against some of the biggest GOP donors and supporters across the state - the beer and wine wholesalers and distributors.
Large scale brick & mortar stores like WalMart, Giant, Safeway, CostCo, etc. backed Privatization and attempted to hijack McDonnell's Privatization effort so that they too could sell liquor, beer, and wine and thereby bypass the beer and wine wholesaler/distribution franchises.
Obviously the wholesaler/distributors fought like hell to prevent this from ruining their regional monopolies on beer and wine sales. They poured tons of money into lobbying against the Privatization effort.
McDonnell got his ass handed to him by his own party as a result.
Besides, the GOP had more important fish to fry anyway - like their insane focus on a trans vaginal pipeline through the wombs of mothers, sisters, and daughters across Virginia.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
duhhhhhh
()
Date: January 10, 2013 07:28AM
@BelowMe - The plan he originally floated wouldn't have done anything to the beer & wine wholesalers except expand their business as they would have taken on distributing liquor too.
Virginia requires all retailers to obtain their alcoholic beverages via local licensed distributors. Even Wal-Mart, Costco etc. The distributors have a government sanctioned/required monopoly at the brand level as each brand of beer/wine can only be sold by one distributor.
In other words, if you want to carry Budweiser, you have to source it from Guiffre. They can charge whatever they want because there is no competition for Budweiser. You either pay it or don't carry Budweiser.
Liquor meanwhile is distributed by VABC. They do periodic checks & compare inventory to invoices to make sure you are not going into DC and sourcing your alcoholic beverages from one of the warehouses over on New York Ave.
This is actually the reason why Sangria was outlawed for so long, because once the liquor is mixed into the Sangria, you have no way of proving where the liquor was sourced.
The original plan (from what I recall) was:
- Established beer & wine distributors in good standing with the state would take over distribution of liquor alongside beer & wine.
- VABC properties would be sold off (hence that first year high, income wise).
- The number of liquor stores in the state would be limited to compare closely to how many VABC stores were in existance prior to privatization (to keep VA from turning into a liquor store on every corner).
- Retailers would enter a bidding system to buy a license to sell liquor.
- ABC would enforce liquor laws/sourcing same as they do beer & wine.
The plan actually sucked ass from a retailer perspective because the licenses were going to be so limited, the only places that would have gotten a license would have been big chain stores like Wal-Mart, leaving mom & pops out of luck.
The plan probably would have resulted in better selection but PROBABLY would have made pricing more expensive as you'd still be stuck with the monopoly at the distributor level and liquor drinkers are FAR more brand-centric than beer or wine drinkers (they would know they could charge an arm & a leg for premium Vodkas because not many people are going to start regularly drinking Kamchatcka Vodka out of a plastic jug over Goose.)
As everyone else has pointed out, it would have sucked from a revenue perspective, even in the relatively short term (5 yrs) and was overall a bad idea but I would be willing to bet of all the people who were angling to shut it down, it certainly wasn't the distributors.
Virginia requires all retailers to obtain their alcoholic beverages via local licensed distributors. Even Wal-Mart, Costco etc. The distributors have a government sanctioned/required monopoly at the brand level as each brand of beer/wine can only be sold by one distributor.
In other words, if you want to carry Budweiser, you have to source it from Guiffre. They can charge whatever they want because there is no competition for Budweiser. You either pay it or don't carry Budweiser.
Liquor meanwhile is distributed by VABC. They do periodic checks & compare inventory to invoices to make sure you are not going into DC and sourcing your alcoholic beverages from one of the warehouses over on New York Ave.
This is actually the reason why Sangria was outlawed for so long, because once the liquor is mixed into the Sangria, you have no way of proving where the liquor was sourced.
The original plan (from what I recall) was:
- Established beer & wine distributors in good standing with the state would take over distribution of liquor alongside beer & wine.
- VABC properties would be sold off (hence that first year high, income wise).
- The number of liquor stores in the state would be limited to compare closely to how many VABC stores were in existance prior to privatization (to keep VA from turning into a liquor store on every corner).
- Retailers would enter a bidding system to buy a license to sell liquor.
- ABC would enforce liquor laws/sourcing same as they do beer & wine.
The plan actually sucked ass from a retailer perspective because the licenses were going to be so limited, the only places that would have gotten a license would have been big chain stores like Wal-Mart, leaving mom & pops out of luck.
The plan probably would have resulted in better selection but PROBABLY would have made pricing more expensive as you'd still be stuck with the monopoly at the distributor level and liquor drinkers are FAR more brand-centric than beer or wine drinkers (they would know they could charge an arm & a leg for premium Vodkas because not many people are going to start regularly drinking Kamchatcka Vodka out of a plastic jug over Goose.)
As everyone else has pointed out, it would have sucked from a revenue perspective, even in the relatively short term (5 yrs) and was overall a bad idea but I would be willing to bet of all the people who were angling to shut it down, it certainly wasn't the distributors.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
Drunkard
()
Date: January 10, 2013 07:36AM
Washington State just privatized and the only plus is...not having to go to a separate store when you're doing your shopping to get your hard liquor. Here in VA, the ABC stores are typically located in strip malls next to grocery stores so in most (not all) cases you don't have to get in your car and drive to another location for liquor.
However, Washington State has the following minuses...the state still controls pricing on liquor in WA for 3 years. Prices went up 15% at retail in order to drive tax revenues during this period. I suppose it never occurred to anyone that high prices drive sales down (especially on a product like liquor) and also the tax revenue. Finally, nobody thought about theft so, initially bottles were literally "flying" off the shelves to underaged drinkers. So, now it's all either kept in a cage in the back of the store so, you're shopping for $80 bottles of single-malt in a dimly lit, concrete floored, shit smelling corner of the store. Or...stores install these outrageous clamps to the bottle necks which have a sensor in them and not one store employee can remove despite having the special tool.
Meanwhile, one can get a gun in less than 15 minutes...
However, Washington State has the following minuses...the state still controls pricing on liquor in WA for 3 years. Prices went up 15% at retail in order to drive tax revenues during this period. I suppose it never occurred to anyone that high prices drive sales down (especially on a product like liquor) and also the tax revenue. Finally, nobody thought about theft so, initially bottles were literally "flying" off the shelves to underaged drinkers. So, now it's all either kept in a cage in the back of the store so, you're shopping for $80 bottles of single-malt in a dimly lit, concrete floored, shit smelling corner of the store. Or...stores install these outrageous clamps to the bottle necks which have a sensor in them and not one store employee can remove despite having the special tool.
Meanwhile, one can get a gun in less than 15 minutes...
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
Jess1
()
Date: January 10, 2013 09:01AM
A quick google search (amazing, huh?) finds that several VA govs & state officials (incl. Dem Govs) have floated the "dump ABC" proposal over the past 20 years. Would be a great thing, too...
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
KeepOnTruckin
()
Date: January 10, 2013 05:05PM
ABC stores are now open on Sundays, ABC reports significantly increased profits due to this. I say open most of them 24 hours, then state revenues will increase even more. As said above, ABC stores are located well enough, it is simply the restricted hours they are open that is inconvenient.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
otis campbell
()
Date: January 10, 2013 06:18PM
All this bitching about saving a few bucks by going to DC. Either you people drink a hell of a lot of booze or you throw big parties every weekend. I am not going to hit DC until I can save alot more money than a few bucks.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
BrianSchoeneman
()
Date: January 10, 2013 06:28PM
The problem has always been to find a way to privatize the stores where the state wouldn't lose revenue. The original plan didn't make it through the GA in 2010, and folks are still working on the idea.
I still support privatization, so long as it doesn't cost us anything. The government has no need in the 21st century to me in the liquor business.
I still support privatization, so long as it doesn't cost us anything. The government has no need in the 21st century to me in the liquor business.
Re: Privatizing ABC Stores
Posted by:
wnrsm
()
Date: January 11, 2013 04:36PM
BrianSchoeneman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The problem has always been to find a way to
> privatize the stores where the state wouldn't lose
> revenue. The original plan didn't make it through
> the GA in 2010, and folks are still working on the
> idea.
>
> I still support privatization, so long as it
> doesn't cost us anything. The government has no
> need in the 21st century to me in the liquor
> business.
Privatization will always cost something. Whatever the gov't makes now will be a burden on the private business. Any profit the private business wishes to make will come from increased costs. It will probably cost more if the private business just breaks even. Higher prices can lead to fewer sales.
One hope I see is if private business is more efficient and can make their margin on doing it cheaper than the gov't.
-------------------------------------------------------
> The problem has always been to find a way to
> privatize the stores where the state wouldn't lose
> revenue. The original plan didn't make it through
> the GA in 2010, and folks are still working on the
> idea.
>
> I still support privatization, so long as it
> doesn't cost us anything. The government has no
> need in the 21st century to me in the liquor
> business.
Privatization will always cost something. Whatever the gov't makes now will be a burden on the private business. Any profit the private business wishes to make will come from increased costs. It will probably cost more if the private business just breaks even. Higher prices can lead to fewer sales.
One hope I see is if private business is more efficient and can make their margin on doing it cheaper than the gov't.