Fairfax County General :
Fairfax Underground
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
How Well Will It Work?
Read the original story and fill out the 3 question survey/poll
Commuters have long been awaiting the new Mega-Project 495 Express Lanes completion since the merits of the project were first announced in 2004. If you have been living under a local news rock over the past decade, essentially the new lanes are a congestion pricing system that based on the amount of traffic at any given time will charge a corresponding fee per mile to either attract or reduce users.
The concept has benefits;
-The new lanes were built for essentially nothing where as in the past it would have drawn upon a limited source of transportation funding, thereby reducing the availability of funds for other projects.
-The new lanes have the benefit of also serving as pseudo BRT (Bus Rapid Transit) because Fairfax Connector/Virginia Railway Express/WMATA buses will be able to use the lanes which are assured by Fluor to operate at all times above 45 mph.
-The new lanes will draw some users from the existing free lanes and reduce some congestion on 495.
The concept has some negatives too;
-The new lanes required extensive new infrastructure in the connecting communities that weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public partnership including local road widenings to support the new anticipated traffic as well as future upgrades that will be necessary.
-The new lanes have created an even greater chasm in some neighborhoods, like Tysons, impeding all forms of transportation except for vehicles. Roads like Jones Branch Drive and Westpark which previously had acceptable access to pedestrians will now be enclosed by highway ramp entrances which are difficult to cross and prioritize vehicle through put over pedestrian safety.
-The effectiveness of the congestion relief is highly variable in other jurisdictions around the Country that have implemented this infrastructure. In some cities like Atlanta and Seattle the new congestion priced lanes have been either underused or ineffective and in some cases can actually induce more traffic on the original lanes by providing commuters a sense of a secondary option that few will use.
Over the next month we will find out the effectiveness of traffic congestion in the short term from the new project. Over the next several years we will find out if it was a net benefit or detriment to our region. Many proponents point to the benefit it provided to L.A. (a car oriented affluent city by all measures) though the long term effect on business in downtown has yet to be understood.
Some smart growth advocates are even divided on the subject matter, citing the aggressive congestion pricing in London and that city's revitalization that has happened in its urban core due to the subsequent reduction in traffic. Unfortunately, any in depth review of London’s system would show that the key was to remove all entry points from escape and creating a “zone of congestion pricing”. Opponents of HOT lanes point to several other implementations that have shown that traffic will simply be pushed from one spot to another as commuters find their own path of least resistance. Without all of the region inside the beltway constrained with congestion pricing the project will likely fall somewhere in between LA and Atlanta over the next few years… it is no shock that both of those cities are perennially in the top 5 worst commutes list. It may however come as a shock to find out that those two cities are also in the top 5 list for the most paved surface per capita, making it quite clear that the amount of road has very little to do with the ability to move people.
The real question isn’t how much will traffic improve with the new Lexus lanes, but how long will it last given current land use policy and whether the benefits of the project will outweigh the detriment it will cause to divided communities in its shadow.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2012 10:35AM by Tysons Engineer.
Welcome to Fairfax Underground, a project site designed to improve communication among residents of Fairfax County, VA. Feel free to post anything Northern Virginia residents would find interesting.
495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 13, 2012 10:33AM
HOT Lanes – Express Lanes – Up and Running This Week
How Well Will It Work?
Read the original story and fill out the 3 question survey/poll
Commuters have long been awaiting the new Mega-Project 495 Express Lanes completion since the merits of the project were first announced in 2004. If you have been living under a local news rock over the past decade, essentially the new lanes are a congestion pricing system that based on the amount of traffic at any given time will charge a corresponding fee per mile to either attract or reduce users.
The concept has benefits;
-The new lanes were built for essentially nothing where as in the past it would have drawn upon a limited source of transportation funding, thereby reducing the availability of funds for other projects.
-The new lanes have the benefit of also serving as pseudo BRT (Bus Rapid Transit) because Fairfax Connector/Virginia Railway Express/WMATA buses will be able to use the lanes which are assured by Fluor to operate at all times above 45 mph.
-The new lanes will draw some users from the existing free lanes and reduce some congestion on 495.
The concept has some negatives too;
-The new lanes required extensive new infrastructure in the connecting communities that weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public partnership including local road widenings to support the new anticipated traffic as well as future upgrades that will be necessary.
-The new lanes have created an even greater chasm in some neighborhoods, like Tysons, impeding all forms of transportation except for vehicles. Roads like Jones Branch Drive and Westpark which previously had acceptable access to pedestrians will now be enclosed by highway ramp entrances which are difficult to cross and prioritize vehicle through put over pedestrian safety.
-The effectiveness of the congestion relief is highly variable in other jurisdictions around the Country that have implemented this infrastructure. In some cities like Atlanta and Seattle the new congestion priced lanes have been either underused or ineffective and in some cases can actually induce more traffic on the original lanes by providing commuters a sense of a secondary option that few will use.
Over the next month we will find out the effectiveness of traffic congestion in the short term from the new project. Over the next several years we will find out if it was a net benefit or detriment to our region. Many proponents point to the benefit it provided to L.A. (a car oriented affluent city by all measures) though the long term effect on business in downtown has yet to be understood.
Some smart growth advocates are even divided on the subject matter, citing the aggressive congestion pricing in London and that city's revitalization that has happened in its urban core due to the subsequent reduction in traffic. Unfortunately, any in depth review of London’s system would show that the key was to remove all entry points from escape and creating a “zone of congestion pricing”. Opponents of HOT lanes point to several other implementations that have shown that traffic will simply be pushed from one spot to another as commuters find their own path of least resistance. Without all of the region inside the beltway constrained with congestion pricing the project will likely fall somewhere in between LA and Atlanta over the next few years… it is no shock that both of those cities are perennially in the top 5 worst commutes list. It may however come as a shock to find out that those two cities are also in the top 5 list for the most paved surface per capita, making it quite clear that the amount of road has very little to do with the ability to move people.
The real question isn’t how much will traffic improve with the new Lexus lanes, but how long will it last given current land use policy and whether the benefits of the project will outweigh the detriment it will cause to divided communities in its shadow.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2012 10:35AM by Tysons Engineer.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
bill gates
()
Date: November 13, 2012 10:42AM
I am so looking forward to leaving this area. Cant complain about opportunity, I made my stake but the traffic is nuts. This boondoggle is not the answer to the problem. Just a scam that some private company got rich on.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Geo
()
Date: November 13, 2012 11:34AM
pro-
I can take my motorcycle without needing an EZPass
con-
You will need an EZPass to use the "free" HOV- oh and you'll have to pay the monthly fee for EZPass
pro-
They got this project done pretty quickly, and less traffic disruption than I expected
con-
It's a concrete monster. They changed the tree lined beltway into a sound walled eye sore. Hopefully it doesn't extend the -uh- prosperity that Springfield saw after the mixing bowl project all the way up the beltway corridor
I can take my motorcycle without needing an EZPass
con-
You will need an EZPass to use the "free" HOV- oh and you'll have to pay the monthly fee for EZPass
pro-
They got this project done pretty quickly, and less traffic disruption than I expected
con-
It's a concrete monster. They changed the tree lined beltway into a sound walled eye sore. Hopefully it doesn't extend the -uh- prosperity that Springfield saw after the mixing bowl project all the way up the beltway corridor
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
The circle of life.
()
Date: November 13, 2012 11:46AM
Geo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pro-
> I can take my motorcycle without needing an
> EZPass
> con-
> You will need an EZPass to use the "free" HOV- oh
> and you'll have to pay the monthly fee for EZPass
>
> pro-
> They got this project done pretty quickly, and
> less traffic disruption than I expected
> con-
> It's a concrete monster. They changed the tree
> lined beltway into a sound walled eye sore.
> Hopefully it doesn't extend the -uh- prosperity
> that Springfield saw after the mixing bowl project
> all the way up the beltway corridor
Lord Fairfax, Washington and others would be proud. The price of success.
Fuck trees. Who needs them? And all roads should be tolled.
-------------------------------------------------------
> pro-
> I can take my motorcycle without needing an
> EZPass
> con-
> You will need an EZPass to use the "free" HOV- oh
> and you'll have to pay the monthly fee for EZPass
>
> pro-
> They got this project done pretty quickly, and
> less traffic disruption than I expected
> con-
> It's a concrete monster. They changed the tree
> lined beltway into a sound walled eye sore.
> Hopefully it doesn't extend the -uh- prosperity
> that Springfield saw after the mixing bowl project
> all the way up the beltway corridor
Lord Fairfax, Washington and others would be proud. The price of success.
Fuck trees. Who needs them? And all roads should be tolled.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Republican Mathematician
()
Date: November 13, 2012 11:57AM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> The concept has benefits;
>
> -The new lanes were built for essentially nothing
> where as in the past it would have drawn upon a
> limited source of transportation funding, thereby
> reducing the availability of funds for other
> projects.
"built for essentially nothing" -- yep. They found a magical accounting practice that allowed them to build a major road without spending a dime.
I love doublespeak or newspeak. It's so cute.
>
> -The new lanes required extensive new
> infrastructure in the connecting communities that
> weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public
> partnership including local road widenings to
> support the new anticipated traffic as well as
> future upgrades that will be necessary.
So how was it built for essentially nothing, again?
Seems to me it benefits politically influential people. Fluor Transurban is a consortium of Transurban, an Australian toll operator, and Fluor, whose board consists of the Chairman of California JP Morgan, Peter Barker, and Alan Bennett, a director of Halliburton.
http://www.fluor.com/about_fluor/leadership/board_of_directors/Pages/default.aspx
Isn't it funny that both the silver line and the hot lanes were constructed by people with connections to the Bush administration?? No-bid contracts are awesome, if you own the people in positions to grant them.
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> The concept has benefits;
>
> -The new lanes were built for essentially nothing
> where as in the past it would have drawn upon a
> limited source of transportation funding, thereby
> reducing the availability of funds for other
> projects.
"built for essentially nothing" -- yep. They found a magical accounting practice that allowed them to build a major road without spending a dime.
I love doublespeak or newspeak. It's so cute.
>
> -The new lanes required extensive new
> infrastructure in the connecting communities that
> weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public
> partnership including local road widenings to
> support the new anticipated traffic as well as
> future upgrades that will be necessary.
So how was it built for essentially nothing, again?
Seems to me it benefits politically influential people. Fluor Transurban is a consortium of Transurban, an Australian toll operator, and Fluor, whose board consists of the Chairman of California JP Morgan, Peter Barker, and Alan Bennett, a director of Halliburton.
http://www.fluor.com/about_fluor/leadership/board_of_directors/Pages/default.aspx
Isn't it funny that both the silver line and the hot lanes were constructed by people with connections to the Bush administration?? No-bid contracts are awesome, if you own the people in positions to grant them.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
I hate Halliburton too but
()
Date: November 13, 2012 12:19PM
Republican Mathematician Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > The concept has benefits;
> >
> > -The new lanes were built for essentially
> nothing
> > where as in the past it would have drawn upon a
> > limited source of transportation funding,
> thereby
> > reducing the availability of funds for other
> > projects.
>
>
> "built for essentially nothing" -- yep. They found
> a magical accounting practice that allowed them to
> build a major road without spending a dime.
>
> I love doublespeak or newspeak. It's so cute.
>
>
> >
> > -The new lanes required extensive new
> > infrastructure in the connecting communities
> that
> > weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public
> > partnership including local road widenings to
> > support the new anticipated traffic as well as
> > future upgrades that will be necessary.
>
>
> So how was it built for essentially nothing,
> again?
>
>
> Seems to me it benefits politically influential
> people. Fluor Transurban is a consortium of
> Transurban, an Australian toll operator, and
> Fluor, whose board consists of the Chairman of
> California JP Morgan, Peter Barker, and Alan
> Bennett, a director of Halliburton.
>
> http://www.fluor.com/about_fluor/leadership/board_
> of_directors/Pages/default.aspx
>
> Isn't it funny that both the silver line and the
> hot lanes were constructed by people with
> connections to the Bush administration?? No-bid
> contracts are awesome, if you own the people in
> positions to grant them.
To be fair there are only about a half dozen companies with the capabilities to construction multi-billion dollar infrastructure. Fluor, Foster Wheeler, and Halliburton are really the only 3 in the game of this order.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > The concept has benefits;
> >
> > -The new lanes were built for essentially
> nothing
> > where as in the past it would have drawn upon a
> > limited source of transportation funding,
> thereby
> > reducing the availability of funds for other
> > projects.
>
>
> "built for essentially nothing" -- yep. They found
> a magical accounting practice that allowed them to
> build a major road without spending a dime.
>
> I love doublespeak or newspeak. It's so cute.
>
>
> >
> > -The new lanes required extensive new
> > infrastructure in the connecting communities
> that
> > weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public
> > partnership including local road widenings to
> > support the new anticipated traffic as well as
> > future upgrades that will be necessary.
>
>
> So how was it built for essentially nothing,
> again?
>
>
> Seems to me it benefits politically influential
> people. Fluor Transurban is a consortium of
> Transurban, an Australian toll operator, and
> Fluor, whose board consists of the Chairman of
> California JP Morgan, Peter Barker, and Alan
> Bennett, a director of Halliburton.
>
> http://www.fluor.com/about_fluor/leadership/board_
> of_directors/Pages/default.aspx
>
> Isn't it funny that both the silver line and the
> hot lanes were constructed by people with
> connections to the Bush administration?? No-bid
> contracts are awesome, if you own the people in
> positions to grant them.
To be fair there are only about a half dozen companies with the capabilities to construction multi-billion dollar infrastructure. Fluor, Foster Wheeler, and Halliburton are really the only 3 in the game of this order.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gotta be a smartass, sorry...
()
Date: November 13, 2012 10:35PM
> To be fair there are only about a half dozen
> companies with the capabilities to construction
> multi-billion dollar infrastructure. Fluor, Foster
> Wheeler, and Halliburton are really the only 3 in
> the game of this order.
So really a quarter dozen, to be fair?
> companies with the capabilities to construction
> multi-billion dollar infrastructure. Fluor, Foster
> Wheeler, and Halliburton are really the only 3 in
> the game of this order.
So really a quarter dozen, to be fair?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 14, 2012 08:24AM
Thanks to everyone who has submitted an answer on the poll. We'd like to get up to 500 respondents so if you havent filled it out, its 3 questions (all checkboxes) and takes maximum 30 seconds to fill out and helps track what the general Fairfax opinion on the project is, or atleast the online opinion.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
flight risk
()
Date: November 14, 2012 08:44AM
Survey taken!
I personally don't get on that portion of 495 often (My commute doesn't take me that way)- but I WILL use the toll lanes if there is somewhere I need to go that's time-sensitive and the congestion on the main lines are too great.
If they can keep up the 45mph, I'd be TRULY IMPRESSED.
I personally don't get on that portion of 495 often (My commute doesn't take me that way)- but I WILL use the toll lanes if there is somewhere I need to go that's time-sensitive and the congestion on the main lines are too great.
If they can keep up the 45mph, I'd be TRULY IMPRESSED.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 14, 2012 09:44AM
flight risk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Survey taken!
>
> I personally don't get on that portion of 495
> often (My commute doesn't take me that way)- but I
> WILL use the toll lanes if there is somewhere I
> need to go that's time-sensitive and the
> congestion on the main lines are too great.
>
> If they can keep up the 45mph, I'd be TRULY
> IMPRESSED.
Thanks for filling it out.
I have my doubts as well, not so much on the long stretch portions between exits because that could be controlled via the pricing, but mostly at the point of exit. Many of the exits end with a traffic signal, and a lot of the traffic movement will involve left turns (atleast they will at Westpark and Route 7). I have a feeling that the queues at this light will cause backups beyond the exit ramps at the worst times during the day.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Survey taken!
>
> I personally don't get on that portion of 495
> often (My commute doesn't take me that way)- but I
> WILL use the toll lanes if there is somewhere I
> need to go that's time-sensitive and the
> congestion on the main lines are too great.
>
> If they can keep up the 45mph, I'd be TRULY
> IMPRESSED.
Thanks for filling it out.
I have my doubts as well, not so much on the long stretch portions between exits because that could be controlled via the pricing, but mostly at the point of exit. Many of the exits end with a traffic signal, and a lot of the traffic movement will involve left turns (atleast they will at Westpark and Route 7). I have a feeling that the queues at this light will cause backups beyond the exit ramps at the worst times during the day.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Smart lights?
()
Date: November 14, 2012 11:15AM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Thanks for filling it out.
>
> I have my doubts as well, not so much on the long
> stretch portions between exits because that could
> be controlled via the pricing, but mostly at the
> point of exit. Many of the exits end with a
> traffic signal, and a lot of the traffic movement
> will involve left turns (atleast they will at
> Westpark and Route 7). I have a feeling that the
> queues at this light will cause backups beyond the
> exit ramps at the worst times during the day.
I read a while ago that they will have a 24 hour control center monitoring the traffic on the HOT lanes. I would imagine they'll be able to control the cycling of those traffic lights to prevent backups.
But I am really baffled at the logic of some of the exit ramps that come to a 'T' on overpasses, like the one on the bridge over 123 at Tyson's Corner Mall. I guess it was cheaper for the builder than a series of expensive on and off ramps.
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Thanks for filling it out.
>
> I have my doubts as well, not so much on the long
> stretch portions between exits because that could
> be controlled via the pricing, but mostly at the
> point of exit. Many of the exits end with a
> traffic signal, and a lot of the traffic movement
> will involve left turns (atleast they will at
> Westpark and Route 7). I have a feeling that the
> queues at this light will cause backups beyond the
> exit ramps at the worst times during the day.
I read a while ago that they will have a 24 hour control center monitoring the traffic on the HOT lanes. I would imagine they'll be able to control the cycling of those traffic lights to prevent backups.
But I am really baffled at the logic of some of the exit ramps that come to a 'T' on overpasses, like the one on the bridge over 123 at Tyson's Corner Mall. I guess it was cheaper for the builder than a series of expensive on and off ramps.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 14, 2012 12:43PM
Smart lights? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > Thanks for filling it out.
> >
> > I have my doubts as well, not so much on the
> long
> > stretch portions between exits because that
> could
> > be controlled via the pricing, but mostly at
> the
> > point of exit. Many of the exits end with a
> > traffic signal, and a lot of the traffic
> movement
> > will involve left turns (atleast they will at
> > Westpark and Route 7). I have a feeling that
> the
> > queues at this light will cause backups beyond
> the
> > exit ramps at the worst times during the day.
>
>
> I read a while ago that they will have a 24 hour
> control center monitoring the traffic on the HOT
> lanes. I would imagine they'll be able to control
> the cycling of those traffic lights to prevent
> backups.
>
> But I am really baffled at the logic of some of
> the exit ramps that come to a 'T' on overpasses,
> like the one on the bridge over 123 at Tyson's
> Corner Mall. I guess it was cheaper for the
> builder than a series of expensive on and off
> ramps.
The only way they can address that big slug of traffic all at once during rush hour will be to release the flood gates in one direction (left turns take 5 seconds per car minimum, most of the time 6 seconds is reality). That means per minute it can only process between 10-12 cars. Highway lanes carry 20-30 cars per minute. Even if the light were to stay green it would still queue. More likely they will arrange a 3 minute cycle with a 1 minute red early on, which will still back up over the course of an hour a few hundred cars during Rush. The other impact of having such a dramatic signal preference is cross traffic inside of Tysons (and we all know how amazingly smooth that is) will be even more impeded than it already is.
I think they are gonna have some big problems early on with this idea of highways dumping to T-intersections.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > Thanks for filling it out.
> >
> > I have my doubts as well, not so much on the
> long
> > stretch portions between exits because that
> could
> > be controlled via the pricing, but mostly at
> the
> > point of exit. Many of the exits end with a
> > traffic signal, and a lot of the traffic
> movement
> > will involve left turns (atleast they will at
> > Westpark and Route 7). I have a feeling that
> the
> > queues at this light will cause backups beyond
> the
> > exit ramps at the worst times during the day.
>
>
> I read a while ago that they will have a 24 hour
> control center monitoring the traffic on the HOT
> lanes. I would imagine they'll be able to control
> the cycling of those traffic lights to prevent
> backups.
>
> But I am really baffled at the logic of some of
> the exit ramps that come to a 'T' on overpasses,
> like the one on the bridge over 123 at Tyson's
> Corner Mall. I guess it was cheaper for the
> builder than a series of expensive on and off
> ramps.
The only way they can address that big slug of traffic all at once during rush hour will be to release the flood gates in one direction (left turns take 5 seconds per car minimum, most of the time 6 seconds is reality). That means per minute it can only process between 10-12 cars. Highway lanes carry 20-30 cars per minute. Even if the light were to stay green it would still queue. More likely they will arrange a 3 minute cycle with a 1 minute red early on, which will still back up over the course of an hour a few hundred cars during Rush. The other impact of having such a dramatic signal preference is cross traffic inside of Tysons (and we all know how amazingly smooth that is) will be even more impeded than it already is.
I think they are gonna have some big problems early on with this idea of highways dumping to T-intersections.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
VAN
()
Date: November 14, 2012 12:46PM
Might be fun to just get on them and drive 40.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Awesome idea
()
Date: November 14, 2012 12:55PM
VAN Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Might be fun to just get on them and drive 40.
That would be a funny act of civil disobedience. Undermine the entire premise of the pay-for-privilege concept.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Might be fun to just get on them and drive 40.
That would be a funny act of civil disobedience. Undermine the entire premise of the pay-for-privilege concept.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Let'sdoit!
()
Date: November 14, 2012 01:45PM
VAN Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Might be fun to just get on them and drive 40.
Woukd be even better to have a car in each lane doing 40mph!
-------------------------------------------------------
> Might be fun to just get on them and drive 40.
Woukd be even better to have a car in each lane doing 40mph!
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Private entrepreneur
()
Date: November 15, 2012 09:06AM
Anyone know what the logistics of starting your own bus shuttling service would be? Sounds like a good way to make some serious money doing slug shuttling between VRE and Tysons along these lexus lanes
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
jim143
()
Date: November 15, 2012 12:06PM
I'll be riding it for free on Saturday taking the kids to soccer and then going up to dinner in Rockville. I dread driving around NoVa on weekends but this may help the trip times on the Beltway--and at no charge thanks to HOV3+.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 15, 2012 09:57PM
Thanks to those of you who have taken the poll. Its actually showing some interesting things, for instance there are more people who believe the HOT lanes will cause more traffic on 495 than believe it will significantly improve congestion conditions. (15% vs 6.5%)
Most people will continue to use 495 as a single occupant non-toll (70.2%)
And a plurality of respondents believe this project will not help their personal commute at all (44.7%)
We will be running the poll for one more day before closing it and publishing the results. If you havent done so yet please take 15 seconds to answer the 3 questions.
Most people will continue to use 495 as a single occupant non-toll (70.2%)
And a plurality of respondents believe this project will not help their personal commute at all (44.7%)
We will be running the poll for one more day before closing it and publishing the results. If you havent done so yet please take 15 seconds to answer the 3 questions.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 26, 2012 11:52AM
Now that 495 HOT lanes has faced it first real commute day (non-holiday week). Has anyone's opinion on it changed? Do you think it is fixing anything at all, even minutely?
Let us know so we can let VDOT know
http://thetysonscorner.com/495-express-lanes-open/
Let us know so we can let VDOT know
http://thetysonscorner.com/495-express-lanes-open/
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
R_in_FFX
()
Date: November 26, 2012 11:57AM
What did this do to help alleviate the ass-fuckery known as 66?
Why instead of getting rid of the idiotic traffic control lanes did they instead repaint the road?
Why when I am driving from Falls Church at 11am on a Saturday morning to Fairfax the traffic looks like Tuesday at 5:30pm?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/26/2012 11:57AM by R_in_FFX.
Why instead of getting rid of the idiotic traffic control lanes did they instead repaint the road?
Why when I am driving from Falls Church at 11am on a Saturday morning to Fairfax the traffic looks like Tuesday at 5:30pm?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/26/2012 11:57AM by R_in_FFX.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gordon Blvd
()
Date: November 26, 2012 03:25PM
@R- because not a soul in Richmond gives a FUCK about us up here, and that goes DOUBLE for anyone on the 66 corridor this side of the Shenandoah - you can believe that shit.
also the pained the lanes just so they can get a better laugh watching us fume on weekends over the bullshit.
@TE - Biggest Complaint - Having to pay to use HOV lanes even when you have 3 ppl in your car is BS to me no matter how much or how little hey cost. Anyone should be able to use the lexus lanes if they have 3 ppl period.
also the pained the lanes just so they can get a better laugh watching us fume on weekends over the bullshit.
@TE - Biggest Complaint - Having to pay to use HOV lanes even when you have 3 ppl in your car is BS to me no matter how much or how little hey cost. Anyone should be able to use the lexus lanes if they have 3 ppl period.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Taxation without Representation
()
Date: November 26, 2012 03:45PM
Gordon Blvd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> @R- because not a soul in Richmond gives a FUCK
> about us up here, and that goes DOUBLE for anyone
> on the 66 corridor this side of the Shenandoah -
> you can believe that shit.
>
> also the pained the lanes just so they can get a
> better laugh watching us fume on weekends over the
> bullshit.
>
> @TE - Biggest Complaint - Having to pay to use HOV
> lanes even when you have 3 ppl in your car is BS
> to me no matter how much or how little hey cost.
> Anyone should be able to use the lexus lanes if
> they have 3 ppl period.
I have thought that the whole thing has done absolutely zero for our region, yet to be disproven.
@GB You mean the $1 monthly fee or did you forget to turn on the HOV signal on the transponder?
-------------------------------------------------------
> @R- because not a soul in Richmond gives a FUCK
> about us up here, and that goes DOUBLE for anyone
> on the 66 corridor this side of the Shenandoah -
> you can believe that shit.
>
> also the pained the lanes just so they can get a
> better laugh watching us fume on weekends over the
> bullshit.
>
> @TE - Biggest Complaint - Having to pay to use HOV
> lanes even when you have 3 ppl in your car is BS
> to me no matter how much or how little hey cost.
> Anyone should be able to use the lexus lanes if
> they have 3 ppl period.
I have thought that the whole thing has done absolutely zero for our region, yet to be disproven.
@GB You mean the $1 monthly fee or did you forget to turn on the HOV signal on the transponder?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Merrifieldian
()
Date: November 26, 2012 04:18PM
The effete tone of the article was really rather offputting. This totally has the scent of someone onboard with the Board of Supervisors' jihad against light industrial use. What's the big deal about a radio tower? Now if you're experiencing near field effects in your telephone or something, that might be a valid complaint. The idea that it somehow ruins the land is ridiculous. Grow up.
I was happy that we got a Chipotle, but "urbanization" is the fascist (dictionary sense) wet dream of land planners and bureaucrats obsessed with excuses for new development and higher tax revenues.
People still need places to have their cars painted and transmissions repaired. Get over it. If you are one of those who don't believe in cars, move in to DC, pay higher taxes, receive ineffective services, and revel in your white liberal guilt and the ostensible moral high ground it allows you to claim.
I was happy that we got a Chipotle, but "urbanization" is the fascist (dictionary sense) wet dream of land planners and bureaucrats obsessed with excuses for new development and higher tax revenues.
People still need places to have their cars painted and transmissions repaired. Get over it. If you are one of those who don't believe in cars, move in to DC, pay higher taxes, receive ineffective services, and revel in your white liberal guilt and the ostensible moral high ground it allows you to claim.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: November 26, 2012 04:52PM
Merrifieldian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The effete tone of the article was really rather
> offputting. This totally has the scent of someone
> onboard with the Board of Supervisors' jihad
> against light industrial use. What's the big deal
> about a radio tower? Now if you're experiencing
> near field effects in your telephone or something,
> that might be a valid complaint. The idea that it
> somehow ruins the land is ridiculous. Grow up.
>
> I was happy that we got a Chipotle, but
> "urbanization" is the fascist (dictionary sense)
> wet dream of land planners and bureaucrats
> obsessed with excuses for new development and
> higher tax revenues.
>
> People still need places to have their cars
> painted and transmissions repaired. Get over it.
> If you are one of those who don't believe in cars,
> move in to DC, pay higher taxes, receive
> ineffective services, and revel in your white
> liberal guilt and the ostensible moral high ground
> it allows you to claim.
I know I shouldnt address this because it is substantially troll like, but what article are you even talking about?
Nothing in this article was about a radio tower, or the removal of light industrial uses. In fact if you look more into my website you will see that we are proponents of bringing mixed use of all types including industrial use. None of this is apt to the article however.
Im sorry you feel so enthralled by strip malls, but when it comes to land use, they are the biggest net draws by acreage for a county. It costs money for the county to keep light industrial areas. If you dont want to go bankrupt as a region, then you have to offset this with revenue from commercial sources which are far more effective.
I also am not the "everyone must stop driving type" but to say that it is wrong to simply imply we should make it easy to have multiple options... that is just odd that you would feel so heatedly against having more freedom. Let me guess "you dont want your tax dollars going towards it". Well that's fine except my tax dollars are just as equal as yours and in this state about 1/10th the funding goes towards non-SOV(bikes, pedestrian, trains, buses, etc) uses compared to roads. Perhaps many of us dont want our tax money continuing to go towards THAT cluster-f.
Either way, you are way off topic on attacking this article for something it doesnt even say.
-------------------------------------------------------
> The effete tone of the article was really rather
> offputting. This totally has the scent of someone
> onboard with the Board of Supervisors' jihad
> against light industrial use. What's the big deal
> about a radio tower? Now if you're experiencing
> near field effects in your telephone or something,
> that might be a valid complaint. The idea that it
> somehow ruins the land is ridiculous. Grow up.
>
> I was happy that we got a Chipotle, but
> "urbanization" is the fascist (dictionary sense)
> wet dream of land planners and bureaucrats
> obsessed with excuses for new development and
> higher tax revenues.
>
> People still need places to have their cars
> painted and transmissions repaired. Get over it.
> If you are one of those who don't believe in cars,
> move in to DC, pay higher taxes, receive
> ineffective services, and revel in your white
> liberal guilt and the ostensible moral high ground
> it allows you to claim.
I know I shouldnt address this because it is substantially troll like, but what article are you even talking about?
Nothing in this article was about a radio tower, or the removal of light industrial uses. In fact if you look more into my website you will see that we are proponents of bringing mixed use of all types including industrial use. None of this is apt to the article however.
Im sorry you feel so enthralled by strip malls, but when it comes to land use, they are the biggest net draws by acreage for a county. It costs money for the county to keep light industrial areas. If you dont want to go bankrupt as a region, then you have to offset this with revenue from commercial sources which are far more effective.
I also am not the "everyone must stop driving type" but to say that it is wrong to simply imply we should make it easy to have multiple options... that is just odd that you would feel so heatedly against having more freedom. Let me guess "you dont want your tax dollars going towards it". Well that's fine except my tax dollars are just as equal as yours and in this state about 1/10th the funding goes towards non-SOV(bikes, pedestrian, trains, buses, etc) uses compared to roads. Perhaps many of us dont want our tax money continuing to go towards THAT cluster-f.
Either way, you are way off topic on attacking this article for something it doesnt even say.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
More car repairs in DC
()
Date: November 26, 2012 04:58PM
Theres actually more car repair places in DC per capita than there are in NOVA per capita.
The irony is great
The irony is great
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gordon Blvd
()
Date: November 26, 2012 06:03PM
@TE - no I mean the fee. Or actually more to the point, the fact one needs a transponder in order to use the thing in the first place. If its HOV, you should be able to use it regardless of if you have a transponder or not.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Cult of Reality
()
Date: November 26, 2012 06:15PM
@GordonBlvd: Eventually, there will be thermal imaging cameras on the gantries which will alleviate the need for transponders. However, I'm just butt-hurt so...what the fuck do I know?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
jim143
()
Date: November 26, 2012 09:34PM
I wonder if mannequins, or anything similarly shaped, wrapped in electric blanket(s) powered by an inverter would take care of the thermal imaging cameras?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Start Researching now
()
Date: November 26, 2012 09:50PM
jim143 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wonder if mannequins, or anything similarly
> shaped, wrapped in electric blanket(s) powered by
> an inverter would take care of the thermal imaging
> cameras?
You can start doing some research. This document pertains to near-infrared mounted on the median, so if they go that route, certain window treatments might make it impossible for them to detect if anyone is in the car.
http://www.dot.ga.gov/doingbusiness/research/projects/Documents/0726.pdf
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wonder if mannequins, or anything similarly
> shaped, wrapped in electric blanket(s) powered by
> an inverter would take care of the thermal imaging
> cameras?
You can start doing some research. This document pertains to near-infrared mounted on the median, so if they go that route, certain window treatments might make it impossible for them to detect if anyone is in the car.
http://www.dot.ga.gov/doingbusiness/research/projects/Documents/0726.pdf
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Merrifieldian
()
Date: November 27, 2012 03:10AM
I apologize for what is arguably misdirected spleen. I think I was responding more to one of the commenters on the article with a username that I thought was yours.
I certainly didn't want to hijack your thread. I think that trying to collect something resembling actual data on how people use infrastructure is correct.
I will say that if you happen to live in the middle of the places under siege by construction contractors, it does rather dramatically effect the quality of life.
I certainly didn't want to hijack your thread. I think that trying to collect something resembling actual data on how people use infrastructure is correct.
I will say that if you happen to live in the middle of the places under siege by construction contractors, it does rather dramatically effect the quality of life.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Merrifieldian
()
Date: November 27, 2012 03:12AM
I should also admit that I've been a fairly vocal proponent of the HOT land concept since well before construction began. My only regret is that the roads aren't privately owned as well and that in the event that the municipalities don't see the windfall for which they're hoping, they'll probably resort to less enlightened means of "making up the deficit."
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
truther
()
Date: November 27, 2012 03:40AM
Merrifieldian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I should also admit that I've been a fairly vocal
> proponent of the HOT land concept since well
> before construction began. My only regret is that
> the roads aren't privately owned as well and that
> in the event that the municipalities don't see the
> windfall for which they're hoping, they'll
> probably resort to less enlightened means of
> "making up the deficit."
You are up at 3am on a Monday night, chances are you have other issues or have a shitty job. Your quality of life was never high to begin with.
-------------------------------------------------------
> I should also admit that I've been a fairly vocal
> proponent of the HOT land concept since well
> before construction began. My only regret is that
> the roads aren't privately owned as well and that
> in the event that the municipalities don't see the
> windfall for which they're hoping, they'll
> probably resort to less enlightened means of
> "making up the deficit."
You are up at 3am on a Monday night, chances are you have other issues or have a shitty job. Your quality of life was never high to begin with.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
jim143
()
Date: November 27, 2012 07:25AM
^^^certain window treatments might make it impossible for them to detect if anyone is in the car.
Interesting link--IR illuminators and cameras on the median detecting occupants. Window treatments or just attaching a windshield sun protector to the left side windows (if the cameras are only installed on the median) may do the job. Perhaps a pull down window sun screen for babies...
Interesting link--IR illuminators and cameras on the median detecting occupants. Window treatments or just attaching a windshield sun protector to the left side windows (if the cameras are only installed on the median) may do the job. Perhaps a pull down window sun screen for babies...
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Ceramic-based window tint
()
Date: November 27, 2012 02:37PM
jim143 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ^^^certain window treatments might make it
> impossible for them to detect if anyone is in the
> car.
>
> Interesting link--IR illuminators and cameras on
> the median detecting occupants. Window treatments
> or just attaching a windshield sun protector to
> the left side windows (if the cameras are only
> installed on the median) may do the job. Perhaps
> a pull down window sun screen for babies...
There are certain window films that use ceramics. Those probably have all kinds of thermal blocking/absorbing properties.
-------------------------------------------------------
> ^^^certain window treatments might make it
> impossible for them to detect if anyone is in the
> car.
>
> Interesting link--IR illuminators and cameras on
> the median detecting occupants. Window treatments
> or just attaching a windshield sun protector to
> the left side windows (if the cameras are only
> installed on the median) may do the job. Perhaps
> a pull down window sun screen for babies...
There are certain window films that use ceramics. Those probably have all kinds of thermal blocking/absorbing properties.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gordon Blvd
()
Date: November 27, 2012 05:26PM
@Ceramic - yea............I'm talking about not wanting to pay a $1 monthly fee - but I'm gonna go ahead and by ceramic windows just so I can defraud the system? o_0
I DONT THINK SO!
I DONT THINK SO!
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Jump right in, the water is nice
()
Date: November 27, 2012 06:09PM
Gordon Blvd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> @Ceramic - yea............I'm talking about not
> wanting to pay a $1 monthly fee - but I'm gonna go
> ahead and by ceramic windows just so I can defraud
> the system? o_0
>
> I DONT THINK SO!
Was not replying to your comment. jim143 was talking about the future use of thermal imaging to determine HOV and non-HOV vehicles.
But feel free to add your two cents. Nothing wrong with that.
-------------------------------------------------------
> @Ceramic - yea............I'm talking about not
> wanting to pay a $1 monthly fee - but I'm gonna go
> ahead and by ceramic windows just so I can defraud
> the system? o_0
>
> I DONT THINK SO!
Was not replying to your comment. jim143 was talking about the future use of thermal imaging to determine HOV and non-HOV vehicles.
But feel free to add your two cents. Nothing wrong with that.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
mrs hernandez - annandale bario
()
Date: November 27, 2012 06:19PM
i frequent have many baby on floor back seat, will thermal pick up?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gordon Blvd
()
Date: November 27, 2012 06:42PM
@Jump - that's what this here site is there for LoLz
pic unrelated
Attachments:
pic unrelated
Attachments:
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
J J J Shabadoo
()
Date: December 01, 2012 05:57AM
Transurban owns the lanes for the next 73 years. Then why are my tax dollars paying to maintain it? Its a private road,
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
clusterF*&k
()
Date: December 01, 2012 11:41AM
The cute plastic tube lane dividers are cute. What happens when it snows? Now that there is no left lane shoulder in the 'regular lanes' does vdot push it all to the right taking the only available shoulder out?
For that matter where does transurban (just kidding VDOT/you will pay for snow removal on the Lexus Lanes) push its snow? Onto the regular lanes through those cute plastic tube lane dividers into the fast lane of the regular lanes? I am sure those beautiful tubes will withstand all that - not.
Get used to it NOVA we let ourselves get screwed over big time - these lanes are a huge boondoggle and we will end up paying twice as much for them because we outsourced the construction instead of using our tax dollars for our own betterment.
For that matter where does transurban (just kidding VDOT/you will pay for snow removal on the Lexus Lanes) push its snow? Onto the regular lanes through those cute plastic tube lane dividers into the fast lane of the regular lanes? I am sure those beautiful tubes will withstand all that - not.
Get used to it NOVA we let ourselves get screwed over big time - these lanes are a huge boondoggle and we will end up paying twice as much for them because we outsourced the construction instead of using our tax dollars for our own betterment.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Republican Utopia
()
Date: December 01, 2012 11:53AM
J J J Shabadoo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Transurban owns the lanes for the next 73 years.
> Then why are my tax dollars paying to maintain it?
> Its a private road,
Welcome to the future Dick Cheney and Halliburton had in store for you.
Privatized profit, socialized risk.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Transurban owns the lanes for the next 73 years.
> Then why are my tax dollars paying to maintain it?
> Its a private road,
Welcome to the future Dick Cheney and Halliburton had in store for you.
Privatized profit, socialized risk.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Crony Utopia
()
Date: December 01, 2012 01:57PM
Republican Utopia Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> J J J Shabadoo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Transurban owns the lanes for the next 73
> years.
> > Then why are my tax dollars paying to maintain
> it?
> > Its a private road,
>
>
> Welcome to the future Dick Cheney and Halliburton
> had in store for you.
>
> Privatized profit, socialized risk.
Hey, just like Solyndra, et. al!
-------------------------------------------------------
> J J J Shabadoo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Transurban owns the lanes for the next 73
> years.
> > Then why are my tax dollars paying to maintain
> it?
> > Its a private road,
>
>
> Welcome to the future Dick Cheney and Halliburton
> had in store for you.
>
> Privatized profit, socialized risk.
Hey, just like Solyndra, et. al!
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Stinkfist
()
Date: December 01, 2012 02:37PM
I have never taken it. The pace was the same in all lanes. Ie I have seen little benefit. Fyi the construction was a major inconvenience for drivers in this area
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Macolm Forbes
()
Date: December 01, 2012 02:42PM
bill gates Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am so looking forward to leaving this area. Cant
> complain about opportunity, I made my stake but
> the traffic is nuts. This boondoggle is not the
> answer to the problem. Just a scam that some
> private company got rich on.
Fuck this Austrailian company, look what happened with the Greenway boondoggle. Tolls are up what? 400%?
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am so looking forward to leaving this area. Cant
> complain about opportunity, I made my stake but
> the traffic is nuts. This boondoggle is not the
> answer to the problem. Just a scam that some
> private company got rich on.
Fuck this Austrailian company, look what happened with the Greenway boondoggle. Tolls are up what? 400%?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
wenbsyiwll
()
Date: December 01, 2012 06:09PM
cons
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Racer
()
Date: December 04, 2012 06:29AM
My drive on the regular lanes has gone much faster now that construction is finished. I have not yet taken the HOT lanes. But every time I have driven by the lanes have been empty... Except for the state police parked on the shoulder.
Cars exceeding the speed limit on those lanes will be an easy target for cops dedicated to those lanes, making them more dangerous for safe drivers.
Cars exceeding the speed limit on those lanes will be an easy target for cops dedicated to those lanes, making them more dangerous for safe drivers.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
fools who commute
()
Date: December 04, 2012 07:58AM
I laugh at you fools. Mostly those who live in PWC.
What were you thinking?
What were you thinking?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
joking
()
Date: December 04, 2012 05:39PM
If there was a MAJOR accident on the beltway and the only open lanes were the HOT lanes, would they still charge?
I was joking at work they could stage a accident and pay off the hot lanes in 1 night.
I was joking at work they could stage a accident and pay off the hot lanes in 1 night.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
funeralHome
()
Date: December 04, 2012 06:17PM
Screw it. I live right off Braddock and the Beltway. Though pissed about the obvious death-trap the inner loop has become near the Braddock entrance to the 'crash lanes' why fight it? Im going to see if I can open a funeral home in the Ravensworth shopping center - maybe next to the swiss bakery. Ill make a fortune.
To the family of todays fatality I dont mean to make light of the tragedy but I sincerely hope you VDOT and Transurban for every thing they have - your loss was the result of absolute greed and willful disregard for public safety.
To the family of todays fatality I dont mean to make light of the tragedy but I sincerely hope you VDOT and Transurban for every thing they have - your loss was the result of absolute greed and willful disregard for public safety.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
letitsnow
()
Date: December 04, 2012 08:17PM
more good news - brine to melt the snow next to the plastic dividers. Im sure that will work in a 12-20 inch snow storm http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/trafficandcommuting/in-beltway-hot-lanes-where-will-snow-go-and-what-if-a-car-hits-the-dividing-poles/2012/10/20/7f0772c6-17d6-11e2-8792-cf5305eddf60_story.html
they dont even pretend to care. Oh and by the way if you swerve to avoid killing someone and go over the pvc dividers Transurban is proud to announce you will incur major front end damage.
Have a nice day...
they dont even pretend to care. Oh and by the way if you swerve to avoid killing someone and go over the pvc dividers Transurban is proud to announce you will incur major front end damage.
Have a nice day...
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Hay Zeus
()
Date: December 06, 2012 01:46PM
Drove on the beltway for the first time since the fast lanes open. Went from 66 to Rt 1 before rush hour. Than in reverse after after rush hour.
Honestly, i don't understand what the problem is. Unless someone is NOT attention for whole minutes at a time there is no reason to get confused and panic about which lane to be in to avoid paying for a toll or getting a fine.
Traveling from Rt 1 to I-66 the transition from the broken white line to a 18in solid white line for about 1 mile then to double white line for another mile should be plenty of time for someone to realize that something is going to happen and to transition out of those designated lanes.
Honestly, i don't understand what the problem is. Unless someone is NOT attention for whole minutes at a time there is no reason to get confused and panic about which lane to be in to avoid paying for a toll or getting a fine.
Traveling from Rt 1 to I-66 the transition from the broken white line to a 18in solid white line for about 1 mile then to double white line for another mile should be plenty of time for someone to realize that something is going to happen and to transition out of those designated lanes.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
NOVADriver
()
Date: December 06, 2012 02:14PM
@HayZeus: I think what's fucking up a lot of people, is that if you're on the inner loop going towards Tysons and you're in the far left lane you have to move out of that lane to avoid inadvertantly entering the Express Lanes. However, when you're on the outer loop going towards the mixing bowl and you're in the far left lane, you still have to move left again to option into the Express Lanes. If you hold your lane on the outer loop the you'll stay in the non-toll lanes. Notice, all of the incidents related to "HOLY FUCK WHAT ARE THESE LANES?!?!" have been on the inner loop prior to the entrance at Braddock. And frankly, there's just way too much information to absorb on those signs going 60+mph. Wait until summer vacation driving season or better yet all of the snow bird seniors going back and forth from Seacaucus and Miami.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
already?
()
Date: January 05, 2013 10:48PM
Have the rates already gone up on the hot lanes? How long have they been open? A couple months? I travel the inner loop every morning and at the entrance to the hot lanes they list 3 exits. I'm pretty sure the 1st exit was less than a buck when they 1st opened.....maybe 90 cents? It's now $1.05. Just curious as I don't use them and never will.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Dr agridlock
()
Date: January 05, 2013 10:51PM
The tolls are adjusted every 15 minutes based on volume.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
already?
()
Date: January 05, 2013 11:41PM
So the more volume the cheaper it gets? I pass that 1st sign right about 6:30am and from day one it always said I think 90 cents. This week it said $1.05 every morning. Maybe less traffic due to people still on holiday vacation caused higher rates?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 06, 2013 03:26PM
Opposite. The more volume the more expensive it gets in order to reduce the number of people using it. The idea is that it will maintain a constant speed, not necessarily to move the most people possible.
I dunno. I think its already proving to be a complete and utter failure, one in which us taxpayers will have to foot the bill as early as this year if the volume doesnt pick up on it (which it wont because the biggest cause of traffic on 495 was the construction of the damn hot lanes before).
Maybe I am pessimistic and this is just the first few months and people getting used to it, i dunno.
I dunno. I think its already proving to be a complete and utter failure, one in which us taxpayers will have to foot the bill as early as this year if the volume doesnt pick up on it (which it wont because the biggest cause of traffic on 495 was the construction of the damn hot lanes before).
Maybe I am pessimistic and this is just the first few months and people getting used to it, i dunno.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Frank
()
Date: January 06, 2013 04:19PM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Opposite. The more volume the more expensive it
> gets in order to reduce the number of people using
> it. The idea is that it will maintain a constant
> speed, not necessarily to move the most people
> possible.
>
> I dunno. I think its already proving to be a
> complete and utter failure, one in which us
> taxpayers will have to foot the bill as early as
> this year if the volume doesnt pick up on it
> (which it wont because the biggest cause of
> traffic on 495 was the construction of the damn
> hot lanes before).
>
> Maybe I am pessimistic and this is just the first
> few months and people getting used to it, i dunno.
I've yet to see more than a handful of people in it. I'd say we are definitely going to get to pony up for the "bail out" clause of the stupid contract. Too bad they don't let us drive for free if our tax dollars pad the Aussie's bottom line.
The most common thing I see is some tractor trailer pulled over by VSP. They must have some cop over there who just wait for something to do. When the lanes are empty, who cares if some trucker pays to use them?
-------------------------------------------------------
> Opposite. The more volume the more expensive it
> gets in order to reduce the number of people using
> it. The idea is that it will maintain a constant
> speed, not necessarily to move the most people
> possible.
>
> I dunno. I think its already proving to be a
> complete and utter failure, one in which us
> taxpayers will have to foot the bill as early as
> this year if the volume doesnt pick up on it
> (which it wont because the biggest cause of
> traffic on 495 was the construction of the damn
> hot lanes before).
>
> Maybe I am pessimistic and this is just the first
> few months and people getting used to it, i dunno.
I've yet to see more than a handful of people in it. I'd say we are definitely going to get to pony up for the "bail out" clause of the stupid contract. Too bad they don't let us drive for free if our tax dollars pad the Aussie's bottom line.
The most common thing I see is some tractor trailer pulled over by VSP. They must have some cop over there who just wait for something to do. When the lanes are empty, who cares if some trucker pays to use them?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 06, 2013 04:34PM
Its actually a problem. A loaded truck is equivalent to thousands of car trips on pavement condition. Since we residents will be paying for the maintenance of the road, if they are using it, it will mean more cost for us.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Free Ride
()
Date: January 06, 2013 04:41PM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Opposite. The more volume the more expensive it
> gets in order to reduce the number of people using
> it. The idea is that it will maintain a constant
> speed, not necessarily to move the most people
> possible.
>
> I dunno. I think its already proving to be a
> complete and utter failure, one in which us
> taxpayers will have to foot the bill as early as
> this year if the volume doesnt pick up on it
> (which it wont because the biggest cause of
> traffic on 495 was the construction of the damn
> hot lanes before).
>
> Maybe I am pessimistic and this is just the first
> few months and people getting used to it, i dunno.
I tend to agree. Under normal circumstances and everything else equal, I'd expect that use would be somewhat higher right after the initial opening just based on newness/curiosity. Which, based on my admittedly limited personal observation, seemed to be the case. I don't see as many on there as I did in the first few weeks. And it sure doesn't seem to be a significant volume (i.e., maybe a few percent tops). I assume that's why they're reportedly doing a freebie for a few weeks - to try to get more people "hooked."
-------------------------------------------------------
> Opposite. The more volume the more expensive it
> gets in order to reduce the number of people using
> it. The idea is that it will maintain a constant
> speed, not necessarily to move the most people
> possible.
>
> I dunno. I think its already proving to be a
> complete and utter failure, one in which us
> taxpayers will have to foot the bill as early as
> this year if the volume doesnt pick up on it
> (which it wont because the biggest cause of
> traffic on 495 was the construction of the damn
> hot lanes before).
>
> Maybe I am pessimistic and this is just the first
> few months and people getting used to it, i dunno.
I tend to agree. Under normal circumstances and everything else equal, I'd expect that use would be somewhat higher right after the initial opening just based on newness/curiosity. Which, based on my admittedly limited personal observation, seemed to be the case. I don't see as many on there as I did in the first few weeks. And it sure doesn't seem to be a significant volume (i.e., maybe a few percent tops). I assume that's why they're reportedly doing a freebie for a few weeks - to try to get more people "hooked."
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Warhawk
()
Date: January 06, 2013 04:46PM
At most, I've only seen 2 cars at one time on them. Looks like a boondoggle failure to me. Great way to spend our tax dollars, /sarcasm. We should have used the money to buy people's property in Arlington and expanded 66 to 4 lanes in either direction.
__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.
__________________________________
That's not a ladybug, that's a cannapiller.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 27, 2013 09:46PM
Its been a few months since the 495 lanes opened. From a few traffic engineers Ive talked to at FCDOT they say that the use of the lanes has increased steadily over the past couple of months.
So I thought it might turn up some interesting survey results to ask the poll again.
If you have time please fill out this 30 second survey even if your opinion has not changed.
Survey Update
Thanks for anyone who takes the time to give an honest opinion.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/2013 09:54PM by Tysons Engineer.
So I thought it might turn up some interesting survey results to ask the poll again.
If you have time please fill out this 30 second survey even if your opinion has not changed.
Survey Update
Thanks for anyone who takes the time to give an honest opinion.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/2013 09:54PM by Tysons Engineer.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
HOV question
()
Date: January 27, 2013 10:00PM
So why the special EZPASS for the HOV usuage, used nowhere else in the country? For the $1/month fee, maybe? Certainly not to encourage HOV ridership.
Seems to me that only a small percentage actually use these HOT lanes.
Seems to me that only a small percentage actually use these HOT lanes.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Fishy
()
Date: January 27, 2013 10:02PM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Its been a few months since the 495 lanes opened.
> From a few traffic engineers Ive talked to at
> FCDOT they say that the use of the lanes has
> increased steadily over the past couple of
> months.
>
> So I thought it might turn up some interesting
> survey results to ask the poll again.
>
> If you have time please fill out this 30 second
> survey even if your opinion has not changed.
>
> href="http://thetysonscorner.com/hot-lanes-express
> -lanes-up-and-running-this-week/">Survey
> Update
>
> Thanks for anyone who takes the time to give an
> honest opinion.
"Increased steadily" doesn't indicate numbers, actual rates, etc.
Since we're on the hook seems like there should be some information made available re usage/receipts vs plans. I've not seen anything along those lines but granted it's not been very long.
You seem to follow this closer than most so if you happen to come across it please post.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Its been a few months since the 495 lanes opened.
> From a few traffic engineers Ive talked to at
> FCDOT they say that the use of the lanes has
> increased steadily over the past couple of
> months.
>
> So I thought it might turn up some interesting
> survey results to ask the poll again.
>
> If you have time please fill out this 30 second
> survey even if your opinion has not changed.
>
> href="http://thetysonscorner.com/hot-lanes-express
> -lanes-up-and-running-this-week/">Survey
> Update
>
> Thanks for anyone who takes the time to give an
> honest opinion.
"Increased steadily" doesn't indicate numbers, actual rates, etc.
Since we're on the hook seems like there should be some information made available re usage/receipts vs plans. I've not seen anything along those lines but granted it's not been very long.
You seem to follow this closer than most so if you happen to come across it please post.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 27, 2013 10:06PM
Fishy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Its been a few months since the 495 lanes
> opened.
> > From a few traffic engineers Ive talked to at
> > FCDOT they say that the use of the lanes has
> > increased steadily over the past couple of
> > months.
> >
> > So I thought it might turn up some interesting
> > survey results to ask the poll again.
> >
> > If you have time please fill out this 30 second
> > survey even if your opinion has not changed.
> >
> > >
> href="http://thetysonscorner.com/hot-lanes-express
>
> >
> -lanes-up-and-running-this-week/">Survey
> > Update
> >
> > Thanks for anyone who takes the time to give an
> > honest opinion.
>
>
> "Increased steadily" doesn't indicate numbers,
> actual rates, etc.
>
> Since we're on the hook seems like there should be
> some information made available re usage/receipts
> vs plans. I've not seen anything along those
> lines but granted it's not been very long.
>
> You seem to follow this closer than most so if you
> happen to come across it please post.
A couple of sources publicly also WaPo and
http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/01/495-express-lanes-usage-increases--83984.html
For the record I am neither for or against 495 Express. I was skeptical, still remain skeptical. Looking forward to seeing the results of this poll a few months after their opening. I have no reason to doubt the validity of the reports that say the usage is up. Anecdotal evidence from my own commute has shown a few more cars coming off of some of the ramps compared to previous months.
That being said, its gone from me seeing 3 or 4 cars to now 5 or 6 cars during my 10 minute drive.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Its been a few months since the 495 lanes
> opened.
> > From a few traffic engineers Ive talked to at
> > FCDOT they say that the use of the lanes has
> > increased steadily over the past couple of
> > months.
> >
> > So I thought it might turn up some interesting
> > survey results to ask the poll again.
> >
> > If you have time please fill out this 30 second
> > survey even if your opinion has not changed.
> >
> > >
> href="http://thetysonscorner.com/hot-lanes-express
>
> >
> -lanes-up-and-running-this-week/">Survey
> > Update
> >
> > Thanks for anyone who takes the time to give an
> > honest opinion.
>
>
> "Increased steadily" doesn't indicate numbers,
> actual rates, etc.
>
> Since we're on the hook seems like there should be
> some information made available re usage/receipts
> vs plans. I've not seen anything along those
> lines but granted it's not been very long.
>
> You seem to follow this closer than most so if you
> happen to come across it please post.
A couple of sources publicly also WaPo and
http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/01/495-express-lanes-usage-increases--83984.html
For the record I am neither for or against 495 Express. I was skeptical, still remain skeptical. Looking forward to seeing the results of this poll a few months after their opening. I have no reason to doubt the validity of the reports that say the usage is up. Anecdotal evidence from my own commute has shown a few more cars coming off of some of the ramps compared to previous months.
That being said, its gone from me seeing 3 or 4 cars to now 5 or 6 cars during my 10 minute drive.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 27, 2013 10:10PM
This is VDOT/FCDOT/Transurbans actual press release on December usage also.
https://www.495expresslanes.com/feature/1064
The January numbers will show whether its a trend or if the number has hit a static plateau.
https://www.495expresslanes.com/feature/1064
The January numbers will show whether its a trend or if the number has hit a static plateau.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
HOV question
()
Date: January 27, 2013 10:20PM
It would be nice if the focus is on increasing HOV ridership and not on how much tolls transwhatever can collect. All I remember is the cars crashing, because the signage and lines were unclear. So if they have a couple more riders since then big deal!
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Fishy
()
Date: January 27, 2013 10:34PM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> A couple of sources publicly also WaPo and
>
> http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/01/495-express-l
> anes-usage-increases--83984.html
>
> For the record I am neither for or against 495
> Express. I was skeptical, still remain skeptical.
> Looking forward to seeing the results of this poll
> a few months after their opening. I have no reason
> to doubt the validity of the reports that say the
> usage is up. Anecdotal evidence from my own
> commute has shown a few more cars coming off of
> some of the ramps compared to previous months.
>
> That being said, its gone from me seeing 3 or 4
> cars to now 5 or 6 cars during my 10 minute drive.
Thanks for the links.
Yeah, I don't doubt that it's "up." The question is whether it's up to where it needs to be. I don't have a good feel for what the estimates were and how those numbers compare to usage and revenue plans.
Also still kind of early to try to ascertain what the "steady-state" will be as far as those numbers go. Independent of having a gauge for magnitude, I'd say that's about as I'd expect it so far. Question is do they now table top at ~24K/workday or do they continue up at N% rate and what the rate is.
My informal observations are the same. A few more here and there but not any major increase. At least during the times that I'm on the road.
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> A couple of sources publicly also WaPo and
>
> http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/01/495-express-l
> anes-usage-increases--83984.html
>
> For the record I am neither for or against 495
> Express. I was skeptical, still remain skeptical.
> Looking forward to seeing the results of this poll
> a few months after their opening. I have no reason
> to doubt the validity of the reports that say the
> usage is up. Anecdotal evidence from my own
> commute has shown a few more cars coming off of
> some of the ramps compared to previous months.
>
> That being said, its gone from me seeing 3 or 4
> cars to now 5 or 6 cars during my 10 minute drive.
Thanks for the links.
Yeah, I don't doubt that it's "up." The question is whether it's up to where it needs to be. I don't have a good feel for what the estimates were and how those numbers compare to usage and revenue plans.
Also still kind of early to try to ascertain what the "steady-state" will be as far as those numbers go. Independent of having a gauge for magnitude, I'd say that's about as I'd expect it so far. Question is do they now table top at ~24K/workday or do they continue up at N% rate and what the rate is.
My informal observations are the same. A few more here and there but not any major increase. At least during the times that I'm on the road.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
jim143
()
Date: January 28, 2013 08:01AM
Wouldn't the fact that the lanes were free for 2 weeks in January somewhat skew the average monthly usage upward? Also, why is there so much more salt on those lanes? Less traffic to disperse it (if that's possible) or more salt?
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Lexus Lanes
()
Date: January 28, 2013 09:49AM
I will not pay to use the lanes. The contractor should reimburse me for road damage to my 95 corolla during construction. I love the car and want to keep it another 18 years.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
HOV question
()
Date: January 28, 2013 09:52AM
These lanes will be exactly like the ICC in maryland. DEAD.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 28, 2013 10:15AM
I wanted to update the link to the poll (we relocated it to another page). Thanks for those who have already weighed in.
I think my site is going to track the monthly public consensus over the next year with the usage numbers and see if there is a correlation. I think it will be very interesting whether it stays at the current numbers or if for whatever reason usage goes up to see if sociologically the project also is seen in better terms.
Based on our last poll, most people thought it was an ill-thought concept or atleast a waste of money that wouldn't improve their own commute.
For anyone who hasn't filled out the poll please use this link instead. Thank you.
Updated 30 Second Survey/Poll
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/28/2013 10:15AM by Tysons Engineer.
I think my site is going to track the monthly public consensus over the next year with the usage numbers and see if there is a correlation. I think it will be very interesting whether it stays at the current numbers or if for whatever reason usage goes up to see if sociologically the project also is seen in better terms.
Based on our last poll, most people thought it was an ill-thought concept or atleast a waste of money that wouldn't improve their own commute.
For anyone who hasn't filled out the poll please use this link instead. Thank you.
Updated 30 Second Survey/Poll
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/28/2013 10:15AM by Tysons Engineer.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
duhhhhhh
()
Date: January 28, 2013 10:21AM
I had to make a trip from National Harbor to Dulles @ 5:30pm last week.
I took the Express lanes because I've gotten used to the inner loop being a parking lot. What had been a 1.5 hour fiasco in the past was a 45 minutes trip that was smooth as silk.
I don't know if it's just being used to all the construction traffic or what, but even the regular lanes were moving at speed, I was pretty impressed.
Best trip I've had on the inner loop in rush hour in probably 15 years.
Two thumbs up for the express lanes.
I took the Express lanes because I've gotten used to the inner loop being a parking lot. What had been a 1.5 hour fiasco in the past was a 45 minutes trip that was smooth as silk.
I don't know if it's just being used to all the construction traffic or what, but even the regular lanes were moving at speed, I was pretty impressed.
Best trip I've had on the inner loop in rush hour in probably 15 years.
Two thumbs up for the express lanes.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
huhhhhhh?
()
Date: January 28, 2013 10:48AM
duhhhhhh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...
> I don't know if it's just being used to all the
> construction traffic or what, but even the regular
> lanes were moving at speed, I was pretty
> impressed.
>
> Best trip I've had on the inner loop in rush hour
> in probably 15 years.
>
> Two thumbs up for the express lanes.
Wait a sec...
So you're praising the express lanes because the construction for the express lanes is no longer screwing up traffic? lol
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...
> I don't know if it's just being used to all the
> construction traffic or what, but even the regular
> lanes were moving at speed, I was pretty
> impressed.
>
> Best trip I've had on the inner loop in rush hour
> in probably 15 years.
>
> Two thumbs up for the express lanes.
Wait a sec...
So you're praising the express lanes because the construction for the express lanes is no longer screwing up traffic? lol
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
duhhhhhh
()
Date: January 28, 2013 12:13PM
That came out a little wrong...
I haven't seen the inner loop run at speed, in rush hour, especially through Tysons, in more than a decade (if ever).
The level of my amazement at a freeway working as expected may have been somewhat impacted by the past few years of utter chaos.
I haven't seen the inner loop run at speed, in rush hour, especially through Tysons, in more than a decade (if ever).
The level of my amazement at a freeway working as expected may have been somewhat impacted by the past few years of utter chaos.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gotcha
()
Date: January 28, 2013 12:25PM
duhhhhhh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That came out a little wrong...
>
> I haven't seen the inner loop run at speed, in
> rush hour, especially through Tysons, in more than
> a decade (if ever).
>
> The level of my amazement at a freeway working as
> expected may have been somewhat impacted by the
> past few years of utter chaos.
Yeah, no doubt having the construction done (for now) and added lanes has helped.
The question is more whether that was the best way to do it and whether it's worth whatever it ends up costing us. Done deal now so...
Time will tell.
-------------------------------------------------------
> That came out a little wrong...
>
> I haven't seen the inner loop run at speed, in
> rush hour, especially through Tysons, in more than
> a decade (if ever).
>
> The level of my amazement at a freeway working as
> expected may have been somewhat impacted by the
> past few years of utter chaos.
Yeah, no doubt having the construction done (for now) and added lanes has helped.
The question is more whether that was the best way to do it and whether it's worth whatever it ends up costing us. Done deal now so...
Time will tell.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
duhhhhhh
()
Date: January 28, 2013 12:51PM
Unless I'm mistaken, it was privately funded so it didn't cost us anything upfront.
My long-term concern will be the tolls going up like Dulles Toll Road to the point of it costing $15 to drive from Dulles to Springfield but you know what...
Fuck it. People need to either move closer to home, use mass transit, telecommute or go HOV anyway. Environmentally & physically we can't support endless increases in the number of cars on the road.
Maybe if commutes get bad enough, employers would be forced to enact telecommuting in order to keep good employees.
Hell, we could cut traffic around here in half just by taking fed gov workers off the road.
My long-term concern will be the tolls going up like Dulles Toll Road to the point of it costing $15 to drive from Dulles to Springfield but you know what...
Fuck it. People need to either move closer to home, use mass transit, telecommute or go HOV anyway. Environmentally & physically we can't support endless increases in the number of cars on the road.
Maybe if commutes get bad enough, employers would be forced to enact telecommuting in order to keep good employees.
Hell, we could cut traffic around here in half just by taking fed gov workers off the road.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Gotcha
()
Date: January 28, 2013 01:39PM
duhhhhhh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unless I'm mistaken, it was privately funded so it
> didn't cost us anything upfront.
>
> My long-term concern will be the tolls going up
> like Dulles Toll Road to the point of it costing
> $15 to drive from Dulles to Springfield but you
> know what...
>
> Fuck it. People need to either move closer to
> home, use mass transit, telecommute or go HOV
> anyway. Environmentally & physically we can't
> support endless increases in the number of cars on
> the road.
>
> Maybe if commutes get bad enough, employers would
> be forced to enact telecommuting in order to keep
> good employees.
>
> Hell, we could cut traffic around here in half
> just by taking fed gov workers off the road.
That's why I said ends up costing us. Lots of "free" things end up costing a ton of money. The deal seems very heavily weighted in favor of the private company in terms of future operating risk. Guess we'll see...
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unless I'm mistaken, it was privately funded so it
> didn't cost us anything upfront.
>
> My long-term concern will be the tolls going up
> like Dulles Toll Road to the point of it costing
> $15 to drive from Dulles to Springfield but you
> know what...
>
> Fuck it. People need to either move closer to
> home, use mass transit, telecommute or go HOV
> anyway. Environmentally & physically we can't
> support endless increases in the number of cars on
> the road.
>
> Maybe if commutes get bad enough, employers would
> be forced to enact telecommuting in order to keep
> good employees.
>
> Hell, we could cut traffic around here in half
> just by taking fed gov workers off the road.
That's why I said ends up costing us. Lots of "free" things end up costing a ton of money. The deal seems very heavily weighted in favor of the private company in terms of future operating risk. Guess we'll see...
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Tysons Engineer
()
Date: January 29, 2013 01:46PM
Thank you to everyone who has responded, we have had 85 total responses so far after only a couple days, we'd like to get above 200 by the end of this week to have a decent sample size (all be it an online sample)... then again who ever said phone polls didn't skew towards older generations also.
If you haven't filled out the poll, it takes 30 seconds and is an opportunity to gripe or praise the project how you see it. Our end goal this year is to have a month to month trending line that compares sentiment to usage, but that takes community involvement to get good feedback.
Sorry to all those who could care less about transportation and would rather discuss the hygienic conditions of the Burke Glory Days instead.
http://thetysonscorner.com/495-express-lane-usage-up-has-consensus-changed/
If you haven't filled out the poll, it takes 30 seconds and is an opportunity to gripe or praise the project how you see it. Our end goal this year is to have a month to month trending line that compares sentiment to usage, but that takes community involvement to get good feedback.
Sorry to all those who could care less about transportation and would rather discuss the hygienic conditions of the Burke Glory Days instead.
http://thetysonscorner.com/495-express-lane-usage-up-has-consensus-changed/
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
$4 toll
()
Date: January 29, 2013 08:18PM
Why do so many 18 wheelers get caught in the express lanes? I've seen one barrel over the boundary to get out of the express lanes. I think a lot of those truckers are from out of state and accidentally get stuck in the toll road. I've seen many of them get pulled over by the VSP.
The merge on the northbound lanes near Georgetown Pike is very poorly designed. There is a long stretch before the dotted lines that could have been used to taper the merge lane more gradually. What's up with that VDOT? That's like building a BMW without cup holders.
The merge on the northbound lanes near Georgetown Pike is very poorly designed. There is a long stretch before the dotted lines that could have been used to taper the merge lane more gradually. What's up with that VDOT? That's like building a BMW without cup holders.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
495 driver
()
Date: January 30, 2013 10:42PM
I would like to strangle the idiot that designed the on area near Braddock Road. If someone is coming down 395 south to get on the express lanes headed towards Tyson's they have to cross 5 or 6 lanes to get to the Lexus Lanes - all this has to be done in a space of about a mile. It is totally stupid and there is going to be a fatal accident there soon.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
Timy
()
Date: February 09, 2013 10:39AM
Whatthe hell is going on with the regular lanes, potholes popping up everywhere since Transurban repaired and repaved it. Some of that ashpalt is less than 90 days old, cracks and potholes everywhere.I hope this doesn't turn out to be another Boston Big Dig problem.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
katiesmith
()
Date: February 09, 2013 08:34PM
We should charge for use of roads, so I'm glad that this is starting to happen more. Those who use them should pay. But, we would be better to have a system similar to the Low Emission Zone system in London and Berlin. For those who aren't familiar with it when you enter the area if you have most pick-ups, SUVs, minivans, vans, buses, and delivery type trucks pay a fee for the emission and damage they cause to the roads. This has been very useful in these cities in help decreasing air pollution. In some very congested areas too everyone is charged and those listed above pay that fee in addition to when they enter the more general area.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
katiesmith
()
Date: February 09, 2013 08:36PM
I doubt anyone is getting rich on the fees they are charging. It costs money to maintain the roads. I think they should charge more. You pay each time you get on the bus or train, why not pay to use the roads.
bill gates Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am so looking forward to leaving this area. Cant
> complain about opportunity, I made my stake but
> the traffic is nuts. This boondoggle is not the
> answer to the problem. Just a scam that some
> private company got rich on.
bill gates Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am so looking forward to leaving this area. Cant
> complain about opportunity, I made my stake but
> the traffic is nuts. This boondoggle is not the
> answer to the problem. Just a scam that some
> private company got rich on.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
katiesmith
()
Date: February 09, 2013 08:39PM
It took less than a week to rebuild escaltors in NYC after the storm. But it takes a year to put one escaltor in Dupont? The corruption is crazy. If things weren't so corrupt the silver line would be done by now.
Republican Mathematician Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > The concept has benefits;
> >
> > -The new lanes were built for essentially
> nothing
> > where as in the past it would have drawn upon a
> > limited source of transportation funding,
> thereby
> > reducing the availability of funds for other
> > projects.
>
>
> "built for essentially nothing" -- yep. They found
> a magical accounting practice that allowed them to
> build a major road without spending a dime.
>
> I love doublespeak or newspeak. It's so cute.
>
>
> >
> > -The new lanes required extensive new
> > infrastructure in the connecting communities
> that
> > weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public
> > partnership including local road widenings to
> > support the new anticipated traffic as well as
> > future upgrades that will be necessary.
>
>
> So how was it built for essentially nothing,
> again?
>
>
> Seems to me it benefits politically influential
> people. Fluor Transurban is a consortium of
> Transurban, an Australian toll operator, and
> Fluor, whose board consists of the Chairman of
> California JP Morgan, Peter Barker, and Alan
> Bennett, a director of Halliburton.
>
> http://www.fluor.com/about_fluor/leadership/board_
> of_directors/Pages/default.aspx
>
> Isn't it funny that both the silver line and the
> hot lanes were constructed by people with
> connections to the Bush administration?? No-bid
> contracts are awesome, if you own the people in
> positions to grant them.
Republican Mathematician Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > The concept has benefits;
> >
> > -The new lanes were built for essentially
> nothing
> > where as in the past it would have drawn upon a
> > limited source of transportation funding,
> thereby
> > reducing the availability of funds for other
> > projects.
>
>
> "built for essentially nothing" -- yep. They found
> a magical accounting practice that allowed them to
> build a major road without spending a dime.
>
> I love doublespeak or newspeak. It's so cute.
>
>
> >
> > -The new lanes required extensive new
> > infrastructure in the connecting communities
> that
> > weren’t part of the Fluor Private-Public
> > partnership including local road widenings to
> > support the new anticipated traffic as well as
> > future upgrades that will be necessary.
>
>
> So how was it built for essentially nothing,
> again?
>
>
> Seems to me it benefits politically influential
> people. Fluor Transurban is a consortium of
> Transurban, an Australian toll operator, and
> Fluor, whose board consists of the Chairman of
> California JP Morgan, Peter Barker, and Alan
> Bennett, a director of Halliburton.
>
> http://www.fluor.com/about_fluor/leadership/board_
> of_directors/Pages/default.aspx
>
> Isn't it funny that both the silver line and the
> hot lanes were constructed by people with
> connections to the Bush administration?? No-bid
> contracts are awesome, if you own the people in
> positions to grant them.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
katiesmith
()
Date: February 09, 2013 08:50PM
I'd take the survey if it wasn't so cookie cutter. For 1. How do I know I'm not an engineer? 2 and 3 I don't work in that area. I generally support the idea of privatizing roads, but I won't use it because I would rather take the metro than take a bus or drive.
Also please note this system is not the same as London's and it would be better to make it closer to London's. London penalizes those who cause the most pollution better SUVs, minivans, pickups and larger are the ones who may in the larger area and only everyone pays in the closer in areas. So we need to charge those who cause the pollution the most for it.
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks to everyone who has submitted an answer on
> the poll. We'd like to get up to 500 respondents
> so if you havent filled it out, its 3 questions
> (all checkboxes) and takes maximum 30 seconds to
> fill out and helps track what the general Fairfax
> opinion on the project is, or atleast the online
> opinion.
Also please note this system is not the same as London's and it would be better to make it closer to London's. London penalizes those who cause the most pollution better SUVs, minivans, pickups and larger are the ones who may in the larger area and only everyone pays in the closer in areas. So we need to charge those who cause the pollution the most for it.
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks to everyone who has submitted an answer on
> the poll. We'd like to get up to 500 respondents
> so if you havent filled it out, its 3 questions
> (all checkboxes) and takes maximum 30 seconds to
> fill out and helps track what the general Fairfax
> opinion on the project is, or atleast the online
> opinion.
Re: 495 Express (Pros and Cons) - Resident Survey
Posted by:
MPbGF
()
Date: November 30, 2016 08:10PM
Tysons Engineer Wrote:
> Commuters have long been awaiting the new
> Mega-Project 495 Express Lanes completion since
> the merits of the project were first announced in
> 2004. If you have been living under a local news
> rock over the past decade, essentially the new
> lanes are a congestion pricing system that based
> on the amount of traffic at any given time will
> charge a corresponding fee per mile to either
> attract or reduce users.
> Commuters have long been awaiting the new
> Mega-Project 495 Express Lanes completion since
> the merits of the project were first announced in
> 2004. If you have been living under a local news
> rock over the past decade, essentially the new
> lanes are a congestion pricing system that based
> on the amount of traffic at any given time will
> charge a corresponding fee per mile to either
> attract or reduce users.