floris mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does anyone know the true headcount on how many
> Floris/FM freshmen are going to South Lakes????


I can report that last Thursday there were three sets of parents/students registering, or trying to register, at Chantilly from South Lakes. One Mom told me her son was scheduled to start at SLHS and one said Westfield/SLHS rded. So I'm assuming they were trying to get into Chantilly so I'm not sure if there was space available or what. Remember back during pupil-placement time we were told that Chantilly was completely full (although we know that is false). I was registering mine too and and all four of us, including myself, were "minorities". The student services office was literally full.

Cool, all the minorities are leaving SLHS and going to Chantilly

Leavem Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cool, all the minorities are leaving SLHS and
> going to Chantilly


Yeah, the RD process revealed much about the racism and bigotry at SLHS. Chantilly has a much more progressive-minded integrated community. Best of luck to all involved.

Navy Mom, hurling slanderous comments will land you in the brig. SL parents never said anything bad; all the bad comments were from the other side.

Navy Brig Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SL parents never said anything
> bad;

Except about those who shop at Shoppers.

Captain's Mast for you, sailor.

Berdhuis, you keep repeating this same tired meme, even though you know it's not true, and even though you know exactly why the SL community did not want to place a larger percentage of Title I kids at SL. You ignore that the SL parents did not think it would be fair to the McNair kids or the SL kids, and that the McNair kids would be better served by remaining at Westfield. You seem a tad too sensitive about where you live. Give it a rest or it's the plank for you.

Navy Brig Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Berdhuis, you keep repeating this same tired meme,
> even though you know it's not true, and even
> though you know exactly why the SL community did
> not want to place a larger percentage of Title I
> kids at SL. You ignore that the SL parents did
> not think it would be fair to the McNair kids or
> the SL kids, and that the McNair kids would be
> better served by remaining at Westfield. You seem
> a tad too sensitive about where you live. Give it
> a rest or it's the plank for you.

Predictably and right on cue. Thanks for the memories, Navy Brig. I won't miss you and your like-minded group. Berhuis, I admire you for trying...

Enjoy those misconceptions and bitter pills, Navy Mom. Hopefully you will find the gumption to move on. Your neighbors have.

South Lakes es numero uno?? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about Latinos Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Let's take a look at how Latinos fare at SLHS:
> >
> > In 2006-07 18 Latinos took the SAT with about
> 35%
> > scoring above the national average.
> >
> > In 2005-06 21 Latinos took the SAT with about
> 33%
> > scroing above the national average.
> >
> > In 2004-05 12 Latinos took the SAT with about
> 17%
> > scoring above the natonal average.
> >
> > In 2006-07 19 11th and 12th grade Latinos
> > participated in IB with just 7 taking the
> exams.
> >
> > In 2005-06 18 11th and 12th grade Latinos
> > participated in IB with just 8 taking the
> exams.
> >
> > Why isn't this school doing more to improve the
> > participation rate of Latinos on SAT and IB?
> >
> > I thought this school was "on the right track"?
>
>
>
>

Why would minority parents want to keep their kids out of South Lakes? They will get a lot of attention there and get a fine education.

is this diatribe? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> are things really better at SLHS Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > As far as participation rates for 12th graders
> at
> > SLHS-an indication of whether the student is
> going
> > the college route-I found some interesting
> data:
> >
> > In 2006-07 40 Black students took the SAT with
> > about 28% scoring above the national average.
> >
> > In 2005-06 38 Black students took the SAT with
> > about 18% scoring above the national average.
> >
> > In 2004-05 42 Black students took the SAT with
> > about 24% scoring above the national average.
> >
> > It does not look like the principal, staff, or
> PTA
> > at SLHS is focused on more Black students
> taking
> > the SAT and/or providing them with SAT prep to
> > help them improve their performance.
>
>
African American students can expect the SLHS staff and community to provide a nurturing environment to help them excell. Bruce Butler is the best principal FCPS has to offer by golly!! We should clone him.

Despite all the yammer, Navy Mom appears to be a minority in that she is one of the few not going to SLHS (and trying to work it out,,,,not spewing bilge bile).

Berdhuis: YOu do need a new schtick. You and Joe Lieberman have strange bedfellows.

Once FairfaxCAPS wins the lawsuit there will be no more redistricting. Make sure you donate, we have a very expensive lawyer and lots of administration costs to pay.

navy parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Yeah, the RD process revealed much about the
> racism and bigotry at SLHS.

I was at Oakton HS standing in line with about 15 parents from SLHS that are pupil placing into Oakton. I was surprised to see that all the Moms pupil placing their kids were what I would call low life minority. It seems those that are pupil placing out of SLHS are the minorities. There's a huge minority influx at Oakton.

Are you clammy because 'low-life' minorities are moving to Oakton?

Well, you can't really blame the minorities being RD'd. Through the RD, people like Berduis repeatedly explained the part of McNair that could be RD'd to SLHS are high performing minority kids, yet SLHS refuses to take them. The message is loud and clear from SLHS, isn't it?

I wouldn't count on Berdhuis as a font of knowledge. You might just be spewing bilge bile, dontcha know?

But you can't deny that part of McNair consists of high performing kids, only thing is most of them are not white. I don't want to start another round of debate, but want to point out there are rooms for SLHS to make the new coming minorities feel welcome, not just the white students.

I am sure that SL is totally welcoming any and all new students. Period.

minorities get the message Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But you can't deny that part of McNair consists of
> high performing kids, only thing is most of them
> are not white. I don't want to start another round
> of debate, but want to point out there are rooms
> for SLHS to make the new coming minorities feel
> welcome, not just the white students.


South Lakes can't handle it. They are doing a lousy job of educating the minorities that they have. Other schools like Lee, Annandale, Stuart, Falls Church are getting these kids in advanced courses, SAT prep, etc, South Lakes is not.

SLHS has one of the lowest IB participation rates for minorities.

SLHS has one of the lowest SAT take rates for minorities.

It is no wonder that these parents are staying away. Good for them for looking out for their kids' best interests. These kids would be much better served at Oakton, Herndon or Chantilly.

I find it ironic how the SLHS would call all the RD parents racists. I think it is time for this PTA and staff to take a good long look in the mirror and admit how their indifference to these kids has hurt them academically.

The numbers don't lie. Butler better get his act together.

Not Bilge Bile? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wouldn't count on Berdhuis as a font of
> knowledge. You might just be spewing bilge bile,
> dontcha know?

I don't count myself as a font of knowledge, either, but I have been an acute observer of my own neighborhood for the past several years.

Devil to pay for you, shipmate.

minorities get the message Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But you can't deny that part of McNair consists of
> high performing kids, only thing is most of them
> are not white. I don't want to start another round
> of debate, but want to point out there are rooms
> for SLHS to make the new coming minorities feel
> welcome, not just the white students.

95% of the Mothers and kids weren't in the RD'd area, they were current minority students that go to SLHS that now are going to attend Oakton. I thought it was interesting because I thought pupil placing was an upper middle class thing, but it appears that low income mothers are the real ones doing it.

Clammy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was at Oakton HS standing in line with about 15
> parents from SLHS that are pupil placing into
> Oakton. I was surprised to see that all the Moms
> pupil placing their kids were what I would call
> low life minority. It seems those that are pupil
> placing out of SLHS are the minorities. There's a
> huge minority influx at Oakton.


What are "low life" minorities? Please define for the rest of us.

Thanks, FM Mom. Clammy, and you do make me clammy, and you say more about yourself with your post that maybe you intend. You are the low life.

FM mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Clammy Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I was at Oakton HS standing in line with about
> 15
> > parents from SLHS that are pupil placing into
> > Oakton. I was surprised to see that all the
> Moms
> > pupil placing their kids were what I would call
> > low life minority. It seems those that are
> pupil
> > placing out of SLHS are the minorities. There's
> a
> > huge minority influx at Oakton.
>
>
> What are "low life" minorities? Please define for
> the rest of us.

My friend's son graduated this year with an FCPS IB diploma and has a full-ride physics scholarship, plus another engineering scholarship, at a top Virginia school. He reports that the "calculus for engineers" class he's taking is going to be a breeze, and that the one required writing class is easier than 10th grade classes were. He says he looks forward to a fairly easy first year at college while he gets grounded and works with professors to help him decide, eventually, which field in physics he's going to pursue. He's also enjoying his chemistry class, having had excellent grounding in pre-IB chemistry. He couldn't tell my friend whether he felt IB prepared him better for college because he has no experience with AP, except that his brother, who took AP calc BC with a score of 5, struggled with calc his first year in college.

One kid, one view, one IB diploma.

Report from College Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My friend's son graduated this year with an FCPS
> IB diploma and has a full-ride physics
> scholarship, plus another engineering scholarship,
> at a top Virginia school. He reports that the
> "calculus for engineers" class he's taking is
> going to be a breeze, and that the one required
> writing class is easier than 10th grade classes
> were. He says he looks forward to a fairly easy
> first year at college while he gets grounded and
> works with professors to help him decide,
> eventually, which field in physics he's going to
> pursue. He's also enjoying his chemistry class,
> having had excellent grounding in pre-IB
> chemistry. He couldn't tell my friend whether he
> felt IB prepared him better for college because he
> has no experience with AP, except that his
> brother, who took AP calc BC with a score of 5,
> struggled with calc his first year in college.
>
> One kid, one view, one IB diploma.



Wow, do you write the "Bud Light" commercials, too?

SLHS IB certainly didn't hold back 30 recent SLHS graduates that are now attending UVA.

Go Hoo's!

Report from College Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My friend's son graduated this year with an FCPS
> IB diploma and has a full-ride physics
> scholarship, plus another engineering scholarship,
> at a top Virginia school. He reports that the
> "calculus for engineers" class he's taking is
> going to be a breeze, and that the one required
> writing class is easier than 10th grade classes
> were. He says he looks forward to a fairly easy
> first year at college while he gets grounded and
> works with professors to help him decide,
> eventually, which field in physics he's going to
> pursue. He's also enjoying his chemistry class,
> having had excellent grounding in pre-IB
> chemistry. He couldn't tell my friend whether he
> felt IB prepared him better for college because he
> has no experience with AP, except that his
> brother, who took AP calc BC with a score of 5,
> struggled with calc his first year in college.
>
> One kid, one view, one IB diploma.


As has been covered ad nauseum - the key phrase in your post is 'IB Diploma'.

As previously noted, the IB diploma rate at SLHS is shockingly low - no-one has ever explained why.

I have no reason to either defend or criticize Bruce Butler, other than to mention that by reputation he is well thought of and engaged in a job that is by most any description challenging.

And generally I do think principals in particular need to be highly accountable.

But the call for Mr. Butler to get his act together may be unfair. It would be an interesting social science exercise, particularly if an unbiased source could be utilized (easier said than done), but it strikes me that the reason minority performance at South Lakes is desultory is not due to the circumstance of pigmentation. No, my guess is that it has a considerably higher number of students from families receiving forms of public assistance, including 8(a) vouchers.

And nothing has proven more deadly to aspirations or work ethic than the narcotic like, stultifying effect of Great Society welfare programs. No one should be surprised at what is going on at SLHS in the minority community - social entitlements bring with them cultural problems that are more pernicious than any other. Again, just an opinion, not sufficiently grounded in research. But as a fair guess, I would go with it. And from this perspective I would take pains to be fair to Mr. Butler and his staff. We should expect a lot from school leaders, but they cannot be expected to work magic.

realmanofgenius Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Report from College Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > My friend's son graduated this year with an
> FCPS
> > IB diploma and has a full-ride physics
> > scholarship, plus another engineering
> scholarship,
> > at a top Virginia school. He reports that the
> > "calculus for engineers" class he's taking is
> > going to be a breeze, and that the one required
> > writing class is easier than 10th grade classes
> > were. He says he looks forward to a fairly easy
> > first year at college while he gets grounded
> and
> > works with professors to help him decide,
> > eventually, which field in physics he's going
> to
> > pursue. He's also enjoying his chemistry class,
> > having had excellent grounding in pre-IB
> > chemistry. He couldn't tell my friend whether
> he
> > felt IB prepared him better for college because
> he
> > has no experience with AP, except that his
> > brother, who took AP calc BC with a score of 5,
> > struggled with calc his first year in college.
> >
> > One kid, one view, one IB diploma.
>
>
>
> Wow, do you write the "Bud Light" commercials,
> too?



It's great that your IB Diploma friend is breezing through his freshmen classes. It also might be interesting to compare that with his brother who took AP calc (and scored well on the test) and then struggled in college calc. Unless they both went to the same schools, it's really hard to draw any conclusions. If the older son went to MIT, Cal Tech, etc, that might explain why his frosh calc caused the kid to struggle...particularly if the younger son is going to a top state school versus a top national school. (Also, maybe the older boy met the love of his life early freshmen year and found it hard to concentrate on anything but her.) I think fair comparisons are really hard to make...just too many variables.

Right on, right on.

please Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> But the call for Mr. Butler to get his act
> together may be unfair. It would be an
> interesting social science exercise, particularly
> if an unbiased source could be utilized (easier
> said than done), but it strikes me that the reason
> minority performance at South Lakes is desultory
> is not due to the circumstance of pigmentation.
> No, my guess is that it has a considerably higher
> number of students from families receiving forms
> of public assistance, including 8(a) vouchers.
>
> And nothing has proven more deadly to aspirations
> or work ethic than the narcotic like, stultifying
> effect of Great Society welfare programs. No one
> should be surprised at what is going on at SLHS in
> the minority community - social entitlements bring
> with them cultural problems that are more
> pernicious than any other. Again, just an
> opinion, not sufficiently grounded in research.
> But as a fair guess, I would go with it. And from
> this perspective I would take pains to be fair to
> Mr. Butler and his staff. We should expect a lot
> from school leaders, but they cannot be expected
> to work magic.

I have a modest proposal. Think about what results in a successful life for students. What do they need to learn to achieve their potential?

Once they leave college, who looks at their grades? Usually nobody. If their grades are reviewed upon hiring just after graduation, are they ever reviewed again? Not likely.

The strongest variable in career success is career satisfaction. That means you're comfortable with your work and peers and, as a result, your performance is maxed out. Another key variable is interpersonal skills - how well you communicate, how effective are you at leading, following, sharing a common goal or task. Except for specialized technical jobs, e.g. software development, etc., it's the quality of your ability to get along that counts (and even among developers, at times;)

In terms of property values, I can understand the concerns about living on one district and then having that changed. However, in terms of the outcomes of a high school education, why isn't there a concern for classes or atmospheres that promoted the qualities of teamwork and the task of identifying the form of study that is most amenable to the student? You can do this just as well at SLHS as you can at LHS.

If you want to assure your children a great shot at life, teach them tolerance and expose them to a variety of cultures and classes. Don't force them to think that their specific high school is a make or break event any more than straight "A's" are a make or break event. And if they're going to SLHS instead of Madison or Oakton, by all means don't fill them with the hostility you may feel about this. They will miss a real opportunity to learn about the larger world and hot to adapt to change.

please Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have no reason to either defend or criticize
> Bruce Butler, other than to mention that by
> reputation he is well thought of and engaged in a
> job that is by most any description challenging.
>
> And generally I do think principals in particular
> need to be highly accountable.
>
> But the call for Mr. Butler to get his act
> together may be unfair. It would be an
> interesting social science exercise, particularly
> if an unbiased source could be utilized (easier
> said than done), but it strikes me that the reason
> minority performance at South Lakes is desultory
> is not due to the circumstance of pigmentation.
> No, my guess is that it has a considerably higher
> number of students from families receiving forms
> of public assistance, including 8(a) vouchers.
>
> And nothing has proven more deadly to aspirations
> or work ethic than the narcotic like, stultifying
> effect of Great Society welfare programs. No one
> should be surprised at what is going on at SLHS in
> the minority community - social entitlements bring
> with them cultural problems that are more
> pernicious than any other. Again, just an
> opinion, not sufficiently grounded in research.
> But as a fair guess, I would go with it. And from
> this perspective I would take pains to be fair to
> Mr. Butler and his staff. We should expect a lot
> from school leaders, but they cannot be expected
> to work magic.


Sure SLHS and Butler have challenges-so do Annandale, Stuart, Falls Church, Lee and Edison. SLHS is trailing those schools in the participatory catagories for minorities-such as advanced classes and SAT.

You have to work with what you have-you can't change the poverty rate in your school (although the SB is trying with this RD). The principals that are successful are making it happen and not making excuses.

It is inexcusable that ANY FCPS school is trailing other VA schools on test scores. We have far more resources than other school districts and we should be getting better results.

nice try Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Sure SLHS and Butler have challenges-so do
> Annandale, Stuart, Falls Church, Lee and Edison.
> SLHS is trailing those schools in the
> participatory catagories for minorities-such as
> advanced classes and SAT.
>
> You have to work with what you have-you can't
> change the poverty rate in your school (although
> the SB is trying with this RD). The principals
> that are successful are making it happen and not
> making excuses.
>
> It is inexcusable that ANY FCPS school is trailing
> other VA schools on test scores. We have far more
> resources than other school districts and we
> should be getting better results.

I agree, the FCPS board should dedicate resources to help SLHS!

Clammy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> nice try Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > Sure SLHS and Butler have challenges-so do
> > Annandale, Stuart, Falls Church, Lee and Edison.
>
> > SLHS is trailing those schools in the
> > participatory catagories for minorities-such as
> > advanced classes and SAT.
> >
> > You have to work with what you have-you can't
> > change the poverty rate in your school
> (although
> > the SB is trying with this RD). The principals
> > that are successful are making it happen and
> not
> > making excuses.
> >
> > It is inexcusable that ANY FCPS school is
> trailing
> > other VA schools on test scores. We have far
> more
> > resources than other school districts and we
> > should be getting better results.
>
> I agree, the FCPS board should dedicate resources
> to help SLHS!



I will verify the numbers, but my hunch is that SLHS is getting "their share" of resources. It appears to be lack of focus and leadership that is resulting in their underperformance relative to these other schools. We really need to hold these individual school leaders accountable. Throwing more money at a problem that appears to be incompetence does not help.

What's the word? How many new students did SL's get? Surely Butler has bragged about it by now.

A South Lakes graduate...................?


Report from College Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My friend's son graduated this year with an FCPS
> IB diploma and has a full-ride physics
> scholarship, plus another engineering scholarship,
> at a top Virginia school. He reports that the
> "calculus for engineers" class he's taking is
> going to be a breeze, and that the one required
> writing class is easier than 10th grade classes
> were. He says he looks forward to a fairly easy
> first year at college while he gets grounded and
> works with professors to help him decide,
> eventually, which field in physics he's going to
> pursue. He's also enjoying his chemistry class,
> having had excellent grounding in pre-IB
> chemistry. He couldn't tell my friend whether he
> felt IB prepared him better for college because he
> has no experience with AP, except that his
> brother, who took AP calc BC with a score of 5,
> struggled with calc his first year in college.
>
> One kid, one view, one IB diploma.

Thirty students from one school seems a bit over the top. That is a huge number. Does anyone know how many TJ sent to UVA?









Wahoooooooooooo! Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLHS IB certainly didn't hold back 30 recent SLHS
> graduates that are now attending UVA.
>
> Go Hoo's!

Somewhere around 125. More were accepted.

The South Lakes population increased by about 200 students.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/03/AR2008090303907.html

Thank goodness those Floris kids are out of Westfield. For the first time ever my daughter made cheerleading and my son no longer gets his toes stepped on between classes. Thanks Kathy! Thanks Stu!

read in the post that now Oakton freshman class is too crowded. principal is quoted as saying he has to "wedge kids in". i guess kathy and stu just made it someone else's problem now.

now crowded Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> read in the post that now Oakton freshman class is
> too crowded. principal is quoted as saying he has
> to "wedge kids in". i guess kathy and stu just
> made it someone else's problem now.

Stu got what he wanted - some more kids at South Lakes to improve test scores and make the SLPTSA happy.

If that bothers you, vote him out in 2011, because he is pretty clear (now that the RD suit has been decided in the SB's favor) that he does not care at all whether any other school is bursting at the seams or, for that matter, under-capacity. The facilities-based arguments used to justify the last RD were a crock, and he dragged Tisdadt and James along for the ride.

Stay tune for the Coppermine ES redistricting. More of the same. This time, however, the school board said they will have criteria for deciding what neighborhoods stay and which go.

There will be the same town hall meetings, where neighborhoods will be divided and conquered. When do we say enough is enough. I guess when the elections roll around.

Mary Ellen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stay tune for the Coppermine ES redistricting.
> More of the same. This time, however, the school
> board said they will have criteria for deciding
> what neighborhoods stay and which go.
>
> There will be the same town hall meetings, where
> neighborhoods will be divided and conquered. When
> do we say enough is enough. I guess when the
> elections roll around.


criteria just mean that you know what they decided in advance

wait... exactly the same as the last time

the SB can't be trusted to tie their own shoelaces let alone run an RD or set the conditions. The recent debacle showed them for what they are - devious, cowardly, conniving and dishonest. The final board meeting of the process was a disgrace - they should all have resigned in shame.

They decided on the criteria on Sept. 4. There is a link on the FCPS home page.

removed - posted in wrong thread



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2008 04:07PM by Lurker..

criteria Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They decided on the criteria on Sept. 4. There is
> a link on the FCPS home page.


can someone post the direct link to where on the FCPS site?

Are you people still crying about this shit?
Give it a rest already

Coppermine is not a high school. Discussions of Coppermine do not belong on this thread.

Tell Me About It Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Coppermine is not a high school. Discussions of
> Coppermine do not belong on this thread.


sure whatever, this is where it will go, this is where people look

LINk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> criteria Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > They decided on the criteria on Sept. 4. There
> is
> > a link on the FCPS home page.
>
>
> can someone post the direct link to where on the
> FCPS site?

No, it is on the school board site and you can't do a direct link. Sorry, but you have to put out the effort to find it yourself.

So how is south lakes? 200 new students went there, lets hear from their families first hand

FCPS Schedules Town Meetings to Help Determine Boundaries for Two New Elementary Schools
http://www.fcps.edu/suptapps/newsreleases/newsrelease.cfm?newsid=946


HERE WE GO AGAIN UGH!!!!!

Another one!!. These school board members are sadists. They are addicted to torturing the people by doing these studies.

Floris Mom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FCPS Schedules Town Meetings to Help Determine
> Boundaries for Two New Elementary Schools
> http://www.fcps.edu/suptapps/newsreleases/newsrele
> ase.cfm?newsid=946
>
>
> HERE WE GO AGAIN UGH!!!!!

Quantum,
Congratulations to your daughter! Looks like she might save you a few bucks on college bills! Kudos to her and her parents.

wow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Another one!!. These school board members are
> sadists. They are addicted to torturing the people
> by doing these studies.
>
> Floris Mom Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > FCPS Schedules Town Meetings to Help Determine
> > Boundaries for Two New Elementary Schools
> >
> http://www.fcps.edu/suptapps/newsreleases/newsrele
>
> > ase.cfm?newsid=946
> >
> >
> > HERE WE GO AGAIN UGH!!!!!

I suspect the SB already knows which neighborhoods will go to these new schools. They did with the last RD. But this time it is different, two new elementary schools not like shuffling older students to high schools and whose parents as well as these students know what their students' educational needs are especially for those with advanced students. That's part of why the last RD was so controversial. Hopefully with these 2 new schools, it won't be as controversial despite the SB's lack of full ethics and predetermining which neighborhoods get redistricted. Best wishes.

One of the elementary schools involved is McNair, a Title 1 school which SL President Vanderburg rejected to attend SL. Floris is probably on the chopping block again to be spilled over to McNair. Sadist SB YES, especially Stu, our so-called representative. It's disgusting.

McNair will not go to Floris, some of the McNair students will go to the new Coppermine and some Floris kids may go there too, that will make room at Floris for kids from Oak Hill since Oak Hill is so overcrowded.

SLPTSA former President Vandenberg actually was very supportive of McNair kids coming to SLHS.

Sorry to burst your self-inflated bubble,,,,,but it's not the first time, is it?

Floris Mom is just an example of the peter principle at work. Ignore her.

Just the facts Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLPTSA former President Vandenberg actually was
> very supportive of McNair kids coming to SLHS.
>
> Sorry to burst your self-inflated bubble,,,,,but
> it's not the first time, is it?

The fundamentals of the South Lakes redistricting are strong.

The South Lakes Talking Points that were posted on the web and printed out and brought to the non-public public meetings rejected the idea of McNair kids going to South Lakes.

These children were described as a burden to the schools and the South Lakes position was that they had too many burdens and needed affluent students only.

The South Lakes parents and students that were in my rooms in those meetings rejected each plan that had McNair kids attending South Lakes. One guy kept calling out exactly how many FRM kids would be added to South Lakes (39! 43!)and rejecting each of those options.

I don't know Elizabeth but if she was SLPTA then she has to share some of the blame for insulting McNair kids and breaking up the Floris community into two high schools.

Of course Reston is finished redistricting and Floris just gets to keep going on and on.

More fake meetings. More drivel from Mr. Stu "Your Future is in the West" Gibson. Don't you want to join us for this one too?



Just the facts Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLPTSA former President Vandenberg actually was
> very supportive of McNair kids coming to SLHS.
>
> Sorry to burst your self-inflated bubble,,,,,but
> it's not the first time, is it?

South Lakes High School is the most unethical school in the entire country. The "PTA" is immoral, unethical, narcissistic, and selfish. Butler has no choice but to go along. He and all of the vice principles and the so-called guidance counselors are a bunch of bullies.

As a former "Future Seahawk", I actually moved after the HS resdistricting in anticipation for this years Coppermine.

McNair currently a mess relative to those schools around it. The logical redistrict for Coppermine would doom them to the same fate from the start. As much as I blamed the school board for last year, I blame the county for this - they planned to have all MULTI-FAMILY housing in those areas. What did they think was likely to happen to schools. The SB is going to do the best they can to balance that and, in my opinion, try to balance the single family, multi-family, and rental units across three schools - Coppermine, Floris, and McNair. Additionally, the students who live north of the toll-road will be moved OUT of the McNair boundary.

So my prediction:
Chunks of Floris to McNair - Oak Mill, Sycamore Lakes, and Monroe Chase
Chunks of Floris to Coppermine - the area over by West Ox and Centerville Rd (north of West Ox)
Chunks of McNair to Coppermine - everything west of Centerville Rd and some along McNair Farms and Coppermine
Chunks of McNair to Hutchinson (is that the ES in Herndon?) - North of Toll Road
Chunks Oak Hill to Floris - back fill possibly? / Perhaps it would even be a move of the GT Center to Floris so Oak Hill can remain a single community???

Overall, "blowing up the McNair mold by infusing a bunch of single family can work out since it will dramatically change the dynamic of the school.

Former Future Seahawk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As a former "Future Seahawk", I actually moved
> after the HS resdistricting in anticipation for
> this years Coppermine.
>
> McNair currently a mess relative to those schools
> around it. The logical redistrict for Coppermine
> would doom them to the same fate from the start.
> As much as I blamed the school board for last
> year, I blame the county for this - they planned
> to have all MULTI-FAMILY housing in those areas.
> What did they think was likely to happen to
> schools. The SB is going to do the best they can
> to balance that and, in my opinion, try to balance
> the single family, multi-family, and rental units
> across three schools - Coppermine, Floris, and
> McNair. Additionally, the students who live north
> of the toll-road will be moved OUT of the McNair
> boundary.
>
> So my prediction:
> Chunks of Floris to McNair - Oak Mill, Sycamore
> Lakes, and Monroe Chase
> Chunks of Floris to Coppermine - the area over by
> West Ox and Centerville Rd (north of West Ox)
> Chunks of McNair to Coppermine - everything west
> of Centerville Rd and some along McNair Farms and
> Coppermine
> Chunks of McNair to Hutchinson (is that the ES in
> Herndon?) - North of Toll Road
> Chunks Oak Hill to Floris - back fill possibly? /
> Perhaps it would even be a move of the GT Center
> to Floris so Oak Hill can remain a single
> community???
>
> Overall, "blowing up the McNair mold by infusing a
> bunch of single family can work out since it will
> dramatically change the dynamic of the school.

great plan, we can all go home now.
bye bye

So, The SB has approved Gatehouse 2. I can't imagine that ANY of their constituents anywhere in the county supported this. How funny that they did this during one of our nation's worst financial weeks in decades. And the shortfall for the county certainly isn't looking better. I mean the property values are soon to rise again, right? Could it be that they think the flush times are around the corner?

They have truly committed one of the deadliest sins of a SB. They did not put the children first. In a family, during lean times, parents wait until their children have eaten before they take what is left. They don't gorge first then leave the leftovers to their kids. There are huge budget cuts across the county--and each school has had to cut back, and some classes are MUCH larger...lean times. The Gatehouse 2 is a nice to have. It would have been nice to have everybody on one campus. But, they didn't NEED it. I'm sure there are many FX residents who would like a new house, new car, but those are nice to haves--and if they can't afford it they don't get it. Maybe it's easier to spend someone else's money. The SB sure acts that way. Another VERY poor move on their part and it was approved 11-1.

Vote the bums out.


Concerned Fox Mill parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So, The SB has approved Gatehouse 2. I can't
> imagine that ANY of their constituents anywhere in
> the county supported this. How funny that they
> did this during one of our nation's worst
> financial weeks in decades. And the shortfall for
> the county certainly isn't looking better. I mean
> the property values are soon to rise again, right?
> Could it be that they think the flush times are
> around the corner?
>
> They have truly committed one of the deadliest
> sins of a SB. They did not put the children
> first. In a family, during lean times, parents
> wait until their children have eaten before they
> take what is left. They don't gorge first then
> leave the leftovers to their kids. There are huge
> budget cuts across the county--and each school has
> had to cut back, and some classes are MUCH
> larger...lean times. The Gatehouse 2 is a nice to
> have. It would have been nice to have everybody
> on one campus. But, they didn't NEED it. I'm
> sure there are many FX residents who would like a
> new house, new car, but those are nice to
> haves--and if they can't afford it they don't get
> it. Maybe it's easier to spend someone else's
> money. The SB sure acts that way. Another VERY
> poor move on their part and it was approved 11-1.

JACK DALE AND THE SCHOOL BOARD GO DOWN IN FLAMES.

A SPECIAL THANK YOU TO THE BOS FOR USING FISCAL RESTRAINT DURING THESE HARD TIMES.


Supervisors Turn Away Fairfax Schools Proposal
$130 Million Sought for Headquarters

By Michael Alison Chandler
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, September 23, 2008; B01



The Fairfax County Board of Supervisors dealt a significant setback yesterday to a $130 million school system plan to consolidate school headquarters in the Falls Church area.

After meeting with School Superintendent Jack D. Dale behind closed doors, supervisors voted unanimously in public to decline to take action on the plan to buy and renovate an office building at 8111 Gatehouse Rd.

The School Board had approved the plan Thursday in an 11 to 1 vote, with the majority contending that it would save money in the long term to centralize school system operations near the Capital Beltway and Route 50.

But Supervisor Pat S. Herrity (R-Springfield) said yesterday's vote sent a signal to school planners to go "back to the drawing board." Herrity said that in a tight budget year, he was concerned the project would not save enough money.

"This is a bad time to be doing this. We should be focusing on schools, teachers and students and not administration," he said.

Dale, head of the 165,700-student system since 2004, said he was surprised and disappointed.

"We thought we had a compelling case," he said, contending that the project would help the system shed costly leases and free up school facilities needed for instruction. Dale said he was unsure what the school system's next step will be.

School officials have been working for several months to advance a plan to bring together about 1,700 school employees from more than a dozen aging or leased facilities. The project was endorsed by the Fairfax County Chamber of Commerce.

Because of declining real estate revenue, rising fuel prices and other factors, the combined budget shortfall for the county government and schools is expected to reach $430 million for the next fiscal year. County and school officials are scrutinizing budgets in every department and program to save money.

In 2004, county supervisors approved a similar plan to buy a building at 8115 Gatehouse Rd., where about 600 school system employees now work, as well as an adjacent three-acre parcel, where officials expected to build an office tower.

But when the building at 8111 Gatehouse became available, school officials saw it as more affordable.

Officials estimated that the total cost to buy, renovate and furnish the 35-year-old building would be about $110 million. But they requested approval to borrow as much $130 million in case costs increase. The price of the building is $52 million, plus as much as $5 million for upgrades.

Under the plan, the acquisition would be financed through a 30-year bond issued by the county's Economic Development Authority. The first $8 million payment would not be due until 2013. Once interest payments are due, school system costs would outweigh savings for the next eight years by as much as $2.7 million.

School officials say that, without cost overruns, the purchase and renovation would ultimately save about $22 million over 30 years, through avoiding lease payments and elimination of some staff positions.

The lone School Board member to oppose the plan Thursday was Ilryong Moon (At Large).


Jack Dale and the School Board are hurting our children.


This School Board and this Superintendent don't have any common sense or ethics.

We are in the worst financial state Fairfax County has been in decades-and it continues to worsen every month.

Shrinking tax base, $400 million deficit, etc....yet they want to build a $125 million lavish office building for themselves and staff.

They want to do this while students at WEST SPRINGFIELD HS go to school in a broken down rat trap that is not save for students or staff.

What are they going to do when their budget is cut by more then $200 million?

What programs will be cut? How many teachers will be let go? How many more schools will be falling apart?

This group does not care about the students in FCPS, rather they care about themselves and the perks they can get. Free parking, health spa, indoor/outdoor cafeteria, etc.

WHAT EVER HAPPEN TO FISCAL RESTRAINT??????????????

Pass out the clown shoes and red nose to Jack Dale. What a BUFFOON! "I was shocked and disapointed," said Jack--really, Mr. Dale? What Circus world are you residing? "The school board does not know it's next steps"--really, Mr. Dale? Weren't you told what would be next, after the poles were pulled from your $130M Big Top Tent? Let us remind you, Mr. Dale and your school board clown cronies....."schools, teachers and students and not administration..." will come first. Now, get back to the clown car and paint the tears on your face.

SB and Dale go down in flames Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> JACK DALE AND THE SCHOOL BOARD GO DOWN IN FLAMES.
>
> A SPECIAL THANK YOU TO THE BOS FOR USING FISCAL
> RESTRAINT DURING THESE HARD TIMES.
>
>
> Supervisors Turn Away Fairfax Schools Proposal
> $130 Million Sought for Headquarters
>
> By Michael Alison Chandler
> Washington Post Staff Writer
> Tuesday, September 23, 2008; B01
>
>
>
> The Fairfax County Board of Supervisors dealt a
> significant setback yesterday to a $130 million
> school system plan to consolidate school
> headquarters in the Falls Church area.
>
> After meeting with School Superintendent Jack D.
> Dale behind closed doors, supervisors voted
> unanimously in public to decline to take action on
> the plan to buy and renovate an office building at
> 8111 Gatehouse Rd.
>
> The School Board had approved the plan Thursday in
> an 11 to 1 vote, with the majority contending that
> it would save money in the long term to centralize
> school system operations near the Capital Beltway
> and Route 50.
>
> But Supervisor Pat S. Herrity (R-Springfield) said
> yesterday's vote sent a signal to school planners
> to go "back to the drawing board." Herrity said
> that in a tight budget year, he was concerned the
> project would not save enough money.
>
> "This is a bad time to be doing this. We should be
> focusing on schools, teachers and students and not
> administration," he said.
>
> Dale, head of the 165,700-student system since
> 2004, said he was surprised and disappointed.
>
> "We thought we had a compelling case," he said,
> contending that the project would help the system
> shed costly leases and free up school facilities
> needed for instruction. Dale said he was unsure
> what the school system's next step will be.
>
> School officials have been working for several
> months to advance a plan to bring together about
> 1,700 school employees from more than a dozen
> aging or leased facilities. The project was
> endorsed by the Fairfax County Chamber of
> Commerce.
>
> Because of declining real estate revenue, rising
> fuel prices and other factors, the combined budget
> shortfall for the county government and schools is
> expected to reach $430 million for the next fiscal
> year. County and school officials are scrutinizing
> budgets in every department and program to save
> money.
>
> In 2004, county supervisors approved a similar
> plan to buy a building at 8115 Gatehouse Rd.,
> where about 600 school system employees now work,
> as well as an adjacent three-acre parcel, where
> officials expected to build an office tower.
>
> But when the building at 8111 Gatehouse became
> available, school officials saw it as more
> affordable.
>
> Officials estimated that the total cost to buy,
> renovate and furnish the 35-year-old building
> would be about $110 million. But they requested
> approval to borrow as much $130 million in case
> costs increase. The price of the building is $52
> million, plus as much as $5 million for upgrades.
>
> Under the plan, the acquisition would be financed
> through a 30-year bond issued by the county's
> Economic Development Authority. The first $8
> million payment would not be due until 2013. Once
> interest payments are due, school system costs
> would outweigh savings for the next eight years by
> as much as $2.7 million.
>
> School officials say that, without cost overruns,
> the purchase and renovation would ultimately save
> about $22 million over 30 years, through avoiding
> lease payments and elimination of some staff
> positions.
>
> The lone School Board member to oppose the plan
> Thursday was Ilryong Moon (At Large).
>
>
> Jack Dale and the School Board are hurting our
> children.
>
>
> This School Board and this Superintendent don't
> have any common sense or ethics.
>
> We are in the worst financial state Fairfax County
> has been in decades-and it continues to worsen
> every month.
>
> Shrinking tax base, $400 million deficit,
> etc....yet they want to build a $125 million
> lavish office building for themselves and staff.
>
> They want to do this while students at WEST
> SPRINGFIELD HS go to school in a broken down rat
> trap that is not save for students or staff.
>
> What are they going to do when their budget is cut
> by more then $200 million?
>
> What programs will be cut? How many teachers will
> be let go? How many more schools will be falling
> apart?
>
> This group does not care about the students in
> FCPS, rather they care about themselves and the
> perks they can get. Free parking, health spa,
> indoor/outdoor cafeteria, etc.
>
> WHAT EVER HAPPEN TO FISCAL RESTRAINT??????????????



Yes, there is some justice in the world. At least the Bd of Sup knows which side their bread is buttered on.

Thanks to the posters here for exposing the Protocols of the Learned Elders of the South Lakes PTA. I look forward to hearing more about how the SLPTA has its fingers around the neck of our public schools.

Once FairfaxCaps wins the lawsuit this will all be over. That will show them they can't push us around!

any news Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So how is south lakes? 200 new students went
> there, lets hear from their families first hand

I'm not part of a family of any redistricted kids at South Lakes but my little brother is freshmen there this year (he went to Hughes) and from what I've heard from him, the redistricted kids and the hughes kids have blended well.

I'm also a mentor for freshmen at SL and one of my freshmen came from Carson. She said that she was nervous at first about not knowing anyone but I talked to her yesterday and she said she made bunch of new friends and was probably going to help build the freshmen homecoming float!

It is unbelievable how supposedly educated parents can come down on the students of one elementary school. What are you teaching your children about tolerance of those less able or less affluent?

McNair Elementary school has excellent teachers. Guess what? Some of those teachers came from your elementary schools. This is inevitable with new elementary schools. The schools involved must provide teachers to the new school, so some of those teachers will come from McNair.

Happy2beHere Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It is unbelievable how supposedly educated parents
> can come down on the students of one elementary
> school. What are you teaching your children about
> tolerance of those less able or less affluent?
>
> McNair Elementary school has excellent teachers.
> Guess what? Some of those teachers came from your
> elementary schools. This is inevitable with new
> elementary schools. The schools involved must
> provide teachers to the new school, so some of
> those teachers will come from McNair.

The schools involved MUST provide teachers to the new school? MUST. You surely are kidding us!

Speaking of South Lakes, the school board web page says they are going to hear about AP offerings at South Lakes during work session 33 on October 6th. The school board asked for a report on this question and some related topics back in February. The report (all two pages of it) is posted on the boarddocs page at http://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/d62d9cb847ef1cbd87257328006795e4/5fdae7e524191977872574c500604b82/$FILE/SouthLakesIBAP.pdf

The report says they now have a class called pre-IB/AP Government, and that IB English, math, music, and languages correspond to AP classes. The plan to offer AP Human Geography failed. The report says "Seven students selected this course for the 2008-2009 school year. However, due to staffing cuts, the course was unable be offered." (This is the first I've heard about staffing cuts at South Lakes. I think with or without staffing cuts, most high schools wouldn't go forward with an elective that only had seven students.)

The report also gives some statistics on pupil placement in/out of South Lakes.

Must?

It is not a joke. Schools affected must provide teachers to the new school.

The board has given South Lakes admins carte blanche because they want to make everybody at South Lakes happy.

McNair currently a mess relative to those schools around it. The logical redistrict for Coppermine would doom them to the same fate from the start. As much as I blamed the school board for last year, I blame the county for this - they planned to have all MULTI-FAMILY housing in those areas. What did they think was likely to happen to schools. The SB is going to do the best they can to balance that and, in my opinion, try to balance the single family, multi-family, and rental units across three schools - Coppermine, Floris, and McNair. Additionally, the students who live north of the toll-road will be moved OUT of the McNair boundary.

Wow!! McNair is currently a mess? Do you have children there? Have you met the teachers there? These are elementary school children, what do you have against children? I'm sorry you dislike the children from McNair, but maybe you should expand your horizons a bit. I'm not sure why you think some children are more deserving than others, yet hopefully, if you've met my children...you treat them the same as your child(ren)'s other friends. I would hate to think that they are being treated unfairly, just because they attend McNair. At least I know my children are tolerant of others no matter where they live, where they or their parents' may come from or how much their friends' parents make.

AP at South Lakes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Speaking of South Lakes, the school board web page
> says they are going to hear about AP offerings at
> South Lakes during work session 33 on October 6th.
> The school board asked for a report on this
> question and some related topics back in February.
> The report (all two pages of it) is posted on the
> boarddocs page at
> http://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/d6
> 2d9cb847ef1cbd87257328006795e4/5fdae7e524191977872
> 574c500604b82/$FILE/SouthLakesIBAP.pdf
>
> The report says they now have a class called
> pre-IB/AP Government, and that IB English, math,
> music, and languages correspond to AP classes.
> The plan to offer AP Human Geography failed. The
> report says "Seven students selected this course
> for the 2008-2009 school year. However, due to
> staffing cuts, the course was unable be offered."
> (This is the first I've heard about staffing cuts
> at South Lakes. I think with or without staffing
> cuts, most high schools wouldn't go forward with
> an elective that only had seven students.)
>
> The report also gives some statistics on pupil
> placement in/out of South Lakes.

There will be NO AP courses at South Lakes. They choose the worst possible AP class and when only 7 students showed up, they cancelled it and used the low enrollment as proof that no one wants AP at South Lakes. They are so transparent. They don't care what the students or parents want, they'll offer whatever the teachers like teaching. Everyone at SL's is stuck with IB.

Just pupil place out of South Lakes to a AP school. A whole bunch did that this year - 80+ or so. It is simple and an easy solution to this IB issue.

>
> There will be NO AP courses at South Lakes. They
> choose the worst possible AP class and when only 7
> students showed up, they cancelled it and used the
> low enrollment as proof that no one wants AP at
> South Lakes. They are so transparent. They don't
> care what the students or parents want, they'll
> offer whatever the teachers like teaching.
> Everyone at SL's is stuck with IB.

This is not so simple. Most people want a sense of community and continuity from their community schools. Forcing people to choose between an oddball program like IB and the standard US high school program of AP means that they have to give up on continuity.


pupil place out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just pupil place out of South Lakes to a AP
> school. A whole bunch did that this year - 80+ or
> so. It is simple and an easy solution to this IB
> issue.
>
> >
> > There will be NO AP courses at South Lakes.
> They
> > choose the worst possible AP class and when only
> 7
> > students showed up, they cancelled it and used
> the
> > low enrollment as proof that no one wants AP at
> > South Lakes. They are so transparent. They
> don't
> > care what the students or parents want, they'll
> > offer whatever the teachers like teaching.
> > Everyone at SL's is stuck with IB.

This document also says that there is a group to study Advanced Academic Opportunities:

"The PTSA has already established a pyramid-wide group called the Advanced
Academic Opportunity Advisory Group. This group’s first meeting is set for late
September. Group members are parents of elementary age, middle school age, and
high school age students presently in the recently expanded South Lakes High
School community."

I looked on the SLS PTSA website and didn't see it mentioned; I found this on the LHMS site:

"The PTSA has already established a pyramid-wide group called the Advanced
Academic Opportunity Advisory Group. This group’s first meeting is set for late
September. Group members are parents of elementary age, middle school age, and
high school age students presently in the recently expanded South Lakes High
School community."

I have not heard of this through Floris or Carson. Does this group actually exist? If so is it there to market IB or campaign for AP?

AP at South Lakes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Speaking of South Lakes, the school board web page
> says they are going to hear about AP offerings at
> South Lakes during work session 33 on October 6th.
> The school board asked for a report on this
> question and some related topics back in February.
> The report (all two pages of it) is posted on the
> boarddocs page at
> http://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/d6
> 2d9cb847ef1cbd87257328006795e4/5fdae7e524191977872
> 574c500604b82/$FILE/SouthLakesIBAP.pdf
>

If you want AP classes at South Lakes all you have to do is request them. Out of 700 some students and only 7 students wanted one AP class.

I wouldn't call that a huge request for AP at SLHS. As has been discussed at length, there are +'s and -'s to both AP and IB.

Some people just have it stuck in their brain that AP courses are the only courses that counts. We all know that is not true and no reason to repeat the thread for some person with fat on the brian.

Out of Pyramid Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This document also says that there is a group to
> study Advanced Academic Opportunities:
>
> "The PTSA has already established a pyramid-wide
> group called the Advanced
> Academic Opportunity Advisory Group. This group’s
> first meeting is set for late
> September. Group members are parents of elementary
> age, middle school age, and
> high school age students presently in the recently
> expanded South Lakes High
> School community."
>
> I looked on the SLS PTSA website and didn't see it
> mentioned; I found this on the LHMS site:
>
> "The PTSA has already established a pyramid-wide
> group called the Advanced
> Academic Opportunity Advisory Group. This group’s
> first meeting is set for late
> September. Group members are parents of elementary
> age, middle school age, and
> high school age students presently in the recently
> expanded South Lakes High
> School community."
>
> I have not heard of this through Floris or Carson.
> Does this group actually exist? If so is it
> there to market IB or campaign for AP?
>
> AP at South Lakes Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Speaking of South Lakes, the school board web
> page
> > says they are going to hear about AP offerings
> at
> > South Lakes during work session 33 on October
> 6th.
> > The school board asked for a report on this
> > question and some related topics back in
> February.
> > The report (all two pages of it) is posted on
> the
> > boarddocs page at
> >
> http://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/d6
>
> >
> 2d9cb847ef1cbd87257328006795e4/5fdae7e524191977872
>
> > 574c500604b82/$FILE/SouthLakesIBAP.pdf
> >
>
Floris and Carson have sent home info about this group and their meetings through their respective newsletters.

71 9th graders pupil-placed out for AP.




Jenny L Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you want AP classes at South Lakes all you have
> to do is request them. Out of 700 some students
> and only 7 students wanted one AP class.
>
> I wouldn't call that a huge request for AP at
> SLHS. As has been discussed at length, there are
> +'s and -'s to both AP and IB.
>
> Some people just have it stuck in their brain that
> AP courses are the only courses that counts. We
> all know that is not true and no reason to repeat
> the thread for some person with fat on the brian.

The actual AP placement number would have been higher if they weren't also accepting pupil-placement for siblings.


Out of Pyramid Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 71 9th graders pupil-placed out for AP.
>
>
>
>
> Jenny L Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If you want AP classes at South Lakes all you
> have
> > to do is request them. Out of 700 some students
> > and only 7 students wanted one AP class.
> >
> > I wouldn't call that a huge request for AP at
> > SLHS. As has been discussed at length, there
> are
> > +'s and -'s to both AP and IB.
> >
> > Some people just have it stuck in their brain
> that
> > AP courses are the only courses that counts.
> We
> > all know that is not true and no reason to
> repeat
> > the thread for some person with fat on the
> brian.

VoiceOfReason Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Must?
>
> It is not a joke. Schools affected must provide
> teachers to the new school.

This is simply not true. No school will be forced to send teachers to a newly opening school just because some of their students will now attend there. If the previous school loses a lot of enrollment due to the redistricting some teachers may be destaffed and may choose to interview at the newly opening school but no school MUST send teachers to the new school. Voice of Reason is just another FairfaxUnderground spreader of rumors. Otherwise he/she would put forth the regulation that stipulates this assertion.

TED Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Out of Pyramid Parent Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > This document also says that there is a group
> to
> > study Advanced Academic Opportunities:
> >
> > "The PTSA has already established a
> pyramid-wide
> > group called the Advanced
> > Academic Opportunity Advisory Group. This
> group’s
> > first meeting is set for late
> > September. Group members are parents of
> elementary
> > age, middle school age, and
> > high school age students presently in the
> recently
> > expanded South Lakes High
> > School community."
> >
> > I looked on the SLS PTSA website and didn't see
> it
> > mentioned; I found this on the LHMS site:
> >
> > "The PTSA has already established a
> pyramid-wide
> > group called the Advanced
> > Academic Opportunity Advisory Group. This
> group’s
> > first meeting is set for late
> > September. Group members are parents of
> elementary
> > age, middle school age, and
> > high school age students presently in the
> recently
> > expanded South Lakes High
> > School community."
> >
> > I have not heard of this through Floris or
> Carson.
> > Does this group actually exist? If so is it
> > there to market IB or campaign for AP?
> >
> > AP at South Lakes Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Speaking of South Lakes, the school board web
> > page
> > > says they are going to hear about AP
> offerings
> > at
> > > South Lakes during work session 33 on October
> > 6th.
> > > The school board asked for a report on this
> > > question and some related topics back in
> > February.
> > > The report (all two pages of it) is posted
> on
> > the
> > > boarddocs page at
> > >
> >
> http://www.boarddocs.com/vsba/fairfax/Board.nsf/d6
>
> >
> > >
> >
> 2d9cb847ef1cbd87257328006795e4/5fdae7e524191977872
>
> >
> > > 574c500604b82/$FILE/SouthLakesIBAP.pdf
> > >
> >
> Floris and Carson have sent home info about this
> group and their meetings through their respective
> newsletters.


Could this just be a new title for a group of parent of students labeled GT? That would correspond with the new title on the GT website.
http://www.fcps.edu/DIS/gt

Jenny L Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you want AP classes at South Lakes all you have
> to do is request them. Out of 700 some students
> and only 7 students wanted one AP class.
>
> I wouldn't call that a huge request for AP at
> SLHS. As has been discussed at length, there are
> +'s and -'s to both AP and IB.
>
> Some people just have it stuck in their brain that
> AP courses are the only courses that counts. We
> all know that is not true and no reason to repeat
> the thread for some person with fat on the brian.


Actually, I think the question should be: do you want AP classes (as in all AP classes) versus IB (all IB)? Asking if they want one or two AP classes isn't very telling. I know dozens of families in FM who had to go to SL because of the RD who very much wanted AP (full AP) for their kids.

For the strong math science kid, it seems that AP is the best (get more math and science) way to go. With math, IB HL math only covers half of Calc BC (yes, I know there is a smattering of multivariable calc in IB math HL, but there is not a full year course). In AP, the math kid can get a full year of Calc BC and then multivariable calc and linear alg. There is also a gap in Physics. There is no Physics HL offered at South Lakes..only standard level--and what is offered covers only a half year of AP Physics 1. Then, a strong Physics kids can take AP Physics 2 in an AP school. So, a strong physics student could lose 1 1/2 years of physics in the IB program at South Lakes (versus what he/she could get at an AP school).

There is no fat on my brain (other parts of my body perhaps), but I think it is fair to say that AP offers a "richer" curriculum for the very strong math/science kids. IB has a lot to offer many students (and all the RD kids I know from FM have been perfectly happy with SL so far), but I think the strong math/science kids is probably better served in AP. If SL were an AP school, we'd be there now.

I have one question. I'm in a district that is about to redistrict for a new high school and since some of you went thought it in in 2007, I would like to know if your property value has gone down?

EVERYONE'S property value has gone down.

Another FM parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Actually, I think the question should be: do you
> want AP classes (as in all AP classes) versus IB
> (all IB)? Asking if they want one or two AP
> classes isn't very telling. I know dozens of
> families in FM who had to go to SL because of the
> RD who very much wanted AP (full AP) for their
> kids.
>
> For the strong math science kid, it seems that AP
> is the best (get more math and science) way to go.
> With math, IB HL math only covers half of Calc BC
> (yes, I know there is a smattering of
> multivariable calc in IB math HL, but there is not
> a full year course). In AP, the math kid can get
> a full year of Calc BC and then multivariable calc
> and linear alg. There is also a gap in Physics.
> There is no Physics HL offered at South
> Lakes..only standard level--and what is offered
> covers only a half year of AP Physics 1. Then, a
> strong Physics kids can take AP Physics 2 in an AP
> school. So, a strong physics student could lose 1
> 1/2 years of physics in the IB program at South
> Lakes (versus what he/she could get at an AP
> school).
>
> There is no fat on my brain (other parts of my
> body perhaps), but I think it is fair to say that
> AP offers a "richer" curriculum for the very
> strong math/science kids. IB has a lot to offer
> many students (and all the RD kids I know from FM
> have been perfectly happy with SL so far), but I
> think the strong math/science kids is probably
> better served in AP. If SL were an AP school,
> we'd be there now.

The very strong math/science kids are at TJ and the rest would be equally well served by either curriculum. Most of the kids who pupil placed from SL to Madison were average kids, not academic stars (not intended as a putdown) who just wanted to stay with their friends from Thoreau.

MF Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Another FM parent Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > Actually, I think the question should be: do
> you
> > want AP classes (as in all AP classes) versus
> IB
> > (all IB)? Asking if they want one or two AP
> > classes isn't very telling. I know dozens of
> > families in FM who had to go to SL because of
> the
> > RD who very much wanted AP (full AP) for their
> > kids.
> >
> > For the strong math science kid, it seems that
> AP
> > is the best (get more math and science) way to
> go.
> > With math, IB HL math only covers half of Calc
> BC
> > (yes, I know there is a smattering of
> > multivariable calc in IB math HL, but there is
> not
> > a full year course). In AP, the math kid can
> get
> > a full year of Calc BC and then multivariable
> calc
> > and linear alg. There is also a gap in Physics.
>
> > There is no Physics HL offered at South
> > Lakes..only standard level--and what is offered
> > covers only a half year of AP Physics 1. Then,
> a
> > strong Physics kids can take AP Physics 2 in an
> AP
> > school. So, a strong physics student could lose
> 1
> > 1/2 years of physics in the IB program at South
> > Lakes (versus what he/she could get at an AP
> > school).
> >
> > There is no fat on my brain (other parts of my
> > body perhaps), but I think it is fair to say
> that
> > AP offers a "richer" curriculum for the very
> > strong math/science kids. IB has a lot to
> offer
> > many students (and all the RD kids I know from
> FM
> > have been perfectly happy with SL so far), but
> I
> > think the strong math/science kids is probably
> > better served in AP. If SL were an AP school,
> > we'd be there now.
>
> The very strong math/science kids are at TJ and
> the rest would be equally well served by either
> curriculum. Most of the kids who pupil placed
> from SL to Madison were average kids, not academic
> stars (not intended as a putdown) who just wanted
> to stay with their friends from Thoreau.


Simply not true, but this horse has been beat to death.

SBS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MF Parent Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Another FM parent Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > >
> > > Actually, I think the question should be: do
> > you
> > > want AP classes (as in all AP classes) versus
> > IB
> > > (all IB)? Asking if they want one or two AP
> > > classes isn't very telling. I know dozens of
> > > families in FM who had to go to SL because of
> > the
> > > RD who very much wanted AP (full AP) for
> their
> > > kids.
> > >
> > > For the strong math science kid, it seems
> that
> > AP
> > > is the best (get more math and science) way
> to
> > go.
> > > With math, IB HL math only covers half of
> Calc
> > BC
> > > (yes, I know there is a smattering of
> > > multivariable calc in IB math HL, but there
> is
> > not
> > > a full year course). In AP, the math kid can
> > get
> > > a full year of Calc BC and then multivariable
> > calc
> > > and linear alg. There is also a gap in
> Physics.
> >
> > > There is no Physics HL offered at South
> > > Lakes..only standard level--and what is
> offered
> > > covers only a half year of AP Physics 1.
> Then,
> > a
> > > strong Physics kids can take AP Physics 2 in
> an
> > AP
> > > school. So, a strong physics student could
> lose
> > 1
> > > 1/2 years of physics in the IB program at
> South
> > > Lakes (versus what he/she could get at an AP
> > > school).
> > >
> > > There is no fat on my brain (other parts of
> my
> > > body perhaps), but I think it is fair to say
> > that
> > > AP offers a "richer" curriculum for the very
> > > strong math/science kids. IB has a lot to
> > offer
> > > many students (and all the RD kids I know
> from
> > FM
> > > have been perfectly happy with SL so far),
> but
> > I
> > > think the strong math/science kids is
> probably
> > > better served in AP. If SL were an AP
> school,
> > > we'd be there now.
> >
> > The very strong math/science kids are at TJ and
> > the rest would be equally well served by either
> > curriculum. Most of the kids who pupil placed
> > from SL to Madison were average kids, not
> academic
> > stars (not intended as a putdown) who just
> wanted
> > to stay with their friends from Thoreau.
>
>
> Simply not true, but this horse has been beat to
> death.

I'm quite confident it's true, but you and your FM/MI friends are the ones dragging out the carcass. Wait a few years and all those families, if they are still in the district, will be sending the younger kids who grew up at SV and Hughes to SL. You'd be better served by explaining why scores at Madison continue to decline while those at other schools - including some IB schools - improve.

MF Parent wrote: "The very strong math/science kids are at TJ and the rest would be equally well served by either curriculum. Most of the kids who pupil placed from SL to Madison were average kids, not academic stars (not intended as a putdown) who just wanted to stay with their friends from Thoreau."

Unfortunately, TJ isn't big enough to accommodate all of the very strong math/science kids in Fairfax County. Look at the admission statistics at http://www.fcag.org/tjadmits2008.html

The statistics show that only 38% of the kids in 8th grade geometry who applied to TJ got admitted for the class of 2012. For 8th graders taking math beyond geometry, the admission rate was only 65%. If you combine the two groups, 40% of these very strong math students got accepted into TJ for the class of 2012. That number doesn't include the very strong math students who didn't apply to TJ for one reason or another, so the total percentage of very strong math students in Fairfax County who actually attend TJ is even less than 40%.

You can argue all day and night about whether IB is equivalent to AP, but it's incorrect to assume that all the very strong math/science students go to TJ. If the School Board were to take an underpopulated school and make it into TJ#2, then you would probably have a valid argument that all the top math/science students could be be accommodated at magnet schools.

MF Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>>
> I'm quite confident it's true, but you and your
> FM/MI friends are the ones dragging out the
> carcass. Wait a few years and all those families,
> if they are still in the district, will be sending
> the younger kids who grew up at SV and Hughes to
> SL. You'd be better served by explaining why
> scores at Madison continue to decline while those
> at other schools - including some IB schools -
> improve.

Ignorance is bliss. Like the post above this one says, there are MANY strong math/science students in FFC that do not go to TJ. Whether deserved or not, AP courses in science and math are worth more than IB courses to most college freshmen. But go ahead and keep telling yourself that IB is just as good.

MF Parent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SBS Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > MF Parent Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Another FM parent Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > >
> > > > Actually, I think the question should be:
> do
> > > you
> > > > want AP classes (as in all AP classes)
> versus
> > > IB
> > > > (all IB)? Asking if they want one or two
> AP
> > > > classes isn't very telling. I know dozens
> of
> > > > families in FM who had to go to SL because
> of
> > > the
> > > > RD who very much wanted AP (full AP) for
> > their
> > > > kids.
> > > >
> > > > For the strong math science kid, it seems
> > that
> > > AP
> > > > is the best (get more math and science) way
> > to
> > > go.
> > > > With math, IB HL math only covers half of
> > Calc
> > > BC
> > > > (yes, I know there is a smattering of
> > > > multivariable calc in IB math HL, but there
> > is
> > > not
> > > > a full year course). In AP, the math kid
> can
> > > get
> > > > a full year of Calc BC and then
> multivariable
> > > calc
> > > > and linear alg. There is also a gap in
> > Physics.
> > >
> > > > There is no Physics HL offered at South
> > > > Lakes..only standard level--and what is
> > offered
> > > > covers only a half year of AP Physics 1.
> > Then,
> > > a
> > > > strong Physics kids can take AP Physics 2
> in
> > an
> > > AP
> > > > school. So, a strong physics student could
> > lose
> > > 1
> > > > 1/2 years of physics in the IB program at
> > South
> > > > Lakes (versus what he/she could get at an
> AP
> > > > school).
> > > >
> > > > There is no fat on my brain (other parts of
> > my
> > > > body perhaps), but I think it is fair to
> say
> > > that
> > > > AP offers a "richer" curriculum for the
> very
> > > > strong math/science kids. IB has a lot to
> > > offer
> > > > many students (and all the RD kids I know
> > from
> > > FM
> > > > have been perfectly happy with SL so far),
> > but
> > > I
> > > > think the strong math/science kids is
> > probably
> > > > better served in AP. If SL were an AP
> > school,
> > > > we'd be there now.
> > >
> > > The very strong math/science kids are at TJ
> and
> > > the rest would be equally well served by
> either
> > > curriculum. Most of the kids who pupil
> placed
> > > from SL to Madison were average kids, not
> > academic
> > > stars (not intended as a putdown) who just
> > wanted
> > > to stay with their friends from Thoreau.
> >
> >
> > Simply not true, but this horse has been beat
> to
> > death.
>
> I'm quite confident it's true, but you and your
> FM/MI friends are the ones dragging out the
> carcass. Wait a few years and all those families,
> if they are still in the district, will be sending
> the younger kids who grew up at SV and Hughes to
> SL. You'd be better served by explaining why
> scores at Madison continue to decline while those
> at other schools - including some IB schools -
> improve.


If you call it "dragging" out a carcass by noting that strong math/science kids who qualify for multivariable calc and Physics 2 (and I call any kid who can take those classes very strong math science kids) can get 1 1/2 years more math and 1 1/2 years more science in AP versus IB, then I guess I'm dragging out a carcass. But I think that extra math and science is important to a certain segment of the student population (and they don't have to go to TJ to qualify and get those higher level classes).

How about we just bus these braniacs to a central location for the multivariable calc and Physics 2, so all Mommyworryworts can stop complaining and carrying on like drones. Honestly, folks can pretty much choose what they want as far as where to go, except TJ. So send the TJ rejects to a "special super braniac science/math" class in one of the aerospace classes at Westfield or some other one-room school house and be done with the whining! Parents who really care do this now anyway (ex. cart their 6th graders to the nearest middle school for Algebra).