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Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Dog Walker1 ()
Date: April 21, 2016 12:22AM

from: http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Man-Dies-After-Attempted-Arrest-in-Fairfax-County-Police-376429671.html

A disabled man has died Wednesday after after a confrontation with officers near a park in Falls Church, Virginia, police say.

Fairfax County police said 45-year-old Paul Gianelos, a resident of a local group home, wandered away from Round Tree Park at 3320 Annandale Road about 1 p.m. Gianelos has both developmental and physical disabilities police said.

An officer found Gianelos about a mile and a half away and asked for the cargiver to meet them, police said.

While waiting for the caregiver, police said Gianelos became combative and four officers restrained him and handcuffed him behind his back. In the struggle, Gianelos' forehead was scraped.

[END QUOTED PORTION OF STORY. Click on link for rest of article and/or to watch video: http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Man-Dies-After-Attempted-Arrest-in-Fairfax-County-Police-376429671.html]

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Internal Affairs and other detectives now looking into this. State Medical Examiner will try to determine a cause of death. At this stage, heart attack is the most likely COD as the guy was obese and had an intense struggle just before his medical distress kicked in.

Sad story, but tip for the cop-haters (whether BLM, white racists, drivers mad about traffic tickets, or other): don't assume police misconduct as an arrest of someone actively resisting is not a peaceful process, nor can it be.

Anyway, condolences for his relatives.

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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice. - John Cassis on manners

Ignoring juvenile attacks and remarks on the internet for over two decades.

Arguing by deflection or name-calling is an admission that you don't have a rational argument.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: MtVernonAvenger ()
Date: April 21, 2016 01:04AM

Police murder another helpless person. It's all part of the plan to cleanse the county of poor and helpless.

It's what they do because it's what you want. Wake up Fairfax County residents. A day of reckoning is upon you. Google Day of Reckoning.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Dog Walker1 ()
Date: April 21, 2016 08:49PM

I'll intersperse my responses to your post with your quotes indented with>.

MtVernonAvenger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Police murder another helpless person. It's all
> part of the plan to cleanse the county of poor and
> helpless.

In your view, untethered to reality as it appears to be, how many have FCPD murdered so far this year?

What evidence do you have of any plan to rid the county of poor and helpless?

Aren't there enough poor and helpless in the county that any such imaginary plan would require a thousand, or at least hundreds, or at the very least dozens of such murders ever year to even be alleged to be a plan?

The low numbers of FCPD involved fatalities (even presuming guilt as you unfairly are, instead of innocence) show that your claims are false.

While I don't approve of police misconduct, it's not fair to assume police are guilty. Aren't they entitled to the same presumption of innocence that you and I would be entitled to if we were under investigation?


>
> It's what they do because it's what you want. Wake
> up Fairfax County residents. A day of reckoning is
> upon you. Google Day of Reckoning.

Maybe there are some racists and haters in the county (or on FFXU?) who want police to "murder" poor and helpless, but you haven't any evidence that a significant minority, much less a majority, of FFX residents want police to do so.

I sure don't want police to be wantonly killing poor and helpless. Nor do I believe that officers or their management would ever be a part of such an evil scheme that you imagine is happening, without any evidence to support your delusion.

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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice. - John Cassis on manners

Ignoring juvenile attacks and remarks on the internet for over two decades.

Arguing by deflection or name-calling is an admission that you don't have a rational argument.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Nxnnx ()
Date: April 21, 2016 08:56PM

How many times did they tazer him? They love giving people the good old white lighting.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: positional asphyxiation ()
Date: April 21, 2016 09:27PM

Positional asphyxiation is a motherfucker.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Remembering Geer ()
Date: April 22, 2016 01:35AM

So the tax payers going to shell out another 3 million dollars and the guilty will get the lesser charge of "man slaughter"?

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: public defender ()
Date: April 22, 2016 01:46AM

How can anyone believe the police are anything but guilty? It boggles the mind.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Barney Fife ()
Date: April 22, 2016 10:09AM

FFX PD is bunch of traffic-writing, incompetent Keystone Kops masquerading as a metropolitan law-enforcement/law-abiding agency.

This is the 21st Century. The county has over 1 million people. Get some training on how to handle ALL CONCEIVABLE situations or the get hell outta Dodge.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Sir Gennady Golovkin ()
Date: April 22, 2016 10:13AM

Another "John Geer" circumstance. DBC = Death by cop = DOA.

When does the cover-up and stonewalling begin? Oh, that has already started.

Blue Wall of Silence going up. Justice going downhill.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: moments before death.... ()
Date: April 22, 2016 10:19AM

Live shoulder cam footage just seconds before his death,


Bubbles+does+als+ice+bucket+challenge_62


RIP

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: itstrue ()
Date: April 22, 2016 11:41AM

This happened a few years at a movie theatre. A disabled man saw a Navy Seal movie, loved it & refused to leave the theatre, wanting to see it again. Cops came and a struggle developed. He died just from somewhat normal cop man-handling. Its because these people have super sensitive respiratory systems.
Not to compare them to dogs but some flat nosed dogs can die giving them a normal bath if you aren't careful, can suffocate.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Augiedog ()
Date: April 22, 2016 07:15PM

Love to Monday morning quarterback the cops. What training can be provided to deal w a non speaking autistic?

Where were the "Caretakers" and how is it that it took so long to notice this guy walked away.

What would the outcome have been if the cops didn't find him?

Did the cops use a taser?

What other medical history did this guy have.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: sounds iffy ()
Date: April 22, 2016 07:49PM

Why are they handcuffing a person who has not committed a criminal act? What does "combative" mean?

Being confrontational with a mentally ill person is usually a recipe for provoking combative behavior. Patience is key.

Who knows what happened, but they need much, much more training.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Augiedog ()
Date: April 23, 2016 06:03AM

So what type of training? How to hug the crazy?

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: compromised airway ()
Date: April 23, 2016 11:09AM

What happened is the guy tried to wander off and one of the officers touched him, probably meaning to prevent him from doing so.

The guy flipped out and struck one of the officers. At that point, it was game on, and they took him down in standard cop fashion, which ends up with him face down on his stomach and an officer on his back.

Since this position has been demonstrated to compromise the respiratory systems of obese people, the guy continued to struggle because he was now feeling like he was being suffocated.

So much violent activity caused the guy to have a heart attack.

Cops need to *quickly* get obese subjects off their stomachs and into a sitting or standing position so that the subject's airway is no longer compromised.

Re: Disabled Man Dies After Struggle With Officers in Fairfax County: Police
Posted by: Dog Walker1 ()
Date: April 23, 2016 11:44PM

compromised airway Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What happened is the guy tried to wander off and
> one of the officers touched him, probably meaning
> to prevent him from doing so.
>
> The guy flipped out and struck one of the
> officers. At that point, it was game on, and they
> took him down in standard cop fashion, which ends
> up with him face down on his stomach and an
> officer on his back.
>
> Since this position has been demonstrated to
> compromise the respiratory systems of obese
> people, the guy continued to struggle because he
> was now feeling like he was being suffocated.
>
> So much violent activity caused the guy to have a
> heart attack.
>
> Cops need to *quickly* get obese subjects off
> their stomachs and into a sitting or standing
> position so that the subject's airway is no longer
> compromised.

That's a quite reasonable hypothesis as to how this tragedy occurred. The medical examiner should definitely look into possible positional asphyxiation and taser use as mentioned by other posters (asphyxiation also raised in your post).

I am not saying that the officers must be exonerated. An investigation, not a white wash, should be followed to find the truth of what happened. Officer error is certainly possible as is a possible failure of management to adequately train officers in dealing with mentally ill and mentally disabled people. However, good faith errors made in split-second decisions under stressful conditions are unlikely to rise to the level of criminal liability.

It is grossly unfair to assume that officers are guilty of criminal misconduct before the dust has settled. All of the posters here would be entitled to a presumption of innocence if they were being investigated. Officers are entitled to that same presumption.

Ever year, officers are injured making arrests. Sometimes the violence comes from people being arrested for misdemeanors. Sometimes the violence comes from people who look harmless.

Arresting or detaining an individual can't be made entirely risk-free if the individual is resisting. It's inherently violent if the person resists, no matter how much the officers would prefer that the individual cooperates. Sometimes mentally ill or mentally disabled individuals will fight officers no matter how well-trained the officers are and despite officers doing everything to make a peaceful arrest or detention.

Officers go into harm's way for the safety of the community. They are human and deserve to be able to go home safely to their families at the end of their shift.

Hating on police and/or trashing them for taking reasonable steps to maintain their own safety is not sensible. Instead, we need to back police when they take reasonable and good faith actions to safeguard themselves, just like we would back them for reasonable, good faith actions to keep us safe.

In this case, keep an open mind and see what the investigation shows.

One of the posters mentioned the tragic death of a Down's syndrome man at the hands of officers when the man wanted to stay in a movie theater. That happened in Frederick, MD and led to MD sending all police to training. Maybe extra training will be in order in VA.

Your suggestion about the need to get obese people quickly off their stomachs, certainly sounds sensible. Possibly, and assuming that medical factors and the investigation support that suggestion, management should train officers to move subjects quickly off their stomachs.

Finally, and it has to be said, (this is not directed at people who are critical of officers for actual misdeeds, this is directed at those who hate all officers): If you hate cops, next time you need help call a crackhead.

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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice. - John Cassis on manners

Ignoring juvenile attacks and remarks on the internet for over two decades.

Arguing by deflection or name-calling is an admission that you don't have a rational argument.

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